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The Amanpour Hour

Interview With Former German Chancellor Angela Merkel; The Human Toll Of The Reignited Syrian Civil War; Interview With "The Substance" Actress Demi Moore; Interview With "All We Imagine As Light" Director Payal Kapadia. Aired 11a-12p ET

Aired December 07, 2024 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:00:38]

CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR: Hello everyone, and welcome to THE AMANPOUR HOUR.

Here's where we're headed this week.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ANGELA MERKEL, FORMER GERMAN CHANCELLOR (through translator): He wanted to decide matters on his own and in a democracy, well, you cannot reconcile that with democratic values.

AMANPOUR: As world leaders brace for Trump 2.0, former German Chancellor Angela Merkel dishes about him, Putin and the strongman phenomenon.

And -- the Middle East meltdown. Extremist Islamic rebels rise up again, taking two of Syria's biggest towns. We look into our archives at the ordinary people whose lives have been ruined by this long, bloody conflict.

Then --

DEMI MOORE, ACTRESS, "THE SUBSTANCE": Would I trade a tighter path, you know, for the wisdom and the peace and serenity that I have in life of who I am today? No, I wouldn't.

AMANPOUR: "The Substance" Demi Moore's star rises again, and we talk about her new body horror film on the dark side of beauty and finding freedom in aging.

And finally award-winning director of "All We Imagine As Light", Payal Kapadia tells us why love is political in India.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: Welcome to the program, everyone. I'm Christiane Amanpour in London.

In his first trip abroad as president-elect, Donald Trump is in France this weekend to celebrate the opening of the Notre Dame Cathedral five years after parts of it were burnt down in a freak accident.

Dispensing with protocol, world leaders like Emmanuel Macron are eager to meet with him and take the measure of the man they know as a deliberate disrupter on the world stage as well as at home.

His second term could mark a seismic shift with populist nationalism on the rise and a rejection of the status quo.

One leader who knows him very well is the former German Chancellor Angela Merkel. And here's a little bit of advice for those who would negotiate with Trump.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MERKEL: I think President Trump lives off actually acting unconventionally. And I think he smells when people are a little bit afraid of him. And when you're not, then you can enter into good talks with him.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

AMANPOUR: So she clocked Trump's bullying style and came up trump. And in our conversation Merkel dishes freely on being tested by strongmen like him and Putin.

I caught up with her in Washington D.C. this week on the U.S. leg of her "Freedom" book tour.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: Chancellor Merkel, welcome to the program.

MERKEL: Yes. Guten tag.

AMANPOUR: We're in the United States. There's a new president of the United States who will take office in January, Donald Trump.

You were one of the first world leaders to meet him. You came to Washington. And out of sight of the cameras, you shook hands, you did your thing, et cetera.

In sight of the cameras, in the famous Oval Office with the fireplace between you, he didn't want to shake hands with you. And even though you asked him kind of discreetly, he just refused point blank and kept looking at the cameras.

And I thought it was really interesting because you said, he wanted to create conversation fodder through his behavior, while I thought I was having a discussion with somebody completely normal.

Is he not completely normal in your view?

MERKEL: I think President Trump lives off actually acting unconventionally, and in this way draws the attention of people to himself. Either he shook the hands of some of my colleagues three times longer

than you usually do, or with me, he didn't do it at all. At this point in time, I had forgotten and normally he would say, well, you shake hands and that's it.

But when you're in this situation, you don't -- and you don't even think about it. But with him, all of these external things, these gestures, all was -- were part of a statement because he wanted to very clearly show that outside of political talks, in these situations, he puts down a marker, whatever he means with it.

AMANPOUR: You also described him as I dealt in facts, he dealt with emotions. How did that affect some of the key issues that you were trying to deal with, his emotional view of politics?

[11:04:53]

MERKEL: I would say looking back, we -- and I'm also speaking here of NATO members and E.U. members, we were actually able to get to sensible agreements with him.

But when you think about tariffs on steel, for example, at first, they were only talking about China and he was talking about the subsidies that China injects into the steel industry.

And then, all of a sudden, we were also covered by tariffs. And these tariffs are still in place today, unfortunately. But then, he wanted to put down a marker, make a statement on this. But in spite of all adversity, we were -- Nato members -- able to pursue NATO in a sensible way, and I would hope and wish that this happens also in the next four years to come.

AMANPOUR: I remember very distinctly when Donald Trump was first elected, you did one of -- you were the only one to actually welcome his election conditionally, in other words, based on the respect and the adherence to mutual values -- democracy, freedom, diversity, rule of law, human rights, et cetera.

And I just, you know, wonder whether you thought he did act in that way, and especially because you said, he was clearly fascinated by the Russian president.

"In the years that followed, I received the distinct impression that he was captivated by politicians with autocratic and dictatorial traits." How did that manifest itself to you?

MERKEL: Well, in the way that he spoke about Putin, the way that he spoke about the North Korean president, obviously, apart from critical remarks he made, there was always a kind of fascination at the sheer power of what these people could do.

So, my impression always was that he dreamt of actually overriding maybe all those parliamentary bodies that he felt were in a way an encumbrance upon him. And that he wanted to decide matters on his own.

And in a democracy, well, you cannot reconcile that with democratic values.

AMANPOUR: Can I ask you, it just popped into my head, his former chief of staff, John Kelly, who was a marine general, he actually said that Donald Trump had expressed interest, approval of Nazi generals.

Does that surprise you that he would say something like that?

MERKEL: Honestly speaking, I never heard this and I wouldn't want to make any comment on this. I said that he was fascinated, not too much co-determination as it were, or too many other people having a say. He wanted to be the person who makes the judgment and the call.

But I think if you approach -- once you approached him without any fear and with clear -- a clear-cut strategy, he listened.

And I think he smells when people are a little bit afraid of him. And when you're not, then you can enter into good talks with him.

AMANPOUR: And you were not.

MERKEL: No. I was the elected chancellor of the Federal Republic of Germany. I mean, we're not a negligible country. We have our own interests, our own vested interests, and I was always guided by these national interests.

I think the United States of America are such an important power, a superpower. But we in Europe are also important. The United States of America cannot do things on their own completely. We have an alliance. We have NATO together.

So, this is not just something where we owe something to the Americans, as Donald Trump quite often said, but the United States of America, too, must have a vested interest or should have a vested interest. At least that would be my advice.

Because when we stand together, we're simply stronger, and there are so many in the world who do not want democracy. So, strength is important in this -- against this background.

AMANPOUR: You have said that he has a nationalistic tone, and that a lot of his negotiations involve a zero-sum game, that for him to win, the other person had to lose -- period, end of story.

Is that constructive in diplomacy or trade negotiations?

MERKEL: It's not my conviction. I am convinced that through wise compromises, you can bring about win-win situations. Situations where the whole world benefits and when self also benefits from that.

I am someone who actually greatly respects international organizations, the United Nations, the World Trade Organization and others. I think they're very, very important. I would like to remind all of us, which has somebody receded into the background that the biggest challenges are climate change and the loss of biodiversity. A human being gets much more vulnerable due to this.

[11:09:47]

MERKEL: And China, the biggest emitter, we have to have them in on this because otherwise we will not be able to make progress on climate change. It may be -- you may, in the short run win, but in the long run, humankind will not be the better for it, will not survive.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: She worked with four U.S. presidents -- Bush, Obama, Trump and Biden.

More of this revealing conversation next when Merkel talks about experiencing Putin's fear tactics.

And ahead in the show, our obsession with aging embodied by the ageless and award-winning actress Demi Moore.

[11:10:24]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

AMANPOUR: Welcome back to the program.

On her U.S. book tour this week, the former German Chancellor Angela Merkel was reunited for an onstage conversation with her close ally, former U.S. President Barack Obama.

But behind the scenes as she reveals in her new memoir, her tenure dealing with many other world leaders was filled with challenges. She often found herself navigating high-stakes power games.

And in the second part of our conversation earlier this week, she opened up about how Putin uses intimidation as a diplomatic tool and how the war in Ukraine might end with him and now Trump in charge.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: Let's talk about the security of Europe and Putin and Ukraine. That's the big issue out there right now.

In your book, you write about Trump's negotiation to get U.S. troops out of Afghanistan, and you essentially say that the way it was done, with no communication with the Afghan government, only with the Taliban, the fate of Afghanistan was sealed. That essentially, Afghanistan was given back to the Taliban.

So, everybody's trying to figure out what is Trump going to do when he says, I can end the war in Ukraine in 24 hours or whatever.

What do you think, knowing what you know about this particular individual and knowing what you know about Putin, how do you think, under these two presidents, that war is going to be ended?

MERKEL: This war is such an incredible suffering for the Ukrainian population and President Zelenskyy proved to be so courageous when on the day of the aggression happened, didn't leave the country, didn't flee, but stayed in the country and is fighting ever since for a sovereign Ukraine.

I don't want to speculate. I don't want to say I can compare this with Afghanistan. I can only say the result of Afghanistan was a disaster.

Because once you have an elected government, such as the Afghan government, and not include them into such negotiations so basically, give to those who actually violate human rights every day and give them the power of attorney, so to speak, then later on they have all the possibilities at their disposal to set the conditions.

There was no internal peace process in Afghanistan due to this, and President Biden actually accepted that and that result of the negotiations, and we saw that this didn't mean anything good for the Afghan people, even until today.

But in Ukraine, well, it will depend on how Europe will sort of -- and this is -- it's sort of due to my successor, how Europe will position itself. I can't say anything on this now.

AMANPOUR: Even in negotiations, the Ukrainian politicians, whether it's President Zelenskyy or others, say, well, how can we negotiate with a liar? He says one thing and does another thing.

In your book, you write point blank that Putin told you a brazen lie when you confronted him about Russian troops inside Crimea and Eastern Ukraine in 2014.

And he also, at one point told you, look at what's happening in Ukraine, this is the 2004 revolution, the Orange Revolution. I will never allow that to happen.

How can anybody negotiate with somebody who you yourself, who knew Putin pretty well, calls a brazen liar?

MERKEL: Well, at the beginning of my work as federal chancellor, that was not what he did. He did not say these brazen lies, but later on in Crimea, he did admit that he had lied. And that was a turning point in our relationship, quite clearly, that I had to be extremely cautious in my approach towards him.

So, you cannot only trust in an agreement with him, that's absolutely correct. So, we have to give to Ukraine, in which form whatsoever, security guarantees, very clear and absolutely reliable guarantees as we gave them when they said we're going to dispense with our nuclear power at the time.

But Ukraine cannot be left without any security guarantee in what maybe we think is a peace.

In my book, I write quite clearly that apart from the military support for Ukraine, it is very important to also think now of how a diplomatic solution can look like after the end of the war.

AMANPOUR: I'm struck in your book, you as the first female chancellor of Germany. You seem to have been heavily-challenged by two macho men.

[11:19:51]

AMANPOUR: I mean, Donald Trump spent his first campaign, as you write, you know, attacking you. You were surprised, you say, that he would spend his presidential campaign attacking a German chancellor.

Putin kept trying to test you as well, and there's the famous story about the dog, right? And now, he's saying that he never knew that you were afraid of the dog when he brought the dog into the meeting the second time that he had that meeting.

So, he said, please, Angela, please know that I didn't do this to frighten you. I'm paraphrasing him. But you thought he knew exactly what he was doing.

MERKEL: Well, look into that particular chapter in my book. When I made my first visit, my foreign political adviser, Christoph Heusgen, at the time, said to his interlocutor, his counterpart, that I had been bitten by a dog. So, it would be very kind not to have a dog present.

I didn't like them all that much. And then he gave to me a stuffed animal, a dog, and said this one is not going to bite you.

So, maybe he forgotten -- he's forgotten it. But if you read this whole story, then it's not very probable that he didn't know anything about it.

I'm writing in my memoir how the situation actually was in Sochi. I adopted a brave face and said, well, never -- as the British royal family says -- never explain, never complain. I survived. The dog didn't bite me. So, let's leave it at that.

But I mean, there's no other explanation for it. It's a little -- a small attempt to test the waters, you know, how resilient a person is, how strong. It's power play, basically.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: Coming up next, more global crisis as rebel forces advance in Syria's 13-year-long civil war. The staggering human toll of this conflict from up close.

We go back to my archive and meet those caught in the middle, after the break.

[11:22:03]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

AMANPOUR: Welcome back.

For almost 13 years, Syria's civil war has ground on sadly becoming background noise recently until suddenly last week, the forgotten conflict was catapulted back into the headlines.

Rebel forces, mostly extremist Islamic fighters, appear to be taking advantage of the weakened axis that's backing Syria's Bashar al-Assad -- Russia, Iran and Hezbollah.

In a surprise offensive, rebel fighters regained control of Aleppo and surrounded Hama and these are the largest cities outside the capital, Damascus. And they're saying they're pressing on there as well.

Since the war first erupted, millions have been killed, wounded or forced into exile as refugees.

I visited some of those displaced taking shelter in a camp in neighboring Jordan, and I brought my then 16-year-old son, Darius, with me.

We met Syrian families and young kids his own age who've had to grow up fast and bear the burden of looking after their family members wondering what their own futures will hold.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: Imagine bringing my 16-year-old son Darius to work, only this isn't your normal day at the office, it's the Azraq Camp for Syrian refugees in Jordan.

Imagine this adolescent leaving his comfortable and ordinary city life in the West.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Hi.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Hi.

AMANPOUR: Coming to discover how these adolescents, young people his own age survive in the most extraordinary situations.

We meet Mohammed (ph), his four sisters and his mother, Shama (ph), who escaped war in Syria and found refuge here in Jordan. They welcome us into their new home with open arms.

It's a far cry from what they've left behind, one room with everything in it, from sewing machine to bedding. Two shelves on the wall that served as the children's library and wardrobe. Heat from a stove fed by a pipe that snakes it's way in from a gas canister.

For Darius the obvious question --

DARIUS RUBIN, CHRISTIANE AMANPOUR'S SON: What was your house like before this one?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: My house is very beautiful and my --

AMANPOUR: And Mohammed continues his story in Arabic, how the family fled when the war finally reach their Syrian village more than three years ago. How the constant bombing disrupted school and made it too dangerous to stay.

RUBIN: Were you afraid anytime during the journey?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, I was afraid, but I had to go, which was to reach somewhere safe and I managed to put my fear aside.

AMANPOUR: And I ask about their dad.

You're the man of the family. You are here with your mom. You've got your four sisters. What happened to your dad?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He died.

AMANPOUR: What happened? How?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: We were at home at the time. And there were some bombing and shooting in the area. He went outside to have a look and he was shot.

[11:29:49]

AMANPOUR: Fortunately, Darius doesn't have to step up quite like Mohammed does, fetching water for his family every day filling these heavy canisters several times each day. It is hard work. His mother, Shama (ph), has come to rely on him.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mohammed does really a good job, especially fetching water which is difficult for me to do. Sometimes he carries 20 liters in each hand. There are six of us and we need a lot of water. So sometimes he carries 10 or 12 containers a day. He also does the shopping because the market is so far away.

AMANPOUR: Into the big, blue barrel and out through a pipe in the kitchen, which is a tiny room that they have only just managed to add to their main room.

Shama says she's trying to recreate a proper family life for the kids.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It's so hard, I cannot tell you. I try to make it comfortable by moving things around and I try to find spaces for their belongings to make it look like home.

We eat, watch TV and sleep here. Now at last, we have a kitchen I can cook in like before.

AMANPOUR: Back in Syria, she says, she was the queen of her castle.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It is hard to lose your husband. I used to be the lady of the house and I was spoiled. I had everything I needed. All I had to do is ask my husband and he would get anything for me.

AMANPOUR: She keeps her memories on her phone.

He's a handsome man.

"Yes", she says. And like so many of the mothers we've met, Shama insist that education is the most important thing for her children's future.

AMANPOUR: And as we walk with Mohammed from his small metal home to the community center in this refugee camp, he says he has learned English here since fleeing Syria.

His dream is to go on to university. Once upon a time, he thought he would be an architect. Now after all that he's born witness to, he thinks he wants to be a journalist.

Should we go in?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes.

AMANPOUR: And here, with a group of teenage boys and girls, Mohammed founded "The Camp" magazine, which they publish every month, thanks to funding by the U.N. and its NGO partners.

And as we sit in on their editorial meeting, Darius, who also works on his school newspaper, wants to know what this project means to them.

RUBIN: What kind of impact does this magazine have on your life here?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE (through translator): It raises awareness and helps get children back to school.

RUBIN: And do you look forward to these new things?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Yes, very much.

AMANPOUR: Internet is only available at these centers so these adolescents don't spend their time online. And there's not much of a social life for them. The camp only got electricity back in December so television has become their main source of entertainment.

But everywhere, we hear the almost mystical reverence these children of war pay to the power of education and determination.

What would you say to Darius about life and about what it's like to be a 16-year-old boy today in this situation?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The price of success is hard work. Determining (ph) whether we win or lose, the most important thing is that we have applied ourselves to this task, any task.

AMANPOUR: Wise words indeed from a young man older than his years.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: It's an experience that stayed with my son ever since. And the sad reality is that more than seven years since that visit, Mohammed is still there and the camp is still brimming with tens of thousands of war refugees with undoubtedly more to come now.

Still ahead, chasing perfection. Legendary actress Demi Moore talks about that impossible dream and finding freedom in aging, and her new film, "The Substance".

[11:33:47]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) AMANPOUR: Welcome back.

Now, today's beauty standards are absurdly high, often impossible to meet and unrealistic. And women and young girls are going to more and more extreme lengths to live up to society's false expectations.

It's an issue at the heart of "The Substance", a recent body horror film starring Demi Moore, who plays an actress clinging on to fame and youth. Her character Elisabeth, turns to a black market treatment, bringing to life a much younger alter ego.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Have you ever dreamt of a better version of yourself? Younger, more beautiful, more perfect.

One single injection unlocks your DNA and will release another version of yourself.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

AMANPOUR: It's a spooky take, and Demi Moore has been on the Hollywood circuit for decades with iconic roles in "Ghost" and "Charlie's Angels". But she's not always been as confident as she is today about her looks or her self-worth.

[11:39:45]

AMANPOUR: She joined me in New York for a frank and open conversation about overcoming her demons, past battles with addiction, and learning to value herself at whatever age.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: Demi Moore, welcome to our program.

MOORE: Thank you so much for having me. I really truly feel so honored. I'm such a fan.

So, this is -- this is a very nice and big moment.

AMANPOUR: Well, we are very happy to talk to you about this amazing film and a lot of other things.

First, I want to ask you about "The Substance".

MOORE: Ok.

AMANPOUR: Because it is extraordinary body horror. It's been out for several months. And it's had a range of critiques. Some have said it's like really deep. Others have said it's really shallow. You yourself said that this could be an absolutely amazing thing or it could be a disaster.

MOORE: Yes.

AMANPOUR: Now, that it's been out for a few months, is it amazing or a disaster?

MOORE: I think it's amazing. I mean, it's really, in truth, I think, hit a certain kind of zeitgeist in popular culture that is even beyond what I could have expected, but all that I had hoped for.

And I think for those looking just for something that's a visceral, entertaining experience, it's all there. And I think for those -- and more so, I find people who it -- where it deeply resonated, it's touched them in a place of their -- kind of their own truth. And that's really like the greatest hope.

AMANPOUR: You are Elisabeth Sparkle.

MOORE: Yes.

AMANPOUR: And at a famous, you know, scene of a lunch or a dinner with, I think, the boss of your show, Harvey, by the way, called Harvey --

MOORE: Yes.

AMANPOUR: -- he essentially told you that you've just hit 50 and you've aged out and maxed out of Hollywood.

MOORE: Yes.

AMANPOUR: So, that's the paradigm. Just give us the story. I mean, it's a very visceral story about something that's a big deal for women in Hollywood and elsewhere.

MOORE: I mean, I think it's -- again, for me, the setting is, you know, heightened by the mere fact that it's -- you know, Elisabeth is somebody in the public eye. She's an actress.

But it's -- and so, there are greater expectations and challenges that come when you are out front facing and with judgments and criticisms that come from the outside.

The fascinating part for me with this was not the circumstances, but it's the aspect of what she was doing to herself, the value she was placing on what other people thought and cared about. Her value on whether she was successful, being the very crux of whether she was worthy or not.

And I think that's the piece that really moved me, because it explored that violence that we can have against ourselves, that harsh criticism, that compare and despair.

AMANPOUR: I spoke with the director, the French director --

MOORE: Yes.

AMANPOUR: -- Coralie Fargeat, who is quite remarkable.

When I asked her after it aired -- after it first released, about working with you, this is what she said. "I discovered someone who was really willing to take a risk."

How far out of your comfort zone did she push you?

MOORE: I mean, I think the very nature of it was knowing that I was stepping into something that was extremely raw and vulnerable, and to really tell the story required to really like expose all those parts that we generally might want to mask, cover up or generally just not share.

Really heightened shots, accentuating those very things that perhaps I don't love. And you know, the truth is it really was, for me, in the end, it was a reclaiming. It was -- and a more empowering ownership by just saying, I am who I am and this is where I am at this moment in time.

And finding kind of the power in that important message of accepting who we are as we are.

AMANPOUR: I spoke to Jodie Foster a while ago "True Detective".

MOORE: Yes.

AMANPOUR: And she said turning 60 was incredibly liberating for her as a female actress, as somebody who played alongside younger actors. It's like her time to sort of almost put the others ahead of her, give them the chance, and not think so much about her own vanity.

Do you feel that having turned 60 is consciously or subconsciously a turning point?

MOORE: I couldn't agree more. I think that there is a great freedom in it. And again, when, you know, like in the story, when you're chasing this idea of perfection, as I heard a woman write in -- on a BBC talk -- radio show, and said, you know, how do you celebrate your body at this age? And she was in her late 70s.

And she said, you know, my body has -- the size and shape has pretty much stayed the same, it's just more loosely wrapped.

And so, I really love that. I totally get it. I understand. And I thought, would I trade a tighter ass, you know, for the wisdom and the peace and serenity that I have in life of who I am today? No, I wouldn't.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

[11:44:52]

AMANPOUR: And still to come with Demi Moore, the liberating power of accepting who you are. We get more personal with her after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

AMANPOUR: Welcome back.

Now Demi Moore has been a Hollywood household name since she broke into the studio scene in the 1980s and 90s.

[11:49:46]

AMANPOUR: Here's part two of our conversation where we discussed her new film, "The Substance", the pressure, the fame, younger men and how her ex-husband Bruce Willis, father of their two children, how he's doing after a recent diagnosis of dementia.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: You wrote a memoir a few years ago called "Inside Out" --

MOORE: Yes.

AMANPOUR: -- in which you detailed in fairly shocking and again visceral information about your childhood, your -- you know, the sexual abuse that you, you know, endured. The drugs, the alcohol, the fear of being you at that time and how you coped with it.

You also really, again, created headlines when you were together with and married to Ashton Kutcher who was a lot younger.

MOORE: Yes.

AMANPOUR: I think he was 25, you were 40.

MOORE: Yes, 40.

AMANPOUR: This film is about aging and how you deal with it. How much of the film and what you were, you know, experiencing doing the film could you link to your own private life and what maybe you went through as being an older woman with a younger man?

MOORE: You know, it was interesting. During that time, you would have thought I was the first person who's ever been with a younger man. I was not. But somehow I was placed as a bit of a poster that came with a lot of judgment.

And I -- but I think all of my life has been in service in a way, you know, the things that I write about in the book that are dealing with a lot of my own challenges with my own body issues, the value I -- especially in my younger years, placed on my body being a certain way also gave me a lot of depth to bring to this. Even though that isn't where I'm sitting today.

But I think that I have all of that to bring into the table.

AMANPOUR: You have three daughters, three grown daughters in their 30s. How did they -- well, how did they react to your film and to your book? Because you shared a lot of secrets.

MOORE: I did. I think there was a lot in the book that, in a way, they didn't know, particularly about my childhood and some of that. But I think it gave them a better understanding of maybe aspects of my intensity of certain things. But overall, I think it presented, I think, a cathartic healing for

them as well. And in a way, I feel like the film was almost kind of a secondary maybe installment to processing whatever was left over from some of that real lack of value.

My middle daughter, Scout, reflected something so beautiful, which is this idea that she said, I want to quit wasting time focusing on all that I'm not, when I could be celebrating all that I am.

AMANPOUR: That's a victory. Score one.

MOORE: A hundred percent.

AMANPOUR: For all women --

MOORE: Yes.

AMANPOUR: -- and girls.

In terms of the family dynamic, you were married for 13 years to Bruce Willis, a huge mega star at the time of your marriage. And he is diagnosed with a kind of dementia.

MOORE: Yes. FTD.

AMANPOUR: Yes. Can you say what that is?

MOORE: It's frontotemporal dementia.

AMANPOUR: Can you tell his fans and people how he is and how he's coping?

MOORE: You know, given the givens, he's in a very stable place at the moment. And you know, I've shared this before, but I really mean this so sincerely. It's like so important for anybody who's dealing with this to really meet them where they're at.

And from that place, there is such loving and joy. And there is great loss, but there is also great beauty and gifts that can come out of it.

AMANPOUR: Ok. All right. Demi Moore, thank you so much indeed.

MOORE: Thank you so much.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

AMANPOUR: And of course, you can watch "The Substance" in select theaters or stream on Mubi.

When we come back, why love is so political in India. That and railing against the patriarchy. I talk to Payal Kapadia, the filmmaker behind "All We Imagine As Light", up next.

[11:53:50]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

AMANPOUR: And finally, a love letter to Mumbai, India's most diverse and cosmopolitan city.

"All We Imagine As Light" is the first Indian film in three decades to compete in the Cannes Film Festival's main stage, winning second prize and critical acclaim. It's about life in the big city and love under the patriarchy as experienced by three women.

I asked director Payal Kapadia why love can be such a political act in India.

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PAYAL KAPADIA, DIRECTOR, "All We Imagine As Light" love in India is very political --

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AMANPOUR: Love?

KAPADIA: Love. The question of love, its political everywhere, I think. But in India particularly so. And for me all my films are about love and longing.

So even in this one, I wanted to explore further the themes of love for these women, one of whom is in an arranged marriage with a man who's disappeared and gone to Germany, and the other is falling in love with a young man and it's just the start of the romance, but you know, there's going to be trouble for them ahead.

AMANPOUR: Why is love political in India?

KAPADIA: I mean, because in India, love has a lot to do with marriage, and marriage has a lot to do with, you know, the sort of control of the family of who you can be with and who they think that you should be with.

[11:59:50]

KAPADIA: And that's related a lot to identity, to do with caste and religion. So it becomes a kind of way that there's a kind of control over the woman's life. And for me, that is a matter of concern.

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AMANPOUR: And "All We Imagine as Light" is out now here in the U.K. and in theaters in the United States.

That's all we have time for though. Don't forget, you can find all our shows online as podcasts at cnn.com/audio and on all other major platforms.

I'm Christiane Amanpour in London. Thank you for watching. And see you again next week.