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Government Shutdown to Last Through at Least Friday; Interview with Rep. Randy Fine (R-FL): Government Shuts Down as GOP, Dems Deadlock on Spending; Supreme Court Lets Fed Governor Lisa Cook Keep Job for Now; Lawyers Indicate Combs Wants to Address Judge Before Sentencing. Aired 3:30-4p ET

Aired October 01, 2025 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:30:00]

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: The nation's first government shutdown in six years will go into Friday. The Senate is going to take a break tomorrow from voting on any bills to fund the government so that Jewish members can observe Yom Kippur.

Let's get to CNN correspondent Arlette Saenz on Capitol Hill for the latest here. All right, Arlette, where are the two sides right now?

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, right now, Brianna, Republicans and Democrats are continuing to dig in, and now many senators are leaving town until Friday. The Senate failed to advance a stopgap funding bill measure a bit earlier this morning, and now Senate GOP leaders are allowing members to leave for the Jewish holiday of Yom Kippur tomorrow. There will not be votes tomorrow, meaning the earliest that senators could take steps to try to reopen the government is Friday, but it's likely that the impasse could last much longer.

Now, Republicans continue to believe that the way to end the shutdown is to get Democrats on board with that seven-week plan. So far, only three senators who caucus with Democrats have switched over to help the GOP on that front. They still need five Democrats to get on board, but Democrats want Republicans to come to the negotiating table on healthcare, specifically on Obamacare subsidies.

Now, there was an interesting scene that played out on the Senate floor during votes earlier today when a bipartisan group of senators huddled for a lengthy period of time. You know, you could see they were very animated in their speech and their facial expressions. We were told that these were really informal conversations, people wanting to come together to try to figure out a way out of this impasse.

We caught up with two Democratic senators who said now is the time to get talking.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEN. JEANNE SHAHEEN (D-NH): We are not that far apart. This is not that difficult to solve. If people would just sit down. Actually, a number of my women colleagues and I have talked about the fact that if the women were in charge, we'd have done this by now.

SEN. PETER WELCH (D-VT): Those discussions we were having with some Republican members, they appreciate that the peril that faces Vermonters with these huge spikes in premiums and maybe $13,000, $14,000, $15,000, they affect folks in West Virginia or North Dakota and South Dakota. So that's the beginning of moving towards trying to get a resolution where there's a common acknowledgement of a problem that affects all of us and the people we represent. Now, there's a long way from where we were having that discussion to a resolution.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SAENZ: So senators say it's a good sign that they are at least talking, but it's unclear whether this would actually result in any proposals that will get leadership and President Trump on board.

I will also note that this afternoon, the OMB director, Russ Vought, held a call with House Republicans where sources said he laid out that permanent layoffs of federal workers will start to begin in the next day or two. That is another pressure point that lawmakers will begin to feel.

It's still unclear how many federal workers might be laid off or impacted, but that is one of the concerns that some Democrats and even some Republicans have around a long-term shutdown.

KEILAR: All right, Arlette Saenz, thank you for the latest from Capitol Hill -- Boris.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Let's discuss the details of the shutdown with Republican Congressman Randy Fine of Florida. He sits on the House Education and Workforce Committee. Congressman, thank you so much for sharing this afternoon with us.

I want to start with a looming threat from OMB regarding massive layoffs at federal agencies. We understand they're coming in the next two to three days. Have you heard any further specifics about when exactly they might be coming and from where?

REP. RANDY FINE (R-FL): I haven't, and Russ was very clear with us on our call a couple of hours ago that they're being very precise and very focused in refining those plans so that whatever they do is done in a very targeted way to fundamentally shrink the size and scope of government. It'll be with a scalpel, not with a hatchet.

SANCHEZ: There are some 95,000 federal civil employees in your home state of Florida, more than 5,000 in your district. What's your message to them?

FINE: Well, my message to them is I cannot believe that Democrats are willing to have them not be paid so that they can give free healthcare to illegal immigrants because that's what's happening. I'm also amazed that Democrats say they care about healthcare, but now they've cut off WIC for women and children who are in need in my district. And I'm also angry that my constituents in Holly Hill, who I just met with a little while ago, said they can't sell their houses because now the people buying can't buy flood insurance.

[15:35:00]

These are terrible things that are going on, and I can't believe Democrats are doing to this -- doing this to us.

SANCHEZ: I do want to ask you specifically about that claim that we've heard from many Republicans that Democrats want to provide free healthcare to undocumented immigrants.

It's much more nuanced than that, isn't it? Because a lot of folks that are being -- that are currently ineligible, that Democrats are arguing should be eligible, are here lawfully, at least presently.

A lot of these folks are asylum seekers. They've applied for asylum in the United States. They're refugees or they're DACA recipients. It's not as though many of them don't actually have permission to be in the country, right?

FINE: It's not nuanced at all. In preparation for this interview, I went on my X-feed at @RepFine, and I put examples from New York, North Carolina, and Rhode Island where unquestionable illegal immigrants, not DACA people, not refugees, illegal immigrants are told that they can get Medicaid.

It is happening. It is not right. And the Democrat proposal to stop the shutdown requires us to let these illegals get Medicaid. And we're not going to be held hostage for that.

We should be focused on Americans, not on illegal immigrants.

SANCHEZ: I believe their proposal speaks to those who are lawfully present in the country. Again, people seeking asylum, DACA recipients, refugees. So it's not necessarily a full blanket proposal for undocumented immigrants.

Isn't there some misdirection that's going on, some conflation between folks that don't have permission to be there and folks that the administration may argue came here via a program that the last administration installed that they see as illegal, but are still nevertheless holding some form of permission to be here?

FINE: No, our bill that we passed, the Working Families Tax Cut, said the kinds of programs that I've featured on my X-feed from New York, Rhode Island, North Carolina cannot continue where unquestionable illegal immigrants are told they can get Medicaid. This is not true. And the Democrats' proposal says, no, no, no, let's back that up so that they can get it.

It is clear. And Democrats have even admitted it. Maxine Waters admitted it yesterday. She wants people to be able to get Medicaid if they're illegal. We're not OK with that. And the bottom line is Democrats should not be holding Americans hostage in order to get free healthcare for illegal immigrants.

Reopen the government, if you want to argue about it over the next seven weeks, do it, but stop holding everybody hostage over these demands.

SANCHEZ: Well, I do want to get to that point of what happens next, but I do want to point out there is still some nuance and disagreement. I don't think that overall they want undocumented people to get benefits. I think that that's a bit hyperbolic.

Nevertheless, I've spoken to Democrats who say that they are skeptical that Republicans would actually bring up this question of extending the Obamacare subsidies that are set to expire at the end of the year. As you know, a lot of folks, open enrollment begins for them in just a matter of weeks, and they are going to see way more expensive premiums. We're talking about roughly 25 plus million Americans.

I wonder what you say to those folks. Are you bullish about having conversations regarding extending ACA subsidies or not?

FINE: Well, you talk about nuance. You need to be nuanced. The debate is not about Obamacare subsidies. Those subsidies have been in place since Obamacare was created. These debates are about COVID era special subsidies that were created because of COVID. Those discussions and debates can happen over the next seven weeks.

All this continuing resolution does is keep the government open until November 21st. Can they make it happen? Can they not?

I don't know, but what I know is this, my constituents in Holly Hill should be able to sell their houses and they can't. My constituents that are dependent on WIC funding to feed their kids, they can't do that either. And this debate over COVID era Obamacare subsidies should not be keeping the government closed.

SANCHEZ: It is a fair point that these subsidies were expanded during the COVID pandemic. Nevertheless, a lot of people rely on those subsidies for health insurance. It's not like not having them is going to make life easier for folks.

So I wonder what your thoughts are on the argument about extending those subsidies. Do these folks, again, 25 plus million Americans that might potentially lose healthcare that will undoubtedly see their premiums go up, do they deserve those benefits?

FINE: No one's saying we shouldn't have that debate. What we're saying is should women and children go hungry because Democrats are unwilling to keep the government open.

SANCHEZ: I understand that.

FINE: That's the discussion. This continuing resolution is not a 10 year solution.

SANCHEZ: I'm looking for --

FINE: It's a seven week solution.

SANCHEZ: I'm looking --

FINE: And we have to have that debate now.

[15:40:00]

SANCHEZ: I understand your position on the government being open, but I do wonder, given the skepticism that we've heard from Democrats that Republicans are going to pick this up, I would like for you to answer whether it is something that you are willing to support or not back. If it is something that you are earnestly wanting to debate, because part of the reason Democrats are trying to have this argument now is because they say Republicans won't actually even bring this up.

FINE: No, no, no, no, but that's not true. They can file amendments. They can bring it up however they want. It may not pass. I don't know the answer to that. I'm only one vote, but what I know is this.

SANCHEZ: And what would be your position?

FINE: Holding people hostage to extend an Obama -- Obamacare subsidy for COVID and keeping people from getting their WIC funding? That's just not OK. That's not how you run the railroad.

SANCHEZ: So is it fair to say that you would not support extending those Obamacare subsidies that some 25 million Americans rely on?

FINE: I'm not inclined to say that COVID is still ongoing. However, that's not the debate we're having today. And I'm only one vote. Some of my colleagues may agree with me. Some of them may not. My view is we open the government, have that debate over the next seven weeks, let the chips fall where they may, but don't tell my constituents they can't sell their houses and they can't feed their kids because you want to argue about COVID-era Obamacare subsidies.

That's not right. This should not be about illegal immigrants. This should not be about Obamacare. This should be about getting the government open so that people can actually live their lives. And Democrats are not OK in holding us hostage to do that.

SANCHEZ: Congressman Randy Fine, we have to leave the conversation there. Always appreciate getting your perspective. I hope you have a healthy holiday.

Shanah Tova.

FINE: Thank you. Thank you, appreciate it.

SANCHEZ: Ahead, the Supreme Court taking up a case with huge stakes for the Federal Reserve and its independence from political influence. That story coming your way in just moments.

[15:45:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KEILAR: The Federal Reserve's independence, widely viewed as critical to America's economy, is at stake in a new Supreme Court case. The court says it will hear arguments in a case over President Trump's efforts to fire Fed Governor Lisa Cook back in August. The court says she can keep her job for now until the case is heard in January.

But the impact of this case could go far beyond that. Will the court allow President Trump to meddle in the Fed?

We're joined now by CNN Chief Supreme Court Analyst, Joan Biskupic. All right, Joan, what did this order say?

JOAN BISKUPIC, CNN CHIEF SUPREME COURT ANALYST: Important development here, that they're going to hold oral arguments. They're not going to decide this case just on the papers as they have for so many other situations where Donald Trump has tried to fire people in independent agencies. They've decided it's serious enough that they're going to hold oral arguments in January.

Lawyers for Lisa Cook will be able to make the case for why she should not be removed while the merits of this litigation go on. And lawyers for Donald Trump are going to be able to say, no, we should be able to remove her immediately.

KEILAR: That's really interesting and a sign of how serious this is. Can we read anything between the lines here about where this is headed?

BISKUPIC: Yes, two things. First of all, the court is allowing her to keep her job. Just about everyone else who's come up here, fired federal workers, fired heads of independent agencies, have been -- the court has allowed Trump to, in the interim, get rid of those people saying, you know, this isn't permanent.

We're just going to say that President Trump is allowed to remove somebody from office while we consider the merits or while lower court judges consider the merits.

But for Lisa Cook, they're saying she can at least keep her job until January and probably a little bit after that while they resolve it.

The other thing we can read into this with the timing is that the justices have already said that they're going to hear a separate major case over just the sheer authority of a president to remove anyone from an independent agency.

That case will be heard in December and that involves the Federal Trade Commission. But in that situation, they might actually give us some hints over whether the Federal Reserve is different. And that's one thing that, you know, lawyers on both sides are wondering about.

A bunch of these independent agencies, you know, safeguard consumer products. They protect workers in the labor force, the federal labor force. But the Federal Reserve is so crucial to the economy, not just in setting rates, of course, but also just keeping the equilibrium of finances going in America.

And the Supreme Court has already suggested that maybe the Federal Reserve as an independent agency is slightly different and they could send some signals in the December case. And then, you know, we'd know a little bit more when we get the oral arguments for Lisa Cook, who has a very serious personal situation here where she's clinging to her job, but also for the nation's regard for the Federal Reserve, Brianna.

KEILAR: Really interesting. Joan, thank you so much for that. Really appreciate it.

BISKUPIC: Sure.

KEILAR: Boris.

SANCHEZ: Now to some of the other headlines we're watching this hour. The White House has confirmed it is pulling the nomination of E.J. Antoni to lead the Bureau of Labor Statistics. Press Secretary Karoline Leavitt telling reporters he remains a great ally of the president but simply didn't have the votes.

Remember that CNN previously reported through K-file that Antony operated a now-deleted Twitter account featuring degrading remarks about former Vice President Kamala Harris, derogatory remarks about gay people and conspiracy theories as well.

Also, a new report has ranked New York the top state when it comes to mental health, with a lower prevalence of mental illness and higher rates of access to care. According to the report, about 23 percent of adults in the U.S. experienced mental health challenges last year.

[15:50:00]

Access to care, though, is falling short, and it's worse in states with greater rural populations, where the number of people without insurance is higher.

And weighing in at more than 1,200 pounds, the large adult male bear known as Chunk has been voted the winner of Fat Bear Week. Despite his size, Chunk was somewhat of an underdog going into the week with a broken jaw.

You kind of see it there on his right side. He handily beat the competition, though more than 30,000 votes ahead of the second-place getter. The bears gather annually at Brooks River, in Katmai National Park, feeding on salmon to gain weight in preparation for winter.

This is actually a live view right now from the National Park of a bear just scanning the horizon. God, what I'd give to be that bear right now.

Still to come, street clothes and a chance to address the court, what we're learning about Sean Diddy Combs' sentencing hearing this Friday, and what we could expect to hear from the convicted rapper as he learns his fate.

Stay with us.

[15:55:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK) KEILAR: Live pictures from New York, as we do have some new video just in to CNN showing the moment that a Bronx high-rise partially collapsed.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Building just fell, huh? Oh! Oh!

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: The video was taken by Victor Johnson, who was in the high- rise just across from the building that partially collapsed.

SANCHEZ: He says he heard strange sounds throughout the night before the building collapsed early this morning. No injuries, fortunately, or deaths have been reported. The FDNY, NYPD, and various city agencies are still looking into what caused the collapse.

Also, we're learning more about Sean Diddy Combs' sentencing set for Friday. In court documents, as lawyers now say that Combs wants to address the judge before the sentence is handed down.

KEILAR: Yes, and the presiding judge has also granted the defense team's request for Combs to be allowed to wear street clothes.

Let's bring in CNN legal analyst and defense attorney, Joey Jackson. Joey, that's pretty interesting because, you know, we didn't see Combs speak in his own defense during the lengthy trial, so how important is this going to be for him?

JOEY JACKSON, CNN LEGAL ANALYST: Yes, good to be with you, Brianna and Boris. It's huge. We did not hear him testify, though we heard a lot from him and saw a lot about him in the trial, but he did not take the stand.

In this instance, I think the judge is going to be looking to see what he says and certainly could influence the sentence the judge decides to give. I think there's three basic principles he'll follow.

The one is that he needs to be contrite. He needs to certainly, you know, be remorseful with respect to what occurred, and that leads to number two, which is to be accountable. He has to recognize that there are victims here who have been hurt by his conduct. He needs to really say that as a role model and a person in the community looked about by so many, people deserve better, his victims deserve better, his family deserve better, the courts deserve better. He didn't give them that.

And then I think the judge is going to want to hear what he's doing as it relates to rehabilitation. How have you spent your time while you have been incarcerated? What are you working on with respect to programs that you've been there? What are you planning to do when you are released?

So I think if he centers them around those issues, which I would be looking for, the contriteness, the accountability, and the rehabilitation, I think the judge could be moved if he starts blaming, making justification and excuses, which I don't expect at all, then I think there could be problems.

SANCHEZ: So on the most serious counts of racketeering and sex trafficking, he was acquitted. He was found guilty of two counts of transportation to engage in prostitution. Last I read, prosecutors want years, right?

I think I read something like 11 years, while the defense argues that 14 months or so is enough. He's already served, I believe, about 13 months. What are you anticipating the sentence might be, Joey?

JACKSON: Yes, so you know what happens, Boris, it's going to be a matter of what the judge focuses on. Now, to be clear on what you just noted, the most serious offense, the racketeering, he could have gone to jail for life. The other counts is related to fraud and coercion that he was acquitted of. That carried a 15-year mandatory minimum. And so this one does not.

Interestingly enough, right, now his defense team wants 14 months, which would equate to time served, you can be released.

Prosecutors want 11 years. The Department of Probation, which does its independent report, wants seven years. And so I think it's going to turn on the issue of acquitted conduct.

You are not, just as of last year, if you're a judge, you are not to consider conduct for which you are acquitted. So the argument is going to be you can consider the nature and characteristics of the defendant. Does that mean the judge considers that he's really violent, or does the defense get its wish that way?

He was acquitted of that and only convicted of transportation for prostitution, which doesn't have a violent component. So that's where the real rub is going to lie. How the judge evaluates that is going to determine the sentence he actually gets.

KEILAR: And just real quick, Joey, during the whole trial, he had his whole family there, right, consistently. Having his mom, his kids, their mothers, is that going to matter to the judge during sentencing?

JACKSON: So I think everything matters, Brianna, and I think that certainly having the familial support there, you'll hear about him having seven kids, of course we've heard that. But I think, you know, it'll be about his family also, but he has to not really make sentencing, Ditty in speaking, about his family.

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He has to make it about the other families that he has really affected negatively, being the victims, but acknowledging that for his family, for his community, for himself, he's gotten better, will do better, is rehabilitated, and as a result, should be released.

KEILAR: All right, well, we just see what happens. Joey Jackson, thank you so much.

And be sure to stay with CNN as we follow the latest on the government shutdown. Tune in to "THE LEAD" with Jake Tapper today. Jake will speak with House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries, an interview that will air live today at 5 Eastern.

SANCHEZ: Still thinking about that bear.

KEILAR: Yes.

SANCHEZ: He's peacefully out there getting ready to hibernate. He'll come out when the government's open again, it'll be great.

KEILAR: There he is.

In the meantime, THE ARENA with Kasie Hunt starts now.

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