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CNN NewsNight with Abby Phillip
Trump Vows to Hit 35 Battleground Districts in Final Stretch; GOP Sounds Alarm on Close Senate Race in Texas; Sources Say, Hegseth's Culture War Fixation Disrupting Army. Nearly 90 Percent of Americans say Corruption in Government is Widespread; New York City's School District to Ban Artificial Intelligence Usage in Most Classrooms. Aired 10-11p ET
Aired September 02, 2026 - 22:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[22:00:00]
(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)
ABBY PHILLIP, CNN ANCHOR (voice over): Tonight, his approval's at a record low, but Donald Trump's midterm strategy appears to focus on him.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He is the toughest, most resilient person that I've ever met.
PHILLIP: Plus, sources accuse Pete Hegseth of hurting the army by fixating on culture wars, as one Republican senator calls on the president to fire him now.
Also, nearly 90 percent of Americans say there's widespread corruption in government, and one of the world's biggest movie stars goes further.
GEORGE CLOONEY, ACTOR: The country run by the least qualified people. I think maybe we have a kakistocracy.
PHILLIP: And if A.I. is the future, Zohran Mamdani says the future can wait, at least in schools.
Live at the table, Adam Mockler, Caroline Sunshine, Jemele Hill, Peter Meijer, and Scott MacFarlane.
Americans with different perspectives aren't talking to each other, but here they do.
(END VIDEOTAPE)
PHILLIP (on camera): Good evening. I'm Abby Phillip in New York.
As Republicans face a midterm battle for control of Congress, President Trump is preparing to enter the fight by hitting the campaign trail for GOP candidates in a bunch of key races.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) TRUMP: I will be with you 100 percent all the way to November. I'm going to take the final 30 days, and maybe a little bit more than that, because it's all about 35 races.
I'm going to go to every one of those 35 places, and we're going to see if we can get everyone elected.
I'm going to go to Alaska, and I won it by a lot, by a real lot. And I'm going to, you know, hopefully get Dan, and we're going to go to Texas and work for Ken Paxton.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIP: That was during a dinner that President Trump hosted tonight for Republican lawmakers.
But is the president's strategy actually a smart move? The party is growing increasingly anxious about Trump's ongoing war with Iran, his trade spat with Canada, the skyrocketing prices for Americans, concerns about his beef imports, and his sinking approval rating. And on top of that, there are reports that a number of Republicans plan to skip the president's so-called Trumpapalooza convention that is scheduled for next week.
They list a variety of reasons, but there are some who are hesitant about being associated with Trump this close to the election. And adding to their jitters is this. Today, the president's super PAC launched its first ads that seem to come straight from the all-about- me T.V.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: We gave you no tax on tips, no tax on overtime, and no tax on Social Security, the largest tax cuts in American history.
The price of eggs is down 60 percent.
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He's fighting for you every day. Help him finish the job.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIP: Before we open it up to the table here, we invite you at home to join the debate. Head to cnn.com/abby. Weigh in there. We'll get to some of your comments throughout the show.
Peter, is it a smart strategy for the Trump super PAC to spend their many hundreds of millions of dollars on ads that are entirely focused on Donald Trump, who is polling in the low 30s? And do you understand why many Republicans right now are asking, does he really care about us?
PETER MEIJER, CO-FOUNDER AND HEAD OF STRATEGY, THE NEW INDUSTRIAL CORPORATION: You know, if you were running for Senate in New Hampshire, if you're Johnson, or if you're there, you do not want the president campaigning with you. If you're Ken Paxton in Texas, you absolutely do. If you're Dan Sullivan in Alaska, you absolutely do.
And part and parcel of that is getting those Trump voters out, but then also reminding some of the folks who are getting wobbly on the right, who maybe don't feel like they want to show up some of the accomplishments of this administration. I mean, everything has been doom and gloom. That's one of the reasons why you're seeing his approval ratings being so low. Going into this midterm talking about those accomplishments, I mean, that's just good politics.
PHILLIP: It's also just worth noting that I am old enough to remember when not so long ago Republicans were celebrating that Paxton was running against Talarico, telling us that this would be an easy race, and now all of a sudden it's literally a panic situation.
Let me just play what Ted Cruz said about this on Monday.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. TED CRUZ (R-TX): And I got to say some of the, the Republicans that are throwing rocks at, at, at Ken Paxton, my message to them is enough.
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Stop your bitching. We had a $200 million primary and Ken won.
You want to complain, complain in the primary. It's over. And, by the way, I will say every moderate Republican, when they win a primary, they tell conservatives, now shut up and support the nominee. My answer to everyone whining, shut up and support the nominee.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIP: And John Thune, the leader in the Senate, said, this is the ballgame. If they don't win in Texas, it's effectively over. So, that seems to tell you a lot about the environment the Republicans are in.
JEMELE HILL, CONTRIBUTING WRITER, THE ATLANTIC: Well, it's interesting because I'm like you hitch your wagon to somebody whose approval rating looks that low. I'm going to give the Republicans the same advice that a lot of people gave the Democrats when Joe Biden was sinking. Why are you still attaching yourself to something that's a losing proposition?
Really hard for me to feel any sympathy. You guys have gone all in on this candidate, all in on D- Donald Trump, not a candidate, but all in on Donald Trump for all of this time. You got to dance with the girl that brung you. In some ways, like this is kind of what you deserve. There were many opportunities that you all had to distance yourself from him, and you didn't do it, and now you're paying the price.
All the things that he's saying in those ads are not only not true, but it reinforces something that we've always known. Donald Trump only cares about him being in office. He doesn't care about you being in office, and that's playing out right now. And, frankly, to me, they're just lying in the bed that they made. SCOTT MACFARLANE, CHIEF WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT, MEIDASTOUCH NETWORK: This is already a brutal state in which to try to run statewide. You got 20 media markets. That's bonkers. Texas. It'll cost you millions of dollars in Texas to run statewide. So, you have a candidate who seems to be as popular with his party as like carrot sticks are with kids, like they're okay with it. They're going to try to eat around it. But, you know, we've got this thing on our plate. We're going to deal with it.
Here's the thing, and there's no way around this. They have been trying to marginalize James Talarico, the Democratic nominee, by making this juvenile locker room argument that he's like low T, low testosterone, not Texas enough. He's the one, Talarico's the one accepting the debate invitations from Dallas, from Austin. He accepted CNN's debate by today's deadline. I don't see where Ken Paxton is. That doesn't seem to be Texas strong. That seems to be low T.
ADAM MOCKLER, YOUTUBE HOST, THE ADAM MOCKLER SHOW: Also, the more Trump puts his thumb on the scale come the midterms, the more it seems like he's screwing the Republicans. There was a choice between Cornyn and Paxton, and Trump chose Paxton, like Trump lite. Paxton is somebody who is incredibly corrupt. His own party turned him in for corruption. He cheated on his wife. I mean, Trump probably thinks he's like a lot like him. They're similar in a lot of ways.
But as we get closer to the midterms, this is going to be a referendum on Trump's first two years. And the closer that he gets to these Republican candidates, I think the worse they'll do. I think that people will think of Trump and think of the Iran war that is failing. We have no way out of it. Think of the tariffs that are spiking our prices on a daily basis. Think of the lack of transparency with the Epstein files and the corruption. These are all ingrained in Trump's first two years. And the more he connects to these candidates, the more that their campaign will be about that same thing.
PHILLIP: Caroline, do you think that Trump has the right priorities?
CAROLINE SUNSHINE, DEPUTY COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR, TRUMP'S 2024 CAMPAIGN: I think the -- in terms of the ads and in terms of the midterms, politics is a lot about who you are, and it's also a lot about who you aren't. And the fact is, in Texas, a guy who thinks that God is non-binary and that white men are the biggest domestic terrorist threat in this country is just not going to play.
And so Donald Trump is not somebody that says that.
PHILLIP: But then why are the Republicans panicking about Texas?
SUNSHINE: They're not panicking. I think you guys aren't very in touch with Texas.
MOCKLER: Trump called it a tough race today.
SUNSHINE: I don't know how much time you've all spent in Texas, but that's not going to going to work. I've spent a lot of time in Texas. PHILLIP: They're -- the message this week is that Paxton is in trouble. The polls, there are many of them, some good, some bad, but they all seem to indicate a race that is pretty close to tied, if not maybe with Talarico in the lead. If all of that were the case, why would Ken Paxton be struggling?
SUNSHINE: Because I think you guys are going to call me after this election and realize that this is Beto O'Rourke 2.0. How'd that go, you know? I mean, James Talarico is --
HILL: Although this is not the same type of candidate though that he's facing.
SUNSHINE: James Talarico is worse. If it were me, I'd pick Beto over James if I were you guys.
HILL: No. I mean, Ken Paxton is not the same --
SUNSHINE: But I'm not in the business of giving advice to Democrats.
MOCKLER: Can you admit that Paxton's uniquely corrupt, though? Like can you admit that with all of the corruption of the past, him cheating on his wife, he's a uniquely weak candidate?
SUNSHINE: I'm not convinced that that's going to matter to voters. I'm convinced that what's going to matter --
MOCKLER: But you admit that he is corrupt?
PHILLIP: So -- okay, if it doesn't --
SUNSHINE: (INAUDIBLE) is they're going to take Paxton and his positions, which I do think Ken needs to get out there and work a little bit harder. I really believe that. I always say when I come on the show, if you don't go talk to people, they're going to believe the worst about you. Ken needs to get out there and talk to the people.
Some of this comes down to how many doors do you knock. Some of it comes down to how many rallies do you hold.
HILL: That's not really his strong point, though.
SUNSHINE: Are you out there on offense?
MOCKLER: He's in London like half the time.
HILL: Yes, it's like that's not his strong point.
SUNSHINE: And so I think that is my advice, is get out there, go on offense, say who you are, but also be very clear about who James Talarico is. I mean, do you think it's okay that he said that white men are the biggest domestic terrorist threat to this country? You're a white man.
MOCKLER: Wait, is he campaigning on that, or was this some comment from like 2019 that was kind of cringe that we've all moved past? SUNSHINE: Oh, so people aren't held accountable for their past comments?
MOCKLER: Ken Paxton in very -- Ken Paxton in very recent history --
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SUNSHINE: You're a white man, though, so you're the biggest domestic terrorist threat to this country.
MOCKLER: Of course, I don't agree with that, but James Talarico isn't running on that. When James Tallarico and Ken Paxton are facing off, they're talking about the economy while Ken Paxton is cheating on his wife. James Talarico is talking about money and politics while Ken Paxton is taking money out of the hands of his voters. Like you realize his own staff turned him in.
SUNSHINE: Is God not binary?
HILL: Who cares?
MOCKLER: This is just such a --
(CROSSTALKS)
PHILLIP: What's interesting about this exchange is that that maybe this is exactly an encapsulation of the race. And I'm telling you, Caroline, you are making the argument that has been Ken Paxton's campaign, and it seems to not be working.
And, Peter, you suggested that Trump would be an asset down there. A reporter yesterday asked Mike Johnson about all the things that President Trump has been up to in office, and this is a non-exhaustive list. Here's how Mike Johnson responded.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REPORTER: In addition to that war escalating, we are now in a regular trade war with Canada, usually one of our greatest trading partners. In addition, the president has angered cattlemen throughout the country by bringing in imports. Are these moves that you support and do you understand Republicans, some of whom I just spoke to who said these hurt your chances, and they think voters do not like them?
REP. MIKE JOHNSON (R-LA): So, there's three branches of government in the federal government, right? There's an executive and we operate the legislative. We try to coordinate as best we can because we have unified government.
If the executive branch is doing their thing, we're doing our thing.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIP: Not exactly a ringing endorsement. And this is a guy who is good for a ringing endorsement of Trump's actions.
MACFARLANE: It sounded like carrot sticks too.
PHILLIP: Yes, he was literally -- he's moving the broccoli around on his plate. This is not sounding like a Republican speaker who thinks that the trade war with Canada, an Iran war, importing cheap cattle from foreign countries is a good platform to run on.
MEIJER: Because the president's looking at the entire country, and Mike Johnson has to also answer to the members down in Texas who are not pleased about the foreign cattle coming in. The members in Michigan who say, what are we doing with this trade war?
PHILLIP: Yes, but do you think that those are good policy moves by the president?
MEIJER: If I'm Mike Johnson, I don't want the conversation to be about a trade war with Canada. I want it to be about positive elements of the record, like the video that Trump is putting out, that his campaign is putting out.
If I am Ken Paxton, I want the conversation to fully be on the weird things that James Talarico said when he was -- you know, granted he was a kid at the time, this was two years ago, you know, but all the crazy things that folks jumped on the bandwagon on and that KFILE over here at CNN does such a great job of finding and digging up. I want that to be the center of the conversation, not to have intraparty grumbling be the component.
HILL: But should that be the center of the conversation? Because at this point --
MEIJER: In a political race, absolutely, it should be --
HILL: Well, here's the problem is, like, I think --
MEIJER: You know, yes, you want to positively identify yourself to the extent that you can.
HILL: Yes, you do.
MEIJER: If maybe you don't have the strongest talking points on that, then you want to negatively characterize your opponent.
HILL: Yes, and I do understand that part of it. But the problem is that I think a lot of people are waking up, and this is independent of Texas. Texas to me is a reflection of how a lot of people are feeling. They're tired of the culture wars, and they're tired of the dumb stuff. We don't care about God being binary, non-binary. He can be 25 different things. I don't care. You know what they care about?
MEIJER: But doesn't it show something about the person's judgment that they jump on every single bandwagon and recited the most idiotic --
HILL: Right, like you got to work that both ways. Just like he said, if how he feels about God and what he thinks God is, is a reflection of his character, then cheating on your wife, somebody is a reflection of character too.
SUNSHINE: They do want elected officials who live in reality. And the fact is if you believe God is non-binary, there's not a lot of Americans that think you live in reality.
HILL: The fact is people care about being broke. That's what they care about.
(CROSSTALKS)
PHILLIP: Okay. Let me give -- let's give one example of whether we're living in reality. The president in his fight with Canada said that he wants to rename Lake Ontario Lake America. 63 percent of Americans oppose that because they are living in reality where the president can't just decide to rename a body of water on a whim.
And then I asked you about the president's priorities. 73 percent of Americans in a July poll said that Trump does not have the right priorities. These are bad numbers for the president.
MACFARLANE: He's in the Rose Garden tonight eating fine beef, eating a three-course meal out on the patio. The hamburgers cost $6 apiece at the grocery store right now. The box of sugar cereal, which sometimes is dinner, $6 for the box of cereal.
PHILLIP: For those of us who know what they're doing.
MACFARLANE: $4 for a loaf of bread. People are not equivocating, they're not being subtle what their priorities are. It's not the culture war crap. It's food can't be purchased at the levels you need when you have two teenagers. They can't afford college, they can't afford healthcare. Fertilizer costs too much, which means farmers are struggling, which is why Iowa's in play.
[22:15:00]
All of this transcends the traditional culture war we saw in 2004 and other variants of over time.
MOCKLER: Can I also just say really quickly, I'm so sick of this false equivalence between Ken Paxton and James Talarico. You have to look at what they've actually done while they've held power. You can't look at some corny comments that Talarico made and be so offended that you're, like, crying on T.V., but then blind yourself to every single thing that Ken Paxton has done over the past five to ten years. He let a pedophile go after one day for no reason as the A.G. This is someone who was turned in by his own staffers, basically impeached by his own party, yet we're supposed to look at Talarico's judgment. It's crazy.
Well, one more thing. Trump is literally posting videos on Truth Social of him removing the sign of Lake America, or Lake Ontario, putting it to Lake America. I mean, it's absolutely crazy.
SUNSHINE: It's funny, and it's getting your attention. You're triggered. PHILLIP: All right. Next for us, Pete Hegseth is under fire inside the Army for his fixation on culture wars, as a Republican senator calls on Trump to fire him right now.
Plus, as Trump becomes the first sitting president to be featured on a coin, a new poll reveals that 90 percent of Americans believe there's widespread corruption in the government.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[22:20:00]
PHILLIP: Tonight, are Pete Hegseth's priorities in the wrong place? In the aftermath of the resignation of the Army secretary, Dan Driscoll, multiple sources are telling CNN that the defense secretary is damaging the Army's efforts to adapt to the modern battlefield. Instead, he's focused on culture wars, prioritizing his personal ideal of the American war fighter, and forcing out leaders who don't align with that vision.
There's growing concern about Hegseth's temperament. As the war in Iran continues and the leadership void only grows, Hegseth is, quote, talking about muscles, dudes in dresses, testosterone, a defense official said. Although Hegseth has previously spoken about technology reform and released guidance about drone warfare, quote, we don't see a change at that level, the official concluded.
This is starting to become a louder and louder conversation. Hegseth's leadership has been a concern for a long time, but now, you know, here's the stark reality in the Army in particular. His purge of the military has been so dramatic that now Driscoll's gone, the military's largest service is left without a top civilian leader, a confirmed top general, a confirmed army general in charge of operations, or a confirmed commander of Army troops in Europe.
And because of all the firings of this -- in the service over the last year, the Army, which has more than 450,000 active duty soldiers positioned around the globe, has fewer generals than at any point in recent history.
MEIJER: That's a good thing, by the way. As a former enlisted soldier, it was good. We got way too top-heavy.
PHILLIP: Well, here's what I would say, just to challenge that. It's one thing to say, oh, we have a strategy around restructuring the Army, but one of the other things that the military sources that are quoted by The Atlantic and CNN say is that there is no strategy. It's driven mostly by Pete Hegseth's likes and dislikes, by people he feels threatened by, by people that he feels like don't sufficiently support his political agenda.
MEIJER: I mean, I think that that is certainly both likely the case and a secretary of defense's prerogative, or secretary of war's prerogative when it comes to choosing personnel. And if those are at issue with the president, then the president can fire or replace, but he shows confidence. I will say -- PHILLIP: So, you're endorsing this idea of firing people in the Army based on personality disagreements and insecurities, when this is the same defense secretary who has said he's bringing merit back to the DOD?
MEIJER: But merit in insubordination or feeling like somebody is not with a program.
PHILLIP: No, I mean, merit as in earning --
MEIJER: All this bitching and moaning about the Army and leadership is a tried and true Army pastime.
PHILLIP: -- merit as in earning your stripes, knowing what you're talking about, having the experience. That's what merit is supposed to mean.
MEIJER: Merit should be your own ability to perform your job, your competency, your qualifications, just filling time in rank, time in grade requirements, and feeling like you're on this pathway. Like the general promotion structure is an incredibly political component within --
PHILLIP: What does merit mean to you?
MEIJER: -- the armed services. What I just said, your ability to perform your job, the totality of your experiences, your competency and execution. I don't equate it to, and this is what I'm pushing back on your description, just how long you've been there, right? How long your --
PHILLIP: But who's -- who are you to say that it's just how long they've been there? Nobody is saying that. In fact, they're saying the opposite.
MEIJER: That's literally the military promotion schedule. It's time in service, time in grade.
PHILLIP: In fact, the argument is that they've wiped out a generation of the most talented and experienced people in theater who were driving the transformation. And it was so bad that Driscoll, on his way out, goes to Trump and says, we can't do our job because of all these firings.
MACFARLANE: The people who've turned inside the Republican Party against Hegseth a little bit are those who are retiring. Thom Tillis had some pretty strong words against him today. We heard Don Bacon, the retiring Nebraska Republican, had some strong words. We haven't heard this from those who are planning to return here in January.
Hegseth has talked a lot about lethality and the importance of lethality. He's made that an emphasis. I talked to Mark Kelly, Democrat from Arizona, of course, military veteran, who says, our problem is not lethality. Our problem is sometimes we have idiots running things.
This is somebody who doesn't command respect on Capitol Hill.
[22:25:01]
That's not a small thing. They're the ones who are going to fund the war. They're the ones who are going to authorize things in 2027. And, respectfully, Republicans get ticked off when they don't get good briefings. They're not. They get ticked off when there's resignations and firings because their constituents hear about that. It's a lot of local people get impacted.
PHILLIP: And let me just ask you, because I know that you're very plugged in on the Hill. It sounds like when you read everything that's being said about this, that Republicans are quietly preparing to push back on, you know, Hegseth acolytes who might be placed in these roles because they aren't happy with what's been done to the Army in particular.
MACFARLANE: And as Congressman Meijer would tell you, they're going to have to appropriate money for this war at some point soon. And it's not just the Democratic votes they're having difficulty getting. If the Republican votes were all lined up for $85 billion for this war, for $200 billion for this war, for a trillion dollars, they'd have the --
MEIJER: To hit the $1.5 trillion defense budget that the president wishes for.
PHILLIP: And not just that, but the --
MACFARLANE: They had that vote tonight. They'd do it right now, Abby, if they had the votes to line up.
PHILLIP: They have so many vacant positions. They have to get some Senate-confirmed people in there. Can they even do that?
SUNSHINE: I don't know if they need to, because to your point, I mean, like let's go back. Like World War II, one of the best things we did in preparation for it was we turned over the general corps frequently. And I think something that's interesting in addition to this is when the Biden administration was forcing our soldiers out of the service because they would not take a vaccine, when they were pushing back saying we couldn't do merit promotions, when they were forcing critical race theory --
PHILLIP: That's absolutely not what happened.
SUNSHIHNE: Yes, they did. Look it up, New York Post. Go fact-check me.
PHILLIP: Oh, well, I will fact-check you.
SUNSHINE: Fact-check me.
PHILLIP: They did not. The Biden administration never said that they could not do merit --
SUNSHINE: OMB pushed back and said we could not do merit promotions in the military.
PHILLIP: That is not true.
SUNSHIHNE: Go ask soldiers. Go ask our soldiers.
PHILLIP: Caroline, that's not true.
SUNSHINE: Critical race theory was pushed on our soldiers. And now that we're actually in a war, let's go ask them, hey, guys, the Marines and the soldiers over there fighting, did the critical race training theories you guys got during the Biden administration prepare you for what you're doing right now?
So, it's just interesting, because when all of that was going on, you guys didn't frame it as a culture war issue. But now that Hegseth is coming in and cleaning that up, which is something that's very popular with the rank-and-file soldiers, it's framed as a culture war issue. That's not connected to reality. That's cognitive dissonance.
PHILLIP: Well, I mean, look, hey, I think it is culture wars when all that Hegseth seems to be talking about is it -- let's just use his language, quote, trannies in the military. What does that have to do with the fact that we have a drone issue where we're not prepared to deal with Iran and their $35,000 drones? What does that have to do with any of that? How does that help us prepare as a military? I don't understand.
SUNSHINE: It has to do with the fact that while we are fighting this war, Hegseth also inherited a military that was not built for this war in terms of the fact of what I just said. Critical race theory and having drag queens on your military bases is not preparing for this battle. So, now we're on two fronts.
PHILLIP: Why is it that --
SUNSHINE: And we can't neglect the domestic front.
PHILLIP: Why is it that he's firing the people who were responsible for that transformation?
SUNSHINE: Because I don't know if you've talked to people who are in the military, but the unfortunate reality of when you're in the military is you are in a chain of command, and you can be fired at will. Same thing if you're in the president's cabinet.
PHILLIP: But that doesn't answer the question.
SUNSHINE: So, that's how that works.
PHILLIP: Why is he firing the people responsible for this so-called transformation?
SUNSHINE: Transformation of what?
PHILLIP: You're saying that Hegseth was brought in to improve the military, to improve readiness, to get the military ready for future warfare. Why is he firing the very people who were doing that?
SUNSHINE: I'm not convinced that he is firing those specific individuals.
PHILLIP: Well, that's actually what we're talking about here.
SUNSHINE: I think that's up for interpretation.
PHILLIP: That is what the conversation is about.
SUNSHINE: I think that's up for interpretation. I don't think we're in the --
PHILLIP: The conversation is about exactly that.
MEIJER: Well, General Chris Donahue's firing, who was doing a lot of that transformation. He'd gone to Ukraine with the now former secretary of the Army, Dan Driscoll. And I think both of them, incredible patriots, and I hope to see them back in government service.
HILL: But the funny thing about this whole conversation is that you all wouldn't trust Pete Hegseth to guard this cup. And you know you wouldn't. And it's like, so we're dancing around what is the major issue, which is his competency, which is poor. And I think I'm being kind by saying poor.
MOCKLER: You are being kind.
MEIJER: I think we're talking about drones. Because I also think that the drone dominance program --
HILL: No. At the root of it, this is about is Pete Hegseth a competent leader? The answer is no.
MOCKLER: I have a question for you off the back of that. But I just want to say, the only person that has been obsessed with race and culture war issues is Pete Hegseth, who was plucked off Fox News by Donald Trump and then put in this position where he is now putting us in more and more danger. Trump doesn't seem to have an understanding --
SUNSHINE: Pete Hegseth isn't who instituted critical race theory policies to our soldiers.
MOCKLER: He is obsessed with race.
SUNSHINE: And let me just speak on behalf of our --
(CROSSTALKS)
SUNSHINE: Go talk to Special Forces guys. They will tell you that during the Biden era, women were allowed into their pipelines and mandated to meet lower standards.
PHILLIP: Okay. SUNSHINE: Do you understand what that does to endanger our soldiers?
PHILLIP: Let me just be clear about one thing.
SUNSHINE: And we can't act like that didn't happen.
PHILLIP: Let me just be clear about one thing that is really important about Pete Hegseth's hire, firing spate.
He has never provided an explanation for why a lot of these people have been fired and for why they've been disproportionately black, people of color, and women. Now, if we are operating on a merit-based system here, you should be able to explain exactly why you're firing who you're firing. You should be able to explain why predominantly the people that you're firing are black people, people of color, and women.
And he has not been able to do that. He has taken people out of the promotion ranks just simply because, it seems, because of their race and gender. If you're going to do that, you've got to explain it, don't you think?
PETER MEIJER (R), FORMER U.S. REPRESENTATIVE, MICHIGAN, AND FOUNDING PARTNER AND HEAD OF STRATEGY, THE NEW INDUSTRIAL CORPORATION: Well, I also think that that is something that Capitol Hill really wants to the point of the Armed Services Committees wanting to understand, I mean, especially in the case, again, I'm going back to Kristana Hugh, who was the last service member on the ground in Afghanistan. He had formerly commanded Delta Force, 82nd Airborne, and then with Dan Driscoll, who was also well-respected on the Hill, with former General Randy George, who was very respected on the Hill.
You need to articulate that in order to rebuild some of that trust because there are a lot of significant and important for the country priorities that are only going to go through Congress, whether it is a defense appropriations for a $350 billion, I apologize on the budget that that was put through, or to get to that actual top line of a $1.5 trillion defense appropriations that is not going to go solely through the National Defense Authorization Act. You're going to have all sorts of problems trying to push an NDAA through both defections on the right and also tremendous angst on the left about anything defense related.
SCOTT MACFARLANE, CHIEF WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT, MEIDASTOUCH NETWORK: Those unexplained firings, they are a wedge issue. Don Bacon has cited the unexplained firings as one of the reasons he's defected.
I think the Democrats would say they have any number of concerns, including that Jemele's cup is not going to be protected by Pete Hegseth or anybody else's excess proof.
CAROLINE SUNSHINE, FORMER DEPUTY COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR, TRUMP'S 2024 CAMPAIGN: It's a critical race training theory for soldiers who are going to protect their cups.
JEMELE HILL, CONTRIBUTING WRITER, "THE ATLANTIC", AND PODCAST HOST, "SPOLITICS WITH JEMELE HILL" AND CO-HOST, "FLAGRANT AND FUNNY": You can keep saying that word and that buzzword a thousand times, the fact is Hegseth is a buffoon.
SUNSHINE: But I think the reality of what's going on here, though --
HILL: That is what this comes down to.
PHILLIP: All right. Next for us, public opinion in one category hits a record high. An overwhelming number of Americans think that the government is corrupt, and it's not just one party that feels that way.
We'll be right back.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[22:35:00]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIP: Tonight nearly 90 percent of Americans say that there's widespread corruption in government. That's the highest level in 20 years, and it's up 10 percent from just last year. That's compared to other advanced economies.
The United States is an alarming outlier, and it's not just a partisan thing. Significant majorities of Republicans, Democrats, independents, they all agree.
Now, today, pressed by CNBC's Joe Kernen on the perceptions of a conflict of interest between his current role as commerce secretary and his family's business dealings, Howard Lutnick denied that he influenced a recent deal potentially benefiting his sons, who now leave the company that he used to run.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JOE KERNEN, CNBC ANCHOR: The perception is that you're sitting now at commerce, and you're able to control what Cantor is getting in terms of fees with your sons running that company. It looks like a conflict of interest. How do you respond to that?
HOWARD LUTNICK, U.S. COMMERCE SECRETARY: It's just not. I had no idea that Cantor was involved with the company at all. It never came up to me.
My kids bought my companies, so I am no longer involved in my own companies at all. My kids bought it from me. They own it, and I had nothing to do with that decision.
This is minor stuff anyway. You know that I'm well-to-do. I don't worry about this kind of stuff.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIP: That's just one example of the concerns that people have, and certainly Democrats are going to be looking into this. Joe Kernen pressed Lutnick on this story from The Times from June that said that the Trump family and the Lutnick family have financial ties to at least 14 companies that are actively working with the federal government on critical mining deals, including a Kazakhstan project. The total amount of federal funding from the Trump administration that has been provided or is being considered for the companies exceeds $8.9 billion.
ADAM MOCKLER, YOUTUBE HOST, "THE ADAM MOCKLER SHOW": This is the most corrupt administration in American history, and it's very easy to say that when you see the level of insider trading happening right in front of our eyes. Donald Trump is currently selling access to his Truth Social for $100,000 a month. It's early access where you can get his tweets about the Iran war or about specific individual ticker signs that he sends out.
He's tweeted out NVIDIA and Dow just as a ticker sign, trying to pump them up. He has made billions of dollars in crypto since taking office, and he's created a pay-to-play pardon scheme where you can basically buy pardons for no good reason if you have enough money to give to MAGA, Inc., and he'll give them to you.
So can we all just agree at this table really quickly that pardons shouldn't be for sale as the President?
[22:40:03]
MACFARLANE: There's nothing that can be done to change the pardon system short of legislation. That's not going to happen. So the pardons are what the pardons are indefinitely.
The Truth Social plus premium plan, that thing's in court. There's a lawsuit by the Intercept that challenges and asks the court to intervene to stop this Truth Social pay-to-get-the-advanced-tip system, and in fact, Natalie Harp is a name defended in that case.
That's one the judge could intervene on. I'm told there could be a hearing on that in the coming days, an intervention by a court soon.
PHILLIP: That's very interesting. You know, the White House and the Commerce Department separately, in response to these types of questions, have rejected the concerns, the suggestion that the Trump administration was improperly mixing government access and family business.
But do you think that that's going to be enough for voters to just say, well, we're telling you we had nothing to do with it? And even though, even if it's not Howard Lutnick himself who runs the company and is financially benefiting from it, or even the President, although he is benefiting from a lot of things personally, the fact that there are family members might be, I mean, that seems to be something that you've got to bring some more proof to actually show people that there was no involvement by the principals in these decisions.
MACFARLANE: Don't bring a Biden. SUNSHINE: I think perception is reality. And I think historically,
when you look back, if a populace perceives that its government and its elites are too out of touch or benefiting off of their backs, whether that is true or not, whether it is legal or not, historically you get revolution. Or they start to look for very extreme solutions to that.
So that's the bigger backdrop through the lens which I'm looking at this. But I'm also looking at selective outrage on corruption. Because you're talking about $8.9 billion.
I want to talk about $18 billion of U.S. taxpayer money that we have not gotten back from Minnesota. And Tim Walz had to say he's not running for reelection, because he knew about it. Where's that money? Are we getting that money back?
Well, we're only upset about corruption, perceived corruption, when Trump's name is involved. But we're not upset about it. As long as the beneficiaries are Somali refugees, then it's okay.
It's more than that. I'm sure.
PHILLIP: It was prosecuted under Joe Biden before it was prosecuted under Trump. And in fact, actually, the Trump administration has been kind of slow. After they raised this in December, there's been not a whole lot of action on this issue.
But it's been prosecuted by Democrats before it was prosecuted by a Republican. So the idea that Democrats don't care about it doesn't make a whole lot of sense. And it also doesn't justify the President and his family.
And I don't want to take the President out of it, because his net worth went from $5.1 billion when he took office to $6.5 billion just in the last year. So he is making money.
He's making money off of crypto deals, he's making money off of meme coins, he's making money off of, I mean, he's an investor in Truth Social, which has a $100,000 fee for early access to his own tweets.
HILL: I mean, I live in Los Angeles, Abby, right? So we have the swap meet there. Donald Trump is basically President of swap meet.
That's what I feel like, because he's pumping coins, shoes. He's selling everything that's not nailed down. I agree.
SUNSHINE: But it's legal. And the fraud in Minnesota is not legal.
HILL: If it's legal, it's bad. And if it's a Democrat, it'd be easy to play like crazy.
SUNSHINE: Somali refugees get in Lamborghinis because they ripped off funds from autistic children.
HILL: And any other, if Joe Biden kills y'all, we'd lose y'all for life. SUNSHINE: Is Donald Trump siphoning funds from why are you killing children?
PHILLIP: Why are you complaining about the Somali fraud actually being prosecuted?
SUNSHINE: Because you have a double standard.
HILL: You have a double standard.
SUNSHINE: A double standard when it comes to corruption and with benefits. Autistic children with their private funds, how many refugees could become millionaires in this country?
PHILLIP: That doesn't make any sense. That's not what a double standard is. It has been prosecuted, and it is being prosecuted.
MOCKLER: As a firm liberal Democrat, I condemn any fraud that happened in Minnesota, and it should be immediately prosecuted. Can you admit that the corruption in the Trump admin should be investigated at the very least? Can you admit that pardon shouldn't be for sale?
SUNSHINE: I'll go further.
I will say that as a country, if we do not like the perception of corruption in any administration, whether it be the Trump administration, the Biden administration, or Congress itself with all of its insider stock trading, then we as a country have to change our laws.
So that's further than you, Mr. Liberalist. I don't have a problem with an investigation, but it's legal is my thing.
So you want an investigation? I'm saying change the law.
MOCKLER: It may not be legal.
SUNSHINE: We're going to have it stay in court, because it's not illegal taking funds from autistic children in Minnesota.
MOCKLER: No one's okay with that.
SUNSHINE: There is a difference there.
PHILLIP: You're shadowboxing with no one. Everybody condemns it. It's already illegal.
MOCKLER: You're the double standard.
SUNSHINE: I'm so glad to get you all on the record on this.
[22:45:06]
PHILLIP: Next for us, the nation's largest school district has banned A.I. in most classrooms, and the order is coming right from Zohran Mamdani. Be right back. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIP: Tonight as the battle between educators and technology brews, the nation's largest school district is now banning A.I. in most of its classrooms.
[22:50:04]
It's part of a sweeping new policy that puts strict limits on A.I. tools, and it impacts about 600,000 students across New York City. Here's what Zohran Mamdani, the city's mayor, is making as his case against A.I. for kids.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAYOR ZOHRAN MAMDANI (D), NEW YORK CITY: Children need their teachers and human connection in order to learn and in order to grow. And they need to develop skills alongside their peers, build relationships with their teachers, and wrestle with tough problems on their own.
The tech industry wants us to believe that A.I. in early education is not only inevitable, but that it is necessary. We do not see it that way.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PHILLIP: Scott, is he getting ahead of the next populist issue for a lot of parents, families?
MACFARLANE: It's the issue now, not so much the next issue. Ask a kid if they think of A.I.. Listen to the damning review you get from kids to A.I. and how they think it's going to subjugate them to unemployment for many years to come.
The American Federation of Teachers is on board with limiting screen time A.I. tools. They actually have a plan to prohibit the use of A.I. or encourage schools to prohibit it for any elementary school kid. No screens between K and second grade, and let's make handwriting and paper part of what we do.
How many teachers out there have to have their kids handwrite responses to tests because they don't want chatbots or A.I. to be utilized through screens?
This is a moment in which we grapple with this. It's not the next issue, it's the now issue.
PHILLIP: Paper.
HILL: Does that include cursive?
PHILLIP: Yes. I mean, but look, this is probably a little closer to your generation than most of us here at the table. But do you think this is the right move?
MOCKLER: Absolutely. So for some context, my generation and the generations below me and even millennials have been struggling with a lot of anti-social behavior due to COVID, due to technology.
They've outsourced a lot of their socialization to Instagram or Snapchat or TikTok or whatever. So there's already that problem. Then you have the introduction of A.I., which outsources the critical thinking along with the socialization skills.
You have a bunch of young people growing up in a reality where you're not getting the social time, you're not getting the critical thinking time, you're not facing tough problems like the mayor pointed out. And I think when you remove the A.I. aspect of it and you introduce some socialization, some critical thinking, it's very powerful for young students and I think it's a good thing overall.
HILL: And not only that, we don't want to rob these kids of what we all remember. How many of you guys remember your kindergarten teacher?
I remember mine. Mrs. Gold. Okay? And when I wrote my memoir, I thanked a lot of my teachers.
That important connection, I think children need to have. We need to constantly remind them that your mind is not some wasteland.
I saw this woman posting about this on social media, how she went into a grocery store and she used, I think it was a $100 bill, and the kid who was working the cash register was confused because they didn't understand the change denomination.
Because we don't want to raise kids to be dependent on technology. I think A.I. can be useful as a research tool and other things, but that young, it just feels like we need to encourage connection as much as possible.
PHILLIP: So there was a, let me just point out, there's a recent study that said A.I. adoption raised homework scores by 18 percent, it reduces completion time by 30 percent, but it lowers monthly exam scores by 20 percent within six months. So that basically tells me the kids are getting their homework done fast, they're not learning.
SUNSHINE: I think this is doing a really big disservice to them though, because the question that we're all going to have to reckon with as a society is, is A.I. here? It's here.
The question is, it's going to create winners and it's going to create losers. That is inevitable. And we have to make it create more winners than losers.
How do you do that? Not by banning the very technology that is going to be part of their everyday life.
You talk about wanting to subjugate and make second-class citizens, a good way to do that would be to teach them not to use it, you know, a good way to make more winners. I mean, A.I. has the potential right now to completely disrupt the labor force as we know it, but where it could create more winners is more entrepreneurs than we've ever had.
The ability of somebody to create, you run your own business, the ability for you, low bar of entry, to create your own business with two employees rather than ten. That's the mentality you have to have, otherwise just telling them, put your eyes, close your eyes, cover your ears, A.I. isn't here, who is that helping?
PHILLIP: I guess one thing I would say is that this is in the context of how students are being taught. And I think that's an important distinction. They're going to be using A.I. in their lives, but is A.I. going to be teaching them?
Mamdani says no, if you're under grades eight and below. And I think that is where I think a lot of parents probably agree with him.
Next for us, we'll react to your feedback from cnn.com/abby when we come back.
[22:55:05]
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
PHILLIP: Now some viewer feedback from cnn.com/abby.
We've got one viewer who says, God is God. Keep God out of politics. There is a separation of church and state for a very good reason.
I think that's directed at you.
SUNSHINE: What makes you think that?
[23:00:00]
PHILLIP: I've got one more. Egg prices may be down, but my trip to the gas pump today cost me $130 and some change, which this person must have a really large truck.
It is that we got the idea. It is expensive. I like all the Michigan representation at the table tonight, at the other side of the table.
HILL: Covering all across the state.
All right, everyone. Thank you very much for watching "NewsNight." "Laura Coates Live" starts right now.
