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Fed Chair Says He Wouldn't Step Aside if Asked by Trump; Trump Vows Radically Different Immigration Policy; Interview with Rep. Joaquin Castro (D-TX): Democrats Grapple with Election Night Losses; Giuliani Ordered to Turn Over Assets or Face Contempt. Aired 3:30-4p ET

Aired November 07, 2024 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:30:00]

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Breaking news into CNN. Fed Chief Jerome Powell speaking to reporters and declaring the independence of the central bank as Donald Trump prepares to take office in January.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: CNN's Matt Egan is joining us live now. Tell us what he said. It was brief, but it was key.

MATT EGAN, CNN REPORTER: It was brief, Boris and Brianna. Look, the Fed takes its independence very seriously. And during a press conference just a few moments ago, the Fed chair was asked whether or not he would step down if he was asked by the president-elect to do so.

Take a listen to that exchange.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Some of the president-elect's advisors have suggested that you should resign. If he asked you to leave, would you go?

JEROME POWELL, FEDERAL RESERVE CHAIRMAN: No.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Can you follow up on it? Do you think that legally you're not required to leave?

POWELL: No.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

EGAN: Now, Powell was also asked during this press conference whether or not the president can demote him or other leaders at the Fed. And he said that that is not permitted under the law.

Now, look, some of this could be a little bit of a moot point, because back in July, Trump already said that he would allow Powell to finish out his term. Earlier today, our colleague Kayla Tausche reported that, according to a Trump advisor, that Trump would be likely to let Powell serve out his term. Conservative economist Stephen Moore, he told me the same thing. He

said that Trump would likely just kind of wait out the clock on Powell, whose term expires in May of 2026. But look, we know that the president-elect's mind can change. And it's easy to see a situation where he could decide that he wants to make a move on Powell.

These two have had a very, very complicated relationship. Remember, it was Trump himself who tapped Powell to lead the Federal Reserve. But Trump has also been very critical of Powell.

At times, he said that Powell had the rates too high. Then he said they were too low. He questioned whether or not there were political motivations behind the interest rate cut back in September.

I do think we need to watch the relationship between Powell and Trump very closely. They are two of the most powerful people in Washington. And there's a lot at stake here in terms of the economy and inflation -- Boris and Brianna.

KEILAR: Sometimes a single word can just be so impactful as an answer. But it makes it tricky for the follow-up question, I will say. But no, he is not going to.

All right, Matt Egan, thank you so much.

President-elect Trump, allies and companies are already quietly making plans to deliver on one of his biggest campaign promises, which is the mass deportation of illegal immigrants.

SANCHEZ: CNN's Priscilla Alvarez is here in the studio with new reporting. Priscilla, what are you hearing from your sources?

PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, what I'm being told is that over the last several weeks and months, Trump allies and some in the private sector were quietly preparing to detain and deport migrants at a large scale. The reason the private sector has been talking about this is because the federal government leans on contractors to manage these detention spaces. In fact, there's only a very few number of facilities that are federally owned.

[15:35:00]

So this had already been part of the discussion. And now they're telling me that they are expecting that to ramp up. Sources also telling CNN that the target at the beginning and these preliminary plans the team is putting together, the Trump team, is focusing on undocumented immigrants who have committed crimes.

But another part of the discussion, too, is DREAMers, those undocumented immigrants who came to the U.S. as children. Now, some of them are protected under the Obama era program, Deferred Action for Childhood Arrivals. But and they have typically had bipartisan support. But that could change. So we'll see how that conversation evolves over time.

But I've been talking to officials about this and they tell me, look, if he wants to do mass deportation, there are practical ways to make that happen.

Of course, attention is going to be a key component of that because you'd have to arrest and then detain before repatriating. But it comes down to money. And in the past, the Department of Homeland Security has moved funds around to try to put money behind these detention spaces and these deportations.

But this type of scale would require so much more than what the Department of Homeland Security can do with its limits. Not to mention that repatriating people is also difficult, given that it requires us to have different diplomacy and agreements with these countries.

But again, just to show you the numbers, because we're showing them here. It costs nearly $11,000 just to apprehend, detain, process and remove one undocumented immigrant. So if you do this on a large scale, you're starting to look at a really big price tag. So certainly in all the conversations I've had, the preparations are ongoing and there are steps that are being taken, especially within the private sector, knowing that this could certainly happen. But it is not an easy feat.

SANCHEZ: And to that point, Donald Trump just moments ago was speaking to reporters off camera. And apparently he reiterated his plan to carry out mass deportations. When he asked about how much an operation of that magnitude would cost, he said, it's not a question of a price tag.

Quote, it's not really. We have no choice when people have killed and murdered, when drug lords have destroyed countries. And now they're going to go back to those countries because they're not staying here. There is no price tag.

I wonder, Priscilla, what are the conversations like now for officials at the Department of Homeland Security and other places, other federal agencies that may have to follow this directive from the president?

ALVAREZ: Well, in some cases, let's start first with there is a price tag. There is money that needs to be put behind an effort like this. At the Department of Homeland Security, officials are no stranger to the whiplash with immigration policy.

You had the Trump administration the first term. Then President Joe Biden came in and reversed those policies. And now they're already signaling that they're going to reverse what the Biden administration did and put in the Trump administration policies all over again.

So there is a mixed bag of emotion. Some people tell me that it's been shell shock, especially among the political appointees. Others tell me that there's optimism and hope because they want a stronger position and posture on the U.S. southern border. So it's certainly a mixed bag.

But this is where we have come in terms of immigration policy, which is it's a patchwork system. And it's whoever is in office that's going to dictate what the policy is because there hasn't been any change to immigration law, which would offer a permanent change. So in talking to multiple homeland security officials over the last 24 hours, they say, we're ready if we, you know, we will do what needs to be done, according to what the incoming president says. But this is not a way to run a system.

SANCHEZ: Priscilla Alvarez, thank you so much for the reporting.

We want to expand the conversation now. Joining us live is Democratic Congressman Joaquin Castro of Texas. Congressman, thank you so much for being with us. And congratulations on your reelection. I do want to ask you about the potential for mass deportations and the Trump comments about there not being a price tag.

But first, I want to get your thoughts on Tuesday and what we saw unfold with the election broadly. What do you think should be Democrats biggest takeaway?

REP. JOAQUIN CASTRO (D-TX): Well, look, it was a tough night for Democrats, but it's true that we've also had tougher nights over the years. The Democratic Party, as you can imagine right now, is in a period of self-reflection and trying to figure out why we lost and what we need to do next time to make sure that we win. That's what political parties do after suffering losses in elections.

And I think that Kamala Harris and Joe Biden did an incredible job for four years in helping our economy bounce back from a once in a century pandemic. We had record job growth. We had record low unemployment.

But I also think that a lot of families, including a lot of Latino families, were still feeling a hit from inflation, much of it that was driven by corporate profiteering and price gouging. And unfortunately, as Democrats, we were reluctant to point the finger there. And so in the election, part of what happened is that Donald Trump and the Republicans, they ran a campaign that was based on fear and resentment, that was pointing the finger at immigrants, at migrants.

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They wanted every American to believe that everybody who was seeking asylum to this country was a potential serial killer. They were pointing the finger at trans kids.

I think they spent over $200 million in ads on the trans issue.

And so they found an enemy and zeroed in on that and worked as hard as they could to convince Americans that these folks were the problem and they were the reason that folks were feeling hardship in their lives.

And so, you know, we got to go back and make sure that we stand up for people, that we stand up for people's constitutional rights, especially because of what you just talked about with mass deportation and other issues. And so we're in the process of that evaluation now.

SANCHEZ: Given your view of that self-reflection among Democrats and the view of Republicans having scapegoated migrants, I'm curious to get your thoughts on Latino voters, especially in the Rio Grande Valley, because Trump had a near sweep of border counties there. What did Trump do right? And how much do you attribute his success to his stance on immigration?

CASTRO: Well, again, I mean, I think that they zeroed in on scare tactics and trying to convince all Americans, including Latinos, that, hey, these people are not like you. These people are coming to hurt you, to harm you. They made up these conspiracy theories about Haitian immigrants in Ohio, about Venezuelans all over the country who were taking over a lot of different apartment complexes and so forth.

And so the media environment is also not what it was 10 years ago or 20 years ago. You have a lot more misinformation and disinformation that is being pumped out and often sold and sometimes accepted as truth. And that's very powerful and it moves people.

And I don't think as a country or even as a political party that we've reckoned with how powerful that can be. But like I said at the beginning, there is an economic element to it as well. I do think that grocery prices, for example, went up too high too fast and people were feeling it.

And when people are feeling it in their lives like that, they're looking around for a reason. Why is this going on? And unfortunately, I think oftentimes Donald Trump and the Republican Party sold them a scapegoat or scapegoats in this election.

SANCHEZ: There were undoubtedly frustrations among many Latinos, especially in border communities with Biden's immigration policy. I do wonder when you hear some folks accuse Latino voters that supported Trump of misogyny and racism, how that sits with you, because there's evidence that points to the contrary. I do wonder how much you think those factors played a role.

CASTRO: Well, first, I don't think that it's fair to blame Latino voters for Donald Trump's win. If you look at a state like Pennsylvania, the percentage of Latino voters is relatively small. And I have heard some of the claims that you've talked about.

But I would ask people to remember that our Latino community, this is a community that overwhelmingly supported the first Black president of the United States in that election in 2012, that overwhelmingly supported Hillary Clinton to become the first woman president of the United States.

So it's a community that is in solidarity with working class people, with people that have experienced injustice, with aspiring people in this country who are reaching to achieve their American dreams. And you know, I don't think Democrats -- it would be a mistake not only to lay that blame now, but also to give up on the community. I think that would be a big mistake by the Democratic Party.

SANCHEZ: What do you think Vice President Harris could have done differently?

CASTRO: Oh, I mean, you know, to be honest with you, Boris, I think that's going to take some more time, at least from me. You know, it's been a few days from the election. You know, she really, she poured her heart and soul into all of it, she and Tim Walz. So many of the surrogates that went out there, the legion of volunteers and everything. And I know, you know, I know it's your job to look for answers and try to get answers and everything. But at least for me, it's going to take a little bit while, a little bit while longer to figure out on our end what we could have done differently.

I mentioned one thing on the I think I really think that we should have been honest about what was going on with price increases. For example, that's one for sure. You know, there are other things as well. But I promise that when we talk again, I'll have a fuller answer for you.

SANCHEZ: I look forward to that conversation. Congressman Joaquin Castro of Texas, thank you so much for your time.

CASTRO: Thank you.

SANCHEZ: Stay with NEWS CENTRAL. We'll be right back.

[15:45:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KEILAR: Former Trump attorney Rudy Giuliani has until next Friday to hand over his assets or face contempt. Giuliani was back in court today after he missed a deadline to surrender items to the two Georgia election workers that he defamed.

SANCHEZ: Those workers say they're still waiting to collect some of his most valuable possessions, including this Mercedes he was spotted cruising in on election day with a top back and microphones in his face.

CNN's Katelyn Polantz is live outside the courthouse in Manhattan. Giuliani got a bit of a scolding in court today and then he had microphones in his face again as he was leaving. Walk us through what happened.

KATELYN POLANTZ, CNN SENIOR CRIME AND JUSTICE REPORTER: Yes, the judge said the keys to that car, the title of that car, enough is enough. Giuliani has to follow the court's orders and has to turn those things, as well as a number of other luxury items, expensive things, watches he has, sports memorabilia, things he's put into storage in Long Island, all of that has to get to the lawyers of Ruby Freeman and Shaye Moss by the end of next week. They're going to give him a time and a place by Monday on where he needs to deliver all of those items to get them to them because he's so in debt to these two women.

[15:50:00]

And Judge Lewis Lyman here at the federal court in Manhattan is trying to enforce that winning, those judgments that they have received there. But just to give you guys an idea of how difficult this is for Ruby

Freeman and Shaye Moss, there was a moment in court where Judge Lyman was discussing with Giuliani himself, who was here, about a sworn statement he made that said he was the only person who knew where his assets were.

And Giuliani stood up in the middle of court and tried to tell the judge he didn't even want his own name on that statement, saying he knew where all of the things he owns would be. And the judge said, that's farcical. And you don't have a right to exercise self-help. You can't just decline to answer questions because you disagree with them.

So that's how the hearing played out over more than an hour. After court Giuliani did get the judge's orders quite firmly, but he came outside and he had more to say.

When asked by CNN if Donald Trump might be helping him now that Trump is returning to the presidency and Giuliani's been out there supporting him publicly, here's what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You think Mr. Trump can help get you out of this?

RUDY GIULIANI, FORMER TRUMP ATTORNEY: Mr. Trump doesn't have to help me get out of it all. What Mr. Trump has to do is straighten out the legal system. You'll find out who the real criminals are.

The bringing of this case was a complete abusive process. The $145 million judgment to anyone sensible is ridiculous, obviously punitive, obviously done because I'm a Republican and I was in a Democratic dictatorship, which by the way, New York is.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

POLANTZ: So the deadline is firm from the court. Ruby Freeman and Shaye Moss can go for Giuliani to get these things from him. They also can go to the Trump campaign to try and collect $2 million that Rudy Giuliani says he was never paid from the 2020 election. Back to you.

KEILAR: Interesting. Katelyn Polantz, thank you for that.

And ahead, vaccines could face new scrutiny under the Trump administration. We'll have that next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Breaking news into CNN, sources tell us that the FBI has informed one of President-elect Donald Trump's lead attorneys that his cell phone was tapped by Chinese hackers.

KEILAR: CNN's Paul Reid is part of the team that broke this reporting. Tell us what you're learning here, Paula.

PAULA REID, CNN CHIEF LEGAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: So we've learned that Todd Blanche, one of President-elect Donald Trump's lead criminal defense attorneys, his phone was tapped by Chinese hackers. This is part of a wide-ranging operation targeting top Republican and Democratic political figures in the U.S.

Now, a source familiar with the intrusion says that Blanche was informed last week by the FBI that hackers were able to obtain some voice recordings and also some text messages from his phone. Now, the source says that this information has no connection to the president- elect. There's no indication that anything that was taken from Blanche's phone is related to the president-elect, but they were able to obtain some information, including communications with family.

Now, Blanche is the second of Trump's attorneys who have been confirmed to have been hacked by foreign adversaries back in August. CNN reported that another one of Trump's attorneys, Lindsay Halligan, was also hacked by Iranian efforts.

So this is significant because, again, you think about what Todd Blanche may be doing in the upcoming administration. He's someone whose name has been floated for jobs like White House counsel or even a top position in the Justice Department, and the kind of information on his phone would certainly be of interest to foreign adversaries.

SANCHEZ: Paula Reid, thank you so much for that update of story. We will continue tracking.

Donald Trump could start naming some of his key White House staff any day now, and there are questions about whether vaccine skeptic and conspiracy theorist RFK Jr. will be in charge of health policy.

KEILAR: CNN medical correspondent Meg Tirrell is here to explain how the U.S. currently tracks vaccine efficacy and safety -- Meg.

MEG TIRRELL, CNN MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT: Hey, guys. So RFK Jr. has talked about not taking anybody's vaccines away, but saying he'll immediately begin studying vaccine safety and efficacy. And this has public health experts kind of scratching their heads.

They're sort of wondering what isn't out there that he thinks he's going to examine and reveal something new, because the system for reviewing vaccines, both before they're on the market and afterwards, is incredibly robust. Before a vaccine gets to market, it starts out with animal studies before it can get to human clinical trials. Often those take years, thousands of participants.

Then it gets to the FDA review process, where documents are posted publicly, both from the manufacturers and from the FDA in its own review. Reviewers often make a recommendation to the FDA. The FDA decides whether to approve something.

Then after it gets on the market, CDC's group of outside advisors meets to review and discuss whether a vaccine should be added to the schedule. Who should get it? How frequently? The CDC's director then can decide whether to accept that recommendation.

And even years after vaccines are out on the market, there are multiple ways in place, both from the CDC and the FDA, that they're continually monitoring vaccine safety and efficacy.

But what is really worrying public health officials and experts that I've talked with is the idea that RFK Jr. could shake confidence in vaccines through this kind of language. And we are already seeing rates of things like the MMR vaccine, measles, mumps and rubella and declining to levels below where the CDC says they need to be to achieve herd immunity and protect everybody in a community. They haven't been above 95 percent for kindergartners for the measles, mumps, rubella vaccine since 2019-2020. So that is really concerning to folks who are worried about diseases like measles or for other vaccines, things like polio, potentially coming back -- guys.

SANCHEZ: Meg Tirrell, thank you so much.

A real-life game of Jumanji is playing out in one small South Carolina town after 43 monkeys escaped from a research facility. This is what the primates look like.

They're still on the loose after escaping from the Alpha Genesis Primate Research Center.

KEILAR: Police say the research center had eyes on the monkeys and were attempting to entice them with food. Sounds like it should work, right? A town administrator reportedly told the media, we're not talking about Caesar, a planet of the apes.

But if you spot any primates, don't approach or try to interact with them or feed them. Call 9-1-1. The monkeys are all female and between six to seven pounds. They have never been used for testing and they are too young to carry disease.

SANCHEZ: They're adorable. They're probably not a danger. What do you think they're trying to entice them with as far as food? Bananas is the easy answer.

[16:00:03]

KEILAR: Bananas, yes.

SANCHEZ: But I don't know.

KEILAR: Any kind of fruit, I would think.

SANCHEZ: Yes, Popeye's chicken sandwich. Spicy chicken sandwich.

KEILAR: Now that is always a good bet, right?

SANCHEZ: It's going to be my afternoon meal. I'm sad that we didn't talk about Raygun, friend of the show. Parasocial friend of the show. I don't know if she knows that we exist.

KEILAR: Be attracting the monkeys with some breaking.

SANCHEZ: The Australian breakdancers retiring from breakdancing. We didn't talk about it today. What a travesty.

"THE LEAD" with Jake Tapper starts right now.

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