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Frustrated Travelers Scramble to Find Flights Amid Disruptions; Supreme Court to Consider Bid to Overturn Same-Sex Marriage; Former Crime Reporter Uses Writing to Help Inmates Heal. Aired 3:30-4p ET

Aired November 07, 2025 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:30:00]

PHIL MATTINGLY, CNN HOST: Just into CNN, James Watson, a world- renowned molecular biologist, has died.

ERICA HILL, CNN HOST: So Watson was one of the people who discovered the double helix structure of DNA. It was a scientific breakthrough that also saw him awarded the Nobel Prize. He went on to become the first director of the Human Genome Project, also the first person to sell a Nobel Prize.

He auctioned it off. Watson was 97 years old.

We are following very closely the travel chaos throughout the country. More than 900 flights so far today canceled. Air traffic controllers also facing staffing shortages once again today.

There are 25 reports of staffing problems that have been noted by the FAA so far. They have been, of course, it's important to note, expected to work without pay for more than a month now. This is day 38 of the shutdown.

MATTINGLY: Yes. As all this is going on, Transportation Secretary Sean Duffy warning that the number of cancellations could go up, affecting up to 20 percent of flights if the shutdown doesn't end soon. The frustration at airports, yes, it's growing.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

[15:35:00]

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I'm concerned for my ex-fellow co-workers at TSA that they get their jobs going again and they get their paychecks.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I am saddened. I am dismayed for those that I see now working without getting a paycheck. I don't want to work without getting a paycheck, and yet they're showing up every day and doing so.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MATTINGLY: Now with us now to talk more about the impact and fallout from these airport travel restrictions is Mary Schiavo, a CNN transportation analyst. She is, of course, the former Inspector General of the Department of Transportation. Always appreciate your time and expertise, Mary.

Just to start, if you have upcoming travel right now, what's your advice to people like yourself trying to navigate an increasing number of cancellations?

MARY SCHIAVO, CNN TRANSPORTATION ANALYST: Well, and I do have upcoming travel, so this is what I do. And I also travel like this in winter weather when storms are likely. Because I can tell you I've slept on almost every airport floor in the country and some in Europe. So try to get a nonstop.

I know it's very difficult in this age of hubs and, you know, spoken hub system, but nonstop, you know, cuts your risk of missing, you know, your flights, et cetera, in half. And then you have the less stress with the nonstop. I always try to get the first flight of the day because that's when the problems haven't compounded all day.

I am concerned right now about the security risk of crowds. We had an attempted attack on one airport. We have had attacks where people were harmed at ticket counters, at baggage claim areas, et cetera.

So go to the airport prepared to move through the mess, the crowds, quickly. Have your boarding passes electronic or printed. Don't check a bag.

Stuff your clothes into a roller board because if you get stuck, you're going to need it, or I always kid around and say buy your clothes when you get there. But not checking a bag gets you out of some lines, and it gives you everything you need if your flight gets canceled and you need to jump on another one or you need to do a standby.

And make sure if you have signed up -- and these are wonderful, everybody should have. It's a little late now, but TSA PreCheck and CLEAR is available at some airports. It moves you through those lines so quickly, and you aren't left standing in big crowds, which will be, you know, a security risk. And I also have travel booked, and I try to do smaller airports, not in the top 30 or 40, with carriers that give us more chances of nonstop flights.

There's a newer carrier out there, and they serve where I live, and so I book nonstops to less popular or less busy cities to have a chance. And then also I look for alternatives. Now, given that it's taking two to three hours to get through security, frankly, if your flight and your security time is four or five hours and the drive is only three or four hours, drive. Drive is -- gas is cheap right now.

And then finally, my big pet peeve. You know who pays for all this is not, technically not the taxpayers of the United States, but the flyers, the airlines, the passengers, the people who use the National Airspace System.

We have paid for this. Our ticket taxes, gas taxes, other taxes go into an aviation trust fund. Well, many decades ago, that got lumped into the federal budget. And it's high time, once again, I was involved back in, I think, 1999, trying to pull that out of the budget and have it freestanding. It's time to reconsider that. It's time to say, get it out of the general budget so we can have a professional system run by professionals for the people who pay for it, those of us who travel.

There's probably also going to be discussions about privatizing air traffic control. That discussion comes up about every 10 years. But those are the suggestions.

And I say I'll be out there and sort of prepare and dress like you might have to camp out because that's what you might have to do on the airport floor.

MATTINGLY: Yes, I don't know why I got like weirdly jealous about how your flex that you've slept in every single major airport in the country and seemingly around the world. It's very impressive to me. Again, can't explain why.

I do want to ask you before I let you go, the kind of graduated scale of flight cancellations, 4 percent today, 6 percent on Tuesday, 10 percent a week from today. The Transportation Secretary called it an art, not a science to keep people safe. How do you see this actually working in practice?

SCHIAVO: Well, in practice, it's what he said. It's an art. They have to wait to see where they have shortages.

And, you know, one thing that people haven't focused on is it's not optional. If you have an FAA facility, air traffic control, enroute center, Traycon, et cetera, each center is rated for a minimum number of employees. You have to have these many employees before you can actually do the job.

And if you don't have them, they have to shut down. So by doing this ratcheting up system, they're hoping to get some of the traffic out so they don't actually have to shut facilities. But those rules, air traffic control rules, are not suggestions. Most of them are rock solid, and you must follow them if you're doing air traffic control. And so that's why.

[15:40:00]

Oh, and the best tip I have to give you, run to the, you know, the cheap discount store and get a blow-up air mattress if you think you're going to get stuck in the winter storm.

I actually travel with those, and it drives my husband nuts.

MATTINGLY: I don't know why you're giving these out for free. Like, you had about 30 tips that are so invaluable right now that we are grateful for your time and expertise as always. Mary Schiavo, thanks so much.

SCHIAVO: Thank you. MATTINGLY: Well, there's a request for the Supreme Court to overturn their landmark 2015 decision to legalize same-sex marriage nationwide. Today, they're deciding if they want to take up the appeal. Those details after the break.

[15:45:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HILL: The Supreme Court is meeting behind closed doors today to consider a long-shot request to overturn a decade-old precedent. Kim Davis, a former Kentucky county clerk who refused to issue a marriage license to a same-sex couple citing her religious objections, is asking the Supreme Court to overturn its 2015 decision that legalized same-sex marriages. A federal court found that she actually violated a court order in denying that license.

Davis served several days in jail. She's been fined thousands of dollars. What the court ultimately decides could impact some 600,000 couples who have married since that landmark decision.

So what is really at play here? Joining us to discuss constitutional law professor at Brown University, Corey Brettschneider, who's also the author of the book, "The President and the People," and co-host of the Oath and the Office podcast. Corey, it's great to see you this afternoon.

So can you just walk us through, what is the actual legal argument here?

COREY BRETTSCHNEIDER, CONSTITUTIONAL LAW PROFESSOR, BROWN UNIVERSITY: Well, she has two, and of course the court hasn't agreed to hear this. She's just appealing for a writ of certiorari, in other words, asking the court to hear her case. But she really has two fundamental claims. There are others as well, but I'll focus on the two fundamental ones.

One, she's saying that the right to gay marriage itself is unconstitutional, and that when the Supreme Court in the Obergefell case said that there was a fundamental, not just right to marriage, but that it extended to gay couples, that was a mistake because it's not based in the text of the Constitution. And she's really relying on the idea of originalism, of looking to the text and betting that the justices are going to take that up.

And then the second related claim is a claim of religious freedom, and she's saying that she's a religious person and that her religious beliefs are opposed to gay marriage, that's why she didn't grant the license, and that they should recognize that the right to free exercise under the First Amendment extends to her as well.

HILL: So then, if she's saying that this goes counter to her personal religious beliefs, is she then saying that the court should embrace her personal religious beliefs and that everyone should have to follow them?

BRETTSCHNEIDER: Well, I think that's a good response to what she's saying. But the Supreme Court -- this Supreme Court, I should say, despite a past of having views like that, wanting to recognize that the freedom for some doesn't mean the right to impose on others, they've really gestured towards the idea of expanding religious freedom in a way that might affect the rights of others. And what she's saying, too -- and I don't want to lose this -- is not just that she has this personal right of religious freedom, but that religious freedom really is incompatible with the right to gay marriage.

That that's part of how she makes her argument. And then she's adding on to that that there really is no such right in the Constitution itself. It would all sound very far-fetched if it was, you know, right after the case or a few years after the case. But where we are now, remember, this is the Supreme Court that overturned Roe v. Wade, which we had for so long talked about and taught as a super precedent, a fundamental right to abortion. And yet the court wiped that away, and why did they do so?

They said, well, no such right is embedded in the Constitution. It doesn't talk about a right to abortion. And she's saying the same thing about gay marriage, that the framers of our Constitution never considered it, and so it should be wiped away.

HILL: So when we look at all of this, her attorney has made clear that he hopes ultimately this will begin the groundwork for overturning Roe v. -- excuse me, for overturning Obergefell.

Do you see this effectively laying the groundwork, even if the justices do not decide to hear this?

BRETTSCHNEIDER: That's such a great question and well put, and I think that's exactly what's going on. This is a very controversial litigant. I don't know if this is going to be the place that they want to make their move if they are going to, to say that there no longer is a right to gay marriage under the Constitution as they did with abortion.

But as you say, it starts to get the ideas in the air, the arguments are out there, and there certainly are some justices, there's no question about this, who want to wipe away the right to gay marriage. They have a very narrow understanding of what our constitutional rights are, looking only to the text. They don't see the right to gay marriage there.

There were dissents, I should add, as the petition for certiorari by Kim Davis points out. There were dissents in that case. People who, the dissenters making the argument that this wasn't really a right, it was wrongly decided.

[15:50:00]

So even if it doesn't happen here, we're living in such an extraordinary moment in American history, although the idea of stare decisis, of respecting the prior decisions of the court, is a bedrock idea. This court will disregard stare decisis if they think that their past decisions are at odds with the Constitution itself. And certainly several of the justices, maybe a majority, hold that view. So yes, for defenders of civil liberties, for defenders of gay rights, we have reason to be concerned. And I would think too that there should also be talk of codifying the right to gay marriage.

That would be a way of protecting against this legislation. Fighting for it, that would protect the right to gay marriage.

HILL: Real quickly, I mean, this is, you know, far down the line, but let's say this were overturned. Do you envision this would then be sort of a state-by-state decision, like we have seen when it comes to reproductive care and abortion in the wake of Dobbs being overturned?

BRETTSCHNEIDER: Well, just to be clear, what the Obergefell decision said, and it was an extraordinary decision at the moment, an unlikely one that many advocates for the right to gay marriage didn't think would work. But the court did say, as a result of that case, that there is a national right in the United States Constitution, in the fundamental right to marriage, that it extended as well to gay couples. So that's a national idea.

Now, if we get rid of that right, what happens? Yes, exactly, we go back to the states, as we have with abortion. And some state constitutions, courts have found, protect the right to gay marriage.

Other states have codified, as I suggested, the Congress should, the right to gay marriage. So you know, the problem, though, just to be blunt about it, is when you have a patchwork for a right like that, and you have a national society, a national government, what happens when you move state to state? Things become very complicated, and that's one of the reasons why the court tried to make this and did make this a national issue.

HILL: Corey, really appreciate it. Thank you.

Changing lives one story at a time. After the break, we're spotlighting a CNN hero helping inmates rewrite their narrative, rewriting the narrative of incarcerated people from behind bars.

[15:55:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MATTINGLY: Now to some of the other headlines we are watching this hour. And the fast food chain Wendy's is set to close hundreds of restaurants across the country. Interim CEO Ken Cook says the affected locations consistently underperformed and dragging -- are dragging down the chain's overall performance.

A turnaround plan comes a year after the chain announced it was closing 140 restaurants for similar reasons.

HILL: Ouch. Meantime, a basketball player from Canada making his mark here in the U.S. Last night, 19-year-old Olivier Rioux took the court for the University of Florida. And in doing so, he made history as the tallest person to ever play college basketball. How tall, you ask? Seven feet, nine inches. So just compare.

Seat number 22 there, looking up to him. 22 is 6'8". Olivier is 7'9".

When asked about his historic debut, he said simply, quote, it's another day, I guess. Yes, there you have it.

Well, it turns out you can now vote for the 2025 CNN Hero of the Year. So over the next few weeks, we're going to be spotlighting each of our top five finalists.

MATTINGLY: And today, we're introducing you to Debra Des Vignes, a former crime reporter who's helping inmates transform their lives through creative storytelling.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DEBRA DES VIGNES, INDIANA PRISON WRITERS WORKSHOP: I didn't really understand humanity as I should have as a young reporter in my early 20s. It wasn't until much later that the faces had stories and had names.

DES VIGNES (voice-over): I decided to volunteer in a prison because I was always inquisitive and curious about their stories.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And this is one more reminder that --

DES VIGNES (voice-over): I saw the raw talent, and that's what led me to create this 12-week creative writing curriculum.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I was convicted of dealing in a narcotic and dealing marijuana. I pretty much grew up on the streets. I lost my mother, my father, my sister, and my brother, and came to a crossroads and had to make a decision whether I was going to use that as fuel to do better.

DES VIGNES: Thank you for sharing that. Yep, I know that was heartfelt.

DES VIGNES (voice-over): We never excuse what they've done. In fact, a lot of them write about their remorse. We're just giving them a sacred space where they can let their shoulders down.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Eventually, though, I began to confront my grief with a clear mind and an open heart, accepting the fact that no matter what I did or who I hurt, nothing was going to bring my brother back from the dead.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I look forward to my Friday afternoons more than most days. People just let their souls bleed out of their pens onto that paper, and for two hours a day, everyone can just truly be themselves, and we're like a little small-knit family here. I plan on going into college and majoring in psychology when I get out, so I feel like this is a huge step towards that.

DES VIGNES: That's going to make me tear up. We'll end on that one. That was really powerful.

DES VIGNES (voice-over): Some people would think it's a lock them up and throw away the key. If a lot of these prisoners are going to be released, then why not use writing as a tool to become better in the space that you're in?

(END VIDEOTAPE)

HILL: To learn more, just log on to CNN.com/heroes. You can vote for Deborah there for CNN Hero of the Year. Also take a look at some of the other top five heroes.

MATTINGLY: And the winner will be announced Saturday, December 6th at 8 p.m. Eastern during an all-star tribute hosted by, of course, Anderson Cooper and Laura Coates right here on CNN.

Have a good weekend.

HILL: You too. Have a great weekend.

MATTINGLY: "THE ARENA" with Kasie Hunt starts right now.

END