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CNN's The Arena with Kasie Hunt

Trump Admin Pushes Election Reforms Despite Supreme Court Loss; Kennedy Center Board Votes To Shutter Center, Trump Says It Won't Reopen Until His Name Can Go On Building; Patel Suggests FBI Agents May Be Sent To The Polls; CBO: Iran War Has Cost More Than $38 Billion Through August 1. Aired 4-5p ET

Aired September 15, 2026 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[16:00:04]

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Also, failure to maintain lane.

MARTA, which, of course, operates bus service in Atlanta, says it is now reviewing the incident.

Thanks so much for joining us this afternoon.

THE ARENA WITH KASIE HUNT starts right now.

(MUSIC)

KASIE HUNT, CNN HOST: Hi, everyone. I'm Kasie Hunt. Welcome to THE ARENA. It's great to have you with us on this Tuesday.

Right now, President Trump and administration officials lashing out at the guardrails just 49 days before the midterm elections.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TODD BLANCHE, ATTORNEY GENERAL: Of course, we're going to comply with the Supreme Court's decision, as we always do. That doesn't mean that we're not going to do everything in this administration that we can to make sure that there are free and fair elections.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: Todd Blanche playing a dual role today as both attorney general and White House press secretary, something that at one point in time might be the top story in and of itself.

But today, the A.G. is vowing that the push ahead on the administration's plans to enact sweeping election reforms despite a stinging defeat at the Supreme Court, with the justices slapping down the president's proposed restrictions on mail-in voting ahead of the November midterms.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BLANCHE: The federal government is always involved in elections. That's not new to this administration. It's not new to the Biden administration. And so, our role is going to be the same role that federal governments play in elections under the law as we're required to do and as we should do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: President Trump today lashing out at the court, even going after the three people that he made Supreme Court Justice.

Neil Gorsuch, Brett Kavanaugh and Amy Coney Barrett writing online, quote, "These are not the people I interviewed".

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BLANCHE: He is very frustrated. And I wasn't at the interviews that he participated in during the last administration when he selected these folks to be on the Supreme Court. He has every right. And indeed, he should communicate his concerns with the Supreme Court whenever he has them. This isn't the first time that he's done it, and it won't be the last.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: The attorney general was not the only administration official in the spotlight today over election security. The FBI director, Kash Patel, also facing questions from senators, we're going to talk to one of them this hour, about the role of the feds in the midterms, now just seven weeks away.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. PETER WELCH (D-VT): Do you pledge that you will not in any way interfere in the will of the American people when they go to the polls in November?

KASH PATEL, FBI DIRECTOR: I pledge unequivocally that I will not participate in your charade of lies.

WELCH: Then why are you being such a panderer to President Trump, who's still claiming that he won the 2020 election, and who has said the only way Democrats can win in 2026 is if they cheat? Do you believe that?

PATEL: What I believe in is the rule of law.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: All right. Let's get off the sidelines, head into THE ARENA. My panel is going to be here.

But let's get started with CNN senior White House correspondent Kristen Holmes.

So, Kristen, can you help us understand -- I mean, the White House is saying both that they'll comply with the court's decision, but also that they want to move ahead with some of the president's priorities around asserting more control over elections. How can those both be true?

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: I would argue this idea of Todd Blanche saying, of course we will comply. It was a real question, and it was one that a lot of reporters in that room wanted to know. And that's the first time we heard him definitively say that. Now, what he did say was that a lot of the reason that it was blocked in the Supreme Court was due to timing, timing with litigation, closeness to those midterm elections.

So, the idea here is that Todd Blanche is saying that they are likely to bring more kind of reform, election, litigation, trying to put more things forward just ahead of 2028, not just ahead of the midterms. And he was specifically asked if he thought that voters were going to be confused by all this back and forth over mail-in ballots. He really brushed that off, saying that people aren't really paying attention. Obviously, that's something that we'll see as we get closer to that midterm election and those mail-in ballots go out.

It was striking to see President Trump -- not President Trump, it was striking to see Todd Blanch kind of back up President Trump's remarks about those Supreme Court justices He was asked if this was a client of his, would he encourage him to disparage the court? And he kind of bristled at that question, saying that it was President Trump's right to be angry and frustrated, to challenge and critique other branches of government, and that he could continue to do so.

So, it was clear from this stint that he did as press secretary that we are not done with the election reforms that this administration wants to do. But it was also just striking to see him up there kind of performing as press secretary, asking everybody, are you sweating? Oh, I'm sorry, actually, I'm not really sorry, telling kind of little jokes and quips.

[16:05:02]

And it's notable that this was in the Rose Garden. I mean, just behind him is the Oval Office. And we know President Trump has been keeping a close eye on these briefings. This is the second press briefing we've had since Karoline Leavitt left, the first being Vice President J.D. Vance. And we do expect there to be a rotating cast of characters within this administration taking that podium.

HUNT: Yeah, the sweating actually came up a number of times throughout the briefing.

Okay, Kristen Holmes at the White House for us -- Kristen, I hope you were -- it's actually a beautiful day here in Washington. It doesn't seem like a very sweaty place. I hope you made it through okay.

All right. My panel's here in THE ARENA, the host of "The Chuck Toddcast", Chuck Todd; CNN political commentator, Republican strategist and pollster, Kristen Soltis Anderson; CNN chief political analyst, David Axelrod; and CNN senior political commentator, Scott Jennings.

We do want to note that Scott Jennings is reportedly being considered for the White House press secretary role. No word on whether he will talk about whether everyone is sweaty or not.

We're also joined by CNN senior law enforcement analyst, former FBI deputy director Andrew McCabe.

Welcome to all of you. Thank you all for being here. Chuck, let me start with you on the big picture here.

And I want to play a little bit more of what Blanche said about President Trump, because he wrote this on Truth Social. The Supreme Court has really let our country down. Certain justices are petrified of these crazed and depraved Democrats. They're not the people I interviewed to serve on the Supreme Court. They are merely a shell of their original selves.

Now, here's a little bit more of what Blanche said about the president and this topic. Watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BLANCHE: As far as President Trump's truth about the justices, he is very frustrated. He has every right. And indeed, he should communicate his concerns with the Supreme Court whenever he has them. This isn't the first time that he's done it, and it won't be the last. He's also publicly very appreciative of the Supreme Court when there's decisions that he very much agrees with. That's what a democracy is about.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: So, Chuck, I mean, we are barreling toward the election here, right? The Supreme Court is putting some guardrails on. No evidence, it doesn't seem, that the president necessarily wants to be -- well, definitely doesn't want to be bound by those guardrails.

CHUCK TODD, HOST, "THE CHUCK TODDCAST": No, and look, I just think it's -- I'm just looking at this the prism of between now and November, and every second that Donald Trump spends complaining about the election procedures is time he's not talking about the economy, is time that he's not reassuring his party that this war is going to end anytime soon. I think it ends up motivating the Democratic base.

Like, I've always thought all of this, you know, a lot of my friends on the left been wringing their hands about this, and I've been like, look, Democrats if you change the polling location an hour before polls open Democrats are going to be aware of where that location is like nothing's going to stop them from voting.

The irony to everything he's trying to do is more harmful to his voters that live in rural America his voters that do particularly places like Texas in particular which is has a tradition of early voting and mail voting and all that so I you know I just think it he's just focused on the wrong things and I think that this doesn't help the messaging crisis, I would say, that the GOP has right now.

HUNT: Axe?

DAVID AXELROD, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: Yeah, look, what it does set up is a pretext if the thing goes down as it appears to be headed, but there's a bigger thing here, which is how the president views the Supreme Court, how he views the attorney general. He's outraged that these justices are not compliant to his wishes, and it completely misreads what the role of the Supreme Court is.

As to the attorney general, by the way, I think they better solve this press secretary thing as soon as possible because they need a real professional there. But as to the attorney general, you know, 50 years ago after Watergate, Edward Levy, the former president of the University of Chicago, was appointed attorney general and his mission was to restore faith in the rule of law and in the institution of the Department of Justice and they set up all kinds of strictures and reforms to make sure that there wasn't political influence in the Justice Department.

And all of that has been torn down now, and now we have an attorney general who is essentially a political apparatchik doing press secretary duty and defending the president's attacks on the Supreme Court.

SCOTT JENNINGS, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I'm trying to rack my brain, Axe, about a time when an American president attacked the U.S. Supreme Court over something they were mad about as it relates to elections. And you know, 2010, in a speech that I'm sure you wrote, President Obama stood at the lectern at the State of the Union and excoriated the justices over Citizens United. This is hardly the first time a president has been upset with the Supreme Court, and it will not be the last.

AXELROD: You know what he said at that speech, what he said was this decision --

JENNINGS: Yeah, you just made a mistake.

(CROSSTALK)

AXELROD: Yes. This decision will open the door to a flood of special interest money and dark money.

[16:10:05]

And that is exactly what's happened. In fact, he was prescient.

I'm glad that you brought it up, because this is a crisis for our country.

JENNINGS: He was mad --

AXELROD: He was standing in the well of the Senate -- of the House at his State of the Union speech, and he was speaking to, I think, an issue that bothers people today, which is the hail of money that's coming, and we don't even know from there.

JENNINGS: Well, I think President Trump is speaking to an issue that bothers people today. Can you trust the mail-in ballot system? I was reading a story from a nonpartisan journalism outfit in Arizona today. Did you know in the primary this summer, something like 50,000 mail ballots never reached their intended recipient. In '24, it was 71,000 ballots.

Mail-in ballots are inherently less safe, less secure, and less reliable than voting in person. He's always believed that. Now, whether this all came too late, that's what the court said. But to say people aren't worried about it is false.

AXELROD: Well, they're worried about it because he keeps raising it as an issue, even though every time people look at this issue, it is a -- it's a false issue. There is not evidence that there is this kind of mass fraud and mail-in voting.

(CROSSTALK)

JENNINGS: Fifty thousand ballots didn't reach the addresses in just one state.

HUNT: Hold on.

Kristen -- Kristen Soltis Anderson, what does your polling data tell you about the trust Americans do or don't have in our system?

KRISTEN SOLTIS ANDERSON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: In the system broadly or in mail-in ballots?

HUNT: In the election system, yeah, like, in our -- that our elections can be free and fair, including mail-in voting. Yeah, I think voters generally believe that elections can be free and fair, but I think when you ask voters, are they concerned about the security of our elections, they also say yes. And their concerns look very different whether you are Republican or Democratic.

If you are a Republican, you are gravely concerned that it is too easy for someone who should not be allowed to vote in this country to vote. And they look at states like California, New York, often blue states, that simply cannot competently count ballots, and that it takes weeks and weeks and weeks, and they say that's broken in the system and it needs fixed.

Democrats also worry about our system, but their concerns are quite different. They worry that people who ought to be able to cast ballots are prohibited from doing so by a system that either is, oh, we're worried there's going to be law enforcement outside of the polling place, et cetera. And so, they share concerns broadly that the system has things that aren't working, but their specific concerns are quite different.

HUNT: So, Andy McCabe, let me you in here, because I'd love to get your perspective on what it was like to watch the attorney general do that news conference. And, of course, we also heard from Kash Patel, the director of the FBI. And I'm interested to know what role you think the FBI should have this time around, if any. And are you confident that they're going to have a role that is appropriate?

ANDREW MCCABE, CNN SENIOR LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Yeah, I don't. I don't know that I would call myself confident about that at this point, but let's start with your first question. What this is a -- this is a totally unique thing that we've witnessed here today.

Let's remember that the Department of Justice traditionally not now, but in the past has -- is the one government agency that has been respected for the last 50 years. The need for them to function independent of the political side of the White House. DOJ and the FBI work very closely with the White House on national security matters, but on criminal matters, on rule of law matters, you try to keep that stuff out of politics. You don't want to pollute the justice system with political motivations.

And in pursuit of that goal, attorneys general have been very careful about not appearing behind the podium at the White House. So, to have the attorney general show up and essentially play, you know, press officer for the White House in the Rose Garden with the Oval Office as his backdrop was remarkable. And I think it shows us how much that independence of the Justice Department has eroded in this administration and particularly under Todd Blanche's leadership.

HUNT: Yeah, and your view too on, of course, what has sparked the president's criticism of the courts and some of what we heard from Blanche at that podium where ostensibly, you know, in previous iterations as you just laid out, the idea that the attorney general would be stepping in to defend the president attacking another branch of government seems remarkable, perhaps as an understatement, but remarkable. And of course, in this case, that's what he's doing all around this mail-in balloting.

And of course, worth remembering that the FBI went to Fulton County to seize ballots, the reasons for which we still don't fully understand.

What does that all say to you about what we may be headed for in the fall?

MCCABE: Again, historically, the FBI has never taken the position that is their responsibility to police our elections, right? Making sure that elections are fair and safe is the responsibility. The FBI has never taken the position that is their responsibility to police our elections, right? Making sure that elections are fair and safe is the responsibility of the states.

[16:15:00]

The FBI will step in and open a civil rights investigation if there are some sort of criminal allegation around how the election took place, but that requires a referral from a state to say, hey, come in, this group showed up, they intimidated people, can you help us figure out who did this and why?

That has not happened so far. Instead, we have the FBI essentially creating an investigation of an entire state, that being Georgia, on predication that is still unknown to the public. What we've seen in the kind of case materials filed with the court so far is just a regurgitation of the same complaints about the 2020 election that were raised in 2020, and have never gone away despite failing in every legal challenge. There were somewhere in the neighborhood of about 60 at the time and never having turned up any solid evidence of the sort of election malfeasance that the president and his supporters continue to claim.

So why the FBI felt it was necessary to get a search warrant to seize all of the voting materials, the actual ballots, the records of those ballots, is something that we still don't know. And it is a complete departure from the way the FBI has seen their responsibilities in the past.

HUNT: All right. Andrew McCabe, sir, thank you so much for your expertise. Always appreciate it.

The rest of my panel is going to stand by here.

Coming up next in THE ARENA, new reporting on what's being described as effing crazy. What went down when President Trump called in to a Kennedy Center board meeting as members vote to close it after a judge's newest ruling on adding the president's name to the building.

Plus, Senator Peter Welch will be here with us live after that tense and combative hearing today between the Senate Judiciary Committee and FBI Director Kash Patel.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. CORY BOOKER (D-NJ): You could do whatever you want, sir. My concluding remark is, we don't have an FBI director. We have a lackey here who is using govern -- and frankly, he's not even a good lackey. He's an incompetent lackey. He's like an 18-year-old kid who wants to join a fraternity that he could never be a member of, doing keg stands and chugging with friends. He's an embarrassment to the agency and wouldn't qualify even to be an FBI agent, sir.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:21:34]

HUNT: All right. Breaking news, President Trump announcing just moments ago that the Kennedy Center board has voted to close the cultural institution effective immediately. The president also insisting in the post that the renovations to the center won't begin until his name is added to the building. This after a federal judge prevented the board's latest attempt to do just that.

One source told me today that the president himself called into the board meeting and yelled at members, including Democratic Congresswoman Joyce Beatty, whose lawsuit prevented the president's name from being added to the center's exterior.

Another source telling our Sunlen Serfaty that the heated exchange between Trump and Beatty was, quote, "effing crazy". The president blaming the congresswoman for getting the courts involved, saying she was responsible for the downfall of the Kennedy Center, according to a person familiar with the matter.

My panel is back.

We are joined by Norm Eisen, who is representing Congresswoman Joyce Beatty in her lawsuit.

So, Norm, it's good to see you. Thanks for being here.

Is there anything more you can tell us about this? Were you surprised the president personally called in and did this?

NORM EISEN, FORMER WHITE HOUSE ETHICS CZAR: Well, the president's behavior at the board meeting and that social media statement demonstrate what this is really about. President Trump and his hand- picked cronies on this board are taking the Kennedy Center hostage, and they will not allow it to thrive unless his name is placed upon it, but that's illegal, Kasie.

Congresswoman Beatty has been fighting this from day one and I can tell you I was texting with the congresswoman. The board meeting itself was only for trustees, but texting in real time. She stood up for the law, for the success of the Kennedy Center, and she stood her ground as we've been doing in court.

One last thing, they can put all they want to shut it down. There is a court order that the Kennedy Center cannot be closed precisely because of these shenanigans. We're going to keep fighting until we get the Kennedy Center back on its feet, never with Donald Trump's name on it.

HUNT: All right. So, Scott Jennings, can you help me understand as the possible future White House press secretary -- Scott's rolling his eyes if you can't see that at home.

Scott, okay, this is the president of the United States of America. This is the board of the Kennedy Center of Trustees having a meeting. He calls in. Instead of, what are the other things he could be doing? Worrying about the war with Iran, worrying about gas prices, worrying about -- I mean, he seems to have time also to worry about mail-in voting and other things, the list of priorities is enormously long and any president's time is precious.

Why? Why is he doing this?

JENNINGS: Well, I assume it's because he cares about it. We have a president who actually cares about the arts community, cares about the Kennedy Center. There's strong documentary --

HUNT: He's closing it.

JENNINGS: -- documentary evidence that it needs renovations.

HUNT: He's refusing to fund it unless they put his name on the outside.

JENNINGS: It needs to be taken care of. Look --

HUNT: Yeah, but he could take care of it without his name on it.

JENNINGS: I know --

HUNT: That would be okay?

[16:25:00]

JENNINGS: You ask me why. I'm telling you.

HUNT: Right.

JENNINGS: It's because he cares about it. And presidents are often asked to care about and worry about and wonder about multiple things at the same time, which I'm quite sure he's capable of doing.

AXELROD: You know, I'd say just briefly on the subject itself. The fact is this center was named for John F. Kennedy as a living memorial. Congress named -- this is the memorial in Washington for John F. Kennedy. So that's why this has become an issue.

But beyond that to say I'm not going to repair it, it is in disrepair and we have to fix it, but I'm not going to fix it until you put my name on the building is quite something.

The bigger thing is the thing Chuck mentioned, there was a poll today, the Siena Poll and the Times, and people were asked whether they thought Trump generally focuses on the right things. 36 percent said yes. 61 percent said no. Among independent voters, that number was 27 percent.

This is precisely why he's in such a big political jam, because at a time when the country is facing all of these problems, particularly relative to the economy and the effect that the war has had on this economy, he is spending his time calling into Kennedy Center meetings and saying we're not going to repair the place until they put my name on the building.

SOLTIS ANDERSON: Well, let me -- I actually think it's even worse than that, because it's not just that --

AXELROD: I thought you make it sound bad.

SOLTIS ANDERSON: It's not Americans' number-one issue, because Scott's right, presidents can do lots of things all at once, and if it was that Donald Trump was, say, really, really focused on wanting to bring the murder rate in America down to zero, that is not people's number- one issue, but it might be a pretty useful way for a president. It's not a bad issue.

So, it's not just that he's focused on an issue that's not American's tippy-top issue or second-tier issue or even third issue. It's that voters sent Donald Trump to Washington because they felt like it was a town full of insiders who only cared about themselves and they wanted to send an outsider there who would shake things up and put people first. And he has done a lot of putting Donald Trump's name on stuff first.

And I think there's a lot of disillusioned voters out there who voted for him in 2024 and are looking at stuff like this. Is it their number one issue? No. Is it a reason why they might go, these people are all gross. I'm staying home? Absolutely.

TODD: By the way, there's something really troubling about a living human being who needs to put their name on somebody else's tombstone, because that's what this is. This is Washington, D.C.'s tombstone to John Kennedy. And it's gross.

And let me speak one other thing as a local. I've been in Arlingtonian now over 20 years. This is our art center in this community. And it's offensive the way he's come in and just like he doesn't spend any time here. And he's just essentially saying, well, you don't put my name on your art center, I'm going to tear the whole thing down.

So I know he doesn't care about the local community, but man, it is an extra finger in the eye. But the part of this that -- look, she brought up all that he's now becoming the exact person he actually campaigned against, the elitists of Washington. I keep coming back to what living individual wants to put their name on somebody else's tombstone. I just find that so disturbing.

HUNT: Scott, do you have an answer for that?

JENNINGS: Well, look, regarding whether he cares about the location of Washington, D.C., I would just disagree. He's done more than any modern president to clean up, modernize, make safer.

TODD: By the way, some of it, I appreciate it. I appreciate --

(CROSSTALK)

TODD: But adding his name to everything is here.

JENNINGS: Democrats consistently attack him for trying to beautify and make safe Washington, D.C. So I actually think it's the opposite. He does care about Washington, D.C.

The Kennedy Center, look, he obviously cares about it. It's a personal thing for him. I had been in this building since 2007. The only theater I go to is the Cinemark back in Kentucky when the latest --

TODD: It's not your local theater. I understand that. But that's most of them are local.

(CROSSTALK)

JENNINGS: That's most of America.

AXELROD: Scott, can I just ask you, do you think it's appropriate for him to, if he believes the building really needs to be renovated, is it appropriate for him to close it down, deprive people of the opportunity to use it, and not begin the reparations until they let him put his name on the building? You think that's appropriate? JENNINGS: I don't know if I agree with your characterization of that. He has been calling for and trying --

AXELROD: He said it today. That's what he said.

JENNINGS: For months and months and months --

AXELROD: He said today he will not begin reparations until they allow him to put his name on the building. Do you think that's appropriate?

JENNINGS: He's going to fight it out. I don't know what's going to happen. It doesn't sound like they're going to let him do it. It's how he feels about it.

I don't personally care about this myself. It's how he feels about it. I do know this. He thinks the building ought to be renovated someday, and I think there's a lot of evidence that it needs to be.

AXELROD: But at the end of the day, what it doesn't do is lower people's costs or deal with the fundamental challenges in their lives that they sent him here to deal with.

HUNT: Well, and Norm Eisen, I mean, is there any legal recourse here?

I mean, obviously the courts have said he can't put his name on the outside. The president claimed in his post a piece of the ceiling fell down, and he said I'm not going to fix it.

[16:30:05]

I mean, I would love to be able to take my kids to the Kennedy Center regularly. It's something lots of families here do, and suddenly it's just not an option.

EISEN: Yeah, and that's because of Donald Trump.

The other part of the Kennedy Center and the rest of his behavior around the District of Columbia, the reflecting pool, we're litigating that case, the toxic dumping of the East Wing debris. We're litigating that case.

There's a thread of illegality that runs through all of these things. He can't put his name on the Kennedy center. Congress has said it's a memorial to John F. Kennedy.

And so, the courts have held him in check. He's constantly not just with his path of destruction across the District of Columbia. But with all of his illegal behavior -- at Democracy Defenders Action Fund, we have over 300 legal matters stopping him.

He's violating the law. The courts will enforce the law. They will stop him.

HUNT: All right. Norm Eisen, thank you so much for your time. I really appreciate it. Hope to see you soon.

The rest of the panel is going to stand by.

Coming up next in THE ARENA, hear from the Republican who just surprised party leadership and introduced articles of impeachment against Pete Hegseth.

But first, Democratic Senator Pete Welch -- Peter Welch will enter THE ARENA after his committee tried to get FBI Director Kash Patel on the record ahead of the midterms.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. RICHARD BLUMENTHAL (D-CT): The FBI has no general authority to monitor elections.

PATEL: That priority rests with DHS.

BLUMENTHAL: So you would agree with me that deploying FBI agents to the polls on election day would be contrary to law?

PATEL: I don't know that we can't legally do it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:36:24]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. CORY BOOKER (D-NJ): Like a thug, you're using your agency to go after reporters in a chill to one of the most sacrosanct ideals of the United States of America.

PATEL: I don't have much to say. This guy called me a thug. It's kind of ironic. He's running for president of the United States. He just got his 20-second ad campaign. Next.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: A heated hearing today on Capitol Hill, where FBI Director Kash Patel defended his leadership of the bureau, touting his casework as he clashed with members of the Senate Judiciary Committee over a series of controversies, including his viral appearance at the Olympics last winter, FBI hiring standards, the apparent ousting of career officials, and his use of FBI resources.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

WELCH: Do you pledge that you will not in any way interfere in the will of the American people when they go to the polls in November.

PATEL: I pledge unequivocally that I will not participate in your charade of lies.

SEN. JOHN KENNEDY (R-LA): Why would you even get into bestiality?

PATEL: We are not into bestiality.

WELCH: You barged into the celebration of our winning Olympic team. What were you doing -- doing that?

PATEL: What you'll never understand is the players who are my friends invited me into the locker room.

SEN. ADAM SCHIFF (D-CA): Were they purged because they worked on the January 6th investigation of the president?

PATEL: There was no purging.

SCHIFF: Were any of those agents fired?

PATEL: Many retired --

SCHIFF: Excuse me, excuse me.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: All right, joining me now in THE ARENA, one of the senators who questioned Patel today, Democrat from Vermont, Peter Welch.

Senator, it's great to see you, thank you so much for being here.

I want to follow up on what you said there. I mean, you pressed him about whether agents would be sent to polling places. And, you know, earlier in the testimony, he had told Senator Klobuchar that he would follow federal guidelines, which of course prohibits that. But he wasn't as direct with you. Why?

WELCH: Well, because he's playing a role of facilitating Donald Trump's intention to guarantee through the use of federal forces that he gets the outcome in this election that he wants.

I mean, the big question with Patel, he's the director of the FBI, is will he facilitate election interference?

And what I asked him was this: President Trump just recently said in Ireland that he won the 2020 election. He just said in Houston that the only way Democrats can win is by cheating. So, he's in advance discrediting the will of the people and justifying the use of federal forces to get the outcome he wants.

And Patel plays a major role in that. And in fact, he changed his answer from Senator Klobuchar and Blumenthal to saying that he would have forces who were there.

HUNT: Sir, do you have real concerns that there may not -- the procedures around the voting may not be followed properly and especially when it comes time to seat the next Congress.

I mean, do you think any of that, in your mind, is something that's worth actually worrying about?

WELCH: Well, I'm incredibly worried about it, and I think everybody should be. I mean, keep in mind that Republicans, Democrats, independents, it's their votes who should determine who their leaders are. It shouldn't be the president or the FBI director.

And the president has made it very clear that he doesn't accept an election outcome unless it's the one he prefers. I mean, keep in mind, he's the one who invited folks to the Capitol in January 6th. He's the one who as recently as a few days ago said that the -- that he won the 2020 election.

[16:40:03]

And he's the one who continue to assert that there will be cheating.

So, yes, there's a determined effort on the part of the president to get the outcome that he wants, and all of us should be extremely concerned. And by the way, what's different now is he had resistance in his first time, his first term -- this time, he's got acolytes. He's got people like Patel. He's got the speaker.

He's got people all in government that are going to be compliant and subservient to whatever it is he demands.

HUNT: So, given all the concerns you've just laid out, what are Democrats doing about it?

WELCH: Well, the bottom line here is we're going to have to depend on the courts. And obviously we'll have election monitors, but at the end of the day, if and when there is action that is interference, we're going to have to go to the courts.

Now, I actually have some confidence in the courts. Because as you remember, after the 2020 election, there were some 80 or so lawsuits that were filed by the Trump folks, and virtually every single one of them, except I think one, was dismissed. So, we have to be ready, and we have to be ready to act immediately.

The other question is down the line when it comes to seating people. And what we have to do is call on our Republican colleagues who have a shared responsibility that we as Democrats have, to seat the people who were certified in their districts as having been elected.

HUNT: Senator, I want to ask you a couple other political questions. You are relatively close with Senator John Fetterman. I don't want to -- I don't want to characterize it for our viewers. So please do so yourself if you wish to.

But I know the two of you know each other. I want to play what he had to say because, of course, he appeared in a video that was at the midterm convention that Republicans held. in Texas and he's facing repeated questions about whether he may switch parties. This is his latest response. Watch.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JOHN FETTERMAN (D-PA): Not going to be a Republican. And why can't you guys just wait till the midterm, you know, and if I turn a Republican and then I'll be a liar then like it's just like my name is not on the ballot, like chill and wait for the midterm here. I've always been a Democrat. It's like -- no matter how many times I say that, I'm still getting asked just getting into the elevator.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: How do you explain and understand what Senator Fetterman is doing? Worth noting that Chuck Schumer just called him a strong Democrat.

WELCH: Well, he votes with us over 90 percent of the time, and he's got incredible, I think, sensibilities in support for working-class Pennsylvanians in the steel city, in the steel corridor. So, his votes are really aligned with mine and with the Democratic caucus.

John's unique. You know, you don't find many Democrats doing a video at the Republican convention. But that's going to be up to Pennsylvania voters.

But as far as my respect for him as a friend and as a member of the Democratic Caucus, when he votes with us 90 percent of the time, and then he and I very much disagree about Israel and Gaza, but we've got to have a big tent party. So, 90 percent is pretty good.

HUNT: All right. Senator Peter Welch, sir, thank you very much for joining us. I really appreciate your time.

WELCH: Thank you.

HUNT: All right. Ahead here in THE ARENA, the new report out this afternoon that details just how much the Iran war is costing us, down to the dollar.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:47:54]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. THOMAS MASSIE (R-KY): Secretary of Defense Peter Hegseth, by such conduct, has demonstrated that he will remain a threat to the Constitution if allowed to remain in office and has acted in a manner grossly incompatible with his duties and the rule of law. Peter Brian Hegseth thus warrants impeachment and trial, removal from office, and disqualification to hold and enjoy any office of honor, trust, or profit under the United States.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HUNT: In a surprise move, Republican Congressman Thomas Massie introducing articles of impeachment against Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth for high crimes and misdemeanors.

It comes as the Congressional Budget Office released a new report that reveals the cost of the Iran War so far through August 1st, the U.S. spent approximately $38 billion. They estimated it will continue to cost $2 to $3 billion per month. They also found the economic impact from the war is also expected to increase inflation for the first quarter of 2027.

New polling released today found that two-thirds of Americans disapprove of the president's handling of the war.

My panel is back.

Chuck Todd, Thomas Massie continues to be a thorn in the side here. He took everybody by surprise when he did this.

TODD: Yeah. And if you're a Democrat running in a state and you're looking for a way to bring up the Iran war in a way that gives you bipartisan cover, Republican Congressman Thomas Massie introducing articles of impeachment perhaps provide that cover.

But look, I think this war -- I mean, it goes to, frankly, the theme of what we've been talking about with every story. It's like, at the end of the day, it's the current circumstances that are being mismanaged right now, right? Everything we were told about this Iran war has not turned out so far the way it has been promised, whether by the president.

Now, whether this is a Pete Hegseth problem -- I could tell you this, as a taxpayer, I'd like to know, after 25 straight years of the defense budget going up, how do we have a military that runs out of munitions after a war with a smaller country? Like that is -- like I look at this and wonder, hey, where are members of Congress outraged about this?

[16:50:05]

Like, how mismanaged has this been? How captured by defense contractors is the Pentagon that we are just incapable of being prepared for modern warfare? That's a larger debate, but I will tell you this, I think Massey basically just only helped Democrats with their Iran messaging.

HUNT: Scott?

JENNINGS: Well, let's just go back down memory lane about why Thomas Massie is upset, because he turned against the president politically. The president engaged in endorsing a primary opponent against him in Kentucky's 4th district, where I live, by the way. And Thomas Massie lost his race in the Republican primary back in May by over 10 points.

He has since spent all of his time attacking the president, attacking the president's party, et cetera, et cetera. You can call him a Republican. He's a Republican in name only. Or a RINO in popular parlance.

He's going to continue to attack the president because he's got sour grapes about how his political career has turned out. Donald Trump ended Thomas Massie in Kentucky, and he'll be replaced by a congressman there who supports Donald Trump. The Republicans in his own state, in his own district, threw him out of office, and so now he's going to try to leave some items in the punch bowl on the way out. But I think Republicans know what the score is here.

AXELROD: Yeah. But here's the thing. We should take a walk down memory lane to the beginning of the Trump administration and the election that led to his being president again, in which he promised that he was going to lower costs, that he wasn't getting America involved in forever wars. And what we've had were these tariffs and trade war with Canada and a war in Iran has gone terribly wrong.

And we're mired in this quagmire there that is continuing to raise the costs on Americans, that has cost 18 Americans their lives and has raised the issues that Chuck brings up about whether we are less safe in other parts of the world because of the lack of ammunitions, the amount of manpower and ships and so on that have been moved to the Middle East.

These are real issues. These are real issues. I mean, I don't care about Massie, but I think everybody should care and does care about this.

And this is a huge problem. It's a political problem for the president, but it's a big problem for the country, so I don't think it should be dismissed as a miffed congressman. This is -- this is an issue that we need to -- as far as a country --

(CROSSTALK)

HUNT: Yeah, I mean, listen, this "New York Times"/Sienna poll shows 63 percent of Americans, Kristen, think it was the wrong decision.

SOLTIS ANDERSON: Yeah, this was, you know, I've been saying for months that I think the original problem with the communication around this war is that there are things that the American people would be more than happy to see the United States use its power to try to achieve, trying to keep Iran from getting a nuclear weapon is one of those things.

But the messaging coming out of the White House between last summer saying, well, we devastated their program, but maybe we didn't, and this time it being kind of a mixed message with, is that our goal? Is regime change our goal? What was it?

It was a little muddy at the beginning, and that means that now that it has stretched on longer, even than the White House said that it would originally, you're seeing it pull down the president's numbers. And I've been thinking a lot about what election this reminds me of.

And with the Democratic Party in I thought a lot about the Tea Party movement, moment that the Republicans had, wave election, but you throw away seats because you nominate crazy people. Democrats may be going through some of that.

But for Republicans, this reminds me a bit of 2006. This was George W. Bush's second term. He gets reelected with an American public saying, go for it. He comes in and says, I've got a mandate. I'm going to do what I want. and then winds up using that mandate to do things that ultimately run popular, capped off by the souring of the Iraq war and an election that leads to Speaker Nancy Pelosi.

And I just, for Republicans, it just feels like that's the direction that this is all headed.

TODD: There are so many 2006 parallels. Sherrod Brown was facing Mike DeWine then, Sherrod Brown facing Mike DeWine, lieutenant governor. You know, people are wondering, is Virginia flippable? Is Texas flippable? Montana? Alaska?

It is interesting. The parallels are quite striking, though.

HUNT: You lived through that, Scott Jennings.

JENNINGS: Don't remind me. I lived through it in the White House political office. And as the president said at the time, it was a thumping.

Look, I just want to take some issue, though, with the characterization that this war has been a failure. It has been a spectacular performance by the U.S. military. We have sunk their entire navy. They have no army to speak of. We've decimated their defense industrial complex.

Their leader is a cardboard cutout that no one has really seen in public. Their economy is in freefall. They have not exported a drop of oil since mid-July, all thanks to the brilliant performance of the U.S. military.

They cannot make a nuclear weapon. If they wanted to, and I'm sure they do, they cannot make a nuclear weapon because this president has stopped them.

I'm not here to dispute the polling, but sometimes presidents are called upon to do the right thing despite whatever the political --

[16:55:03]

HUNT: Isn't there an argument now that it's being poorly executed?

JENNINGS: I'm sorry?

HUNT: Like, isn't there an argument to be made now that it's being poorly executed? What did they went in there to do, they failed --

JENNINGS: Well, I'm sure that I'm sure well, yes, I hear many Democrats doing PR for the defeated Iranian regime, but that's not the reality. We have defeated these people by any historical metric.

The entire --

(CROSSTALK)

AXELROD: Let's just return to planet Earth.

TODD: Why are they still stopping --

AXELROD: Let's return to planet Earth here for a second.

The world's energy market is being strangled today. We haven't won the war.

HUNT: All right.

AXELROD: We've had a terrible defeat there because--

JENNINGS: Oh, boy.

HUNT: All right. We unfortunately got hot, right when we had to go.

We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HUNT: Thanks for watching.

"THE LEAD WITH JAKE TAPPER" starts right now.