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Sen. Bob Menendez Guilty On All 16 Counts In Federal Corruption Trial; Sen. Schumer Urges Sen. Menendez To Resign After Corruption Conviction; Nikki Haley, Ron DeSantis To Speak At RNC Tonight. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired July 16, 2024 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:30:00]

KARA SCANNELL, CNN CORRESPONDENT: With his name, hidden in $190- something-thousand was stashed in a Forever 21 shopping bags in the closet.

And those were all details that the prosecution had used to build their case where they were able to fold back the covers of what Menendez was doing in order to receive that money.

And that involves looking at the call records of seeing what -- who we was talking to and what actions he was taking officially after those interactions.

And, you know, one of the men charged in this case initially agreed to cooperate and he was someone that testified at this trial, which his firsthand testimony, this alleged conspiracy.

I think we're seeing the prosecutor start to walk up to the mic, so we should hear very shortly from the U.S. attorney for the Southern District of New York, Damian Williams, who will be taking the podium to address the conviction in this case.

I'm looking to see if he has walked out yet. I don't think he has. But he will be speaking to the cameras soon about this monumental prosecution of the sitting U.S. Senator.

And the former chairman of the Senate Foreign Relations Committee on these serious charges of acting as a foreign agent and using the power of his office.

That was a theme throughout this trial, that he had abused and sold the power his office to do things that we're seemingly small, interfering in a criminal prosecution to help out a friend.

But that were also so much more significant and more of a betrayal of the trust that the constituents had put in him to act on their behalf and represent them in Congress and not that of a foreign government.

We're still waiting to see the doors opening if we're going to --

(CROSSTALK)

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: Let's - let's listen in here from the beginning.

DAMIEN WILLIAMS, U.S. ATTORNEY, SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK: -- House convicted Senator Robert Menendez of corruption and national security offenses.

This case has always been about shocking levels of corruption. Hundreds of thousands of dollars in bribes in the form of cash, gold bars, a Mercedes Benz.

This wasn't politics as usual. This was politics for profit. And now that a jury has convicted Bob Menendez, his years of selling his office to the highest bidder there have finally come to an end.

I want to thank the career prosecutors and law enforcement agents and analysts who meticulously investigated and prosecuted this case. Their work is the reason why this shocking corruption has finally been unearthed and brought to an end.

They are the best of the best. I'm enormously proud of them and proud to serve with them.

Thank you.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Will you seek the maximum sentence, sir?

CHRISTIE CURTIS, FBI SPECIAL AGENT & ACTING DIRECTOR, FBI NEW YORK FIELD OFFICE: Good afternoon. I'm Kristie Curtis. I'm the acting assistant director of the FBI's New York Field Office.

Today is a day a victory and a victory for justice. Public corruption investigations like this hold our leaders accountable and ensure they serve the public interest and not their -- they serve the public's interests and not their own.

This conviction comes after careful investigation and hard work by the FBI, IRS, any the U.S. attorney's office. The FBI's pursuit of truth and integrity was instrumental in securing this conviction.

When an elected official betrays the trust placed in them, it undermines the foundation of our democracy.

Thank you.

SAM MANUEL (ph) GOMEZ, IRSCI: My name is Sam Manuel (ph) Gomez, and I'm with IRSCI, Criminal Investigation. I'm especially in charge in the New York Field Office.

Thank you and good afternoon.

Thank you to U.S. Attorney Damian Williams for hosting us today.

It is a great commitment and collaboration between IRS agents, the FBI, and SDNY that today's verdict was possible.

I would like to recognize the work of the FBI Public Corruption CI Squad, the SDNY Public Corruption Unit, trial attorneys and paralegals for the tremendous effort in presenting this case, and the SDNY tax attorneys.

I will -- I want to specifically recognize the IRS CI special agent who worked this case in tandem with FBI special agents.

Today's verdict is a reflection of all the hard work. Job, well done.

Thank you, everyone.

UNIDENTIFIED REPORTER: Mr. Williams, will you seek the maximum?

KEILAR: All right, there you heard from officials, from the FBI and as well, beginning there, the U.S. attorney from the Southern District of New York, Damian Williams.

I want to bring Harry Litman back in to talk a little bit about this.

Williams saying there, Harry, that this was about shocking levels of corruption. He wanted to be clear, this wasn't politics as usual. He said this was politics for profit.

And he said that Menendez'S years of selling his office to the highest bidder has finally come to an end.

We still obviously have to see what his political fate is in the Senate, even as we see the top Senate Democrat saying that he needs to resign, but we're going to see what happens there.

[13:35:09]

What do you think, having heard this from the prosecution?

HARRY LITMAN, FORMER U.S. ATTORNEY: You know -- excuse me -- I'm a former U.S. attorney and he was, as U.S. attorneys ought to be, bland and on triumphant.

But there was one word that jumped out at me and that was the word "finally" and after years. So there really, I think, was a sense you knew it from people in the Department of Justice of a real sort of pride goeth before a fall.

Just after that first prosecution many years ago came undone, he began this scheme of criminal conduct that ended today with the result.

And I think Williams is saying he has finally been caught really put a point and a sort of extra little ump to what would -- what was otherwise just a straight by-the-facts description of this case.

So that, to me, really gave a little quiet sort of flourish about the whole relationship of this very office to Bob Menendez, dating back a decade.

KEILAR: Yes. I mean, to your point, I wondered about that as well because he didn't say it explicitly, but it seemed that he was referring to something more than just the years under which this particular conviction has to deal with. He, of course, was facing, back in 2017, bribery and corruption

charges, which the jury didn't reach a verdict. Did that seem uncharacteristic that he referred back to that or does this feel in a way, for DOJ, like a vindication that they weren't able to see that process to conclusion?

LITMAN: Yes. Look, U.S. attorneys aren't supposed to be triumphant or go take things personally, but it's very clear, and anyone who knows that office knew that it was a stinging defeat and they thought that, in fact, it was an unjust one in the sense that he really had been a corrupt public official.

And when he, as your correspondents have said, took up on this charge, on this criminal conduct in the immediate aftermath, people's heads were spinning. And I think it really redoubled their resolve to bring him to justice.

And it was that little -- almost a bread crumb thrown to his -- to the FBI and his folks who've worked on the Menendez cases not just now, but for years, that that Damian Williams, a very solid professional by-the-book prosecutor, gave that extra important detail.

KEILAR: Yet, and Harry stay with me because I do want to talk with you about sentencing.

But first, I want to read something that the New Jersey governor has said. He's responded to news here that Senator Bob Menendez has been found guilty on all 16 of the counts that he was facing in his federal corruption trial.

He said, "Today's verdict, finding Senator Bob Menendez guilty on those counts, demonstrates the Senator broke the law, violated the trust of his constituents, and betrayed his oath of office. It also shows that, in America, that everyone, no matter how powerful, is accountable to our laws."

He says, "Senator Menendez received a fair trial and due process of law as he was titled to under our Constitution."

And he goes on to thank the public servants, obviously, who served in this case.

He reiterated his call for Menendez to resign immediately after being found guilty of endangering national security and the integrity of our criminal justice system.

And he says, "If he refuses to vacate his office, I call on the U.S. Senate to vote to expel him."

Back to sentencing, which is October 29th, shortly before the election here, what do you think is a reasonable and a just amount of time for Senator Menendez to serve for what he has been found guilty of?

LITMAN: So first of all, Judge Sam Stein is actually known for not going so hard on white-collar defendants, but this is a special one. And by the way, this subtext of, just before the election, even the

New Jersey governor's comments, I think have to be taken as part of the kind of broader -- what it -- set of mistrust and for whether there's equal justice for all of different parties.

What I think -- I can tell you more about the process. The Probation Office will prepare a report. We -- you know, we've talked about, has he had any other involvement? He may be called upon to have a blank page, a completely open book about anything else he's done in order to affect his sentencing.

[13:40:05]

Then we have the guidelines calculations that I haven't completed yet, but I think they are in the 50-month range. But they'll just be preparatory.

So, you know, I believe that, in this case, it's both just and expected that he'll have a real sentence. Say, two-and-a-half, three years. I know that it will strike some people as short when you hear about 55 years or 85 years or 20 years.

But I think the real question is, will this 70-year-old disgraced public servant do serious time in the federal penitentiary? And I think the answer to that is yes.

But otherwise, the way the system is set up will be it'll be very much down to Sam Stein.

I think you'll hear a recommendation from Damian Williams' office for a pretty substantial sentence. And October 29th, as you say, just a few days before the election, is when it will play out.

It's not quite -- it's hard to predict the exact numbers now.

KEILAR: Yes, we will talk more about whatever the length of that may be, what that time would look like and how quickly it might begin. We'll talk about that ahead.

We are waiting to see if Senator Menendez will be coming to the microphones. We do think that is going to happen.

Let's get in a quick break. Stay with us. We will bring that to you as soon as it happens.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SEN. BOB MENENDEZ (D-NJ): We're disappointed by the jury's decision. I have every faith that the law and the facts did that sustain that decision and that we will be successful upon appeal.

I have never violated my public oath. I have never been anything but a patriot of my country and for my country. I have never, ever been a foreign agent. And the decision rendered by the jury today would put at risk every member of the United States Senate in terms of what they think a foreign agent would be. I think my attorney wants to say something and I'll be going.

UNIDENTIFIED ATTORNEY FOR BOB MENENDEZ: Afternoon. We were surprised and disappointed with the jury's verdict. We disagree with it and we believe, today, as we have, in Bob's innocence.

There are grave appellate problems with this case and this verdict. And we're going to pursue all appellate avenues aggressively. And we do expect he will be vindicated.

Thank you.

(CROSSTALK)

KEILAR: All right. Senator Bob Menendez, of New Jersey, undeterred by the justice that has been served against him, where he's been found guilty of all 16 federal charges that he was facing, in what was really, by all appearances from legal observers, a pretty sound case against him.

I want to bring Harry Litman back into the conversation, former U.S. attorney.

He said, Harry, "I have never violated my oath. I have never been a foreign agent."

The evidence really seemed to indicate something different.

LITMAN: Yes, it did. But let me tell you where he's going. So the Supreme Court, in a series of cases, have really imposed an elevated mental state on exactly these kinds of requirements.

[13:45:08]

So he will argue, especially under this new-fangled foreign agent one, that it really needed to be a very specific actual purpose to pay back or provide something concrete to the people of Egypt, rather than just, as he argued at trial, though he didn't testify himself, some kind of vague confluence of events.

The court, the Supreme Court has been pretty starchy on just those sorts of requirements. But the U.S. attorney's office knows that very well. And they have kind of carefully aided these charges around those previous rulings.

So he'll certainly press it. But I wouldn't give his odds very strong going forward.

One quick point, if the district court judge, on October 29th, thinks he has a strong case, he will let him stay at liberty during the appeal.

If he doesn't, Senator Menendez might have to bring his toothbrush to court because it will be the district court who can I don't think you've got a strong enough case. Senator Menendez, we remand you immediately to the custody of the -- to jail, so that -- the strength of his -- of his arguments on appeal will

depend on whether he remains of liberty after October 29th.

KEILAR: Bringing his toothbrush to court. You put it very starkly there, Harry.

LITMAN: Yes.

KEILAR: Let's talk about -- I do want to talk a little bit about the politics of some of this on the Hill.

But before that, I want to ask you, when we look at the sentencing, and as you said, you thought an appropriate time is really a few years, right? Two-and-a-half, three-and-a-half years, I think you said that that is something that seems to you may be appropriate for what he is facing here.

What kind of time would this be? I mean, where would he serve? What kind of people would he be serving that time with?

LITMAN: So on the first point, I just want to say this is very loosey- goosey of me and we'll see what Judge Stein wants.

But as to your second question, it's a completely separate inquiry. The Bureau of Prisons will make an initial determination. And someone who has committed a heinous crime, but has nevertheless a well-behaved prisoner, not a security risk, can either initially or work their way up to a fairly low security incarceration.

So in other words, the seriousness of his crimes, all the things we're talking about today, do not translate into a more secure kind of detention unless he himself is in danger.

So I would expect him to be serving his time at a relative low- security federal penitentiary.

KEILAR: Explain that. Because you'd said Judge Stein tends to go easier on white-collar criminals. But I think a lot of people look at what Senator Menendez has been convicted of and this doesn't quite seem to fit the bill of being a white-collar criminal.

This isn't, say, an insider trading scandal, for instance. This is about something bigger. This is about trading information and favors against the country that he has sworn an oath to in favor of another country.

LITMAN: One-hundred percent. And it is the most important feature of a sentencing and the signature feature of his -- his conviction. All I was referring to as a study based on not that much that compare different sentencings by judges in this district of white-collar defendants.

But you're 100 percent right that this is not -- I mean, it's the important point about the case. It is at once a kind of down-and-dirty Jersey bribe, but also this much more important national security gloss that the jury has now found beyond a reasonable doubt. So these protestations by Menendez that he -- he didn't act that way

will have zero purchase at sentencing as opposed to the legal arguments that maybe he can offer.

So, yes. What is in the mind of Judge Sam Stein when it comes to this extra very important feature, that's what well find out on the 29th. And this little datum that, in garden variety white-collar cases, he doesn't tend to throw the book at defendants, I think is close to know, meaningless.

KEILAR: Well, that's really interesting.

All right, Harry, stay with me if you would.

I want to get quickly to Lauren Fox on Capitol Hill.

You heard the Senator there, Lauren, or pardon me, here in Washington. You heard the Senator. He's not going anywhere. He's pretty defiant. He is going to force the hand of Senate leadership it sounds like.

[13:50:09]

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, those initial statements from him outside of the courthouse, it's clear that he wants to appeal this decision.

That would lead you to believe that he is defiant here, arguing that he may stay in this -- stay in his Senate seat.

I want to just pull back for a second though and lay out the fact that, right now, he is receiving pressure to step aside from Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer.

It's not clear that Schumer will be able to convince him. It's not clear if Schumer is going to try to call Senator Menendez.

What we have seen so far is the statement from Senator Schumer. But we should point out that this call for him to resign is new from the majority leader.

Prior to this moment, Schumer had made clear that he wanted this case to play out. He had said that he was disappointed in Menendez, that there are standards in the Senate. But he had not gone as far as asking Menendez to resign.

We are also getting some new reaction from Andy Kim, who is running to replace Senator Menendez in this seat.

In a statement, he said, quote, "This is a sad and somber day for New Jersey and our country. Our public servants should work for the people. And today, we saw the people judge that Senator Menendez as guilty and unfit to serve.

"I called on Senator Menendez to step down when these charges we're first made public. And now that he has been found guilty, I believe the only course of action for him is to resign his seat immediately." And again, Brianna, we talked a little bit about this a few minutes

ago. But right now, if Senator Menendez decides that he is not going to resign his seat, there is action that Senate leadership can take.

And that includes calling for a vote to expel him from the Senate. That would take two-thirds of the members voting in order to do that.

But, you know, Brianna, perhaps given the fact that the election is just around the corner, that is an option for Democrats.

Especially given the fact that you can imagine some Democrats in red states, who already have tough elections, do not want to be talking about this as they are running back home -- Brianna?

KEILAR: No, they certainly don't. It is a very bad look.

Lauren Fox, thank you so much.

And thanks to Harry Litman and Kara Scannell as well for her excellent reporting in following this case.

As we follow this breaking news, Senator Menendez found guilty of the 16 federal charges in this bribery and corruption case that he was facing.

And now the Senate majority leader, Chuck Schumer, calling on him to resign as the Senator from New Jersey shows no indication that he is going to comply with that.

We're going to take a quick break. Next, we're going to go live to Milwaukee and the Republican National Convention, where my co-anchor, Boris Sanchez, is there now, following all of the twists and turns. And moments ago, spoke with Georgia Governor Brian Kemp.

So we're going to bring that to you, next. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:57:52]

SANCHEZ: Welcome to CNN'S special live coverage of the Republican National Convention. I'm Boris Sanchez on site in Milwaukee. My co- anchor, Brianna Keilar, is live for us first in Washington.

Day two is underway here at the RNC. And it is going to be a tough act to follow as day one saw the first public appearance of Donald Trump since he survived an assassination attempt just two days before.

The former president made an emotional entrance with a bandage on his ear. That ear, of course, was the one hit by a bullet.

Convention goers cheered for him and his new vice-presidential pick, a former Never Trumper, the Senator of Ohio, J.D. Vance.

The two became the official nominees of the Republican ticket last night. But tonight's theme of the convention will make a focus on making

America safer again. That is to go along with an overall message of unity that Trump says he is pushing after nearly being killed.

We're going to see how tonight's slate of Republican speakers are going to live up to Trump's call, including some former rivals, Nikki Haley and Ron DeSantis.

We want to start with CNN's Kristen Holmes, who's here at the RNC.

So, Kristen, give us a preview of tonight's events.

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Boris, it's not just that these are rivals. These were the top rivals. Governor Ron DeSantis, Governor Nikki Haley.

The reason why this is so notable is because of what actually happened in the leadup to them speaking. We were told hold that neither of them had been given speaking slots.

Now, Florida Governor Ron DeSantis had been invited to the convention. He was going to be here, but not given a speaking slot.

Former governor of South Carolina, Nikki Haley, wasn't even invited.

And after we reported that, there was an enormous amount of backlash. Remember, there has been a lot of talk about people who we're looking for alternative to former President Donald Trump, who supported Nikki Haley or who supported Ron DeSantis.

And they wanted to bring the party together. They obviously believe not inviting them did not do that.

Now, we're going to see somewhat of a message of unity by having them up on that stage.

And we will note, traditionally, those top rivals would be at the convention. So it was strange that they weren't going to be given these kinds of speaking roles.

But when it comes to what exactly we're going to hear from the speakers tonight, a lot out of the speakers, some of them, Senatorial candidates, they are known for their kind of ramped up rhetoric.