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United Healthcare CEO Fatally Shot; Keach Hagey is Interviewed about Musk's Rivals. Aired 9:30-10a ET

Aired December 04, 2024 - 09:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[09:30:35]

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, we have breaking news from right here in New York. We're just hearing that the CEO of United Healthcare, which is the largest healthcare company in the country, was murdered this morning, gunned down on the streets in what police are calling a targeted attack.

That's Brian Thompson right there, the CEO of United Healthcare. He was shot and killed while outside the Hilton Hotel.

Let's get right to CNN's Brynn Gingras with the latest on this.

I know the details are just coming in, Brynn, so what are you learning?

BRYNN GINGRAS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, that's right, John, of course this is still unfolding. Investigators there on the scene.

But as you just described there, they believe, right now, this was a targeted attack.

Now, let's back up to just a few hours ago this morning, in midtown Manhattan. And for reference for people who aren't familiar, of course, with New York City, this is really not far from where the tree lighting is expected to occur tonight. In the heart of the theater district in midtown Manhattan. It's - we're told that Thompson was headed to a conference for United Healthcare that was expected to happen in the ballroom of that hotel of the - the Hilton there in midtown when there was a gunman who fired shots about 20 feet away from him as he was approaching that hotel.

Again, it appears it was a targeted attack. That gunman then, according to sources telling our John Miller, fled through a back alley near a theater, again in the heart of New York City, in the theater district, hopped on a bicycle and that is how that suspect got away.

So, you can imagine right now, investigators are there on the scene. They're combing that area. They're pulling video of a very popular area of New York City. Lots of cameras to pull from to figure out exactly what happened here, where that person fled to. What we understand, though, is that that suspect was actually outside that hotel for quite a bit before Thompson actually approached that hotel. So, that is why, at this point right now in the investigation, investigators believe this was a targeted attack.

But again, a lot of questions here. Exactly why Thompson was targeted, who obviously this person is, was there any help. Again, as I said, we're told through sources that he fled on a bicycle through a back alley. So, it doesn't appear like there was anybody else yet involved. But still, so many questions. And we know investigators combing the scene of that area as we speak.

BERMAN: Yes, again, just to reiterate some points that Brynn just made there, we believe - we've been told, CNN's John Miller reporting, that the gunman had been waiting for Brian Thompson, the United Healthcare CEO, to arrive at this conference at the Hilton, which is why they believe this was a targeted attack.

As Brynn points out, the Hilton Hotel, I mean, right in the middle of all the action, particularly in the Christmas season here in New York. So, so much activity in and around that area. So, obviously, that is of enormous concern this morning.

And then, Brynn, this guy got away. Or the shooter got away, we think on a bike. I have to imagine there is not a small manhunt underway right now across this city.

GINGRAS: Oh, absolutely, there's a huge manhunt across this city. And also let's reference the time, John. We're talking again - I keep reinforcing it - but midtown Manhattan, at the height of Thursday morning, a rush hour time, and a gunman firing multiple shots outside this hotel where, as you just said, this is a big tourist area. And as I also mentioned, you know, this is the tree lighting. So, there's a lot of security in this area, especially today because of that event that's taking place later tonight.

So, this is certainly something that is extremely alarming to police, that this could actually happen. And that's going to be probably part of this investigation is, how did it happen. But it does appear it was a targeted attack. And you just said it, John, this is no small manhunt that is going on right now as they search for the suspect who might have fired these shots.

BERMAN: You know what, I'm going to let you take that call, Brynn, because we are getting new information in by the second here. Hopefully Brynn's got some new reporting for us in just a minute.

Again, the news that we're following at this moment, the CEO of United Healthcare, Brian Thompson, gunned down on the streets of New York this morning. Just context, United Healthcare is the biggest health care company in the country. We don't know why Thompson was targeted, but authorities believe it was a targeted attack. The gunman, police tell John Miller, waiting for Thompson to arrive at an event at the Hilton Hotel.

[09:35:02] And importantly right now, the gunman still on the loose. So, a manhunt underway in jam-packed, holiday-crazed New York City.

We're going to have much more on these breaking developments right after a break.

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BERMAN: All right, we are going to stay on the breaking news. We're trying to get some new information about what happened the last few hours here in Manhattan. The CEO of United Healthcare was murdered, gunned down on the streets, in what police are calling a targeted attack. Brian Thompson, you can see him right there, he was shot while outside the Hilton Hotel where he was arriving, apparently, for a conference.

Let's bring back Brynn Gingras, who has been reporting on this, for any more information you've been getting, Brynn.

GINGRAS: Yes, that's right, John. Listen, I just got off the phone with sources, and I'm just learning a little bit more details. First of all, we should get a lot more details because we're expecting police to hold a news conference later this morning at about 11:30 or so. So, we'll probably hear from the police commissioner. Hopefully by then we'll have a little bit more details on the investigation, as you can imagine, that is very, you know, in high speed at this point right now.

What we're also learning, of course, as John Miller was reporting through his sources, is that police are right now pulling camera images from all that area. And as I said before, there are a lot of cameras since we're talking about the heart of Manhattan. So, there are images that police are going to have of this suspect, not only the video of that - him - this person, you know, trying to get away on a bicycle, as we reported, through a back alley behind a theater, but also just images of this actual person.

And what we're - I'm learning from sources is that this person was also masked. So, it's possible this is going to hinder a little bit of them trying to identify who this person is.

I've also learned from sources just within the last few minutes that that person might have been waiting outside that hotel for about ten minutes or so. As we said, John was reporting that sources were telling him that we believe he was waiting. It's a targeted attack against that United Healthcare CEO, Brian Thompson. That is what a theory - one of the theories that investigators are working with right now. So, it's possible that person was actually waiting outside that hotel for about ten minutes or so.

Again, this is all preliminary information. This is what we are learning from sources at this point. And, of course, they need to firm up their information as this investigation continues.

[09:40:00] But we will expect some more information certainly when police have that press conference, we're expecting around 11:30 this morning. But those are some new details.

BERMAN: All right, Brynn, stand by for us for a moment, or work the phones if you have to.

I want to bring in Steve Moore, a CNN law enforcement analyst, former FBI special agent.

Steve, so, two things I want to ask you about the Brynn just reported. Number one, this gunman was masked, apparently, and is now on the loose in New York. Talk to us about the manhunt that you imagine is underway.

STEVE MOORE, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST (via telephone): Well, it's going to be really difficult, obviously, because within about five minutes your description isn't going to be worth anything. He's going to dump the mask probably, probably switch into clothes or at least take off the dark clothes that were probably over his street clothes. You would probably be setting up some kind of cordon.

But, again, you're talking about midtown. So, how much - how much can you actually shut off in a short amount of time? I think, in this case, you're probably looking less at an immediate arrest because you don't know - I mean you have cabs, public transport, Uber personal cars. He could be anywhere by now.

BERMAN: So, very quickly, law enforcement sources have told our Brynn Gingras and John Miller that they believe this was a targeted attack. And one of the main points of reasoning there is that they believe this gunman had been waiting on the scene for ten minutes before the shooting. If you can discuss the importance of that fact.

MOORE: Well, it's - it's pretty huge at this point. Yes, it - it seems targeted. First of all, he was at a meeting that was publicly known. It wouldn't be hard for anybody to determine where his location would be. The fact that he was waiting right at that point for ten minutes would show that he had some intel on where this person would be at a certain point. So, that is - you know, that does two things to you. It shows that, again, it appears to be a targeted attack. And, number two, it doesn't appear that other people in the area are going to be necessarily in immediate danger.

It switches you, though, to the mode of who - who and why.

BERMAN: Yes.

MOORE: And, of course, when you have a - a company like that, that serves millions of people, boy, it's a big, big net.

BERMAN: Yes, the who and the why of it.

So, walk me through what law enforcement can do given the limited information they have right now, guy laying in wait for ten minutes or so, opening fire when he sees Brian Thompson walking into the hotel, taking off on a bike. We know Brian Thompson - and I do apologize to everyone, we're trying to get more information on this man who was lost, and our condolences are to his family this morning to be sure. But if he was walking into a conference at this point, Steve, do you try to talk to everyone who was there, go through anyone who had been waiting to see him, to find out what you can. How critical are these first minutes in that case?

MOORE: The first minutes are very important, of course. But what you're - what you're going to look at is, is what - was he - was the gun that was used, was it a semi-auto? Was - are there casings on the ground? The casings can - can at least lead you to the type of pistol that you're looking at, or if it - I'm assuming it was a pistol. It can give you that kind of information.

You're also trying to pick up as quickly as you can any security cameras that would have been in the area of the - of the hotel and the direction in which he seemed to escape. So, you're looking again at the - at the stuff that would be right there.

The people in the car, yes, or the people waiting for him would be crucial. You'd also want to know, was there somebody where he got into the car? Was there somebody waiting there if he had just arrived.

So, you're going to be sending people all over the place, trying to get instant interviews.

BERMAN: And again, New York City has the largest police department in the country. All very much, I think, focused on figuring out where this shooter is and pulling at every thread they can find.

Steve Moore, stand by, if you will, for a moment.

I want to bring back Brynn Gingras, who's been working the phones and her sources trying to find out whatever you can.

[09:45:05]

Brynn, what's the latest?

GINGRAS: Yes, the latest - sorry, I just got a text message. The latest is, you know, they're still - they're still looking for this person. It doesn't appear, according to sources, that they're very close to finding who this person is. As I mentioned, sources were telling me that from an image that they were able to - to get from all those cameras in midtown Manhattan, they do have an image of who they believe this suspect is. And that image shows that that person was masked. So, of course, that is going to be difficult to decipher who that person is, especially as the getaway we believe from sources telling John Miller was this person ran from that hotel in midtown Manhattan, down a back alley by a theater, because it's in the heart of the theater district, and got on a bicycle. And that's how this person got away. So, you can imagine now they are pulling video from that possible route of escape and trying to figure out where this person actually went.

So, backing up a little bit. More details, again. What we're understanding happened, at about 6:45 or so this morning was that the CEO of United Healthcare, Brian Thompson, was headed to a midtown hotel, the Hilton, there in the heart of the theater district in midtown Manhattan, again, on a day that is very heavily secured because tonight is the tree lighting of the Rockefeller tree. And this person is believed to have been there for about ten minutes or so, waiting for Thompson to arrive at the hotel, who was attending a conference for United Healthcare. And according to sources telling John Miller, that person fired multiple shots at about 20 feet away before getting away and killing Thompson.

So, again, this is something police - you saw all the crime scene tape up there in midtown Manhattan. We do expect more updates at the earliest, 11:30 this morning we're expecting a news conference from the NYPD.

John.

BERMAN: All right, we're waiting for that news conference. We will let you get back to working your phones and reading that text message that just came in.

Brynn Gingras, back with you in just a moment.

Our thanks to Stephen Moore as well.

Again, the breaking news, the United Healthcare CEO, Brian Thompson, gunned down outside a hotel in New York City. Of particular concern right now, the gunman on the loose. A manhunt underway. The latest right after this.

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[09:51:45]

BERMAN: All right, just an update on the breaking news. There was a manhunt underway here in New York City. The CEO of United Healthcare, Brian Thompson, was gunned down outside the Hilton Hotel not too long ago. They believe the gunman was waiting for him. They believe, the police do, it was a targeted attack. And there's now a manhunt for this shooter, who escaped down an alley, believed to be wearing a mask as well, which made the surveillance difficult. We'll have much more on this in a moment.

In the meantime, shifting gears. This morning, there are new reports of fear among tech industry leaders as Elon Musk cozies up to President-elect Trump. That's a euphemism there. More than cozies up. Many of the business rivals are making new efforts to get in good graces of Trump and the administration. Sam Altman, the OpenAI chief, who's had some pretty open beefs, if we can use the plural of beef, with Musk, recently said this on Fox News.

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SAM ALTMAN, CEO, OPENAI: We need to be able to have the best AI infrastructure in the world, to be able to lead with the - the technology and the capabilities. I believe President-elect Trump will be very good at that. I look

forward to working with his administration on it.

It does seem to us like this is going to be very important. It does seem like this will be one of these unusually important moments in the history of technology.

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BERMAN: All right, with us now, "Wall Street Journal" reporter Keach Hagey, who has reported extensively on this.

So, if you put up a picture of Sam Altman, why is that man worried this morning?

KEACH HAGEY, REPORTER, "WALL STREET JOURNAL": Well, Elon Musk has a long list of enemies, but Sam Altman is near the top of it. He has been openly feuding with Sam Altman and actually filed an expanded lawsuit against him since the election and since becoming first buddy. And he's been all over X saying he doesn't trust him and giving him Trump-like nicknames like swindly (ph) Sam.

BERMAN: We have a little sound to this effect, just so people can see what you're talking about.

Let's play that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ELON MUSK, ENTREPRENEUR: I don't trust Sam Altman. I - and I - and I don't think we want to have the most powerful AI in the world controlled by someone who is not trustworthy.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Yikes, if you're Sam Altman.

HAGEY: Yikes. Yes, I mean, this new administration is going to have vast power over the direction that AI goes, for all AI. And Elon Musk has a huge amount of influence over what is happening right now in the administration. He's been pushing for appointments. He's been making loud calls. And if you want a favor from Trump right now, a good person to talk to is Elon Musk. So, you - that is not a person who you want to be openly saying that he doesn't trust you.

BERMAN: So, talk to us more about that, is if you want a favor from Trump, you have to be in Musk's good graces or like you absolutely, categorically can't be on Musk's bad side here in Trump world. Is that the sense right now among tech leaders?

HAGEY: There is a sense that if you want something from Trump, Musk is the person to go to. Of course - of course there are others.

BERMAN: Yes.

HAGEY: And, of course, people are trying to go around and hire lobbyists and do their meetings around the edges. But he has not left Mar-a-Lago since the election, more or less.

BERMAN: So, what are people like Sam Altman, Mark Zuckerberg, others, you know, Bill Gates right there who's had other beefs with Elon Musk over the years, what are they doing now to fix this if they want to?

HAGEY: So, Sam Altman met recently with Howard Lutnick in Palm Beach, trying to kind of forge relationships with folks that are not, you know, that are going to go around Musk. And folks like Mark Zuckerberg, you know, have - have been down and met with the president-elect as well. So, people are trying to make, you know, direct pleas to President-elect Trump without, you know, Musk in the way.

[09:55:07]

BERMAN: All right, Keach Hagey, as I said, you've got great reporting on this. People should go check out your article in "The Wall Street Journal." Thanks so much for being with us this morning.

HAGEY: Thank you.

BERMAN: Kate.

BOLDUAN: All right, there's a lot of news that we're tracking. We'll continue to follow the breaking news of the shooting of the CEO of United Healthcare in midtown Manhattan. A manhunt underway. All of that continues on CNN right now.

CNN NEWS CENTRAL is now going to pass it off to "CNN NEWSROOM," up next.

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