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President Castro's Daughter Speaks Out; Former Ukrainian Minister, Exiled in Russia, Speaks Out; Imagine a World

Aired December 18, 2014 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN HOST (voice-over): Tonight as Cuba turns a new page in its long history, we hear for the first time from a

leading member of the Castro family, the president's daughter and Member of Parliament Mariela Castro joins us live from Havana.

Also ahead President Putin tries to calm fears over Russia's economic chaos, which has been triggered mainly by interference in

Eastern Ukraine and dropping oil prices. We hear from a member of Kiev's old regime, who says the country must stay united.

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OLEKSANDR KLYMENKO, FORMER MINISTER OF REVENUE AND DUTIES OF UKRAINE (through translator) Donbas has always been and is part of

Ukraine.

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AMANPOUR: Good evening, everyone, and welcome to the program. I'm Christiane Amanpour.

The sea change in U.S.-Cuba relations is reverberating around the world and tonight, for the first time, a Castro speaks out. I'm joined

by Mariela Castro Espin, whose father, Raul, the Cuban president, gave a historic address to the Cuban people yesterday announcing that relations

with the United States would never again be the same.

People in Havana wept when they heard the news, so long inured to the Cold War reality that their country has lived under for five

decades.

But the official government line seemed most elated about America's release of the last three of the Cuban 5, men convicted and jailed for

espionage here in the U.S. "Returned," declared state newspaper Granma and Mariela Castro tweeted enthusiastically about their freedom and her

father met with the men after they touched down in Havana.

So what will all of this change mean for the Cuban people themselves? And will President Castro hasten much needed reforms?

Member of Parliament and an important civic leader Mariela Castro joins me live from Havana. And our interview is being broadcast on our sister

network around Latin America.

So Ms. Castro, welcome to the program. It's good to have you back again.

Let me ask you, as you stand there, at this very historic moment, how you feel about this change in relations? You were just born when

the embargo was imposed on your nation.

MARIELA CASTRO ESPIN, DAUGHTER OF RAUL CASTRO (through translator): Yes, exactly. I was born in 1962 and the economy blockade, the economic

financial and commercial blockade had been imposed against our revolutionary and independent process and really I feel -- felt excited

and I feel that a dream has come true, something that we wanted for so many years, normalizing the relations, something we always wanted since

the beginning of the start of the revolution as declared by our leader, Fidel Castro.

AMANPOUR: You mentioned your leader, Fidel Castro, who is your uncle. Does he know about this? How does he feel about this?

ESPIN (through translator): Well, I'm going to answer I don't know why this is a view about this process but I imagine that at any moment

he's going to write his reflections as usual. But I'm certain that he's really happy about it. He must have participated in all this decision-

making.

AMANPOUR: Did you know about it? These incredible secret negotiations that your father, the president, and others were involved

with for the last 18 months, we understand, with American officials, with Canadian officials at the Vatican.

Did you know about all of this that was going on?

ESPIN (through translator): I didn't have the slightest idea . Yesterday I was surprised as you have been, as all Cubans have been and

all over the world. And I think that in Cuba, when things like this are done, they are done in silence and so this is the result that we had. I

do not participate or I don't take part in my father's job. We each do our jobs.

AMANPOUR: You are a member of parliament and you've been expressing your great happiness but especially you and the official

Cuban media and parliament and everybody in Havana has been very happy with the U.S. release of the remaining members of the so-called Havana

5.

What was most important to the Cuban government? Was it the release of these men? Or is it the easing of sanctions and the shift in

relations with the United States?

ESPIN (through translator): There are two things that are extremely important to our people and the fact that they having started

together this is then a surprise and also extremely gratifying. I have said myself on interviews that I had to choose a better (INAUDIBLE) and

then the negotiations. This step taken, which is so important in our history and to do it together really I would like to say congratulations

to both parties.

AMANPOUR: You had told me the last time we spoke that you had a lot of hope for President Obama when he was elected and you hoped that

this actually, this day would come to pass.

Your comment, your reflections on President Obama today?

ESPIN (through translator): First of all, I would like congratulate President Obama for his courage. Really, what I wanted the

most was for President Obama to go down in history as the U.S. president who ended the blockade and also who free the Five. I never thought I

would have been (INAUDIBLE). I didn't want to lose hope and I'm glad to have faith and to have the trust and confidence that this possibility

was going to be possible.

So I'd like to thank President Obama and all the teams and people who have supported this cause, not only for the Five but also to start

normalizing relations between Cuba and the U.S. I'm certain that this is being celebrated also there in the U.S., some valuable that I have

met and many other people.

AMANPOUR: You speak about the embargo. As you know, the embargo is an act of Congress. Only an act of Congress can lift it. And there

are a lot of opposition now, voices being heard in the U.S. in Congress and indeed in Miami, where some of the older generation are pretty angry

that President Obama has done this.

What hopes do you have for the embargo to be lifted?

And what do you say to the Cuban Americans, those who still oppose rapprochement with the Castro regime?

ESPIN (through translator): I think that the American people, a great deal of a part of the American people, those that want to have

relations normalized and also to put an end to the embargo as a matter of justice and also for the presence of Cubans, the presence -- and

Cuban Americans in the U.S. is significant for the policy of the U.S. against Cuba. I've talked to many people. I've seen articles and I

think that many people are keen on having relations normalized. Some people are benefiting from the blockade economically but we cannot

continue to carry on with the policy that benefits only a small amount of people. And also the result will affect the U.S. interests and also

the civil liberties for the U.S. I think these Cubans who don't agree with this intelligence confer measures should reflect and try and get

support and ethics in this sense.

AMANPOUR: As you know, the burden of proof right now rests a lot with you in Havana. People want to see a much more pluralistic politics

in Havana, political parties really addressing human rights, even Human Rights Watch says that the government remains a very repressive

government.

You are a civic leader who has worked hard for all sorts of minority rights, particularly in the LGBT community.

Do you believe that this is an opportunity to open up Cuba inside? Will there be more political pluralism, much better human rights?

ESPIN (through translator): Well, the first step taken in favor of human rights in Cuba is to put an end to the blockade. That is the most

important thing. This is the greatest impediment to our development. We have suffered a lot because of it. On the other hand, I can say that

the Cuban revolution is a product and a historical experiment just to try and find equally and social justice and to cover human rights. We

have been working in this direction, have free education and so on.

But we've got yet many challenges identified by the people and we have a lot of deadlines. We're going to continue working towards. The

fact that is opening in the relations it will help. But as Cubans, we do not identify (INAUDIBLE) the democracy that in many countries that

have many parties and yet they have not achieved democracy.

And they have kept on repressing the people when they start to demand and claim their civil rights and liberties. This is an issue we

can continue and talk about further ahead. It's very interesting and it's fantastic that it's part of this dialogue.

AMANPOUR: So do you foresee some greater liberalization for people's lives in Havana?

You know, more freedom of the press, obviously we hear there's going to be more Internet, more communication freedom. But people still

are swept up and put into jail if they are overtly and sometimes covertly against the government.

Do you think that Cuba can now, with the relations changed, and that threat removed from them, can move towards a more human rights-

centric policy for the people there?

ESPIN (through translator): Well, the revolution of politics is focused on the people's interest. The people's representatives are part

of the government. Our policy is to continue deepening and strengthening this strategy of social justice on the basis of our

sovereignty and to achieve better mechanisms for independence and to strengthen our ties with all countries in a respectful manner as it has

been possible now with the United States.

We haven't had any issue with freedom of expression. We can say whatever we want. Nobody can shut us up. This is just maybe a cliche

invented in relation to Cuba and all the North Americans who have come during Obama's term, who has granted (INAUDIBLE) to come to Cuba, beside

the blockade. They have seen it. I don't know whether this has been published in the U.S. but they say there is freedom of expression. But

I would like to see it myself.

AMANPOUR: I'm sure that your father, the president, will have a lot to talk about with President Obama. The White House says they

foresee him making a trip to the White House.

How will he enjoy that?

ESPIN (through translator): I'm sure that he will enjoy a lot. And he will use a more diplomatic language than myself talking about

these issues.

AMANPOUR: All right. Mariela Castro Espin, thank you so much for joining me from Havana. Thank you very much.

And now, from the Cuban missile crisis to the fall of the Berlin Wall, Havana's solitary history has been closely linked with its former

Soviet sponsor. But now in a reversal of fortune, Cuba has come out of the cold and the Russian ruble can't stop falling. The ruble losing its

clout -- after this.

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AMANPOUR: Welcome back to the program.

In the end of year news conference in Moscow, the Russian President Vladimir Putin blamed, quote, "external factors," such as oil prices and

sanctions for Russia's financial crisis. And he prepared his people for even tougher times ahead.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VLADIMIR PUTIN, PRESIDENT OF RUSSIA (through translator): This situation could continue approximately -- no, we can say exactly -- for

two years. But that is -- does not have to be like that. The situation can be -- could improve sooner, even the first or second quarter of next

year or the end of next year. Nobody can say that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

AMANPOUR: President Putin attributed 25 percent of the crisis to Western sanctions, following his annexation of Crimea. And interference

in Eastern Ukraine. And today the E.U. slapped on even more sanctions.

Ukraine's economy, which is heavily reliant on Russia, is also suffering. The IMF says the country will need billions more in bailout

money. Under ousted President Viktor Yanukovych, the economy lost billions of dollars. My next guest was a key minister in his

government.

What responsibility does Oleksandr Klymenko bear? I spoke to him from Moscow earlier this week.

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AMANPOUR: Oleksandr Klymenko, welcome to the program. Thank you for joining me.

KLYMENKO (through translator): Good evening. Thank you for having me.

AMANPOUR: Let me ask you first, you are in self-imposed exile in Moscow.

Do you ever foresee a time when you can go back to Ukraine?

Would you go back and face the music, so to speak?

KLYMENKO (through translator): Well, I hope I will go back to Ukraine in the immediate future. My concerns for my country and my

people all are with me and I'm prepared to face the Ukrainian people and look at them with my own eyes and I'm extending my helping hand to my

people without stopping for a moment.

AMANPOUR: You say you're willing to look the Ukrainian people in the eye, Mr. Klymenko.

But are you willing to tell them how the country managed to lose $100 billion in corruption and tax avoidance under the Yanukovych years,

when you were the minister of revenue and in charge of taxation?

KLYMENKO (through translator): I worked in the civil service for more than nine years. I was a technocrat minister. I was first asked

to head the tax authority. And then because my team achieved so much, I was asked to lead the ministry.

I did a lot as a minister for my country and people were increased budget revenues by many times over. We reformed the tax and fiscal

areas were achieved.

I indicated -- and international effects (ph) (INAUDIBLE) noted that. I am prepared to contribute all and every day in the office of

minister of tax and revenue of Ukraine.

AMANPOUR: On the other hand, you are accused personally of overseeing a massive network of phantom companies which are accused of

being corrupt but also a massive tax avoidance scheme.

How do you answer that?

KLYMENKO (through translator): Christiane, unfortunately, there is a very poor political trend in Ukraine. Once the new administration

comes into office, they start to denigrate everything else. I've been able to see the criminal file against (INAUDIBLE) an opportunity to deny

all those accusations when I was in charge of the tax ministry.

I was fighting against the black economy and our achievements were many times more important than those microeconomic indicators would have

before.

The shadow economy did recede and tax revenue increased at a much faster rate than the entire Ukrainian economy did.

AMANPOUR: It is true that corruption and oligarchy have plagued Ukraine for decades, some say for the last 23 years at least.

Through many, many different administrations. Do you acknowledge any shortfalls and shortcomings then in your administration?

KLYMENKO (through translator): Well, of course, we did have shortcomings. We failed completely many things, which includes taxation

of individuals, the simplification (ph) of the tax payment seizure.

But then there are things for which I'm personal proud of. Firstly, we invited PricewaterhouseCoopers, one of the best auditors, to

help us carry out reform in our ministry with permission an anticorruption strategy for our ministry.

AMANPOUR: Let me go back to February, when all this sort of collapsed around your ears. There is video of you at the airport in

Ukraine as you were rushing to leave, I believe along with the prosecutor general, which has also raised questions about, you know,

various ministries being in bed with the justice system as well.

You, though, say you want to see the file against you; you want to face the Ukrainian people.

Are you willing to go back to Ukraine then?

KLYMENKO (through translator): I'm afraid what happened in February supports my statement about a political purge against me just

because I was labeled as somebody involved with the Yanukovych regime.

Nobody wants to know that I was a technocrat minister. There was no justice then. This was about revolutionary expediency and political

purges.

Of course I want to go back to my country and my people. I'm sure that a lot needs to be done to unite Ukraine instead of disuniting it

and -- the way it's being done now because they're deleting the people of Donbas out of the Ukrainian people. I can't look at this without a

pain in my heart. And I want to be helpful to Ukraine.

AMANPOUR: As a former official in Donetsk, as a Ukrainian, do you take the side of the pro-Russian separatists?

Do you think that Eastern Ukraine should be part of Russia?

KLYMENKO (through translator): I think the Eastern Donbas should decide for themselves where they should belong. What is important is to

hear Donbas today, its decision, its voice should be important.

But Donbas has always been and is part of Ukraine. But it's important to note that Donbas is not against Ukraine. But Donbas is not

happy with the government in the last 23 years. The government has been -- is the key perpetrator of everything that's happened. This is what

they should be held responsible for.

AMANPOUR: Oleksandr Klymenko, thank you so much for joining me from Moscow.

KLYMENKO (through translator): Thank you.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: Now as all of this continues to cost Russia dearly, one patriotic news outlet has turned to the night sky for some answers,

employing an astrologist. According to the stars, the ruble will make a full recovery by 2017, which is, in fact, what President Putin predicted

at his news conference earlier.

As Russian television looks to the heavens, Hollywood stars are feeling the heat of hell -- after a break, imagine a world where a film

about an assassination threatens to destroy the people who created it. The Sony hack makes a direct hit -- after this.

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AMANPOUR: And finally tonight, the Sony hacking scandal has become one of the most notorious cyber crimes of recent years, with sensitive

business information from major corporations made public and available on the Internet.

The White House said today the Sony hack is being treated as a serious national security matter and CNN understands the U.S. plans to

blame and name North Korea as the culprit -- soon.

It's thought that Sony angered the North with its movie, "The Interview," about journalists posing as assassins and trying to kill the

leader there, Kim Jong-un. A hacking group called The Guardians of Peace have claimed responsibility and the studio has not only canceled

the film's premiere in New York this week, but now it's pulled it from all movie theaters.

And actors and artists like Rob Lowe and Steve Carell have derided Sony for, quote, "their lack of nerve" in stopping the film's release.

The North Korean government denies all the accusations but praises the hacking as, quote, "a righteous deed."

Surely now everyone from the boardroom to the White House is taking their online security more seriously tonight.

And that's it for our program. Remember you can always watch the show online at amanpour.com, and follow me on Facebook and Twitter.

Thank you for watching and goodbye from New York.

END