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Anderson Cooper 360 Degrees

Hurricane Melissa Strikes Jamaica With Historic 185 MPH Winds; Hurricane Now A Cat 3 Storm With 125 MPH Winds, Taking Aim At Cuba; Oversight Committee Details Biden's Decline; GOP-Led Oversight Committee Says Biden Pardons Signed By Autopen Are "Void" In Final Report; U.S. Military Strikes 4 Alleged Drug Boats In The Pacific, Killing 14; CNN's Clarissa Ward Returns To Syria To Investigate Austin Tice's 2012 Disappearance; Country Music Superstar Luke Bryan On Living With Grief. Aired 8-9p ET

Aired October 28, 2025 - 20:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

PATRICK OPPMANN, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: And you know, my biggest worry is there's so much debris on peoples roofs. This is people of old tile roofs here, and the wind is going to pick that up. And those become missiles in the dark. You will hear them, you will not see them, they can kill people if they hit you. So, when police say to stay inside, that is very good advice because the winds are going to pick up and that will become deadly.

ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: Yes, we will see what of course really happens as the darkness is completely around you, keep up preparing for that strike coming in just the next hour or so. Patrick, thank you so very much and thanks to all of you for being with us. AC360 begins now.

[20:00:35]

ANDERSON COOPER, CNN HOST, "ANDERSON COOPER: 360": Tonight on 360, punishing winds torrential rains. One of the most powerful hurricanes ever recorded comes ashore, hitting Jamaica as a Category 5 storm.

Also tonight, a new House report openly questions any pardon signed by President Biden with an autopen. And now a top Justice Department official is alleging abuses took place.

And later, a deeply moving conversation with country music superstar, Luke Bryan about grief and loss. Part of my podcast, "All There Is," which starts this new season tonight. How Luke Bryan is talking about grief to help others get through theirs.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LUKE BRYAN, AMERICAN SINGER AND SONGWRITER: This boy, he was nine years old. He looked up at me and he had these big tears in his eyes and he looked at me and he goes, "Mr. Luke, I lost my sister a couple of months ago, and I want to know how you get through life?"

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COOPER: Good evening, thanks for joining us. We begin tonight with the latest bulletin on where Hurricane Melissa is going next. Even as were just starting to find out the damage its already done to Jamaica. It slammed into the island nation as a Category 5 storm lingering with winds of 185 miles an hour.

Now, when it hit, it was the most powerful ever recorded. And now, some seven hours later, with the eye moving off the country's North Coast, it's hard to fully assess the situation because communications are down. One government official says the Parish of Saint Elizabeth in the Southwest, in his words, is under water and has sustained extensive damage.

Now, in some places, people are even being warned about crocodiles, which have been displaced by flooding. As we said, we've got a new bulletin on the storm just in from the National Hurricane Center. CNN meteorologist Derek Van Dam joins us from Kingston. What kind of damage have you been seeing and what's the latest with the forecast?

DEREK VAN DAM, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Anderson, Melissa is still a major hurricane. Category 3, Jamaica's mountainous terrain helped weaken the storm, but it is still a formidable major threat not only to this nation, but also to Eastern Cuba.

So, they need to be prepared, because what we've witnessed on the ground is a taste of what they're about to go through tonight. But when it comes to Jamaica in particular, it is going to be a grueling and very difficult night for the residents here, especially to the West of where I'm located. I'm in Kingston, the nation's capital, where the infrastructure has taken a beating. But we know that the most catastrophic part of the storm occurred where landfall took place. And that is in the Western Parishes of this incredible island nation.

We've driven around, we have seen some minor damage to the nation's capital. But as you can clearly see, were not out of the woods yet. We continue to get buffeted with very powerful winds. The taste of sea salt from the Caribbean Ocean, which is just over my shoulder here. It gets whipped up and pushed over the sea walls because of the strong winds that continue to come through.

ATMs where we try to get money, they -- some of them, the ones that we've experienced on our own with our team, have no cash left in them. And we think that, you know, with the gas stations here being completely closed, gas will be a major issue going forward.

The other issue is the difficulty getting aid where aid needs to be distributed the most and that is the Western part. There's one of those gusts, Anderson, that takes your breath away sometimes because you never know when it's going to come in. That's the nature of these outer bands of the hurricane.

You know, this just gives you an idea of how intense this hurricane is, because were almost were almost a hundred miles away from its inner core, the center of the storm, the most powerful part, which is offshore off of the north coast of Jamaica.

So, it's not even on land any longer and were still getting the winds that you're witnessing here on air. So, as people try to assess the damage, it is not the time. You need to continue to shelter in place because this storm is not done in Jamaica especially the Western and Northern Parishes. And then with Cuba, with its eye set on Cuba, the Bahamas, and eventually Bermuda later this week. This storm is a monster and it's got an incredible destructive history -- Anderson.

COOPER: Derek Van Dam, thank you, be careful.

Joining me now is journalist and documentarian Jonathan Petramala in Kingston, Jamaica, as well. So, Jonathan, what have you been seeing as you've been moving around the island?

[20:05:10]

JONATHAN PETRAMALA, JOURNALIST AND DOCUMENTARIAN: Yes, we tried to move around as much as possible, Anderson. It's so important to try and get the full story in a storm like this. Obviously, way too dangerous to get super close to eye. One of the strongest hurricanes ever to make landfall and that's part of the problem and why we really need to push the fact that aid needs to get in there as quickly as possible. We know that what we haven't seen yet is going to be just incredibly destructive, terrible humanitarian crisis in the Western part of Jamaica.

PETRAMALA: And it's hard to believe, you look over my shoulder and you see lights complete opposite story on the Western part of the island, and that is something that that folks really need to get in their minds and why it's such a rush is because people are in such need of help. Their structures that they likely were riding the storm out, most likely, or is destroyed by the winds -- 185 mile per hour winds at least times.

And then the supplies that they have probably all gone as well. So, they're going to be in desperate need of that aid as quickly as possible. And also, it's a race for attention. The further we get away from the landfall of a storm like this, Anderson, the less attention people kind of remember and pay attention to what's happened. And that reduces the amount of help that comes in from -- out of here in Jamaica.

COOPER: How difficult is it to get around? I mean, just to drive around to get some of the images that you've gotten.

PETRAMALA: You know what, if you draw a line down the center of Jamaica, the Eastern half, it's really almost a normal day in a weird sense of the term. Like not a lot of cars on the roads, most of the stoplights are still working, most of the lights are still on, but then you reach that halfway point you get around Mandeville, and that's when it gets really, really bad.

You have the flash flooding that you see in some of the videos. You see some of the wind knocking over trees. The trees here don't really have deep roots and so they're really prone to collapsing. And so, that's going to be a big effort to clear the highways to get into that Western part of the country.

There's not a huge, massive road system here in Jamaica. So, they're really going to have to focus hard on getting those roads clear so we can get the aid in as quickly as possible. Again, the Western half of Jamaica is completely different story than here in the Eastern half.

COOPER: Jonathan Petramala, appreciate it. Thank you, joining me now is the Prime Minister of Jamaica, Andrew Holness. We spoke with him last night. What a day it has been, certainly Prime Minister, thank you.

What are you hearing about the impact of this storm? What kind of reports of damage are you getting?

ANDREW HOLNESS, PRIME MINISTER OF JAMAICA: Well, just as you have heard from your previous two guests that the corridor of impact would have been in the Southwestern end of the island. Saint Elizabeth, parts of Manchester, parts of West Berlin, and then heading to the Northwestern end of the island, Saint James, Hanover and parts of Trelawny.

It is clear that wherever the eye of the hurricane hit there would be devastating impacts, and the reports that we have had so far would include damage to hospitals significant damage to residential property, housing and commercial property as well and damage to our road infrastructure.

But I think that, you know, we have mounted a very credible and strong preparation and recovery strategy, and that will help us to ensure that our citizens who may now be facing hardship, they can have confidence that the government will be able to reach them immediately after the storm is passed.

COOPER: Yes, I mean, when do you anticipate you would be able to get rescue repair crews? You know, electricity restored to some of the hardest hit parts of the island?

HOLNESS: Well, in the Eastern end of the island, we should be able to start the recovery process immediately. So, tomorrow onwards, we should be able to restore electricity, telecommunications.

In the Southern end of the island. That may take a few more days, but today I had a meeting of my Cabinet. All the ministers are mobilized. We have put the necessary measures in place. So, tomorrow the effort to clear roads to ensure that there is island wide connectivity to return electricity and to deal with the humanitarian issues that may occur. The need for food, medicine and temporary shelter all of those will be mobilized tomorrow.

COOPER: There were some reports of fatalities as people prepared for this. You know, cutting down trees and injuries. Have you gotten any reports of fatalities from the during the storm? Well, you know, as best as we would have tried and we would have informed citizens I'm certain that there would be eventualities and situations. But as of now, I don't have any confirmed reports of deaths.

[20:10:09] But with a Category 5 hurricane with a damage along the corridors, we had explained earlier, we are expecting that there would be some loss of life.

COOPER: Yes, Prime Minister, I appreciate your time tonight. I know you're busy. I appreciate it.

Much more of our breaking news coverage ahead -- thank you.

Hurricane Melissa, when it's done with Jamaica, will be heading toward Cuba, packing powerful winds, drenching rain, storm surge. We will check preparations on the ground tonight with our correspondent in Santiago de Cuba.

And CNN's Clarissa Ward tracking down what happened to American journalist, Austin Tice, who disappeared 13 years ago in Syria. She found a man who was an adviser to former President Assad and one of the last people to see Tice alive.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CLARISSA WARD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: My name is Clarissa Ward I'm a journalist for CNN.

Can I ask you a couple of questions? I'm looking for more information about my friend, Austin Tice.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:15:26]

COOPER: We are back with our breaking news. Hurricane Melissa the most powerful storm ever to hit Jamaica, ravaging the island with heavy winds and drenching rains, now, heading toward Cuba, where its set to strike in the overnight hours, bringing expected 20 to 30in of rain, up to 12 feet of storm surge.

CNN's Patrick Oppmann is standing by in Santiago de Cuba. What's the scene there now? What are preparations like?

OPPMANN: You know, just in the last few minutes, conditions have deteriorated incredibly Anderson. It's dumping rain on us, we're expecting to get up to 20 inches of rain. This is the most mountainous part of Cuba. So, for people living in those remote mountain communities, you get this much rain. It can lead to landslides. It will cut them off for days, perhaps longer, a very dangerous situation.

We are in a total blackout in Eastern Cuba at this moment, Anderson. We're broadcasting right now because we brought a generator with us from Havana. Otherwise, people in Cuba's second largest city are in the dark right now. The wind will continue to pick up as this very powerful storm eventually makes landfall on the overnight hours, the rain continues to dump on people, and they will be in the dark hour. Perhaps the scariest thing is that a lot of people have very old houses, and I've seen from previous hurricanes that pieces of the roof get picked up and that turns into shrapnel.

And so, you imagine spending the entire night in the dark hearing this shrapnel going through the air, not being able to see it as is, very powerful winds from this hurricane comes in and begins to wreak havoc.

So, it's going to be a very, very long night for people in this part of Cuba as a slow moving storm eventually crosses the island tomorrow and heads towards Bahamas. But it is going to take a while, and it's expected to do enormous damage here.

COOPER: Patrick, I appreciate you being there for us, Patrick Oppmann.

My next guests were celebrating their destination wedding with 70 of their friends and family members in Jamaica before the storm hit. They're now stranded at the Grand Palladium Lady Hamilton Resort on the northwest side of the island. Joining me are Tasha Joseph and Leon Joseph, Jr.

Leon, Natasha, you were celebrating your wedding, congratulations. Before the hurricane hit, I understand about 70 of your wedding guests are stranded with you at the resort. How is everyone doing tonight? How are you guys doing?

LEON JOSEPH, NEWLY WED STRANDED IN JAMAICA: We just came back from gathering food from the buffet. So, it chaos in there. Long lines across the trees and debris is down, so it makes it hard to difficult to navigate the resort now. So we're doing our best.

COOPER: Have you been in your rooms, mostly?

TASHA JOSEPH, NEWLY WED STRANDED IN JAMAICA: Ninety eight percent of the time, 98 percent. We've been trying to keep the water out. It's been flooded in here the whole time. Most of the family is doing good. It's a lot of flood, a lot of water. We're trying to ration food, make sure we all have enough food to eat. And they opened the buffet.

So, now everybody's running back and forth trying to gather food for all the families. So, we have designated people getting food to serve everyone.

COOPER: And I see the video that you sent us, you guys are basically wiping water off the floor that's coming in wet from the balcony?

T. JOSEPH: Yes, from the --

L. JOSEPH: There's an open area on the third floor. So, water is just coming in with the wind and things like that. So, and I guess, you know, there's a hill or on a hill, but it's not even. So, the water is going to flush down towards us mostly.

COOPER: Were you, I mean did you try to leave Jamaica when you heard about the storm? Did you just decide, I know a lot of flights were obviously canceled. Did you decide to just ride it out?

T. JOSEPH: No, we attempted to leave. We attempted to leave. We found out about the storm. We found out about storm while we were -- the day of the wedding.

L. JOSEPH: Yes about that --

T. JOSEPH: Yes, and then we tried while we were at the wedding, everyone was trying to enjoy themselves. We we're getting notifications that flights were being canceled. And then the next morning, it was total chaos. So we kept trying, people were on the phone all day trying to get flights and no flights were letting us out. And the airport shut down. So, our entire family is stuck here until Saturday and Friday.

L. JOSEPH: Friday, Saturday.

T. JOSEPH: Yes, Friday, Saturday.

COOPER: Does it feel though, like the worst of the storm is over in your location?

T. JOSEPH: No,

L. JOSEPH: I mean, not to us. I mean, it could be slowing down, but it just the way the resort looks, looks like it's still like, you know, it's damaged and we don't know what tomorrow is going to bring as far as what they have to do to clean up. But right now, it doesn't feel that way. But it could be, you know.

T. JOSEPH: It doesn't look that way either.

COOPER: Have you ever been in a hurricane?

T. JOSEPH: Yes, I've been in a hurricane.

COOPER: So how did this one compare?

[20:15:10]

T. JOSEPH: With Katrina, it was Katrina. I was in Florida.

COOPER: Okay.

T. JOSEPH: This is this is just as bad. This is just as bad. So, yes, this is bad, but we're actually the water. So, watching the water smash against the window and flood the water coming in, it's terrifying. It's terrifying but it's, you know. We're still alive, we're together.

COOPER: The windows were they -- of your room, were they boarded up or, it looks from the video like we can see out the window.

L. JOSEPH: Not our floor, but the first floor and second floors are boarded up. Okay, so the first floors in some of the buildings are boarded up, yes.

COOPER: So did you feel like the window shaking at all or buckling?

L. JOSEPH: Oh yes. T. JOSEPH: And we heard it.

L. JOSEPH: Tons of rattling. It seems like, you know, when you're in an apartment and people are just running back and forth, it sounded like that times ten, it's like doors.

T. JOSEPH: Like smashing our doors to get in.

L. JOSEPH: Breaking in, yes.

T. JOSEPH: Let's put the chair behind the door to hold it because you hear the door shaking and rattling, so was the patio door. We brought in the furniture, but it's still -- it was terrifying. Like we had to keep our kids, like, towards the bathroom so they won't freak out because we have three and five-year-olds.

COOPER: Wow. I have a three and a five-year-old, so I sympathize with what that's like, especially with the three-year-old. I hope they're not too scared. By the way, your wedding photos look beautiful and it looks like it was a great time, nevertheless. And so, you certainly got a memorable story to tell for the rest of your of your long and happy marriage. So, listen, I appreciate you talking to us. I hope you get home soon. And I hope -- I just wish you the best.

T. JOSEPH: Thank you.

L. JOSEPH: Thank you, Anderson.

COOPER: All right.

T. JOSEPH: Appreciate it.

COOPER: Coming up next tonight, the House Oversight Committee saying that Joe Biden was impaired as President and that pardons he issued, including a family member, should be considered void.

Also, previewing my podcast about loss and grief, "All There Is." The first episode with country star Luke Bryan, available right now at cnn.com. "All there Is." I'll talk with Luke Bryan about grief, the losses in his life and how faith has brought peace.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRYAN: You'd be mad at situations, you're going to be mad at God, of course. But really at the crux of it, you know at the heart of it, believe you'll be with him again, and I think that's how I've really tried to get through this life.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:26:43]

COOPER: New actions by House Republicans tonight on a long time complaint of the presidents, namely, President Biden's use of an autopen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R) PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: But that Biden and his people and his probably autopen. It looked like we had an autopen for a President.

I don't use autopen, unlike Biden. Biden uses autopen.

See, no autopen.

Remember when I said, the autopen.

Could I use another pen? What does Biden do?

The autopen is going to become one of the great scandals of all time.

I think the biggest scandal of the last many years is the autopen.

Grossly unfit president who listened to whoever was operating the autopen.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COOPER: Well, the President, as you know, has gone as far as to replace what would be President Biden's portrait of the White House with a framed image of an autopen machine.

Today, after investigating Mr. Biden's mental acuity, the House Oversight Committee entered the fray with the Republican majority issuing a report titled: The Biden Autopen Presidency: Decline, Delusion, and Deception in the White House.

Quoting now, "The committee deems void all executive action signed by the autopen without proper corresponding contemporaneous written approval traceable to the President's own consent", and in a letter to Attorney General Pam Bondi, Chairman James Comer writes, "The committee requests that you investigate all executive actions taken during the Biden administration to ascertain whether they were duly authorized by the President of the United States".

Speaking tonight with CNN's Jake Tapper, Chairman Comer zeroed in on pardons.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. JAMES COMER (R-KY): The last three months of the Biden administration at a time when all of these inner circle people had no contact whatsoever with Joe Biden. He was not giving public appearances. He was not issuing statements as to why he made this decision to pardon these people, or why he made the decision, and what process on the executive order.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COOPER: Well, keeping them honest, some of the testimony from Biden's staffers taken by the committee would seem to cast doubt on the idea that President Biden did not know what he was doing.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NEERA TANDEN, FORMER WHITE HOUSE STAFF SECRETARY: I will say, sometimes I have a reputation for toughness, and I always require my -- the signature part, you know.

RONALD KLAIN, FORMER WHITE HOUSE CHIEF OF STAFF: We use the same process that I thought prior presidents had used.

JEFF ZIENTS, FORMER WHITE HOUSE CHIEF OF STAFF: I don't want you to miss the rigor and the amount of iterations, the amount of time the president spent on pardons. He made these decisions, obviously, but he also made these decisions after, in most cases, many, many meetings.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COOPER: In their minority report, Democrats on the committee cite that any other testimony saying such "Consistent firsthand accounts uniformly contradict Republican claims and portray President Biden as fully engaged and capable throughout his presidency."

Mr. Biden, for his part, told "The New York Times" back in July that all pardons were his decision and the autopen was used because of the volume of signatures. And as for that, Justice Department legal counsels and Democratic and Republican administrations have signed off on the practice, citing how the issue was commonly understood in the framers day, which is that a person's physical signature is not key. Quoting from the 2005 opinion, "Under this well-settled legal understanding, an individual could sign a document by directing that his signature be affixed to it by another".

Opinions of the Attorney General, the Department of Justice have repeatedly applied this understanding in various contexts to conclude that executive branch officials, including the President, may satisfy statutory signing requirements in this manner.

That said, House Speaker Johnson apparently disagrees.

[20:30:23]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MIKE JOHNSON (R-LA): It's unprecedented, there is no legal precedent because no, no previous president had an autopen or had the audacity to have people signing things on their behalf when they didn't even know what was in it. And so, we're in uncharted waters as a nation.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COOPER: Joining us now is Jeffrey Toobin, author of "The Pardon: The Politics of Presidential Mercy." Is there a precedent for what the House Oversight Committee has done?

JEFFREY TOOBIN, FORMER FEDERAL PROSECUTOR: Well, there -- COOPER: Or what they're suggesting?

TOOBIN: There is no precedent for trying to undo a pardon because of how it was signed. And I certainly don't think even in the Republican report that there is evidence that anyone in the Biden White House committed a crime. However, that report does not reflect well on the Biden White House at all. And this rush to grant thousands of pardons in the very last minutes led to a process that is very much open to criticism.

COOPER: I want to put something that Ed Martin from the Justice Department, an attorney from the Justice Department, said. He said that his office, quote, "cannot support the validity and ongoing legal effect of pardons and commutations issued by -- issued during the Biden administration without further examination."

I mean, the Constitution -- what is the Constitution? Does this --

TOOBIN: Well, obviously, there was no --

COOPER: -- (INAUDIBLE) on this? No autopen.

TOOBIN: -- autopen in the 18th century. But the 2005 report of the Justice Department very specifically says that an autopen is an appropriate form for presidents to sign bills or other documents, as long as the president specifically directed it. You can't -- a president can delegate the signing of a document, but he can't delegate the decision about whether to sign something (ph).

COOPER: Would there not -- would -- I mean, I don't know if everything the President says is written down, but wouldn't there be evidence of whether the President had, you know --

TOOBIN: Well --

COOPER: -- requested something?

TOOBIN: That's what the report is largely about, is that how the President did the authorizations. Most of the time, it seems there was some sort of written record of his authorization. But at the end -- and this is one of the problems with presidents jamming all these pardons into the end of their terms, is that it turned into a pretty chaotic process.

And, you know, like George Herbert Walker Bush did this. Bill Clinton did it. Donald Trump did it in his first term. Interestingly, George W. Bush and Barack Obama did not do it. But this idea of jamming all these pardons into the end where there's no political accountability, it leads to all sort of -- sorts of problems, as it did here.

COOPER: So, I mean, one administration sort of looking back, questioning decisions made, things signed. Is that a slippery slope potentially?

TOOBIN: I don't even think there's a legal mechanism to do it. The only way you could actually test whether a pardon is valid is then indict the person again and have the person raise the pardon as a defense. That seems extremely convoluted and unlikely. I think the goal here is to embarrass the Biden administration. And I think that was a success.

COOPER: Yes. Jeff Toobin, thank you very much.

The U.S. military has carried out more deadly strikes on alleged drug trafficking boats. Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth says U.S. forces hit four boats in three strikes in the Pacific Ocean, killing 14 people. Now, this marks the largest one-day operation with a total of 14 boats destroyed, 57 people killed since last month.

And it comes as the U.S. builds up its military strength in the Caribbean with Hegseth vowing to, quote, "track, network, hunt, and kill those involved in the drug trade."

Still ahead tonight, a preview of the new season of my podcast, "All There Is." The first guest is country music superstar Luke Bryan. It's a great conversation. He talks about his own profound losses and grief and how he tries to help others deal with their pain.

First, CNN's Clarissa Ward tracking down a former Syrian government official who may know the fate of her friend, American journalist Austin Tice, who disappeared 13 years ago in Syria.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[20:38:26]

COOPER: There are important new clues in the mysterious disappearance of Austin Tice. He was a budding journalist who traveled to Syria in the summer of 2012 to bear witness to the uprising against the brutal Assad regime. Within two months, Tice was captured by Assad's forces and then vanished.

For 13 years, his disappearance has haunted his family and friends and multiple U.S. administrations. Now, with the fall of the Assad regime, new questions are being asked, including by CNN's Clarissa Ward, a friend of Austin Tice's.

Tonight, her exclusive report on what she's been able to uncover and the questions that remain unanswered.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

CLARISSA WARD, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): These are some of the last known videos of U.S. Journalist Austin Tice shown here for the first time.

AUSTIN TICE, U.S. JOURNALIST: It's clearly a popular revolution, right?

WARD (voice-over): They were shot in the city of Yabroud in Syria in July 2012, shortly before Austin went missing 13 years ago.

TICE: It's just -- it's so moving and peaceful. It's such like an act of community.

WARD (voice-over): Ten months after the collapse of the brutal dictatorship of Bashar al-Assad, his dungeons have been emptied. But the ghosts of tens of thousands of his prisoners remain. Among the missing, Austin Tice, journalist, U.S. Marine captain, Georgetown law student, devoted son and brother, and my friend.

For me, this is personal. I've come to Syria to find out what really happened to Austin and track down the shadowy figure who knows the answer.

[20:40:01]

WARD: I'm just looking back through all of these emails that Austin and I were sending each other. And I have one from Sunday, August 12th. He was getting ready to cross into Lebanon. I was getting ready to meet him in Beirut.

And he says, "If I cross when I have plans to, we'll be throwing back those cocktails pretty soon." Of course, plans never really work out here.

WARD (voice-over): I never heard from him again.

TICE: (Speaking Foreign Language)

Oh, Jesus. Oh, Jesus.

WARD (voice-over): Weeks after Austin disappeared, a video surfaced online purporting to show him held by jihadists. Former U.S. officials tell CNN they quickly determined it was a ruse and that Austin was in the custody of the Assad regime.

Safwan Bahloul was a general in external intelligence at the time, and one of the last people to see Austin alive, summoned in by the man who was holding him.

SAFWAN BAHLOUL, FORMER SYRIAN EXTERNAL INTELLIGENCE GENERAL: I was contacted by a four-son general at that time. He was called Bassam Al- Hassan. He's very close to the President. And he told me, we have caught an American journalist.

We want you to interrogate in a way or meet the guy and see the possibility if he's not a mere journalist, if he's a spy in a way. He told me that he's an ex-Marine officer. He was brave. He was not a shaky character. He wasn't shaky. He was brave enough to face his custody.

WARD: Did he ever ask you for help?

BAHLOUL: If you mean help to be freed, no, not at all. But he told me if I could obtain some things to make his life easy in the cell he was kept there. I told him, like what? He told me, you know, some magazines, journals to read and, you know?

OK, and what else? And he told me, soap and a towel. And I told him, OK. And after that, I think the next day I was called by another guy in Bassam's office. He told me in Arabic (foreign language), which it means our pal just escaped.

They discovered that he used the soap to rub his body, yes body, with the soap to lubricate his body. And he put the towel on broken shattered glass, which is cemented to the external fence.

WARD (voice-over): We managed to get into the compound where Safwan says he interrogated Austin. At the time, under the control of Assad's Republican Guard. It was never a formal prison. The perfect place to hide a high-value captive.

WARD: It could be this, look. Obviously, it's all been refurbished, so it's hard to match the descriptions exactly. But one thing particularly that Safwan talked about was this high window. You can imagine he just spent days and days in here plotting how he was going to escape.

WARD (voice-over): For more than 24 hours, we're told Austin was on the run in the upscale neighborhood of Mazzeh. Perhaps hoping to reach the many embassies and United Nations offices in the area. But he didn't get far.

BAHLOUL: Every security apparatus in Damascus, which there are thousands of operatives, they started the search and he was caught by one of them. And he was redelivered to the National Defense Forces militia, which headed at that time by Bassam Al-Hassan.

WARD (voice-over): Al-Hassan brought Safwan in to see Austin one more time.

BAHLOUL: It wasn't like the previous times I saw him. He was optimistic and energetic.

WARD: But he had lost hope.

BAHLOUL: Yes, absolutely, absolutely. Because I was talking to him and he was not responding. He was in a way we could say depressed. And I never saw the guy again.

WARD: Did you understand when you left what was going to happen to him?

[20:45:01]

BAHLOUL: It's unimaginable even. In my wildest thinking, I wouldn't suspect that he will be -- let's say he will just disappear.

WARD: So let me ask you this, who knows what happened to Austin? Who knows the truth?

BAHLOUL: Bassam.

WARD: Is this him?

BAHLOUL: Can I see it? Yes, absolutely. 100 percent. 100 percent. WARD (voice-over): For years, Bassam Al-Hassan stayed in the shadows. Now, CNN has obtained new, never-before-seen images of him. Known in regime circles as Khal, or Uncle, he was a top Assad adviser and founder of the Iran-backed National Defense Forces militia, blamed for brutal massacres.

After the fall of the Assad regime, Al-Hassan fled quickly to Iran. Then, in April of this year, he showed up in Beirut, Lebanon, and sat down with the FBI for a series of interrogations about Austin. We've been given a tip about where Al-Hassan is now hiding out, an upscale apartment complex in a suburb of Beirut.

One balcony and one man in particular draws our attention. By the end of a long night of watching, we're convinced it's him.

Wearing hidden cameras, producer Sarah Sirgany and I go to confront him.

WARD: Hi, how are you?

My name is Clarissa Ward. I'm a journalist for CNN. Can I ask you a couple of questions? I'm looking for more information about my friend Austin Tice.

BASSAM AL-HASSAN, ADVISER TO FORMER SYRIAN PRESIDENT BASHAR AL-ASSAD (through translation): Come in.

WARD (voice-over): He invites us into the apartment, but he is clearly rattled and asks over and over again how we found him.

AL-HASSAN (through translation): I insist to know, who told you about this place? No one knows where I live.

WARD: I'm not going to tell you how we found out where you are. It's not important. We've been looking for you for a while. We know that you've given multiple different stories. Can you just tell me, because he was my friend, is Austin Tice dead?

AL-HASSAN (through translation): Of course, Austin is dead. Austin is dead.

WARD (voice-over): He tells us he explained to a team from the FBI that President Assad gave him the order to execute Austin and that the order was carried out by a subordinate.

AL-HASSAN (through translation): I don't want to protect Bashar al- Assad because he abandoned us and left us. This relates to President Bashar only.

WARD: Yes. But you sent him to his death.

AL-HASSAN (through translation): I don' t want to go into any details. These are details that I told the team. I told the team that I received the order and I passed it on. That's it.

WARD: Can you just tell me one thing? Can you tell me when Austin died?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translation): From 2012? October?

AL-HASSAN (through translation): He passed away.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translation): He passed away. 2012? 2013? 2013?

WARD (voice-over): He refuses to give any more information. When he asks to take a photograph of us, we decide to leave.

At the door, he talks about Austin's mother, Debra Tice. His voice cracks.

AL-HASSAN (through translation): I owe her an apology and it upsets me to remember it. Truly.

WARD: Understood.

AL-HASSAN (through translation): I wish what happened hadn't happened.

WARD (voice-over): It is a gut punch to think that Austin may have been killed 12 years ago.

WARD: One thing that he was very emphatic about is that Austin is dead. Austin is dead. And he wants to pass his condolences to Debra.

WARD (voice-over): CNN has confirmed that Al-Hassan failed the FBI polygraph test. What is less clear is what parts of his story are a lie. In September, a U.S. delegation, including FBI investigators, came to Damascus to search for Austin's remains, based on a location given to them by Al-Hassan. They came away empty-handed.

The full truth of what happened to my friend may well never be known, like the fate of countless Syrians.

WARD: Everyone was keeping so many secrets.

BAHLOUL: Well, in a way, in a way.

WARD: Everyone was lying?

BAHLOUL: It's all about loyalty and worship, and nearly worshipping the commander. The supreme commander, he's a president, da-da-da-da- da. He's everything.

So, yes, lying is widely spread in the X regime, yes. It's nothing personal. I was doing my job. That's all it is.

[20:50:20]

Austin may simply be remembered as yet another victim of the endless lies and senseless cruelty of a ruthless regime.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

COOPER: Clarissa joins us now. What an extraordinary investigation you have done. Has his family responded to these claims?

WARD (on-camera): So, we have been in touch with the Tice family throughout, and I should say, you know, I've been close to them now for 13 years, Anderson. They have always maintained that Bassam Al- Hassan is a pathological liar. They did provide a statement to us regarding this specific report in which they said very simply, Austin Tice is alive, and we look forward to seeing him walk free.

And certainly in every conversation I have had with Debra Tice, Austin's mother, she is convinced, she feels this in her gut, and until she sees irrefutable evidence to the contrary, she will never give up that hope.

COOPER: What was it like for you to hear this, I mean, to do this? You knew him.

WARD (on-camera): It was honestly really hard, because even though I was aware of the reports, Anderson, that Bassam Al-Hassan had told the FBI that Austin had been killed and that Bashar al-Assad had given the order, when I'm sitting in that apartment with him and he's looking me in the eyes and he's like, of course Austin is dead, Austin is dead, it was a moment where I felt honestly a little bit winded, and I think it took --

COOPER: Yes.

WARD (on-camera): -- a moment afterwards to try to process what that really means and unpick the lies from the truths --

COOPER: Yes.

WARD (on-camera): -- and the half-truths and --

COOPER: Well, incredible also to see this man who was a big wig in the brutal regime of Assad and now has this pathetic existence of, you know, allegedly of guilt and remorse.

WARD (on-camera): Yes.

COOPER: Clarissa Ward, thank you.

WARD (on-camera): Thank you.

COOPER: Coming up next, superstar country singer-songwriter Luke Bryan, he's the first guest in the new season of my podcast about grief called "All There Is." The audio and video available right now for the podcast on our grief community page at CNN.com AllThereIs.

Luke Bryan's willingness and ability to share the grief he's lived with after the deaths of his brother, sister, and brother-in-law is profound.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LUKE BRYAN, SUPERSTAR COUNTRY SINGER-SONGWRITER: You just have to learn to understand that it's a normal emotion that life -- your life will never be the same, and closure's not my word. I think that I live every day going, you know, true pieces of my heart and soul and mind were taken, never to be given back.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[20:57:09]

COOPER: The new season of my podcast, "All There Is," premieres tonight. My first guest, country singer-songwriter Luke Bryan. He's an incredible guy. He's one of the world's best-selling music artists. He's a judge on American Idol. He's been married to his wife, Caroline, since 2006. They have two boys, Bo and Tate.

Luke Bryan knows terrible tragedy. His brother, Chris, was killed in a car crash. His sister, Kelly, died in 2007. Her husband, Lee, died of a heart attack. In his pain, though, Luke Bryan routinely reaches out to others, and he talks about grief, something so many of us find hard to do.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRYAN: One of my most beautiful moments I ever had as a country music singer is I was in North Carolina, and I'm doing my meet-and-greet. And, you know, meet-and-greets, you're meeting fans and taking pictures, and there's a lot of chaos. But this boy, he was nine years old. He looked up at me.

And he had these big tears in his eyes, and he looked at me. He goes, "Mr. Luke, I lost my sister a couple of months ago, and I want to know how you get through life." And when that nine-year-old, Anderson, when that nine-year-old told me that, it was -- I dropped down on my knees and just did the best job I could, did the best job I could in that moment to help that young man.

And I said, "Buddy, you talk to your sister like she is still here. You treat her, you treat her like she is here, every day of your life. You talk to her when you go to bed." And it was just -- and that was, when that boy did that, it really affirmed my need to talk about my loss.

I mean, when you're able to touch a kid that age, I was like, yes, any time I can talk about this, it is -- it's the right thing to do. And there's just so much of that going on in the world. And I think some people --

COOPER: Yes.

BRYAN: -- have been insulated from it, thank God. But then the people that have tragedy, I hope they can hear our stories and understand they're not alone in their journeys with it.

COOPER: I mean, the fact that that nine-year-old boy could vocalize that and say that to you in that moment is incredible.

BRYAN: You know, when I looked up at is -- I looked up at his parents, and his parents, they went there knowing that he wanted to ask me that. And, gosh, there wasn't a -- I mean, it was one of the most powerful things that I've ever been a part of.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

COOPER: We can watch my entire conversation with Luke Bryan, video and audio, right now on our grief community page, that's at CNN.com/AllThereIs. You can also listen to it wherever you get your podcast.

In addition, I'm starting a weekly companion show called "All There Is Live." It's going to be live-streamed on our community page every Thursday night, 9:15 p.m. I hope you join us for that. The first one is in two days on Thursday. We can come together there, talk about grief and not feel so alone in it. All of it is at CNN.com/AllThereIs.

That's it for me. The news continues. I'll see you tomorrow. The Source with Kaitlan Collins starts now.