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Both Son and Father Appear in Court for Georgia Shooting; Jobs Market Picks Back Up; Vance and Harris Comment on School Shooting. Aired 8:30-9a ET

Aired September 06, 2024 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[08:30:00]

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Any moment now the 14-year-old suspected of killing four people at that Georgia high school will appear in person in court. His father is also charged in the case now, expected to be in the same courtroom just an hour later.

We've been seeing some different angles of this. The victim's families, Sara, lined up in the front row.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: You can see them there, some of the victim's families. I think there's about 18 people from the four families that lost loved ones there. And one of them is holding a little doll, a little Mickey Mouse doll, and we'll remember that that was Mason Schermerhorn family. There they are there. They're holding that. And it just reminds you, he was supposed to be taking a trip to Disney World. And that, of course, is never going to happen now. Those families, obviously, just devastated sitting in this court, watching this unfold, knowing that they'll never see their loved ones again.

BERMAN: That is just heartbreaking.

SIDNER: It - it truly, truly is. Those are the victims there, Richard Aspinwall, Christina Irimie, the two teachers, and Richard was also a coach, and Mason and Christian. All of them gone.

Let's now take a look at what's happening in court. There is a little bit of movement there. We are waiting to see this first arraignment.

BERMAN: All right, with us now, defense and trial attorney Misty Marris.

Misty, walk us through what actually will happen in this courtroom over the next few minutes.

MISTY MARRIS, DEFENSE AND TRIAL ATTORNEY: Absolutely.

Heart wrenching scene here as we watch this unfold.

So, this is an arraignment hearing. That means that each individual defendant will be advised of the charges against them by the judge. At that point they can enter a plea. Right now it's unclear whether or not there's representation. We'll see whether or not they have had assigned counsel, defense attorneys who will be present.

The next step would be to talk about potential bail or release and then set forth a schedule for the next appearances that will take place going down the line. It's a very procedural hearing, but there are going to be some aspects to look for here, specifically relating to representation for each individual person and whether or not they're - what plea they're going to enter. And that will show how this is going to play out moving forward.

SIDNER: This is a really unusual case in some ways because usually the parents of the suspect that is this young, 14-years-old, he's now being charged as an adult, are in the courtroom or they have at least some parental guidance. We now know his father has been arrested on charges too, second-degree murder and involuntary manslaughter. Just how does this work? I mean he has no representation. Obviously, his parent is now jailed. So, how will this work with the courts?

MARRIS: So, right now, Sara, that was actually something that was pretty shocking that happened. So, we've seen parents arrested for the acts of their children before. We covered this all together with the Crumbley case.

But this case is a bit different. And also that arrest was so fast for the father to be arrested so quickly. Usually, you would see a more protracted investigation, especially with these novel theories of law.

And so today you're seeing both being arraigned at the same time. So, at this point, there's going to be different issues with respect to each individual defendant. First, we have a minor. Now, he's automatically being charged with an - as an adult in this case because of the severity of the actions and the allegations in this case. But, will they challenge that?

With respect to the father, is he going to request bail? We don't know exactly what's going to happen as this plays out. But I will say, it will be interesting to see the probable cause affidavit against the father because that arrest and the charges, four counts of involuntary manslaughter, a legal theory we've seen before, ignoring a risk that was apparent, specifically in this case, that there was a violent propensity of his son and then having a gun accessible. We know that he purchased the gun that was used in the shooting in December of 2023 and gifted it to his son. That's going to be the legal theory.

But there's another charge here, second degree murder. That is a completely different legal theory than we have seen before. So, what, if anything, his defense attorney is going to raise in this arraignment, we'll - we'll see as time goes on.

BERMAN: The judge just walked in. Let's listen for a moment.

JUDGE CURRIE MINGLEDORFF: And good morning, everyone. My name is Currie Mingledorff. I'm assigned to preside over this morning's proceedings. We're here for a limited purpose this morning.

I do want to note, for everyone's benefit, that there is - as everyone certainly is aware, considerable interest in what has occurred in our community in the last several days.

[08:35:10]

For that reason, the court has seen fit, under Rule 22 of the Spirit Court - Uniform Spirit Court rules, to allow media outlets to record some of these proceedings.

However, under those rules, the court has set in place certain limitations. And - and I just want everyone to know that the media has been informed of that, and I'm confident that they will comply with that.

But otherwise, there is to be no filming or recording by any members of the public or any other individual, other than those authorized specifically by the court in its signed ruling.

Are we ready, counsel, to begin and bring the defendant in?

BRAD SMITH, DISTRICT ATTORNEY: The state's ready, Your Honor.

MINGLEDORFF: All right.

ZANE HARMON, DEFENSE ATTORNEY: The defense is ready.

MINGLEDORFF: All right.

All right, good morning, sir. Are you Mr. Colt Gray?

COLT GRAY, DEFENDANT: Yes, sir.

MINGLEDORFF: My name is Currie Mingledorff. I'm assigned to preside over this morning's proceedings.

Mr. Gray, I do need to inquire as to whether you're able to read and write the English language.

GRAY: Yes, sir.

MINGLEDORFF: All right.

I also want to inform you - well, I want to ask you, do you understand that you have the right to be represented by an attorney in these proceedings?

GRAY: Yes, sir.

MINGLEDORFF: And you are, in fact, represented today, is that correct?

GRAY: Yes, sir.

MINGLEDORFF: And Mr. Zane Harmon, you're here on behalf of this defendant, is that right?

HARMON: Yes, Your Honor.

MINGLEDORFF: All right. And you understand that you have the right to be continuously

represented throughout this proceeding. And if you cannot afford to be - to hire counsel, this court is obligated under the constitution to provide counsel for you, without cost to you.

All right, I am going to inform you of a few other matters. And I'm not going to ask you anything, just inform you.

So, one is, I want to make sure that you are aware that you have the right to remain silent. You don't have to say anything at all. And it's important to understand that because anything you might say could be used against you at further proceedings associated with your case.

I want to inform you of the charges that you currently face. In essence, you are charged with four counts of felony murder, as outlined in - in state warrants that have been issued against you. I want to make you aware that the maximum penalty for felony murder - so, for each count, the maximum penalty is that you could be punishable by death, by imprisonment for life without parole, or by imprisonment for life with the possibility of parole. If you have any questions about these charges, then I would urge you to discuss those with your attorney.

I would invite you, Mr. Harmon, to inform the court as to whether there's a request for bond at this time.

HARMON: At this time, Your Honor, there is not a request for bond. We will file the appropriate motions if that becomes necessary.

MINGLEDORFF: All right. An indictment by the grand jury for most felony offenses or accusations - well, you have the right to receive an indictment for these offenses. And I assume, Mr. Brad Smith is here on behalf of the DA's office, or he is our district attorney and he's accompanied by Ms. Patricia Brooks (ph), who is his chief assistant.

A preliminary hearing. You'll have the right also to a preliminary hearing unless you make bond, which, of course, at this point, there's no bond been requested, or unless you wave such a hearing.

You have the right to a speedy and public trial by a judge or jury. You have the right to confront and cross-examine all witnesses. You have the right to call witnesses on your own behalf and testify in your own defense if you so choose.

As you sit here in this courtroom today, under the law, you are presumed innocent. Your refusal to testify at any point, in any proceeding, will not be used against you in determining whether you are guilty or not guilty.

Counsel, let me just inquire as to whether there are any other items that the court should address before we conclude this preliminary hearing.

[08:40:08]

HARMON: No, Your Honor. SMITH: No, Your Honor.

DONNA SEAGRAVES (ph): Well, I do have one piece of information to convey to the court.

MINGLEDORFF: Yes.

SEAGRAVES: There was the development yesterday afternoon that makes it necessary for our office to have alternate counsel appointed. And arrangements have already been made in that regard. I've already explained that to Mr. Gray. An alternate council will be appointed by the end of the day today.

MINGLEDORFF: All right. Thank you very much. Ms. Donna Seagraves.

All right. Then, with that, this hearing is concluded. And you may escort this defendant out.

SIDNER: Wow. Just watching this 14-year-old coming into court, listening to those charges, which he was told could be punishable by death. The judge is still speaking. Let's listen in to what the judge is saying.

MINGLEDORFF: And I think we're going to have a little bit of a recess before we conduct that, unless everyone's ready to proceed wit that.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: We're ready.

MINGLEDORFF: I think - I think that I - I told the - the media outlet that I would recess briefly to allow them to kind of reconfigure what they're doing. And so we'll be in recess for a short time until I'm informed that - that everyone's ready, all right

SIDNER: OK, so what you're hearing there is Judge Mingledorff saying, you know, they're going to recess because the father is now going to come in. All of the council said they're ready. So, that's going to happen very shortly here.

But that picture of the 14-year-old, it took your breath away to see how young he was, how small he was, and yet you have all these people in the audience, 18 family members of the four killed, devastated because he's accused of taking their lives.

BERMAN: And they were lined up behind him watching this hearing as it took place.

In terms of what actually transpired, there was not a plea entered here. We did learn that he was represented by counsel. That counsel may change over the course of the day, but he had a lawyer right there beside him and there was no request for bond at this moment. And then the defendant there, and I'm not going to speak his name, the defendant there was told that the sentence for the crimes for which his charge is, the maximum sentence could be death.

SIDNER: Something for a 14-year-old to hear.

Let's get to Misty Marris, who was also watching this along with us.

Just your takeaway from what you heard from the judge. This is obviously a routine thing. But there is nothing routine about seeing a child in this position and knowing that he's accused of taking other children and teacher's lives at this young age, and charged as an adult.

MARRIS: Absolutely. And when you see this 14-year-old sitting there behind the defense table, it's just truly stunning.

But what we saw unfold in the courtroom, we - we saw what is a procedural hearing, but - but as you stated, Sara, nothing mundane about this one.

So, what did we learn? We learned that he had defense counsel. However, it sounds like, for some reason, maybe there's a conflict of interests, something of the like, the defense counsel is going to be replaced by the end of the day.

The judge asked if there was going to be an application for bond. That would be some form of release, requesting release from the defendant. The defense attorneys said, no. That means that he will be remaining in a juvenile detention center. Even though he's charged as an adult, in Georgia, from the ages of 13 to 17, any time served takes place in a juvenile detention center because of his young age. So he's going to remain there.

The next thing we heard was that he has the right to have - be indicted by a grand jury or to have a preliminary hearing. We know this is a basic tenet of the criminal law, that you have to be formally indicted in some ways. The standard being probable cause. Sometimes defendants waves that. In a case like this, we could see the defense actually wave this and say, let's just move on to trial and assess whether or not there's going to be a plea deal, not guilty or guilty. So, that's the next step.

A preliminary hearing is like a mini trial. That's why we heard the judge set forth all of the rights that the defendant had if this were to go to a preliminary hearing, that there would be the opportunity to cross-examine witnesses and the opportunity for the defense to testify.

Now, we heard the judge ask a few questions at the beginning. One of the reasons, we're dealing with a minor here. Sara and John, this is what we were speaking about before. We have someone 14-years-old. And although he's represented, he's technically, under the law, not competent to make his own decisions. And I'm not talking about competent in the layman's term, just that children are not able to enter into contracts. They can't make legal decisions for themselves.

In a situation like this, since his father is also facing charges, we don't know about the status of his mother, whether or not she's going to be involved in his trial.

[08:45:05]

Sometimes there's what's called a guardian ad litem, who is appointed to oversee the case and help a minor make these determinations.

We also did not hear, and I would expect this to come at some point, a request for an independent mental health evaluation. In cases where you have just the most horrific facts like this, a mass shooting, a defense attorney is going to say this person should have a mental health evaluation to determine whether or not there's potential defense or whether they're competent to stand trial. So, those are all the issues we would expect to see moving forward.

BERMAN: Misty Marris, our thanks to you.

Again, we still have our eye in that courtroom. They are in recess temporarily because the father of the accused shooter will be brought into that same courtroom for a very similar hearing shortly. You're looking at live pictures right there. It looks like they may not wait terribly long for this second part.

SIDNER: Right.

BERMAN: And from a legal standpoint, this is the novel part of what we're seeing here. So, we will go back to that courtroom the minute things happen.

I do also have to say, there is other breaking news. We just got a new jobs report in, being called the most important jobs report of the year. We'll tell you what the numbers show right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:50:34]

BERMAN: And we do have breaking news. New jobs numbers just in. These could be the most important numbers of the year.

With us, Julia Chatterley.

What do they show and what do they mean?

JULIA CHATTERLEY, CNN ANCHOR AND CORRESPONDENT: I've got good news and bad news. The good news is that it shows a slowing jobs market, not a collapsing jobs market. The bad news is, it's not going to help address the question of what the Fed does later this month, but you can push me if you want to.

So, what we got is the jobs added for last month, 142,000 jobs. That's less than expected. We were hoping for around 160,000. The better news is that the unemployment rate actually fell. So, a lot of people that were on temporary layoffs, last month, in that July number that was weaker, actually came back into the workforce. So, that's a good sign.

The danger and the slight warning sign in these numbers, the revisions to what we saw in July. July actually was the big fear factor, the recession warning that people were talking about. Those numbers were revised lower. So were June's numbers.

So, there's a little warning sign in the revisions. Again, next month, this is a very important point until next month's data, we'll watch that to see whether we see revisions again.

But if you look at the past three months actually overall, this does show a little bit of a pickup in the amount of jobs that were added, net over the month, but the revisions lower to June and July are a warning.

Where we were adding, construction, health care. Where we lost, a little bit in manufacturing.

There will be some alerts. And as I said, this doesn't address, I think, the question of what the Fed does. But the underlying data in this is still pretty good.

BERMAN: Yes.

CHATTERLEY: Wages picked up a little bit. There's reasons to be optimistic, even in a slowing jobs market.

BERMAN: Yes, wages picked up a little more than expected. The revised down for June and July, maybe not the brat summer that the economy was looking for.

CHATTERLEY: It's not a brat summer. Yes.

BERMAN: But pretty good.

So, let's talk about what this means for interest rates because the Fed meets - it's like a week from now.

CHATTERLEY: Yes.

BERMAN: They make an announcement. The issue is, and I'll try to explain it simply, you'll actually say what it means, whether or not they cut rates by a quarter point or a half point. A half point would be a lot. A quarter point would be about what's expected, but maybe not as much as some people want.

CHATTERLEY: I think that was perfectly explained. Borrowers out there, they'd love that half a percentage point cut. This data doesn't tell you what they're going to do. I hate to say you - to say it. I'll go out on a limb and say, I think they do a quarter of a percentage point. I think based on this data, based on what we get in inflation data next week, I think if they came out in September, and it's September the 18th is the date and said, look, we're going to cut half a percentage point, it could create a bit of a fear factor. What do they know and see that we aren't seeing still in the data?

BERMAN: It may be the news today was good enough so they don't take more extreme measures.

CHATTERLEY: Right.

BERMAN: So, for some people, the good news may end up being bad news, but it's all sort of measured.

CHATTERLEY: Exactly. BERMAN: All right, Julia Chatterley, thank you very much for that.

CHATTERLEY: Thank you.

BERMAN: We will try to see what the ripple effects will be on the market over the course of the morning.

CHATTERLEY: Yes.

BERMAN: Thank you.

Sara.

SIDNER: All right, thank you, John.

As we wait to see the father of the accused shooter in the school shooting in Georgia come into court, there is plenty of politics at play here. We have also gotten some new information on Kamala Harris and her huge cash advantage right now. Her campaign says it raked in $361 million in August, nearly triple that of Donald Trump's fundraising haul of $130 million. The Harris campaign now, $404 million in cash reserves. The Trump team working with $295 million in its stockpile at this moment.

Joining us now, CNN political commentator and Republican strategist, Shermichael Singleton. Also, former campaign manager for President Obama's 2012 presidential campaign, Jim Messina.

Thank you, gentlemen, for being here.

I want to begin, not with the big money haul, we will get to that, but - but because of what's happening and because of what we have been seeing, these, these just mind-numbing pictures of a child going into court, 14-years-old, charged as an adult, and all of the parents sitting behind who lost their family members and family members of the teachers watching all this happen.

Both J.D. Vance and Vice President Kamala Harris both had something to say about this. Kamala Harris says, I should never happen in our country. We have to do something about gun violence. And here's what J.D. Vance had to say about it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. J.D. VANCE (R-OH), VICE PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Clearly, strict gun laws is not the thing that is going to solve this problem. What is going to solve this problem - and I really do believe this - is, look, I don't like this.

[08:55:03]

I don't like to admit this. I don't like that this is a fact of life. But if you're - if you are a psycho, and you want to make headlines, you realize that our schools are soft targets. And we have got to bolster security at our schools.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: What do you make of those comments? One of the things that struck some people is the fact of life thing. And while it is true that that is something that we've had to deal with in this country over and over and over again, do you think that was a good answer?

SHERMICHAEL SINGLETON, CNN POLITICAL COMMENTATOR: I mean, look, politically, you're looking at about 10 million unregistered gun owners in this country, Sara. You look at some of the battleground states. Pennsylvania, there's around 500,000 of them unregistered. Around 175,000 unregistered in Georgia. And so I think from the campaign's perspective, they're looking at this of, do we potentially turn off those voters that we will absolutely need in what will be a marginally close race? And I think in these types of tragedies, you certainly want to recognize the horror that occurred. You want to recognize the lives that were lost.

But we are in a campaign season. And I think J.D. Vance recognizes that and he's recognizing the dynamics that you cannot risk turning off voters at you absolutely need. And Donald Trump already has skepticism from those voters because of the bump stock ban that he signed. So, that's a big issue.

SIDNER: Jim Messina, what did you hear there? And though Kamala Harris has not given a - a robust plan on what she would do to stop this gun violence, especially gun violence in schools, she said it should never happen again.

What do you think of how the two candidates there handle this?

JIM MESSINA, FORMER OBAMA 2012 CAMPAIGN MANAGER: Well, look, this race is going to come down to these swing women voters in these suburbs that Shermichael and I focus so much on. And J.D. Vance telling them that he wants to turn their schools into prisons to keep their kids safe isn't going to work with these voters. They are sick of worrying about their kids and it continues. And the fact that this is an incident that happened in the swing state of Georgia just magnifies the politics here.

And so I think you'll see the Harris campaign be very strong. And I think this will be a big issue in the debate next its weak because these swing women voters that we're following are going to look at J.D. Vance's answer and say, hey, that's not the route we want to go down.

SIDNER: I wanted you to talk about money, because it does play a role, of course, in politics.

SINGLETON: Yes.

SIDNER: It doesn't mean you win just because you have the bigger war chest -

SINGLETON: But it helps, though.

SIDNER: But it - but it does help. SINGLETON: Yes.

SIDNER: Kamala Harris has this huge haul, including 1.3 million from brand new donors. Should Donald Trump be worried about this?

SINGLETON: I mean, so, Sara, when you teed this up, you were talking about she has almost tripled the amount that Trump currently has.

SIDNER: Yes.

SINGLETON: Well, in 2016, that was the same dynamic for Hillary Clinton. We underestimated Trump's performance with voters. We underestimated his ability because he didn't have enough money. I'm not convinced at this point that that's going to matter.

In an interesting way, Donald Trump has been able to target and penetrate voters despite the cash deficit when compared to the other side. Does it help Kamala Harris buy more ads, get to more places? It certainly does. But in a unique way, Donald Trump has seemed to be able to penetrate that despite the cash default.

SIDNER: Jim, are we in unchartered times? Because as Shermichael points out, you know, the balances here haven't always helped the candidate that was running against Donald Trump.

MESSINA: Well, we are. I mean, Sara, on one hand I'm sad because I used to hold the record for most raised in a presidential race, and the Harris campaign is going to blow that out of the water.

SIDNER: The competition is real.

MESSINA: And I think, in general, I agree with Shermichael, that money is less important in presidential elections. That said, you need ads. And you need, you know, the field operations. And these voters that we're talking about, you need robust field operations. And that's where the Harris campaign has a massive advantage over Trump. She has like seven to one in the battleground states of offices open, of paid staff on the ground. And that's the question.

Also, I want to point out that it's not 2016. Trump has a huge negative that he didn't have there. He's running for the third time. He's kind of capped at these numbers. And he's got to find some way to change this race. And having Kamala Harris and her money sitting on top of him in these battleground states is not going to be helpful in the final 60 days.

SINGLETON: Sara, if I could just really quickly.

SIDNER: Go ahead. Sure. Sure.

SINGLETON: So, I get Jim's point. And he's right, the money does help in terms of opening up field operation offices You need them to be able to target voters in those states.

What the Trump campaign is doing this time around, from my understanding, is depending on other outside groups that support the campaign to do that work on the ground, I would also push back a little bit and say, this race is still close, despite the deficit, despite not being able to put as many ads in some of those battleground states, you're still looking at a race that's in the margin of error. You're looking at a state like Pennsylvania, where 16 percent of the voters there are still undecided.

SIDNER: It's neck and neck. Right. Right.

SINGLETON: So, this could go either way.

SIDNER: Thank you to the both of you for talking us through. And again, we are watching see what happens in court with the school - accused school shooter and his father.

Jim Messina, Shermichael Singleton, thank you both so much for coming on.

[08:59:59]

John.