Return to Transcripts main page

CNN News Central

Special Counsel Files New January 6 Indictment Against Trump; Harris And Walz Kick Off Bus Tour In Battleground Georgia; Israel Launches Large-Scale Military Operation In West Bank. Aired 7:30-8a ET

Aired August 28, 2024 - 07:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[07:30:00]

ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST, FORMER ASSISTANT U.S. ATTORNEY, SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK, FORMER FEDERAL AND STATE PROSECUTOR: That's been removed from the indictment, as have several of Donald Trump's talks with his White House advisers.

Basically, what Jack Smith is trying to do is conform the indictment to the immunity ruling that Justice Jackson was just talking about and cast everything Trump did as not his official act as president, which would be immune, but his private act as a candidate.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Who gets to decide and when if they did enough here to comport with the Supreme Court ruling?

HONIG: Ultimately, the Supreme Court. So here's what --

BERMAN: Funny how that works.

HONIG: Yeah, right, and it will always come back to them.

Here's what will happen. So Jack Smith has now voluntarily pulled part of his case out. Now, starting later this week, we're going to go through the process where the parties argue about it. And Donald Trump's team is not going to say wonderful, we're happy with --

BERMAN: Yeah.

HONIG: -- the superceding indictment as is. They're going to say all if it's immune. And then Judge Chutkan is going to have to sort it out. But whatever she decides, Trump has the right to appeal to the mid-level Court of Appeals and then to ask the Supreme Court to take it -- importantly, before trial, which is why if trial happens in this case ever, it's not going to be for quite a while.

BERMAN: So not before the election --

HONIG: No way.

BERMAN: -- to be 100 percent clear.

HONIG: Yes. BERMAN: I think the tenor of the entire discussion in the last few

months about all the cases about Donald Trump has been oh, if he wins the election --

HONIG: Right.

BERMAN: -- slash -- when he wins the election, all these cases go away. Well, the election looks a lot different now, potentially, than it might have a couple of months ago when Joe Biden was still running. Trump could lose.

HONIG: Yeah.

BERMAN: What happens if he loses to these cases?

HONIG: It's such a good reminder of the stakes for Donald Trump the individual. Because if he wins, he's president and these cases --

BERMAN: Yeah.

HONIG: -- all go away or get put on indefinite long-term hold. But if he loses, he's going to have to contend with all four of these cases.

Now, the case we've been talking about -- the January 6 case -- that'll take a while to go --

BERMAN: Um-hum.

HONIG: -- through the process we just discussed, but I think it will ultimately make it to trial. But you and I are going to be standing here in 2026 --

BERMAN: Yeah.

HONIG: -- possibly talking about that trial.

The other federal case -- the classified documents case -- currently dismissed. Trump filed a -- or excuse me, Jack Smith filed a brief a couple of days ago asking to revive it, and I think he'll win on that. I think he'll get that case reinstated. But again, we're looking at trial late 2025-2026.

I think both state cases are in serious trouble. Obviously, the Manhattan case is over. We have, potentially, sentencing in a few weeks. But I think there's going to be a major appeal issue. I think there's a good chance that case gets reversed. And the Georgia case, I think we've seen the last of. I think that case is going to get thrown out.

BERMAN: But these federal cases -- if Donald Trump loses --

HONIG: Yes.

BERMAN: -- he's facing serious trials, and he'll have a lot of time on his hands if he's not president.

HONIG: Yeah. If he loses, I think it's very likely he's going to have two federal trials in late 2025, early 2026.

BERMAN: And one other point I want to make here because it's so extraordinary in this discussion over the last 24 hours about Jack Smith filing this superceding indictment in the federal election case. In the classified documents case, the judge -- you know Aileen Cannon has ruled the special counsel is a sham to begin with.

HONIG: Right.

BERMAN: That you can't exist constitutionally. So you've got one judge saying this whole thing doesn't count while the other case in a parallel term is going on full steam.

HONIG: So there are some interesting tactics -- strategy at play here by Donald Trump's team. Remember, he's got two different federal indictments, both of them brought by special counsel.

BERMAN: Yeah.

HONIG: Actually, the first one that dropped was the D.C. one --

BERMAN: Um-hum.

HONIG: -- the Judge Chutkan case. Donald Trump never made this argument about the special counsel to Judge Chutkan. Instead, he waited and made it only to Judge Cannon on the docs case, and he won with her. Now again, I think that's going to be reversed.

But I think what we have here is a pretty clear case of judge shopping. I mean, as between the two judges, it seems quite clear Trump's team said let's hold off on the D.C. case. We don't think we have a favorable judge there. Let's bring it to Judge Cannon down in Florida. They were right. But again, I do think she's going to be reversed on this.

BERMAN: It just shows what a real outlier it is judicially -- that ruling --

HONIG: Yeah.

BERMAN: -- compared to everything else that we've ever seen.

HONIG: I guess one upside of having multiple indictments is you do get to pick which judge you like better for certain issues, if there was an upside to this.

BERMAN: Elie Honig, great to see you.

HONIG: Yeah.

BERMAN: Thank you very much.

HONIG: Yeah, all right.

BERMAN: Sara.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: All right.

This morning, we're learning new details about an incident that turned physical at Arlington National Cemetery during Donald Trump's visit there on Monday. It happened while Trump was in section 60, the burial site for recent U.S. casualties. Trump suggesting on Truth Social that the problem stemmed from his campaign's use of photography.

CNN's Alayna Treene has more on that from Washington. What happened here?

ALAYNA TREENE, CNN REPORTER: Right. Well, Sara, so a lot of back-and- forth from both sides, the Arlington National Cemetery but also the Trump campaign, on what exactly did happen.

But what we know is that some people who worked at the cemetery had blocked members of Donald Trump's team -- members of his campaign on Monday from attending and participating in some of the wreath ceremony when Donald Trump was laying some of the wreaths on Monday to honor the 13 fallen U.S. servicemembers who were at Kabul's Abbey Gate during the chaotic withdrawal from Afghanistan.

Now, I'm going to break down some of this for you. So the big question here is about whether or not Donald Trump was able to participate in partisan events, as the cemetery calls it, while at that visit, particularly in this area called section 30.

[07:35:05]

Now, we did hear from Donald Trump. He posted, as you mentioned, Sara, on Truth Social. And as you said, he did seem to argue that perhaps this was because of photography. This is what he wrote on Truth Social, and they also included a post or a letter from the families who said that they had supported this effort.

He had said, "We had given our approval for President Trump's official videographer and photographer to attend the event, ensuring these sacred moments of remembrance were respectfully captured and so we can cherish these memories forever." And that is from the families of some of the servicemembers who were killed during that Afghanistan withdrawal a couple of years ago.

Now, I will also add that the cemetery, for their part, had said in a statement to CNN that federal law prohibits political campaign or election-related activities at Arlington National -- at Army national military cemeteries -- excuse me.

So that's where some of the dispute is here.

Now, I will say NPR was the first to report some of this. They had said that they had heard from someone at Arlington National Cemetery who said that there was a physical altercation between members of the cemetery staff and Donald Trump's campaign. Trump's campaign has pushed back on that. They said that there was no physical altercation. However, a member did block them from participating in this.

Now, we also did hear from Chris LaCivita. This is Donald Trump's co- campaign manager. He's also someone who is a veteran.

He said, "President Trump was there on the invitation of the Abbey Gate Gold Star families to honor their loved ones who gave the ultimate sacrifice for their country. For a despicable individual to physically prevent President Trump's team from accompanying him to this solemn event is a disgrace and does not deserve to represent the hallowed grounds of Arlington National Cemetery."

So again, Sara, a lot of back-and-forth here. I do think the big takeaway is that this was a moment that, of course, Donald Trump's -- they recognize was a solemn moment. This was something to honor the family members of the fallen soldiers and has been a bit tainted now by this dispute over whether or not Donald Trump had violated federal law by making this a political event -- Sara.

SIDNER: We also -- beyond this -- and that's Chris LaCivita's video there of him laying down those flowers.

We also saw this very friendly interview with Dr. Phil and President Trump. What have you learned from that?

TREENE: Right. Well, we've seen -- Donald Trump has sat with Dr. Phil before and you're right, it is a friendly interview. It's always interesting to see him when he's sitting down with people that he feels like he can be more candid with, he's more comfortable with. That is kind of the vibe that we got from this interview last night.

But at one point, Donald Trump did talk about his attempted -- the attempted assassination on him back in Butler in July, and he seemed to hint that he believes that Joe Biden and Kamala Harris bear some responsibility for that. Take a listen to what he said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, (R) PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: When this happened, people would ask whose fault is it? I think, to a certain extent, it's Biden's fault and Harris' fault. And I'm the opponent. Look, they were weaponizing government against me. They brought in the whole DOJ to try and get me.

They weren't too interested in my health and safety. I would be if I were in their position, but they weren't very interested. But they were always making it, from what I understood -- and I could feel it. They were making it very difficult to have proper staffing in terms of Secret Service.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TREENE: OK, Sara. So, first of all, I just want to be clear that there is no evidence whatsoever that President Joe Biden or Vice President Kamala Harris have tried to purposefully make it more difficult with -- as it relates to Secret Service staffing for Donald Trump.

But the point about the rhetoric is something we actually have heard Donald Trump and many Republicans argue that it was the rhetoric and the language that Democrats use against him that contributed to this person attempting to shoot Donald Trump.

And so, a lot to unpack there. I think you're going to probably continue to hear some of this. And as we know -- as we move closer to November, a lot of these attacks are getting more personal, more nasty, and that's kind of where Donald Trump laid this yesterday.

SIDNER: All right, Alayna Treene. Thank you so much -- John Berman.

BERMAN: All right. So, Sara, as you know, Vice President Harris and Gov. Tim Walz are beginning a bus tour of Georgia today focusing on southeastern Georgia. And one thing you will notice about this area, a lot of red. A lot of Republican counties where they're going, and that is by design. Why?

Well, you will remember, the margin in Georgia in 2020 when Joe Biden did win was only 11,000 votes. That's not a lot. In 2016, Donald Trump won by 211,000 votes. So Democrats really, if you think about it, made up 220,000 votes.

[07:40:06]

Where did they get all those votes? Well, everyone knows that in Fulton County, around Atlanta, Democrats tend to do really well. You can see Joe Biden won here by 250,000 votes. Hillary Clinton did win there but only by about 180,000 votes, so a 70-vote -- 70,000-vote margin there.

You might think oh, Democrats can make up all the ground they need just around Atlanta. That's not really the case. They've got to keep the margins pretty slender even in some of these Republican areas.

So if you think about the southeast, what they need to do is focus on, for instance, Effingham County here. You can see Donald Trump beat Joe Biden there by about 16,000 votes. Hillary Clinton actually had it closer. She only lost by 13,000 votes. So Democrats want to try to keep these margins down, in a way, so they have less work to do in the very blue Atlanta area.

We know that the Harris-Walz team is going to end up in Chatham County. That's where Savannah is. This is a county they won in 2020, you can see, by about 25,000 votes. That is a stretched-out lead from 2016 where Hillary Clinton won just by about 17,000 votes.

So as they go county-to-county, Sara, it really is all about the margins.

SIDNER: Can I just say that was so impressive, John. You know what? John King, eat your heart out. John Berman's the man.

BERMAN: Magic fingers.

SIDNER: That was --

BERMAN: That's what they say.

SIDNER: I'm very impressed with how smooth that was. There's no way I could have done that.

BERMAN: Smooth with a "B."

SIDNER: Smooth. Thank you, John.

Joining us now is CNN political commentator and Democratic strategist Maria Cardona, and Republican strategist and former RNC communications director Doug Heye. Thank you both for being here. Doug's in person. Maria, what's going on? Like, what, you don't like me anymore? You're just not going to show up in the studio?

MARIA CARDONA, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST: I'm sorry, Sara. I missed the train. I missed the train. I'm sorry.

DOUG HEYE, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST, FORMER RNC COMMUNICATIONS DIRECTOR: The text messages she sends about you, just they're awful (PH).

SIDNER: I know, they're awful -- it's true -- but they're correct.

Let us talk about something that we just heard from Donald Trump blaming Kamala Harris and Joe Biden, president at the time of his attempted assassination.

Doug, why is he doing this?

HEYE: I think the ultimate question is why because --

SIDNER: That is the question.

HEYE: -- it doesn't serve a real purpose.

I was -- I was in North Carolina Sunday and Monday, and I saw Donald Trump campaign ads and they were on message. They talked about the economy. They talked about prices -- the things that voters are talking about.

SIDNER: Yeah.

HEYE: What he said on Dr. Phil is just sort of that grievance tour that doesn't win over new voters and turns away potential voters who maybe don't love Trump, but they don't love Harris or the Biden-Harris agenda or administration either. Those are the voters he needs to talk to. And by going in these weird directions, which he's done for years, he limits his ability to do so.

SIDNER: Maria, what did you make of this blame game that happened during that very friendly interview -- who he has talked to before, Dr. Phil?

CARDONA: Desperation, Sara. That is exactly what's going on with the Trump campaign. That's exactly what's going on with Trump. They have not been able to land on any effective strategy or attack that has stuck to Kamala Harris and Tim Walz since they became the nominee for president and vice president. And that is driving them crazy.

Not only that, but to go to Doug's point, this is Donald Trump's go-to move. His message -- or his ads might be on message. His campaign might go blue in the face telling him to stick to the message when he's at rallies, when he's in these interviews, but he is unable to do so. We know that about him.

We know that he likes to go to the division, to the fear, to the hatred, to the retribution, right? That is -- those are the politics that are in his DNA. And it does alienate key coalitions of voters that he's going to need to win.

Frankly, it's why the Harris campaign is pushing for unmuted mics so that the country can see Donald Trump in his -- all of his delusional glory because that's who he is at his core. That is what he will be if he gets another four years in the White House. That is what makes him so unfit to be President of the United States.

SIDNER: Let's talk about what's happened with special counsel Jack Smith. He has sort of redone this indictment and put it back into the public sphere and put it back into the courts.

How is Donald Trump going to defend this? I can see some of the talking points already happening and it does give vibes of what happened with Hillary and Comer --

HEYE: Um-hum.

SIDNER: -- back in the day -- with the FBI director at the time. But this was already an indictment that the Supreme Court said cannot go as is, so he just changed it around.

What does this do to Trump politically?

HEYE: Well look, Trump's going to Trump, you know, as we talked about with the Dr. Phil interview. That's what he does. He tries to throw dust in the air to cloud things up.

[07:45:05]

But this comes with a political risk for him and it's because it goes to that chaos agent. And if you're -- if you're one of those voters who you're just tired of chaos, this doesn't help Trump reach those voters.

Again, he can hit them with so many issues where the Biden and Harris administration are underwater. It starts with the economy --

SIDNER: Prices, yeah.

HEYE: -- and prices. It goes to the border. There's a lot of areas for Donald Trump to be on offense and on the attack. This distraction that -- ultimately, that's -- I think that's the issue.

He's clearly not going to be in trial or convicted, or anything like that between now and the election --

SIDNER: Yes HEYE: -- so it's the conversation around that that distracts, as Trump can do himself sometimes, from what could be a winning message for him.

SIDNER: Maria, I do have a question for you because both Donald Trump and Kamala Harris have flip-flopped. It's become a thing that isn't a career killer anymore in politics.

CARDONA: Yes.

SIDNER: We've certainly seen Donald Trump change his policies and mind multiple times, and now we're seeing the same from Kamala Harris. Some of the things she's said about fracking. Some of the things she's said about the wall. Some of the things she's said about cars and electric vehicles. She's changing her policies there.

Does that hurt her as voters look at the records of the two of them?

CARDONA: No, I don't think so at all because I think there's a big difference. The positions that you are talking about, Sara, were four years ago, five years ago when she first ran for president. And I think a very compelling argument that she can make is that as any strong, smart, competent public servant does, they learn from their lived experiences.

She has had 3 1/2 years of a lived experience of being vice president and understanding how key policies affect the American electorate. So hence, she has learned, she has evolved. She has changed her positions as she has come into new knowledge -- as she has come into that lived experience.

And so she has talked to voters for the last 3 1/2 years, as she has focused on what she now understands really helps them. Really helps these American families -- middle-class voters, working-class voters -- and understand how to really help them take that step to again, like she says, not only get by but to get ahead.

I think that's an incredibly compelling argument versus Donald Trump who says one thing today, flip-flops tomorrow depending on who the last person was to whisper in his ear. That is not a way to govern. That is a way to continue with the chaos and continue with the crazy.

And so I think that is a true contrast that I think she can really use to her advantage as she talks about where she is now on the policies that she is going to push, along with Tim Walz, on issues that really expand the middle class, protect our rights and freedoms, and focus on giving Americans a better life for themselves and their children.

SIDNER: Maria --

HEYE: Sara, I think you had it right. They both have flip-flopped here. And, yes, Kamala Harris has had a 3 1/2-year lived experience in the vice presidency that most of us won't know about, but it's the last 3 1/2 weeks where she's come to these new positions.

All of a sudden, she realized fracking is important for Pennsylvania. That's a flip-flop --

SIDNER: Yeah.

HEYE: -- and she's going to deal with that.

SIDNER: Doug Heye, Maria Cardona --

CARDONA: That wasn't in the last 3 1/2 weeks though, Doug. I mean, that --

HEYE: Four and a half?

CARDONA: -- that's a lived experience in the last 3 1/2 years. Did you talk to her about fracking before she became the nominee?

SIDNER: Maria is giving the platform --

HEYE: I'll give you four.

SIDNER: -- on something that they can do. It's called evolve.

HEYE: Yes.

SIDNER: I think we've heard the word evolve. We will see if they use your language, Maria.

HEYE: And in politics, my candidate evolved, your candidate flip- flops.

SIDNER: Correct. That is the way it works.

Thank you both so much. Appreciate your time.

CARDONA: You can also -- you can also evolve if you're the party that actually believes in evolution. That helps.

SIDNER: Oh, lord, here we go. Doug's like he's not touching that.

HEYE: I'm not going there.

SIDNER: Thank you two. It's too early for this, man. All right.

Coming up, Travis Kelce bets on love. Why some think his latest investment includes a nod to girlfriend Taylor Smith -- Swift. Oh, I got that wrong. The Swifties are going to come for me this morning.

All right. Also, all eyes are on NVIDIA. What today's earnings report could tell us about the future of AI.

(COMMERCIAL)

[07:53:40]

BERMAN: New this morning, Hamas is calling for "general mobilization and escalation" after Israel launched a major military operation in the West Bank. Palestinian health authorities say multiple people have been killed in what Israel calls a counterterror operation.

CNN anchor and chief national security analyst Jim Sciutto is in Tel Aviv. Jim, what are you learning about this operation this morning?

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR AND CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Well John, it's the biggest Israeli operation in the West Bank since the October 7 attacks. Israeli officials, the IDF, say they're going after what they call Islamic Iranian terror infrastructure. The allegation they're making is that weapons are coming into the West Bank funded by -- facilitated by Iran, and that this attack is intended to target that.

The death toll at this point stands at at least nine.

And what we're hearing now publicly in response from Hamas is Hamas is calling for a mobilization of its supporters and fighters in the West Bank. So it's a significant operation and that reaction from Hamas is significant.

Israeli officials make the point that the terror environment -- the threat is real now. You may remember a little more than a week ago there was a suicide bombing here in Tel Aviv where only the bomber was killed. So the Israeli officials -- Israeli officials are justifying it based on the nature of the threat and what they say is the infrastructure building in the West Bank.

[07:55:07]

BERMAN: Where does this put the hostage and ceasefire negotiations?

SCIUTTO: Yeah. Listen, you know, I've covered so many negotiations like this and oftentimes you will see attacks like this -- operations like this in the midst of sensitive negotiations and it's hard to say which way it will cut. Will it disrupt those negotiations because it -- well, when you have Israel and Hamas carrying out operations like this against each other it certainly can make it harder for negotiators.

Can you make the argument that it allows Israeli negotiators to show toughness in terms of counterterror operations and therefore make it easier to make concessions to bring a deal across the finish line? Maybe. But let's be frank. Those negotiations are quite sensitive right now. It's not clear that they are making progress on the most intractable issues. So any increase in hostilities, particularly in the West Bank, are ones that you have to treat as a risk.

And it's been notable to hear the Israeli foreign minister tweeting today that Israeli should treat -- carry out operations in the West Bank like they've been carrying out in Gaza. That certainly would be quite an escalation.

BERMAN: Yes, it would.

All right, Jim Sciutto. Great to have you there. Thanks so much -- Sara. SIDNER: In just a few hours, the Paralympic Games opening ceremony gets underway in Paris. More than 4,000 athletes will compete in 22 sporting events over 11 days starting tomorrow. Many of the events will be held at the same venues that hosted the Olympics two weeks ago. Nearly two million tickets have been sold. They are some of the bravest and most inspiring athletes.

All right. An environmental group is calling for Robert F. Kennedy Jr. to be investigated over an incident where he allegedly beheaded a dead whale that washed ashore near his home. The story shared by Kennedy's daughter in a 2012 interview with Town & Country magazine, says he used a chainsaw to cut off the whale's head. Now the Center for Biological Diversity Action Fund wants some answers.

And it's been a huge business week for two famous football brothers. Jason and Travis Kelce signed off on what a source tells CNN is $100 million podcast deal with Amazon. It's for their "New Heights" podcast -- that's what it's called.

And Travis just bought part ownership in an up and coming racehorse after attending the Kentucky Derby back in May. The 3-year-old horse is named "Swift Delivery." It is set to make its stakes debut at the Toronto Cup this Saturday. But before you get too excited, no, the horse wasn't named after Kelce's popstar girlfriend, although I'm sure that's why he bought it. I'm just saying maybe. I don't know -- John.

BERMAN: Yeah, it seems like a little bit too much of a coincidence, I have to say.

SIDNER: It's a little -- yes.

BERMAN: And also, I have to say I do not understand the economics of podcasts and why I'm not doing it if you can make $100 million. I mean, I could find a brother to do a podcast with even though I don't have one.

SIDNER: Let's just do one and get paid $10,000. I'll take it.

BERMAN: All right. This morning, investors are gearing up for a critical earnings report from NVIDIA. The chip manufacturer's report could have a huge impact on the market. This thing has been going wild the last year.

CNN's Matt Egan is here. What are we expecting?

MATT EGAN, CNN REPORTER: Well John, this is being described as one of the biggest moments in years for Wall Street because NVIDIA is not just the MVP of the AI boom, it's the MVP of the entire stock market.

Look at this share price. It is going to the moon. It's a meteoric rise that we've rarely ever seen before, and it's being driven by the fact that INVIDIA makes chips that power the AI revolution. And that has made this company one of the most valuable on the planet.

Even though it's not a household name it is now valued at more than $3 trillion -- $3.2 trillion. More than Microsoft, more than Alphabet, more than Amazon, more than Saudi Aramco, and just behind Apple for the number one spot.

And the higher the stock price goes the more important it is for the overall stock market, right? It accounts for a huge part of the tech sector. It really sets the tone for the whole market at large.

And the bar has really been set very high for today's earnings report. Analysts are expecting triple-digit growth from NVIDIA across the board, saying that revenue, profit, free cash flow -- all of it will more than double from the year before.

Veteran tech analyst Dan Ives -- he told me that there's such high demand for INVIDIA's share price that it's been -- essentially become the new oil and gold in the modern world. And he said that they "expect another drop the mic performance from INVIDIA as of right now, Jensen and Co. are the only game in town."

Now, investors are going to be living and dying at everything that INVIDIA's CEO Jensen Huang says. The big key is what does he say about future demand? Are big tech companies -- are they ramping up spending? Are they cutting back? The answer to that question could carry the stock market to new heights or cause stock prices to tumble.

BERMAN: They're doing a really good job keeping expectations in check --

EGAN: Yeah, right.

BERMAN: -- basically saying this is the biggest thing ever.

EGAN: Yes.

BERMAN: All right, Matt Egan. Great to see you. We really appreciate it.

EGAN: Thank you, John.

A new hour of our flagship morning show CNN NEWS CENTRAL starts right now.