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The Lead with Jake Tapper

Meta CEO Mark Zuckerberg Testifies in Landmark Trial; Sources Say, Authorities on Both Sides of U.S.-Mexican Border on Lookout for Any Clues as Guthrie Search Continues; New Mexico Lawmakers Plan to Investigate Epstein's Ranch. Springsteen Takes Swipe At Trump, Labels Him "Wannabe King"; Team USA's Outstanding Wins On Winter Olympics Day 12. Aired 6-7p ET

Aired February 18, 2026 - 18:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

JAKE TAPPER, CNN ANCHOR: Welcome to The Lead. I'm Jake Tapper.

This hour, big tech on trial, Facebook founder and Meta Chief Mark Zuckerberg testifying in a California courtroom today about claims that his social media platforms harmed children and teens.

[18:00:04]

In moments, I'm going to be joined by a father who lost his son who participated in a social media challenge, and is now pushing for more protections for kids online.

Plus, officials on both sides of the U.S.-Mexico border are on the lookout for clues tonight, as Nancy Guthrie's location remains unknown. We're going to go live to Arizona for an update on the search for Savannah Guthrie's 84-year-old mother now in day 18.

Also a push for a new investigation into Jeffrey Epstein, this one in New Mexico, where lawmakers are creating a bipartisan committee to look into allegations of criminal activity on a ranch that Epstein owned in that state. What do they think they could find? I'll ask one of the lawmakers involved ahead.

The Lead tonight, social media on trial. Right now, Meta CEO Mark Zuckerberg is inside a Los Angeles courtroom where he has taken the stand to testify in a landmark social media addiction trial that began last month. Meta and YouTube are accused of intentionally designing addictive features that hooked a now 20-year-old woman as a child and harmed her mental health, she says. Zuckerberg's testimony will give him a chance to defend the efforts the company says it has taken to protect young users.

This lawsuit is the first of more than 1,500 similar lawsuits to go to trial. Over the years, we have sadly brought you countless stories of families who said that their children were hurt or died as a result of social media. In just a moment, I'm going to talk to another one, a father who lost his 12-year-old son.

Other grieving families have traveled to Los Angeles in hopes of securing a courtroom seat to watch Zuckerberg's testimony. Let's go to CNN's Clare Duffy. Clare, get us up to speed on what happened in court today.

CLARE DUFFY, CNN BUSINESS TECH REPORTER: Yes. Jake, there were some really heated moments. Zuckerberg, of course, a key witness in this trial as the CEO and majority owner of Meta. And at the heart of the questioning here was really whether Zuckerberg did enough to address the risks that this platform has known there were about four young users. He was talked -- he was asked, for example, about under 13 users accessing Instagram in violation of its policies, also asked about beauty filters on Instagram, which experts that Meta consulted said could be harmful to young users.

And Zuckerberg pushed back. He talked about the need to balance safety with considerations, like privacy and free expression. He ultimately said that he believes he has navigated protecting young users on his platforms in a, quote, reasonable way.

And Meta has denied the claims in this lawsuit. They say that this 20- year-old woman, Kaylee, experienced mental health challenges because she had a difficult childhood, not because of Instagram. Ahead of Zuckerberg's testimony today, a Meta spokesperson told me, quote, the question for the jury in Los Angeles is whether Instagram was a substantial factor in the plaintiff's mental health struggles, the evidence will show she faced many significant difficult challenges well before she ever used social media.

And interestingly, Jake, this plaintiff Kaylee, was actually in the courtroom today for Mark Zuckerberg's testimony. And at the end of her lawyer's questioning, he unfurled this multiple feet long banner full of hundreds of little pictures that she had posted on Instagram in an effort to really hammer home how reliant and how addictive they say she was to this platform.

TAPPER: Clare, lots of impacted families are at this trial. What are they saying?

DUFFY: Yes. Families, as you said, have flown in from across the country, parents who say their children were harmed or died as a result of social media. And interestingly, among those parents are people who were in the audience back in 2024 on Capitol Hill when Mark Zuckerberg turned around and apologized to parents for the harms that they say their children have faced on social media.

Among those moms is Julianna Arnold. She blames Instagram for the death of her 17-year-old daughter, Coco. She talked this morning on The Situation Room about what she was hoping to see out of Zuckerberg's testimony today. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JULIANNA ARNOLD, FOUNDING MEMBER, PARENTS RISE!: We want the truth. We want the truth. We want transparency, and we want these companies to be held accountable.

That's why we're here today. They need to see -- Mark Zuckerberg needs to see again -- we already faced him once in January, 2024 in Congress at a hearing where he was forced to apologize to us and now we really want to hear the truth because that day we did not hear the truth.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DUFFY: And, Jake, one of the other things that parents are hoping may come out of this trial is they're hoping that Congress is watching this closely and may finally be motivated to pass a more comprehensive online safety legislation.

TAPPER: All right. Clare Duffy, thanks so much.

Joining us now to discuss is Todd Minor. His 12-year-old son, Matthew, tragically died in 2019 after participating in a viral social media challenge. And Todd, let me start by saying how sad we all are and sorry for your loss. I'm sure this trial is a lot to take in. How are you doing?

TODD MINOR SR. FATHER OF MATT MINOR: Thank you, Jake. Yes. A lot of times it's -- we're just -- my wife and I were just speechless that we thought everything just made sense that that the algorithms were harmful.

[18:05:01]

But we are thankful that everything is in court now and everything is coming to light.

TAPPER: What do you hope comes out of this current trial?

MINOR: Well, I can't even say justice, maybe to a small extent, justice, but I think it would be in a big tech would have to -- at least officially would have to admit or show -- it would show that they were liable in the deaths of the young people.

TAPPER: You've been a proponent of the Kids Online Safety Act, which would require platforms to provide safeguards for minors, including restricting access to minor's personal data, providing parents with tools to supervise minor's use of a platform. A version of it passed the Senate, but it has faced delays in negotiations regarding its final version in the House of Representatives. What about that act do you think would be most beneficial to kids?

MINOR: I think the duty of care would probably be the biggest thing, or at least that they design it to keep young people in mind. Most of the time when they're designing this software, they design it to be addictive to young people, not taking into account for mental health. But with this legislation, it would force them to have to keep mental health in mind and also online harms that would be directed toward young people.

TAPPER: What do you want people to know about Matthew? Tell us about Matthew.

MINOR: Matthew, he was a wonderful child, a beautiful smile. He lit up the room wherever he went. And he meant so much to us and the love that he had for us was so strong that that's why we continue to fight for everyone else's children so they don't have to go through the pain that we've experienced this tragedy.

TAPPER: What's your message to other parents out there who are trying to help navigate their kids using social media?

MINOR: Well, I kind of look at it as we were outgunned. The algorithms beat us to the punch. We never knew that social media applications were so strong that they could just send these harmful information to your children, and you're thinking, you know, if you check on them every couple minutes, that you would be able to keep them safe, but you can't do that if it's sending to them every 20, 30 seconds or even less than that. It's a program. It's, I guess, A.I. or some kind of computer-generated algorithm, and there's not a parent in the world that could keep up with how fast they can send information to your child.

TAPPER: If you could say anything right now, and it would be heard by any of these tech CEOs putting out these social media platforms that kids use, whether Mark Zuckerberg or anyone else, what would you say to them?

MINOR: You designed this and knew that this software or your applications would harm children. You've always known and you just didn't care. It's so harmful you don't even allow your children to use your own social media applications. So, what does that say? That says that our children are in danger and that you just didn't care. You put profits before our children's safety.

TAPPER: Todd Minor, I know it's not easy to talk about this, but we really, really appreciate it. May the memory of Matthew be a blessing. Thank you for talking to us today.

MINOR: Thank you, Jake. Thanks for having me.

TAPPER: A source telling CNN tonight that authorities on both sides of the U.S.-Mexican border are looking for leads in their search for Nancy Guthrie. We're going to go live to the Guthrie home outside Tucson for the latest. That's next,

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:10:00]

TAPPER: Our National Lead now, the search for Nancy Guthrie is now well into its third week, although Guthrie's whereabouts remain unknown. Due to the Tucson's proximity to the Mexican-U.S. border, investigators have briefed authorities on both sides of that border to be on the lookout for any clues that might assist in finding the 84- year-old.

CNN's Ed Lavandera is outside the Guthrie home in Pima County, Arizona. Ed, what's the latest?

ED LAVANDERA, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, investigators have been talking about, or they're answering questions about this, the question of Mexico and if the geography here could play a role into where she might be. And we've learned today from sources saying that the U.S. has informed U.S. Border Patrol, as well as Mexican border officials, about the Guthrie situation and alerting them to it, obviously. And then -- but we've also heard from -- Jake, from local officials at the state level and the local level in Mexico who've also told us that there has been no request for assistance in that investigation as well.

But, clearly, with the lack of answers, we're now 18 days into the search and investigation of Nancy Guthrie's disappearance. You know, there's just no real clear definitive answer as to where she might be. And, obviously, with Tucson's close proximity to the border, that has always been an issue and a question that has lingered over this entire case for some time. So, we're kind of, you know, asking questions about that here at this point.

It also comes as we're still awaiting any kind of clear indication from investigators about the DNA that was discovered here at the home. Investigators say that that is being put through more analysis, including genealogical analysis. That is evidence that could take some time.

But now this far into the investigation, the sheriff was asked about whether or not at this point if they still believe that Nancy Guthrie is alive.

[18:15:05]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REPORTER: Has there been any evidence so far that Nancy is still alive, or is it just hope of investigators and the family?

SHERIFF CHRIS NANOS, PIMA COUNTY, ARIZONA: There's been no evidence that she's not.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LAVANDERA: And that's ultimately the conundrum that so many investigators are under here, is that with no clear answer one way or the other, they continue operating with the hope that they will find her alive, even as all of the questions surrounding this investigation continue to swirl. Jake?

TAPPER: All right. Ed Lavnadera in Pima County, Arizona, thank you so much.

And, again, if you out there have information, any information you think could help this case, please call the Pima County Sheriff's Department at 520-351-4900, or the FBI I at 1-800-CALL-FBI. You can also reach the agency online at tips.fbi.gov.

A New Mexico ranch owned by Jeffrey Epstein is the latest target of investigators. I'm going to speak to one of the lawmakers leading that charge ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:20:00]

TAPPER: In our Law and Justice Lead today, the House Oversight Committee interviewed billionaire retail magnate Les Wexner in Ohio. Wexner, the former owner of Victoria's Secret and Bath and Body Works, was subpoenaed for testimony in 2009 after Jeffrey Epstein was arrested and charged with sex trafficking minors. DOJ records show that Wexner's lawyers described a decades-long business relationship between the two men that Wexner ended after Epstein stole money from the Wexner Family.

Democrats accused Wexner of downplaying his close relationship to Epstein.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. STEPHEN LYNCH (D-MA): Les Wexner gave Epstein the ability to handle his children's and his family's money. So, at least that part of it, that part of it makes it hard to believe Les Wexner's testimony.

REP. ROBERT GARCIA (D-CA): We should be very clear that there would be no Epstein island, there would be no Epstein plane, there would be no money to traffic women and girls, Mr. Epstein would not be the wealthy man he was without the support of Les Wexner.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: After Epstein's death, an FBI official described Les Wexner as a, quote, secondary co-conspirator, Wexner's lawyers say he had no knowledge of Epstein's illegal activities with young girls.

New Mexico's State House of Representatives is now creating a bipartisan committee to investigate the property that Jeffrey Epstein once owned in the state known as Zorro Ranch. They're investigating it for allegations of criminal activity. The committee plans to partner with the New Mexico Department of Justice for this deep dive into allegations of abuse and sexual assault possibly committed at Zorro Ranch.

And joining us now to discuss is Democratic State Representative Andrea Romero, one of the bill's sponsors. Representative, thanks for joining us.

So, no one opposed this measure. So the committee, the Truth Commission, will be created. How does it feel to have this over the finish line?

STATE REP. ANDREA ROMERO (D-NM): Well, it feels like we're just beginning really, truly. You know, we have been thinking about this for a while, trying to find the mechanisms in place to make sure that we can be apolitical and ready to do business. The reality for this commission is something that our community desperately needs and needs to know about. You know, this is information that we're all trying to out together nationwide and worldwide about what went on and how it went on. And for us in New Mexico, it is so critical that we get this story straight.

TAPPER: Well, it's great to see it happening in a bipartisan way in New Mexico, if not here in D.C.

There's an email in the Epstein files released by the Department of Justice that mentions Zorro Ranch. It's an unverified claim that two women are buried there, two women who died by strangulation. The sender of this email has been redacted by the DOJ. It was sent to a local radio host who told CNN he believes it came from someone who worked on the ranch. He passed the email onto the FBI when it was sent in 2019. Does your committee intend to push the Justice Department for more answers regarding that email?

ROMERO: Yes, we do. And we will go to the fullest extent of the law to get those answers. The reality that we understand is that that email was sent and our then-attorney general requested that the federal government investigate these claims, that there was a request to do that back in 2019. But, unfortunately, those requests went unanswered by the federal government.

You know, we feel very challenged that we have to be forced to do this ourselves in New Mexico when those requests went unanswered then, and here we are seven years later trying to pick up the pieces.

TAPPER: Are there other claims about Zorro Ranch in the Epstein files that you intend to look into further?

ROMERO: Yes, absolutely. I mean, the claims are absolutely sprawling and certainly very concerning. We have allegations of everything, from sex abuse and trafficking to harming children of very young ages. It's horrifying what we're learning, it seems, every single day, but we're committed to telling the truth and making sure that there is a record, and if needed, it would be pursued in the court of law.

TAPPER: There was an unusual report in The New York Times in 2019 that mentioned Zorro Ranch. Jeffrey Epstein at one point, quote, hoped to seed the human race with his DNA by impregnating women at his vast New Mexico ranch, unquote. The New York Times report says there's no evidence this plan ever came to any sort of fruition, but is this some sort of scientific scheme of Epstein's that you plan to investigate as well?

ROMERO: Absolutely. These allegations are horrifying about what went on.

[18:25:03]

We have heard from victims that they may have woken up in very strange places. It's a really difficult process to understand. And that's so critically why we need to know what the truth was, who were the folks in the room, who knew what happened and why were these never investigated, especially if victims came forward. This is what's so critical about the public understanding how this happened. And, certainly, if folks came forward on a crime, why was this never investigated?

So, yes, we are looking to these various records, and, again, every single day learn something horrifying about what went on or allegedly went on.

TAPPER: Well, it wasn't investigated for a lot of reasons, but one of them is that the alleged perpetrators are very, very powerful, wealthy people. Are you ready for that?

ROMERO: You know, this is -- well, fortunately, why we are a bipartisan commission, you know, we're not here to play politics about anything. We're really here to go on a fact-finding mission, who is involved. And we understand even in our state that it was the highest echelons of people who are being named in these files.

And so for us, it's about making sure that no stone is unturned. Whoever it is that we find that may have been a perpetrator in these crimes will be named. They will be named, and they will -- we will recognize what went on here.

And so, yes, the stretch is very wide and potentially very deep, but we will make sure that the public knows what happened.

TAPPER: New Mexico State Representative Andrea Romero, thank you so much. Please keep in touch with my team and come back when you find some facts. I appreciate it.

ROMERO: Thanks. I appreciate you. Thanks.

TAPPER: The U.S. overhauled its childhood vaccine schedule earlier this year, putting it closer in line with countries such as Denmark. But health officials there say, not so fast. Dr. Sanjay Gupta traveled to Denmark to find out why.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:30:00]

TAPPER: In our Health Lead, the Trump administration's health officials have spent much of their first year fixated on upending the childhood vaccine schedule with sources saying that Health and Human Services Secretary RFK Jr. wants a plan that more closely resembles that of Denmark. The new U.S. schedule now recommends 11 vaccinations compared to the previous 17. Denmark recommends ten vaccinations. However, experts say Denmark's health model should not be imposed internationally.

CNN's Dr. Sanjay Gupta went to Denmark to find out more.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DR. SANJAY GUPTA, CNN CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT (voice over): Denmark has long recommended fewer childhood vaccines than the United States. Babies here leave the hospital without any shots. By the time they're 12 years old, most Danish children have received vaccines against ten diseases.

Now, compare that to the United States. Until recently, American officials recommended children get vaccinated for 17 diseases. Now, six of those are still available but no longer recommended, hepatitis A and B, meningitis, rotavirus, flu, and COVID-19.

Some of those, like Hepatitis B, are still a serious threat in certain parts of the United States, but not so much in Denmark. About 6 in every 100,000 Americans are diagnosed every year with chronic hepatitis B, compare that to less than 2 per 100,000 in Denmark. That means around 18,000 Americans diagnosed every year compared to about 100 in Denmark.

So, this is a referral hospital?

DR. JENS LUNDGREN, PROFESSOR OF VIRAL DISEASES, UNIVERSITY OF COPENHAGEN: That's right.

GUPTA: Dr. Jens Lundgren is a specialist in infectious diseases. He sits on the panel that decides which vaccines to give Denmark's children.

Did it surprise you when you heard that the United States is trying to emulate their vaccine schedule on Denmark?

LUNDGREN: Yes, I certainly didn't see that coming. You cannot just take what has been carefully thought through in one geographical location and just extrapolate that and generalize that.

GUPTA: I think part of the reason that they emulate Denmark is because Denmark has the fewest vaccines on the schedule.

LUNDGREN: But you see, that's not a good argument, right? So, why do you want to contend your vaccine program against the fewest vaccine? You want to have the right vaccines for the public health that you have in your population.

GUPTA: You believe these vaccines that we're talking about on the childhood vaccine schedule, you believe they are safe and effective?

LUNDGREN: Correct?

GUPTA: That's not the concern here.

LUNDGREN: That's not the debate here.

GUPTA: So, what is it fundamentally about?

LUNDGREN: We have come to realize after we have made some mistakes also early on in how the vaccine program that it's entirely based on trust, the trust.

The trust -- the parents needs to trust when we come with a new vaccine into the program. They need to trust that that's very sensible to do and they would therefore adhere to that. GUPTA: Lundgren and his colleagues are now considering adding another vaccine, the one for chickenpox. Most Danes trust their government. Of the world's most advanced economies, it ranks near the top. And here's the United States, dead last, just 28 percent of Americans trust the government.

Danish's trust in government goes far beyond vaccines. Even after parents leave the hospital, child-rearing looks a whole lot different here.

I want to show you something pretty extraordinary. We've come to visit two and a half month old Esther. Of course, we expected to find her inside the house, given how cold it is. But instead, here she is in a stroller outside freezing cold temperatures.

You'll see this everywhere in Denmark. Parents swear by the fresh air for their heavily swaddled babies. The family is waiting for a home health nurse to arrive who will come free of charge five to six times during the baby's first year of life.

[18:35:00]

What I'm struck by is Denmark is so different than the United States. You're here. Parental leave, nationalized healthcare system.

KENNETH SEJR HANSEN, FATHER OF THREE: Obviously, there's a lot of people in the U.S. who are not that front of the government actually running anything at all.

EDITH MARIE NIELSEN, MOTHER OF THREE: It's two completely different countries, right? And it's run differently and politically, governmentally. But I would want for the people in U.S. to have some of the benefits that we experience because I do believe it benefits me as a parent, I believe it works. So, I basically trust the system, right, that they have decided it for me, and it works.

GUPTA: Vaccination isn't the only reason that outbreaks are less common here in Denmark. The National Serum Institute, or SSI, here in Copenhagen keeps meticulous medical records of all Danish citizens, helping them track illnesses to help predict and even prevent outbreaks.

What makes Denmark's superpower this data tracking?

LONE SIMONSEN, PROFESSOR OF POPULATION HEALHT SCIENCES, ROSKILDE UNIVERSITY: Whenever someone is tested for something, it goes into one database. Whenever someone is vaccinated, it goes into one database. It doesn't go to all kinds of places. It's one place. And then it's quite doable to link all this together.

GUPTA: Americans might be uncomfortable with that level of tracking, but it is one of the many factors that makes the Danish system work.

It's easy to see reflections of the MAHA movement here. Danes emphasize personal health to ward off disease, and they're skeptical of too much medical intervention. But the success of the Danish system is based on so much more than the number of vaccines parents give their children, nationalized healthcare, high trust, and a lot of strong co-dependence on one another.

Dr. Sanjay Gupta, CNN, Copenhagen, Denmark.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

TAPPER: And our thanks to Sanjay for that report.

It's the boss versus the commander-in-chief. Why Bruce Springsteen is taking on the Trump administration and the reverse, that's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:40:00]

TAPPER: In our Politics Lead, Donald Trump Jr. and Eric Trump are facing new questions today after The Wall Street Journal reported that an Emirati-backed firm linked to an Emirati royal family member spent $500 million to acquire a 49 percent stake in a Trump company, World Liberty Financial, which we've mentioned before on this program. The timing of this, of course, is what's particularly interesting because the purchase was made after Trump was elected to his second term, and just months before the United Arab Emirates won access to tightly guarded American A.I. chips.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP JR., PRESIDENT TRUMP'S SON: A, my father has nothing to do with. B, it has nothing to do with A.I. chips. And, c, we met in the Middle East the first time. There's not a person in that room, there's not a banker, there's not a fund manager that doesn't go to the Middle East and to the -- you know, whether the sovereign wealth funds of the world. They're some of the biggest investors in every fund in America. To critique the one here and not talk about the others would be nonsense. It's literally what they do.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Earlier this month, CNN reached out to World Liberty Financial regarding that Wall Street Journal report. The company replied with a statement that read in part, quote, neither President Trump nor Steve Witkoff had any involvement, whatsoever, in this transaction and have had no involvement in World Liberty Financial since taking office.

The statement went on to read, quote, any claim that this deal had anything to do with the administration's actions on chips is 100 percent false, unquote.

Steve Witkoff is the president's top envoy in the Middle East, and his sons are also on the board of World Liberty Financial, along with Trump's sons.

With me now, David Kirkpatrick, he's written extensively on the Trump family and how that family has profited since the president's time in office, and he has a new piece in The New Yorker that examines how those profits have grown to $4 billion in Trump's second term, and we're only one year into it.

David, what do you make of Donald Trump Jr.'s defense there?

DAVID KIRKPATRICK, STAFF WRITER, THE NEW YORKER: Yes, it was a remarkable non-answer. You know, the question is, did the president know that four days before the inauguration, he had just received a huge financial payment from the Emiratis? An investment that is so hard to value, it looks very much like a gift. That's what would constitute a conflict of interest. And he didn't really speak to that.

The other striking thing about this is that it wasn't disclosed. In fact, the company seems to have taken some actions to keep it hidden. Almost all of the other Trump investments, which, you know, in many ways, have raised a lot of questions about potential conflicts of interest or exploiting the presidency off personal profit, he announces those with a press release. This is the only one, to my knowledge, that they have tried to hide, and you have to wonder why.

TAPPER: In your new piece in The New Yorker, you write in part, quote, he and members of his family have signed a blitz of foreign mega deals shadowed by conflicts of interest, and they've launched at least five different cryptocurrency enterprises, all of which leverage Trump's status as president to lure buyers or investors. Ethics watchdog say that no other president has ever so nakedly exploited his position or on such a scale, unquote.

So, you mentioned crypto. Is that the industry that the family is making the most money off of right now, or is it some, something else?

KIRKPATRICK: That is where they're making the most money. And you can kind of see the recipe broadly. You know, crypto is a field that a lot of people don't understand and distrust for obvious reasons. And if you add to that, the credibility, the prestige of the president of the United States, you can add value almost immediately. And that's what they're trying to do especially through this enterprise, World Liberty.

TAPPER: A recent trademark filing has some state lawmakers questioning if the Trump family is looking to profit off the potential renaming of the Palm Beach International Airport. Florida legislators are currently ramping up efforts to change the name to honor the president, the sitting presidents. These kinds of things are usually done after a president leaves office.

The Trump Organization released a statement earlier today that reads in part, quote, to be clear, the president and his family will not receive any royalty, licensing fee, or financial consideration, whatsoever, from the proposed airport renaming, unquote.

[18:45:08]

Where do you see that going?

KIRKPATRICK: I don't think, you know, I take them at their word. I don't think they plan to get paid for the renaming of the Palm Beach airport.

At the same time, you know, it's clear that ever since President Trump first appeared on "The Apprentice" and became a celebrity, what that family has done is sell his name. They're in the business of licensing his name and the presidency has sort of stepped in as a new engine of that fame to run that licensing machine. So, of course, they're going to protect the trademark. That's what they're all about.

TAPPER: Republicans complained a lot about how Hunter Biden and President Biden's brother were profiting off of proximity to then the vice president, then the president. How does this relate on a -- on scale wise.

KIRKPATRICK: I think you would agree that they are similar in kind, right? That we've seen many times a relative of a president or other public official trying to profit off that connection. In scale, it's totally different. You know, it's a mouse and a dinosaur.

TAPPER: Yeah. And a mountain and a molehill.

David Kirkpatrick, thank you so much.

KIRKPATRICK: Yeah.

TAPPER: Appreciate it.

My panel joins us now.

Doug Heye, I guess the question I have is, do voters care?

DOUG HEYE, FORMER RNC COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: No. I think we've learned that lesson over and over again and they don't care

TAPPER: Ahat doesn't mean, by the way, that we shouldn't.

HEYE: But -- and look but you know, how often do we see things disappear and say the House Ethics Committee and it makes news for a day or two and then we've forgotten that person has been investigated for months.

With Donald Trump, they're so open and brazen about this. One, you can't really concentrate on whatever it is he may then tweet something that distracts us as well. And voters have factored all of this in. Once Donald Trump won after the "Access Hollywood" tape, I think we know that the rules are different for him, whether they should be or not.

TAPPER: So, this is definitely different in terms of scale. The first term there were questions about the hotels and people renting rooms in the Trump hotel in D.C. just to curry favor, et cetera, et cetera. But now, it's just a shamelessness that I've really never seen.

CHUCK ROCHA, FORMER SENIOR ADVISER, BERNIE SANDERS 2016 & 2020 PRES. CAMPAIGNS: I've talked about this with you on this program before. I'm one of the few Democrats who give Donald Trump credit for the prowess of him politically, tapping into the anxiety of the American voter in the last presidential race while Joe Biden was old and weak, perceived by the voters.

You know why he won? There's a couple of reasons. One was the border. Another one was the perception that he was going to fix a rigged system. And what this seems like to the voter, as somebody who runs campaigns every day, is the system is rigged for him to win.

Now, what does that have to do with the -- with the midterms? Doug is right. They're not running to that because somebody's rigging the system. But what they see is what's going to motivate them to show up in a midterm when normally 35 to 40 percent of the electorate don't show up in a non-presidential year. This is just another thing showing them, no matter who they vote for, the system is rigged

TAPPER: Let's talk about The Boss, Mr. Springsteen, taking on the president. Bruce Springsteen just announced the North American leg of his tour. The venues are sending a message. The tour kicks off in Minneapolis. It ends in Washington, D.C.

Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRUCE SPRINGSTEEN, SINGER-SONGWRITER: We will be rocking your town in celebration and in defense of America. American democracy, American freedom, our American Constitution and our sacred American dream, all of which are under attack by our wannabe king and his rogue government in Washington, D.C.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: So, I know that, like the Hollywood elite or the celebrity elite gets dismissed not only by Republicans, but by Democrats, too. They're like, it just doesn't work anymore. But this is The Boss. Is it any different for him?

ROCHA: First of all, I don't see how he continues to get younger every time he goes on tour. That bothers me a lot.

TAPPER: He looks pretty good, yeah.

ROCHA: But as a voter and does this matter? It doesn't. Somebody is not going to vote because of The Boss.

But here's what it does do, Jake, is that when he's in a town or we're covering him talking about Minnesota, we haven't talked about Minnesota in a week or two because the president saw that this was horrible, sent in Tom Homan. They sent some of those folks home. They quit killing Americans in the street. And it's kind of died down.

Every time he pops back up and talks about it, it's just a reminder. And that helps the Democrats.

HEYE: And here's -- I got to tell you, I'm on a lot of text chains about the concert. Tickets go on sale on Saturday.

TAPPER: Yeah. HEYE: One of the discussions were having is of my Republican colleagues, which ones are going to feel that they're going to be able to go to the concert in D.C. and risk being spotted by their colleagues and maybe put in playbook? Its a very real conversation that Republican comms staffers are having right now.

TAPPER: Well, and I'm sure made worse or exacerbated by the White House responding in a statement to "Politico" about this, it says, quote, "When this loser Springsteen comes back home to his own city of ruins in his head, he'll realize his glory days are behind him and his fans have left him out in the street, putting him in a 10th Avenue freeze-out because he has a severe case of Trump derangement syndrome that has rotted his brain."

So, first of all, Steven Cheung there, White House comms director, a remarkable knowledge of Springsteen catalog for somebody who claims to hate this icon. But do you think that this is actually going to become like a cultural thing where Republicans won't you'll go, you don't care?

HEYE: Oh, I'm -- tickets go on sale Saturday at noon. I'm --

[18:50:00]

TAPPER: It's still Springsteen. He's still singing "Thunder Road".

HEYE: Absolutely. And look, whenever we see the tortured sort of quotes where they use the song lyrics and all this Republicans, Democrats do it, it's always painfully awkward. So, I'll make it a little more awkward. I think if we learned anything over the past few years, it is very hard, especially in this administration, to be a saint in the city especially, if that city is Washington, D.C.

TAPPER: Nice. All right, so let's turn to 2028. Former Transportation Secretary Pete Buttigieg is visiting two potential early voting states, Nevada and New Hampshire, that's in less than a week.

Meantime, Illinois Governor J.B. Pritzker has gone toe to toe with Trump over the years. He's delivered his annual State of the State Address today.

Another potential White House hopeful, Maryland Governor Wes Moore, was on CNN earlier today with Kasie Hunt.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KASIE HUNT, CNN HOST, "THE ARENA": You have no idea whether or not you might run for president or not.

GOV. WES MOORE (D), MARYLAND: No, I'm not running for president. I'm not because I'm -- I love what I'm doing. And remember, you know, four years ago, I'd never held elected office in my life. I don't come from a political background. I'm not -- I'm not one of these people who's been spending 20 years, you know, going from job.

HUNT: You are speaking -- (END VIDEO CLIP)

TAPPER: Anyway, Chuck, of those three, who do you think is most promising right now as a -- as a potential candidate?

ROCHA: Look, I'm one of the few people in this town who's actually run a campaign for president. And there's one thing that we've learned as Democrats is that there's parts of the demographics that we have to win back, and we have to find a candidate. Your question to me is which of those three would help bring back Latinos, bring back working middle class guys who work in steel mills in Pittsburgh and in Ohio.

And I don't know, I don't know of those three, which one can.

TAPPER: Is there one? Is there another one out there that you that you kind of like?

ROCHA: Money and votes -- sure. Everybody knows I work for Ruben Gallego and he's a Latino and very working class. That's one. But Ruben doesn't have the money that Pritzker does. But Pritzker has a whole lot of money. They all each have their own like, bona fides and their strengths, but a lot of them have weaknesses.

TAPPER: Well, you can't Frankenstein it, man. You're going to have to -- you're going to have to -- you're going to have to pick one guy.

Who worries Republicans the most?

HEYE: I think the bigger challenge for Republicans is what comes after Trump and they've got to sort that out knowing that Donald Trump isn't going anywhere anytime soon. But to sort of answer your question, I don't think there's a Democrat that has more pure political talent than Wes Moore. It's a long way to go, but he is that talented. And if you're around him and you guys have been, you get sucked in like it's Bill Clinton level charisma that he has.

TAPPER: All right. Well, I don't know if this is charisma. It's something -- it's a video from HHS Secretary RFK Jr. with Rid Rock. Apologies ahead of time for showing you this. This is supposed to inspire Americans to get fit.

(VIDEO CLIP PLAYS)

TAPPER: I don't know, Doug. Thoughts?

HEYE: I didn't mean to leak my home videos. I needed the money at the time. That's my story. I'm sticking to it.

ROCHA: Look, anybody that follows my social media for 20 minutes knows that I work out every morning. I take health very seriously. You do not work out in blue jeans. I don't care who you are.

TAPPER: Thanks to both of you.

It was do or die for Team USA's men's hockey team this afternoon, and it came down to a nail-biting finish. And we're going to head to Milan-Cortina for an update next. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[18:57:20]

TAPPER: In our sports lead. It has been a big day for Team USA at the Winter Olympics. Skier Mikaela Shiffrin won gold in the slalom, ending her eight-year Olympic medal drought and upping the team's medal count to 24. She is now both the youngest and the oldest woman to win Olympic alpine gold, winning at age 18 and now age 30.

Also an electric overtime win for the men's hockey team over Sweden, sealing a place in the semis.

CNN's Coy Wire somehow pulled the worst assignment in news. He's over in Italy, covering the Winter Olympic Games.

Coy, what happened in the rink today?

COY WIRE, CNN SPORTS ANCHOR: Hi, Jake.

Team USA and Sweden in an epic quarterfinal down to the wire. Sweden's Mika Zibanejad of the New York Rangers scoring with a minute 30 to go to tie it. Team USA's coach is the Rangers head coach, Jake. Both teams have a whopping 25 NHL rostered pumped to be back in the Olympics for the first time in 12 years.

In overtime, Olympics goes three on three. Quinn Hughes of the Minnesota Wild, hammering home the winning goal. Team USA one step closer to gold. They're headed to the semis to face Slovakia. I was on those slopes to see the winningest alpine skier of all time in Cortina.

Team USA Mikaela Shiffrin, get back to the mountaintop gold in slalom. Her last individual Olympic gold was 2018. She failed to get any Olympic medal the last eight years. You could hear a pin drop ahead of her final run.

But Mikaela, at 30 years old, put on a masterclass winning by one and a half seconds. She posted along "I did it, I won" message on Instagram afterwards, but Jake she'd written it the night before, manifesting the comeback, overcoming injuries and mental blocks. Mikaela Shiffrin is an Olympic champ again.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MIKAELA SHIFFRIN, U.S. SKIER: It's not always easy. Sometimes it feels impossible. But in the end today, it was a -- to take away the noise and to just be simple with it. There will always be criticism, but I am here to earn the moment and that is going to require some risk. Not the easiest thing to do, but in in the end today, we could do that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WIRE: Finally, Jake, we had a streaker during a live event on the cross-country course. A fur baby, a local dog busting out of his doghouse at a B&B nearby, giving competitors, spectators and officials a few moments of pure chaos. A wolf dog, one of the competitors, said she thought she was hallucinating.

Officials eventually leashed him. Everything was fine. No gold medal for the pup, but we did get a dog. Epic photo finish from the official Omega Scan'o'vision. One of the best highlights of the day.

Jake, back to you.

TAPPER: All right. Coy, thanks so much.

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"ERIN BURNETT OUTFRONT" starts now. Take it away, Erin.