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Interview With Rep. Glenn Ivey (D-MD); Global Tech Outage; Democratic Pressure Growing on Biden to Drop Out. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired July 19, 2024 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:00:43]

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Donors bailing, poll numbers falling, more Democrats bolting, though President Biden just sent out a new statement saying he is staying in the race and that he's excited to get back out on the campaign trail.

Plus, a global meltdown, a major tech outage hitting airlines, businesses, and emergency services worldwide. We're going to explore what caused it and whether it could happen again.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: And American journalist Evan Gershkovich is convicted of espionage and sentenced to 16 years in a Russian prison.

The U.S. has called this a sham case from the start. How the government is responding this hour.

We are following these major developing stories and many more, all coming in right here to CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

President Biden plotting his return to the campaign trail, but a growing number of Democrats are saying it is too late.

Thank you so much for joining us. I'm Brianna Keilar, alongside Boris Sanchez back from Milwaukee here in Washington.

And just minutes ago, the president released a statement vowing to get back on the campaign trail next week, but the list of lawmakers calling for him to pass the torch, it is getting longer almost by the hour.

SANCHEZ: Yes, still, his campaign seems unfazed. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JEN O'MALLEY DILLON, BIDEN CAMPAIGN MANAGER: Look, absolutely the president's in this race. Joe Biden is more committed than ever to beat Donald Trump. And we believe on this campaign we are built for the close election that we are in and we see the path forward.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Let's take you now live to Delaware with CNN's Priscilla Alvarez.

But, first, let's actually go to the White House with CNN's senior White House correspondent M.J. Lee.

M.J., strong pushback today by Biden and his campaign. What more are you hearing from sources?

M.J. LEE, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Boris, the Biden campaign is telecasting in every which way that the president is not going anywhere.

You played the sound of the Biden campaign chair saying he is absolutely staying in the race. The Biden campaign also sent out a memo earlier saying not only is he the presumptive nominee, but it said there is no plan for an alternative nominee.

CNN also reported last night that senior-most West Wing aides have had no discussions either amongst themselves or with the president himself about plans for him to drop out. And just moments ago, we got a statement from the president himself.

This is a part of what he wrote. He said: "I look forward to getting back on the campaign trail next week to continue exposing the threat of Donald Trump's Project 2025 agenda, while making the case for my own record and the vision that I have for America, one where we save our democracy, protect our rights and freedoms, and create opportunity for everyone. The stakes are high and the choice is clear. Together, we will win."

The campaign is basically saying that it has been emboldened by the end of the Republican National Convention and particularly President Donald Trump's speech last night. They said it was clear that that speech was all about him. He didn't present an agenda or a clear vision for the country and certainly was not a speech, the campaign is saying, meant to bring more people into his tent.

But, Boris, I think it's just important to note right now the campaign can say all they want that the president is staying in, but Democrats are continuing to remain incredibly concerned about the prospects of President Biden continuing to campaign.

We are seeing, as you mentioned earlier, Democrats by the day continuing to publicly call on the president to drop out. We have reported that there are many in the upper ranks of the White House and the campaign that privately believe that the president should drop out, not to mention donors who are freaked out and are not writing checks anymore.

Meanwhile, the president himself physically cannot get out on the campaign trail because he is isolating after testing positive for COVID. So, at this moment in time, we cannot overstate just how much unease there is right now inside the Democratic Party.

KEILAR: All right, we are certainly feeling that.

M.J. Lee, thank you.

And, Priscilla, we're hearing that some donors are now threatening to freeze donations for House and Senate races. Tell us about this. PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Yes, donors are

saying they're willing to hold back big-dollar checks.

That unease that you heard about there from M.J. extends to the donor class. There has been growing anxiety over concerns about the viability of President Biden and his candidacy. One Democratic strategist told this to our colleague John King -- quote -- "They believe, if Joe is at the top of the ticket, the House and Senate are gone too. They don't want to throw good money after bad."

[13:05:19]

I have also talked to Democratic strategists who have spoken with donors who are willing to give money to downballot races, but not to the top of the ticket, in hopes of at least trying to keep some Democratic seats in the House and Senate.

But what this shows us is the state of play in the donor class. Of course, campaigns need money, and there is so much concern that it has become hard for some advisers to sell President Biden as a candidate because of this intraparty revolt.

It has been difficult to talk to the campaign, according to some sources, who say the campaign remains defiant and is not listening to some of the concerns held by those who are, up until this point, not willing to hand over those checks.

Now, President Biden has not usually put in a lot of stock with. Donors and there are -- there is the belief among some in the campaign that eventually they will come around when it gets closer to Election Day and it's clear that it is an election between Biden and Trump.

But let's also not forget that, last week, George Clooney, a top donor, also said that President Biden should step aside. So this is still ongoing and unfolding, and clearly a challenge that the campaign is having to grapple with.

KEILAR: Yes, it's becoming a bigger challenge by the hour.

Priscilla, thank you for that report.

And joining us now to talk a little bit more about this moment is Congressman Glenn Ivey.

He is a Democrat from Maryland, and he's also a member of the Congressional Black Caucus.

You said on Saturday, sir -- by the way, thank you for being with us.

REP. GLENN IVEY (D-MD): Sure.

KEILAR: It is a really important moment, I think, that we're at right now.

You said Saturday that Biden is the best fit to beat Trump. Do you still feel that way? IVEY: I do.

And if I could add something to that, you heard just a moment ago directly from the president about the record he's got to run on, which is outstanding, and the vision for the future was just to build on that.

But for the people who are just saying, we want to get out, we want him out, and they're passing the torch, one of the challenges I have is that they're not talking about who you would pass it to. And part of that means there's going to be this big scramble at the convention, which I think would send a terrible message to the public that the party's in disarray.

And on top of that, if it's not Kamala Harris, I think you have got a huge challenge about two things. One is African-American voters feeling that she's been disrespected. But, secondly, you have got the financial piece of it.

We're talking about donors, but Biden/Harris campaign has, I think, last 90-plus-million dollars in the account. Nobody else can get that if they're not named Biden or Harris.

KEILAR: Well, so what if it is Kamala Harris?

IVEY: I think she'd be outstanding. And I have said before I think they're a great team. The Biden/Harris team has been a very strong one, and she could actually run on the record that they have built together.

But for the folks who aren't talking about that, but they're saying they want him off the ticket, they need to address that piece. And then the last part of it is the organization. They built a strong national office structure for grassroots campaign, which I think is going to be pivotal this year.

That doesn't pass off to somebody else either. They'd have to pay fair market value for the office space, the contracts, the leases. All of that stuff would have to be addressed. And you're asking somebody to come in and do that in like 60 to 70 days.

Most of the names I have seen other than Biden and Harris have no national name recognition. Who can put together a winning presidential campaign in that time?

KEILAR: Well, there are calls saying that he -- it's already done, that the election is as good as lost if Joe Biden continues at the top of the ticket.

And those calls are coming from inside the house. This is what we're hearing from people at the White House and inside of the Biden campaign. And I think that is something that may give a lot of Democrats pause here.

There was a memo from a respected Democratic polling firm that says Democrats who argue, who make the case that Biden is fit for office are in danger of being seen as dishonest, that it is going to hurt them electorally.

Do you worry about that? Do you see how your fellow House Democrats and colleagues on the Senate side worry about that?

IVEY: Well, I will let them speak for themselves on those kinds of issues.

But the point I was going to make, though, a moment ago was that the polls aren't bearing out this -- some kind of the-sky-is-falling scenario. Most of the polls that I have seen show that they're still margin-of-error numbers pretty much like they were before the debate. And I don't know that the Republicans helped themselves that much with the week that they just had.

[13:10:00]

Normally, coming, off a convention, the party has a big bounce. I don't think they're going to get that here. And it's been interesting that, even though he's had probably the worst three weeks that a presidential candidate's ever had in American politics, he's still in the game from a polling standpoint.

And we haven't even had a chance to focus back on his actual record, what he's accomplished in the first three years of his presidency and what he could do going forward.

KEILAR: Well, sure, but I would challenge you on that, because there are people calling for him to step aside who wouldn't argue at all about his record and about what he's accomplished. They would be in complete agreement with you on that.

When it comes to the polls and what you're seeing, so are you trying to argue that there has been no moment -- movement? Because he's doing worse than he was in the spring. There has been movement since the debate. There are concerning numbers even done since the assassination attempt on Saturday.

What do you say to concerns about that?

IVEY: Well, we may be looking at different polls, because I think there was movement in Virginia, for example, but I don't see the movement, certainly not a -- the floor falling out of the room kind of numbers in the other battleground states.

KEILAR: I'm talking about movement trending in the wrong direction...

IVEY: That's what I mean too.

KEILAR: ... the momentum...

IVEY: Yes.

(CROSSTALK)

KEILAR: ... and that obviously other Democrats are reading perhaps differently than you're reading. Why is that, do you think?

IVEY: Well, the polls -- we will set the polls to the side for a moment, because I really don't think you have seen numbers there where he's no longer a viable candidate. The momentum...

KEILAR: Donors believe differently. They're looking at internals, right? They have internals.

IVEY: Well, I can't speak be to those. But...

(CROSSTALK)

KEILAR: Well, I just want to be clear, we don't -- we don't use those.

IVEY: Yes.

(CROSSTALK)

KEILAR: But they certainly speak to what they are putting stock in.

And you just heard our report that they are saying they're going to withhold money for downballot races, because they're trying to mobilize members of Congress like yourself, like others to come out against this. They have real concerns.

IVEY: Let me address that and then back up to the other point.

But one of the things the Democratic Party has really fought about is to what extent we're a moneyed interest party and to what extent we're a party of the people. And being controlled by the donor class, I don't think sends the right message at this time.

For the voters we're trying to reach out to, swing voters, persuadable voters, African-American, not constant voters, but irregular voters, that's not the message that they want to hear. Some -- the big-dollar folks are telling we want somebody else.

And the 14 million people that cast votes for Joe Biden already, I don't know that they want to hear that their votes are going to be preempted because big-moneyed interests have a different view.

But to back up to a moment, to what you were saying a moment ago, there's momentum out there, but it's not necessarily coming from the voters. There's a lot of momentum from donors, media and the like that keep focusing on this issue. And I'm not saying it's unfair.

KEILAR: Eight Democrats today...

IVEY: OK. OK. Fine.

KEILAR: ... officials within the Biden campaign and the White House.

IVEY: My colleagues.

I don't know about the anonymous folks. I can't speak to that.

KEILAR: They're real people.

IVEY: OK. But real voters aren't moving in the way that you guys are talking about.

And we haven't even really had a chance to focus on the actual campaign messaging, which is talking about the scary things you heard this week coming out of Milwaukee and the positive things that we can do going forward.

The Project 2025 piece, which people are just starting to get a sense of -- for example, they want to eliminate the Department of Education. I think that's going to have an impact on voters. And when you listen to some of the things that you heard this week with respect to Trump and Vance, particularly on abortion rights, for example, I think that's going to be problematic.

If we can get to the point where we can get back to actually campaigning, give the president and then the surrogates a chance to speak about what we want to do for the future of America, especially with respect to pocketbook issues, I think he can get the numbers closed and we can win this race.

But we won't win it with the circular firing squad. That's for sure.

KEILAR: Well, we will see who wins out in that argument that is happening. We're watching it play out before our eyes.

Congressman Glenn Ivey, thank you so much for taking some time to be with us. We appreciate it.

IVEY: Thanks for having me.

KEILAR: A global tech outage with just crippling impacts, from airlines to banks to 911 services. So what caused this worldwide meltdown and how do you stop it from happening again?

And new details on what the Trump rally shooter searched online before the attack.

We're live from Pennsylvania. Stay with CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:18:47]

SANCHEZ: A massive cyber outage that at least some experts are saying is the largest in history continues to cause chaos and disruptions around the globe.

In fact, we have just learned that UPS and FedEx are both warning that there could be some service delays. It's also led to gridlock at airports worldwide. In the U.S. alone, more than 2,000 flights are canceled, thousands more delayed. KEILAR: And along with air travel, banks and other businesses have

been knocked offline. Hospitals, government agencies, even some 911 systems have all been impacted here.

Cybersecurity firm CrowdStrike says glitches in a routine software update cause this chaos, not any sort of cyberattack, which is quite alarming in itself. The company says the problem is gradually being fixed.

CNN's Isabel Rosales is live for us from Atlanta's Hartsfield-Jackson International Airport. It is the world's busiest airport indeed. What are you seeing there? What's the situation the ground?

ISABEL ROSALES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Brianna, Boris, people are understandably frustrated. They're anxious.

I have spoken with a lot of folks today. They're trying to make important functions, birthdays, funerals, weddings, heck, going back to work.

And this is what they're experiencing, having to wait in these massive lines, because, even if flights have resumed from the earlier ground stops that we saw this morning across all of the carriers, the problem is in processing these customers and getting them to check their luggage and getting them checked in and making their way over to TSA, which has been not impacted.

[13:20:21]

Today, this airport is not only the world's busiest, but also the site of the most cancellations in the U.S. So far, more than 600 flights here have been delayed and canceled. And, today, we're expecting 300,000 passengers to make their way through Atlanta Hartsfield- Jackson Airport.

Let me introduce you to Kimberly Medina over here, who has been visiting family, trying to get back home to L.A.

How would you describe your experience and others here today?

KIMBERLY MEDINA, AIR TRAVELER: I'm a little upset. I'm not going to lie. I just got a text message right now that they delayed my flight. So I'm going to -- allegedly, we're going to leave around 5:30, when we were supposed to leave at 3:30.

So, that does put a damper on my plans and trying to get home on time.

ROSALES: Yes. And, I mean, you're traveling with children. That makes this even more complicated, right?

MEDINA: Yes. They're a little hungry, frustrated. They want to rest, and can't really do that. We're just trying to check in our bags at this moment.

ROSALES: And what I have actually seen has been airline staff coming out, one with a with a megaphone yelling out an order of the flights that are taken off, prioritizing those, saying, hey, Los Angeles -- well, we wish Los Angeles -- Tampa, New Orleans, all of that.

(CROSSTALK)

ROSALES: And that's how they're having to manually check people in.

How would you describe the impacts this is having to travelers like yourself?

MEDINA: It's very different, very frustrating. This is something I haven't seen before. It's kind of like chaos, but kind of controlled chaos.

This is definitely something -- yes, you -- if you can stay home, please stay home. Don't travel right now.

(LAUGHTER)

ROSALES: And that has been the advice, stay home or start driving.

"I want to get home," somebody just yelled out.

Guys, the airport has also been helping out these passengers, giving out waters, just trying to make their time that they're having to wait here as easy as possible.

SANCHEZ: Yes, minimize the stress that already exists with traveling.

Isabel Rosales from Atlanta, thank you so much.

Let's discuss with Lance Ulanoff. He's the editor at large for TechRadar.

Lance, thanks so much for sharing part of your afternoon with us.

Let's start with CrowdStrike. What exactly is it? And, obviously, how does it play into this entire outage? It sounds like it was a glitch on an update? What does that mean?

LANCE ULANOFF, EDITOR AT LARGE, TECHRADAR: Right.

So, CrowdStrike is a cybersecurity firm that really serves the globe. It has thousands of customers. It serves a huge part of the U.S. government. It serves most states. So it's baked into a lot of infrastructure. And CrowdStrike is really about protecting Windows systems, right, Windows systems all over the world.

How do you do that? By constantly delivering updates that make sure that it gets ahead of the latest threats. So it's pretty regular for CrowdStrike to deliver these little software updates just to ensure that everybody can't be hacked or attacked.

And, of course, this was not a cyberattack at all. It was corrupted data that was delivered. Apparently, it was a corrupted file that was not caught coming out of CrowdStrike and was not caught going into all of these systems. And it went into all of these systems at once. And then, of course, the systems, Windows, in particular, crashed. We got the blue screen of death. We got a lot of systems that rely on Windows in that back end that went down. Xbox Live, WhatsApp, all of these different systems were unavailable.

And, of course, it affected systems like 911 in Alaska and flight systems and screens that you would just look at to get information. So all of that kind of went kaput because Windows went kaput, but really because CrowdStrike delivered a bad file.

KEILAR: I wonder, Lance, whether this is a -- whether it's like a flashing red alarm light or if it's sort of a silver lining in how it is revealing a vulnerability, when you're talking about how disparate the different entities are that are impacted here.

ULANOFF: Yes. Yes.

And there's been some talk over the last few hours about diversity of software, because CrowdStrike serves so many. And the way business and I.T. and infrastructure enterprise works is that they tend to look at, well, who are my customers -- my partners using? Maybe I will use the same thing.

So they all use the same thing. And one funny thing that happened along the way here is that a different security firm, Kaspersky, is like, this wouldn't have happened if you used us. But it's kind of ridiculous.

I mean, this is what people are using. I think the big alarm here is that when you have so many people using one system and they make one small mistake, it can have such a big ripple effect. A lot of us have been talking about, like, 24 years ago, we wondered what Y2K would really be like. Oh, guess what? This is what it would really be like.

[13:25:03]

SANCHEZ: I am wondering how this affects different sectors and even different companies different ways.

And I will give you a bit of a personal anecdote. I flew in this morning from Chicago after covering the RNC in Milwaukee the last few days. And there were folks that I was close to who were taking a flight on a different airline, same destination, almost the same exact departure time.

But because it was a different airline, they got stuck and I was able to fly out. Could you explain how this affects different airlines or different sectors in different ways?

ULANOFF: Well, you have to understand that CrowdStrike is dealing with the platform. It's dealing primarily with Windows and protection of that on these enterprise systems.

But Windows is a platform that means that it has about -- it's so disparate, like what kinds of software that each company is using or each business or piece of infrastructure is using. They're not all using the same thing. Even in the same industry, they're not all going to use the same thing.

So, different health care providers will use different systems. And some -- some may be more vulnerable to a glitch like this than others.

SANCHEZ: Wow, that is fascinating. I'm fortunate to be here and I'm fortunate to share the afternoon with you.

(LAUGHTER)

SANCHEZ: Lance Ulanoff, thanks so much for the perspective. Appreciate it.

ULANOFF: It's my pleasure.

SANCHEZ: Of course.

KEILAR: I'm fortunate. I mean, I'm very glad you're here to anchor for three hours with me.

(LAUGHTER)

KEILAR: That would have been rough stuff.

SANCHEZ: You didn't have to do it alone. Yes, yes, that's tough. That's tough.

(LAUGHTER)

SANCHEZ: We have plenty more news to come, including the breaking news, the number of Democrats calling on the president to quit this race growing seemingly by the minute. Look at your screen. We're now at 30 lawmakers.

Stay with CNN. We're following the latest.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)