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Syrian Civil War Reignited; Trump's FBI Pick Stirs Controversy; Hunter Biden Pardoned. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired December 02, 2024 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:00:42]

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: President Biden breaks his promise and pardons his son Hunter. Why he says he made the decision, despite telling Americans multiple times he would not, as his press secretary tries to defend the decision.

Some are linking the timing of the pardon to another one of president- elect's Trump's controversial administration picks, this time his choice for FBI director, Kash Patel, and why that name is concerning for members of both parties.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: And an unwelcome trend this holiday season, a spike in respiratory illnesses and a type of walking pneumonia that's filling up children's hospitals across the country.

We're following these major developing stories and many more all coming in right here to CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

KEILAR: We begin this hour with a sudden reversal from President Biden as his time in office winds down, issuing a full and unconditional pardon of his son Hunter.

It's something the president repeatedly vowed that he would not do.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DAVID MUIR, "WORLD NEWS TONIGHT" ANCHOR AND MANAGING EDITOR: Let me ask you, will you accept the jury's outcome, their verdict, no matter what it is?

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Yes.

MUIR: And have you ruled out a pardon for your son?

BIDEN: Yes.

MUIR: You have?

BIDEN: I am satisfied that I'm not going to do anything. I said I'd abide by the jury decision and I will do that and I will not pardon him.

(END VIDEO CLIP) KEILAR: The pardon means that Hunter Biden will no longer be sentenced later this month on federal tax and gun convictions. And it spares him from any chance of going to prison, which was very much a possibility.

The move also grants Hunter Biden clemency from other federal crimes that he may have committed during a 10-year period. Here's first lady Jill Biden just moments ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

QUESTION: Dr. Biden, what changed on the pardon for Hunter?

JILL BIDEN, FIRST LADY: Of course I support the pardon of my son. Thank you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: We have CNN senior White House correspondent M.J. Lee here with us now on this story.

M.J., what more can you tell us about the president's decision and what went into it?

M.J. LEE, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Brianna, the White House is fully aware how badly this looks for the president and the White House, given that this marks a total reversal, a total about-face for a president and a White House that repeatedly, as you just showed, had said unequivocally that the president would not pardon his son.

It is a decision we are told that was made over the weekend as the president was spending the Thanksgiving holidays with his family in Nantucket. Officials are stressing that this wasn't a decision that the president made lightly, that he really wrestled with the decision, going back and forth before landing on the decision to eventually pardon his son.

Of course, the White House is getting a ton of questions about this reversal, including White House Press Secretary Karine Jean-Pierre as she was on her way to Angola, where the president will be spending a couple of days, reporters asking her to explain why the president decided to do a sudden 180.

And she made clear, notably, that this actually did in part have to do with the results of the election in November. Take a listen.

(BEGIN AUDIO CLIP)

QUESTION: Do you think this would have happened if Harris hadn't lost the election?

KARINE JEAN-PIERRE, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: I'm not going to get into the election. It is a no. I can answer that. It is a no.

And what I can say is... QUESTION: It's a no, this would not have happened if Harris hadn't lost the election? The pardon would not have happened if Harris hadn't lost the election?

JEAN-PIERRE: I can speak to where we are today. And so I can't speak to hypotheticals here. Where we are today, the president made this decision over the weekend. He thought about it. He wrestled with it.

(END AUDIO CLIP)

LEE: And, Brianna, based on our reporting and if you also take a look at the lengthy statement that we got from the president last night, it is clear that it essentially boiled down to this.

The president as a father felt like he needed to do this to protect his son. One White House official that I spoke with said that the political opponents of the presidents and their treatment of Hunter, that was something that really swayed the president as he made this decision.

This official said that he saw the treatment as being cruel, that he felt that Hunter Biden had endured enough. And one thing in particular that really swayed the president was this belief that his political opponents wanted to break Hunter Biden even as he was going through his recovery process through the various addictions that he had been battling.

[13:05:05]

This is what the president said about that in his statement last night. He said: "There has been an effort to break Hunter, who has been five-and-a-half years sober, even in the face of unrelenting attacks and selective prosecution. In trying to break Hunter, they have tried to break me and there's no reason to believe it will stop here."

Now, as a reminder, the president, of course, lost his other son, Beau, back in 2015. Hunter is his last remaining living son, clearly somebody that he is very protective of. And I think it is not at all a coincidence that as a part of his statement last night, he specifically said this: "I hope Americans will understand why a father and a president would come to this decision."

KEILAR: Yes, and he also lost a daughter decades ago at an extremely young age.

M.J. Lee, thank you very much -- Boris.

SANCHEZ: President-elect Donald Trump is seizing on Biden's decision to pardon his son, writing on social media -- quote -- "Does the pardon given by Joe to Hunter include the J6 hostages, who've now been imprisoned for years, such an abuse and miscarriage of justice?"

Point of fact, those imprisoned for their actions on January 6 are not in any way hostages. Meantime, the president-elect has announced plans to tap Kash Patel as

his new FBI director. The longtime loyalist is a controversial figure who's vowed to dismantle the Justice Department and take on the so- called deep state, a pick that now tees up a potentially explosive confirmation battle in the U.S. Senate.

Let's take you now live to CNN's Kristen Holmes, who is in West Palm Beach, Florida, near Trump's Mar-a-Lago estate.

Kristen, take us inside this decision by Trump.

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Boris, a very windy West Palm Beach, Florida right now, so I apologize if you have any trouble hearing me.

But what we were told is that it came down to two final candidates for president-elect Donald Trump. One was the Missouri attorney general, Andrew Bailey, as well as Kash Patel. Now, staunch loyalists to Donald Trump, as well as his family, were pushing Kash Patel, but obviously Patel is incredibly controversial, as you noted.

Now, it came down to the fact that they were having these different interviews with these various candidates, and Donald Trump just wasn't that impressed by Bailey. That's what multiple sources told us, that he wanted to go with someone who was a firebrand, a bomb thrower, like Kash Patel.

Now, obviously, again, this is incredibly controversial and is going to set up a fight when it comes to Congress because of the fact that Patel has no real experience with the FBI. He's not a former agent. That's generally a role that goes to a former agent. The other part of this is the fact that he has essentially said that he would go along with whatever it is that Donald Trump wants to do, including gutting the entire FBI.

And there's a lot of questions as to what exactly that would look like. Now, I do also want to point out one thing, one other thing, because this is something that's going on right now. We have just seen reporting in "The New Yorker" about another one of Donald Trump's controversial picks who is currently up on Capitol Hill, Pete Hegseth, who has been nominated to be secretary of defense.

In this reporting which was done through a whistle-blower account that was given to "The New Yorker," it says that Hegseth was forced out of two roles in which he ran veterans groups because of misconduct. And one of these whistle-blower reports, it says that he sexually pursued female staffers. It also says that he had -- was repeatedly intoxicated during his time as a leader of these organizations.

The reason I'm pointing that out is because we obviously know that Donald Trump's team had been on edge when it came to Hegseth because of that 2017 sexual assault allegation that they were unaware of. How this plays into that is something we're going to be watching closely as we were told that Donald Trump's team also told Hegseth pretty directly they didn't want any more surprises. Unclear if this is a surprise. One thing to note, when it comes to

allegations of intoxication, there was another letter here that was obtained by "The New Yorker" that says that he was passing out, that his behavior was despicable.

One thing that we know about the president-elect, because of his brother's relationship with alcohol abuse, it is not something that he tolerates from the people around him, obviously something to watch closely.

SANCHEZ: Yes, a really important point there, Kristen.

Trump also made some announcements on a few other noteworthy picks. Tell us about those.

HOLMES: Yes, it certainly seems as though he is rewarding family and loyalists in this. We know that Jared Kushner's father, whom Donald Trump pardoned, is now going to serve as the ambassador to France.

And his daughter Tiffany's husband's father is going to be an adviser on Middle East issues. I had heard from a number of people that this was likely to come. But one thing to really keep in mind here as we look at the picture that Donald Trump is painting is who it is that he is tapping. He is clearly looking to people who are going to serve him loyally, who are part of his family, not going through the channels that he went through back in 2016-2017, when he was naming people.

He was essentially given a list of more establishment Republicans. Now, in this case, he is rewarding so many of these people with ambassadorships or with high-level jobs.

[13:10:05]

One of the other things to keep in mind here is generally these ambassador jobs go to high-level donors. That's one thing that Donald Trump has been giving his high-level donors actual Cabinet positions, like Howard Lutnick or Linda McMahon, who has been nominated to be the head of Education, so something interesting that he is clearly doing in this quest to surround himself by people he believes who, one, will fulfill what he wants to do, but, two, will be loyal to him.

SANCHEZ: Kristen Holmes live for us in West Palm Beach, Florida.

Thank you so much for the update, Kristen.

A lot to discuss with Andrew McCabe, former deputy director of the FBI and CNN senior law enforcement analyst.

Andy, thank you so much for being with us.

Let's start with Hunter Biden. What was your reaction to the news that Joe Biden would pardon him? And what do you think the fallout is going to be from this long term?

ANDREW MCCABE, CNN SENIOR LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Yes, Boris, I was a little shocked, I have to say. I'm sure that this decision was torturous for President Biden. It puts

-- it really pits him against two things that we know mean very much to him, his respect for the system of justice and his role as an institutionalist, preserving those sorts of institutions and his love for and desire to protect his son.

So he had no easy choices here. But, nevertheless, choosing to issue this pardon for whatever reasons he did after so many times saying he would not is a really bad look for him. And I think it's potentially a destructive thing for his party.

I think it creates the appearance of hypocrisy. And I think it will -- it could go to supporting what I think are misguided opinions, but, nevertheless, people's opinions that the system is somehow stacked in favor of Democrats against Republicans.

I think this looks like the nation's head Democrat using the system for his own benefit.

KEILAR: And Republicans are really seizing on the time frame here, right, including the senator-elect from Indiana, Jim Banks, who said: "Joe Biden issued a pardon to Hunter Biden for any crimes that he might have committed since 2014. Why such a specific year? Well, Hunter Biden just so happened to join the board of Burisma, Ukrainian energy firm in that same year, 2014. So corrupt."

What do you make of the time frame here?

MCCABE: Well, I mean, my initial impression was, this is the president's desire to protect him for the longest period that reflects the president's time of service in the White House.

But, nevertheless, the effect of that very broad 10 year-time frame is, ironically, it will perpetuate the conspiracy theories and the accusations around Hunter Biden. They will never be resolved criminally, but it gives his detractors the opportunity to say, oh, well, he must have done something in 2014 to require a pardon going back that far.

SANCHEZ: I'm curious about a specific portion of the pardon, text of what the president put out.

He writes -- quote -- "The charges in Hunter's cases came about only after several of my political opponents in Congress instigated them to attack me and oppose my election. Then, a carefully negotiated plea deal agreed to by the Department of Justice unraveled in the courtroom with a number of my political opponents in Congress taking credit for bringing political pressure on the process. Had the plea deal held, it would have been a fair, reasonable resolution of Hunter's cases."

Part of the reason it fell apart, though, had to do with the disagreement between Hunter's attorneys and the judge over whether other potential charges against Hunter could be processed in the future, right? So how much stock do you put into this rationale?

MCCABE: It's really hard. That's really hard to say. I think that it definitely has the impact of generating more of that

sort of speculation, right, the range of the pardon, the depth of what's going all the way back to 2014.

However, there are reasonable arguments that could be made to say that Hunter Biden was treated differently than other people who were engaged in similar criminal conduct and who would likely have not been prosecuted to this extent of the law.

Hunter Biden endured a, what, five-year investigation, in which these are the only charges that came out of it. So I think this narrative that he was a subject of some sort of unfair persecution, there is some facts to back that up. It's clear that the president believes that's what's going on here and that most of it was generated -- targeted towards Hunter because of President Biden's role in the White House.

KEILAR: If it weren't for Biden's pardon of his son, the story that we would be focused on today is Donald Trump saying he wants Kash Patel to be his FBI director, who is an incredibly controversial, maybe the most controversial pick of anyone that he has made so far.

But I also wonder if you think this pardon that Joe Biden has made of his son increases the chances that the Senate may confirm Patel, when it could have been in question before.

[13:15:07]

MCCABE: You know, I'm not the -- that requires a level of political analysis that may not be in my wheelhouse. But I can say that the act of the pardon is, and we have seen this already in commentary across the board, generating a fair amount of frustration and anger, particularly on the Republican side.

That perception, that anger, that feeling that the other side is working the system to benefit themselves and their family members could very well have an impact on how aggressively some senators who harbor legitimate questions or concerns about Kash Patel or any of the other nominees, it could change the way that they approach those hearings.

I think that's possible. I wouldn't predict outcomes, but I think it's a possible effect.

SANCHEZ: And, lastly, Andy, I wanted to give you an opportunity to respond to Donald Trump tying this pardon to January 6 convicts. What did you make of that?

MCCABE: You know, kind of classic Donald Trump. It's not -- those two things are not related in any way, except maybe in the terms that he intended.

Is this some sort of a threat, like, well, you're going to pardon Hunter, I'm going to go out and pardon a bunch of people that you don't think should be pardoned? So are we now one step deeper into a government that takes policy and legal positions based on vendettas? Very possibly.

SANCHEZ: Andrew McCabe, appreciate the analysis. Thanks for joining us.

MCCABE: Thank you.

SANCHEZ: Still plenty more news to come on NEWS CENTRAL, including the Syrian civil war flaring up and escalating quickly after a new rebel offensive and joint Syrian and Russian airstrikes. This renewed violence comes after years of relative quiet, so why is this happening now?

KEILAR: And we have closing arguments in the manslaughter trial against a former Marine accused of putting a subway passenger into a choke hold, killing him in doing so. What his defense team is arguing next.

Then later, why Elton John says he has lost his eyesight.

You're watching CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

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[13:21:38]

SANCHEZ: Syria's civil war has been reignited.

Today, rescue workers inside Northern Syria say dozens of civilians have been killed as Syrian and Russian jets intensify airstrikes. Some new video into CNN shows the moment of impact from one strike on the streets of Aleppo. Watch this. Stunning footage there.

This is all in retaliation after Syrian rebels launched a surprise attack and seized control of large areas in recent days.

Let's get some perspective with CNN military analysts retired U.S. Air Force Colonel Cedric Leighton.

Colonel, thank you so much for being with us.

The Syrian conflict sort of came to a standstill roughly a decade ago and this is the most intense action we have seen in about eight years. Why now?

COL. CEDRIC LEIGHTON (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Well, that's a really great question.

And there are so many different things that actually have happened in this whole thing. But, first of all, they have -- when you look at Syria in general, you see all these different rebel groups right here. So we have basically had a static map for the last about 10 years or so.

But there have been actions that have been going on with all of these different groups, and especially this group right here, this area right in this green area. This part, these Syrian rebels have been very active in the Idlib province area and now in the Aleppo area. And that has made a difference, because now, even though there have been instances every day for the last 10 years or so, now we have actually seen momentum because all the different elements that are supporting the Syrian regime are now weakened.

SANCHEZ: Syria and the conflict in Syria is sort of a battleground for a multitude of regional players. Talk to us about who's backing Bashar al-Assad, the president of Syria, and who's backing all these different rebel factions.

LEIGHTON: Right. So the main backers of Assad are Russia, Iran and Hezbollah.

And each one of these countries is occupied with other things, countries or groups in this case. Of course, Hezbollah has been decimated by the Israelis. The pager attack took out a lot of their leadership. And Iran has been dealing with Israel and they have been busy in that sense. They have also tried to support proxies of their own like Hamas and Hezbollah. They have not been very successful against Israel.

And, of course, Russia is wrapped up in Ukraine. And now with Georgia heating up, Russia has basically had its hands full, although it, of course, has bases in Syria and they're mainly right here in the western area of the country.

SANCHEZ: So the rebels, who's backing them?

LEIGHTON: So who's backing the rebels? So this actually is quite interesting, because you have Turkey, the United States and Saudi Arabia, as well as a few other Gulf countries, that are backing different parts of the rebel coalition.

And that rebel coalition is actually quite, quite a major group that has all kinds of things going on because they are now under this umbrella group, more or less an umbrella group called Hay'at Tahrir al-Sham, or HTS, for short, former al Qaeda affiliate, basically running the show in Idlib.

But groups by Turkey and groups that have been previously supported by the U.S. have backed HTS and they are basically coalescing in this one group that is designed to get rid of Assad. That's their main goal right now is to get rid of Bashar al-Assad.

SANCHEZ: Fascinating that it's a former al Qaeda affiliate that's sort of the umbrella group over this.

[13:25:01]

The U.S. came close to a more expansive role in Syria back in -- about a decade ago, when former President Obama talked about there being a red line and asking Assad not to cross that red line and using chemical weapons against his own people and that sort of thing. It didn't come to fruition, but there is expansive evidence that Assad has committed war crimes against his own people.

LEIGHTON: Absolutely.

So he's ruled Syria since 2000. He took over from his father, Hafez al-Assad, who was an air force officer who himself took over in a coup d'etat. He's -- Assad Jr. has been accused of using chemical weapons and there's ample evidence that he did that.

And, in fact, his war crimes are so bad that France issued an arrest warrant last year for crimes against humanity. So Assad is in deep trouble if he loses his position of power in Syria right now.

SANCHEZ: Yes, we will see how the rest of this conflict goes.

Colonel Cedric Leighton, appreciate the analysis. Thanks so much.

LEIGHTON: You bet, Boris.

SANCHEZ: Brianna.

KEILAR: Let's talk more now with someone who has been covering this conflict in Syria for more than a decade, CNN chief international correspondent Clarissa Ward.

And, Clarissa, it really stands out how quickly the rebels were able to regain so much territory capturing Aleppo.

CLARISSA WARD, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Brianna, I mean, for those of us who covered this since 2011 and who have been watching Syria closely, this has been a moment where your jaw just drops open, because we haven't seen these kinds of territorial gains from the rebels in more than eight years.

It was in 2015 that Russia decided to cast its lot behind Bashar al- Assad, carrying out a very ruthless aerial bombardment campaign that effectively ended the Syrian uprising, quashed the rebellion. And since that point, it has been largely a state of no peace, no war.

But as you heard Colonel Leighton sort of lay out there for you, essentially, the backers of al-Assad in the form of Russia, in the form of Hezbollah, in the form of Iran have been distracted by other battles. And so the rebels really saw this as a moment to exploit the vacuum and try to make another push.

Within a matter of days, they are now in complete control of Idlib province. They are in control of the city of Aleppo, Syria's second largest city, the center historically of its commerce. They are making pushes in the northern Aleppo countryside. And most recently now, they have been issuing warnings to people who live in Hama, the central city, the fourth largest city in Syria, that they should avoid any space or place near members of the regime, giving an indication that they are preparing for an offensive there as well.

So, certainly, this is a moment that I don't think anybody saw coming. And there is a lot of anxiety now as to where this goes.

KEILAR: Yes, I mean, that's the question, right? What does the future hold? Is it more of the same? What are the prospects for an internationally brokered peace plan between the rebels and the Syrian government, as you see it.

WARD: I would say the prospects of a sort of formalized peace deal are very dim.

It has been quiet in Syria for years, but it was more of a sort of no war, no peace situation, rather than an actual brokered peace. There is so much daylight between the different sides in this conflict. And I do think it's important as well to just highlight that, beyond the sort of fighting forces, you have half the population of Syria who were displaced from their homes during the worst of this fighting.

You have true atrocities that were carried out by the regime of Bashar al-Assad, using poisonous gas against his own people, using nerve agents like sarin gas against his own people. So this is a war that has been absolutely devastating to the ordinary people of Syria.

And yet there are very real concerns as well about who these rebels are, what their end goals are, and how much unity really exists between them ultimately, because, again, as you heard from Colonel Leighton there, a lot of different cooks in the kitchen, a lot of different backers with competing agendas.

And given the broader context across the region of the incredible destabilization that you have seen since October 7, I think there are very real concerns that many do not want to see the Syrian civil war reignite again.

KEILAR: Clarissa Ward, live for us from Lebanon, thank you for that.

There are higher prices that could be on the way after president-elect Trump threatens 100 percent tariffs on several countries. We will talk about why just ahead.

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