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The Cosby Show Star Malcolm-Jamal Warner Dies at Age 54; Kremlin: Can't Rule Out a September Putin-Trump Meeting in Beijing; Four Suspects in UC Berkeley Professor's Murder Plead Guilty. Aired 2:30-3p ET

Aired July 21, 2025 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:30:00]

SEGUN ODUOLOWU, ENTERTAINMENT JOURNALIST: -- words because when I saw the news, I could not believe it. 54 is not only so young, but what he meant to me growing up and to a great many of us to see something like that, represent, to see us represented is so powerful. It's definitely a tragic loss, not just for the entertainment community, but the Black community as a whole.

We lost somebody that -- I throw it to you, Bomani, I grew up watching him and laughing and my dad did the same thing. I brought you into this world. I'll take you out.

He just did it with a Nigerian accent.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN HOST: It's such a good point that he in his life tried to live up to that, to that wholesome image himself, Segun. It's such, it's such a great point. Sorry, Bomani, go ahead.

BOMANI JONES, HOST, THE RIGHT TIME WITH BOMANI JONES PODCAST: No, I was going to say the dynamic that Segun pointed out is interesting because my parents are both professionals, but the thing is the Cosby show comes out in 85. I'm five years old, so I don't have a recollection of the world without -- a world without the Cosby show. And so what was revolutionary for a lot of people for me was much more commonplace because of the life they showed was more similar to a life that I recognize.

Now, what I always find to be interesting and not that this was that different from most, from many sitcoms, but as much as Cosby had a tendency to fall into traps of respectability politics, those kids were driving him crazy at every turn. And the Theo Huxtable drive him crazy was interesting in the first couple of seasons of the show, because it's just basically your son's a screw up who says he wants to be a regular person. He had to tell him that that's why he made D's and everything.

The progression of the character was one who had actually an undiagnosed learning disability, which I think for, A, created a relatability to a lot of people in circumstances where they felt like they were doing their best and just couldn't get it right. And so it went from being a joke that Theo can't get it right to you recognizing, oh, there's a reason. And there's way ahead of kind of a conscientiousness that we have now about those issues.

But it also, I think the term class was used, but as the Theo Huxtable character gets older, he just gets a whole lot cooler. Like that was somebody that you could see by the end of it and be like, yes, I wouldn't mind kicking it like that guy kicks it. So as much as we could talk about like these kind of deeper issues of how it affected Black people in the end, this worked because it was an entertaining television show.

And a big part of why it was entertaining is he gave one of the more realistic portrayals of a teenager on screen while actually being a teenager, because normally people who get that right are actors who are older and can look back on what their lives were in real time. He was capturing what a 14, 15, 16 year old would be in a very relatable format for not just Black people, but also Americans. Like it's crazy to think how many white people watch that show at the time, given how decidedly Black it was.

So we can claim the character very closely, certainly, but let's be careful and not lose sight of the fact that this was an American character that was shared by the country from coast to coast.

SCIUTTO: I'll say, listen, as I said to Brianna earlier, I watched it. I watched it religiously as well, but I could hear maybe you're the same. I hear in the passion, Segun and Bomani in your voices, just what it meant to you to watch this show, right? It just comes across with everything you say.

ODUOLOWU: Yes, Bomani touched on it like the learning disability, like in the Black community, in many communities, that's not discussed, right? I had never seen that before.

And I know people that because of what was displayed on the Cosby show and that conversation led to conversations in their own family. Bomani is right. This was an American character because you don't be on the most successful sitcom in television at the time, if it was only for one group of people.

Malcolm Jamal Warner himself, away from the camera, and I know you all mentioned it, led a very private life. He was kind of like the anti- star and really didn't, you know, seek the fame, but was really an artist. And the art form that he showed on television that we consumed, you know, must-see TV, Thursday night, you knew the time.

You sat down there, we ate dinner watching the Cosby show. It was one of the only shows that we could watch. And like I said, for me and for my brothers, I've been on the phone with them and we're having conversations like, I can't believe he's gone.

And we're reminiscing and being reminded about shows and episodes. And you know, the Gordon Gartrelle, when Denise made the shirt for him, there are episodes that his character went through that are so indelible and left memories for us that are never going to go away.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: Yes, yes, I think it was dyslexia that he had. And I think of his early adventures, because it was early on in the series, with Cockroach, his friend, who was so memorable as well.

Just so much warmth that he brought to that character. And so much of himself, clearly, that he brought to that character. Segun Oduolowu and Bomani Jones, thank you so much to both of you. Really, really appreciate this conversation, as I think so many people are feeling this and our hearts go out to this family.

[14:35:00]

SCIUTTO: That's the thing, a family has lost their father today. And our prayers with them.

KEILAR: Yes, thank you guys so much.

Still to come, there is a possibility that President Trump will be talking with Vladimir Putin here in the coming weeks. What this could mean for the struggling push for peace in Ukraine.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SCIUTTO: A meeting between President Trump and Russian President Putin is still on the table for now. The Kremlin says it cannot rule out the possibility of the two leaders sitting down on the sidelines of an upcoming World War II anniversary event in Beijing, assuming that Trump also attends the commemoration.

[14:40:00]

This comes after the Ukrainian president, Volodymyr Zelenskyy, called for talks with Russia next week to advance ceasefire negotiations.

A spokesman for the Kremlin, Dmitry Peskov, on Sunday told Russian media that Moscow is, quote, ready to move quickly on a peace deal with this caveat.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DMITRY PESKOV, KREMLIN SPOKESMAN (through translator): Russia is prepared to move swiftly. For us, the main thing is to achieve our objectives. They are clear, obvious, and unchanging. But the process doesn't depend solely on us.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Russia later launched another barrage of intense missile strikes across Ukraine, killing at least two people, wounding more than a dozen. Many of the targets, civilian targets, apartment buildings.

Here with me now is Andrius Kubilius. He's European Commissioner for Defense and Space. Commissioner, thanks so much for taking the time.

ANDRIUS KUBILIUS, EUROPEAN COMMISSIONER FOR DEFENSE AND SPACE: My pleasure.

SCIUTTO: So first, given you're coming to Washington following what most described as a positive NATO summit, a positive meeting between President Trump and America's European allies, do you find the state of that relationship better now, given in the past President Trump has often criticized not just NATO, but the EU as well?

KUBILIUS: Well, at least we're doing our job, you know. We are really preparing our defense readiness to take responsibility on European defense on our shoulders. And that comes, you know, because of American position, which was always very similar, asking us to take that responsibility.

And second, because we are, you know, feeling very much no threat of possible Russian aggression.

SCIUTTO: The German chancellor, when he was elected, said quite publicly that part of the reason, perhaps even the principal reason, for Europe to boost its defenses is because it can no longer trust the U.S. to lead, perhaps even to come to its defense. Do European partners fear that perhaps if there was an attack by Russia, for instance, they would be on their own?

KUBILIUS: Well, you know, we hear also very clear announcement by President Trump that, you know, America is standing together with NATO and with Article 5. So this is one thing. But second is, definitely, we hear also from American administration that Europeans should take responsibility on European defense because, you know, of rising Chinese military power, maybe Americans will need to shift more and more towards Indo-Pacific.

So we take that as some kind of basis for our strategy, and strategy is very clear. We are starting to invest huge amounts of money into our defense.

SCIUTTO: Yes. Talking about Ukraine now, this is yet another night of just punishing air attacks by Russia. We did have the news in the last week that the U.S. will continue weapon shipments to Ukraine, including air defense. Does Ukraine, with the combination of what it's receiving from Europe, does it have what it needs now to defend itself?

KUBILIUS: Well, that's perhaps for military experts to say, you know, better. But definitely, you know, in my view, the only way to convince Mr. Putin to end the war is to implement the formula peace through strength, and strength on Ukrainian side. And we need to see very clearly. Yes, both in the United States and we, we did quite a lot supporting Ukraine since the very beginning of the war.

But if you calculate in, you know, monetary terms, how much we gave, you know, military support, it's both sides, we gave around 60 billion during, you know, three years. So it means per year, we're giving around 20 billion, and 20 billion from both sides, 20 from EU, from U.S., is around 0.1 percent of our GDP.

SCIUTTO: Yes.

KUBILIUS: So 0.1 percent of GDP is not, you know, zero, but it's not also 3.5 percent, which we are ready, according to NATO agreements, to invest into our defense. We can do more.

SCIUTTO: You heard the Kremlin spokesperson there saying that Russia is ready to move swiftly towards peace negotiations, as long as all of our objectives have been met. Has Russia at all reduced its objective of, in a sense, essentially controlling Ukraine?

KUBILIUS: Well, you know, definitely, and a lot of European leaders are very clearly saying that there is no clear picture that Putin will agree on peace, if situation will continue to be as it is now. Because perhaps he is considering that he is winning --

SCIUTTO: Yes.

KUBILIUS: -- in this situation. And that is why, you know, strength on Ukrainian side is one of the conditions, how peace can be brought much more quickly.

And that is what we need to do.

SCIUTTO: Do you believe that Putin is seriously interested in peace negotiations right now, or more likely wants to continue the war?

KUBILIUS: I see that he wants to continue.

[14:45:00]

SCIUTTO: Well, let's hope that changes. Andrius Kubilius, Commissioner for Defense, thanks so much for joining.

KUBILIUS: Thanks a lot.

SCIUTTO: And still to come, the latest on the murder of an American professor in Greece, his ex-wife saying she fears she might lose her children.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KEILAR: We are following new developments in the death of the UC Berkeley professor who was killed in Greece. Four of the five suspects charged in the case pleaded guilty in court today. The fifth suspect is the professor's ex-wife, who'd been in a bitter custody battle with him. She says she had nothing to do with his murder. Her boyfriend, the main suspect, allegedly confessed.

CNN producer Elinda Lapropoulou is in Athens with more on what happened today in court. Alinda, tell us what happened.

ELINDA LAPROPOULOU, CNN PRODUCER: It's been a remarkable day in court in Athens today. Actually, we just had five pleas from the five people that were allegedly involved in the killing of the American professor. All five have been remanded in custody, including his ex-wife. We just heard this just minutes ago.

The partner, the current partner of the ex-wife, has confessed to murdering the professor. He said he did it because he was afraid that he would take the children away from them, away from him and his partner, the mother of the children. He said he could not bear to see his partner go through that.

Now, the truth is that the professor and the children all had both Polish and U.S. citizenship. The mother only had Greek citizenship. She was in full custody of the children since the divorce.

[14:50:00]

The father had visitation rights, had come to Greece to see the children and to go through a hearing in relation to their custody case just a day before he was killed. So it seems that this was indeed the motive that led the current boyfriend to the murder.

But what is really significant here is what happens to the children now, because once the mother has been remanded in custody, then it becomes much easier for the custody to possibly go to the relatives of the professor in Poland who do want joint custody. The lawyer of the ex-wife spoke to us earlier today, saying how much she fears losing her children.

Let's take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ALEXANDROS PASIATAS, LAWYER FOR EX-WIFE OF PRZEMYSLAW JEZIORSKI: My client is not guilty. She has nothing to do with the murder. She had no prior knowledge of the whole thing. She happened to be the murderer's girlfriend. And now the most important is that she's terrified about the future of her children because she thinks that she may lose them.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LAPROPOULOU: Well, as you can -- as you can see, it's been a very emotional case. It's gripped Greek audiences as well. People in Greece have been following it very closely, both because the professor was somebody who's a very prominent person, but also because of all the emotional value that went into this battle -- Brianna.

KEILAR: Yes, certainly capturing a lot of attention. Thank you so much, Elinda Lapropoulou, for that report.

Still to come, a heat dome sitting on top of 70 million people facing dangerous temperatures this week. We're going to tell you why this heat wave is so worrying.

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[14:55:00]

SCIUTTO: Right now more than 70 million Americans are under heat alerts as a heat dome hovers over the southeast and expands into the Midwest later this week. And while it is certainly warmer during the day, it's also hot at night, low temps, 10 to 15 degrees above normal.

Meteorologist Derek Van Dam joins us now from the CNN Weather Center. So, Derek, are we going to get any relief for this anytime soon? DEREK VAN DAM, CNN METEOROLOGIST: I would love to say that we are, but I believe that this heat wave will actually build and get worse before we get any real relief, at least that's what the extended outlook shows us.

So here's those 60 million Americans under these heat alerts right now. And of course, this is a combination of the dangerous overnight lows, but also the humidity that we've been talking about, the above average moisture levels in the atmosphere.

All of these red dots have, since the beginning of summer, or at least the meteorological summer, June 1st, have set their warmest minimum average temperature to date. That's really saying something. And we could broaden it out and look at it in a few different ways, but the overnight lows here are just simply stifling.

In fact, we're talking about significant amounts of overnight lows. None of the daytime highs for other locations. I mean, we're talking about reaching 100 degrees for the first time in Dallas this year.

Nothing out of the ordinary there, but the fact that we're seeing that triple digit heat is really saying something. And it's going to spike here in St. Louis, places like Chicago again. So it's really a Midwest and into the central parts of the U.S. Eventually, that heat will spread to the eastern parts of the country as well. And so you can kind of see this departure from normal as we build this heat dome through the coming days, Jim. And then it just recycles itself. More heat and more humidity means more uncomfortable nights ahead -- Jim.

SCIUTTO: We're definitely feeling them here in Washington, D.C. I'll tell you that much. Derek Van Dam, thanks so much.

Still to come, more reaction to the tragic news about the death of sitcom star, podcast star, singer Malcolm Jamal Warner.

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