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Polls Show Harris with Edge; Rep. Barbara Lee (D-CA) is Interviewed about Harris and the Democratic Party; Remembering Phil Donahue. Aired 9:30-10a ET

Aired August 19, 2024 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:30:00]

HARRY ENTEN, CNN SENIOR DATA REPORTER: Maybe there's a little (INAUDIBLE). But I think this week in particular could be a good chance for Kamala Harris to take that ball, take that talking point away from Republicans and say, this is where I am, this is what I stand for. And maybe it's not necessarily what you might have expected from Joe Biden.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: So, people will be shocked to learn, Harry, that occasionally you and I talk offline.

ENTEN: We do.

BERMAN: Luckily, it's usually about polling. It's usually about what we talk about online.

ENTEN: Occasionally.

BERMAN: One of the things that I've been interested in, and I asked you is, that Republicans are accusing Harris of changing positions on a lot of issues. And she has changed positions on issues. In the old days they would have called that flip-flopping.

And one of the things I've been curious about is, does that hurt candidates anymore when they run for office? What evidence are you seeing?

ENTEN: Well, what's so interesting is those "New York Times"/Sienna College poll that came out from those sunbelt battleground states essentially have the candidates flip-flopped on the issues that matter. And what do we see? In fact, a majority of those likely voters in those sun belt battleground states that, in fact, Kamala Harris has flip-flop on those issues that matter. And yet she is doing significantly better in those states than Joe Biden was back in May. She's tied in the aggregate of these states. Joe Biden was actually down by nine points.

Now, what I will note is that a near majority also say that Donald Trump has flip-flopped on issues that matter. So, I'm not quite sure that that talking point lands is strong when you have somebody like Donald Trump who has sort of been all over the map over the last 20 years. Yes, he has been a Republican nominee for president now three times in a row, but before that, I don't think a lot of Americans necessarily knew where he was. And I'm not sure Donald Trump necessarily knew where he was.

So, the charges against Harris, I don't think, are sticking. I'm not sure they necessarily matter because as Donald Trump has kind of shown, you could say one thing 20 years ago, and another thing today, and the voters will believe what you say today.

BERMAN: Very interesting. All right, Harry Enten, thank you so much. Appreciate it.

ENTEN: Thank you, John.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: The times have changed, I think is the way to put that.

BERMAN: Something's blowing in the wind.

SIDNER: Exactly.

Joining me now, Democratic campaign consultant Tim Hogan and CNN political commentator and former Trump White House communications director, Alyssa Farah Griffin.

Thank you both for being here.

We just heard Harry talking about, you know, this flip-flopping issue. But he also went into that poll that said that less people know exactly the policies that Kamala Harris stands behind compared to Trump. So, why is it we are seeing more people in these polls, although within the margin of error, but more people saying they would vote for Harris.

TIM HOGAN, DEMOCRATIC CAMPAIGN CONSULTANT: Yes. I think what you've seen is when Joe Biden passed the torch, when Kamala Harris stepped up as the nominee, you saw a consolidation of the Democratic base. You saw younger voters, black voters, Latino voters saying they're excited about her candidacy. And so we've seen those sunbelt states shift back towards Harris.

But you've also seen independent voters, those double-hater voters, people who are swing voters, show some excitement for Harris as well. And it's not that she's completely undefined, right?

SIDNER: Right.

HOGAN: She has the benefit of some of the policies of the Biden administration she can tout as successes and she can also talk about new policy moving forward, like she rolled out her economic policy on Friday. So, I think people have a sense of who she is and her values. She's been good in communicating that. And I think that is what has brought voters back into the fold.

BERMAN: You know, Tim just mentioned the double-haters and the independents. The double-haters we usually refer to are people who didn't like Biden or Trump. ALYSSA FARAH GRIFFIN, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I'm a self-described double hater, yes.

BERMAN: All right. So, how - how -

GRIFFIN: Disliker at this point.

BERMAN: That's right, we don't hate. How does this convention then, do you think, how should it appeal to the independent/double-hater?

GRIFFIN: So, anytime I watch a convention, I remind folks, there's the audience in the convention hall. They're with you. These are your delegates. They're thrilled to be here. But there's the millions of folks at home, many of them undecided voters, who maybe they liked some Trump policies but they don't like his character or personality, or they're just exhausted. This is the third time we've done it. We don't necessarily want to do it again.

So, I'm looking at, what are the messages that are meant to resonate with those more moderate voters, not just playing to the progressive left flank? And Kamala Harris has proved pretty apt at doing this in a way that I don't feel like Biden was quite as much. She's working in language deliberately targeting independents and how she frames things. So, I'm curious, I'm looking for that. I'm looking for, you know, you've got Congressman Adam Kinzinger speaking, a Republican, who is now supporting her. So, how is she trying to reach those folks.

And by the way, she's going to be appearing here, but Donald Trump's on the campaign trail. So, there's going to be a lot to respond to and for her surrogate to be pushing back on. And as we've seen, when he's on the trail lately, it's not a disciplined message. It's not 2016 where it's build the wall, build the economy, you know, rebuild the middle class. It's all over the map.

So, she's in a really strong position going into this.

SIDNER: I do want to talk about what Donald Trump has been saying, because I'm sure he is hoping to get some attention, and which he will by going out and making speech after speech after speech. He's attacking the Democratic Party and Harris again over and over again on the economy and on personality. But he's also saying this. And this has happened quite a few times as well.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP (R), FORMER U.S. PRESIDENT AND 2024 PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: A group of people that have no idea what the hell they're doing. Are you better off with Kamala and Biden than you were under President Donald J. Trump?

[09:35:03]

I don't think so. You know, they do poll on this stuff and I'm at like 93 percent. And I said, so why are we having an election? They didn't have an election. Why are we having an election?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: I guess, Alyssa, to you. Why does he care? I mean if he feels like he's the best candidate for the job, why is there this constant attack about Harris being now in place of Biden?

GRIFFIN: This is not the race he wanted to run. He wanted to run against Biden. He planned everything around it. He thought this was going to be about age and strength versus, you know, the 80-year-old president. And now it's completely flipped on its head. He's also - I've mentioned this before, he's used to kind of being the pop culture icon in the presidential race. He appeared on SNL in 2016. He's this larger than life cultural figure. But Kamala Harris has kind of consumed that in this race. You've got young people, you've got celebrity endorsements, and I don't think he knows how to navigate that.

But there's also a factor, he is just not who he was in 2016. There is a lack of discipline - and, by the way, he's never been the most eloquent person out there, but there's a lack of message discipline. He goes on these side tangents. He's talking about her appearance. It's so unhelpful with the very voters he needs to target, women in the suburbs, independents and moderates.

BERMAN: How do you treat him then, this week especially, Tim? I mean, you know, because there's been this division? And Chris Cillizza, I'm looking at Twitter right now, is just laying it out. I mean, to an extent, Biden has always framed him as this dark, menacing figure. Harris-Walz, a little bit more comic.

HOGAN: Right.

BERMAN: What do you think we'll see here?

HOGAN: I think it's both. I think it is, they're a little weird and creepy, as Tim Walz said and rolled out that messaging. I think it is also, though, a message about preserving democracy. I think Joe Biden's going to talk today about, he beat Donald Trump in 2020 on the message of, you know, the battle for the soul of the nation, and he did preserve democracy. But it's about moving forward now, defeating him once again. And that's what Kamala Harris can do.

I will just say, you know, no matter what Donald Trump does, if he is - if he is on the stump delivering his message and talking about policies, a lot of the policy that he's talking about is also extremely unpopular, talking about a 10 percent to 20 percent tariff hike that could lead to $4,000 in taxes on families. He talked - you know, he - his policy in the past has been to repeal the Affordable Care Act. And you have someone in J.D. Vance, a partner with him, who's not the most charismatic individual. I mean you talk about rolling out a VP candidate that has absolutely bombed. It's - it's him, right? He's talking about childless cat ladies. He was on a podcast where they were pontificating on the, quote, "whole purpose of the postmenopausal women." They can't talk like normal people. And so that is, I think, the biggest liability for Trump right now is they just can't drive a message.

SIDNER: Tim Hogan, Alyssa Farah Griffin, thank you both so much for coming up - getting up early and coming in here with us.

All right, today, disgraced former Congressman George Santos is expected to plead guilty to campaign fraud charges. We're waiting to get the details of that plea deal.

Plus, a lot more ahead from the DNC.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:42:15]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

GOV. TIM WALZ (D-MN), VICE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: Vice President Harris, as we said, is bringing back what we all know, this politic can be not just against something - we know what the threat is from them - but about a positive future. And this idea that politics can be done with joy and kindness and decency. And you can do all those things and skill beat the hell out of somebody at the ballot box. You can do all those things.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: That was Vice Presidential Candidate Tim Walz speaking to Pennsylvania delegates.

Now, back here in Chicago at the Democratic National Convention, we are expecting to hear tonight from President Biden, officially passing the torch to his vice president, Kamala Harris. Recent polling indicates a tight race between Harris and former President Donald Trump, although she is up in several battleground states. But a new CBS survey indicates voters say they have a clearer picture of exactly what Donald Trump stands for in the race than Harris herself.

With me now, Democratic Congresswoman Barbara Lee of California.

We were just talking in the break. You have been to so many conventions. There are some folks that aren't - weren't even born in the first conventions that you went to. Give - give me some sense - not to age us both. Give me some sense of what you're expecting tonight that's different than what you have seen over these many years since I think, what, 1972?

REP. BARBARA LEE (D-CA): "72. Sara, thanks a lot for having me.

You know, I got involved in politics through the campaign - the presidential campaign of the Congresswoman Shirley Chisholm, who ran for president in '72. And I registered to vote then and helped organize her campaign. Went to Miami as the Shirley Chisholm delegate. And the rest is history. I've been to every single convention except for one where, of course, it was so exciting when Reverend Jackson ran. I was a delegate and '84 and '88. And also with President Obama. And every single convention, again, except '72.

At this convention, it's different. All of these conventions have been extremely exciting because all of them were about more - a more inclusive democracy and including more people who never had a seat at the table and who did not participate necessarily with the Democratic Party. But at this one, I think we see more hope, more joy. And, you know, I've - we've honored Reverend Jackson last night. And I mentioned the wisdom of him talking about early on, keep hope alive.

And I think because of Vice President Kamala Harris and Governor Walz, we're seeing now a burst of excitement and energy, but also people who want to work to make sure they win.

And I think that is extremely important because the election, of course, is going to be tight. And people, though, at this convention understand the threats to taking away our freedoms.

[09:45:03]

They understand that Vice President Kamala Harris has been part of an agenda, the Biden-Harris agenda, that has delivered for the American people. And she has an agenda herself to move forward to make life better for everyone, reduce the cost of living, of course, housing is the big issue, creating affordable housing, pathway to home ownership. And so people are excited about the issues and are excited about doing the work. And that's important so we can win and defeat Donald Trump.

SIDNER: Congresswoman, I'm curious what you think of - there's been so many attacks from Donald Trump and from J.D. Vance about Harris, about her - her policies now, but about her personally. And we haven't heard a lot of talk about her being the first woman, the first African American woman, south Asian woman, who will be at the top of the ticket that we have - that we have ever seen as this historic moment. And she doesn't concentrate that - on that either. Although with Hillary Clinton, it was very much about her being potentially the first female president.

Why do you think that is? And what do you think about that messaging?

LEE: Sure, Sara. And you know, as it's very obvious, first of all. But secondly, there have been so many who have paved the way, such as Fannie Lou Hamer, Sojourner Truth, Harriet Tubman, Hillary Clinton, Shirley Chisholm. And so we've come to this point now where the work and the sacrifices of so many black women and so many women and so many young people have gotten us to this point. And so this is historic. It's historic for me personally. This is a book end from 1972.

And so, you know, also, I think, the country is clear about the fact that we need new leadership and we need a new perspective. Vice President Harris brings a perspective. She brings a lens that has not been in the White House. And we know to solve these problems, we have to have new energy, new lens, new perspectives a new vision for where we go. But she has the experience. She is prepared. And she's ready. And she's from Oakland, California, born in my congressional district, raised in Berkeley. And so she's got the spirit.

SIDNER: I knew you were going to bring that up. And I know you know her personally. And she's from the bay, as people say who live there. I do want to ask you, what would be the thing that you would be most worried about, mistakes that could be made tonight or in the next several nights as this convention gets underway, that you don't want to see happen?

LEE: Sara, you know, I don't focus on the glass half empty. I look at the glass half full. Of course conventions, and I want to salute Migyon Moore and all of those who have gotten us to this point in a phenomenon away. And so, we have to look at the fact that this convention provides a venue for organizing the party and unifying the party. Look at the alliances and the coalitions that have been built. And look at all of the issues that are being raised. Look at the speakers. Look at the young people who are enthusiastic, who will be here.

And so I say we need to focus on the positive. I know the negative and the glass half empty of course is always there. But I think if we focus on the joy, as Governor Walz talks about, and the fact that we have to work hard and we have to unify and keep our eyes on the prize. That's the goal coming out of this convention so that we can make sure that we defeat Donald Trump, who's trying to take away our rights, the freedom to reproductive rights, our voting rights, you name it, and move forward and win. And win big. And that's, I think, what the message should be out of this convention. And people are ready to roll and ready to work and excited about that. So, I'm looking at the glass half full. And I think that we're going to do it.

SIDNER: All right, Congresswoman Barbara Lee, thank you so much. We will see you out here in Chicago in just a bit.

LEE: Thank you.

SIDNER: We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:53:29]

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Breaking news just in. Legendary talk show host Phil Donahue has died at the age of 88. That's according to "People" and NBC News. They are reporting they've received a family statement that he died last night at home following a long illness.

And take a look at that video. Just a few months ago, Donahue was awarded the Presidential Medal of Freedom by President Biden.

Here's a look back at his life.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PHIL DONAHUE: After 29 years and more than 6,000 shows, here we are.

SIDNER (voice over): Phil Donahue changed the face of daytime television forever with a talk show that tackled controversial issues in front of a live audience.

DONAHUE: We were so different. Everything else around us was a soap opera or a game show.

SIDNER (voice over): Donahue honed his broadcasting skills early in his career as a radio and TV news anchor in his native Ohio. His big break came in 1967 when Dayton's WLWD TV launched "The Phil Donahue Show."

Donahue had the groundbreaking idea of asking the studio audience for questions.

DONAHUE: Suddenly people were watching people just like themselves stand up, kick tires, complain. And we found that we liked that.

SIDNER (voice over): "The Phil Donahue Show" built a reputation as a forum for hot button topics like equal rights for women.

DONAHUE: Issues that women cared about and talked about among themselves, we were on the air talking about them.

I realized that people in the audience were asking better questions than I was.

SIDNER (voice over): The show moved to Chicago, and later New York, all the while expanding to more stations across America.

[09:55:00]

National syndication meant higher profile guests. Among them, his future wife, actress Marlo Thomas. In 1977, audiences watched the couple fall in love live on stage.

DONAHUE: You are really fascinating. And you are -

MARLO THOMAS: No, but you are wonderful. I said it when we were off the air and I want to say, you are loving and generous and you like women and it's a pleasure. And whoever the woman in your life is very lucky.

DONAHUE: Well, thank you very much.

She was just obviously a very exciting person. She was not only gorgeous, she had the great facility, language, and she had opinions and he was a feminist. She was somebody you could argue with.

SIDNER (voice over): Donahue paved the way for daytime talk show hosts like Geraldo Rivera, Jerry Springer, and Oprah Winfrey, but soon began losing viewers to his new lineup. In 1996, after years of declining ratings, "The Phil Donahue Show" ended.

DONAHUE: Well, thank you. I am flattered. You may be seated.

SIDNER (voice over): Donahue returned in 2002 with a short-lived interview program on MSNBC. The left-leaning broadcaster claimed his outspoken opposition to the Iraq War lead to the show's cancellation.

In later years, he appeared as a political commentator and produced the 2007 anti-war documentary "Body of War." UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let your voice be heard.

SIDNER (voice over): Phil Donahue, daytime talk pioneer and an enthusiastic examiner of society's thorniest questions.

DONAHUE: I think everybody ought to have a talk show. It's a wonderful education.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

BOLDUAN: Phil Donahue was 88 years old.

Thank you all so much for joining us today. This is CNN NEWS CENTRAL. We are live all week in New York and Chicago for the DNC.

"CNN NEWSROOM" is up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)