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Soon: Trump Expected to Speak from Oval Office; Trump Speaks with Putin Ahead of Zelensky Visit Tomorrow; Sources: DOJ to Ask Grand Jury to Indict John Bolton Today; DOT Pulls $40M from California, Over English Rules for Truckers; Man Accused of Stealing Unreleased Beyonce Music Indicted; WNBA's Angel Reese Walks Runway at Victoria's Secret Show; Tonight: NYC Mayoral Candidates Face Off in Debate. Aired 3- 3:30p ET

Aired October 16, 2025 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: A Second Summit: President Trump says he's agreed to meet face-to-face with Russia's Vladimir Putin again in hopes of ending the war in Ukraine.

And Ordered to Testify: A federal judge wants answers from the ICE field director in Chicago after multiple violent encounters between federal officers and residents are caught on camera, including this one of a teen being tackled and arrested by a border patrol agent.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Plus, he is one of the Democrats' most loved and feared candidates running for office this November. Tonight, Zohran Mamdani takes the stage, hoping to end any debate inside his party.

We're following these major developing stories and many more, all coming in right here to CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

So, we are standing by for President Trump to speak at the White House. He's scheduled to hold an event in the Oval Office, but he also just made a lot of breaking news. The first involving Russia's war on Ukraine. The President just over an hour ago announcing that he and Russian President Vladimir Putin have agreed to meet again in person for talks to end the war. The meeting, he says, will happen in Budapest, Hungary.

And on Gaza, the President posting a grim new warning, saying, quote, "If Hamas continues to kill people in Gaza, which was not the deal, we will have no choice but to go in and kill them." And what he means by we is just one of the critical questions.

Let's bring in senior White House reporter Betsy Klein.

Betsy, first, what more is President -- is the President saying about Putin?

BETSY KLEIN, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Yes, Brianna, the President says that he had a very productive call with Russian President Vladimir Putin. And this comes at such a critical moment for this conflict. And on the eve of his meeting at the Oval -- in the Oval Office with Ukrainian President Zelenskyy.

The President said in a readout of that call that the leaders discussed the future of U.S. and Russian trade relations, as well as returning abducted Ukrainian children from Russia and peace in the Middle East, something that he said could potentially foster an end to this conflict. But notably, some news on the next steps, Brianna.

He said in that post to social media, "At the conclusion of the call, we agreed that there will be a meeting of our High Level Advisors, next week. The United States' initial meetings will be led by Secretary of State Marco Rubio, together with various other people, to be designated. A meeting location is to be determined. President Putin and I will then meet in an agreed-upon location, Budapest, Hungary, to see if we can bring this inglorious war between Russia and Ukraine, to an end."

Of course, yesterday marked two full months since that summit between Presidents Trump and Putin in Alaska. There has been so much stalled momentum for that conflict, the President getting increasingly frustrated and looking for ways to ramp up pressure on Russia, including efforts to share more intelligence with Ukraine on the topic of Russian energy infrastructure, those kinds of facilities, as well as publicly and privately considering the possibility of the U.S. providing those long-range Tomahawk missiles to Ukraine.

That is something that is of deep concern to Russia. They have a 1,500-mile range. Unclear if it came up during this call. It was not in the President's readout, Brianna.

KEILAR: And here now, just a few days after really, you know, celebrating and taking a victory lap on that ceasefire in the Gaza war, there are some issues, obviously, with Hamas delivering the remains of Israeli hostages who were killed. What is the President's message to Hamas? What are officials at the White House saying about this?

KLEIN: The White House is monitoring what is a very fragile peace deal in the Middle East very, very closely. President Trump, taking an unprecedented step in his post to social media just moments ago, he wrote, quote, "If Hamas continues to kill people in Gaza, which was not the Deal, we will have no choice but to go in and kill them."

Of course, we've asked the White House for clarification on what he means by we. If that's the United States, Israel, another party. We'll see if the President addresses this in the coming moments when he takes questions from reporters.

KEILAR: Yes. Raising a lot of questions with that post. Betsy, thank you so much. Really appreciate it. Boris?

SANCHEZ: Let's get some analysis now. We're joined by Russia and geopolitics expert Dmitri Alperovitch. He's also the author of "World on the Brink." Dmitry, thank you so much for being with us. What's your reaction to hearing this news that President Trump and Vladimir Putin are trying to schedule another summit two months after their last one ended with no real progress on ending the war in Ukraine? DMITRI ALPEROVITCH, RUSSIA AND GEOPOLITICS EXPERT: Yes, it's been

almost exactly two months since that last summit, as you said, in Alaska. I think President Putin has realized that things have gone not really great for him since that summit. First of all, the rhetoric from President Trump has changed dramatically in support of Ukraine. He's pressuring the Europeans to cut off oil and gas sales from Russia. And of course, now the conversation about sending potentially Tomahawk cruise missiles that can range key Russian cities like Moscow and St. Petersburg and deliver a thousand-pound warhead.

[15:05:04]

This is a huge problem for Putin. He's trying to undo the -- what he sees as the progress that Zelenskyy has made in the last two months, try to turn this back into a conversation about his needs to end the war on his terms. So, he's going to try to go -- have another go at it.

SANCHEZ: Part of the conversation I was having earlier with CNN Security Analyst Beth Sanner is that she believes this is part of a -- a bit of a poker game between Trump and Putin, where she believes that Putin, in response to that promise or threat potentially to send Tomahawk missiles to Ukraine, Putin is going to try to make Trump think that the world is on the brink of World War III. Do you agree with that assessment? And how well do you think Putin can back up that idea?

ALPEROVITCH: Yes, I mean, this has been the rhetoric from Putin since day one of this war, that any weapons provisions to Ukraine are escalatory and are risking nuclear disaster. He has threatened, of course, nuclear escalation, really, since 2022. So, this is not anything new.

Look, I think there are real problems, logistical problems, in providing Tomahawk missiles to Ukraine. There's a big question of how would they launch them. You need U.S. destroyers or U.S. submarines or at least typhoon truck missile launchers to launch them. We don't have really many of those things, and we need all of them in the Indo- Pacific to provide.

So, I think it's actually probably very unlikely that we would actually provide Tomahawk. So, Donald Trump knows that, and I think he's trying to use the threat of it to try to get Putin to come to the table.

SANCHEZ: I -- I wonder what you make of the portion of the post where Trump announces this potential upcoming second summit, where he says that the two leaders spent a great deal of time talking about trade between the two nations when the war with Ukraine is over. Trump has repeatedly framed the conversation about ending the war as one hinging on Russia's economic promise and the value that a good trade relationship with the U.S. could have for Putin and for his country. Do you think the economy is a motivator for Putin in the way that Trump sees it as one?

ALPEROVITCH: No, I don't think so. I think he's squarely focused on national security. But he actually thinks that Donald Trump is very interested in economic ties with Russia. He says so himself. This is why in Alaska, you may recall, he brought a huge swath of Russian businessmen to that meeting. He's brought his economics minister. So, he was trying to actually engage Donald Trump on economics, saying, forget this war, let's trade together.

And Donald Trump, both in Alaska and again today, said, no, we're not going to do that until the war is over. So, it's Donald Trump that's actually conditioning war's end on ties with Russia.

SANCHEZ: I'm also curious, Dmitri, what you think about the location of this potential summit. And we should note, it only happens if these preliminary meetings between Russian and -- and American delegations go well. Why Hungary specifically? How does Viktor Orban play into all of this?

ALPEROVITCH: Well, I think it was unlikely that Putin would once again go to the United States. That would be a huge concession on his part. Once is fine. Twice it looks like you're paying homage to the United States. He can't afford to do that. Donald Trump is unlikely to come to Moscow, so they need to find middle ground somewhere. And Viktor Orban is someone who is both close to Putin and is close to Donald Trump. So, it's a good setting for both of them to meet there.

SANCHEZ: Dmitri Alperovitch, thank you so much for joining us. I just -- I just want to show our viewers the cover of your book, which we mentioned as we introduced you. We very much appreciate you joining us. "World on the Brink" is the title. Thanks again, Dmitri.

ALPEROVITCH: Thank you.

SANCHEZ: Coming up, we could soon learn if one of President Trump's fiercest critics have been -- has been indicted. The latest developments in the case against John Bolton.

Plus, a highly anticipated mayoral debate tonight in New York City. Why this could be a pivotal opportunity for Democratic nominee Zohran Mamdani to win over members of his own party.

And later, Speaker Johnson calling himself Mad Mike as the shutdown drags on. Day 16 for Mad Mike. We'll be right back.

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[15:13:47]

KEILAR: We're following our breaking news this afternoon, the possible indictment at any moment of John Bolton. Sources telling CNN that the Justice Department will seek that indictment of President Trump's former National Security Advisor today. And the lead prosecutor on the case was actually seen just a short time ago entering the federal courthouse in Maryland.

SANCHEZ: Bolton has been a Trump critic since leaving the White House, and he's under investigation for allegedly mishandling classified information. Sources previously told CNN that part of the investigation centers around notes he made in an AOL account while he was working for Trump. Let's get some perspective now with former U.S. Attorney and former Deputy Assistant Attorney General Harry Litman.

Harry, thanks so much for being with us this afternoon. What do you imagine Bolton could be charged with, and what will you be looking for as you read this potential indictment?

HARRY LITMAN, CNN POLITICAL ANALYST: Yes, well first, I really want to read the words. I think we knew in some of the other cases where a rookie was brought in just to indict that the charges would -- would be threadbare. Here we don't. This is in real -- a very important distinction here, it is a career prosecutor, 12-year veteran of the department, head of the National Security's section in another office. So, offhand, there's the real possibility that these are bona fide.

[15:15:09]

On the other hand, Bolton is a very sophisticated operator. He wouldn't have done something as ham-handed, I think, as just having absconded with National Security papers. So, it does, I -- I'll be looking right away to see, does -- is this about conduct that's long since passed? Either the AOL account you said, or something that happened with his book where he and the administration were crosswise and they sued him not to publish, but he prevailed.

In other words, something about long ago violations that they've now revived to make a national security case. But we really have to read the words of this indictment first before knowing the exact theory.

KEILAR: Yes, it's such an important point that you make there, Harry, because you -- you write in your latest Substack post of this expected Bolton indictment, along with the Comey and Letitia James indictments, quote, "that it leaves little doubt that a once honorable agency," meaning the DOJ, "has fallen into a cesspool," Harry, tell us how you really feel, "with no credible path back so long as Trump is president."

We should note, Harry, it's interesting because CNN reporting, sources are telling CNN that prosecutors within DOJ, they do see this as different from Comey and James. But you're also raising some really interesting questions about how they may -- how it may not be. Tell us a little bit more about that.

LITMAN: Yes. And look, I stand by my critiques as they apply, certainly to -- to Comey and to James and others who are contemplated. But yes, you know, broken clock works twice a day and this Bolton prosecution may be solid. So, the -- the thing that gives one pause, besides that, of course, he also happens to be an enemy of the President, and that's been the independent improper reason for other charges, is he himself just doesn't seem to be the -- the sort of person who would ham-handedly just take National Security stuff.

But again, we're talking about the head of the National Security section, a well-respected guy. I, you know, I know of him who wouldn't be just doing this sort of violation of DOJ practice. So, I really want to see it in black and white. It's quite possible, and his lawyer, Brianna, is suggesting all of this is recycled from the past, either involving the book or the AOL email. That doesn't mean it wouldn't be a crime, but it's certainly different from the flavor you got when they served the search warrant and you wondered if he had new, fresh national defense information documents.

I think it's going to be a theory that goes back in the past and makes a crime out of conduct we've been somewhat aware of already.

SANCHEZ: Given what you described as the solid reputation of this prosecutor, it doesn't sound like you'd think that Bolton would have a case for selective prosecution the way that someone like former FBI Director James Comey's attorneys have argued is an issue in his case, as they have filed to dismiss the case.

LITMAN: Yes. So, I basically agree. On the other hand, Trump has certainly, in his fusillade of complaints against different people, had -- have -- has singled out, I can't say, has -- has identified Bolton as someone who should be gotten that. And under the law, Boris, if that's the reason they're doing it, it really doesn't matter if the case is solid.

But yes, I agree, this one seems certainly orthodox, by the book. I can't believe this career prosecutor has basically, you know, thrown his law license in the Potomac, as others have done in the cases that we've seen out of the Eastern District of Virginia. It's part of the puzzle. I really want to see, and my, you know, my mind is open that this could be a solid theory. We will see.

SANCHEZ: According to the reporting, we will potentially see it before the end of the day, so we'll be watching for it. Harry Litman, appreciate the expertise.

LITMAN: Yes, and he -- by the way, that's right, he's been there -- one quick thing, he's been there two hours, very consistent with making the final presentation to the grand jury and a vote within an hour.

SANCHEZ: Wow, important to keep that in mind. Thank you so much, Harry.

So, this just in, it is official. The government shutdown will last until at least next week. Senators have begun heading home for a long weekend. We'll take you live to Capitol Hill next.

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[15:24:27]

KEILAR: Now, to some of the other headlines that we're watching this hour. The Department of Transportation is holding back $40 million from California, saying the state isn't doing enough to make sure truck drivers can speak and read in English.

Transportation Chief Sean Duffy says drivers must be able to read road signs and speak to police. He's criticized California for giving a commercial license to a foreign driver involved in a deadly crash. California defended its practices, saying it followed all rules when issuing the driver a license and that its truck drivers have a safer crash rate than the rest of the country.

[15:25:02]

And a man has been indicted after allegedly stealing hard drives containing unreleased music from a Jeep belonging to Beyonce in Atlanta. This is an incident that happened back in July in a parking deck two days before her first Cowboy Carter Tour stop in Atlanta. Police said two people claiming to be on Beyonce's team discovered the back window of the car had been smashed and two suitcases were missing. No word yet on what may have happened to the missing music.

And WNBA star Angel Reese is now the first professional athlete to walk the runway at a Victoria's Secret fashion show. The 23-year-old Chicago Sky forward showing off her catwalk yesterday alongside supermodels like Bella and Gigi Hadid. The star-studded lineup also featured transgender, pregnant and plus-size models.

And before the show, Reese celebrated the diversity, telling CNN, quote, "everybody looks different, but they're all beautiful."

And tonight, Zohran Mamdani, Andrew Cuomo and Curtis Sliwa will face off in the first of two debates in the New York City mayor's race. This campaign has been unusual, but this debate might be the last chance to change the dynamic. With less than three weeks until Election Day, Cuomo has a chance to shift the narrative to his policies and possibly get more support. We have CNN correspondent Gloria Pazmino with us now, live from New York.

So, Gloria, what should we expect to see from candidates tonight?

GLORIA PAZMINO, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: That's exactly right. What we are going to be looking for is whether or not any of these three candidates have a good shot tonight, over the span of two hours, to really change the narrative. We know Zohran Mamdani has been solidly in the lead in the last few months. Andrew Cuomo, the former governor, has been trying to sort of revive and reinvent his campaign. And then, of course, there's a Republican, Curtis Sliwa, who has gotten a lot of support for someone that's never held public office here in New York City.

So, the question really is, how is Zohran Mamdani, as the frontrunner going into this debate tonight, going to handle what is sure to be a lot of attacks from both of his opponents.

And for Andrew Cuomo, the question is whether or not he will be able to define a lane for himself without, A, potentially alienating moderate Democrats that he's trying to appeal to by perhaps embracing Republicans too much. Remember, Mamdani has tried to connect him to President Trump at every turn. So, we'll see if he's able to really sort of draw a contrast between himself and Mamdani by talking about his experience and Mamdani's lack of experience, which is something that he often talks about on the campaign trail.

KEILAR: Looking at the bigger picture, the Democratic Party has kind of struggled to fully get behind Mamdani. This is what Congresswoman Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez and Senator Bernie Sanders said about this on the CNN town hall last night.

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REP. ALEXANDRIA OCASIO-CORTEZ (D-NY): I do worry about the example it sets when our leaders do not support the party nominee, because in the future, we will need -- we will need folks to rally behind a presidential nominee.

SEN. BERNIE SANDERS (D-VT): He is bringing people out who never voted. He is bringing blacks and whites and Latinos and Asians, everybody together around a really strong agenda, talking about affordability in New York. What is not to like?

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: So, who still has not endorsed Mamdani, Gloria?

PAZMINO: Well, there's a handful of members of the New York congressional delegation that have not yet endorsed him, but the one that we have focused in on the most, and that's because he's the leader of the delegation, is Minority House leader Hakeem Jeffries, who represents parts of Brooklyn and has been asked over and over for several months now why he has not yet endorsed Mamdani.

Now, Jeffries did say a few days ago that he has met with him and that he expects to say something about it in the days leading up to the early voting period, which is just in two weeks. And we just got a bit of news in the last few minutes that both Bernie Sanders and Congresswoman Ocasio-Cortez will be rallying with Zohran Mamdani next weekend to launch early voting here in New York. So, we're seeing just how much support he is getting from the party's sort of liberal left wing.

KEILAR: Very interesting. We'll be watching that here in the coming days. Gloria Pazmino live from New York, thank you so much.

And with the government shutdown now expected to last until at least next week, we have some brand-new polling showing who Americans are blaming for the standoff.

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