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The Lead with Jake Tapper

Musk Tells GOP Senators He's Open To Coordination On DOGE Cuts; Rep. Nicole Malliotakis, (R-NY), Is Interviewed About DOGE; International Turmoil At FBI As Patel Tries To Overhaul Bureau; Agents Concerned Foreign Adversaries Could Exploit Agency Discord; Experts Warn Measles Cases Could Spread In Texas. Police Investigating Deaths Of Actor Gene Hackman & His Wife; Israel Says It Won't Withdraw From Gaza-Egypt Border As It Sends Team To Ceasefire Talks; Connecticut Teen Sues School District, Alleging She Graduated Without Being Taught To Read Or Write. Aired 5-6p ET

Aired February 27, 2025 - 17:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[17:00:00]

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: For a meeting largely focused on the future of the conflict in Ukraine and negotiations in the war started by Russia's Vladimir Putin. That's where we begin with CNN's Jeff Zeleny at the White House.

Jeff, we just saw President Trump meeting with the British prime minister. Also just hours away now from President Trump's meeting with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy. Where do they stand (ph)?

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Phil, that meeting on Friday will certainly be extraordinary in the history of the Russia, Ukraine invasion and the war. And what we have seen this week, starting on Monday with French President Emmanuel Macron, backed up by British Prime Minister Keir Starmer, trying to pull the American president away from Vladimir Putin, trying to inject some uncertainty and skepticism and in fact, a call for concessions before any peace deal can be made. But it was clear in conversation after conversation Donald Trump saying he likes and he respects and more importantly values the word of Vladimir Putin. He said, I trust him.

Now, the question here, of course, hanging over all of this is how Trump will treat Zelenskyy at the White House tomorrow. He has called him a dictator, but that is not something he repeated today when he was asked by a reporter in the East Room.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I think we're going to have a very good meeting tomorrow morning. We're going to get along really well. OK? We have a lot of respect. I have a lot of respect for him.

We've given him a lot of equipment and a lot of money, but they have fought very bravely. (END VIDEO CLIP)

ZELENY: So saying there that the Ukraine soldiers have fought very bravely, I think few people would question that. But he did not say if he would apologize to Zelenskyy for calling him a dictator.

Phil, the backdrop of this meeting tomorrow here at the White House, even as this deal is still being worked out, this rare earths mineral deal where the U.S. would get essentially a chunk of the valued property of Ukraine as an economic bargaining chip, but also a security arrangement. But the biggest question still hanging over all of this is what security would the U.S. offer? And this is something that the British prime Minister walked away from this meeting without getting answer if the U.S. essentially would have their back. But the President was asked at the news conference a little bit earlier if he believes in the Article 5 from NATO, which is an attack against one is an attack against all? He said yes, he does.

That's important because if British and French troops were attacked by Russia, that would mean the U.S. would have to come to their aid. So, Phil, so many questions hangover hanging over this meeting tomorrow. But the president said Zelenskyy will be here at 11:00 a.m. on Friday. Phil.

MATTINGLY: It's been a very, very high stakes week. Jeff Zeleny covering all for us at the White House, thanks so much.

Well, also this afternoon, Elon Musk is the head of the Department of Government Efficiency met with senators behind closed doors on Capitol Hill. Now this as many Republican lawmakers have been facing backlash from constituents about widespread cuts and layoffs across the federal government. CNN's Manu Raju is with us now from Capitol Hill.

Manu, what did you hear from inside that meeting?

MANU RAJU, CNN CHIEF CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, this was born because of a lot of concerns from Republicans in particular that they were blindsided by what Elon Musk has been doing, that senators are very territorial over their perch of the committees of jurisdiction that they oversee some of these key federal agencies and they're learning about these cuts on X. They're learning about things on -- via social media or seeing it in the newspapers or on T.V. and they're hearing it from their own constituents. They want to have a better process from learning about how Elon Musk and the Department of Government Efficiency are going after some of these programs, some of the programs that they themselves support. So today's meeting was an effort to try to get on the same page as about in terms of coordination, in terms of communication. What we're told is that in this meeting that occurred off campus actually at the White House today with Elon Musk and some top senators that they talked about keeping the lines of communications open, they gave, according to Senator Tommy Tuberville, he told me there was actually a point person that they can now reach out to if they have specific concerns about they have specific suggestions on individual programs to cut.

But there are a lot of concerns about -- from Republicans about not just the -- what some of the programs are being cut, but just how quickly this is being done and how this seems to being done without any real consultation. So, Phil, this was an effort try to go to alleviate some of those pressures that are coming from Capitol Hill, from the president's own party. The question is whether Musk will ultimately listen to that, those concerns and whether the Republicans will be OK with Musk's efforts going forward, Phil.

MATTINGLY: Manu, my ears perked up last night when Speaker Mike Johnson had an interview with Kaitlan Collins. He mentioned the possibility that DOGE cuts would be factored in to that spending deadline that's coming up. Is that a plausible option right now?

RAJU: It really does not seem to be, which is really raising a lot of questions about how ultimately they can avoid a government shutdown. Remember that is just in two weeks. March 14th is the deadline and there is no agreement. First of all, they needed to reach an agreement over how much to spend for the entire federal government for this year. There's no agreement between Republicans and Democrats on that question.

[17:05:00]

Now what about all the other issues underneath it? How will Donald Trump deal with the fact that Congress will need to figure out how to fund federal agencies like USAID that Donald Trump is trying to dismantle at this moment? Will he agree to a spending bill that provides money for those very agencies that he is seeking to undercut? That is a major question.

We know Mike Johnson did indicate that he wants to go that route. A lot of Republicans are not sure. John Thune, the Senate majority leader, said that we'll figure out how that works out. We know where the administration stands. And the top Republicans who chair the key House and Senate appropriations committees told reporters today that they do not see that as a viable alternative here, which is raising real questions about how to avoid a government shutdown and how to keep Trump and Musk happy.

MATTINGLY: Manu Raju, at the Russell Rotunda, a countdown clock. We have seen it so often over the course of the last several years. It's about that time.

Manu Raju, we appreciate you, bud.

Joining me now is New York Republican Congresswoman Nicole Malliotakis.

Congresswoman, really appreciate your time. Can you start there with where I ended with Manu, which is Speaker Johnson raising the idea of factoring in the DOGE cuts into a CR agreement? Is that something you would be open to?

REP. NICOLE MALLIOTAKIS (R-NY), WAYS AND MEANS COMMITTEE: Well, I think that we certainly want to consider a lot of the savings that have been identified by Elon Musk and the DOGE within reason, right? Because some of these things we are questioning and we're not 100 percent supportive of. But with -- the idea of DOGE was to give recommendations to Congress on where we can save taxpayer money considering we have a $37 trillion debt. And then it's up to Congress to who is the body that has the power of the purse to then incorporate it into our spending. So I think it is appropriate for Congress to be considering it.

However, with the short time frame we are dealing with, I mean, we're all talking about just two weeks. I think that does make it difficult.

And the other thing we need to consider is that in order for any funding mechanism to pass, it's going to need to be bipartisan. Why? Because the Senate, you need 60 votes. We only have 53 Republicans. Therefore, you're going to need seven Democrats to join us. And so it's going to need to be bipartisan. I think some of my colleagues in the Republican conference don't recognize that. And as soon as we try to work with Democrats, they want to -- they don't want to vote for it. And I think that that's really what puts at us at risk at a shut -- for a shutdown right now.

MATTINGLY: Yes, it's such an important point. We all know how this is going to end. It's just a matter of how painful it's going to be from getting from here to that point on some level with a bipartisan agreement. You know, what you just said, I think is an important point. The idea of DOGE was recommendations to lawmakers, lawmakers enact the cuts.

Obviously that hasn't been how it's operated in practice at least. Recommendations haven't necessarily been sent to you guys. A lot of action has already been taken. You mentioned you don't agree necessarily -- your colleagues don't agree with everything that's happened up to this point. What are the issues that you've seen from your perspective for your district?

MALLIOTAKIS: Well, first of all, look, the president is within his right in terms of the federal workforce to increase it or reduce it. We saw that President Biden increase the federal workforce by 5 percent. It was the greatest increase we've seen in any one single term of a president since the 1980s. And so many of these probationary employees that are being relieved of their responsibility, the president's within has right to do that. However, what I would also say is that we should be working with the secretaries, these smart individuals, very capable individuals that the president appointed to head these agencies, they need to be consulted in this matter too.

So, if DOGE is making recommendations, you know, the secretaries are the one that -- ones that should be taking those recommendations, looking within their agencies and seeing what is the best way to make this agency more efficient, to better serve the public, to protect the taxpayer, to make sure there's metrics in place so we're getting the results that this agency is supposed to be receiving for the American people. And what I would say is that may not be happening. This seems to be happening very fast and furiously and I don't see that consultation taking place. So that I think is a real critical point that I would like to see happening here.

And we hope -- and I'll give you one example for -- one example, the 9/11 World Trade Center healthcare program, when there were cuts made to CDC staff, we had employees, 16 of them, within the 9/11 health care program that serves my district that were also relieved of their responsibilities. And we had to go back to the White House and ask them to reverse that. And as a New Yorker, President Trump understood that the 9/11 World Trade Center health care program is so important for our first responders and the victims that are suffering from 9/11 illnesses and cancers right now. And that was not -- that was like throwing the baby out with the bathwater. And that's why this has to be done slowly, cautiously, and in a thoughtful manner.

As I like to say, a scalpel, not a sledgehammer.

[17:10:01]

MATTINGLY: Which seems to be the opposite of what they're doing on some level, right? It's more of a ask forgiveness, not permission structure. I think the question becomes -- and you raise a really important kind of window into this, you having to call after the fact, you and your delegation having to reach out after the fact and say, whoa, this is a problem. Who did you call? How did you know what to do?

Because that's what we heard from senators today of, we don't even know a point of contact necessarily.

MALLIOTAKIS: Well, we reached out directly to the White House and we explained why this was problematic. And, you know, there were a number of grants that were going to the FDNY that were for research for 9/11 related illnesses. And the 16 employees that were terminated were doing very important work to make sure that these -- the applications and that the illnesses were being approved in a timely manner. And we need this to be rectified.

And again, I -- look, I thank President Trump for doing it. Look, it should have never gotten to that, obviously, right? But I do thank President Trump, because at the end of the day, as a New Yorker, he understood, you know, that this was an important program. But we have to fix what happened here and why this happened by DOGE so fast and furiously, where it had this unintended consequence.

We want to -- we don't want to have this type of unnecessary anxiety for the people who are being served by these programs. We don't want to have these unintended consequences where we have to go then back and ask for them to reverse it. We've kind of seen something similar happen with the National Park Service with some seasonal employees there, some other employees with agriculture that were working on the avian bird flu and also the nuclear science program. These are aware reversals had taken place. So let's work with the secretaries.

Let's entrust these individuals that President Trump appointed who are very capable to make the final determination. Again, those should be a recommendation. They should be an advisory role. But at the end of the day, it's the secretaries under this administration, as well as the members of Congress who should have the final say.

MATTINGLY: Real quick, before I let you go, have you gotten any indication, you know, saying that it needs to be fixed, kind of the process here, that it's being fixed, that they understand that there will be any changes?

MALLIOTAKIS: Well, I haven't necessarily gotten any clear indication. But what I will say is that, again, DOGE is doing a very important work. The amount of grants that they've been able to identify that were going to so many unnecessary things and programs that were just unnecessary overseas in other countries, taxpayers were quite furious with this list once they saw what was happening. But when it comes to -- and again, the federal bureaucracy, that's the problem with these grants. We never had that information as members of Congress because when we earmarked funding for these agencies, it's then these federal bureaucrats that were making the final decisions of where these grants would go.

And we had a hard time getting a list even when we had them for hearings and we wrote letters and we asked questions and we did issued subpoenas, we still had a hard time getting this information. It was only when President Trump came to office, opened up the books, and really allowed the public to see where this money was being spent that we were able to identify so much of this waste and unnecessary funding.

So what I would say is they are overall doing some many good things. They've identified billions of dollars in wasteful spending that we can preserve, taxpayer money and make sure it goes to its intended purpose or goes back to the taxpayer or goes down to pay our $37 trillion debt, which is really the impetus behind this, to get our debt under control so we don't go bankrupt. But again, I -- the reason why I talk about this and others are talking about it is make sure the process is smoother, that there are checks and balances, that the secretaries are involved with what's going on in their own agencies, and that members of Congress can then go forward and draft pieces of legislation that will reflect the priorities of this administration and our government.

MATTINGLY: Yes. It's an important conversation. Important points that you're making. Appropriations process, too, coming up. That's where a lot of this stuff can actually happen with those recommendations.

Republican Congresswoman Nicole Malliotakis from New York, appreciate your time. Thanks so much.

MALLIOTAKIS: Thank you.

MATTINGLY: Well, the new FBI director running into some very early obstacles during his first week on the job. Up next, what CNN teams are learning about the disagreements inside the agency that are causing problems already? Plus, the update we got just moments ago as investigators try to figure out how Hollywood legend Gene Hackman and his wife died inside their home.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:18:44] MATTINGLY: In our law and justice lead, the newly cemented FBI director's first week on the job hasn't necessarily been smooth. Kash Patel's credibility is on the line after some members of the advisory panel designed to build trust between Patel and the rest of the bureau suddenly stepped down. Meanwhile, tensions are building by the day between Trump loyalists and career FBI officials. I want to bring in CNN's Senior Justice Correspondent Evan Perez who's all over this story. Also joining us, CNN Chief Law Enforcement Analyst John Miller.

Evan, to start with you, you have this great piece out, tons of behind the scenes reporting here. What did you learn?

EVAN PEREZ, CNN SENIOR JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Phil, you know, look, it goes beyond Cash Patel walking in a week ago, last Thursday into the director's office and asking and demanding new carpeting and new window treatments, right? It goes beyond that. One of the first things he did in one of the early meetings with senior leaders was to outline that he wanted to move as many as 1,500 people out of the Washington area from headquarters and some of the other offices in the Washington area to the field offices and to an FBI facility in Huntsville. And part of the idea is that, you know, they want more agents to be out there, as Kash Patel has said, to go out and be cops.

And look, I will say that inside the FBI, as you know, Phil, from your time covering DOJ and the FBI, you know, there is a lot of feeling, a lot of support for the idea that more power needs to be shifted out to the FBI field office. What is going awry here is the way they've gone about it, including, of course, the plan early on to try to fire more than 100 people who were associated with January 6 cases. Of course, there's still this whole review ongoing of January six cases that that is really souring the support inside the FBI big time.

[17:20:30]

MATTINGLY: You know, John, an element of Evans reporting that really stuck out to me is, you know, the concern among FBI officials that internal discord kind of people trying to figure out what the new directors wants to do is trying to do may do actually opens the door for adversaries, China, Russia, Iran to exploit vulnerabilities. How real is that threat?

JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: Well, I think it's very real. If you look at the FBI's post 9/11 transformation from what they say it needs to get back to a law enforcement organization, agents being cops, chasing bank robbers and drug dealers and, you know, organized criminals. What we learned after 9/11 is that that doesn't fit today's threat environment, solving crimes and arresting bad guys. You need the intelligence and coordination and the collection and the analysis that allows you to prevent all of the terrorist attacks that were prevented, to get ahead of all the espionage operations that were thwarted, to deal with cyber as it spreads its tentacles in ways that it's going to be really hard to recover from. And you can't do that just by being cops.

And adversaries are looking at the depletion of these headquarters entities and the idea of firing hundreds, if not thousands of people in the counterterrorism business because they worked on the January 6th case. And what do they see? Adversaries see opportunity.

MATTINGLY: You know, Evan, you talk about adversaries. What's fascinating here is investigations cross administrations, right?

PEREZ: Yes.

MATTINGLY: Particularly when it comes to foreign adversaries that maybe the FBI is looking into here. This administration has a very different foreign policy posture than really any administration we've seen on some level when it comes to adversaries, regardless of party. How does that factor into those investigations?

PEREZ: Yes, look, I mean, that's a part of the big problem right now that I'm detecting certainly from talking to agents inside, Phil. And John just, you know, really emphasized this. Part of the issue is, you know, you see a lot of emphasis. I think we were showing some of the things that Kash has talked about in some of his meetings, including starting doing a partnership with the UFC, right, to emphasize physical fitness. Look, we are living in the bro era and that we understand all of that, but, you know, for the FBI, a lot of what they do is focusing on Russia and China and Iran.

And one of the things I heard from people is, you know, agents are wondering, is it OK for me to investigate a Russian counterintelligence threat? Is it OK for me to open a case against a criminal Russian criminal organization that has ties to the Kremlin, given the fact that the White House is playing footsie with Vladimir Putin, right? Is this OK for me to do, or am I going to get punished because it clashes with the foreign policy goals that is being outlined by the President of the United States? They don't know. The other thing that they don't know is whether it's OK to open public corruption cases, because that is also sort of under the gun.

And one of the things that is going to be affected by this move of agents out of the Washington area is the intelligence part. Counterintelligence is a big focus of the criticism by the right wing. And so I think there's a lot of concern inside the FBI that this could really affect our ability to deter not only terrorist threats, but also threats from China and from Iran, North Korea.

MATTINGLY: John, there's a lot of important nuance in Evan's piece in terms of, look, this is early -- people are trying to figure everything out. They've read a lot. They've listened to a lot of podcasts. Apparently, UFC is a thing at the FBI now, but in terms of credibility, regaining confidence of the people on the ground, the workforce here, is that plausible at this point? Is there time for that to happen? What does he have to do?

MILLER: Well, there is, but. But, you know, Evan, and you just, in this question, put your thumb on it, which is right now the FBI is looking upward at its new director and its new deputy director, two people from outside the FBI, to see whose director and deputy director they're going to be. Are they going to be the director for the agents for the bureau for the mission, or are they going to be the FBI director for the White House, which takes an agency that's been independent and really makes it part of the political operation, and that's what they're waiting to see.

MATTINGLY: Evan Perez, John Miller, appreciate you guys. Thank you.

PEREZ: Thank you.

MATTINGLY: Well, the new warnings from health officials today as a measles outbreak turns deadly in Texas and continues to spread.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[17:29:17]

MATTINGLY: In our health, lead experts warn a deadly measles outbreak will continue to spread in places where vaccination rates are low, particularly among children. The highly contagious virus is responsible for the death of a child in West Texas, the first U.S. measles death in a decade. This as the Health and Human Services Secretary RFK Jr. says they're quote, "following the epidemic every day," but has not encouraged vaccinations in relation to this outbreak.

I want to bring in Pediatric Infectious Disease Specialist Dr. Adam Ratner. He's the author of "Booster Shots, The Urgent Lessons of Measles and the Uncertain Future of Children's Health."

Dr. Ratner, I want to start with what we heard from the Health and Human Services secretary yesterday that measles outbreaks are, quote, "not unusual." What did you think when you heard that?

DR. ADAM RATNER, PEDIATRIC INFECTIOUS DISEASE SPECIALIST: It made me angry, to be honest. Children should not be dying of measles in the United States in 2025. This was a preventable death and the cases that we're seeing in West Texas are preventable cases.

MATTINGLY: The skepticism about vaccines, look, it is a different time than it was 10 years ago, 20 years ago, in terms of the public discourse in this country about vaccines. What is your message to parents who are skeptical about vaccines or -- or anti-vaccine altogether?

RATNER: It is reasonable to ask questions about any health thing that your pediatrician recommends or any doctor recommends. You should get your questions answered and that is completely fine, but you should get your answers from a trusted source, which is usually a pediatrician, and that there is a lot of misinformation out there and that as we're seeing in Texas right now, that misinformation can lead people to not vaccinate their kids and the result can be fatal outbreaks.

MATTINGLY: It's important to point out, look, local officials in West Texas have been unequivocal in the need for vaccination and their belief about vaccination. Look, measles was declared in the U.S. eliminated in 2000. I think one of the questions I've been asking this week is, do you think this outbreak will reach a point where that declaration gets reversed? RATNER: I'm concerned about that. I mean, so elimination has a technical definition, which is -- is no spread in the United States over the course of longer than a year. And so an outbreak like this certainly endangers that elimination status, but regardless of whether we hold onto elimination status or not, the -- the point is that there are more frequent and larger outbreaks now than there used to be. And that is because we have declining vaccination rates across the country.

So the MMR vaccination rate in kindergarten children has gone from above 95 percent, which is where we needed it pre-pandemic, to under 93 percent and continuing to fall. In some counties, like in Gaines County, where we're seeing the outbreak now, the vaccination rates for kindergartners with MMR is under 80 percent. That is too low to prevent an outbreak.

MATTINGLY: For people who are vaccinated, whose kids are vaccinated, what should their level of concern be if they live in West Texas, if they're dealing with something like this?

RATNER: Right. So the best thing that you can do to protect your kids is to get them vaccinated. And what we usually do is one dose of the measles, mumps, rubella vaccine at about a year of age, and then the second dose at four to six years of age. You can get kids an earlier dose if your doctor or local public health departments recommend that. In the setting of an outbreak, a kid who has received two MMR doses is very likely to be protected. You get about 97 percent or 98 percent protection from that.

It's not 100 percent. We have seen some cases of measles in this outbreak in vaccinated kids. They tend to be milder. The children who are hospitalized are not children who were vaccinated. But the number one thing that you can do to protect your kids and protect the rest of your family is to get them vaccinated.

MATTINGLY: Ask the questions, but also believe the statistics. Dr. Adam Ratner, appreciate your time, sir. Thanks so much.

RATNER: My pleasure. Thanks.

[17:33:18]

Well, CNN has obtained the emotional 911 call made after workers found Hollywood icon, Gene Hackman, and his wife dead inside their home. The latest on the investigation into what happened, that's next.

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(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GENE HACKMAN, ACTOR: If you put your effort and concentration into playing to your potential to be the best that you can be, I don't care what the scoreboard says at the end of the game. In my book, we're going to be winners. OK?

(END VIDEO CLIP) MATTINGLY: In our Pop Culture Lead, remembering Gene Hackman, the two- time Oscar winner, and his wife, Betsy Arakawa, were found dead in their New Mexico home, Wednesday, along with one of their dogs.

The everyman actor starred in seminal classics like what you just saw, "Hoosiers," "The French Connection," "Bonnie and Clyde." Now authorities are investigating the cause of their deaths. CNN's Josh Campbell reports.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

SHERIFF ADAN MENDOZA, SANTA FE COUNTY, NEW MEXICO: We're going to work this case. They're going to look at every aspect and -- and figure out -- try to figure out the exact cause. And I -- again, I think the autopsy is going to be key and the toxicology.

JOSH CAMPBELL, CNN SECURITY CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Tonight, an investigation is underway into the death of two-time Oscar winner, Gene Hackman. The 95-year-old Hollywood icon was found dead, Wednesday, inside his New Mexico home along with his wife, Betsy Arakawa, and a dog, according to officials. Circumstances which the Santa Fe County Sheriff's Office called suspicious enough in nature to require a thorough search and investigation.

MENDOZA: It's concerning that every -- every -- everyone in the house, including the dog, is deceased.

CAMPBELL (voice-over): Deputies were called to Hackman's house on a welfare check request made by two maintenance workers, according to a search warrant.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: No dude, they're not moving. Just send somebody out here really quick.

CAMPBELL (voice-over): Inside, deputies found the couple's bodies in different rooms. Hackman in a mudroom, his 63-year-old wife in a bathroom near a space heater, with an open prescription bottle on the counter and pills scattered around. Deputies say she had obvious signs of death and body decomposition. Officials did not find any signs of forced entry, and the fire department and gas company didn't find any obvious signs of a gas leak. A Sheriff's Office spokesperson says the cause of death has not been confirmed, but it is not believed to be foul play.

Raised in Denville, Illinois, Hackman served in the Marine Corps before moving to Hollywood in 1952 to try his hand at acting.

HACKMAN: It's all I ever wanted to do.

CAMPBELL (voice-over): It wasn't until 1964 that he started getting breaks.

HACKMAN: Look like we're having such a time, boy,

CAMPBELL (voice-over): He earned an Oscar nomination for his performance as Buck Barrow in the 1967 film "Bonnie and Clyde." HACKMAN: All right, Popeye's here. Get your hands on your heads. Get off the bar and get on the wall.

[17:40:00]

CAMPBELL (voice-over): He won his first Oscar playing New York cop, Popeye Doyle, in the 1971 film "The French

HACKMAN: Lex Luthor. Possibly you've heard the name, the greatest criminal mind on Earth.

CAMPBELL (voice-over): Often playing the villain or beloved antihero, Hackman won his second Oscar for his role in Clint Eastwood's 1992 Western "Unforgiven."

HACKMAN: When he fires that, take out your pistols and shoot him down like a mangy scoundrel he is.

CAMPBELL (voice-over): Known for his more intimidating roles, he was also beloved for his comedic ones.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Are you getting divorced?

HACKMAN: It doesn't look good.

I've loved every minute of my career. I really have.

CAMPBELL (voice-over): Then in the early 2000s, Hackman quietly retired from Hollywood.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Nothing's on. There's no script in front of you. No one's calling Gene Hackman.

HACKMAN: No, no. It's probably all over.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

CAMPBELL: And of course, here in Santa Fe, investigators behind me at the sheriff's department are now running yet another high profile investigation. This was the same team that investigated the fatal shooting on the set of the movie, "Rust" involving Alec Baldwin. We just got some new information in from the sheriff's department. They say that both on Gene Hackman as well as his wife, autopsies have been performed. At this point, they determined there's no sign of external trauma. They say that carbon monoxide and toxicology tests have been requested as the medical examiner continues this investigation.

But as authorities continue to search for answers here, we know that whatever they saw there at the house concerned them enough to go to a judge and say, we need to search this residence in order to gather additional information. We know that investigation is underway. Finally, sort of pointing out that these medical examiner investigations can take time, often weeks, sometimes even months to get to a cause of death, Phil.

MATTINGLY: Josh Campbell with the latest in Santa Fe, New Mexico, thanks so much.

Well, in our Faith Lead, a new statement from the Vatican today says the Pope's condition is, quote, improving, but his prognosis is still unclear. Let's get the latest from CNN Vatican correspondent, Christopher Lamb.

CHRISTOPHER LAMB, CNN VATICAN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Phil, another Vatican statement on Thursday giving people calls for hope when it comes to Pope Francis's health condition. Vatican saying the Pope is continuing to improve.

However, the clinical picture remains a complex one and the prognosis for the Pope still needs a few more days to be determined. The Vatican saying the Pope is continuing to receive high flow oxygen but is alternating between a mask and the nasal cannulas. A Vatican source said that was a positive sign.

We're also told that the Pope was in the chapel at the hospital where he's being treated, the Gemelli on the 10th floor. He received the Eucharist and he did some work. Now, the Pope has been in hospital since the 14th of February. It's the longest hospital stay of his papacy. He has pneumonia in both lungs. He's 88 years old and has a history of respiratory infections.

There's been a huge amount of concern and anxiety here at the Vatican. And in Rome, people have been gathering to pray for the Pope. Behind me in St. Peter's Square, another prayer service was held on Thursday evening. And there's also speculation in Rome about the future of this papacy. Could Francis resign is a question that some people are asking. And the Pope has indicated in the past that he wouldn't do that.

Of course, so much depends on the clinical picture and how the Pope responds to the treatment that he's getting in the Gemelli Hospital. We are expecting a further update from the Vatican on Friday morning. Phil?

MATTINGLY: Christopher Lamb, thanks so much.

[17:43:27]

CNN is sitting down with a Connecticut teenager who claims she graduated high school without knowing how to read or write. Now she's in college and suing her former school district. The details next.

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MATTINGLY: You're looking at the scene of a car ramming attack in central Israel today. Officials there say at least nine people were injured and two of the victims, a 16-year-old girl and a 76-year-old man, are on ventilators with Sirius Industries.

And a viewer warning before this next video, which shows the graphic aftermath. Bodies and belongings strewn on the side of the road. Israel blames the attack on a Palestinian man. They say he's been, quote, neutralized and was in Israel without a permit. This as the next phase of the hostage and ceasefire negotiations approaches quickly. Source telling CNN, Israel will not withdraw its forces from the Egypt-Gaza border, which is required under phase two of the deal. CNN's Jeremy Diamond is in Tel Aviv. Jeremy, where do negotiations stand here?

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN JERUSALEM CORRESPONDENT: Well, Phil, Israel and Hamas have now concluded the exchange of Israeli hostages for Palestinian prisoners as prescribed under phase one of this agreement. After Hamas released the bodies of four Israeli hostages in the early hours of this morning, Israel in exchange released 643 Palestinian prisoners.

But the question now is what happens next? Because Israel and Hamas, remember, they were supposed to start negotiations on phases two and three of this ceasefire agreement on the 16th day of this ceasefire. But now, as we approach day 42 on Saturday, which is the end of phase one, Israel and Hamas have barely entered into those negotiations. They are about to, though.

The Israeli prime minister this morning authorizing a delegation to travel to Cairo to engage in some of those negotiations. But will they actually be looking to get to phase two? That's one of the questions, because Israeli officials have made no secret that their preference for now, at least, is to work on extending phase one, meaning getting more Israeli hostages out of Gaza in exchange for Palestinian prisoners, but without having to address the thorny issues surrounding an end of the war in Gaza and the withdrawal of all Israeli troops.

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The question now is whether that's something Hamas will actually go for. We know that they have in recent days and weeks shown a clear interest in preserving this ceasefire and having it continue. But will they be willing to release more Israeli hostages without guarantees about the end of the war?

Steve Witkoff, President Trump's special envoy for the Middle East, he was supposed to already have been in the region, but seems to have postponed his trip so far, perhaps trying to see whether or not progress is achieved in these upcoming talks in Cairo. Phil?

MATTINGLY: Jeremy Diamond in Tel Aviv, thanks so much. We'll be right back.

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MATTINGLY: In our National Lead, a Connecticut teenager has filed a lawsuit claiming she graduated from high school despite not being able to read or write. Aleysha Ortiz is now in college and she's sitting down with CNN's Danny Freeman to explain how she passed years and years of classes while being illiterate. Her claims that school leaders and teachers pushed aside her family's concerns and didn't do enough to help her learn.

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DANNY FREEMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Did you ever think you'd be going to college here?

ALEYSHA ORTIZ, COLLEGE STUDENT SUING SCHOOL DISTRICT: No, never. Never in many years.

FREEMAN (voice-over): In some ways, Alicia Ortiz is living an American dream. The 19-year-old began her freshman year at the University of Connecticut in Hartford this fall. She's excited to study public policy, the culmination of hard work after moving north from Puerto Rico as a child.

FREEMAN: Do you remember when you first came to Connecticut?

ORTIZ: Yes, I remember. I was very nervous, but I know it was going to be a better opportunity for me to learn.

FREEMAN (voice-over): But Aleysha says those opportunities never came to fruition.

FREEMAN: Even today, could you read this or would it take you a long time?

ORTIZ: It's impossible. I just see these words everywhere.

FREEMAN (voice-over): Aleysha graduated from the Hartford Public School System last year, but she says today she is illiterate. She still doesn't know how to read or write. When she was in early education --

ORTIZ: They would just either tell me to stay in a corner and sleep, or just draw pictures, flowers for them.

FREEMAN (voice-over): And when she was in high school, she relied on speech-to-text programs and other apps to read and write essays.

FREEMAN: So if you had an assignment where you had to write something, you'd open up a document like this, and then do what?

ORTIZ: I would go here to use the text-to-speech.

FREEMAN: It says dictate.

ORTIZ: Dictate, yes. I love pizza.

FREEMAN: This is how you would do your assignments.

ORTIZ: And then -- cats have a world V.A. case boarding a twin-prop airplane.

FREEMAN: If you had to read something, that's how you'd do it.

FREEMAN (voice-over): She said her mother, who does not speak English well, tried to get answers. ORTIZ: She advocated so much. She went to the school. The principal would promise her that they would do better. And sometimes there would be people from the district, or the directors, promising her that they would do better.

FREEMAN (voice-over): Now, Aleysha is suing the Hartford Board of Education and the city for negligence. The suit alleges the school district documented and acknowledged Aleysha's learning challenges through multiple grades, but because they were not adequately addressed, she continued to struggle academically and began exhibiting maladaptive behaviors in the classroom.

ORTIZ: Sometimes I feel proud to be the best child, because at least I was something to them, and I wasn't invisible.

FREEMAN (voice-over): While the city of Hartford and an educator named in the suit declined to comment when contacted by CNN, in a statement, Hartford Public Schools wrote, while Hartford Public Schools cannot comment on pending litigation, we remain deeply committed to meeting the full range of needs our students bring with them when they enter our schools and helping them reach their full potential.

JESSE P. TURNER, PHD, THE LITERACY CENTER, CENTRAL CONNECTICUT STATE UNIVERSITY: UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What's a "Dogman"?

FREEMAN (voice-over): Dr. Jesse Turner is the leader of the Literacy Center at Central Connecticut State University. He feels the main issue here is inequality in public education.

TURNER: America should be asking a question. Do we really care about our children, all of our children? And I would argue that maybe we don't.

FREEMAN (voice-over): A 2019 report from EdBuild, which promotes equity in public schools, found that majority non-white school districts get $23 billion less than districts that serve mostly white students. Minority enrollment in Hartford's public schools is at about 90 percent.

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The Department of Education is a big con job.

FREEMAN (voice-over): Plus, Turner fears a crucial guardrail will be lost if the Trump administration follows through with abolishing the Department of Education.

TURNER: How do I protect the special education children? Who do I go to if I close it down?

FREEMAN (voice-over): College has presented its own obstacles, but Aleysha says UConn has been accommodating, but she doesn't want any other student to go through what she experienced.

ORTIZ: I know we can do better and I know we have a powerful community that wants to do better. I want to be the voice for them.

FREEMAN (voice-over): Danny Freeman, CNN, Hartford, Connecticut.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MATTINGLY: Danny Freeman, thanks so much.

Well, our last leads start with our National Lead. Investigators are trying to figure out what caused the ceiling to collapse inside a movie theater in Washington State. Firefighters say only two people were inside Tuesday night when debris fell from the roof. Fortunately, no one was hurt.

In our Out of this World Lead, today, Blue Origin announced its next space mission will feature an all-female crew, including a few names you'll likely recognize, journalist, Gayle King, singer, Katy Perry, are among the group. Our team couldn't find any Katy Perry lyrics to let me sing about this. Also, Lauren Sanchez, who you might know, is engaged to Blue Origin founder Jeff Bezos.

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And in our Money Lead, Subway is bringing back its discounted foot long sandwiches. But no, it's will not cost $5. Starting tomorrow, will sell a foot long sandwich for $6.99, which could be a steal given that some of those sandwiches run up to $14. What are you putting on the sandwich?

A big programming note starting next Monday, March 3rd, The Lead is on the move. Look for this show in the new time slot 5:00 to 7:00 p.m. Eastern every weekday here on CNN. Meantime, news continues on CNN with Wolf Blitzer in the Situation Room.