Return to Transcripts main page
CNN's The Arena with Kasie Hunt
Trump's Renewed Iran War Prompts Renewed GOP Midterm Worries; Early 2028 Poll Shows AOC Leading Dems In New Hampshire; Gen Z's Advice To A First-Time 9-To-5 Worker Goes Viral; 1969: Neil Armstrong & Buzz Aldrin Become First Humans On Moon; Drink Up! New Study Says 5 Cups Of Coffee A Day Is Safe. Aired 12-1p ET
Aired July 25, 2026 - 12:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And the nose, look at the shape of the nose.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And that looks like a fuselage. I mean, that other wing isn't there --
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Right.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: -- but that could be a plane. That's a plane. I think there's a really good chance that's a plane.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BIANNA GOLODRYGA, CNN ANCHOR: Just incredible.
Well, that's all we have time for. Don't forget, you can find all of our shows online as podcasts at CNN.com/audio, and on all other major platforms.
I'm Bianna Golodryga in New York. Thanks so much for watching. Christiane will be back next week.
[12:00:42]
KASIE HUNT, CNN ANCHOR: Hi everyone, I'm Kasie Hunt. Welcome to The Arena Saturday.
Is the war with Iran driving President Donald Trump to lose touch with his own supporters? After two weeks of renewed American airstrikes, Iran seems no closer to cutting a deal, let alone surrendering. The latest fighting once again sending oil prices higher than they've been in almost two months.
But President Trump is defiant, insistent he's got Iran right where he wants them. The trouble is, it sounds like he and his biggest supporters are on very different pages.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I don't understand how it's possible that Iran has the capabilities to fight this way. DONALD TRUMP (R), PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We control the strait, they don't control anything.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He promised to keep us out of endless wars or unsatisfactory wars, and now he's in one.
TRUMP: We're doing very well against the Islamic Republic of Iran.
REP. MIKE JOHNSON (R), HOUSE SPEAKER: And now we've got to wrap it up.
TRUMP: We're not finished at all.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Clock is ticking for President Trump to get out of this war before voters head to the polls.
TRUMP: Americans aren't against the war. The -- a poll just came out.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: All right, on that note, my panel's here in The Arena. CNN Legal Analyst, Former Federal Prosecutor Elliot Williams, the Co-Host of the Interview podcast from the New York Times, and a CNN Contributor, Lulu Garcia-Navarro, Former Biden White House Communications Director Kate Bedingfield and Former Trump White House Communications Director Alyssa Farah Griffin, both CNN Political Commentators.
Thank you all very much for being here.
Alyssa, quite a snapshot there of the President with one message and some of his core supporters with another. Where are we on the politics of this as, of course, the President seems to be seriously weighing a massive escalation?
ALYSSA FARAH GRIFFIN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: It really makes you wonder if the President is getting sound advice from advisers around him. My concern in the second term has been that there's not as many voices who are willing to tell him what he doesn't want to hear but needs to hear because he seems convinced that his base is still with him. He seems convinced that the Republican Party is with him on Iran, and they frankly are not.
Listen, I'm quite hawkish. I'm somebody who could be convinced of a just war in Iran. I supported taking out the Ayatollah. I am not convinced that this war makes sense. There has not been a national address to sell it. There has not been a messaging campaign on Capitol Hill to say, this is our plan, this is our strategy.
And as of today, our munitions are depleted. So if the U.S. were to, God forbid, be attacked, we would be in a less safe place to defend ourselves. He is sending Republicans into the midterms with high gas prices, an unpopular war, and inflation. Like, I don't know what he is thinking, but someone is not telling him reality.
LULU GARCIA-NAVARRO, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: And measles, and measles.
GRIFFIN: And measles. And, honestly, diarrhea too. I'm sorry. ELLIOT WILLIAMS, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Exploding diarrhea. Let's be clear (ph). No, you know what's interesting? It's what is the President thinking. This seems to be the first issue that can't just be solved with vibes. If you notice over these years that we've all lived with the President, you send a tweet out, some social media, say you'll fix it in two weeks, and eventually the problem can go away, or at least Republicans will get behind you.
Because this deals with an unpredictable international actor, the President simply -- the playbook that has worked for him politically for so long just doesn't work.
KATE BEDINGFIELD, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: Well, that playbook works with his base.
WILLIAMS: Yes, no, no, I know.
BEDINGFIELD: He commands the MAGA base via Tweet and Truth Social. But the problem he's got going into November is independent voters, swing voters, people who voted for him in 2024, but don't consider themselves MAGA, but voted for him because he promised no new forever wars, and to bring down prices, and to close the border.
They are frustrated with what he's doing on this. They don't understand what the goal is. They believe it is making, as it is, it's making their gas prices higher. So it's not just the MAGA base. The big -- the problem that he's got politically is he's not making a persuasive case to the people that he's got to pull in in order to prevent Republicans from having a very damaging November.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: But it's not only that, right? It's -- we're looking at the Iran war, but it's also the Iran war with tariffs on top of it --
BEDINGFIELD: Certainly.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: -- which are going to exacerbate the inflationary problem that we're having in this country. It is him constantly getting over his own message where he will go somewhere and talk about the economy, and all the Republicans are like, thank God, and then he will turn around and bring up a big sort of a billboard of his ballroom.
BEDINGFIELD: Yes.
[12:05:07]
GARCIA-NAVARRO: You know, there is no consistency. He is all over the place. He is easily distracted. And a war, unfortunately, you have to be very focused on.
BEDINGFIELD: Absolutely. And that is -- and just quickly, that is one of his biggest political vulnerabilities is that people don't feel he is focused on their lives and their priorities. And so not only are they frustrated with substantively what they see him doing in Iran, but they also say more broadly, he's not focused on anything that is making my life better. And that's the big political liability.
GRIFFIN: Well, in case in point, doing this national address of sorts about the 2020 election in the year of our Lord, 2026. Like, who is struggling to pay their bills was like, this is what I needed. This is being responsive to my needs. Completely detached from the reality of the moment.
And I have to wonder, like, where is Susie Wiles in this? Where is Marco Rubio, somebody who is a very sound voice and knowledgeable on foreign policy, who could have instructed him that the resolve of the Iranian regime is actually quite strong. This was never going to be quick. This was never going to be in and out. I don't know where those voices are.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Those voices, I don't think, are there. Donald Trump, if there's one thing that we now realize about him, is that he does not allow dissent anymore. And that has been one of his strengths for the party, because he has completely dominated the party.
He has crushed dissent. He has expelled those who do not see things the way that he sees them. But when you are in a moment of national crisis, we are in a war with another country in the Middle East, you need those voices in the room, and they're no longer there.
HUNT: Well, let's look at what Marco Rubio had to say this week, the Secretary of State, framing the way the President apparently views this conflict. And it is not the traditional biblical eye for an eye. Watch.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Do you rule out striking civilian interests (ph)?
MARCO RUBIO, SECRETARY OF STATE: I think, I saw -- you know, guys, I saw Araghchi, their foreign minister, who the other day say or something about their policies, an eye for an eye. The President's policy is a head for an eye. I mean, honestly, that's what it's going to be.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: So, I mean, to your point, Alyssa, that's apparently his voice in the room.
GRIFFIN: Yes, and I want to be careful in saying this, but I think in the same way that we saw that Wall Street sort of started to accept that Trump tacos, he bluffs, he says big things, but then he ultimately ends up caving. I worry that, you know, our adversaries in the Middle East, the Iranian regime, have seen these threats over and over.
You're going to wipe you off the map, these tweeting things out, and he hasn't responded in those overwhelming ways, and I think they're waiting him out. But what happens, and this is where it gets deadly dangerous for our country, is he's going to be pushed to make a decision. It's either going to be pure capitulation, which that MOU, I believe, represented, or it is going to be a massive escalation of U.S. force, and neither are good for the country.
BEDINGFIELD: Right. I think that's the big issue. If you're talking about significant escalation, are you talking about boots on the ground? Are you talking about committing American troops? And if so, what is the aim? I mean, we still aren't hearing. What is the aim in putting American boots on the ground? Is it to -- is it full regime change? Is it some sort of, you know, almost partnership role with the Iranian government -- I mean, what is --
WILLIAMS: All of the above, and that's the thing.
BEDINGFIELD: And it's -- but it's -- so telling the American people who are already frustrated by this war, don't understand the aims, you know, hey, we might actually send your sons and daughters, you know, and put boots on the ground there. And for what end? That is not a persuasive argument to, again --
GARCIA-NAVARRO: And also threatening war crimes, which if you're saying --
BEDINGFIELD: Well, that's --
GARCIA-NAVARRO: -- I'm going to bomb civilian infrastructure, I'm going to wipe out, you know, civilian --
WILLIAMS: Bridges.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: -- bridges and places where civilian -- which civilians use, that also isn't good for the country, and that also is not great just full stop. So what is President Donald Trump doing? Nobody can answer that question.
HUNT: All right. Well, on that note, coming up next here, the potential 2028 Democratic candidate that, according to a new poll from one state, has more support than Kamala Harris, Bernie Sanders, and Gavin Newsom combined. That's our quote of the week.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. ALEXANDRIA OCASIO-CORTEZ (D), NEW YORK: Polls go up, polls go down. That's kind of part of how all of this works.
MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Why do you think yours are going up right now?
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[12:14:00]
OCASIO-CORTEZ: I think that right now, the most important thing before the country right now is for Democrats to win the midterm elections. That's why I have put the energy that I have put into it, because whether I'm here or not, we need to hold that majority and stop a lot of the bleeding that's happening in this country.
RAJU: And then after the midterms, you decide what to do.
OCASIO-CORTEZ: I mean, I guess that's how time works.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: Indeed. So no one's officially announced they're running for president in 2028. As you can see there, it's considered uncouth to do so before the midterm elections unfold. But as anyone who is sitting here can tell you, everyone is running until they're not. And one of those people is Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez.
A new poll out this week shows her surging to the top of the field in one critical state. It's a poll of likely Democratic voters in New Hampshire that, of course, this may be changing, but doesn't make it any less important symbolically. They do hold the first-in-the-nation primary.
[12:15:06]
Now, many campaigns have, you know, sprung to life there, faded into the background there. But take a look at these results. AOC way out in front of other names like Kamala Harris, Bernie Sanders, who you may remember won New Hampshire at one point, Gavin Newsom, Mark Kelly, former Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg is a close second, but he basically has the same level of support that he did back when they did this poll in February.
Now, here's how the 36-year-old lawmaker AOC reacted to the numbers. It's our quote of the week.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OCASIO-CORTEZ: I feel very, you know, humbled by the support of everyday people. I think that, you know, polls go up, polls go down. That's kind of part of how all of this works. When I make decisions about my life, it's -- they aren't just rooted in polls. They're rooted in what people need, what is best for the country, and what is appropriate for the moment.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: What is appropriate for the moment? That phrase is carrying a lot of -- doing a lot of work there. Alyssa, I know you've been out there talking about this week. What do you think she represents in the field? What would she represent in a broader contest?
GRIFFIN: So there's no question that the more DSA Bernie wing of the Democratic Party is where the energy is right now. But how that translates from a primary to a general election is critically important. So Bernie Sanders won New Hampshire previously.
He did not go on to get the nomination, although I would say her support is probably even more than it appears because she would likely get that Bernie Sanders support in New Hampshire. But keep in mind, New Hampshire is one of -- I'm a Granite Stater by marriage, one of the whitest states in the country. This is not a state that's reflective of the core Democratic base.
When you look at who actually could go on to not just win a primary and win a general election, I think the energy is going to shift to somebody who's more to the center, somebody who could take on a Marco Rubio or a JD Vance, people who have, Marco Rubio I'll say, a little bit broader of appeal because I think if it ended up being her, you might as well skip the billion dollars we're going to spend and swear in Marco Rubio. Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez is not winning seven swing states.
BEDINGFIELD: I don't agree with that.
HUNT: Let's hear it.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: No, I -- listen, I think we're really in early days, right? But I think she has an extraordinary amount of name recognition. I think she is pivoting to the center, as often happens. And I think the positions that she has held have over time not seemed so extreme.
I mean, if you think about where she came in and the things that she was sort of being talked about as being an extremist over, nowadays Medicare for All is kind of almost like a centrist position in the Democratic Party. So I don't know that this is going to be quite as unlikely as perhaps some make it out to be.
BEDINGFIELD: So I disagree a little bit because Medicare for All is an example. When you start to really ask people, you know, do you want your private insurance to be taken away, they say no. So Medicare for All as a slogan --
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Right.
BEDINGFIELD: -- yes, people are clearly hungry for change. AOC is somebody who represents a -- certainly a new generation, but also kind of this, you know, energy for change. Medicare for All is a great example, though, of when you start peeling away voters in swing states and you explain to them what it actually means, it becomes incredibly unpopular.
And so while I definitely agree that she -- you know, it doesn't surprise me, for example, to see her kind of at the top of this list because in part she's, you know, she's out there, she's on TV, she's on, you know, she's in front of people. As Alyssa rightly pointed out, New Hampshire is a very white state.
Part of the challenge that candidates from the -- some as far as the socialist wing of the party, now I think AOC maybe would not call herself socialist in this moment, to your point about moderation. But candidates from that wing of the party do very well with white college-educated voters.
And for a Democrat to win the president -- first of all, to win the Democratic nomination, you have to win black voters, you have to win Latino voters. And then, of course, to win the general election, you have to appeal to a much broader audience. So I think it doesn't surprise me that there's energy for her. I still think the reality of her, she is Hispanic.
GRIFFIN: Keep in mind, Bernie's weakest voting bloc was black voters. I mean, and you cannot recreate the Obama coalition without having black men and women, without having Latinos.
BEDINGFIELD: Absolutely.
GRIFFIN: And I think she will no doubt play an important role in 2028. I think that there's some Kingmaker-type role that she could play in some of, you know, in certain states and primaries. But I think that she is -- this country's pretty centrist, despite how each of our parties tend to run. I don't think she could pull it off.
WILLIAMS: Yes, I would think it's largely two things. It's so early, and name recognition is the name of the game today. People know who she is, partly because conservatives have spent the last however many years making her into the face of the left. So it's name recognition and the fact that so much of what she's talking about is affordability and prices and things that are resonating sort of outside and beyond her.
[12:20:02]
I will note, what's interesting, back to the name recognition point, Jon Ossoff, who I think many people will at some point find a very compelling candidate, is at 2 percent. Why no one outside of sort of the pundit class in Washington actually knows --
HUNT: Well, he wasn't even in the poll.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
HUNT: Right? They just put him in.
BEDINGFIELD: I should say, I don't think that there is -- I think there's a -- there is a path for her will require a lot of separation from policies and positions that she has held throughout her career. I mean, she was just on stage with Abdul El-Sayed in Michigan this week. He is somebody who has not distanced himself or has refused to disown comments he made about defunding the police, for example.
She will have to own that. I mean, she will have to find a way to separate herself from that. So there's just -- there is a lot of work that she will have to do to win more moderate voters.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Well, and she is one of the most stable speakers on the left.
BEDINGFIELD: I agree with that. No question.
HUNT: In a world where authenticity is absolutely key, pulling off what you just outlined --
BEDINGFIELD: Very true.
HUNT: -- is no easy feat.
BEDINGFIELD: Absolutely.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: I don't disagree with that. And by the way, let me just be clear, I am not endorsing AOC for president. I am just trying to make the counterargument.
BEDINGFIELD: Sure.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Because I remember sitting here when Mamdani was coming up and all the pundit class was dismissing him, saying that he had no path, that this wasn't going to work out for him. And, you know, I recently interviewed him. I have interviewed AOC in the past. And what I will say is that we are working, I think, in a particular moment where insurgent candidates are very popular.
This isn't just about -- it's just that people are very fed up. And Donald Trump did one thing very well. He opened the door to kind of people's imagination as to who could be sitting in the Oval Office. I'm saying this very politely. And so I think some of the, you know, some of the old rules don't apply.
HUNT: Some of the credentials that were previously required perhaps don't --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
HUNT: -- are not demanded any longer.
All right, coming up next here in The Arena, the comments pouring in after someone asks the Internet for advice ahead of starting their first corporate job. Even Oprah is weighing in on what she tells young Americans who are becoming adults.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
OPRAH WINFREY, HOST, "THE OPRAH PODCAST": This is what I say to my girls who, you know, graduating from college and starting their first jobs, and they're talking to me about, you know, work-life balance at this point. I go, you ain't got no work-life balance at 22, 23.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That's tearing us up, by the way.
WINFREY: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We're all trying to look for the balance. It ain't there.
WINFREY: No, no, no, no, no, no.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It ain't there. It's tearing us up.
WINFREY: It's not there.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
WINFREY: You're not supposed to have it.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's your job. I give you money, you give me ideas.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: And you never say thank you.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's what the money is for. You're young, you will get your recognition. And honestly, it is absolutely ridiculous to be two years into your career and counting your ideas. Everything to you is an opportunity. And you should be thanking me every morning when you wake up.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[12:27:24]
HUNT: Maybe we're dating ourselves, but everyone on this panel, while that was playing did the, that's what the money's for.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That's what the money's for.
HUNT: In unison. So here's why we played that, OK? This summer, thousands of young people will be starting their very first 9-to-5 jobs. It's an exciting opportunity that's opened doors for so many, but let's face it, can sometimes feel like, all taken, no given. That's how Dolly Parton put it.
One new Gen Z worker recently asked TikTok what she needs to know before starting her first corporate 9-to-5 gig. Now, TikTok flooded her post with practical advice, like the following, quote, "Organize your inbox right away. Don't delete anything," and, "Always bring a cardigan/sweater. No matter how hot it is, it will be freezing in the office."
A number of them, however, were quite cynical. Quote, "Never do your best, ever. Your best doesn't get you recognized, it gets you more work." One person wrote, "Give only 20 percent of your actual effort or they will get used to your 100 percent and it will be your new baseline," another advised.
In a separate interview this week, Oprah Winfrey, though, offered the new generation of workers some different advice as she reflected on her own, as we all know, considerable success.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WINFREY: I only do what I want to do and I've earned the right to do that because there was lots of times I had to do what I had to do. You have to do what you have to do, what you need to do, until you can do what you want to do. You can't -- on these kids today, a lot of people think, oh, I just want to do what I want to do. You got to work to be able to do what you want to do.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
WINFREY: Yes.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: Wow, there is so much here and maybe I'm just a millennial, but go ahead.
WILLIAMS: If that message were coming from anyone but Oprah right now, I think it would fall really hollow. The fact is, Oprah is the first black female billionaire in the world. I think the wealthiest self- made woman in the world. And she has the credibility to say, no, you need -- and she grew up poor --
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes.
WILLIAMS: -- black and in the South, and a woman. She has more credibility than anybody else to make that point. And I think it's hard -- like, I'm -- I reflexively want to say, well, all kinds of things make it hard to get ahead. And if you -- maybe it's not just about the hard work. No, Oprah. And so I just trust Oprah.
GRIFFIN: I was honestly laughing that 9 to 5 is hard. It was like, when we were coming up in politics, we were talking more like 7 to 7, running around Capitol Hill --
HUNT: I was just -- yes, the producer who wrote that script --
GRIFFIN: Yes.
HUNT: -- who I think is a huge star and who I work with, was working the overnight --
GRIFFIN: Yes.
HUNT: -- when I was anchoring in the morning.
(CROSSTALK)
[12:30:06]
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Yes. I mean as a journalist, we know there is no off switch. I wish there were. And I also came up in the generation where your boss said jump and you said how high? I also came up in the generation that when you were suffering, you'd lock yourself in the bathroom and cry yourself, you know, and that was thought to be like self-care.
(CROSSTALK)
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Right. And that was self-care. And I'm glad to say that that is no longer the case. I also grew up in the generation where if your boss asked you out on a date, you might say, maybe I'll do that. You know, I mean, and we have moved on from that. And so I do think this is a healthy debate because not everyone is going to become a billionaire. Not everyone is going to become whatever it is. And we have a generation now where they have to work one job, two jobs, three jobs and to make ends meet or they're worried about any job.
And so I do think it's worth having the discussion of what we ask of our young people today if and what is the balance? And some kids, young people are going to be like, I do want to work 110 percent and maybe they are going to be the ones that get there. But is that really required from everybody? I don't think so.
GRIFFIN: Oh, go ahead.
BEDINGFIELD: No, no, I just -- I agree, absolutely. Obviously, cultural shifts, there have been important cultural shifts in the way workplaces operate and they've been to the good. But, but fundamentally, the baseline is still, to my mind, is still working hard. It is still putting in your maximum effort. Now, that doesn't mean working around the clock necessarily, although yes, in politics it does. And in journalism --
(CROSSTALK)
BEDINGFIELD: And in legal profession it does.
HUNT: You want to be at the top of whatever it is that you're doing. You're going to have to work really hard to get correct there.
BEDINGFIELD: Correct. But it's also, it's about putting in your best effort. It doesn't necessarily mean, you know, it doesn't mean doing 12 hours of busy work. It means looking at the task, you know, tackling it with ingenuity, with creativity, with effort, you know, in seeing the person who said, don't give them 100 percent, that's your baseline. You do also have to think about you come home at the end of the day, how do you want to feel about the work that you did? And I just think telling young people that, you know, your work shouldn't be something that you take pride in. Now, of course, it doesn't have to be your only sense of identity. And hopefully it's not.
GRIFFIN: But I tend to think the first decade or so of your career is for grinding. Scott Galloway makes this point.
BEDINGFIELD: Totally.
GRIFFIN: He's like, it's not about balance. It's about working yourself, building your way up, climbing. Oprah probably a better messenger than Scott Galloway, so I love him, but I tend to feel that way. I would not -- I was someone who had to work to pay my bills. I didn't have family to fall back, and it wasn't an option. I was literally working because I wanted to get somewhere and I wanted to be able to, you know, have a roof over my head, grind when you can. It's going to get harder later in life. You're going to have family and other commitments.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: I just again -- just my last point to push back on this, which I agree with you, of course I do. You have to work hard to get ahead, of course. But I think a lot of this distrust or mistrust is coming from the idea that our corporate overlords, whomever they may be, when you're working for companies, do not have our best interests at heart, structurally put things in our way to extract as much labor as they can from us without remunerating us. And so I'm using us doing a lot of work here.
But what I'm just trying to say is that I do think that there is just a general feeling that perhaps that happy payday of getting your work recognized and getting the money that you deserve isn't going to actually come when push your effort --
GRIFFIN: And young people's dollars going less far too.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Or you're going to be thrown out of your job anyway. So that, I think, is what's in the wire.
HUNT: And I think the sort of distrust is in the guarantee that the American dream always meant, you know, now, when the median age to buy your first house is 40 years old, that promise is a little bit broken. But we did start off with Oprah, who we seem to all agree is a good messenger on this. So here's another messenger, Dolly Parton.
WILLIAMS: Yes.
HUNT: OK. National treasure, Dolly Parton. She says this, find out who you are and do it on purpose. That means if you really want to know who you are, you've really got to put some thought, prayer and effort in trying to figure out what that is. If you see that you're heading down a path, doing one thing and it's not working out. I've always said it's OK to change horses in the middle of a dream. Maybe you've learned just enough about the thing that you were after that God's directing you in a different way. So the main thing, and here we are again, is to just work hard, believe in yourself and do it.
WILLIAMS: And this is why America has never bowed knees the knee to a monarch. But we do have two, which are Beyonce, Dolly Parton. No, but no, but to be clear, and all of this is true. She said the main thing is to be yourself and be true and to work hard. But it's not the only thing. And I think the power of Gen Z right now is the recognition that, yes, hard work is important. We're all in agreement here that you have to work hard, you have to grind. But also, we do not live in a meritocracy, we never have. We showed this clip from "Mad Men" that was all built on the idea that the people who worked the hardest were the ones who got ahead. That's not true. We don't live in that world now. And I agree with -- is Lulu a girl? Yes.
[12:35:21]
But the point is -- so and I think that's hard for many young people who are growing up in this world that, wait a second, if I work hard, I will not be able to achieve this American dream that you were talking about, Kasie. HUNT: Yes.
WILLIAMS: And I think you just have to make some peace with it.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: But you will never get the American dream without working hard thing.
HUNT: Yes.
(CROSSTALK)
HUNT: That is the overarching point.
All right, ahead here in The Arena, nearly six decades since one of the most gripping moments for the U.S. and for the world. It all unfolded on live T.V.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The eagle has landed.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We're home.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Man on the moon. What?
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hey, we're going to be busy for a minute.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There he is. There's a foot coming down the step.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm at the foot of the ladder.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Armstrong is on the moon, Neil Armstrong, 38-year- old American, standing on the surface of the moon.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
[12:40:54]
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: There he is. There's a foot coming down the step.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm at the foot of the ladder.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Armstrong is on the moon, Neil Armstrong, 38-year- old American standing on the surface of the moon on this July 20th, 1969.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's one small step for man, one giant leap for mankind.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
HUNT: I mean, it literally never gets old watching that. It was indeed a giant leap. And believe it or not, it was 57 years ago this week that the legendary Walter Cronkite reported on that moment that Neil Armstrong became the first man to set foot on the moon. The Apollo 11 spacecraft, which of course carried Armstrong, Buzz Aldrin and Michael Collins, traveled over 200,000 miles in 76 hours to make history.
The journey captured the imagination of the United States and of course, the world. An estimated 600 million people tuned in to watch that broadcast that we just watched again. And now, over a half century later, amid all of the bitter political division that we see here in the U.S., the question that it raises is whether we're likely to see any unifying moment as big as that one. I'd like to think we could, but I don't know.
GRIFFIN: I'm not sure. I will say, I do think the Artemis mission reminded people that there is a fascination that's like, beyond our human experience in space. And it did feel like this great unifying moment that we needed collectively. But I worry not to take it to a darker place. I'm not even sure how as polarized and divided as we are, that we could rally in a World War II style moment if the country needed to come together. Like, I think the depth of our divide and polarization is actually like quite dangerous in that moment.
WILLIAMS: I think the two weeks after 9/11 are what you're talking about. But then immediately, what -- I think things got polarized very, very quickly there. And I don't even think right now if, God forbid, if there were any such frightening moment in America, we'd even have two weeks given how divided we are on things like national security and foreign policy, but also just moral questions in the United States. I just don't think there's that kind of unity there.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: I saw a recent poll in the United Kingdom which asked if there were -- if you had to defend the country, would you, you know, would you sign up? You know, the idea of, like, how they rallied during World War II and the role that the England, United Kingdom played, and it was shocking how few people felt that there. And I think it would be very similar here. Part of that, I do think also is that we don't have an idea of national service here anymore. There is nothing that we ask people to do in service of their country. And I do think that is a problem.
BEDINGFIELD: Yes, I think outside of our politics, people are still willing to find common ground, on a community level, I think people come together, they help their neighbors. There's a sense of community. I think it is our national political environment that has given us this sense that we are so, so fractured. And so when you look at a big moment like, you know, like the moon landing or we're talking about the possibility of, you know, of, for example, a terror attack, it inevitably is absorbed through this national political lens. And I -- what I struggle with is, how do we break out? How do we break out of that? How do we not default always in this moment where social media, well, really social media, drives so much of our sense of current events, how do we break out of that? And I don't, I wish I had the answer. I don't.
WILLIAMS: I think it's broader than social media, though. I think it's how people consume information. Along with your point, people -- everything we consume now is tailored to what we want, when we only get what we want, information wise, we get radicalized in our views. And that's happened in the United States.
GRIFFIN: Well, and even on the moon landing, about a sixth of Americans don't believe it actually happened.
[12:45:02]
HUNT: Yes.
GRIFFIN: So when you live in an environment where --
WILLIAMS: Wait, we did?
GRIFFIN: Yes, we found one of the six.
BEDINGFIELD: Elliot is amazed.
HUNT: Oh my gosh.
GRIFFIN: But it shows when you don't live in sort of the same fact environment. No one was watching that when Walter Cronkite was speaking and thinking, oh, this isn't real. But over time, and now you've got these digital dopamine hits, people just don't believe things with that they see with their own eyes.
BEDINGFIELD: Yes. And AI is only exacerbating that, only turbo --
HUNT: Yes. It's only going to get worst. Yes. I mean, I think everyone sitting here was too young to watch this live, but it is one of those moments. I don't know if you remember, Elliot, have you ever talked to your parents about where they were? Because that's another thing, right? Like these types of moments that we can have where you'll remember, oh, I remember where I was when I saw that happen.
WILLIAMS: No, I mean, my parents are a tough example because they were in Jamaica still at that time and just a different relationship to global events when you're in a developing country.
HUNT: Of course. Yes.
WILLIAMS: The moment that I remember, like that was the Challenger Explosion, where everybody remembers where they were at that moment. And it was unifying. It was frightening. And quite frankly, one of the most unifying things about it was the President of the United States who spoke to and for everyone at that moment, even people who did not love or support Ronald Reagan, trusted and believed in what he said that night. It was a unifying moment for the country.
HUNT: Part of me also wonders if some of the way, and I'm interested in what you think about this, the way that we think of our own political divisions is driven by the fact that we're actually living through it. Because I think it's worth remembering. I mean, it was JFK who sent us on a mission to go to the moon. By the time we land on the moon, JFK has been shot and killed. It's not as though political violence and division are new. GRIFFIN: Yes, certainly. I think so, my dear friend Whoopi Goldberg reminds me of this, that we may feel like we're living in the most polarized moment, but our country has been through some very rocky times, like civil rights, the Vietnam era. We have been this divided before. The exacerbating fact, I do think, is our new technologies, the A.I., the social media, the disinformation campaigns that you could see.
But I would echo, because I think it's really important when you said, Kate, in our own communities, I don't feel that. I don't feel that in my church. I don't feel that in the neighborhood I live in. And I live in a, you know, there's Democrats, there's Republicans. People want to come together and help each other. I'm also convinced if you look at most polling on major issues, the country is also not quite as divided on a lot of the major issues, but we have a political environment motivated by money, limitless money in our politics that is making us more divided.
HUNT: I mean, the interest in the money is, I mean, generating division with money creates more money for the people that have it.
BEDINGFIELD: No question. No question. And again, you go back to, we're in a place where you can't trust that what you see online is real. Is it, you know, is it factual? Has it been created by artificial intelligence? Is the image you're looking at real? And then you have an outlet for people to spend all day sort of having these micro arguments and sort of thereby exacerbating the sense that all of this is all consuming.
The only sort of optimistic thread here to me in thinking about that is it's actually, you know, like the percentage of people who spend their time arguing on X all day is actually very small. Very small.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Very small. I think about it all the time when I get in the middle of some kerfuffle there, I'm always like, this is actually doesn't matter. Not even a little bit.
BEDINGFIELD: Correct.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: And it fills me with joy.
BEDINGFIELD: Correct. And so remember that remembering that is important.
[12:48:24]
HUNT: Yes. All right, coming up next here, something totally different. The drink you might want to have more of. And in the morning, we'll explain.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Please move. Please, please, please.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: How many cups have you had this morning?
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: None.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Plus.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Five. But yours is better.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You have a problem.
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, I do.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
HUNT: Or does she have a problem? This week, the American Heart Association said that up to five cups of coffee a day, it may actually potentially lower your risk of heart disease. I'm sorry, what? The latest research found that consuming up to 400 milligrams of caffeine per day or five 8 ounce cups of coffee appears to lower the risk of heart failure, heart disease and even strokes for some people.
But if your order is a venti white mocha quad shot with five pumps of caramel and lots of creamer, you're out of luck. The benefits strictly limited to consuming paper, filtered or instant coffee. This is excellent news for me, I have to say. Yes, I'm going to live forever. I'm going to live forever. Like, how many cups of coffee does everyone here. Does everyone here drink coffee?
WILLIAMS: Yes.
HUNT: Yes. How many cups a day?
WILLIAMS: One big cold brew every morning?
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Yes. One big iced coffee every day.
HUNT: Just one.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Just one. I don't do more.
BEDINGFIELD: Two or three espressos in the morning. And then probably two cups of coffee throughout the day.
WILLIAMS: What?
GRIFFIN: So when I was in the White House, a giant coffee with three espresso shots and then I'd have another one around noon. I was over the 400 milligrams. Recently postpartum, I'm one coffee and I'm trying to lower it, but apparently it's good for you.
WILLIAMS: That's like, you might as well just start doing cocaine if that's -- if that's the --
HUNT: But there's no health benefits.
(CROSSTALK)
GARCIA-NAVARRO: It might help your heart, but you can get addicted to caffeine.
HUNT: Yes. Oh, I am firmly addicted to caffeine.
GARCIA-NAVARRO: And this is the thing. When you stop using it, you get headaches, there's all sorts of other things. So, like, I am very sympathetic to everyone celebrating this news, and yet I would still say that perhaps five cups of coffee a day have other implications.
[12:55:02]
WILLIAMS: Yes. You know, my wife is --
GARCIA-NAVARRO: Very jittery.
WILLIAMS: My wife's big thing over the last couple years has been matcha in that it's got roughly the same caffeine content but just not the same crash afterward. So just something to think about.
GRIFFIN: I'm very pro matcha.
HUNT: I will say I do drink green tea out of this month every day.
BEDINGFIELD: Yes. I do like green tea. Yes.
HUNT: Because if I were to put coffee in it, I would never sleep. But I do also drink, so I have a drip coffee maker. So I'm healthy there. It makes eight cups of coffee. OK. And I consume the entire pot basically every morning. I really drink more coffee now that I work to work in the afternoon than I did in the morning because in the morning I'd have time for like one and I then I would --
GARCIA-NAVARRO: That's why this is like the 10th coffee segment that I've had on at this show. So this really does reflect the interest of Kasie.
HUNT: It really does. All right, guys, thank you so much. This has been so much fun. Thanks to all of you at home for watching. Don't forget, you can see The Arena every weekday right here on CNN, 4:00 p.m. Eastern Time. You can also catch up by listening to The Arenas podcast. You can follow us on X and Instagram. We're at TheArenaCNN. Enjoy the rest of your weekend. The news continues next on CNN.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
