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Border Patrol Official Accused of Violating Use-of-Force Order; Russia Announces Successful Test of Nuclear-Powered Missile; Drinking Rate Hits New Low Amid Growing Health Concerns. Aired 2:30-3p ET

Aired October 27, 2025 - 14:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:30:00]

OMAR JIMENEZ, CNN HOST: President Trump today openly criticizing a raid carried out by his own administration. Hundreds of South Korean workers were shackled, detained, and deported last month by armed ICE agents and the largest sweep yet at a workplace in the president's immigration crackdown.

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: So these were folks who were working at a sprawling Hyundai plant in southeast Georgia. And it's worth noting, where is President Trump? Well, he is in Asia today, and he is now saying that that raid is an issue.

CNN's Priscilla Alvarez is joining us with details. It's really interesting to hear him say this, because in Korea, there was a huge blowback after this happened.

PRISCILLA ALVAREZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, and it was clearly an issue here on the domestic side when it all happened, because the South Korean foreign minister met with Secretary of State Marco Rubio right after this happened to hash out even how these South Korean workers were going to be returned to their country, given again the clash here. And it was such a clear example of how the administration's immigration crackdown was coming up against its business interests and its manufacturing interests. So the president weighing in and saying that he did not agree with how this happened, take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I was very much opposed. Look, when they come in and they're making very complex machinery, equipment things, they're going to have to bring some people in at least at the initial phase. I was opposed to getting them out.

And in fact, before they got out, they were pretty well set. But before they get out, I said they could say they went, they left, and they're going to be coming back.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ALVAREZ: So the president saying there that they're going to be coming back. Well, the South Korean president has a different view on this. In fact, he told Bloomberg that the workers didn't want to return. [14:35:00]

They were quite traumatized by this event where there was this workplace raid. And he also said that there is some deal on the horizon. So it's unclear what that will look like and whether this means other visa issuances or other structures for them to return. But clearly, the trauma of this workplace raid resonates in South Korea and among these workers.

So where this plan goes from here and what those discussions look like are going to be really interesting to watch.

JIMENEZ: I want to ask about another dynamic we've been watching because there's this dynamic of federal immigration enforcement in major U.S. cities like Chicago, for example. And we have now a border patrol commander set to appear in federal court tomorrow in Chicago to answer for use of force tactics that he's accused of carrying out in that city. What do we know about that?

ALVAREZ: A really important official, Gregory Bovino, is the Homeland Security official who has been charged with leading the federal crackdown in these cities. He was in Los Angeles where there were similarly lawsuits over the conduct there. And now he's going to testify tomorrow in Chicago.

Now, this testimony is very focused on the way that their agents are interacting with protesters. There's been a temporary restraining order blocking the use of tear gas, for example, other tactics against peaceful protesters unless there's an imminent threat. And the incident here is where protesters were confronting agents and a tear gas canister was thrown by Bovino.

Now, the videos we have seen don't tell the whole picture because it's a bunch of different clips. So we -- the Department of Homeland Security says that they were throwing rocks at Bovino, that one hit his head, and that's what he was responding to. But the plaintiffs in the case in filings over the weekend said that is a lie and that didn't happen.

So it's going to be a fascinating testimony tomorrow and an important one to watch, not only because it relates to Chicago, but also all that can come in the administration's federal crackdown because Gregory Bovino has been the one that they have tapped to lead the charge.

JIMENEZ: Priscilla Alvarez, appreciate the reporting as always.

Let's talk more about the alleged use of force violation. Joining us now is former U.S. Attorney Harry Litman, host of Talking Feds podcast. I want to start with, I wonder what you make of this dynamic playing out in Chicago, where it seems like this battle of authority between one aspect of the federal government and the White House's aggressive enforcement push versus the federal judiciary trying to keep up with any alleged violations.

HARRY LITMAN, FORMER DEPUTY ASSISTANT ATTORNEY GENERAL: Yes, I think two points are especially noteworthy. The first is, Judge Ellis doesn't necessarily believe the ICE agents in the field. And of course, there's a video of Bovino throwing a tear gas canister and preparing to do another.

But I think those are the consequences of what's been a pattern in the last several months of representations in court by Trump folks that don't hold up. The second thing I think to note is she entered a restraining order saying exactly, don't do this unless all these other things happen. And this is the situation on the ground.

And it sure looks as if that's not the case. Bovino is, as your guest just said, the head border agent in charge. But he was also right there in the field.

So I don't see how -- well, he should show up tomorrow. We'll see if they try to wriggle out of it. But in general, this is part of a whole secondary issue in these ICE cases.

There's on the one hand, approaching people without any reason, just willy-nilly, which the law forbids. But then second, doing it with unreasonable force. Bovino himself is accused of pointing a gun at a veteran saying, bang, bang, you're dead liberal and that sort of thing.

All kinds of Fourth Amendment, excessive use of force, even if the initial encounter were lawful.

JIMENEZ: Well, and a lot of allegations that, of course, the court will be trying to nail down as a part of this hearing. But you mentioned something that I thought was interesting because there is this dynamic right now where what DHS puts out in press releases doesn't necessarily appear in court filings or where the judges are questioning the reliability of DHS testimony. I mean, in one case, New Jersey, a judge actually asked the government prosecutor to push DHS to remove public postings the judge felt were prejudicial and did not properly represent the indictment.

How is that relationship between public facing and courtroom facing information typically handled? And is there anything here that's unusual to you, just given your experience?

LITMAN: Sure. Second question. First, I think it is particularly fraught now.

You've had DOJ attorneys who represent continually in the uncomfortable position of either trying to defend or not even knowing what those folks are saying, how it's typically handled. I'm the DOJ attorney coming in. I speak to DHS, including their general counsel.

We agree on the facts. Nothing's hidden. I'm not the enemy.

And then you go forward and make your best case in court. That seems to have been honored in the breach generally in the Trump era.

[14:40:00] JIMENEZ: Well, and I guess in regards to the Bovino appearance, what penalty options does a federal judge have if it is found that someone like Bovino violated the temporary restraining order in a place like Chicago?

LITMAN: They're broad, but also kind of amorphous. But if he were -- I don't expect this to happen tomorrow. And he has to sit for a deposition as well on a five hour deposition, November 5th.

But theoretically, he could be held in contempt, including criminal contempt. He could be personally fine and the like. There's always the difficulty of do you go against the individual officer or the United States?

But that's what's in the background. Of course, in the past, just simply being found in contempt of a court order would be really a strong chastisement by a district court. Again, that seems to be a factor that is also out the window.

There's a certain lack of shamelessness to this all. But if it continues, she -- and I think you'll hear her say the words tomorrow -- could hold Bovino expressly in contempt of court.

JIMENEZ: It will be something we will be watching for. But as you mentioned, a few other key dates in sort of this ongoing process. Harry Litman, appreciate the insight as always.

Thanks for being here.

LITMAN: Thank you.

JIMENEZ: All right, still ahead. Russia successfully tests a nuclear powered cruise missile, prompting renewed calls for more Western air defenses.

How could this add to the tensions between President Trump and Putin? We'll talk about it.

[14:45:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

KEILAR: President Trump responding after Vladimir Putin announced Sunday that Russia successfully tested a nuclear-powered cruise missile and is working towards deploying it. Russian officials say the missile flew for 15 hours over a distance of 8,700 miles. Trump downplayed the news this morning, saying Putin should put more energy into ending the war with Ukraine.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TRUMP: You ought to get the war ended. The war that should have taken one week is now in its soon fourth year. That's what you ought to do instead of testing missiles.

(END VIDEO CLIP) KEILAR: CNN contributor and former Moscow bureau chief Jill Dougherty is with us now. Jill, how concerning is this Russian test?

JILL DOUGHERTY, CNN CONTRIBUTOR: You know, it is a unique weapon. And certainly the fact that it could fly that long, it flies low. There are many different aspects technically why it could be very important.

However, it really essentially, if you ask experts, has a big political component. I mean, just look at the way the Russians kind of announced this. President Putin was actually wearing fatigues as if he was in the military when they announced to him, yes, the test has been successful.

So I think this is a lot of messaging. Obviously, President Trump had an answer for that, which I think, in my opinion, was quite good, because it didn't inflate the significance of this. He essentially said, yes, we both test missiles.

And by the way, we have one that's, you know, right off your shore. We don't have to go 8,000 miles. So I -- but I do think that it illustrates that Vladimir Putin is concerned about a couple of things.

You could definitely say the sanctions against his oil companies, two biggest oil companies, and also the threat, although it doesn't seem to be there right now, of giving the opportunity for Ukraine to have those Tomahawk missiles, which are really quite significant, deep, deep strike missiles.

KEILAR: Yes, Trump said, they know we have a nuclear submarine, the greatest in the world, right off their shore. What do you think about that kind of that mutually assured destruction talk? Is there any concern about that being the place where the U.S. and Russia are right now?

DOUGHERTY: Well, I think it is overall a dangerous situation, because, you know, the last arms control agreement between Russia and the United States expires in 2026, in the spring. So we -- after that, there will be no agreement between the two countries about limiting nuclear weapons. So a lot of this, you know, it's posturing, yes.

But it does get into the area -- and Putin does this all the time -- it does get into the area of saying, hey, we can strike you with a nuclear weapon, if. And that is -- that's dangerous posturing. And as we know, from the history of nuclear weapons, things can happen, you know, there can be false indications that there's an attack. And that could be extremely, extremely dangerous.

KEILAR: Trump is on an Asia swing, and he's going to meet with Chinese leader Xi Jinping. And he's hoping that Xi can help pressure Russia to come to the negotiating table in this war with Ukraine. Do you see that happening?

DOUGHERTY: Well, there's no question that he's going to press him. Whether it actually works or not, is a little unclear. It appears that the -- let's say the major companies in China, probably would abide by the sanctions. But there are other ways of getting around sanctions. And I think, you know, you have to see, right now, this is connected not only with Ukraine, etcetera, it's connected with the overall relationship between the two countries, China and the United States. But there's a lot at stake.

The theory always is, could the United States peel away China from Russia?

[14:50:00]

But that is a lot more complicated, I think, than just an individual conversation.

KEILAR: Yes, certainly. Jill, always great to get your insights. Jill Dougherty, thank you very much.

And just ahead, millions of Americans have been spending October sober, and it's more and more likely they will keep that streak going when the calendar changes. We'll look at the support that people have to live life without alcohol.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:55:00]

JIMENEZ: We are in the last week of Sober October and the move to shelf alcohol appears to be picking up some steam.

KEILAR: Yes, a recent poll reported a record low number of Americans say they drink alcohol, just 54 percent. And that tracks with the surge in adults who see it as bad for their health.

We're joined by Scott Strode. He was a CNN hero in 2012 and founded a national sober active community called The Phoenix. He also appears in the new film "Sober" that is premiering next year.

And Scott, I think we've all heard of like dry January, right? But Sober October here is something that's really kind of taken off. Tell us why you think this is something that people are really interested in.

SCOTT STRODE, FOUNDER, THE PHOENIX: I think Sober October or Dry January are great times for people just to dip their toe into sobriety and try out life in a little more present and connected way. And what I think is so special about it is oftentimes you realize that maybe you didn't need those drinks to have that fun social time or to connect with others. And that's really what the nonprofit I started, The Phoenix, is all about, helping lift each other up and dream of what's possible in our sobriety.

So if you're trying out Sober October, you can come join us at The Phoenix.

JIMENEZ: Well, and when you even search up Sober October online, I mean, you know, Joe Rogan's name pops up. I mean, yes, as I understand, he and his friends have done a version of this for years. But how have celebrities and influencers sort of popularized the sober curious movement?

We'll call it that.

STRODE: I would say they kind of made it cool to try. And plus, with all the mocktails that are out there and different kind of seltzers and everything, there's a lot more options. And for example, The Phoenix did some sober sections at music festivals.

So you could come in and have mocktails and hear great music without having to drink and maybe, you know, forget where you got your car was or how you got there, that kind of thing. So we're just giving people alternative where you're more connected.

JIMENEZ: Yes.

KEILAR: And that's what's so interesting about what you're doing here, which is the sober active approach, because a lot of people, they need that alternative, like you're talking about the music festival, but also they need a lifestyle alternative, right? And a way to have that social outlet with people.

STRODE: Yes, I think it's really about connection and solving for isolation. I think drinking and drug use when you're feeling alone and disconnected is when it really gets dark. And I think in this sort of cultural moment in our country, we need to feel more connected.

And at The Phoenix, we believe in each other, even if we don't yet believe in ourselves. And that's the magic of it. Whether you're tying into a climbing rope or trying your first triathlon or going to your first yoga class, there's people there that, that empower you.

JIMENEZ: Well, and there are a lot of people now, I'm sure, you know, we're coming to the end of October here. And I'm sure there are people who are probably thinking about, all right, maybe I should, I should cut back or maybe I shouldn't drink as much. I mean, what is your advice to sort of take in that, that first step to at least try it out?

See, see how it feels.

STRODE: Yes. I would just encourage people to just change up your routine a little bit. Like I always say, which side of 5 a.m. are you getting up at 5 a.m. or are you staying out till 5 a.m.

JIMENEZ: OK. Yes.

STRODE: And pick a little fitness routine, you know, try to move your body a couple times a week. And more importantly, come to The Phoenix because it's free.

Just find our, at phoenix.org and show up. And you can even become a volunteer to start Phoenix in your community.

KEILAR: And how can it help, you know, sort of dipping your toe into something, trying it out. And, you know, if someone does a Sober October or they do a Dry January or they pick whatever time period and they might want to continue that, how would you suggest to someone that they do sort of approach something, even just with the idea that maybe it's temporary, but see how you feel and then maybe carry it from there.

STRODE: I would just say, find a passion that doesn't happen in a bar or around drinks and get some other people to go with you and then start doing that thing. And what often happens is you fall in love with it. You realize, I didn't think I was a runner, but maybe I am, or I became a cyclist during Sober October.

And by having these new experiences, the world opens up to you and you start to think differently about who you can be.

JIMENEZ: And, you know, when October finishes or January finishes, you know, people, they might ease back sort of into that lifestyle or they might slip up. They might say, you know what, I was doing this and now I'm back on the other side of 5 a.m. to use your example. What advice do you have for folks who maybe just slipped up a little bit and maybe actually getting back is a little bit tougher than it was to even try it in the first place?

STRODE: I think that's a great question because what I see at Phoenix is when people volunteer to lead Phoenix events, they're sharing a passion and gift with others. What's really happening is they're finding grace and love for other people. And when they can find it for other people, they can start to find it for themselves.

So if you do have that slip up or that relapse, don't go into that shame place, just reconnect with your community and they can help pull you out of it.

KEILAR: What do they say about what's on the other side?

STRODE: What's on the other side?

KEILAR: Yes, when they start getting into the lifestyle ...

END