Return to Transcripts main page

CNN News Central

Wisconsin School Shooting. Aired 1-1:30p ET

Aired December 16, 2024 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:00:00]

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: A shooting at Abundant Life Christian School. Multiple injuries there have been reported.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: This school is a K-12 with an enrollment of about 390 students, according to the school's Web site. And we do understand that police will be giving us an update live here in 15 minutes, and we will be taking that as soon as it begins.

CNN's Veronica Miracle is tracking this. She has more.

Veronica, what are you learning?

VERONICA MIRACLE, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Boris and Brianna, we understand from -- according to police, that there are multiple injuries that have been reported.

Of course, these situations, they're developing. So there's a lot of scanner traffic right now that we can't confirm. What we can confirm from police is that multiple injuries have been reported and that this remains an active and ongoing investigation. Police have closed a lot of the roads around the school right now.

They're asking people to avoid the area. We just heard -- we were listening to a mother who's been interviewed by local police. She said that she was able to ascertain that her kids are OK because her sister works at the school.

But there are a lot of parents right now who obviously have not been able to get in touch with their children. This is a K-12 school. We understand that this is a Christian school. It was founded in 1978. And it is a very small school. About 200 families from some 56 different churches make up the greater Dane County area, where the school resides, including the metropolitan Madison and its surrounding communities.

And those are all students that are represented in the student body. It's a very small school. And we are still learning more. This is the second shooting at a Christian school in just weeks. There was one in Northern California where a 5-year-old and a 6-year-old were shot.

Those two children did survive, but they have serious injuries, very, very serious, still in the hospital, have a long road to recovery, according to the sheriff from the Butte County area. That school shooting happened in early December. So this is the second school shooting at a small Christian school in just weeks.

Boris and Brianna, as we learn more, we will bring it to you.

SANCHEZ: Veronica, please stand by.

Let's bring in retired FBI supervisory agent Rob D'Amico, along with former Boston Police Commissioner Ed Davis, and CNN senior national security analyst Juliette Kayyem also with us.

Thank you, all three, for being with us.

Obviously, we are awaiting word from police officers. We understand that there's going to be a press conference in about 12 minutes or so. I do wonder, given that this appears to be an active scene -- we just saw a set of officers walking in with a canine into the building -- Ed, what do you make of what we're seeing and the fact that we're set to hear from law enforcement shortly?

ED DAVIS, FORMER BOSTON POLICE COMMISSIONER: Well, it could very well be, Boris, that this is an active scene, that they have not caught the person responsible. So it's hard to discern just from the initial photographs we're seeing.

But when they're going in with canines, they're probably involved in a search inside.

KEILAR: Yes, certainly. You would expect that.

And, Ed, we are at that point that has become all too familiar, where we are waiting to see what has happened here. Unfortunately, we know it all too well.

DAVIS: That's true.

And, Brianna, they're actually -- the first job is to evacuate people, to make sure that they are tending to anyone who's wounded to try to get them medical care, and then to secure the scene and obviously find the perpetrator. So there's a lot happening in the very early minutes of an incident like this.

It's hard to get information out. The fact that the police have already scheduled some type of communication with the press is really encouraging, give us some ideas to what's going on in a fairly short period of time. But this is all about saving lives at this point.

SANCHEZ: Rob, if you could, please take us through the stages of what a response like this entails. You have a 28-acre campus, some 400, roughly 400 students not counting faculty and staff. And you see the large law enforcement presence just outside the campus.

What does it look like beyond the yellow police lines?

ROB D'AMICO, FORMER FBI HOSTAGE RESCUE TEAM MEMBER: Well, in the beginning, you have to secure it, make sure that whoever you think is doing the shooting is neutralized. And then you have to make sure that there's not two, if you do

neutralize that. Why they're doing it, they have now started doing tactics where EMTs will actually enter the site while there's still police activity trying to neutralize a shooter in order to start bringing victims who may be shot out.

So they started training EMTs actually where body armor because, in the old school shootings, they had to wait a long period of time and some victims had actually perished during that time. So the training has changed a bit now, that law enforcement will try to neutralize the shooter or pin them down and EMTs will actually enter the scene while it's still somewhat dangerous to start rendering aid to victims and get them out of that danger area.

[13:05:25]

The fact that they're bringing -- I can't see the video, but you can always tell, like, if police are entering a building and they're taking very tactical approaches to it, that there's still a threat in the building. If they're just walking in with canines, they're not worried about where a gunshot may come from, I think that will tell you that either the shooter's neutralized or in a corner that's not particularly dangerous to where those police are coming in.

So I'd have to see the video. Body language, you can tell a lot. The fact that they're going to probably do an announcement in a few minutes, I think they have information. I don't think it's an active thing, unless they're going to try to get a description out if someone had gotten out of there to try to get the public to help.

KEILAR: And I think, to your point, what you're describing is just a maybe calmer entrance with the canines. We just saw three officers going in and video from just moments ago here.

Rob, take us through this, because police officers have told CNN as they're working to clear the school and they have no one in custody. We are awaiting details, of course, but there is an array of possibilities here, which is the understanding that the shooter may be inside and is no longer a threat, is inside and is a threat.

Explain to us whether this -- that would be still active and ongoing. The body language that you were suggesting does make you wonder about perhaps not being inside and a threat or that the shooter could be off scene. Take us through these possibilities.

D'AMICO: Yes, so as you mentioned, that the shooter is what we call neutralized or down hard would be that he was shot and he's not posing a threat, as in handcuffed.

It could be running medical assistance him if he's shot.

KEILAR: Rob, I'm so sorry. We do have an update from our Veronica Miracle, so that you are not going to have to speculate on this.

Veronica, can you give us the latest that you're learning? MIRACLE: Absolutely.

Our CNN's Shimon Prokupecz actually spoke with the Madison police chief. And this is on the record here. One suspect is down. Several casualties have been reported, and there have been transports to hospitals, including children. One staff member has potentially been killed.

They are still conducting secondary searches of the building and vehicles. So that's from the Madison police chief, according to our CNN's Shimon Prokupecz. That's the latest.

SANCHEZ: Veronica, thank you so much for that update, very significant news there.

It appears that law enforcement believes that a suspect is down. We understand that there are several folks injured, at least one possibly dead, both children and staff being transported to local hospitals.

We have got Rob D'Amico, if you're still with us.

I think that speaks to some of the scenarios that you were describing and the demeanor that law enforcement had as we watch them enter the building. I wonder what the process looks like now.

D'AMICO: Well, now they're -- I think that the canines are in there, again, to search things. There's oftentimes the possibility of a shooter dropping homemade explosives and other things, other booby traps. They will probably do that if they do a search warrant when they identify the shooter and have to go search his house for evidence.

You always want to look for devices because they know the police are going to come there, so that's probably what the canines are going in to do. They want it secured enough that it is also a crime scene. So, as they're -- the first priority, obviously, is the victims, getting them medically set to be able to be transported.

And then you have a crime scene that you now have to protect for those -- all those things that are going on here. So there's a ton of chaos going on. It looks really bad, but the people inside have gone through. You do tabletop exercises. You do walk-throughs of these.

So people really do understand what their roles are. And then you're going to have a Central Command. And then the big thing is getting it out to the media. One, you want to ensure that the parents understand where to go for the reunification with their child. And then they also have to put out information to, again, tell the public what's going on.

[13:10:00]

That's become a big training issue, especially with small police departments. Large police departments have an entire P.R. department, and they go to training for it. The smaller ones really need to get that training. So they have been doing that through different programs, because getting information out is very important.

KEILAR: And we're, just to update our viewers, looking at the scene there in Madison, Wisconsin, from moments ago.

There has been a shooting at a Christian school, Abundant Life Christian School, which is situated in a very residential area there.

I want to bring in our Shimon Prokupecz, who just got some reporting from law enforcement officials.

Shimon, go back over what you have learned here.

SHIMON PROKUPECZ, SENIOR CNN CRIME AND JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: So, Brianna, I have been in communication with the police chief there in Madison, Wisconsin, Chief Barnes.

And he tells me that they believe, at this point, that there is a suspect down, that there are several casualties that have been transported to an area hospital, and some of those injured include children. There is also a teacher or a staff member that is injured as well, severely injured.

That is something that they're still investigating, but that staff member also taken to the hospital and severely injured. They are conducting secondary searches, which is what we obviously always see in these situations, where police go back in, they start to search to make sure there are no other suspects, no other gunmen on the loose.

So, that is what we are seeing develop now. They are doing the secondary searches, but obviously still a very much ongoing situation. We don't know if the gunman was a student or if it was someone outside, but, as you have been reporting, the chief said -- he's expected to brief the media at about 15 after.

So in about five minutes or so, we should hear from the chief, but obviously a very, very serious situation under way here in the Madison, Wisconsin, area. Again, several students have been injured. They believe at this time that the gunman has been contained, has been either injured.

He's telling me that the suspect is down, and so right now at this point, they're trying to actually investigate, obviously, exactly what happened. But at this point, they believe they have it contained. They're doing secondary searches to make sure there are no other shooters.

SANCHEZ: Shimon, thank you so much for that update. Please stand by and let us know if you hear more.

Again, we are set to hear from police in just moments, in about three minutes for a scheduled press conference.

We do have a panel of experts with us.

And, Juliette Kayyem, I'm curious to get your reaction to what we're hearing here, the suspect apparently down, law enforcement reacting to this situation in a very quick manner, it appears.

JULIETTE KAYYEM, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Yes.

And the quick press conference is essential at this stage just, because, one, you have the family unification issue. You need to get parents back with kids. And then you also need to make sure that other schools in the area are not unduly impacted.

We may get a motive if they do have the suspect or they do know who the suspect is. Why this particular teacher? Was it a classroom or was it -- why was this particular teacher killed? Was it she was leading a classroom that the shooter was in or was this a known suspect?

And that will help. It's not ideal, but that will help sort of give police and, of course, the community a sense of what happened at the school. Of course, we are always in the -- we're always in the school shooting season, I have to say, and not sarcastically. It's been a little while since we have seen this kind of police activity.

And that was probably because they didn't have him originally, but like your other analyst -- the worst is over. We now need to figure out in particular what the motive is and who the suspect is.

KEILAR: And we are watching right now, as we are waiting here in just moments. It's scheduled for 1:15 East Coast time, 12:15 Madison time, an update from law enforcement there.

Police say they believe a suspect -- the suspect is down, but there are children among the injured in the school shooting at Abundant Life Christian School. And, right now, there are a lot of worried parents out there.

SANCHEZ: Yes, no question about that.

Our -- one of our affiliates actually caught up with one. And as we await this press conference, we're going to take a quick break and leave you with this witness sound from a parent who rushed to try to find their children.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BETHANY, MOTHER: I just pulled up here a little bit ago, but my mom, obviously, she lives nearby and she watches my kids. So she did give me a call that she saw a ton of police. And, obviously, my daughter goes here and my nieces and nephews, my sister.

[13:15:01]

So she called me on the phone. She told me, "Please remain calm." So I was already trying to mentally prepare. But, yes, after a bit, I was kind of like, OK. And she's like, there's an active shooter at the school. She had like an inside source kind of tell her.

And I just bolted out, drove down here. I called my husband and he made his way over here. Obviously, I couldn't get in, but I went around the back to my mom's house and talked with her. And, like I said, my sister is involved with the school. So I was able to get a little bit of an inside take on what was going on.

But she did tell me that they were OK.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[13:20:03]

SANCHEZ: Back to our breaking news.

Police in Madison, Wisconsin say that officers are investigating a shooting at Abundant Life Christian School, and they are about to give an update just any moment from now.

KEILAR: This school is K-12.

And we have Shimon -- we have CNN's Shimon Prokupecz with us with the very latest here.

Shimon, what can you tell us as we are awaiting this press conference with law enforcement?

PROKUPECZ: So, Brianna, this information comes to us from the chief of police there in Madison, Wisconsin, Chief Barnes. I was in touch with him as this was happening.

And he tells me that they believe that, at this point, the suspect is down, that there are children that have been taken to the hospital and been injured. There is also a staff member of the school that was seriously injured, potentially a fatal injury, but they're still sorting through that.

And, as you said, we are waiting to hear from the chief. He told me he was expected to speak around 1:15, 12:15 local time. I think they're still gathering a lot of the information.And as they try to get everything they can together, that's when we should hear from the chief here.

But the key here now is that obviously the police here know what they're dealing with, they believe they have the suspect. They believe now that the situation itself is under control. And now what they're doing are secondary searches to make sure there are no other gunmen, no other suspects that they're looking for, but, obviously, a very frightening situation here.

You have children that have been injured. You have staff members that have been injured. And police are still trying to sort through everything. I asked if the gunman was a student or if it was from somebody outside. I have not heard back from the chief yet.

So, obviously, they are still trying to gather everything, and I believe they will have a lot of information for us once the chief takes to the mics,but a very serious, serious situation here. Yet again, we're dealing with a school shooting. Immediately, when I texted with the police chief, that's what he told

me. He said, we're dealing with a school shooting here. This is something that I know this chief has trained for, has dealt with, and it is something that has been on the top of mind for them there in Madison, Wisconsin, as it is for every police chief across the country now having to face this threat.

And this is something that certainly they have been preparing for. And I hope here soon we will hear more information from him.

KEILAR: Do we know, Shimon, anything about the exact timing here and about the response?

PROKUPECZ: No, I don't know because, as this was developing. So I would say to you it was around maybe or so -- close to 1:00 that I started texting with him, and it took some time to hear from him.

So, some time around that point, they already knew that they had the situation contained. So, just before 1:00, they realized that the situation was contained. Suspect being down usually means that it was someone who -- a suspect that was shot, whether self-inflicted or by the police.

That's usually what that means to me, but I have not been able to get, Brianna, any more information at this point, but it seems, like from everything that I communicated with him about, it seems that at least, at the very least, they do have the situation under control.

SANCHEZ: Shimon, please stand by and keep us posted with the latest.

I do want to let our viewers know that Wisconsin's Governor Tony Evers just posted on social media, talking about this school shooting, saying -- quote -- "I am closely monitoring the incident at Abundant Life Christian School in Madison. We are praying for the kids, educators and entire Abundant Life School community as we await more information and are grateful for the first responders who are working quickly to respond" -- end quote.

Again, we are set to hear from police just moments from now. A press conference was originally scheduled for 1:15 p.m.

I want to go to Veronica Miracle, who's also been monitoring this story for us.

And, Veronica, you have some information about what makes this school on this campus -- actually, here comes the police chief now.Let's listen in as we wait for an update from officials.

SHON BARNES, MADISON, WISCONSIN, POLICE CHIEF: Usually, this is where I start and I say, thank you for coming and talking about how important the media is to our community.

But the truth is, today is a sad, sad day, not only for Madison, but for our entire country, where yet another police chief is doing a press conference to speak about violence in our community, specifically in one of the places that's most sacred to me as someone who loves education and to someone who has children that are in schools.

So I'm going to tell you what I know. I will answer any questions that I can. There will be a secondary briefing that our PIO will let about, OK?

Today, around 10:57 a.m., our officers were responding to a call of an active shooter at the Abundant Life Christian School here in Madison. When officers arrived, they found multiple victims suffering from gunshot wounds.

[13:25:14]

We train on this almost quarterly. The last time we trained on this as commanders was approximately two weeks ago. The protocols are simple: Stop the killing. Stop the dying. Find out who's doing this. The officers did that, and they did that adamantly.

We had officers from around the county and around the state that came in support of this particular incident. Officers located a juvenile, who they believe was responsible for this diseased in the building. Additionally, the officers began administering lifesaving efforts to anyone who was wounded and making sure that those persons were transported.

What we know is that a total of about seven persons were transported from this scene to area hospitals for treatment. We know that at least three people have lost their lives, including the juvenile person.

I don't have any other information about those persons who have lost their lives. I'm not going to release that until we have, of course, spoken with family members and ensuring that they are fully aware of this tragic, tragic scene that occurred today.

I want to think all of the law enforcement partners and community members that came out to help our friends at the ATF. I have gotten calls from my friends at the FBI, the state patrol, the sheriff's office, Monona Police Department, our fire department. It goes on and on and on, because this is something that we all prepare for, but we hope we never have to do.

As you can see, we have a unification center that was immediately set up where parents and guardians and loved ones and grandparents wanted to get information about their loved ones and we wanted to make sure that they were unified immediately.

So we were doing more than one thing at one time. We're still going through methodically clearing that school, clearing every vehicle, and making certain that there's no other threats to this community, which we believe there are none.

We immediately alerted our mayor's office, and I have been on the phone with her in her office constantly. We also alerted Madison schools. We put the schools on lockdown. But there is no threats to MMSD schools at this time. But we wanted to make sure that we did our due diligence in this

particular case. Again, we're still going through, collecting evidence, collecting information, making sure that our community is safe from what is a sad day for our community and for our country.

And we have to do a little bit better. I don't have all the answers that you want right now, but I will tell you this. We have some of the best officers in the entire country. Our detectives are amazing. We're going to go and work hard and go through this scene, so that we can piece together what exactly happened.

Again, there will be another briefing in about two hours. And if I have additional information, I will certainly let you know what that information is.

Again, around 10:57 a.m., officers responded to an active shooter. They responded per our protocol. They found the person who they believe was responsible, who was down, deceased. We know that it's juvenile -- we know that there are other persons who have lost their lives.

We know that we have transported about seven people after giving them lifesaving measures. It's important to notice too that about three miles from here is our training center. Today, our special event team medics were in training.

And so they got to practice in real time. They left the training center immediately and came down here and doing in real time what they were actually practicing for. And that's why training is so important and making sure that we can provide the best possible training and the best possible response for our community members.

I'm asking everyone to send your heart, your heartfelt wishes and prayers and thoughts yet again to a community. But, this time, it's my community.

Dylan (ph)?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes, who -- can we start over here with...

(CROSSTALK)

BARNES: Sure.

QUESTION: Chief, you mentioned you're a father. You're the police chief here in Madison. What emotions are you feeling right now after going through all that?

BARNES: To be honest with you, I'm feeling a little dismayed now, so close to Christmas.

Every child, every person in that building is a victim and will be a victim forever. These types of trauma don't just go away. And we need to figure out and try to piece together what exactly happened.