Return to Transcripts main page
Anderson Cooper 360 Degrees
Interview With Rep. Jason Crow (D-CO); Vance Repeatedly Refuses To Say If He Believes Trump Lost 2020 Election; New WSJ Polling Finds Tight Race In Six Swing States, Trump Has Slight Edge In Nevada; Obama Chastises Black Men For Coming Up With "Reasons And Excuses" Not To Vote For Harris; Black Voters On The State Of The Race In Milwaukee; Milwaukee's Black Voters Reveal Warning Signs For Harris; Hurricane Destruction And Recovery On Two Coasts; Inside A Election Operations Center As Mail-In Votes Are Counted. Aired 8-9p ET
Aired October 11, 2024 - 20:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
FRED PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): A situation they could soon escalate even more as Iran has vowed a crushing response to any attacks by Israel.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PLEITGEN (on camera): And you know, Pamela, the Iranians are saying that if Israel, for instance, targets Iranian oil and gas installations, that in the future, the Iranians might target not only Israeli military installations, but possibly Israel's energy sector as well - Pamela.
PAMELA BROWN, CNN HOST: All right, Fred Pleitgen, thank you so much. And thank you for joining us, AC360 starts right now.
[20:00:33]
JOHN KING, CNN HOST: Tonight on 360, with just 25 days left in the race, Donald Trump stirs up fear of migrants in search of votes and apparently, in spite of the facts.
Also tonight, new polling and what it says about just how close this race is right now in almost every state that counts, including Wisconsin, where I talked with Black voters critical to Democrats.
And later, Florida on the recovery effort on both coasts, even as the impact of Hurricane Milton is still being felt.
Good evening. John King here, in for Anderson tonight.
When the mayor of Aurora, Colorado first learned Donald Trump would be speaking in his city. He gave this statement to "The Denver Post," I'm very excited, he said, that the former president wants to visit our city to see for himself that the narrative that we are being overrun by TDA gang members is false.
Well, today, Trump visited. That didn't happen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) DONALD TRUMP (R) FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Well, today, Trump visited that didn't happen. I will rescue Aurora and every town that has been invaded and conquered, these counties have been conquered explain that to your governor, he doesn't have a clue. They've been conquered.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: That's the former president today in Aurora, which apparently hasn't been conquered because there's a former president wandering around.
As he has been saying, for weeks now, he's been saying that for weeks now, claiming not just at the city, but that other cities in Colorado as well have been, as he puts it, conquered by members of the Venezuelan gang, TDA, except they haven't.
Here's what actually happened.
In August, this video was posted on social media, footage of armed men walking down the hallways at a local apartment complex. Trump supporters claimed it showed TDA taking over. The building's owner did appear to verify that, but the city says the building's real problem was unsanitary conditions and other code violations. And in August, the city condemned the place.
Aurora's mayor tells CNN the 10 men associated with TDA have been identified and nine arrested. Separately, six armed men seen in that viral video have all been identified and one of them has been arrested.
In other words, there seems to be a problem of some sorts, which apparently is being dealt with in some fashion. It's just not anything, not even close resembling what the former president has been saying on the stump and get this, he also blames Kamala Harris.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: ... all because Kamala Harris decided to empty the slums and prison cells of Caracas and many other places happening all over the world.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: I don't think I need to tell you this, but the vice president of the United States can't free anyone from American prisons, let alone Venezuelan prisons. In some ways, it's surprising he credits her with being able to do anything, especially considering, they also spent a good deal of his time today calling her stupid.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: We are going to defeat Kamala Harris who has no clue what the hell is going on.
We are being led by stupid people. She does not know what she's talking about, I'm telling you. There is something wrong with her.
Either she's really dumb or she's very naive. Something's wrong, something's wrong up there.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: He also mocked her for using a teleprompter. In this case falsely. And yes, that thing in the upper left-hand part of your screen as you watch him speak, is his teleprompter.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: Did you see where she did a town hall yesterday and she used the teleprompter? I never saw it though. You don't use teleprompters. We don't use teleprompters. Period.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: Yes, he does of course and keeping them honest, it's easy to make light of things like that, false statements about teleprompters. But less so, when it comes to Trump's campaign to stir up fear of migrants -- of outsiders.
His attacks on lawful Haitian immigrants in Springfield, Ohio, for example, set off a wave of death threats. He attacked those immigrants again, today in aurora, and he upped the ante. Listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: You're going to have hundreds of millions of people coming in here and you're not going to have -- and they're going to take your house, that woman has a beautiful house over there. I saw it actually, enjoy it because you won't have it long. They will take over your house.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: Perspective now from the Democratic Congressman Jason Crow, he represents Colorado's sixth congressional district, which includes Aurora. We spoke just moments before airtime.
Congressman, grateful for your time tonight. I want to begin by asking you to listen to a piece of the president's speech in Aurora today. We'll talk on the other side.
[20:05:06]
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: In Aurora, multiple apartment complexes have been taken over by the savage Venezuela prison gang known as Tren De Aragua, or as your law enforcement and law enforcement all over the world, they know them all over the world. They're a savage gang, one of the worst in the world and they're getting bigger all the time because of our stupidity.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
KING: How much of that is true?
REP. JASON CROW (D-CO): None of it, John. It's a total lie, a total fabrication. I couldn't be more proud to represent Aurora. I couldn't be more proud to call it as my home. It's where I'm sitting right now, not too far from those apartment complexes that the president is lying about.
He has made this up and he's made this up in the same way that he made up the lies about migrants in Springfield, Ohio, in the same way that he's making up lies about the federal government's response to the hurricanes in southeast United States.
He is making these things up because he's distracting, or he's trying to distract people's attention from his policies that are overwhelmingly unpopular and being repudiated by the American people from his desire to gut climate change policies, to give tax breaks to billionaires and corporations on the backs of the middle class, to impose a national abortion ban. He doesn't want us to be talking about that stuff. So he's making up these lies.
KING: You say that his policies are being repudiated by the American people. However, you know, the polling just as well as I do. This is as close a race as you can get in the battleground states, the vice president and the former president are essentially tied. Trump has a bit of an advantage if you look at Nevada; pretty much tied, in the other six, if he's lying all the time and people don't like his policies, why is this a tossup race?
CROW: But when you actually talk about his policies, that's when people repudiate it. If you talk about gun violence prevention, climate change, abortion, rights tax breaks for the middle class, pro- labor union policies, people support that, right and this is because he constantly lies and distracts and engaged just in culture warfare that you are in a situation where it's hard to talk about those issues.
So yes, I always make a case that we need to keep focused on what this election is about. It's about our democracy, it's about our climate, it's about gun violence, it's about safety in our communities, and it's not actual true immigration reform. Let's not forget that the immigration crisis and our broken immigration system is in large part not fixed because of Donald Trump.
We had a bipartisan deal in the United States Congress that got 68 votes in the US Senate, that was a deal that would have addressed many of the issues that we're dealing with at the border, border security, reducing the backlog, providing a pathway to citizenship and permanent residency for folks in the country legally or who want to follow the law and normalize their status.
All of that would have been addressed and we were ready to vote on it. Donald Trump picked up the phone. He called his minions in Congress and he said kill the deal. Kill it because he would rather run on the problem than solve the problem. That's why we're.
KING: Congressman Jason Crow of Colorado. Sir, I appreciate your time tonight. Thank you.
CROW: Thank you.
KING: Some perspective now, joining us, the 2020 Trump press communications director Erin Perrine; POLITICO national political correspondent, Meridith McGraw; and the Biden-Harris 2020 senior campaign official, Ashley Allison.
Erin, I want to start with you. You know what it's like to be inside Trump land. The former president knows he's lying. His political team knows he's lying, but he continues to lie and overhype this. Why? What is the political goal?
ERIN PERRINE, FORMER DIRECTOR OF PRESS COMMUNICATIONS, TRUMP 2020 CAMPAIGN: Well, there is a clear political strategy from the Trump team regarding immigration and they've been very clear about that and about illegal immigration.
This is clearly a strategy and a tactic that they will believe works for them because the American people in polling are showing that even everything given they believe that Donald Trump is better at securing this southern border in handling illegal immigration than Kamala Harris.
So, right now, Donald Trump, he went to Aurora, Colorado today and networks all across the country are talking about illegal immigration. He is driving that narrative and you have seen television ads from the presidential race on down about illegal immigration, about illegal immigration and crime in communities.
This is a narrative that they believe will work for them because they are seeing that it's showing in the polling.
And Donald Trump's going to go to New York City in October. You think, where we have seen competitive House races, where Democrats have won on an immigration message against Republicans that going in there and even talking in New York City about illegal immigration, that will help down-ballot.
Listen, there is a strategy to this while maybe not everybody agrees to it, there is a method to that madness.
KING: There certainly is a message to it.
So, Ashley, Erin just teed it up. Donald Trump wants us talking about this. Donald Trump says outrageous things because it dominates news coverage. Among the things he said today, is that these people are coming into our country to, "infect our country".
It's language like that, that makes Democratic blood boil because they think it's so unfair. And so, it treats migrants so indignantly. The question is, should Harris react to that, address this issue, or do you ignore him and hope people say that's a lie, that's intolerance and they won't vote for him?
[20:10:20]
ASHLEY ALLISON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, you know, as I was hearing Erin speak, I was just -- I'm just trying to figure out, it is a strategy. It's a strategy that is rooted in dishonesty and dishonest strategy sometimes work in politics. I think that's why so many Americans have kind of lost hope in our political system over the years.
I think that Kamala Harris, should continue to talk about what her vision is for immigration. I don't think she should respond to Donald Trump. I think she should say, I want to do this, I want to do that, and when I tried to do this, Donald Trump stopped me.
Also, I think as I was listening to him say those words, we are covering this and I think it's important that we cover and we call out the lies, but every time Donald Trump speaks, my recommendation, I'm going to give this free recommendation to the network out, they haven't asked me as we should factcheck him in real time and put the word lie in front of his face when he saying it on air.
Because a lot of times people hear it and have -- make it be a water stamp and do it for every candidate. When they are telling dishonest fact or dishonest things to the American people that will lead them down a path that is not good for America, we should say, that that is not a fact, that is a lie, and that is one way I think we can counter Donald Trump because he's not going to stop. Like, he's going to keep lying.
He has lied the last eight years. He's going to lie the next 25 days and truth be told, America, if he's president, he will lie to you for four more years.
KING: Meridith, you're the reporter on the conversation, so, let's get a little granule here. It's clearly a strategy, both the Democrat, the Republican in the conversation agree with that. But what is it about?
Clearly, it gins up the Trump base? We know that, we know that from 2016, we know that from 2020, immigration is an issue that gins up the Trump base. But do they see any other gain? Do they see it getting them voters in any place or as many Democrats believe, do they see it maybe suppressing turnout by making other people think this is so ugly, I'm getting out, I'm just out of here.
MERIDITH MCGRAW, NATIONAL POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT, POLITICO: Well, we've seen how Donald Trump has demonized undocumented immigrants over the years and he's really made this a core pillar of his campaign. And even though we see that the economy is still ranks highest among issues for Republicans, immigration is up there too.
And so, it's partly to gin up his base, but Trump is going to a community that he has put in the national spotlight. It's in a blue state, and so the Trump campaign has the opportunity to say they were in a blue state, even though they're using it to try to make the case to supporters that these incidents of crime can happen in your community too.
But here, the facts of the matter, are that there isn't' a correlation between immigration and crime. There have been some grizzly crimes that have been pointed out by the news media and by the Trump campaign. But there just isn't a connection there but it certainly will drive up some of his own support within the party.
KING: So Erin, what happens in the Trump campaign war room, if somebody raises their hand and say , sir, I know this is what you want to say, but we'd like to win Montgomery County, Pennsylvania. We'd like to win Maricopa County, Arizona. Maybe it's a little bit different there, but among more moderate suburban voters, this might not work. What does he say?
PERRINE: Well, it's a combination of things to take to win a campaign. It's data, its message, and it's ground. It's not just one portion of it, it's not just the message that needs to get out there. You need to couple it with the analytics and the data to make sure you're talking to the correct voters and you've got to make sure that the ground game is there to support all of that and have the multiple touch points.
One television ad and one news clip is not generally going to persuade a voter. They need multiple touch points and especially if there are low-propensity voter and in election like this that sits within the margin of error, those low propensity voters, those ones who do not have the natural instinct to go and vote are the ones that are going to be so critical in this election.
So making sure that they find that right touch point to that low- propensity voter. Both campaigns are struggling to do that right now, but that is how they're going to win. And it could be in the wild counties in Wisconsin, it could be in the suburbs of Atlanta, it could be in the colored counties in Pennsylvania, but its more than one choice and one message that they have to be able to deliver and that's what they're doing right now.
KING: It's a loud and it's a dark choice, that one, but we'll see if it works. Everyone please stick around, a lot more to discuss. And before we go to break, quick reminder, the Colorado Governor Jared Polis, will be Kaitlan Collins' guests tonight on "The Source," that comes up, of course, right at the top of the hour.
Next for us, running mate JD Vance and his five answers to one simple question. Does he believe Donald Trump lost in 2020?
And later, my conversations with Black voters in Milwaukee on how Kamala Harris does and does not change their thoughts on this election.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:19:15]
KING: We'll get to my friend here and talk about the tightness of this race in just a moment. But say this about Trump running mate JD Vance, he stays on message. In a brand-new interview with "The New York Times", Lulu Garcia- Navarro, listen, he consistently refuses to answer a pretty simple question.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LULU GARCIA NAVARRO, HOST AND WRITER FOR THE OPINION SECTION OF THE NEW YORK TIMES: In the debate you were asked to clarify if you believe Trump lost the 2020 election do you believe he lost the 2020 election?
SEN. JD VANCE (R) VICE PRESIDENT NOMINEE: I think that Donald Trump and I have both raised a number of issues with the 2020 election, but we're focused on the future. I think there's an obsession here with focusing on 2020. I'm much more worried about what happened after 2020, which is wide-open border, groceries that are on unaffordable. And look --
NAVARRO: Senator, yes or no? Did Donald Trump lose the 2020 election.
VANCE: Let me ask you a question, is it okay that big technology companies censored the Hunter Biden laptop story, which independent analysis have said cost Donald Trump millions of votes.
[20:20:10]
NAVARRO: Senator Vance, I'm going to ask do you again, did Donald Trump lose the 2020 election?
VANCE: Did big technology companies censor a story that independent studies have suggested would have cost Trump millions of votes?
NAVARRO: Senator Vance, I'm going to ask you again, did Donald Trump lose the 2020 election?
VANCE: And I've answered your question with another question. You answer my question and I'll answer yours.
NAVARRO: I have asked his question repeatedly. It is something that is very important for the American people to know, there is no proof, legal or otherwise that Donald Trump did not lose the 2020 election.
VANCE: You're repeating a slogan rather than engaging with what I'm saying, which is that when our own technology firms engage in industrial scale censorship, by the way, backed up by the federal government in a way that independent studies suggest affect the votes I'm worried about Americans who feel like there were problems in 2020.
(END VIDEO CLIP)'
KING: I'm worried he can't answer that question because to the extent that there were problems in 2020, they've so far gotten the former president indicted. His former attorney, Rudy Giuliani disbarred.
Meridith, I want to start with you here. A simple theory about this, right? Senator Vance says he's looking forward, not backwards. He diverts and goes to other questions. You know that as a reporter, you ask a tough question, they ask something else, so they answer something else.
If Vance were to say Donald Trump lost, number one, the boss would get very mad. But number two wouldn't that be the trapdoor? That's the biggest of the lies. It's in the pyramid of lies.
We just talked about lies about migrants. There are so many other lies Trump told. If once -- the cue to their voters. Oh, we're lying about that, then what happens?
MCGRAW: Well, refusing to answer whether or not Donald Trump lost the 2020 election has become more or less a litmus test for the modern Republican Party and for a lot of Trump supporters and his allies, too.
You know, when JD Vance answered this question during the CBS debate, it was a low point in what was otherwise a very strong performance for him and Governor Walz called it a damning none answer, but Senator Vance is not Mike Pence. He said in that same interview that if he was a sitting senator, he would not have voted to certify the election results and that if he was vice president, he would have asked states to provide multiple slates of electors.
So, for Vance, he's making clear where he stands on this, even if it is a falsehood that the former president lost the election.
KING: He is disciplined and also not telling the truth, but he is disciplined.
Ashley, Senator Vance also said in that interview tonight that after the presidency, he thinks the most important position in the government will be the attorney general. And he added that a new Trump administration would, "clean house" at the Department of Justice. How would you interpret that?
ALLISON: Well, that's why so many people have been raising the alarm flags about Project 2025. The Trump campaign continuously says that they are not a part of Project 2025, even though many people affiliated with his administration, his past administration, and his campaign, and some iterations wrote that document.
And in that document, it talks about gutting federal agencies. The thing that the American public should know is that when I worked in the White House, it was very different than Donald Trump's White House is there used to be a firewall. There used to be a firewall between the White House and the president and the Department of Justice.
So that means when Merrick Garland is attorney general, he can go after -- appoint Jack Smith, who can go after Donald Trump, but he also can appoint somebody who can go after Hunter Biden because the Department of Justice is the people's Department of Justice, not the president's Department of Justice.
So, it just signals that, yet again, Trump is connected to 2025. And if not directly, he believes in those approaches to gut our judicial system, and really use the Department of Justice to seek vengeance on his political opponents and enemies, as he said in the past. KING: Erin, I want to turn attention now to the new polling and first, just to look at the state of the race, 226 electoral votes likely are solid for Kamala Harris to 219 for Donald Trump. So, essentially a very close race. What you see in yellow or gold, depending in your TV at home here, those are the toss-up states, seven of those.
This is the new NBC, I mean, yes, this "Wall Street Journal" poll, forgive me. They used to poll together, they don't anymore. Here are your battleground states. Harris plus two in Arizona, essentially no clear leader. Harris plus two in Georgia. No clear leader. Harris plus two in Michigan, no clear leader. Tied in North Carolina, Trump plus one and in Pennsylvania, that's no clear leader, tied in Wisconsin. If Trump does have a lead outside the margin of error there it is in Nevada.
So, it's a tossup race, Erin but if you go back to 2016 or 2020, Donald Trump today, 25 days out, is in a better position than he was in an either one of those races.
PERRINE: That's right, John, he is. And if you even just look at Wisconsin, right, in 2016, he was looking at about 42 percent, in 2020, Donald Trump was leaning about 43 percent. Now, he's sitting around 47 percent. So, the question is, what kind of error are we actually going to be looking at in polling? Because we say margin of error, because polling is an imperfect science.
[20:25:07]
When you look at that, are we going to be looking at the 2020 style errors, when you look at those more holistically, if you use that pattern of polling for where Donald Trump is now, he would win all seven competitive battleground states. But if you if you look at what the errors were in 2022 when it came to polling, Kamala Harris will win six of the seven battleground states.
So, what adjustments had they made for polling at this point to try and correct for either of those, to be able to see in a state like Wisconsin where Trump closed at 47 in '16 and '20, where the difference was where we're going to be able to know how close this race actually is because it's likely within tenths of a percentage of points in a lot of these states.
KING: Trust me, I do this math several times a day and it is complicated.
I want to switch maps as I bring Meridith into the conversation. Meridith, the vice presidential candidate, the Democratic side, Governor Tim Walz today was in Macomb County, Michigan and as I switch the map and I want to bring that up. He's talking to blue-collar voters there. That is the place. Let's come to the 2020 map here. That is the place back when I was getting started before are any of you were born.
That's when Ronald Reagan coined the term -- Democrats coined the term Reagan Democrats because Ronald Reagan was winning in this blue collar area. Donald Trump won it just barely in 2020 -- not just barely in 2020, he won it by a decent margin there. And then here again, against Hillary Clinton.
Macomb County, that's blue-collar workers. That's Warren, Michigan. That's the auto industry.
This is a race on the margins. We're going to talk on a few minutes about margins about African-American voters. We talk about what sells in the suburbs, talk to me about Macomb County, Michigan blue collar Tim Walz, what are they trying to do, are they trying to win it, or just get closer?
MCGRAW: I think like you said, this is going to be won on the margins. This race is going to be decided by the six percent of undecided voters, whoever they are and the Trump campaign is really trying to drive up a gap in gender in particular, drive out men, male voters, who they think could really be the deciding vote in this upcoming election.
KING: Erin Perrine, Meridith McGraw, Ashley Allison, appreciate your time on a Friday, thanks so much.
Coming up for us, the latest installment of my "All Over The Map" series. We'll take a closer look at the race in battleground Wisconsin through the eyes of Black voters in Milwaukee.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:31:38]
KING: 25 days now to Election Day and it is crystal clear, Democrats believe they still have their work cut out for them when it comes to attracting a key member of their long-standing coalition, black male voters.
Next week, the Vice President, Kamala Harris, scheduled to participate in a radio town hall with Charlamagne Tha God, co-host of course of the popular syndicated radio show with a huge national following in the black community. Yesterday, President Obama, the former president, spent part of his first day back on the campaign trail at a Harris campaign office delivering this message to black men.
(BEGIN VIDEOCLIP)
BARACK OBAMA, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We have not yet seen the same kinds of energy and turnout in all quarters of our neighborhoods and communities as we saw when I was running. Now, I also want to say that that seems to be more pronounced with the brothers. And you're coming up with all kinds of reasons and excuses.
I've got a problem with that because part of it makes me think, I'm speaking to men directly, part of it makes me think that well, you just aren't feeling the idea of having a woman as president. And you're coming up with other alternatives and other reasons for that.
(END VIDEOCLIP)
KING: Now, that kind of comment likely to make waves in places like, let's pop up Wisconsin, right there in Milwaukee. The swing state Wisconsin, Democrats of course depend on a huge black turnout from people who live in the cities, including Milwaukee.
I went back to Milwaukee recently for the latest installment of my All Over The Map series in which we're examining the race through the eyes and the experience of voters and key voting blocs in the swing states. I wanted to see if black voters thought Harris as the nominee had changed the dynamics of the race.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)
KING (voice-over): Door to door, north side Milwaukee. If Kamala Harris is to win Wisconsin, the path starts right here.
DEVONTA JOHNSON, CANVASSER, BLACK LEADERS ORGANIZING FOR COMMUNITIES: How do you feel about Kamala Harris?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, Kamala Harris, I think she's great.
JOHNSON: She's great. How do you feel about Trump?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Not so great.
KING (voice-over): A phone number to keep in touch.
JOHNSON: I appreciate you, ma'am. Have a good day, blessed day.
KING (voice-over): To make sure support translates into voting.
JOHNSON: He was pretty excited about Kamala.
KING (voice-over): Devonta Johnson now shares that excitement. When we met a year ago, he was undecided between Joe Biden and Donald Trump.
JOHNSON: At the time, I was like kind of iffy, feeling like everybody else like undecided and not confused, but it's like, I don't know for sure going to vote for him. But now that Kamala got the ball and she rolling with it, I feel like, oh yes.
KING (voice-over): Johnson and his colleagues walk these streets year round, building trust for right now. The leaves are falling. Halloween is at hand. It's turnout time.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I just want to remind you that early voting starts on October 22nd.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My wife and I, we already absentee ballot.
KING (voice-over): This look under the hood was positive.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I just want your opinion.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Trump is trying to take us back to days that we don't want to be in.
KING (voice-over): But there are cracks in the Democratic foundation. UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I know I don't want him, but then I feel like I question her a little bit too.
KING (voice-over): The canvassers share notes every workday.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What are people saying?
KING (voice-over): No question Harris is stronger in the Black neighborhoods now than Joe Biden was when we first visited a year ago.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's a sense of hope in the air.
[20:35:07]
KING (voice-over): But there are warning signs.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It is people out here saying that they don't want to vote. They still saying that.
KING (voice-over): Often the conversation at those doors turns to higher rents and food prices.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We got to pick and choose between what we can and what we can't buy. And ain't nobody talking about it. But you all just vote, vote, vote, get out and vote. You all want us to vote.
KING (voice-over): Angela Lang is the boss here at Black Leaders Organizing for Communities. She knows the hard math of Hillary Clinton's narrow 2016 Wisconsin loss and what it took to deliver Joe Biden's narrow 2020 win. Cautiously optimistic now as she rallies her team and runs the 2024 canvassing numbers.
ANGELA LANG, EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR, BLACK LEADERS ORGANIZING FOR COMMUNITIES: You can't win a statewide election here without going through the heart of Milwaukee and in some cases that runs through this office and the work that our team does. But also we're seeing folks in heavily red areas that are getting together with other women at coffee shops without their husbands knowing, for example, and starting to have those conversations.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We got the most to lose right now.
KING (voice-over): Off-the-chart support among women is critical for Harris. When these canvassers encounter a Trump supporter, it is almost always a Black man.
LANG: One of the things that we've heard is people are like, well, I think I had more money in my pocket when Trump was in office because of the stimulus checks during the pandemic.
BRIAN MCMUTUARY, WISCONSIN VOTER: It's kind of hard to choose when that's all you got.
KING (voice-over): Brian McMutuary was a lifelong Democrat, but he voted for Trump in 2020. He's undecided, but leaning Trump this year. MCMUTUARY: The cost of living, you know, gas, food prices, you know, rent, it's hard. You try to, you know, keep up and trying, you know, stay away from the credit cards.
So what'd you do today?
KING (voice-over): McMutuary has two children, manages a McDonald's, disagrees with Trump on immigration and abortion, but likes his take on cryptocurrency and remembers being better off when Trump was president.
MCMUTUARY: I would have to say that the biggest difference is I didn't have any experience.
KING (voice-over): Plus, he says he worries Russia's Putin and China's Xi wouldn't see Harris as an equal.
MCMUTUARY: They look at a man as being, you know, a leader. So that's like somewhat of a troubling issue.
KING: Do you have any problem with a woman president?
MCMUTUARY: Nope, not at all. Like I say, it's about doing the right thing for the country.
ERIC JONES, WISCONSIN VOTER: How can you take bigotry over a job?
KING (voice-over): Eric Jones hears it all when he stops for coffee at the barber shop and in his real estate business.
JONES: If I was a gambling man, I would probably put my money on Harris. Things are getting better. The numbers are better. The energy is different.
KING (voice-over): But an earlier job sometimes hurts the Vice President.
JONES: It is black men. Law enforcement has not been kind to black people historically. District attorneys have not been kind to black people historically.
KING (voice-over): Plus, Jones says abortion and transgender rights sometimes come up in his barbershop debates.
JONES: The good old party feels that they have a monopoly over the Christian vote. The Democratic Party feels they have a monopoly over the black vote. The problem is there are a lot of blacks that are Christians and the black church is one of the strongest institutions in the community. So you have this tug of war in a city that I'm pretty sure the black vote will decide who wins that city and more than likely the presidency.
KING (voice-over): Yes, turnout time in a community that matters big time.
(END VIDEO TAPE) KING: I'm joined now by Washington Post White House Bureau Chief Toluse Olorunnipa and the former DNC Communications Director Mo Elleithee. Toluse, let me start with you. You've covered this issue before. Look, it's Milwaukee, Wisconsin, but it's also Detroit, Michigan. It's Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. It's Charlotte, North Carolina. It's Atlanta, Georgia.
This is a critical piece of the Democratic coalition. You heard the former president say he thinks a lot of it is they don't want to elect a woman. They don't want to support a woman. You heard the canvassers. Their feedback is it's more complicated. Where do we think the truth is?
TOLUSE OLORUNNIPA, WHITE HOUSE BUREAU CHIEF, THE WASHINGTON POST: Well, first off, John, kudos to you for getting down into the community and hearing some of those voices on the ground. In part, it's important because, you know, you get your polls, you hear from your pundits, but the people on the ground are going to be the people that make the difference.
And we have heard a lack of enthusiasm going back to when Biden was a candidate in black communities, especially among black men, because of those cost of living issues that we heard during your piece. A lot of people are struggling.
A lot of people said that things were better under Trump. That inflation wasn't as high, and they're voting with their pocketbooks and not voting based on race or not even voting based on the things that Trump has said that has offended this group of people often and over and over again over his past eight years in office.
And so, that is a very difficult situation that Kamala Harris, the vice president, finds herself in. She's in a better position than Biden was, especially given her race and her background and her willingness and her ability to communicate with this demographic group.
But she has some work to do. And that's part of the reason she's going to be speaking with the Breakfast Club hosts next week, trying to make a direct pitch to black men saying, I need to earn your vote. I need to tell you why my administration is going to be different and better for you.
[20:40:09]
And not only the Trump administration, but also the Biden administration and her ability to do that could determine whether or not she's the president when we count the votes in a few weeks.
KING: Mo, you live through a piece of this in 2016. Hillary Clinton wins the popular vote, narrowly loses, including the blue wall states, Michigan, Wisconsin and Pennsylvania. How do you crack the code when somebody says, no, it's cost of living or somebody says, oh, I'm worried Putin and she won't treat us an equal, but I'm fine with a woman president. How do you crack the code and how do you get them to reconsider? MO ELLEITHEE, FORMER DNC COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: Look, you just -- I think she's doing what she needs to be doing. She's out there in the community talking to people. You know, one of the biggest complaints about Democrats during an election year is that they wait until the end to start talking to the black community. That takes the black community for granted.
This does not sound like a campaign that is taking the black community and the black vote for granted. Since the day she announced her candidacy, she's going in to the community. She's going in and making the case.
Now, I think it's a little bit of all of the above, right? She needs to go in there and she needs to keep talking about the economic future. She's rolled out an economic plan. She needs to be going into the community and talking about how that economic plan benefits individuals, benefits families, because that's what a lot of these voters are most concerned about.
As to the whole Putin, she -- you know, will they see her as a leader thing? You know, I think she can crack that code. I think she can go out there and be forceful. It's probably one of the reasons why Donald Trump didn't want to debate her a second time, because on a debate stage next to him, she looked like a leader.
So she's got some work to do, but I think she's doing it. I think she's doing what she needs to.
KING: Toluse, we're talking about the pieces, right? You know, one of the questions every day you get is like, who would you rather be today, right? 25 days out, would you rather be Harris or you'd rather be Trump? So Harris clearly has some cracks in the Democratic coalition.
Again, black men are not going to vote for Donald Trump in any overwhelmingly numbers -- overwhelming numbers. The question is with these battleground states so close, if she loses just a little or for a small percentage stay home, it could make a difference.
Flip side, we showed some pictures earlier. The Minnesota governor, Tim Walz, her running mate, out in Macomb County, Michigan today, a place that used to be blue that has gone red, you know, above 8-mile road, blue collar, mostly white union workers there. A few weeks ago in the election, how does he play in this sort of fight to move the margins?
OLORUNNIPA: Well, Tim Walz is trying to win over that blue wall by making that connection with those union workers, making the connection with people like him, people who may not be as comfortable with Kamala Harris as the president. But when they see that she chose Tim Walz, when they see someone more like them, willing to join her on the ticket, it may become a little bit more comfortable.
He's trying to win over some of those male votes, keep the male, female gap down when it comes to the gender gap, which is pretty significant in this race. But Kamala Harris is relying on Tim Walz to be at Friday night football games in high schools and speak to gun owners and try to reach out across the aisle and reach some of those middle of the road voters who aren't necessarily swayed by Trump's message, but aren't yet comfortable with Kamala Harris.
And so, he is making the pitch. He is, in these swing states, he's really out there trying to win over a number of votes from some of these blue collar workers leaning in on his own biography. And it seems like it's working so far, but whether or not it will be enough, that remains to be seen.
KING: And Mo, as we talk about cracks in the Democratic coalition, if you're watching at home, they might think, oh, they're having this conversation because she's in such deep trouble. No, she's actually in a very, very close race with the former president of the United States. And she has just as good a shot as he does to win.
I just want to show this. This is from the Wall Street Journal polling. Back in March when Joe Biden was the candidate, 42 percent was the Democratic ballot in Arizona. Now it's 48 percent. When Biden was the candidate in Georgia back in March, the ballot was 43 percent. Now it's 48 percent.
In North Carolina, Biden was getting 43 percent in March. Now, Harris is getting 47 percent. So her situation has improved and improved significantly. What's the key to get that little bit more, to get it to 49, 49 point something?
ELLEITHEE: Yes. Yes, every vote matters in this one. And you feel that sense of urgency within the party. You feel that sense of urgency within the campaign. She's going to those handful of battleground states over and over and over. The states that are going to be decided by the most narrow margin.
She's got to keep going in there, making the case for the future. People know how they feel about Donald Trump, right? They love him, they hate him, or they tolerate him. So she's got to give them the alternative. And that's what she's been doing.
KING: Toluse Olorunnipa, Mo Elleithee, gentlemen, thank you so much. Appreciate your time.
Up next for us, the death toll rises as both coasts of Florida try to recover. You see it right there from Hurricane Milton.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:49:08]
KING: An 83-year-old Florida man found dead today raises CNN's estimate of the death toll from Hurricane Milton to 17. Randi Kaye has more now on the destruction and recovery efforts across the state tonight.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)
CHARLIE GARRETT, HOME DAMAGED BY HURRICANE MILTON: The storm surge was enough to make us concerned. We didn't know where it was going to land.
RANDI KAYE, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Pastor Charlie Garrett's family has lived on Siesta Key, where Hurricane Milton made landfall since 1948. He and his wife, Hideki, share this property with his father, who lives in the front cottage. All of them evacuated for Hurricane Milton. Along with their eight dogs.
GARRETT: We've lost trees all the way back on the property, on the side. They're all down. And then all of a sudden, the wind started coming from the other direction. And it was as bad as I've ever been in. This was as horrific as anything.
KAYE (voice-over): Charlie says the house flooded with about 3 feet of water, just like it had a couple of weeks ago during Hurricane Helene. They didn't evacuate then.
[20:50:04]
KAYE: People say, well, are they going to run or are they going to rebuild? Which one is it for you? You're going to run or rebuild?
GARRETT: No, we're staying. Yes, we've been here all these years and I'm going nowhere. Dad has had enough and he's moving off the island. It's just not worth saving the house, probably.
KAYE: Why do you stay?
GARRETT: Helene went all the way up to Ohio and it destroyed entire towns. Where are you going to go? Right? I mean, this is where I grew up. There's nowhere safe on this planet. Wherever you go, there's something.
KAYE (voice-over): He's working round the clock to clean up his yard.
GARRETT: Sofas, there's all kinds of stuff, garbage cans. All these garbage cans I'm using, they all came from somewhere else. They're not mine. Everything I had during Helene is out in the bay. It's all gone.
KAYE (voice-over): About 170 miles away from Siesta Key in Palm Beach Gardens on the east coast of Florida, more destruction. An EF3 tornado, packing winds of 140 miles per hour, chewed through this community as Milton approached Florida. It is the strongest tornado from a tropical system in Florida in more than half a century.
KAYE: This house was actually the first home that was completed in this community and now it's condemned. Here's the sign marked unsafe. They lost their roof. These are just some of the tiles here on the ground right on their driveway. They lost their windows. They lost their front doors. And now there is literally a hole in their house. You can see right through it.
KEVIN WATTS, HOME DESTROYED BY TORNADO: It was in the center of the house, like they always trying to do, center of the house, multiple walls around us. And we don't need the stairs.
KAYE: Will you rebuild? WATTS: Yes.
KAYE: You'll stay put?
WATTS: Yes, ma'am.
KAYE (voice-over): Down the street, this woman was huddled in a closet under her stairwell with her family and a friend who evacuated from Sarasota, thinking they'd be safe here. That's when she got a terrifying text from a neighbor.
ANNA STROUD, HOME DAMAGED BY TORNADO: Someone says, oh my God, I see it. And I'm like, you see it? And they said, yes, it's coming from Publix and it's coming right for us. We definitely hear it coming through and the shaking. And then we also felt the wind. And when we felt the wind, you know, we knew we were compromised.
KAYE (voice-over): Her home is badly damaged, but not destroyed.
KAYE: Do you consider moving or are you going to rebuild?
STROUD: Well, we will rebuild.
KAYE (voice-over): Back in Siesta Key, Charlie is leaning into his faith while keeping an eye on Mother Nature.
GARRETT: As long as I have that faith that Christ came out of the grave, nothing can harm me.
KAYE: You feel like God would keep you safe here?
GARRETT: No. If I stayed here and I died, it would have been my fault. It's a world of disaster. And so we make choices and those things happen.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
KAYE (on-camera): And John, the communities really are coming together. The woman we met who survived that tornado, she said when they all came outside, all of her neighbors, she described it as sort of apocalyptic. She said that when they saw each other, they were all like, what can we do to help? Can we babysit? Can we help board up a window?
And it was the same thing for Pastor Charlie in Siesta Key. He said that all of his neighbors came together to help right away. And not just his neighbors, John, he said church members from Texas, Ohio, and as far away as Germany came to help him. John?
KING: Resilience is remarkable. Randi Kaye, thank you so much. Fascinating reporting.
Up next, back to the election. For us, we'll take you to one North Carolina county where they're already starting to process mail-in ballots.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[20:57:26]
KING: 25 days to election day but they're already processing mail-in ballots and they're already fighting over them. More from CNN's Paula Reid.
(BEGIN VIDEO TAPE)
PAULA REID, CNN CHIEF LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: We're here at the Wake County Board of Elections Operations Center where in just a few minutes, they're going to begin processing mail-in ballots that have already arrived. This process, it's open to the public, it's open to the media. So let's head inside and see how it works.
REID (voice-over): This box contains one of the first batches of mail- in ballots to be processed in the county. Officials review each envelope to make sure it's properly sealed and signed.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Look at those instructions, follow them carefully.
GREG FLYNN (D), WAKE COUNTY, NC BOARD OF ELECTIONS: Sometimes there's missing witness information or missing notary information or they're voted and signed. So there's a little -- these are things that we catch.
REID: You can see behind me, the committee is hard at work. They are processing ballots that have already been mailed in. This is a bipartisan committee, two Democrats, two Republicans, and a chair appointed by the governor.
REID (voice-over): Roughly a dozen members of the public came to watch the proceedings.
REID: So once ballots are reviewed and approved by the Board of Elections, they come back here to the sort of goldfish bowl situation where they are then further processed. And I'm whispering here because this is very quiet.
REID (voice-over): This work may seem mundane, but these envelopes and whether they have been accurately filled out could decide the election. As Democrats have traditionally been more likely to use mail-in ballots, Republicans have already made this the subject of litigation in multiple battleground states.
In Pennsylvania, a pivotal state in the 2024 race, the RNC has sued to challenge procedures that allow voters to fix issues like missing signatures or incorrect dates so their ballots can be counted. Concerned, the Harris-Walz campaign backed the DNC and state Democratic Party quickly intervening.
Ultimately, the state Supreme Court rejected this challenge and another over counting ballots that arrive in envelopes without handwritten dates or have incorrect dates. But these types of issues could be revived after the election. GOV. JOSH SHAPIRO (D), PENNSYLVANIA: We knew that he would try his same old tactics again. And in fact, we've already begun to see some litigation to try and make it harder for certain people's votes to count.
REID (voice-over): Officials are working to educate voters about how to properly fill in their mail-in ballot through videos like this.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Make sure you sign it and write the current date in the right spots on the larger envelope.
REID (voice-over): Back in North Carolina, election officials are preparing for the litigation over these ballots to ramp up, especially if former President Trump is behind in the vote count.
PAUL COX, GENERAL COUNSEL, NC STATE OF BOARD OF ELECTIONS: If you have close elections, I think both major parties are lawyered up and they're ready to go to court if they feel like there's something to be gained strategically from it.
REID: How likely do you think it is that this, the election, anything related to North Carolina will end up in court?
COX: I think it depends on how close it is. That's always the case.
REID (voice-over): Paula Reid, CNN, Raleigh, North Carolina.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
KING: The news continues. The Source with Kaitlan Collins starts now.
