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CNN's The Arena with Kasie Hunt
Soon: Trump & Hill Leaders Meet As Shutdown Looms; New: Mamdani Talks To CNN After Adams Exit NYC Race; Now: Lawmakers Speak After Trump Meeting. Aired 4-5p ET
Aired September 29, 2025 - 16:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[16:00:28]
KASIE HUNT, CNN HOST: Hi, everyone. I'm Kasie Hunt. Welcome to THE ARENA. It's wonderful to have you with us on this Monday.
Right now, at the White House, President Trump set to meet with congressional leaders from both parties as the federal government once again heads toward a shutdown. Government funding is set to run out tomorrow night if there's no deal between Republicans and Democrats.
And at this point, we have been here so many times before and like every shutdown showdown that came before, everyone here in Washington says it's not my fault.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. CHUCK SCHUMER (D-NY), SENATE MINORITY LEADER: God forbid the Republicans shut the government down. The American people will know it's on their back. First, they're in charge. They have the house, they have the Senate, they have the presidency. So, they know it's in charge -- they're in charge.
REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES (D-NY), HOUSE MINORITY LEADER: Here's the thing: Republicans control the House and the Senate. And as a Republican president, if the government shuts down, it's because Republicans want to shut the government down.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: So, there you go. The public blame game.
But behind the scenes, Democrats in the Senate are going to have to decide just how far they are willing to go. You remember last Friday they voted down a stopgap bill that would have kept it open. They're going to have another chance to do that tomorrow, it looks like.
But there's also this element of the high stakes game of chicken with Republicans. They control both chambers of Congress and have some risk of getting blamed. Republican leaders in the House passed that stopgap measure that Democrats can't stand, and then they bailed out. They left town. They are still gone. They are unavailable to vote again on a different stopgap.
And two sources tell CNN that in a call this morning, the House Speaker Mike Johnson urged Republican members to stay unified.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. JOHN THUNE (R-SD), SENATE MAJORITY LEADER: What the Democrats have done here is take the federal government as a hostage and for that matter, by extension, the American people.
REP. MIKE JOHNSON (R-LA), SPEAKER OF THE HOUSE: It's fine to have partisan debates and squabbles, but you don't hold the people hostage for their services to allow yourself political cover. And that's what Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries are doing right now.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: All right. Let's get off the sidelines and head into THE ARENA. Our panel is here.
And we're also joined by CNN's Kristen Holmes. She's live for us at the White House. CNN's Manu Raju is up on the Hill.
Kristen, I'll start with you just because the action has come down to your end of Pennsylvania Avenue, the president's meeting with congressional leaders expected to start soon.
What is the White House thinking right now?
KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Kasie, I mean, we're talking about whether or not there's going to be a deal when it comes to the White House. They'll say, yeah, sure. If Democrats are willing to just sign on to another stopgap, sign on to a short term CR, or just keep the government open. They believe that if it's going to come down to who's going to blink first, that it's not going to be them.
And President Trump has essentially said that if Democrats aren't going to come around and aren't going to give up some of their ideas, then there is no negotiating to be done. Something he repeated earlier today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I'm meeting with, as you know, a couple of Democrats in a little while about the country, about keeping our country open. They're going to have to do some things because their ideas are not very good ones. They're very bad for our country. So, we'll see how that works out.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HOLMES: Now, of course, it should be noted that congressional Democrats did have a meeting scheduled with Donald Trump that then the president canceled.
Now this has been rescheduled. But when it comes down to who is going to be at blame, the White House believes that they have stronger messaging, that they can paint this as a Democratic issue. Now, whether or not that's true obviously remains to be seen. But they put their money on themselves when it comes to messaging this as something that the Democrats are at fault for.
HUNT: Yeah, well, and look, to that point, Manu Raju, this really has put Schumer in a bind between his general inclination and the general Democratic idea that keeping the government open and running is kind of a better thing for the country. They seem to be less afraid. You know, they're more afraid of shutting it down than Republicans certainly seem to be. And the base of his party, which is demanding that he stand up and do something.
MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, because back in March, he ultimately agreed with Republicans and voted to keep the government open. And he endured serious blowback from the left flank and from House Democratic leaders. Now, he is very much on the same page as House Democratic leaders. At least he's projecting that publicly.
Hakeem Jeffries and Schumer have a series of demands. They want to reverse health care cuts that were enacted in Trump's signature policy achievement, the One Big, Beautiful Bill Act.
[16:05:05]
They also want to extend expiring Obamacare subsidies. That is a big part of what they are pushing for. Those are set to expire at the end of the year. And I had a chance to ask Hakeem Jeffries whether or not it would be a red line for him on this issue and whether or not he would be open to supporting a straight extension of government funding simply if the White House were to agree to negotiate. It's clear that he is taking a very firm line.
But some Senate Democrats aren't going as far as he is.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RAJU: You get some assurances that they're willing to negotiate on extending the Obamacare subsidies. If that happens, would you be then be open to a clean CR for the next seven weeks?
JEFFRIES: Enough with the games that Republicans have been playing connected to the health care of the American people, and no one can trust their word on health care. Are you kidding me?
RAJU: Hakeem Jeffries has made very clear he wants a deal in actually written on the extension of the subsidies or they're going to vote no on a clean CR? That is a red line.
SEN. TIM KAINE (D-VA): Yeah. You're giving me what somebody in the House is saying and a red line is hypothetical. So, I would like to see some assurance that we're moving down the path to something meaningful.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
RAJU: And that last comment is significant. It's coming from Senator Tim Kaine of Virginia, who stayed, of course, represents a significant amount of federal workers who would, of course, be hit very hard by a government shutdown as the White House threatens to for mass firings going beyond furloughs, which has been commonplace in past shutdowns. How do senators like Tim Kaine deal with this issue?
That's going to be one of the big things to watch here, Kasie, if and when we do get to a government shutdown, because at least seven Senate Democrats would be needed to join with Republicans to vote to advance legislation to keep the government open, would they would simply assurances to negotiate on issues like health care be enough to win over those Democrats? Will Democrats be divided, or will they be unified and continue to take this firm line against the White House? Those are huge questions at this significant moment for Washington and for the country.
HUNT: Yeah, for sure. All right. Manu Raju, Kristen Holmes, thank you both very much.
All right. Our panel here, CNN legal analyst Elliot Williams, CNN special correspondent Jamie Gangel, former Democratic congressman from South Carolina, Joe Cunningham, and the former speaker pro temp of the House, Patrick McHenry.
We're also joined by our new -- with this week two, week three of our text chain. Additional analysis from some of our top reporters and contributors. They will chat along extra for those of you who watch us on mute, you know, you know who you are.
Mr. Speaker, that's the hat we're going to put on for you today.
PATRICK MCHENRY (R), FORMER SPEAKER PRO TEMPORE: Bad news rolls up.
(LAUGHTER)
HUNT: But seriously, just help us understand what the dynamics are here. The -- Schumer -- Chuck Schumer is in a real box here. And obviously, there's a lot flying off Capitol Hill information wise. But the big question is, is he going to cave? What are the pressures on him in your view.
MCHENRY: So, let's step back strategically and see -- see where this is, not about the substance but about where we are strategically. So, the speaker of the House and the minority leader have two very different positions than do the majority and minority leader in the Senate. The Senate is a completely different body.
You saw a continuing resolution passed out of the House with two Democratic votes last week. They did their job. They punted for six weeks like we've done dozens of times over dozens of years, right? So, this is a fairly normal thing. And in fact, is a continuation of the very policy that Schumer voted for in March.
Schumers issue is while saying Republicans run the Washington is in fact, true. But the filibuster means that the minority leader in the Senate has power and has power for the last 50 years because of our budget process, they need 60 votes in order to pass a continuing resolution. The minority leader has to be a part of it.
I'm sorry. Leadership is tough. His incentives are so different than Jeffries. Jeffries wants to vote no and become speaker of the House after the midterm. Schumer has to manage through the year, day by day. It's a very different, nasty thing for Senate majority leader.
So they've made a decision. They're going to stick together and they have a choice of good policy and good strategy, bad policy, bad strategy.
And they've chosen a third course, which is dumb -- dumb strategy.
(LAUGHTER)
MCHENRY: And I can tell you, the Republican, for many shutdowns, a shutdown is a dumb strategy because you have no way to get out of it except hope.
ELLIOT WILLIAMS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: You know, you know, one of the best --
HUNT: We're going to clip and save that, guys, like that is perfect for the --
WILLIAMS: One of the best -- one of the best things I heard recently is that the party that is seen as clamoring for a shutdown, or at least open to it invariably throughout time, is the one that gets blamed for it. Now, historically, that's been Republicans -- think of 2018 and Ted Cruz and so on.
But there -- you know, better than anybody else.
[16:10:02]
There is a portion of the Democratic base that wants more of a fight and is will -- and is signaling to the leadership that they're willing to let it happen. It's hard to see how that doesn't come back to having Democrats being blamed for it in some way.
HUNT: Congressman, how do you see this?
JOE CUNNINGHAM (D), FORMER SOUTH CAROLINA CONGRESSMAN: I mean, nobody is winning when Washington stops working, right? I've been through the longest government shutdown when I came into office in 2019. You know, no shutdown is good. A few days or a week or two is bearable because people receive back pay. You go past a month like we did in 2019.
Then, you know, it gets a little scary for those people who are being forced to work like our service members don't get paid. But nobody's winning and everybody's losing. I think, personally, that Democrats are going to be losing more because, you know, I think back not long ago when Schumer was in the White House and Trump was threatening to shut it down, shut it down.
And Democrats are saying you cannot shut the government down no matter what. And here we are with -- you know, the Democrats threatening to hold and shut down. And this goes into a larger piece of the credibility that Democrats struggle with right now. And this will go in the back of people's minds as they start -- as Democratic Party is trying to repair its credibility.
It's like -- well, you said this a couple of years ago, and now, you're saying something different. So --
HUNT: Right.
CUNNINGHAM: And I do agree that Republicans are in control of the message. And I agree with Hakeem Jeffries, like, practically speaking, Republicans do control the House, the Senate, the White House. But the messaging and the narrative is still being driven by Republicans.
HUNT: So, let's stick with that because, Jamie, I want you to weigh in on this.
JAMIE GANGEL, CNN SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT: Yeah.
HUNT: The messaging -- and this was Karoline Leavitt, the White House press secretary. And, you know, oftentimes in these situations, the question is whose message is more easily understood, right? And here's what the White House is currently able to say about this.
Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KAROLINE LEAVITT, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: There is zero good reason for Democrats to vote against this clean continuing resolution. They voted for this exact same bill 13 times in the past. We want to keep the funding for our military, for our veterans, for our women and our children in this country, continuing, we want the government to stay open. The president is giving Democrats one last chance to be reasonable today.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: They're basically saying, Jamie, it's a clean CR. You voted for it before. Why aren't you voting for it now?
GANGEL: What could possibly go wrong, right? It's -- look, this is a game of chicken. And I think Trump has made it clear through his messaging that he is not scared to shut the government down. He believes that it will hurt the Democrats more. And that becomes sort of the psychological game here. Who gets blamed? Can he out message the Democrats?
We don't know whether Schumer is caving. Theres been some reporting today that that sounds as if it may be going in that direction. But Donald Trump has his success in messaging has made this harder on the --
WILLIAMS: The interesting thing with Karoline Leavitt there, she said a couple words that are that win with everybody -- military, veterans -- GANGEL: Right.
WILLIAMS: -- children. The one word, the two words she didn't say, health care because they've looked into that issue and it just doesn't poll well for Republicans right now and had to stay away.
MCHENRY: And the reason why the Democrats think that they have an advantage in this fight is they have one issue --
WILLIAMS: Health care.
MCHENRY: -- one issue only, that they are popular with the American people over President Trump, and that is health care.
So they're going to raise this issue and a whole set of litany of things that are unreasonable to ask for related to it.
And at the end of the day, what we'll see is Schumer will cave. That is the only way we reopen the government. Democrats who are defending the state against who they think is an authoritarian, are going to give the administration more authority in a shutdown. OMB has enormous authorities and reading of the law, and Russ Vought has a plan for their lives, and they're not going to like it.
And the pain level will go up before there will be reasonable outcomes of the Senate. We'll have a clean CR, and then we'll actually have some policy making post that.
HUNT: So, what do Democrats get out of that if they do it? Anything?
MCHENRY: A valiant fight.
(LAUGHTER)
MCHENRY: This reminds me a lot of 2013 where Obamacare was to the Republicans advantage going into that shutdown. And we were so successful in that shutdown that Obamacare was more popular after the Republicans raised Obamacare.
(LAUGHTER)
WILLIAMS: The caveat that --
MCHENRY: And Republicans were less popular.
WILLIAMS: If it were to go on for -- to your question, Kasie, if it were to go on for a really long time, then at a certain point, Democrats narrative about Republicans own government. And look, the government has been shut down for six months, look --
HUNT: Maybe --
WILLIAMS: Other than that, no, no, no, I'm with all of you on.
MCHENRY: The Republican base would be mostly fine with that.
WILLIAMS: Yeah.
CUNNINGHAM: I think the Democratic Party would be a much better standing if they're able to better articulate what they're shutting the government down -- subsidies, health, health care in general. I don't think it's tangible enough.
MCHENRY: It all comes out in the wash.
CUNNINGHAM: For people to put their hands around it.
MCHENRY: Whatever you thought the issue was, no one will care.
[16:15:01]
They will just blame you. Now, the question environment --
(LAUGHTER)
GANGEL: The man who knows.
(CROSSTALK)
WILLIAMS: Right? But do you have some feelings to work through, Patrick?
MCHENRY: This is therapy for me. Thank you so much.
(LAUGHTER)
CUNNINGHAM: You can talk about it more.
MCHENRY: You think it's going to work out for you, and it doesn't. And it doesn't. So this is not going to end well for anyone involved, but it's going to be a lot of drama for us to follow.
HUNT: Great for the country, guys. You heard it here first.
All right. Coming up, Republican Congressman Mike Lawler will join us here live in THE ARENA. What he thinks could be done to avoid a shutdown. And what was really said this morning on a private call with GOP lawmakers and the speaker of the House.
But first, a first look at a brand-new interview right here on CNN Zohran Mamdani sitting down with our Erin Burnett what he's saying about that decision by Eric Adams to drop out of the New York City mayoral race, and whether he thinks Donald Trump had anything to do with it.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:20:21]
HUNT: All right. We're back now with a first look at a big new interview here on CNN. New York City mayoral candidate Zohran Mamdani talking to our Erin Burnett, just one day after the current mayor, Eric Adams, decided to abruptly drop out of the race, now essentially making it a two-man race between Mamdani and the former governor, Andrew Cuomo. Although there was, of course, a Republican in there who could be a spoiler one way or the other.
CNN anchor Erin Burnett joins us now with more from her interview.
Erin, what did he tell you?
ERIN BURNETT, CNN ANCHOR, ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT: All right, so you know, what's amazing about this is how it's become so national, right? In part because President Trump has wanted to make Zohran Mamdani the face of Democrats as Trump says, communists, because that is how he has painted Zohran Mamdani, who obviously is the frontrunner to lead the biggest city in the country.
Interestingly, Kasie, I spoke to him today, the day after Eric Adams dropped out of the race, the current mayor, who had made it really a three-way race, plus that spoiler.
As you indicated, the last time I spoke to him was the day after he won the primary, kicking out Andrew Cuomo at the time temporarily.
So having a chance to see him on the day after each of these of the two biggest events of this election for the biggest city in the country, he's really making it very much about Trump and that Trump has a side here. Trump called "Reuters" today and said, I think it gives Andrew Cuomo a much better chance. I'd welcome it.
I mean, he's not making any --
HUNT: He's not hidden. It's all there for us at all. Yeah.
BURNETT: No, not at all. Not at all.
But also a lot of questions, which Trump pardoned the mayor of New York, Eric Adams, you know, and whether there's been any more discussions about Eric Adams working in the Trump administration, what kind of quid pro quo perhaps there is. And I asked Mamdani about that. And here's that exchange.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: So, Eric Adams, we know met privately with Trump's Middle East envoy, Steve Witkoff earlier this month is our understanding, and that one of the topics was possible opportunities in the Trump administration, one of which possibly could be ambassador to Saudi Arabia.
Why do you think Adams dropped out now? We are essentially one month from election day.
ZOHRAN MAMDANI (D), NEW YORK CITY MAYORAL CANDIDATE: I have to be honest with you. I think it's a fool's errand to try and understand what Eric Adams does and why he does it. What I think is clear, though, is whether we're speaking about Adams or we're speaking about Cuomo, we're speaking about supposed leaders who are willing to put their own personal ambition before the needs of the people they're supposed to serve.
New Yorkers are right now under attack from an authoritarian administration in Washington. Donald Trump has ushered through legislation that will throw them off their health care, take SNAP benefits away from them, all in service of the largest wealth transfer this country has seen. And instead of fighting back against that vision, instead of fighting for New Yorkers, these politicians are looking to get on the phone with Donald Trump to see what it is that they could broker together.
BURNETT: Do you think that there is some sort of a deal between Trump and Adams?
MAMDANI: I -- I can't speak to that. All I can tell you, though, is that, you know, Donald Trump is clearing the way for Andrew Cuomo because Donald Trump knows that Andrew Cuomo will clear the way for Trump's agenda.
And New Yorkers are tired of that agenda. They want someone who's actually beholden to the people of this city, not to the White House.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BURNETT: And, Kasie, obviously, Trump has made this national right in his recent comments. I counted just a few times he's spoken about Mamdani, including today when he spoke about him eight times. He called him a communist, right?
So as much as Trump has made it clear he wants Andrew Cuomo to win, he also thinks that Zohran Mamdani winning would be great for Trump in branding Democrats as communists.
HUNT: All right. Erin Burnett, really enjoy you -- thanks for bringing some of that to us first, and we really look forward to watching the rest of it. You can watch more of Erin's interview with Zohran Mamdani. That's going to be tonight at 7:00 p.m. Eastern, right here on CNN.
Erin, thank you for that.
Our panel is back with more on this. Our text chain also here to weigh in and follow along.
Congressman McHenry what -- what is your sense of Zohran Mamdani's political skills and how they stack up against a president that is clearly trying to define him a certain way to the country?
MCHENRY: Well, there are two different things at play here. So, what you saw in Mamdani's interview was a politician of high capacity. I mean, the way he pivoted out of a serious question into his litany of policies he thinks are winning for him is expert, high level expert at a national level, and New York is the ultimate set of local politics.
But for President Trump, this is about telling the rest of America about what is happening in urban America. You see this with crime. You see this with immigration. You see the fight that he's having with local liberally run for generations governments, that I think the American people should look at and say, that's a failing, way to go and see that there's a conservative alternative.
[16:25:13]
And the president is highlighting that.
HUNT: All right.
MCHENRY: So, Mamdani plays an important role for the president. And an example of urban liberalism and urban decay. And that is helpful. That is a very different set of things than winning the mayor's race, which you saw. The skill that Mamdani has, and now he has a head-to-head. It's going to be interesting to watch.
HUNT: Relatively head-to-head. I want to bring the Republican candidate in for a second, in a second. But Jamie Gangel, I really want to talk about Andrew Cuomo for a minute. Like, why is Donald Trump like as much as it would be? As Erin notes, you know, an easy way for President Trump to run against Democrats in the midterm election. He actually seems to want Andrew Cuomo to be governor of New York and not Mamdani. Why?
GANGEL: I do not know, but I just to your point, Congressman, about his ability -- his political ability, his messaging, Andrew Cuomo has been exactly the opposite.
I understand we think the race gets closer but I still do not see a road for Andrew Cuomo here.
HUNT: Well, so let's watch briefly. Mamdani, who congratulated Cuomo on Sunday when this news broke. Let's take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAMDANI: And Andrew Cuomo, you got your wish. You wanted Trump and your billionaire friends to help you clear the field. But don't forget, you wanted me as your opponent in the primary, too.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
GANGEL: I rest my case. That's it. Yeah.
If you watch Cuomo's straight to camera videos, you can actually really see the contrast, at least generationally.
WILLIAMS: And to Patrick's point, he pivoted right to the billionaire point, which is a winner of a point. So, you know, he's a savvy politician.
The other thing, and Gloria Pazmino in the text thread just noted this a second ago. There's still a moderate Republican in the race in Curtis Sliwa, a moderate law and order focused Republican. He's built 40, 50 years of talking about this issue.
The notion that Andrew Cuomo has any prayer of winning as mayor of New York is just ought to be out the door. It's just not going to happen based on who's in the race.
HUNT: And let's hear from the Republican in this race, Curtis Sliwa. He was on Fox News earlier today. Take a look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
CURTIS SLIWA (R), NYC MAYORAL CANDIDATE: If we believe the polls back in June, Andrew Cuomo was going to have a coronation as mayor. Zohran Mamdani was 40 points down. He beat him by 13 points.
As soon as that happened, I was being told drop out for Eric Adams, drop out, drop out for Eric Adams. Imagine how foolish I would have been yesterday if I had dropped out for Eric Adams, who dropped out. And by the way, the king of the dropouts is Andrew Cuomo, bar none. Take it away, Mr. President, and we can beat Zohran Mamdani.
I'm the Republican candidate. I'm the only law and order candidate. I will do it. You're the law and order president.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: So, there you have Curtis Sliwa with his -- now he's not. It's really in this to win it, right?
We're looking at honestly, if you -- if you put up the Marist polling, before Adam's exit, Mamdani was running 21 points ahead. They polled that said if Adams exited, Mamdani would be 16 points up. If both Adams and Sliwa were to drop out, Mamdani would still be up by ten points.
Now, as Sliwa pointed out, the polling has been flawed in this race, but it doesn't really change the outcome.
(LAUGHTER)
HUNT: But it left me speechless.
CUNNINGHAM: I mean, if you look at the South Carolinian to be kind of the Nostradamus of New York City mayoral races, it may not be the best one, but it is -- I mean, it's a tough road to hoe for Cuomo, right?
WILLIAMS: Yeah.
CUNNINGHAM: There's no doubt about it.
WILLIAMS: And a couple of things you should be clear. I mean, no we would never ask someone from the Palmetto State to speak eloquently about New York. However --
HUNT: As a moderate Democrat, however. Moderate the hat, I was asking.
WILLIAMS: But they become national races because of what New York represents and means. Patrick was talking about this earlier, but it's one of the rare mayor races, mayoral races where people running have to have a foreign policy position and think of the number of people who've come from either running for mayor or been mayor that ran for president one day.
HUNT: They all want to be president.
WILLIAMS: They want to be president. It's not -- it's not -- I mean, Zohran Mamdani.
(CROSSTALK)
HUNT: Or maybe will be.
MCHENRY: But I will say I will say to you, the flight out of New York for taxpayers, people that want basic law and order and they want functional schools and a modicum of choice on their schools.
WILLIAMS: Oh, I'm not disputing any of that.
MCHENRY: This is a great gift. If Mamdani is elected, it is a fabulous gift, not for liberalism, but for conservatism. It's a big win --
WILLIAMS: All I'm saying is Rudy Giuliani, Al Sharpton, Mike -- I mean, none of them president of the United States, but they're national figures that all came out of this, crucible of New York city politics.
GANGEL: Can I just ask you one question? Why did the Republicans not nominate a serious candidate? This could have -- if you had --
MCHENRY: He's been a fixture since the 1980s.
GANGEL: I know, I'm a New Yorker.
MCHENRY: Right? And I have dear friends that have that have been the nominee and run for governor -- I'm sorry, mayor of New York as Republicans. It is a vicious, crazy thing.
Even Bloomberg couldn't spend as a Republican. He also had to be an independent at the end. So it's a tough set of politics.
But time out. These are Democrat cities, right? The path to the mayorship is through the Democratic Party. They've nominated somebody who is basically a proto communist.
And so, I mean, this is a hell of a thing to bear as a party, but he will be a major voice for the Democratic Party at a time where they're going to try to appeal to moderate folks like your former district and western North Carolina and these Democratic -- former Democratic constituencies are going to look at this and go, I'm not for that.
I mean, this is a hell of a gift for the two Democratic leaders in the House and the Senate from New York. Woohoo. I love that.
HUNT: Everyone from New York.
All right. We could talk about this all afternoon, clearly. But we are going to have to take a break. I do want to thank our friends for joining us in THE ARENA text chain.
We so appreciate your time. As does anyone flying in an airport watching CNN on the wall.
The rest of our panel is going to stand by.
Coming up next, we are keeping our eye on the White House, where congressional leaders are set to meet with the president to see if there's any way to avoid a government shutdown. We're going to talk live with Republican Congressman Mike Lawler.
Plus, the president's new warning to Hamas after meeting with Israel's prime minister and whether a ceasefire is actually close at hand.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I have a feeling that we're going to have a positive answer, but if not, as you know, Bibi, you'd have our full backing to do what you would have to do.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[16:36:07]
HUNT: All right. Welcome back.
Chuck Schumer, Hakeem Jeffries stepped to the microphones at the White House. Let's listen.
SCHUMER: We met with the president for the first time since all of these issues started, even though we have requested repeated meetings with Leader Thune, Speaker Johnson and the president. We have very large differences on health care and on their ability to undo whatever budget we agree to through rescissions and through impoundment, as well as pocket rescissions. And we've I think for the first time, the president heard our objections and heard why we needed a bipartisan bill.
Their bill has not one iota of Democratic input. That is never how we've done this before. When I was leader, we negotiated four times with Republicans, and we never had a shutdown. And so, it's up to the Republicans whether they want to shut down or not.
We've made to the president some proposals. Are Republican leaders will have to talk to them about them? But ultimately, he's the decision maker. And if he will accept some of the things we asked, which we think the American people are for on health care and on rescissions, he can avoid a shutdown. But there are still large differences between us.
JEFFRIES: It was a frank and direct discussion with the president of the United States and Republican leaders. But significant and meaningful differences remain. Democrats are fighting to protect the health care of the American people. And we are not going to support a partisan Republican spending bill that continues to gut the health care of everyday Americans, period, full stop.
There's a Republican caused health care crisis that is causing hospitals and nursing homes and community-based health clinics all across the country in rural America, urban America, small town America, the heartland of America, and Black and Brown communities throughout this country. And that crisis is happening right now.
And that's why we believe there is urgency to both keeping the government open, reaching a bipartisan spending agreement that actually meets the needs of the American people in terms of their health, their safety, their economic well-being and quality of life, while also addressing the dangerous Republican health care crisis.
SCHUMER: We laid out to the president some of the consequences of what's happening in health care, and by his face and by the way he looked, I think he heard about them for the first time. The closing of rural hospitals, the fact that so many clinics are closing.
And I don't know if he knew this before, but the fact that people will pay $4,000 more a year, $400 more a month, close to $5,000 more a year on their health care premiums. If we don't do anything and people don't know what to do. The average working family can't afford that.
I told him how I met a mother who was crying to me because her daughter had cancer, and what has happened with health care, with what they have done, she's going to watch her daughter suffer and maybe die. And so, he seemed to, for the first time, understand the magnitude of this crisis. And we hope he'll talk to the Republican leaders and tell them we need bipartisan input on health care, on rescissions into their bill.
Their bill does not have a --they never talk to us. Thune didn't negotiate with me. Johnson didn't negotiate with Hakeem. And on the key issues, the appropriations committee, which is talked about three of the smaller bills, they're good bills.
[16:40:03]
They said the appropriators couldn't agree and said, kick it up to the four leaders. They still haven't talked.
JEFFRIES: Let me say we're deadly serious about addressing the Republican cause health care crisis because its a deadly serious issue for the American people. Largest cut to Medicaid in American history hospitals, nursing homes and community based health clinics closing right now. The fact that more than 20 million Americans are on the brink of experiencing dramatically increased premiums, co-pays and deductibles because of the Republican refusal to extend the Affordable Care Act tax credits, which benefit working class Americans.
And we pointed that out. I pointed that out. Working class Americans, their health care. That's what we're fighting to preserve, to defend and to strengthen.
SCHUMER: Thank you.
We take questions or no?
Okay. Thank you everybody.
(CROSSTALK)
HUNT: All right. We were listening to Hakeem Jeffries and Leader Schumer talking about the looming government shutdown.
Joining us to discuss further is Republican congressman from New York, Mike Lawler. He's on the house financial services and foreign affairs committees and also represents one of the few swing districts that currently exists in America.
Congressman, thank you so much for being here. I really appreciate it.
I want to know what you think here. The house passed its bill with a couple Democratic votes left town. And now the question is whether or not Senate Democrats are going to carry forward this threat that they made their towards potential shutdown, or are they going to try to find a way through this?
What did you hear in their comments there?
REP. MIKE LAWLER (R-NY): Well, unfortunately, I heard a whole lot of hypocrisy and, rhetoric that doesn't match previous actions. The fact is that the CR that was passed through the House is a continuing resolution of the current spending, which means that it is the Biden budget and the Biden policy riders.
So, for Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries to say they weren't involved in the negotiations, there was nothing to negotiate. It's a continuation of the current spending levels and the current policy riders from fiscal year '25. So, the idea --
(CROSSTALK)
HUNT: All right. Sir, unfortunately, I have to pause you now, you have to watch this along with me.
LAWLER: -- that they didn't have a negotiation --
HUNT: This is the vice president and the speaker of the House, and Leader Thune. Let's listen.
J.D. VANCE, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We have disagreements about tax policy but you don't shut the government down. We have disagreements about health care policy, but you don't shut the government down. You don't use your policy disagreements as leverage to not pay our troops, to not have essential services of government actually function.
You don't say the fact that you disagree about a particular tax provision is an excuse for shutting down the people's government and all the essential services that come along with it.
If you look at what Chuck Schumer has said in the past consistently, it's whatever our disagreements are, lets negotiate with them. Let's talk about them. Let's figure out a bipartisan solution. But you don't shut the government down.
In other words, you don't put a gun to the American people's head and say, unless you do exactly what Senate and House Democrats want you to do, we're going to shut down your government. But that's exactly what they're proposing out there.
Now, we have to remember, they're very frustrated. They say that they're very frustrated about the fact that this negotiation has not taken place until today. But if you look at the original -- the original thing they did with this negotiation, it was a $1.5 trillion spending package, basically saying to the American people, we want to give massive amounts of money, hundreds of billions of dollars to illegal aliens for their health care, while Americans are struggling to pay their health care bills. That was their initial foray into this negotiation.
We thought it was absurd. We told them it was absurd, and now they come in here saying that if you don't give us everything that we -- that we want, we're going to shut down the government. We think that's preposterous. We think it's totally unacceptable. And we think the American people are going to suffer because these guys won't do the right thing.
Now, I want to make one final point here. You will hear a lot from Senate Democrats, from House Democrats about the fact that American health care policy is broken. Well, we know that American health care policy is broken. We've been trying to fix it for the eight months that we've been in office. But every single thing that they accuse about being broken, about American health care is policy the Democrats have supported for the past decade.
So, if they want to talk about how to fix American health care policy, let's do it. The speaker would love to do it. The Senate majority leader would love to do it. Let's work on it together. But let's do it in the context of an open government that's providing essential services to the American people. That's all that we're proposing to do.
And the fact that they refuse to do that shows how unreasonable their position is. I think were headed to a shutdown because the Democrats won't do the right thing. I hope they change their mind, but we're going to see.
I'll let the speakers say a few words.
JOHNSON: Thank you, Vice President Vance. I want to thank the president as well. They showed strong leadership today. They invited the four leaders over here because the president has operated in good faith, and he demonstrated that very well.
[16:45:02]
The problem is that Chuck Schumer and Leader Jeffries refused to acknowledge the simple facts. Let's review what the simple facts are. As the vice president was saying, this is the commonsense thing to do. This is the right thing to do. This is the simple thing to do.
By way of review, the House is getting back to the way the regular appropriations process is supposed to work, 12 separate appropriations bills passed through the House Appropriations Committee, three off the floor. The Senate doing their work as well.
All this in bipartisan fashion, by the way. They passed three bills in the Senate. Those bills don't match up exactly. So, for the first time in years since 2019, you have a conference committee that is being constituted between the house and the senate. This is the way a bill becomes a law. They work out the differences.
All this is happening in bipartisan fashion. The problem is we've run out of clock. September 30th is the end of the fiscal year, so we need a little more time. So, what we did in the Republican majority is the right responsible, simple thing. A clean continuing resolution, a short term nonpartizan continuing resolution.
It's only 24 pages in length. Leader Thune has a copy. If you want to see the exhibit. There's nothing partisan in here. No policy riders, none of our big party preferences because we want to do the right thing by the American people and allow more time for negotiation.
Now, there's a reason that Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries have come out here stomp the feet, saying that they can't go along with this. They're trying to bring in extraneous issues. They issued a counterproposal. You should go take a look at what they requested, $1.5 trillion in new spending that is unrelated to the ongoing appropriations process.
They wanted to, as you said, restore taxpayer funded benefits. Okay? Hardworking taxpayers in America, they want to -- they want to take your funds and give that for benefits to illegal aliens. They want to restore that because we got rid of it.
They want it. They want to prop up left leaning media outlets, $500 million they threw in on top of that, $1.5 trillion on a seven-week stopgap funding measure. We're not going to do that. They know we can't do that, and we never have in the past.
During the Biden administration, there were 13 threatened shutdowns. The Republicans in the minority did the right thing. We kept the government open. We're simply asking for the Democrats do the same.
Again, I want to thank President Trump for the strong, solid leadership. He listened to the arguments, and they just wouldn't acknowledge the simple facts. I want to thank vice president here for showing his leadership as well.
If the Democrats make the decision to shut the government down, the consequences are on them. And I think it's absolutely tragic. We've never said that was a good idea. We never believed it is.
And I want you to remember when we voted in the House, we passed it out of the House. The House has done its job. We did that almost two weeks ago. Every Democrat in the house except one voted to shut the government
down. That is the record. And don't forget it.
I ask Leader Thune to step in here.
THUNE: Thanks, Mr. Speaker. Mr. Vice President.
This right here, ladies and gentlemen, is what we're talking about, 24 pages. It's a continuing resolution to fund the government through November the 21st. I don't know where they're saying this is some huge, partisan thing. This is something we do fairly routinely.
And when the Democrats had the majority on 13 different occasions, they had the majority. President Biden was in the White House. We passed continuing resolutions to fund the government. This is purely and simply hostage taking on the -- on behalf of the Democrats.
The Republicans are united. House Republicans, Senate Republicans, President Trump, the House has passed a clean funding resolution to fund the government until November the 21st. It's clean. It is bipartisan. And it is short term.
But it gives us enough time to finish the appropriations process, which is the way we should be funding the government. So, Republicans in the House and the Senate, president united, they've passed the bill. This is setting -- sitting right now at the Senate desk.
We could pick it up and pass it tonight. We could pick it up and pass it tomorrow before the government shuts down. And then we don't have a government shutdown. It is totally up to the Democrats because right now they are the only thing standing between the American people and the government shutting down. We're all in favor of funding the government. And this is something that's been done routinely 13 different times by the Democrats when they had the majority. So, it's -- to me, this is -- it's purely a hostage taking exercise on the part of the Democrats. We are willing to sit down and work with them on some of the issues. They want to talk about, whether it's the extension of premium tax credits with reforms. We're happy to have that conversation.
But as of right now, this is a -- this is a hijacking of the American people, and it's the American people that are going to pay the price.
REPORTER: Can you respond to us?
VANCE: Russ, do you want to say a few words?
RUSSELL VOUGHT, DIRECTOR OF THE OFFICE OF MANAGEMENT AND BUDGET: Sure, sure. We want to keep this government open. It is not good for the American people to have the government shut down for any period of time. We will manage it appropriately. But it is -- it is something that can all be avoided. It can all be avoided by accepting a reasonable position, which is what the House has passed and what sits at the Senate desk, which is to continue to fund the government with a short-term continuing resolution.
[16:50:06]
It has never been a viewpoint that $1.5 trillion is a reasonable amount of spending to be included on a short-term CR. This is hostage- taking. It is not something that we are going to accept. And we hope that the Democrats come back from the brink, fund this government and allow us to move forward. Thank you.
VANCE: Great.
What's up?
REPORTER; So just to be clear, is there room for negotiation here with Democrats? And you mentioned you believe that we are headed toward a government shutdown, is the federal government preparing to fire federal workers if the government does shutdown?
VANCE: Well, first of all, we have to keep essential services functioning as well as possible. If the Democrats shut down the government, and Russ has been tasked with making sure that's possible.
But you asked about negotiations. One of the things I admired about the president, but frankly, the entire team's approach during the conversation we just had with Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries was -- you know, yeah, they have some crazy ideas, giving taxpayer money to illegal aliens for health care. That's a crazy idea.
Funding transgender surgeries in Peru. That's a crazy idea. But they had some ideas that I thought were reasonable, and they had some ideas that the president thought was reasonable. What's not reasonable is to hold those ideas as leverage and to shut down the government, unless we give you everything you want.
There were multiple times where Leader Jeffries or Leader Schumer would say, you know what, we should be doing this. And the president of United States would say, yeah, absolutely. Let's have that conversation. But we're going to do it in the context of the people's government being open.
We're not going to let you take the people's government hostage and then give you everything you want. And that's really the state of the negotiation.
Yeah. Let's have a conversation. Let's have a negotiation. We're not going to shut down the government because we won't give the Democrats everything that they want.
Kaitlan?
KAITLAN COLLINS, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Respond to what Senator Schumer said that there were aspects about health care ending for certain people, that the president was learning about for the first time in that meeting. And was the president open to a deal on the ACA subsidies?
VANCE: As he was learning about it for the first time, thanks to Chuck Schumer. But what I -- what I will say is, look, we have put a $50 billion
rural hospital fund into the actual -- the Big Beautiful Bill that we passed a few months ago, because we know that under Biden administration's policies, there are a lot of small town hospitals, a lot of rural health care that was getting shut down and that was struggling. We're trying to fix that problem.
In fact, we're happy to work with Democrats to fix that problem. We want to work across the aisle to make sure that people have access to good health care. We are not going to let Democrats shut down the government, take a hostage unless we give them everything that they want. That's not how the people's government has ever worked. That's certainly not how it's going to work under the Trump administration.
(CROSSTALK)
JOHNSON: This is very important on health care. Their counterproposal, what Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries are demanding is that they claw back the $50 billion that we put into the rural hospital support structure. They want to take that back. We're not going to do that. We passed that because we have to allow for that.
Also, if they shut the government down, not only are troops unpaid, federal workers and all the services that everybody relies upon, but the WIC program, the nutrition program for women, infants and children, they will not get that program will not be funded.
FEMA won't be funded. We have hurricanes off the coast of the United States right now. This is serious business.
You have telehealth. You have mental health services. All that that's funded by the government would stop if Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries and the Democrats have their way. The Democrats shut down would be damaging for the country. We can't allow for it.
VANCE: Thank you all.
REPORTER: CR -- was there any mention of passing a shorter CR?
HUNT: All right. Let's bring back Republican Congressman Mike Lawler to talk a little bit more about this. There you had the Republican side and you were in the middle of explaining kind of the dynamics of this shutdown question.
In your view, if it does shut down, who gets blamed?
LAWLER: Look, this is entirely a shutdown of the Democrats making. Let's go through the facts. House Republicans passed a continuing resolution, a clean CR that keeps the current spending and current policy riders in place. Those were agreed to under the Biden administration.
So, shutting down the government is not an option to me. And I have been both under Democrat administration and Republican administration. I have always voted to keep the government funded and open. Chuck Schumer and Hakeem Jeffries have long been on record lecturing
America about the need to avoid a government shutdown, about the need to pass a clean CRs to keep the government funded and open so that we could finish our appropriations work. All of the issues that they're raising, whether we agree or disagree, are for negotiation during a final appropriations package.
The Affordable Care Act subsidies that came in place under COVID -- during COVID, I signed on to legislation to extend that by a year. But that is not something that you hold hostage. With government funding, shutting down the government is going to hurt the very people that they claim they want to protect.
[16:55:01]
And so, from my vantage point, this is very simple -- Chuck Schumer needs to immediately go back to the Senate, meet with Leader Thune, agree to pass the CR that is sitting at the Senate desk so that we can keep the government funded through November 21st and negotiate through all of these outstanding issues.
There is zero justifiable reason to shut the government down, period.
HUNT: We, of course, unfortunately, some of our time got a little bit abbreviated because we've been listening to the leaders talk about this.
I did want to ask you about another issue that was front and center today, and that was President Trump meeting with the Israeli prime minister, Benjamin Netanyahu, at the White House. The sense there that the president was really trying to strongarm the Israeli prime minister into accepting this peace plan, there even was an apology to the Qataris as part of all of this.
Do you think that President Trump is squeezing Benjamin Netanyahu in a way that the Israeli prime minister perhaps does not like?
LAWLER: No, I think obviously the objective has been to bring this conflict to an end, eliminate the threat from Hamas and get all of the hostages returned to their families, whether they are alive or deceased.
These negotiations have been happening in earnest for months, for months since President Trump took over, Steve Witkoff has been working tirelessly, along with Secretary Rubio, to get an agreement, working with not only the Israelis, but our Arab partners. And I can tell you, as chair of the Middle East and North Africa Subcommittee on the Foreign Affairs Committee, these discussions and the contents of this plan have long been, negotiated with the Israelis and our Arab partners. The objective is to eliminate the threat of Hamas.
Obviously, I've said many times the fastest way for a ceasefire is for Hamas to release the hostages and surrender. In the absence of that, you have to have a negotiated settlement. Thats what we've been working towards. Everybody who has been decrying this for months should be applauding the efforts of President Trump to bring this war to an end.
HUNT: And finally, Congressman, we also were talking earlier on the show about the mayor's race in New York city. Of course, very close by to where you are. I'm interested to know if you think that Eric Adams should be given a job in the Trump administration now that he has dropped out of the race.
LAWLER: In my opinion, no. I think Eric Adams did the right thing by dropping out of the race. He had no path to win. And now, we will see what happens in the coming weeks. I'm supporting Curtis Sliwa. I personally do not think Andrew Cuomo is a solution. If you look at all of the challenges facing New York, most of it is at his hands.
Cashless bail was signed into law by Andrew Cuomo. New York became a sanctuary state under Andrew Cuomo. He shut down Indian Point and banned natural gas, giving us an energy crisis of epic proportions in New York.
So many of the challenges were created by Andrew Cuomo. So, from my vantage point, he's not a solution. But that all being said, the voters will decide, one thing is clear Zohran Mamdani will be a disaster for New York City. Anyone who espouses banning private property ownership, defunding the police, shutting down prisons, legalizing prostitution, government-run grocery stores is not fit to serve.
And given his response, by the way, when he was asked point blank by Melissa Russo of NBC News just yesterday to condemn Hamas and he refused to do so. As far as I'm concerned, he's unfit to serve as mayor of New York City, the largest city with respect to Jewish population anywhere outside the state of Israel.
HUNT: All right. Congressman Mike Lawler, very grateful to have you on the show today, sir. Thanks very much for being with us.
LAWLER: Thanks, Kasie.
HUNT: All right. We've got just about a minute here, so let's do a lightning round, predictions. Is the government going to shut down this week?
MCHENRY: Yes.
HUNT: Yes?
CUNNINGHAM: Yes.
HUNT: Straight up, yes?
WILLIAMS: Yes. Briefly.
HUNT: Jamie, what?
GANGEL: Elliot said --
HUNT: Just briefly? GANGEL: What Elliot said --
HUNT: All right. So that only took 10 seconds guys, in case you were wondering.
MCHENRY: Well, what's the over/under? Give us the over/under.
HUNT: Sixty seconds.
MCHENRY: How many days?
WILLIAMS: I think they figure something out within a week.
HUNT: Well, it's your prediction I want.
MCHENRY: I'll take the over.
HUNT: How long do you think it's going to last?
MCHENRY: Well, I -- it's over a week and I think it's because the Democrats need this opportunity to fight the president, elevate themselves and elevate the issue of health care. That is the only thing they got. And so, they have to go play.
WILLIAMS: If it's over a week, its going a long --
CUNNINGHAM: It's going to take as long. As long as polling comes back about the Virginia governor's race, because there's a lot of people going to be impacted.
MCHENRY: Russell Vought has a plan.
HUNT: All right. Now, we are actually out of time. Come back soon. Thanks to all of you.
If you've missed it at home, you can always catch up on our podcast.
But right now, don't go anywhere.
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