Return to Transcripts main page

CNN News Central

Rep. Cory Mills (R-FL) are Interviewed about the Rally Shooting; Fact Checking First Night of the Republican Convention; Sabrina Eaton is Interviewed about JD Vance. Aired 9:30-10a ET

Aired July 16, 2024 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:30:58]

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Less than 72 hours after an attempt on his life, a visibly emotional Donald Trump walked into the convention hall here in Milwaukee to a standing ovation and chants of "fight, fight, fight" from his supporters. The same that he -- the same chant actually that he yelled just seconds after he was grazed by a gunman's bullet at the Pennsylvania rally.

And today we are also learning - I mean every day we are learning new details about how this all played out. A new CNN analysis shows that the crowd there notice the gunmen at least one minute and 57 seconds before he opened fire.

Let's dive into this a little bit more. Joining us right now is Republican Congressman Cory Mills. He is a former sniper.

And, Congressman, I mean, I lean into that because you have a specific background in exactly what we are talking about in your training and being in an advanced team to go to venues, to scope out potential holes, to fix those potential holes.

This detail, this is from a CNN analysis of the video that's come out, is that people in the crowd saw for about a minute and 57 seconds had eyes on him before he opened fire. To you, that says what?

REP. CORY MILLS (R-FL): Well, I'll tell you, even more than that, as this continues to develop as a story and we get more information about it, we've also heard that up to 20 plus minutes that this individual was up on the roof making its way -

BOLDUAN: That he could have - yes, he should have been seen, right?

MILLS: Yes. And that two different civilians who were attending the rally had taken photos and actually sent this to local law enforcement.

We also had heard about local law enforcement accessing the roof and having the rifle pointed at them with in which case they had retreated.

BOLDUAN: Yes.

MILLS: You know, I look at all of these things and I look at different videos where an assailant will pull a firearm on a law enforcement officer and the first thing they do is they immediately pull and draw and mitigate the threat and the risks. You know, I ask why a local law enforcement officer did not do so.

The other thing is, is that when you set up an advanced team - I keep hearing this about the perimeter elements.

BOLDUAN: Yes.

MILLS: You know, the perimeter is actually established by your threats that are in the area. So, if I don't have any threats outside of 100 yards, OK, fine, I can cordon off a certain area. But if I have a building 160 yards, perfectly adjacent to the stage, that's an obvious threat, especially with an elevated position has overwatch. That's a sniper's paradise.

And, you know, we talk about (INAUDIBLE). You also have, which no one talks about, but the water tower. The water tower as well is -

BOLDUAN: So, what I'm hearing from you is it's not - a failure on the ground for sure, but ultimately a failure in advance.

MILLS: I think it's a failure in advance. I think it's a failure to have the counter snipers to be able to established their rangefin and their sketch maps.

BOLDUAN: I also heard - there also - we also learned that local snipers were stationed inside that building at the time -

MILLS: I haven't heard that piece of it yet, but that doesn't necessarily make sense -

BOLDUAN: We did hear -

MILLS: Unless they were actually in a window which was backed off, because a lot of times you will get yourself in there.

BOLDUAN: OK.

MILLS: Sometimes you exposure your rifle in a way to try and do a force protection or a show of force that actually stops things.

Others are actually more tactical where they'll sit back a little bit. But a sniper, for the law enforcement, is only trained to shoot about 75 yards. Unlike your counter-sniper teams that are on site (ph).

But - but here's my problem. In having done this for so long, and they always say the adage of ignorance is bliss, and I think that's true. I've done thousands of advances. I've done thousands of counter-sniper operations with our teams in, or, you know, Iraq and Afghanistan, et cetera. The amount of negligence, the amount of mistakes that was made here, I have a very difficult time not leaning myself towards, this was intentional as opposed to fecklessness. BOLDUAN: Well, wait, talk to me about that. I actually heard you say this right - the day after, which I wanted to ask you about. What do you mean intentional?

MILLS: You know, I -

BOLDUAN: You mean an intentional failure on the part of -

MILLS: No, I wouldn't say an intentional failure on the part of, but I've got to just - you know, I sit here and I scratch my head. And you don't want to be the conspiracist. You don't want to be the person -

BOLDUAN: I'm telling you, because that's what it - that what it's leaning towards.

MILLS: And - no, I know. And that's the issues that you walk this fine balance of, you're not trying to be conspiracist, but you look at this and you go how could this have gone so poorly?

BOLDUAN: But it's one thing if someone on the streets has it. It's not - I mean, you, Coy Mills, member of Congress, former sniper, you saying it, I mean, it makes my eyebrows go up.

[09:35:03]

MILLS: Of course.

BOLDUAN: What - when you say you're walking the line on this, intentional what?

MILLS: You know, it almost seems to me - I think that an investigation is necessary at this point within Congress, not just the FBI, not just others.

You know, I look back at it and I'm thinking, all right, you know, for an individual, if you looked at the escalations and how they are trying to approach him. Let's just say that it was like, OK, first we want to censor and silence you. Then we want to indict and imprison you. Now we're attempting to kill you and take back the stage.

BOLDUAN: Whoa, whoa, whoa. You - let's - let's slow down.

MILLS: Please.

BOLDUAN: I'm - I'm hearing two things from you. I don't want to jump ahead of things, but I'm also hearing you jumping ahead of things.

MILLS: Well, actually, I'm just looking at all the different possible capabilities. You know, one of the things as a military member, one of the things -

BOLDUAN: But -

MILLS: Well, wait. But one of the things as a person who's run in the special operations communities before, one of the people who's actually done this is that, you look at all potential analysis, right? That - that's how you play worst case scenarios and -

BOLDUAN: Donald Trump and his team have said do not - that, like -

MILLS: No, I agree.

BOLDUAN: Dial it back.

MILLS: But - completely.

BOLDUAN: Do not blame this on Joe Biden. But what you're -

MILLS: Oh, well, actually, I didn't say Joe Biden, to be completely clear.

BOLDUAN: Who's the they then? Let's be very specific.

MILLS: Well, that's what the investigations do. Was it local law enforcement that had made the mistakes, or was there something to it? Was their other types of things that we need to be analyzing or looking at and providing analysis.

My point to this is that, when something's so significant - you're talking about something that hasn't happened in decades, right?

BOLDUAN: I totally - I - I -

MILLS: But - but - but my point is, is this. From a perspective of someone who's actually conducted these, these are not difficult advances. This is not like I'm putting together a stage placement in a tight shot. This is about looking at your surroundings, what is my green, yellow, and red route, which is your routes out in case. What is my actual elements of - that I need to be looking at as far as mitigating threats or risks or increased levels? Where is my range fan for the sniper that says, OK, here's my 100, my 200, my sketch. Here's an area where someone could shoot. Here's a - because here's my thing, let's just say it's a Royce (ph) element.

BOLDUAN: So, you're saying - wait, wait, wait, you're saying this is so basic that - how big the screw up was, that's what's leading your brain down this road?

MILLS: That's exactly right, in a way. But - but - because here's the other thing. Let's just say it's a resource -

BOLDUAN: But, look - but, Congressman, Tom Emmer was just on. Tom Emmer was jus ton with me and he said very three specifically to me, I wrote it down, that he said very clearly, "it is too early to be talking about" -

MILLS: It is.

BOLDUAN: "Who is at fault and who is responsible."

MILLS: It is. That's why an investigation's necessary.

BOLDUAN: But is it - is it not dangerous, is it not reckless to use - to even be throwing around the word intentionally?

MILLS: So, to question things as we do an investigation is recklessness, because at that point then should we never questioned anything?

My point is, is this.

BOLDUAN: I'm not - I'm not trying to be -

MILLS: So, let me ask a simple question, Kate. But - but let me just ask - ask -

BOLDUAN: Look, I'm not - again, I'm not trying to be piecey.

MILLS: No, I understand.

BOLDUAN: My point is, in the political environment that we are in.

MILLS: But here's my - but here's my point, though, what would it have taken, right? Let's just say that resources was limited. Let's go with that as in their reasoning.

So, how many times have you seen where they just put a police car inside of a parking lot with not an officer in it and just leave the lights on as a deterrence? Why couldn't that have been a simple thing that was placed in? Why couldn't we have said to the owner of the actual AGR company, hey, look, we don't want to disrupt your business, but we also want to make sure your parking lot is clear of people trying to park in there for the rally. Why don't we place an officer there?

My point is that this was too easy of a solution. And when I think about 160 yard shot -

BOLDUAN: I'm just so comfortable with even have that -

MILLS: I'm uncomfortable with having to say it. Trust me, my whole point is, is that I would like to look at this and say, where was the mistake made? How can we correct it in the future? Why was this actually done?

But I think that this does warrant a J-13 type commission where we can actually look at it and say, let's investigate and find out why this happened so it doesn't happen to anyone. This is not about a political thing. This is about, we had an attempt to assassinate a president.

We really need to understand what a serious matter this is. And this was a milliseconds or millimeter difference between this being in that attempt, and this being an assassination.

BOLDUAN: Yes.

MILLS: And I can tell you, at 160 yards, Kate, just to give you an idea, you're off the shelf rifle shoots what they call one-minute of angle at every hundred yard line. So, at 100 it's one inch, 200, two inches, et cetera. So, now you're talking about 1.6 inch grouping capability of a rifle off a manufacturing line. Your average human being, because we used to do this and understand in sniper training. You're 20 inches shoulder to shoulder, 40 inches head to waist, and you're six by eight in your average head size. These are kind of the dimensions that you look at as an average. You're talking about a 1.6 inch grouping for multiple shots on a basic rifle.

We're blessed, and I do believe in divide intervention, so I am a person of faith. I can't explain, one, I hope that it was a corrugated roof and maybe he slipped off on one of the edges of the corrugated roof or he was rushed. But this - the whole thing, I think, just needs to have a better explanation so that the American people and everyone can feel comfortable.

BOLDUAN: And I think that's why people are saying pump the brakes, because we've seen conspiracy theories honestly on the right and the left.

MILLS: (INAUDIBLE).

BOLDUAN: I just had Donie O'Sullivan on that - it's already going like wildfire. This is the kind of political environment that they're saying it's too hot and people are jumping to too many conclusions.

MILLS: Yes. Well, as a -

BOLDUAN: That's - I mean, that's why I am so uncomfortable with this.

MILLS: As a military member, one of the things that we do is we what if scenario everything in the world, right? That's how we actually stay (ph) safe (ph).

(CROSSTALK)

MILLS: And so when I look at the what ifs -

BOLDUAN: I know, but it - but it - I don't know. I'm just saying if it's - the what if - the what ifs that you - you talk about maybe in an investigation and the what if that you are presenting on live television, I don't know, it's just -

MILLS: Well, so, listen, I'm a public official.

BOLDUAN: Yes.

MILLS: Anything that I do, anything that I say, I say in the public. I don't try and hide it in private. I think that the American people need transparency, accountability, and accessibility to the elected officials, not to try and hide behind what we want to look at.

[09:40:05]

And I also think that if we - if the American people know that we're questioning these things as well, it puts them at rest to at least know, why aren't they at least looking into this? We should look at every single situation which is of this significance. We should look at it from multiple angles to ensure that nothing is left out, nothing could be potentially claimed as being covered up.

BOLDUAN: Yes.

MILLS: We need to have more transparency to the American people. I think that's what everyone deserves.

BOLDUAN: But a full investigation.

MILLS: A full investigation.

BOLDUAN: Before anyone --

MILLS: That's right.

BOLDUAN: -- points at fault (ph)?

MILLS: That's exactly right.

BOLDUAN: Congressman --

MILLS: And that's why I say I lean, I have not made an accusation of something. I just want to make sure we're covering our basis to ensure that we get a proper investigation at all levels to ensure this doesn't happen again and that our president can be safe.

BOLDUAN: Congressman, thank you for coming in.

MILLS: Thank you, Kate.

BOLDUAN: Thank you very much.

John, back to you.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, excellent work there, Kate.

So, how many lies were told during day one of the Republican Convention? We've got a brand new fact check.

And new reporting on how JD Vance won over Donald Trump to secure his spot on the Republican ticket.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

BERMAN: All right, day two of the Republican Convention is underway, but let's talk about what was said on day one. CNN's fact checker in chief, Daniel Dale, is here with us now.

And, Daniel, we want to start with Marjorie Taylor Greene, what she said about jobs.

Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. MARJORIE TAYLOR GREENE (R-GA): They claim that our economy is thriving, yet hundreds of thousands of American-born workers lost their jobs these past few years.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Daniel.

DANIEL DALE, CNN SENIOR REPORTER: American-born workers have gained millions of jobs under President Biden, 4.7 million jobs over the three years between June 2021 and June 2024.

[09:45:00]

Now, I'll call this claim misleading at best rather than false because it is possible that within this group there are particular hundreds of thousands of workers who did lose their jobs, but Congresswoman Greene created the impression that this group of workers has lost jobs on the whole. And that's not even close to true.

BERMAN: So there was a claim about the Middle East made by RNC chair Michael Watley.

Let's listen to that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MICHAEL WHATLEY, RNC Chairman: Four years ago, Europe and the Middle East were at peace.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Oh, I guess that's it. Right there. That was quick. Daniel, very quick.

DALE: That's - it was very quick.

BERMAN: Go ahead, check it.

DALE: Very quick and very wrong. Former President Trump also makes this claim that he achieved peace in the Middle East. Not even close to true again. Whatever the merits of his Abraham Accords in which some countries that were not at war with Israel agreed to normalize relations with Israel, when he left office, there were civil wars ongoing in Yemen, in Syria. Of course, an unresolved Israeli- Palestinian conflict, an Israeli conflict with Iran, with Syria, with Hezbollah in Lebanon. U.S. personnel continued to be attacked in a highly unstable Iraq. So, the idea that Trump achieved peace in the Middle East with his Abraham Accords is just not correct.

BERMAN: And, Daniel, again, this was a very quick one. I want you to listen to the RNC video, pre-recorded video that was played. It talked a little bit about the economy.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: America has reached the highest inflation in 40 years.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Daniel.

DALE: So, John, this claim is out of date. So, there was a 40-year high inflation two full years ago in June 2022 when it hit 9.1 percent. But this video and another pre-recorded video at the convention didn't mention that inflation has plummeted since then. It's now a third of that. It was 3.0 percent this past month, June 2024.

BERMAN: All right, that was night one. We know you're going to be at work the next three days.

Daniel Dale, great to see you this morning. Thank you very much.

DALE: Thanks. Thanks, John.

BERMAN: Sara.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: All right, freshman Senator JD Vance previously said he was a never Trumper, called the former president noxious, and leading the white working class to a very dark place. Now, he is sharing the Republican ticket with Donald Trump. So, what changed? That's up ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:50:36]

SIDNER: This morning, Ohio freshman Senator JD Vance is officially Donald Trump's running mate. But he wasn't always a Trump supporter in the past. He's had some really tough things to say about Trump. So now the question is, can this Trump critic turned ally help the president win swing states in November and secure blue-collar votes.

Joining me now, Sabrina Eaton, Washington correspondent for the Cleveland.com and "The Plain Dealer." Very familiar with "The Plain Dealer." Thank you so much for coming on for us this morning.

You have covered Vance for a long time. Can you give us some sense of who he is. The public got to know him a bit from, you know, "Hillbilly Elegy." And I think you have a visitor. It happens to us all. It happens to us all when we're doing live from our home.

What can you tell us about who he is as you have covered him throughout these years?

I'm not sure that you can hear me. Sabrina, can you hear me?

Seems like we've had a disconnect here, as happens -

BERMAN: It was a great question.

SIDNER: Quite regularly.

Thank you, John. BERMAN: It was a great question.

SIDNER: Appreciate it.

BERMAN: One that deserves an answer.

SIDNER: An answer.

BERMAN: That's what I have to say about that.

SIDNER: Thanks for your input this morning.

BERMAN: Yes.

SIDNER: It's always lovely to see you sitting right next to me.

BERMAN: Yes.

SIDNER: We're going to get back to Sabrina in just a few seconds when we figure all of that out. Technical difficulties happen to everyone.

We'll be right back.

BERMAN: Stick around.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:56:37]

SIDNER: All right, through the miracle of technology, we are back once again. Sabrina Eaton, the Washington correspondent for Cleveland.com and "The Plain Dealer."

Thank you so much for being with us this morning. Now we've got your audio. I think you can hear me.

SABRINA EATON, WASHINGTON CORRESPONDENT, CLEVELAND.COM AND "THE PLAIN DEALER": Yes.

SIDNER: You know a lot about JD Vance. You have talked to him throughout the years. Can you give us some sense of who he is that the public doesn't yet know?

EATON: Well, I mean to - I've talked to him since he has been elected to the U.S. Senate. So, I don't want to exaggerate, you know, the depth of my bond with him. I mean, he's - he's just joined the Senate since, you know, since the beginning of last year. And, you know, he's - he's really made quite a rapid rise, you know, defeating a lot of established Ohio politicians to win the Senate primary that - the year he won with, of course, Donald Trump's endorsement. And, you know, since he's come in the Senate, he's been introducing a lot of bills that seemed like they're designed to whip up the Republican base. You know, things like - like having English be the country's official language, you know, making it so that - you know, trying to make gender affirming care for minors more difficult, you know, things of that nature, stuff that doesn't really seem like it has much chance of passage in the Senate that's Democrat controlled but that is really geared toward, you know, more exciting the - you know, the right-wing base.

He has done a few other things, like when there was a big train accident in East Palestine, he was very out front in - in going to East Palestine and trying to secure federal assistance. He was very out front in getting, you know, in bird dogging the investigation on that. And he has tried to get legislation passed that would improve rail safety in the wake of that accident. But that seems to be stalled in the Senate Commerce Committee at the moment.

He has three kids -

SIDNER: Let me ask you -

EATON: Yes, sure, ask away.

SIDNER: Go ahead. Three children.

I do want to ask you about what you think made him made this big shift from being a person who said he would never vote for Donald Trump, and that he was even thinking about, as he put it, holding his nose and voting for Hillary Clinton back in 2016, to the person he is now, who is just rallying behind Donald Trump in big ways.

EATON: Well, you know, he says that, you know, he's - he's now illuminated and I guess sees things differently. Some could say it's - it's opportunism. I mean, I can't really tell you that I have like the inside poop (ph) on exactly what made him evolve, but it does seem like it's - it has propelled him through the Republican ranks rather rapidly.

SIDNER: Sabrina Eaton, thank you so much for your time and for us getting all this technology sorted out.

EATON: Well, thanks for having me, Sara.

SIDNER: I appreciate it.

All right, and that's - we've got the inside poop (ph) on the next show.

[10:00:01]

BERMAN: There you go.

SIDNER: It's coming up.

BERMAN: There you go. We know what's on next. "CNN NEWSROOM."

Thanks so much for being with us this morning. Convention coverage continues right now.