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Protest Inside Trump Tower In Support Of Activist Mahmoud Khalil; Trump Meets With Nato Secretary-General In the Oval Office. Aired 1:30-2p ET

Aired March 13, 2025 - 13:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[13:30:00]

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: We are following breaking news out of Trump Tower in New York City. That's where a protest is underway.

Video from inside Trump Tower shows a Jewish Voice for Peace organized demonstration, where protesters have filled the lobby of the building denouncing the arrest of Palestinian activist, Mahmoud Khalil.

These are live images right now outside of Trump Tower.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: Let's go to CNN's Omar Jimenez, who is on scene there.

Omar, tell us what you are seeing.

(CHANTING)

OMAR JIMENEZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes. So right now, we're actually just catching the remnants of what seemed to be the last of the protesters being loaded into police vehicles right now.

They have just been lined up, about 30 or so, just by my rough estimate, put in zip ties.

And as you mentioned, they were inside Trump Tower not too long ago protesting over the arrest of Mahmoud Khalil, who, of course, was that pro-Palestinian organizer on Columbia's campus as a part of the protests that we've seen.

Now you see the scene around here as well. A lot of supporters likely saw some of the images go out online, and they've gathered here. They've gathered here at the corner here in Manhattan, outside of Trump Tower.

But you can see the group that's, again, just come up organically. Some have stopped to see what was going on. But many, of course, chanting in support of Palestinians as well.

Now, look, we have seen a lot of attention go over this particular arrest of Mahmoud Khalil. Of course, those legal proceedings still ongoing at this point.

But that seems to be the draw of many of these folks here who believe that the First Amendment rights are being infringed on too far to this point. And so that is why many of them came out here.

And the group that was protesting was Jewish Voices for Peace. Of course, they -- they have pushed many times in protests that we've seen in support of some Palestinian issues over the course of this -- this being no different, again, on those First Amendment grounds.

That seems to be what many of the people are chanting here. We've heard chants of "Free Mahmoud Khalil." We've heard chants in support of Palestinians.

But again, the last remnants of the folks that were inside Trump Tower not too long ago, you see the huge police presence that formed here. They've got the street completely blocked off.

And even trying to get here, you can't even get on the side of the street where Trump Tower is. I'll show it to you just over my corner. That is where Trump Tower is. That is where they were let out not too long ago.

They've got barriers up on the streets as well in about a block radius as they try to get this scene under control. But of course, a protest that bubbled up just this afternoon grew to at least what appeared to be dozens. And now it seems they are being taken into custody by the New York Police Department.

SANCHEZ: Omar Jimenez is live for us in downtown Manhattan outside of Trump Tower.

Omar, thank you so much for that update. We will, of course, keep our eyes on the situation there.

We just got tape back of this meeting between President Donald Trump and NATO Secretary-General Mark Rutte at the White House.

KEILAR: That's right. They just spoke. Let's listen.

TRUMP: Hello, everybody.

It's great to be with a friend of mine, who was prime minister of the Netherlands, so I got to know him very well. We had a great relationship always, Mark Rutte. Now, he's secretary-general of NATO, and doing a fantastic job. Everybody -- every report I've gotten is what a great job he did, and I'm not at all surprised when I hear it. We had to support him, and we supported him as soon as I heard the name. But he was a fantastic prime minister, and he's doing a fantastic job, a -- an even tougher job.

Which is tougher, being the prime minister of Netherlands, or...?

RUTTE: This job is quite tough.

TRUMP: I would think this is (inaudible).

(LAUGHTER)

RUTTE: Yeah. But with -- there's -- both things is also brutal, so... (LAUGHTER)

TRUMP: Yeah, yeah, but this is pretty tough, but...

RUTTE: Yeah.

TRUMP: ... you're doing -- you're doing good.

RUTTE: Thank you.

TRUMP: We're going to be discussing a lot of things, obviously. We'll be discussing what's happening with respect to Ukraine and Russia. At this moment, we have people talking in Russia. We have representatives over there, Steve Witkoff and others, and they're in very serious discussions, as you know. Ukraine has agreed, subject to this, what's happening today, to a complete cease-fire, and we hope Russia will do the same.

Thousands of people are being killed, young people usually, mostly, young people. We were just talking about it. Thousands of young people are being killed a week, and we want to see that stop. And they're not Americans and they're not from the Netherlands, for the most part.

RUTTE: No.

TRUMP: They're not from -- they're from Russia and they're from Ukraine, but they're people, and I think everybody feels the same way. We want it to stop.

TRUMP: It's also a tremendous cost to the United States and other to countries, and it's something that would've never happened if I were president, and it makes me very angry to see that it did happen, but it happened, and we have to stop it.

[13:35:00]

Mark has done some really good work over the last week. We've been working together. And he's done some really good work. So very happy about that.

We'll also be talking about trade and various other things, and think we'll have a very, very strong day. We're going to have lunch afterwards, that'll go (ph), and then we'll see you all later.

But Mark, would you like to say something?

RUTTE: Yeah. First of all, the -- thank you so much, Mr. President, dear Donald, again for hosting me and -- but also for taking time in Florida a couple of weeks...

(CROSSTALK)

RUTTE: ... reelected.

TRUMP: That's right. RUTTE: And of course our phone call a couple of weeks ago. And I must say, 2045 (ph), you basically -- you originated the fact that in Europe, we are now spending, when you take it to aggregate, $700 billion more on defense than when you came in office in 2016, 2017. But that was 2045 (ph).

But when we look at 2047 (ph)...

TRUMP: That'll be hard to top.

RUTTE: ... what happened the last couple of weeks is really staggering. The Europeans committing to a package of $800 billion defense spending, the Germans now potentially up to half a trillion extra in defense spending, and then of course you have Keir Starmer here, the British Prime Minister, and others all committing to much higher defense spending.

And we know there we need to do more, but I really want to work together with you in the run-up to the (inaudible) Summit to make sure that we will have a NATO which is really reinvigorated under your leadership, and we are getting there.

And we also discussed defense production and -- because we need to produce more (inaudible). We are not doing enough, and not in the U.S., not in Europe, and we are lagging behind when you compare to the Russians and the Chinese.

And you have a huge defense industrial base, Europeans buying more -- four times more here than the other -- the other way around, which is good because you have a strong defense industry, but we need to do more there to make sure that we are (inaudible) the production and kill the red tape. So I would love -- love to work with you on that.

And finally, Ukraine. You broke the death lock -- as you said, all the killing and the young people dying, cities getting destroyed. The fact that you did that, that you started the dialogue with the Russians, and the successful talks in Saudi Arabia now with the Ukrainians, I really want to commend you for this.

So -- well, the Hague is my hometown. I would love to host you there in the summer, and work together to make sure that that will be a splash, a real success, projecting American power on the world stage.

TRUMP: What Mark is saying is when I first went to NATO, my first meeting, I noticed that very few people were paying, and if they were, they weren't paying their fair share. There were only seven countries that were paying what they were supposed to be paying, which was -- yeah...

(CROSSTALK)

TRUMP: Could be even worse (ph). But there were just very few countries that were paying, and even the paying -- they -- it was at two percent, which is too low. It should be higher. It should be quite a bit higher. But you had Poland, and I remember Poland was actually paying a little bit more than they were supposed to, which I was very impressed with. And they -- they've been actually terrific, and some of the others.

But most of them weren't paying or they were paying very little. And I didn't think it was appropriate to bring it up there but I said it's going to be brought up at my next meeting. And my next meeting -- you know, the first meeting, you want to give them a little break. The second meeting, it began, and I was able to raise hundreds of billions of dollars.

I just said we're not going to be involved with you if you're not going to pay, and the money started pouring in and NATO became much stronger because of my actions and working along with a lot of people, including Mark.

But they would not pay for other presidents and other -- I don't think other presidents even knew that they weren't paid. I asked first question, has everybody paid up? And literally -- I mean, they shook -- they told me seven. You could be right, it could be three, but that makes it even worse. But they just weren't paying. And I said, "No, I won't protect if you're not paying. If you're delinquent or if the money isn't paid, why would we do that?"

And as soon as I said that, you got a little hit from the press because they said, "Oh, gee, that's not very nice," but if you said the other, nobody would have paid. And the money started coming in by the billions and, you know, hundreds of billions of dollars flowed into NATO and NATO became strong.

RUTTE: Yeah.

TRUMP: And you remember that. And your predecessor, who I thought was a very good man actually...

RUTTE: Absolutely, Jens Stoltenberg. He sends his best wishes...

(CROSSTALK)

TRUMP: ... terrific. Stoltenberg, Secretary General. And he made this statement that when Trump came in, the money started coming in like we never saw before. Hundreds of -- it was actually probably close to $600 billion came in, and NATO became strong from that standpoint. And now we have to use it wisely and we have to get this war over with, and -- and we'll be back to a normal -- much more normal life.

And maybe we're close. We're getting words that things are going OK in Russia, and it doesn't mean anything until we hear what the final outcome is. But they have very serious discussions going on right now with President Putin and others.

[13:40:00]

And hopefully they all want to end this nightmare. It's a nightmare.

It's a horrible thing when you look -- I get -- I get pictures every week. They give me the pictures of the battlefield, which I almost don't want to see. It's so horrible to see young people laying -- arms and legs and heads laying all over the field. It's the most terrible thing that you'll ever see. And it's got to stop. These are young people with -- with mothers and fathers and sisters and brothers and friends. And it's a -- it's got to stop.

So we hopefully are going to be in a good position sometime today to have a -- a good idea. We'll have -- we know where we are with Ukraine, and we are getting good signals outside of Russia as to where we are with Russia. And hopefully they'll do the right thing.

It's a really -- humanity -- we're talking about humanity, we're not talking about the money. But then you add the money to it and, you know, hundreds of billions of dollars is being spent and really wasted so unnecessarily. It should have never happened.

So it's an honor to have you here. And they've picked a great gentleman, I'll tell you. That was -- I was so happy to hear it cause you had somebody -- Stoltenberg was really good, and you have somebody that's going to do an incredible job. And I was so much in favor of you. You have no idea. They had another person that I did not like.

(LAUGHTER)

I was not happy. And I think I kept him from -- you know what I'm talking about. I said this is the right man to do it. And he really did. He was a great Prime Minister of the Netherlands. He did a great job. And that's what he's doing right now.

So thank you, everybody, for being here. And it's very great honor to have you. And we even have some of our great energy people here today, right? We have our -- the Governor and we have Chris. You know Chris...

(CROSSTALK)

TRUMP: He's supposed to be the most talented man in the world of energy, according to the Governor. So I don't know if he's right. And we have -- General, you've been fantastic. Thank you very much. And we have all -- a lot of good people that won't be so much involved with this but they wanted to see what was happening. It's become a little bit of a show, but we wanted -- they wanted to see what was happening. And -- and I think a lot of good things are happening.

So with that, if anybody would have a question?

(CROSSTALK)

QUESTION: Sorry -- sorry. Steve Witkoff's trip to Moscow, you spoke about it. What sort of agreement do you hope he comes away from there with?

TRUMP: Well, we'd like to see a ceasefire from Russia. And we have, you know, not been working in the dark. We've been discussing with Ukraine land and pieces of land that would be kept and lost and all of the other elements of a final agreement. There's a power plant involved -- you know, very big power plant involved. Who's going to get the power plant and who's going to get this and that? And so, you know, it's a -- it's not an easy process.

TRUMP: But phase one is the ceasefire. A lot of the individual subjects have been discussed. You know, we've been discussing concepts of land because you don't want to waste time with a ceasefire if it's not going to mean anything. So we say, look, this is what you can get. This is what you can't get.

They discuss NATO and being in NATO. And everybody knows what the answer to that is. They've known that answer for 40 years, in all fairness. So a lot of the details of the final agreement have actually been discussed. Now, we're going to see whether or not Russia is there. And if they're not, it'll be a very disappointing moment for the world.

Yeah?

QUESTION: Does Vladimir Putin just said he is open to a ceasefire, but he does still have some concerns? He suggested that you two should speak directly. Do you have plans to speak to him soon? If so, how can we get this across?

TRUMP: Sure. He did say that today. It was a very promising statement because other people are saying different things. And you don't know if they have anything to, really, if they have any meaning -- or I don't know. I think some of them were making statements. I don't think they have anything to do with it.

No, he put out a very promising statement, but it wasn't complete. And, yeah, I'd love to meet with him or talk to him. But we have to get it over with fast. You know, everyday people are being killed.

It's not like, as we sit here, two people will be killed. Think of it. Two people are going to be killed during this little period of time. Thousands of people a week are dying. So we really don't have very much time. We have to make this fast. It shouldn't be very complicated.

QUESTION: Mr. President, a representative of Canada, the finance minister in town and we'll meet members of your administration during the day. Any chances that you will ban on the tariffs on aluminum and the ones that are planned for April 2nd?

TRUMP: No.

QUESTION: You are not going to change your mind?

TRUMP: No, no. Look, we've been ripped off for years. We're not going to be ripped off anymore. No, I'm not going to bend at all. Aluminum or steel or cars, we're not going to bend.

We've been ripped off as a country for many, many years. We've been subjected to costs that we shouldn't be subjected to.

[13:45:00]

In the case of Canada, we're spending $200 billion a year to subsidize Canada. I love Canada. I love the people of Canada. I love -- I have many friends in Canada. The great one, Wayne Gretzky, the great. How good is Wayne Gretzky? He's the great one.

But we have a -- I know many people from Canada that are good friends of mine. But, you know, the United States can't subsidize a country for $200 billion a year. We don't need their cars. We don't need their energy. We don't need their lumber. We don't need anything that they -- that they get.

We do it because we want to be helpful. But it comes a point when you just can't do that. You have to run your own country. And to be honest with you, Canada only works as a state. It doesn't -- we don't need anything they have.

As a state, it would be one of the great states, anyway. This would be the most incredible country visually. If you look at a map, they drew an artificial line right through it between Canada and the U.S., just a straight artificial line.

Somebody did it a long time ago, many, many decades ago, and it makes no sense. It's so perfect as a great and cherished state. Keeping "Oh, Canada", the national anthem. I love it. I think it's great. Keep it. But it'll be for a state, one of our greatest states, maybe our greatest state.

But why should we subsidize another country for $200 billion? Of course, it's $200 billion a year. And again, we don't need their lumber. We don't need their energy. We have more than they do. We don't need anything. We don't need the cars. I'd much rather make the cars here. And there's not a thing that we need.

Now, there'll be a little disruption, but it won't be very long. But they need us. We really don't need them. And we have to do this. I'm sorry. We have to do this.

Yes?

QUESTION: Mr. President?

TRUMP: Yeah?

QUESTION: You made it very clear that NATO needs to step up, although great progress has been made in the first mandate. How do you envision this new transatlantic?

TRUMP: Are you talking about NATO stepping up?

QUESTION: Yes.

TRUMP: Well, NATO is stepping up for this man. This man is a man that only knows how to step up. And we have the same goal in mind. We want the war ended and he's doing his job. He only knows how to do a good job. That's one thing. That's why I fought for him to get that job, because they had some other candidates that I'll tell you would not have done a very good job.

RUTTE: I need this part of the -- of the movie for my family.

TRUMP: We're going to -- we're going to get him clip of that little essay. But the rest of the statements, he doesn't care.

QUESTION: So, how does this new transatlantic cooperation? How do you envision it?

TRUMP: Well, we have this one thing. I mean, you know, we're on the other side of the ocean and they're right there. And yet, we're in for $350 billion because of Biden and they're in for a $100 billion. So, it's a big difference and it's unfair. And I said, you have to equalize. They should equalize. They should have -- it should have never happened where Biden just gave this money away.

Now, as you know, we're we have an agreement with Ukraine on the rare earths and other things. And that'll get us something back, a lot back and get us our money back. We're not doing it for that, though.

We're doing -- I'm just doing this to get the worst up. I'm doing it really to save lives. But at the same time, we were treated very unfairly, as we always are by every country. And we're in for very substantially more than the European nations are in for, and that shouldn't be.

You know, they're much more affected by it than we are, because we do have an ocean in between. But I don't know. I think good things are going to happen. I really do. I think good things are going to happen.

I do say -- we were talking before, and Mark was very nice. He said, "If you were to get involved, there would be no -- you'd just be going on". This thing would have gone on for a long time.

RUTTE: Breaking a deadlock. It was crucial.

TRUMP: Yeah, we broke a deadlock. We did break a deadlock. I hope -- I hope it's meaningful.

RUTTE: Yes.

TRUMP: Yes? Did you have one? Yeah?

QUESTION: Thank you, Mr. President. And I had just the news on the southern border, you've got DHS and ICE who are reporting that there was a little bit of fudging of numbers during the Biden administration on both the catch and the release side. With respect to reporting the number of illegals coming into the country...

TRUMP: They cheat with the numbers. They worked the numbers -- I love that question. Who are you with?

QUESTION: Just The News.

TRUMP: Very nice. That's good.

QUESTION: Do you know how many of those are criminal, illegal aliens? And Biden's out of office, Alejandro Mayorkas... TRUMP: No, Biden fudged the numbers. The numbers were totally fake. And he gave fake numbers. I knew they were fake. Everybody knew they were fake. But now, it came out and terrible what they did. That administration was a horror show for this country.

QUESTION: Can you hold anyone accountable?

TRUMP: Well, I don't know.

[13:50:00]

They gave phony numbers, and phony numbers are a very bad thing to give. But I'm not sure about that. I don't know how it would play. We want to get it straight down.

We have -- we're after many, many bad people that were let into our country. And Kristi Noem and my friend Homan --- how good is Tom Homan doing, right? And they're after him and they can't -- I mean, you see they're taking them out in record numbers. Gang members, gang leaders, drug dealers.

There's a problem the Netherlands does not have. The Netherlands never had this problem. If you'd like to take it...

RUTTE: There are few (inaudible).

TRUMP: I can deliver some nice people to the Netherlands.

RUTTE: I'm not sure.

TRUMP: No, what he did to this country, letting 21 million people flow through an open border, many of those people were hard criminals from prisons and jails, from mental institutions, and I always say insane asylums because they were seriously deranged. And they're here from, not South America -- from all over the world. From South America, but from all over the world, and it's so -- it's so sad. You'd say, why would anybody do this? Why?

OK, go ahead.

QUESTION: And (inaudible) there's some new internal Democrat polling that doesn't look great for Democrats, but it also has 54 percent unfavorability for Republicans in swing states and battlegrounds for the midterms. Do you consider those voters cap- -- capturable for -- for Republicans?

TRUMP: Yeah, well, we did -- you know, I won every swing state, as you know, by a lot, and I won the popular vote by a lot, and we won the counties. If you look at the counties and district plan, we had 2,725, and they had 501. That's a real -- that's why the map is all red. So we had a great thing.

Yeah, I think -- I think winning from the Democrats -- I saw -- if you look the other night, I made a speech, and I introduced two young ladies who were killed, right? Two killed, viciously, violently killed, young -- unbelievable -- both outstanding people. They were killed by illegal aliens, and the Democrats wouldn't get up and applaud. The mothers were, I mean, inconsolable. They were crying, and everybody was crying. The Democrats sat there with stone faces. They didn't clap. They didn't stand. They didn't do anything.

SANCHEZ: We've been listening to President Trump at the White House, inside the Oval Office, alongside the NATO Secretary-General Mark Rutte.

The headlines here from this press availability, the president saying that a statement put out by Vladimir Putin, saying that he was open to a sort of ceasefire deal, but not really accepting the terms on which the U.S. had proposed.

It was a very promising statement, saying Trump, that it was incomplete. He would love to meet and talk to Putin, but we have to get it over with fast. He wants to see a ceasefire.

He also essentially announced something we hadn't heard before, the way that this is being negotiated. He says that we've been discussing pieces of land that would be kept and lost, adding that there's a power plant involved, a question of who gets that power plant. It's not an easy process, he says.

He also added that there's a question of whether Ukraine can join NATO being a NATO -- he said of Ukraine, they've known that answer for 40 years. If we don't see a deal, Trump says, it will be a very disappointing moment for the world.

KEILAR: Yes, that power plant, the largest in Europe, the Zaporizhzhia power plant, which Russia was able to take over and supply so much of the power to Ukraine, but also other parts of the continent.

He said -- he's trying to kind of put some lipstick on, I don't know, maybe a pig, as we hear Vladimir Putin saying that this is -- you know, he has reservations about this ceasefire. He has not closed the door on this ceasefire, of course.

He said, the idea is great and correct, but he's quibbling with a lot of the details of this, even as Trump is saying they're getting word -- word that things are going OK in Russia, they're having very serious discussions.

And it sounds like he's expecting to get some more information, hopefully, in a good position today to know where we are with Ukraine.

And we're back now with our panel to talk a little bit more about this.

What did you think, David, of what you heard from the president there?

DAVID SANGER, CNN POLITICAL & NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Well, a few things. First, he's clearly in a position here where he wants to encourage the Russians to get to yes.

And on the one hand, the good news about that is that could get you to a ceasefire and save lives. The worrisome news about this is he could be willing to give away

almost anything here if, in fact, his bigger concern isn't Ukraine, but rather just rebuilding the relationship with Russia, which the Europeans think is actually where -- where he is headed.

Two or three other things jumped out at me. The Zaporizhzhia plant, right now, the Russians occupy it, but they have -- the electricity has largely not been going into Ukraine. It's been diverted elsewhere.

That was a Ukrainian plant. And it would be interesting if the Russians got ahold of it.

[13:54:59]

He -- the president said that the Ukrainians have known for 40 years they're not getting into NATO. As recently as the last NATO meeting, there was a promise that you will certainly one day get into NATO. Now, Biden kept putting that -- that day off.

I thought it was interesting on Canada, just to switch topics here for a moment. For the second or third time in a week, he raised the renegotiation of the border line in the in the Great Lakes, something that was decided in a treaty about 120 years ago that he clearly is interested in reopening.

So, you know, you're seeing just a little -- little more that -- at one point he said, "We don't need anything from the Canadians. They need everything from us.

SANCHEZ: Trump saying that Canada could be the best U.S. state. Saying that Canada only works as a state, even saying that they could keep their national anthem.

But if it becomes the states anthem, an interesting pitch there from the president.

Kim, do you -- I wonder what you took from that.

KIMBERLY DOZIER, CNN GLOBAL AFFAIRS ANALYST: Well, to pick up on what David was saying about Zaporizhzhia, you know, there were four oblasts of Ukraine that Russia has annexed, including Zaporizhzhia and Kherson.

But Russia doesn't control those areas completely. So it sounds like Putin's opening gambit is to say we want you to recognize and give us these territories that we have not yet won militarily. And that is a nonstarter in Ukraine.

But the other thing I hear is this has given Trump and Putin an excuse to meet in person ASAP. And I think within days we're going to hear an announcement of a meeting.

And that's when everything gets really perilous, including for those inside Trump's national security team who don't trust Russia, are very anti-Russia. And are worried that the master manipulator, Putin, is going to get in a room with him and make all of this sound reasonable and make Ukraine again sound to him like the bad guy.

KEILAR: Mark, what did you think?

MARK PRESTON, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: I mean, look, I think that we should dismiss the idea that Vladimir Putin and Donald Trump may have worked this out beforehand.

I think that Donald Trump is not surprised that Vladimir Putin came out in fatigues and pushed back a little bit to show the bellicose of the leader that he is.

I mean, we know that Donald Trump looks up to authoritarian figures. And clearly, he is the ultimate authoritarian figure.

I do think, though, Kim is right, we are going to see a meeting very quickly.

Donald Trump was very, very adamant about saying -- he said a couple of times, a lot of these details have been worked out, a lot of these details have been worked out.

Well, what are those details? What we're seeing in the public or what -- what is David and Kim talk about, what's happening really behind the scenes where Russia is really going to end up on -- on the right side of things?

SANCHEZ: We should also mention that the president was asked about a looming government shutdown. The deadline of course, midnight tomorrow. Senate Democrats are ironing out exactly how they are going to come out on this.

The president saying that if there is a shutdown, it's Democrats fault. But if something needs to be negotiated, he's offering his perspective there, saying that I'm here and willing to listen.

KEILAR: Yes. And we will continue to follow this. This play out of the Oval Office meeting between the NATO secretary-general continues. These things are running about 45 minutes long on average. So we'll continue to monitor that for you.

Stay with us. And we'll have much more coverage after this short break.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)