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Trump To Welcome Zelenskyy To White House For Talks On War In Ukraine; Federal Agents Seen Having Violent Encounters In Chicago; Trump Rules Out Using U.S. Forces In Threat To "Go In And Kill" Hamas. Aired 7:30-8a ET

Aired October 17, 2025 - 07:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[07:32:00]

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, we do have breaking news. You're looking at pictures there from just moments ago. That is ambassador John Bolton, former national security adviser, leaving his home in Maryland. We don't know exactly where he's going but it is possible he is going to turn himself in -- to surrender after being indicted on federal charges having to do with the retention of classified documents.

We will monitor his movements. We will tell you if he arrives at the courthouse very shortly. But again, ambassador John Bolton on the move right now after being charged -- or indicted, I should say, having to do with classified documents.

All right. Happening now, will Ukraine get new U.S. missiles or did Vladimir Putin outmaneuver them? Ukrainian leader Volodymyr Zelenskyy heads to the White House shortly to push President Trump for American- made Tomahawks. These are longer-range missiles that would give Ukraine the ability to hit deep inside Russia.

Now, it looked like they may be headed to Ukraine -- those missiles -- but now, after a 2 1/2-hour phone call with Russia's Vladimir Putin, the president says that he will meet Putin within weeks. So what about the missiles now?

With us now is former U.S. ambassador to Ukraine, Bridget Brink. She resigned earlier this year because as she put it, the policy of the Trump administration had been to put pressure on the victim, Ukraine, rather than on the aggressor, Russia. She is now running for Congress in Michigan as a Democrat.

Ambassador, thank you so much for being with us this morning.

The Tomahawk missiles or longer-range missiles -- why are they so important right now?

BRIDGET BRINK, FORMER U.S. AMBASSADOR TO UKRAINE, (D) MICHIGAN CONGRESSIONAL CANDIDATE: Hi. Well, thanks so much for having me on. Well, I think the first question is just really is Trump ready to put pressure on Putin? That's the critical question. That's why I left. That's why I resigned and came home and ran for Congress because we cannot capitulate to autocrats or dictators.

BERMAN: So do you think that President Trump, based on this phone call yesterday -- well, let me phrase this differently. The fact that the Kremlin asked for this phone call between Vladimir Putin and President Trump -- what does that tell you?

BRINK: Well, I think it's a very telling sign. It's a good question because every time the pressure seems to mount for Putin, he reaches out to try to cajole or charm Trump into continuing the conversation and not putting pressure on Russia, on Putin.

There are many ways to put pressure on, just as you mentioned. There are additional weapons that could be given, but also there are things like sanctions. We could work with our allies and our partners in Europe and around the world and ramp up sanctions. We also could do more to get at the $300 billion in Russian sovereign assets that are in Europe and use those to buy additional weapons for Ukraine to defend itself.

BERMAN: How much --

BRINK: So there are many pressure points. And the question is ultimately are we -- is President Trump ready to put those pressure points on?

BERMAN: How much new pressure would the Tomahawks put on Russia?

[07:35:00]

BRINK: I think any amount of additional weapons. And it's started to some extent but not as much as it was during the Biden administration -- would put pressure on Russia together with European allies to decide whether or not to keep going in this war, which actually is costing Russia a lot. Its economy is hurting. It's having a hard time maintaining its oil refinery because the Ukrainians are very effectively targeting that.

But at the same time, it's creating life in Ukraine that's really difficult for the Ukrainians as they head into winter because Russia has escalated the war since January. There are more missiles and drones that have been going to Ukraine rather than any time earlier in the war.

So September was one of the deadliest times and over 5,000 drones were sent to Ukraine by Russia in September alone. That was right after the Alaska meeting.

BERMAN: So now President Trump says he will meet again with Vladimir Putin. He says within a couple of weeks. I'm not sure it's set in stone yet.

But what are those couple of weeks and the fact of this meeting -- what does that now do for Vladimir Putin?

BRINK: Well, I think what Putin is trying to do, and he's very effective at doing it, is buy time to create more facts on the ground. Every week that goes by it's getting colder in Ukraine. It's getting harder for the Ukrainians to be -- back this increasing number of, especially, drones that Russians and Putin are throwing at Ukraine. So it's buying time.

What needs to be done now is Trump needs to call a spade a spade and tell Putin that we are going to do everything. We're going to give more weapons, we're going to ratchet up the sanctions, and we're going to get the sovereign assets in Europe. And this requires Putin to stop the war -- essentially, stop fighting and decide to come to the negotiating table.

BERMAN: Former ambassador Bridget Brink, we appreciate your time this morning. Thank you -- Kate.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Joining me right now is Maura Gillespie, former senior adviser to then-House Speaker John Boehner, and Democratic strategist Julie Roginsky to talk much more about all of this and more.

The politics around, like, where the president stands right now when it comes to -- you've got Zelenskyy coming to the White House. You have the president promising in two weeks or so he's going to meet face-to-face once again with Vladimir Putin.

Do you think, Maura, that he has more momentum, less momentum in tackling this now once again after brokering a ceasefire deal between Israel and Hamas? Like, where do you think -- see things standing in this moment?

MAURA GILLESPIE, FOUNDER AND PRINCIPAL, BLUESTACK STRATEGIES, FORMER PRESS ADVISER TO THEN-HOUSE SPEAKER JOHN BOEHNER: I think he's posturing and feeling a lot more confident in his own, you know, foreign policy.

BOLDUAN: Um-hum.

GILLESPIE: Obviously, he spoke earlier and talked about how many wars he has been, you know, ending --

BOLDUAN: Right.

GILLESPIE: -- and that he's apparently the only president who has done so. So that was news to me.

But that being said, I do think that he feels pretty confident in his ability to handle foreign relations in terms of people are coming to him, right? He loves for all the red carpet people coming to the White House and to be the person that they are all talking to to come up with the deals. He likes to make deals.

I do think that this foreign policy chops right now -- he feels really confident in because there are other areas that he's not feeling as secure in -- and traditionally, domestically. And that may play a role, you know, down the road as being a problem for him.

BOLDUAN: And why he is so comfortable focusing here right now --

GILLESPIE: (INAUDIBLE).

BOLDUAN: -- when this has been an intractable problem from him. He did not solve this one day one -- in the first 24 hours as he thought he would.

The -- with this, Julie, the hesitation that I have seen -- and a lot of people have written about this -- of many Democrats to -- well, celebrating when we look at the deal between -- that he helped broker between Hamas -- Israel and Hamas -- but the hesitation by Democrats to give the president credit for it.

It continued last night -- and I thought of it again because it continued last night in the mayoral debate here in New York City and the fact that this, like, just the hesitation given the hostility between Democrats and the president. The hesitation to give credit when credit is -- seemed apparently due.

What do you -- I don't know. What do you think?

JULIE ROGINSKY, DEMOCRATIC STRATEGIST, CO-FOUNDER, LIFT OUR VOICES: I don't think credit is due.

BOLDUAN: You don't?

ROGINSKY: No, I don't. And it's not because I'm a Democrats; it's because I'm a realist. I mean, he got hostages released. That's wonderful for those 20 hostages who got released. Nothing is really going to change in Gaza. I hate to say it. I wish that -- I wish that were not the case.

BOLDUAN: Right.

ROGINSKY: But you're seeing renewed fighting again. Hamas has not laid down its arms. Bibi Netanyahu's coalition insists that they're going to go into the West Bank now and try to annex the West Bank. I mean, all of this leads to more and more and more conflict in the Middle East.

I don't care if Donald Trump stands up and says that he solved a 3,000-year problem. He can say it all he wants. It's just not true. He got hostages released and for that, I think I'm very grateful. I'm sure the families are very grateful.

BOLDUAN: Of course.

ROGINSKY: But that's all he did, which is not a -- it's not an insignificant thing to do but Joe Biden did that too, right? He had a lot of hostages released also. The problem remains.

And in terms of Russia, he gets played by Putin every single time. I mean, every time. Zelenskyy is here and all of a sudden Putin wants to meet. [07:40:00]

BOLDUAN: It will be fascinating, won't it --

ROGINSKY: Yeah.

BOLDUAN: -- because it is whoever speaks to him last, right?

ROGINSKY: Of course.

BOLDUAN: You've got Zelenskyy today and then, I don't know, two weeks or whatever that the president then sits down with Putin. Just the view -- how that view that the, like, true view and beliefs that he says he has shifts so dramatically with the last person that he spoke to. It will -- I mean, will it happen again, I mean, if past is prologue?

ROGINSKY: Of course.

GILLESPIE: But it also depends on who talks to him within his administration, within his own team.

BOLDUAN: Yeah.

GILLESPIE: His wife, you know. Who is talking to him last about what Putin has done and what Putin is currently doing that maybe isn't on his radar, unfortunately. And so we've seen that play out before with -- when Melania Trump talked about the children --

BOLDUAN: Very true.

GILLESPIE: -- in Ukraine, and it really did sway him. There could be an opportunity like that. We just may not be privy to it right now.

BOLDUAN: The "No Kings" rallies are happening tomorrow -- this weekend -- and organizers are expecting them to be even bigger than last time. Millions of people to turn out. And what they're calling for is to peacefully celebrate the First Amendment right to protest.

And -- but House Speaker John Boehner -- nope, House Speaker Mike Johnson -- we'll ask John Boehner how he feels about it. House Speaker Mike Johnson, he called these rallies "Hate America" rallies.

What do you think this is coming to represent?

ROGINSKY: I think they are desperate -- and I mean desperate to invoke the Insurrection Act and they're going to look for any excuse tomorrow to try to do that.

So to anybody who is marching, I would say treat Donald Trump as a joke as the protesters in Portland did. Be peaceful. If somebody tries to provoke you do not get provoked. Do not engage because they want one little shred of violence -- anything to be able to say look, the country's out of control. We're going to invoke the Insurrection Act.

J.D. Vance said they're considering it. I mean, this is not something that's just theoretical.

BOLDUAN: Right.

ROGINSKY: It's going to happen if there's an excuse.

So I would just to anybody who is marching, please do whatever you can to be as peaceful as possible and to not give them that excuse.

BOLDUAN: And just from hearing House Speaker Mike -- the Republican House Speaker call a -- you know, a day of protest a hate America rally, I mean, it's just kind of antithetical to what Republicans stand for.

GILLESPIE: Well, and it just also shows you how stark things have become in our politics. And I know we talk about this a lot but it just -- it doesn't need to be -- I mean, I was listening to Karoline Leavitt's --

BOLDUAN: Yeah.

GILLESPIE: -- interview the other day speaking about the other party with such hate and venom. I think it's so destructive, especially for young voters who are turning 18 and who are about to have their first votes coming up in this -- you know, with -- whether you're in New Jersey or New York having your first vote here. Whether it's the midterms. This divisive language is just so damaging and it turns people away.

BOLDUAN: We know this. We know this.

GILLESPIE: We know this, yet these leaders do it.

BOLDUAN: Look at the -- look at political violence. I mean, it just -- it -- that's the frustrating bit --

GILLESPIE: Yes.

BOLDUAN: -- is it has not shifted.

ROGINSKY: Yeah.

GILLESPIE: No matter how egregious things have happened and how horrific things have happened it hasn't toned down. And they can say we've got to tone down the rhetoric. They can say it to somebody else but then they don't do a mirror check and reflect upon their own language and how they speak about one another but also to one another.

BOLDUAN: Yeah.

GILLESPIE: It's a real problem and I worry about what the future looks like if we don't get a handle on it. And so I don't really care for how Mike Johnson spoke yesterday.

ROGINSKY: I mean, speaking of young voters --

BOLDUAN: Um-hum. ROGINSKY: -- you look at Young Republicans who are not so young and look at what they're saying. I mean, this is in text messages to each other where they're denigrating Jews, they're denigrating Black people.

BOLDUAN: They're denigrating anyone they can find.

ROGINSKY: Anybody they can find. And it's terrifying and that's --

BOLDUAN: Yeah.

ROGINSKY: -- the generational shift that we're seeing. It's not -- it's not for the better.

BOLDUAN: Yeah. Again, not young. Despite the moniker --

ROGINSKY: Yeah.

BOLDUAN: -- they are not young.

ROGINSKY: What, 30s?

BOLDUAN: I don't think anyone can call me young and I'm the age of some of those people.

ROGINSKY: Yeah.

BOLDUAN: It's good to see you. It's great to see you, guys. Thank you so much -- Sara.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: All right, thank you.

This morning a federal judge in Chicago is demanding answers from the Trump administration after seeing a series of violent encounters between immigration agents and people living in the city. The judge said agents must wear body cameras during operations.

Incidents like this are sparking serious questions about overreach and brutality. Masked agents here you see chasing people through a Walgreens and then tackling a teenager who says he's a U.S. citizen on a sidewalk outside.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He's not said a thing! He's not said a thing!

BORDER PATROL AGENT: Why is he running?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Because you (INAUDIBLE).

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He's not said a thing. He has not said a thing. That's my brother-in-law!

BORDER PATROL AGENT: Get the (bleep) away from me. You don't know what's going on so get the (bleep) back.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: He's not said a thing.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: The incident happened after a car chase that ended with agents unleashing tear gas on a crowd who gathered near the scene.

The judge adding that she is "profoundly concerned that agents are violating restrictions regarding crowd control methods."

And this morning there is also concern from some that federal agents patrolling near schools are disrupting educators' jobs and inducing fear in families.

For more on that I am joined by Sylvelia Pittman. She is a teacher at Nash Elementary School on Chicago's West Side. Thank you so much for being here.

Can you give me some sense of what it is that teachers, students, and parents are experiencing as they go to and from school?

[07:45:00]

SYLVELIA PITTMAN, CHICAGO ELEMENTARY SCHOOL TEACHER (via Webex by Cisco): Um, a little uncertainty. Being very precautious. We are very -- we are taking extra precautions as our students are coming in and out of the schools, as well as our colleagues. Because there is no one that is actually safe from the federal agents coming up and saying anything -- not even just -- not just saying but attacking. They're just stopping -- it's like they're just doing the stop and frisk.

SIDNER: What are you hearing from students and parents about all of this as they come into school or as they drop off their children? Are you hearing them talk about this a lot?

PITTMAN: Um, we're -- some of the parents are talking but it's more of our colleagues. We're doing more talking because we're seeing the escalation of the -- of ICE agents coming through our neighborhoods on the weekends. As we are coming back to school teachers are talking about the different incidents that are happening in various neighborhoods. And it's not just one particular neighborhood; it's been happening all over the city.

And it's very disturbing because we go home on Friday and you're expected to see everybody come back on Monday. And you might hear that there is a family that has been affected or a colleague, someone on their block. We have ramped up community coming together trying to make sure that everyone is safe. You have people from the neighborhood -- when they see ICE we are bringing awareness that ICE is in the area -- and coming together.

We're using our praise (PH). We keep each other safe.

SIDNER: When it comes to the school district or the city do you feel like you have support in that realm?

PITTMAN: Most definitely. Our mayor has been behind making sure that he signed executive orders, making sure that public safety is the number one thing. Making sure that the agencies cannot come into our schools or in any public spaces where they think that they can just do whatever they want to do. So he's tried to keep the citizens of Chicago as safe as possible and our -- the governor.

So everyone is on one accord. It's causing all of the different levels of our government in the state of Illinois to come together and work together.

SIDNER: Sylvelia Pittman, thank you so much for joining us this morning. I really appreciate your time -- John.

BERMAN: All right. New this morning, President Trump announced a new plan to make some in vitro fertilization or IVF drugs more affordable by letting drugmaker EMO Serono (sic) -- I think I said that right -- sell them directly to consumers who could save as much as 70 percent. The president is also encouraging employers to make IVF coverage -- or provide IVF coverage through insurance, but there is no requirement for that -- Kate.

BOLDUAN: Ahead for us, stock whiplash. What is driving uncertainty in the market right now? We have an update for you.

And heart-pounding moments as officers smash the window of a car that's engulfed in flames to rescue the driver.

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[05:52:45]

BERMAN: All right. New this morning stock futures a little bit lower and there is the whiff of concern surrounding the markets, really over the last 24 hours. First, it had to do with auto lenders. Now there's new concern about regional banks.

I want to bring in CNN's Matt Egan here. Again, late yesterday it was kind of touch and go. This morning still a little bit of anxiety. What's going on here?

MATT EGAN, CNN SENIOR REPORTER: Yeah. Well John, look, fasten your seatbelts because, yes, the ride on Wall Street is getting bumpy again. And for once, the concern is not really about tariffs. It is about bad loans.

As you see on your screen, U.S. stock futures are modestly lower. They're actually off their lows but this comes after some significant selling yesterday. And there's a lot of different signs of concern in the market, right? We're seeing treasury bond yields down, gold up. The VIX volatility fear gauge skyrocketing yesterday to the highest level since May. And the CNN fear and greed index of market sentiment -- it ticked into extreme fear for the first time since April.

Now this is largely being driven by concerns that banks have lent too much money to too many weak companies, right? And this was really triggered by those back-to-back bankruptcies last month, right? First, the subprime auto lender and then this auto supply company called First Brands that went bankrupt as well.

Now, one of the banks that has been caught up in that bankruptcy is the investment bank Jefferies. That company's share price plunged by about 11 percent yesterday. In the past month this bank has lost about one-quarter of its value.

BERMAN: Yes.

EGAN: Now, Jefferies has pushed back and said look, they can handle these losses. And they've noted that there's allegations that the First Brands bankruptcy may have been driven by fraud, which would suggest that some of the lenders may not have had a full picture of the financial help of that company.

But it has spread beyond Jefferies, right, because we've seen a number of regional banks also take big hits yesterday. We saw Zions and Western Alliance. They plunged yesterday after they disclosed that they also lent to businesses that they believe may have defrauded them as well.

And then you look at some of the asset managers like Blackstone and KKR. They've also been hit because they've been really part of this private lending boom.

[07:55:05]

Market veteran Michael Block -- he told me that right now everyone is just waiting for the next shoe to drop. He said look, this could just be a false alarm, or it could be that where there's smoke there is fire.

And not just the Wall Street story. This is a Main Street story, too, right? This is linked to the fact --

BERMAN: Sure.

EGAN: -- prices are high and that hiring is low. And if banks do get into trouble that means they're going to have less money to lend to healthy consumers and businesses as well.

So we've got to watch this space very closely to see if this is just an isolated incident or if this is the start of something bigger.

BERMAN: Yeah. The beginning of people kind of sitting up straight, cricking their necks, and being like what's going on here, maybe.

EGAN: Yeah.

BERMAN: We'll see.

EGAN: Yeah.

BERMAN: We'll watch over the next few days.

Matt Egan, thank you very much --

BERMAN: Thank you, John.

BERMAN: -- for this -- Kate.

BOLDUAN: So heroic officers are caught in -- caught in action in Los Angeles. California Highway Patrol officers -- they rushed to the scene and found this car just completely on fire and began -- they used their batons to break in the windows. Inside they actually found an unconscious driver and managed to pull the person out before the flames completely took over. Right now, though, a lot of questions. We do not know what caused the crash and we do not know right now the condition of that driver.

There's also new body camera video to show you that's just been released showing Miami-Dade deputies jumping into action to rescue a sea turtle that they found in distress off the Florida coast. A Good Samaritan spotted the turtle. It was tangled in a crab trap line. They then flagged down marine patrol for help. Deputies boarded the boat, cut the turtle free, and the turtle swam off safely on its own.

So if you found more than $7,000 in cash on the street, what would you do? Police say a man in Maine decided to keep it and now they are calling it a serious crime and saying they need it back. Not a case of finders keepers. The man had just sold a vehicle and apparently accidentally left the cash on the roof of his car, and it fell off into the street when he drove off.

The man's father then -- the man you see in the plaid shirt -- he's seen here. He went to look for the money. Police say he found another guy picking up the cash. The father's car dash camera recorded this whole confrontation. The guy grabbed the cash and then just left.

Police now are trying to identify the man who they say -- who -- they say needs to give it back because it needs to get back to its rightful owner -- Sara.

SIDNER: Man.

BOLDUAN: I know.

SIDNER: That's not nice. Give the money back to the man.

BOLDUAN: I know. But, I mean, there is a moment when you're like --

SIDNER: Where they go oh look, it's just sitting here.

BOLDUAN: -- you see a bunch of cash.

SIDNER: It's true. It's happening.

BOLDUAN: It's a real moral dilemma and we all know what direction I'd go.

SIDNER: Yes, we do, Kate.

All right. This morning President Trump threatening to "go in and kill Hamas" if the group continues to kill people in Gaza. The president later having to clarify that U.S. troops would not be involved in that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, (R) PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We're going to find out if they behave. If they behave, good. If they don't behave, we'll take care of it.

REPORTER: Do you mean U.S. forces would go in and take out Hamas?

TRUMP: I mean, I didn't say who would go in but somebody will go in. It's not going to be us. We won't have to. There are people very close -- very nearby that will go in.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: We've been seeing images of Hamas publicly executing people it deemed were working against them and with Israel.

Let's go straight now to CNN correspondent Salma Abdelaziz. Salma, what are you learning this morning about all this?

SALMA ABDELAZIZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Look, there's a lot of red flags, of course, Sara, with trumps being issued from President Trump to Prime Minister Netanyahu, to the violence that we're seeing Hamas carry out on the ground.

But diplomacy is winning out. We are seven days into this ceasefire and it is still holding despite how fragile and precarious it is. And there are signs that mediation efforts are continuing to work as well.

First of all, we're seeing these assurances being made. Yes, we heard the threats from President Trump, but he's also said time and time again that he believes the parties remain committed to the truce.

Secondly, we've seen de-escalation work. Just in the last 24 hours Israel had threatened to reduce aid to the Gaza Strip because of the slow release of hostage remains. But now U.S. officials say Israel has backed down from that threat and aid is being allowed into the enclave as per the agreement.

And the third point here -- and this is really the most important one, Sara -- communication channels remain open. We're hearing from those involved in the negotiations that mediations are -- mediation efforts are ongoing and consistent. That means everyone is still speaking.

But, of course, this is a very precarious truce and that's why you're hearing President Trump walking this tightrope between saying yes, I have faith in the agreement but if there are any issues there will be consequences.

I want to read you a statement that he put on Truth Social. I think we have that to pull up for you. "If Hamas continues to kill people in Gaza, which was not the deal, we will have no choice but to go in and kill them."

No doubt about it, of course, Sara, the threat of violence, the threat of the resumption of this conflict looms large over Gaza and the wider region, but the hope is that these mediation efforts continue. And diplomats will tell you the U.S. needs to take an active role not only in making sure these parties abide by the ceasefire but also to push them to the next phase -- phase two of the deal -- where there are even more obstacles.