Return to Transcripts main page

The Lead with Jake Tapper

Trump Escalates Push to Acquire Greenland; Dangerous Winter Storm in Michigan Caused Massive Pileup. Aired 5-6p ET

Aired January 19, 2026 - 17:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[17:00:00]

AUDIE CORNISH, CNN HOST AND CORRESPONDENT, PODCAST HOST: Today, we remember MLK as an American hero and a legend of the civil rights movement. Just a quick reminder, it wasn't always the case. Polling conducted in 1963 found just 41 percent of Americans actually approve of him, a reminder that the right thing may not always be the most popular thing.

Now, I want to turn things over now to Pamela Brown standing by for "The Lead." Hey there, Pam.

PAMELA BROWN, CNN ANCHOR AND CHIEF INVESTIGATIVE CORRESPONDENT: Hey! Thanks so much, Audie. Great show. We'll look for more tomorrow in "The Arena."

Well, shouldn't you be fully committed to peace if you really, really want a peace prize? "The Lead" starts right now.

President Trump sending an extraordinary message to the prime minister of Norway, saying that since he did not win the Nobel Peace Prize, he no longer needs to think purely about peace in his efforts to take over Greenland. Responses now pouring in from stunned allies.

And more than 100 cars involved in a giant pileup in Michigan today. Incredible video as a dangerous winter storm sweep through the Great Lakes region and another major storm is on the way that could spread all the way from Texas to Virginia. We are heading to the CNN Weather Center for a new forecast.

Plus, we are just a few hours away from crowning a new college football champion. Will the undefeated Indiana Hoosiers take the crown or will the Miami Hurricanes pull off an upset? CNN is live on the ground in Miami ahead of the big game.

Welcome to "The Lead." I'm Pamela Brown, in for Jake Tapper, and we start in our "World Lead." President Trump's increasingly alarming words and actions in his quest for the United States to acquire Greenland, which belongs to Denmark.

We learned today that the President sent this extraordinary message to Norway's prime minister. It reads -- quote -- "Considering your country decided not to give me the Nobel Peace Prize for having stopped eight wars PLUS, I no longer feel an obligation to think purely of peace, although it will always be predominant, but can now think about what is good and proper for the United States of America. Denmark cannot protect that land from Russia or China, and why do they have a 'right of ownership' anyway? There are no written documents, it's only that a boat landed there hundreds of years ago, but we had boats landing there, also. The world is not secure unless we have complete and total control of Greenland."

Well, needless to say, a lot to unpack here. The president is saying he might toss peace with U.S. allies out the window because Norway did not give him an award, an award that the Norwegian government has absolutely no role in deciding. The Nobel Committee is simply headquartered in Norway.

The stunning exchange followed Trump's other big move on Friday, saying the United States will impose a 10 percent tariff on goods from Denmark, Norway, Sweden, France, Germany, the United Kingdom, the Netherlands, and Finland starting February 1st, increasing to 25 percent on June 1st until an agreement is reached.

All of these causing widespread alarm among top European leaders who are standing behind Denmark in this standoff over Greenland. CNN has live team coverage across the globe. Nic Robertson is in Greenland, Alayna Treene is at the White House, and Richard Quest is in Davos ahead of the World Economic Forum.

Richard, I'm going to kick it off to you. Tomorrow, Trump will be in Davos, coming face to face with these European leaders. How are they preparing for what is sure to be a critical interaction?

RICHARD QUEST, CNN INTERNATIONAL ANCHOR, CNN BUSINESS EDITOR-AT-LARGE: They really -- they don't know which way to turn, in a sense. On the one side, they've got their process in place, so-called the trade bazooka that they will put into place, which could lead to dramatic retaliation against the United States, even cutting off access for U.S. companies, tech companies to Europe. But they don't want to do that. They're looking desperately for any off-ramp that they can find.

The problem is the president doesn't seem to want to take it. Each time the Europeans say, look, we'll give you what you want, just you can't have sovereignty, you can have the bases, we'll talk about minerals, we'll do anything necessary, but you can't talk sovereignty, and the president doubles down and says, no, ownership control, that's what this is all about, and if it continues like this, then, frankly, any meetings here in Davos are doomed to fail.

BROWN: And Richard, President Trump at the same time is also launching this U.S.-led Board of Peace that will oversee the reconstruction of Gaza. The Kremlin said Russian President Vladimir Putin received an invite for this. And now, we're learning French President Emmanuel Macron turned down his invitation. What more can you tell us about that, Richard?

QUEST: Well, it's turning into something of a fiasco in a sense because nobody really understands how this is going to operate.

[17:05:02] What is the thinking behind it? We know President Trump is the chairman of this board of panel, but the exact operating mechanisms, what's its purpose, the reconstruction of Gaza, but is this really a bonanza for U.S. construction, how much of it is designed as a real estate project, the difficulty -- look, you remember here, Pamela, you know -- you know this as well as anybody, the difficulty is this is a part of the world that has been fighting each other for decades and is not easily going to come to the table in peace. The fact that this Board of Peace is so uncertain, so unknown, that's the issue.

BROWN: And not to mention the price tag of a billion dollars. Thank you for your reporting there, Richard. I'll go over to you, Nic, because you're on the ground in Greenland. I would love to get your perspective on what officials there are saying and how the mood is overall on the ground.

NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Yes, there's a definite feeling here from the Greenlanders, from the prime minister, that they're saying all they can say politely, hands off Greenland, Greenland is not for sale, we don't want to be part of the United States.

The prime minister here today saying that they had a very unified and dignified message, and they're very happy for the support that they're hearing from across Europe. And the Danish foreign minister has talked about red lines.

And the Danish military has upped its presence here. It's a significant increase of troops not just here in Nuuk where we've seen more troops arriving here today. We've seen more troops on the streets. I think we saw a military helicopter flying over a short time ago. But Kangerlussuaq about 200 miles north of here inside the Arctic Circle, Danish troops upping their presence there as well, all part of this Arctic training exercise. They've sent in their top army commander.

So, there's a very sort of significant diplomatic red line drawn by Denmark, support from Europe, a military presence that's ramping up here despite President Trump threatening tariffs on NATO countries that may join this Arctic security training exercise. And the Danes thought that they had agreement with the White House on this, all designed to show President Trump that Denmark and its allies inside NATO, and this was a message from the NATO secretary general today, can give security here.

But I think a lot of people here, they're living with a real fear that President Trump might double down on his easy way or the hard way and go the hard way. They feel in some way sort of bystanders to their own destiny because although they can protest here, look, they are only 57,000. They don't actually have their own army. Denmark obviously has the military. NATO is the backup. But they sort of feel this is happening in a way where they're not really able to shape it. So, they're spectators in a way, hoping it goes away, but trying to deal with that reality that maybe it won't and it might get worse. That's the real fear. BROWN: It's an understandable fear. And Alayna, you have new

reporting on why President Trump is so emboldened when it comes to Greenland.

ALAYNA TREENE, CNN POLITICAL REPORTER: Yes. Look, this is obviously, Pamela, something that President Trump has coveted for many years now. He has not only been ratcheting up this rhetoric, of course, in the recent weeks, but this dates back to his first administration.

But I think the reason that we're seeing this kind of, you know, fixation and the president's repeated insistence on Greenland in recent weeks is because, I'm told from my conversations with people, Pamela, in that building behind me, that he is very much emboldened after the success of the operation in Venezuela to capture Nicolas Maduro.

Obviously, Venezuela and Greenland are two very different countries, but what the president felt with Venezuela, particularly in the conversations after that operation, I'm told, is that, you know, he really wants to assert his influence in the Western Hemisphere and work on Venezuela to try and counter Russian and Chinese aggression. And similarly, that he thinks that reach and that influence can apply to the Arctic. Similar reasons, national security and fending off the aggression from U.S. foreign adversaries like Russia and China.

The thing that's interesting though is about the ways in which he is saying he wants to do this and mainly this idea of him not ruling out using the military to try and reach this goal of essentially annexing Greenland from the Kingdom of Denmark.

That is where some officials in the White House are actually kind of split on this, I'm told. Some people do not believe, as much as they are on board with the president's idea, that it is important for national security and even more important specifically for the United States missile defense system to have that in the Arctic region. They're not as much, you know, all sold on how to achieve those goals.

And so, this is going to be a very interesting conversation as we see it play out. And I also would keep -- I would remind you that the president is going to Davos tomorrow, to Switzerland, where he's going to be meeting with many different NATO allies.

[17:10:05]

This conversation is going to be front and center there as well, Pamela.

BROWN: And I know our Richard Quest will be all over that, tracking those conversations. Thank you so much to all three of you. I do appreciate it.

So, how far will President Trump go to acquire Greenland and how much is this quest damaging relationships with key allies? I'll ask the former U.S. ambassador to Denmark up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) BROWN: Back with our "World Lead." President Trump wants Greenland so badly that he is threatening tariffs against European allies who don't support this and telling Norway's prime minister he's less inclined to think of peace since the Nobel committee did not give him the Nobel Peace Prize. Again, the Norwegian government itself has nothing to do with deciding who wins this prize.

So, why is President Trump so fixated on Greenland right now in this moment? Big picture.

[17:15:00]

Greenland is an important strategic region because of its position between the U.S. and Europe, potential shipping routes, and its natural resources. Trump last week said this about security.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA: Greenland is very important for the national security, including of Denmark. And the problem is there's not a thing that Denmark can do about it if Russia or China wants to occupy Greenland. But there's everything we can do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: Joining us now, Alan Leventhal, former U.S. ambassador to Denmark under President Biden. Hi, ambassador. So, I wonder how you're perceiving President Trump's latest rhetoric around Greenland. And what would you tell the president if you were still the U.S. ambassador to Denmark?

ALAN LEVENTHAL, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO DENMARK UNDER PRESIDENT JOE BIDEN: Well, Pamela, first of all, thank you so much for having me this evening. I've been listening to the earlier conversation about the potential tariff war between the E.U. and the United States over the president's talking about taking military action in Greenland.

The U.S.-E.U. relationship is the largest trading relationship in the world. It's $1.6 trillion. It represents over five million American jobs. I'm very concerned about the consequences of U.S. military action in Greenland in terms of what could happen to American jobs.

BROWN: Because of that. And then you have, you know, President Trump talking about the national security reasons around Greenland, saying that it's likely Russia or China would try to occupy Greenland. Should NATO and Denmark, do you think, be doing more to beef up security in Greenland? And then, of course, the U.S. has its own agreement where it could beef up security.

LEVENTHAL: Well, first of all, there are no Chinese and Russian vessels around Greenland. It's just not the case. It's true that the Arctic is going to be increasing importance. It's warming at four times the rate of the rest of the planet. So, we need to be concerned about that. When I was ambassador, I went to Greenland six times, three times to Pituffik Space Base, which is less than thousand miles to the North Pole. It is a very important location when you think about protecting North America from the Arctic. But we could have anything we want within our existing agreement or Denmark and Greenland would modify the agreement. This is not about that.

But I'm very concerned on the consequences if there's a military action in Greenland, not just on E.U. trade and jobs in America, but what does it mean for NATO? If we take military action in Greenland, a NATO country, Denmark is a founding member of NATO, it's one of America's closest allies, NATO will never be the same.

What does that say to the Russians in Ukraine? When I was ambassador, it really struck me. Copenhagen to Kyiv is like going from Washington to Chicago. It's next door. There is great fear of what a Russian takeover Ukraine would mean, and it would send a very strong message to the Russians that the U.S. doesn't care. And what would happen in Asia with China and Taiwan?

So, this has enormous consequences if the U.S. were to take military action. And for what reason? We could get everything we want by working with the Danes and the Greenlanders, and they would open their arms to work with the U.S.

BROWN: I want to go to the sound from the Treasury secretary, and he was making his case about why the U.S. needs Greenland, why it should acquire it. I want you to listen, and then we'll talk on the other side.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SCOTT BESSENT, UNITED STATES SECRETARY OF THE TREASURY: Make it part of the United States. And there will not be a conflict because the United States right now, we are the hottest country in the world, we are the strongest country in the world. Europeans project weakness. The U.S. projects strength.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BROWN: And, of course, he's talking about American allies or what was once American allies. I don't even know what it is anymore. Is there any going back for the United States now in its quest for Greenland? I mean, given all the rhetoric from President Trump on down?

LEVENTHAL: Well, the goals of the president has been stated in terms of security in the high north and the Arctic and the passages as the Arctic waters warm. I think the Danes agree with the importance of that. NATO agrees with the importance of that. I think the question is how to get there.

And it's hard to understand why we would pursue a policy which would have such severe consequences on jobs in America and our relationship with allies around the world, Ukraine. This is a very serious issue that has serious consequences. And all of it can be done with the support of Denmark and the support of Greenland. Look, the base in Pituffik, it's -- when I was there in April, it was 40 below 0. We're talking about very harsh weather. We're talking about things (ph) which will support the United States and Greenlanders.

[17:19:58]

I see no reason for this because we can accomplish all the president is talking about within our existing relationship.

BROWN: Former Ambassador Alan Leventhal, thank you so much. More than 100 cars --

LEVENTHAL: Delighted to be with you, Pam. Thank you.

BROWN: Thank you. More than 100 cars involved in this massive pileup today. As a winter storm moves through Michigan, at least nine people were hurt and roads were shut down for miles. I'll get an update from the local sheriff's department in just moments. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: "International Lead", some incredible video to show you. Whiteout conditions causing a massive pileup involving more than 100 cars and trucks along an interstate near Zeeland, Michigan.

[17:25:02]

That's just southwest of Grand Rapids. At least 10 people were injured. I want to bring in Captain Jake Sparks with the Ottawa County, Michigan Sheriff's Office. I know you've been very busy today. Can you give us any updates, sheriff or captain, I should say?

CAPT. JAKE SPARKS, CAPTAIN, OTTAWA COUNTY SHERIFF'S OFFICE: Yes, thanks for having me. Yes, thank you. The latest update here, I just got word from the units on scene, is that we hope to have the scene cleared in about the next half an hour. So, hopefully, the highway is back open within the hour. Obviously, it has been a long day. We've had units on scene for over seven hours now. So, large-scale incident. And fortunately, it wasn't more serious than it was.

BROWN: So, it's still 10 injured. Is that right?

SPARKS: Right. Ten people were injured and transported to area hospitals. Those are varying degrees of injury. I would classify them all as fairly minor. Nothing life-threatening at this time that we believe. So, that's good news. In all, there was over 100 vehicles involved, probably several dozen tractor trailers, semis, 100 cars involved. You know, it was a large-scale scene there spreading several miles on interstate I-196 in the Zeeland area.

BROWN: Yes. I mean, you have these whiteout conditions, more than 100 cars. Tell us about the biggest challenge in responding to a pileup like this.

SPARKS: Well, that's a good question. I guess, first of all, I would say the conditions. So, obviously, it was poor conditions that led to the crashes. And then once one vehicle crashed, the blowing snow led to poor visibility, slippery roads, extreme cold temperatures. I think it's in the (INAUDIBLE) right now. It is difficult for the motorists out there.

But then you also have all of the responders that are out there that have been on scene for over seven hours now, like I say. So, that makes it very difficult scene to process. First, trying to get the injured out of there. And then we had a number of motorists that were stranded out there. The highway was completely shut down in both directions to allow those first responders to do their work and, you know, prevent the pileup from continuing.

So, we were stacking up ambulances. And then we brought in some buses from a local school district. So, we greatly appreciate that cooperation. We were able to bus some of the stranded motorists back to that high school so they could be reunified and get rides to pick them up. We brought about 25 people there, transported them so that they could be out of the area and safe to shelter. So, it was a big operation and grateful for everyone's cooperation.

BROWN: Markedly an effort there. All right, Captain Jake Sparks with the Ottawa County Michigan Sheriff's Office, thank you so much.

SPARKS: Thank you.

BROWN: Well, as brutally cold temperatures and dangerous subzero wind chills grip much of the Midwest, there is now concern about a potential major winter storm that could spread from Texas through the South and into the Mid-Atlantic. Meteorologist Chris Warren has the latest forecast. Chris?

CHRIS WARREN, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Pamela, it's conditions like this that can lead to those pileups we saw in Western Michigan. You can imagine why very little visibility. And then, snow on the ground makes it very difficult to stop, especially if you have to stop in a hurry. More snow, heavy at times, is a possibility with winter storm warning still in place.

Coming off of the Great Lakes, this is where we can see more of those snow bands set up, and those snow bands can create what is essentially nice visibility to almost like a blanket of snow, like a curtain of snow. We can go from decent visibility to like next to nothing and near zero visibility, almost like that. Snow will add up some spots in the heaviest snow bands, ending up getting about a foot, maybe a foot and a half. About 70 percent of the U.S. population this week into the weekend will experience temperatures 32 degrees or colder, below freezing.

Here is what we're looking at for a huge portion of the U.S. Not just below freezing, but feeling like below zero in the coming hours and staying that way when you factor in the wind and what it's going to feel like on your skin throughout the Great Lakes and the Northern Tier.

And then looking ahead to this weekend, the European forecast model and the American GFS both showing the possibility, it's not locked in, it's not a guarantee, but snow and ice, something to watch for going into the weekend, which could ultimately, Pamela, end up being a big deal.

BROWN: All right. We shall wait and see. Chris Warren, thanks so much. We have some new CNN reporting that reveals the FBI actually did open a civil rights investigation to the ICE agent who shot and killed Renee Good in Minneapolis earlier this month. But that investigation quickly changed focus. I'll get reaction from a former director of ICE in moments.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

PAMELA BROWN, CNN HOST: In the National Lead, 1,500 active duty soldiers are on alert, ready to deploy to Minnesota, pending approval from President Trump, who is reportedly continuing to weigh the use of the Insurrection Act.

As of now, it remains a last resort, sources tell CNN. And this comes as ICE and Border Patrol agents flood the state in a massive enforcement push, which critics are calling federal overreach. Meanwhile, the Justice Department briefly opened a civil rights probe, but closed it, shifting scrutiny instead to Good's partner and local officials.

In the frigid Twin Cities, protests continue to rage, with demonstrators clashing with federal forces and disrupting local events.

Let's bring in former ICE Director, Sarah Saldana. Nice to see you. So Minneapolis Mayor Jacob Frey has described the federal immigration crackdown as an invasion. From your experience and perspective as a former ICE Director, how do you respond to that characterization? And how do agents view their role when operating in cities that strongly oppose federal enforcement?

[17:35:14]

SARAH SALDANA, FORMER ICE DIRECTOR: Well, they're professionals. The removal officers and the agents are professionals, and they understand that they may not be the most popular members of law enforcement in a community, but they go about their business the way they should.

The problem that we have here is we have this constant escalation, not only of rhetoric, but these threats of adding even more of a presence, even military presence, which would be, I would think, quite appalling to that community. It is so important to have a connection with a community that you're operating in. It's -- it is not -- it should not be us against the community, and I'm talking about ICE officers in this case. It should be coming in to help the community. I think we may be long past that at this point, but that's the way it really should work.

BROWN: Minnesota's Attorney General, for his part, said that the ICE agents in Minneapolis are, "reckless and not trained well." In your view, which current tactics that you've seen there have been effective, and which ones are not?

SALDANA: Well, I haven't tuned in to every video there is. I have certainly gotten adrift of how some of these law enforcement officers are responding to situations. It's always important to have a proportionate law enforcement response to any crisis or situation, anytime you're involved with either members of the community or somebody you're trying to apprehend.

In this case, we have seen immediate, almost anger expressed by law enforcement. It may be at this point that they are so angry with what they've seen in Minnesota that they're going to respond that way. But I'm thinking, just as an example, when I looked at that video of Miss Good's killing, I noticed that the two gentlemen, the two officers who had left their vehicle first, were very aggressive in their approach to the car.

And that just seems to be the order of the day. It is, let's run these people over as opposed to, let's go about our business, get it done, and make the country truly safer, not more threatening.

BROWN: And as you said, that social contract between law enforcement and the community is so important, right? We have this new reporting coming in that the FBI shifted its probe from doing a civil rights investigation into that ICE officer to the alleged assault of the officer. Do you think there should be a civil rights investigation into this ICE officer? I'm just curious your thoughts on that.

SALDANA: Well, of course, if there's a question of that, and I believe that, I can't imagine anybody not admitting that there's a question of whether this woman's civil rights were trampled on, I think that it's important, and it should be important to the officer, to the agent, to the agency, to have a fair and balanced investigation. Because once all the facts come out, perhaps there will be something that we don't know about publicly, but that would explain more of what we saw in the video.

So, I believe that law enforcement are, these officers are different from you and me. They are armed, they have authorities that the typical citizen does not have. They need to be held accountable, and they need to respond to these claims that there was overreach here.

BROWN: Could both be true, though, that Renee Good's civil rights were violated here, and of course, she's deceased, but also that ICE officer had a genuine fear for his life, and that's why he opened fire? I mean, you know, what do you do if both could be true?

SALDANA: It's possible, Pam. It's possible. I will not exclude that entirely, but that's why the investigation is so important, is because we need to know everything that happened moment by moment. I know what I see on the video, so does your audience, but we need the whole context, and we need a full airing out of the facts. Yes, it's possible.

I'm very concerned about what I see in the video, though, when you have a woman who's not armed who's saying that she's not angry with anyone and who has not threatened anybody to end up dead just moments later. That is -- that calls -- that is a compelling case for a thorough investigation.

[17:40:09]

BROWN: Sarah Saldana, former ICE director under President Obama, thank you so much.

SALDANA: Sure.

BROWN: Well, six major races will be on the ballot in Iowa this year, so how are voters there feeling about President Trump as tomorrow marks his first full year back in office? John Kings' All Over the Map series is back with those answers, up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: We are back in our Politics Lead. Tomorrow will mark one year since President Trump began his second term. A recent CNN poll shows a majority of Americans, 58 percent, consider his first year in office a failure, 42 percent call it a success.

[17:45:09]

But what is it that Trump is doing that's driving those numbers? Let's go all over the map with CNN's John King, who recently traveled to Iowa.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JOHN KING, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): The Ebersole cattle farm, rural Kellerton.

KING: How are you?

SHANEN EBERSOLE, IOWA VOTER: It's good to see you.

KING: How are you doing?

KING (voice-over): Calving season before election season.

EBERSOLE: And then they'll calve in a pasture just like this. They're all of our old mama girls.

KING (voice-over): Shanen Ebersole speaks politely but plainly. There are signs of Trump exhaustion.

EBERSOLE: We definitely have choices. We can say calm down. We can say talk nice.

KING (voice-over): Ebersole was a Nikki Haley supporter, but reluctantly backed Trump in the end. Three out of five is her first year grade. The economy feels a little better and illegal immigration is way down. But Trump's big Argentina beef bailout didn't feel so America first, nor does talk about somehow taking Greenland.

EBERSOLE: I don't agree with that in any way shape or form.

KING: That's not what you voted for?

EBERSOLE: No.

KING (voice-over): Ebersole's take on Washington? Trump picks too many fights. And people in Congress, she says, worry too much about money and power and too little about family farmers or finding compromise.

KING: You're open to voting for a Democrat?

EBERSOLE: Of course. I think that you have to vote for the person that best meets your goals.

KING: The 2026 midterm stakes here in Iowa are enormous. The state is picking a new governor, a new United States senator, and all four of its House seats, of course, are on the midterm ballot.

KING (voice-over): Next stop, Des Moines and its fast growing suburbs.

BETSY SARCONE, IOWA VOTER: There's that saying Trump was right about everything, and that's kind of how I'm feeling right now.

KING (voice-over): This breakfast conversation or sixth visit with Betsy Sarcone dating back to August 2023. Her shift beyond dramatic. A DeSantis then a Haley voter said she would vote for Joe Biden if Trump won the Republican nomination. But she changed her mind.

SARCONE: I think Biden probably changed me more than Trump. I think watching nothing be done, you know, for four years about an open border, and I think that actually pushed me further to the right to want more law and order, to want stricter borders and to want more control over this country.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BROWN: And with us now is John King, along with CNN's Jeff Zeleny. So how prevalent is a mindset of that first woman we heard from in your piece that fractured support for Trump, whereby one could go Democrat instead of Republican?

KING: Absolutely critical dynamic to track between now, January, and to the November election. Because if these reluctant Trump voters, who either voted for Trump all three times but have character questions, or a lot of people who voted for Trump then voted for Biden and then came back to Trump when Biden sort of disappeared for them, what do they do? Anecdotally, in our all-over-the-map group, we found a little bit in Iowa, we have some in Pennsylvania, we have some in Colorado, all where there are battleground congressional districts.

Look at our new poll, you see it as well. Trump got 94 percent of the Republican vote in the election. His approval rating is 87 percent among Republicans right now. He got 46 percent of independents in the last election. His approval rating among independents is only 29 percent. So there are a lot of people out there who voted for Donald Trump who are not happy at the moment, and for Democrats, that's an opportunity. BROWN: And you were just in Georgia, Jeff, tackling the same issue. What's the mood there in Trump's second term? And I'm wondering, do people understand when you're talking to them about what the U.S. is doing in Venezuela and this rhetoric around Greenland and all of that? I mean, what are they saying to you?

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Look, they're more focused on their individual lives. I mean, they are the headlines of the day. But one thing that is really clear, that was also clear in John's piece, there is a sense of exhaustion, there's no doubt. Among the true believers, there's not. They love it. But the sense of exhaustion is palpable.

But I talked to a farmer in southern Georgia, we had some time on his farm as well, and he said that, I thought things would be better. He voted for Trump three times, and he might again, but he said, I thought things would be better. The trade policy has been devastating to so many. But cost and affordability is one thing that comes up again and again.

So look, the bottom line here is that people are going to vote their own pocketbooks, and things just simply have not gotten better. And the President said, I'm going to lower your energy costs by 50 percent in a year. It hasn't happened, but people are aware of that. So but at the end of the day, Democrats have a lot of work to do to try and get some of these voters, of course.

And there are limitations to what is going to happen in this midterm election year. As we talk about a lot, I mean, the maps have changed. There's not likely to be some massive wave, because that's not how these seats are drawn anymore. But there is a sense of exhaustion, I would say, above most other things.

BROWN: And Chan and Epperson, who you spoke to, you know, you asked her about Greenland, and said, look, I didn't vote for that. Or you had said that, and she said, yes, I didn't vote for that. So I wonder, what more you heard from folks there in Iowa about President Trump's fixation on foreign affairs, at a time when energy prices are not going down, grocery prices aren't going down, and how that's settling in with folks.

[17:50:03]

KING: So she's a cattle rancher, right? And so Trump has this big bailout for Argentinian beef, to help the Argentinian leader, who he likes. She's like, wait a minute, that's not America first. Greenland, she's like, no how, no way. Not by military force, not by negotiation, no, that's not so America first. And again, that's the idea. There were a whole lot of people who voted for Donald Trump in the end, in 2024.

They didn't like Harris, they didn't know the Vice President, they were mad at Biden because he disappeared. They didn't really want to vote for Trump again, but he won the nomination. They said, OK, he's going to close the border, and he's going to cut my taxes, and the economy is going to get better. Jeff makes a key point, Donald Trump said it would get better like that, and it hasn't, right?

So now they see that they've tried to block out, they remember the first term, they don't follow as much social media, they don't watch the news as much, because it was not good for their blood pressure. Liberals say this, and Trump voters say this. The first term was not good for their blood pressure, they've tried to check out, but he's everywhere again. He's everywhere again, and he's doing a lot of things. They're like, fix the border. They don't like the tone, what they see in some of these ICE raids, but they want the border closed down.

They're actually happy with the immigration numbers, but they worry about the tone there, and they're like, what is Greenland? Venezuela is more of a mixed message. A lot of people say Maduro's a bad guy. They're a little worried about what comes next.

BROWN: All right, let's turn to a different red state. That would be Louisiana, and that's where Republican Senator Bill Cassidy's path to re-election just got more difficult, because on Saturday, President Trump endorsed Republican Congresswoman Julia Letlow, posting this on social media, "should she decide to enter this race, Julia Letlow has my complete and total endorsement. Run, Julia, run."

Senator Cassidy responded, posting, "If Congresswoman Letlow decides to run, I am confident I will win." This all happened, Jeff, for context, after Senate Majority Leader John Thune encouraged the president to support Bill Cassidy, and it comes after Senator Cassidy worked very hard to get back in Trump's good graces. Quite the dynamic here.

ZELENY: No doubt, but he still committed the original sin in Trump's mind, and that was voting to convict him on the impeachment several years ago, so he's never going to be able to get back in his good graces, but it's not the smartest move to make angry and make it more difficult the lives of Senate Republicans. I mean, the reality is the margins are slim, and just for example, the health care bill. The President suddenly is pushing a health care bill against Senator Cassidy.

He leads the committee in which that would go through, so this will be an interesting primary. If it plays out, it looks like she is getting in. There's a February filing deadline, so it's one of the rare examples of Trump actually getting into a primary. He's been much more judicious about to weighing in in primaries than in previous years, but this will be a dogfight, there's no doubt, and an unnecessary waste of or spending of a Republican money that could go elsewhere to like Maine, for example, or other actual key states.

BROWN: How are you seeing it, John?

KING: Look, the President is often his own worst enemy. There are a lot of Republicans who wish the president would remember he's the leader of the Republican Party, right? He views himself as the leader of the Trump Party and the MAGA movement, and sometimes he mixes up with Republican things in a way, to Jeff's point, that the leadership thinks that hurts our cause. BROWN: All right, John King, Jeff Zeleny, thank you both.

KING: You bet.

BROWN: Well, college football's new champion will be crowned in just a few hours, and CNN's Coy Wire has a preview. Coy?

[17:53:16]

COY WIRE, CNN SPORTS ANCHOR: Oh my goodness, Pamela, it is picking up. We're here at the National Championship game between the Miami Hurricanes and the Indiana Hoosiers. We had Fat Joe here, we had Mark Cuban here, and the ticket prices are astronomical. We'll talk about it coming up after the break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BROWN: In our Sports Lead tonight, Miami versus Indiana. We are less than two hours away from the kickoff of the college football playoff national championship game. The number 10 ranked Hurricanes taking on the number one undefeated Hoosiers. CNN's Coy Wire is at Hard Rock Stadium in Miami. And Coy, you are joined by a very special guest.

WIRE: A very special guest. A very bald and beautiful guest. Fat Joe, Miami Hurricanes superfan. This place is starting to light up. You're helping us shine brighter tonight. What are you making this environment?

FAT JOE, RAPPER: Couldn't sleep last night. Up all night. So excited about the Canes. It took, what, 25 years to get here? Thank God we home. I mean, I ain't going to lie, there's a lot of Indiana fans here. When I pulled up, I was like, yo, what's going on? I mean, they came to show out, but the Canes today, I believe in miracles. I believe they said we wouldn't win last week or the week before we won. Are we going to win today?

WIRE: They were 100 to 1 underdogs ahead of the selection show, ahead of the playoff selection show. But Coach Mario Cristobal has done an incredible job rallying this team. He is a no-nonsense, no-living-in- the-past mentality. He doesn't say the U is back. He says the U is here. The U is here.

And it's incredible that this is a home game for your Hurricanes. This is where they play their home games, Pamela. The home of the NFL's Miami Dolphins. But today we will get a lot of those Hurricanes faithful here. How do you see it all playing out against these Indiana Hoosiers? They're undefeated.

JOE: I can't wait to see Michael Irvin on the sideline, the super fan of all super fans. I think we're going to win today. Call me delusional, call me whatever you want, but you know, I'm going for the Canes. And I believe they got a strong possibility of winning. Malachi, the whole crew. I'm excited about these guys right here. It's going to be great.

WIRE: And they're starting to come out right now. Thank you for helping us get started. Hey, lean back and have some fun tonight, right?

JOE: Lean back. And we're going all the way up, baby.

WIRE: All the way up. Pamela, it's about to be on. Head coach Curt Cignetti for the Indiana Hoosiers has his team ready. He says he loves how the media has sensationalized, how closely knit they are, how they're hugging on the practice field. But he says he's tired of all that. He says there's no time for warm milk and cookies in war. It's about to be a war out on that field in just a bit. Pamela?

[18:00:09]

BROWN: Welcome to The Lead.