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New Release: Epstein Mentioned Trump Multiple Times in Private E-mails; ByHeart Recalls All Its Baby Formula Products Nationwide; U.S. Mints Last-Ever Penny After 230 Years of Production. Aired 3:30- 4p ET

Aired November 12, 2025 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:30:00]

BRIANNA KEILAR, CNN HOST: A source is telling CNN that Republican Congresswoman Lauren Boebert is not expected to remove her name from a discharge petition that would go around House leadership and compel a vote on the release of the Epstein files. We're told the top Trump administration officials were planning to meet with Boebert today as the White House resists releasing all of the files. And it comes as, minutes from now, Arizona's Adelita Grijalva is expected to be sworn in as the newest member of the House of Representatives.

The sources -- sources tell CNN that during that ceremony she'll be flanked by at least two survivors of convicted sex offender Jeffrey Epstein. Grijalva is expected to provide the final signature that is needed for that discharge petition.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: And remember, Grijalva's swearing in will come just hours after Democrats on the Oversight Committee released private e-mails from Epstein and his associates where he mentions Donald Trump by name multiple times. We're joined now by Sarah Fitzpatrick. She's an investigative reporter who covered Epstein extensively.

She also knew Epstein victim Virginia Giuffre for almost a decade and interviewed Virginia and her family after Virginia's death. Will Sommer is also with us. He's a senior reporter for The Bulwark and has covered right-wing conspiracies extensively.

Thank you both for being with us. Sarah, what's your reaction to these e-mails and the fact that they're being put out there?

SARAH FITZPATRICK, INVESTIGATIVE REPORTER WHO COVERED EPSTEIN EXTENSIVELY: I think it's an explosive development. It is the first time that we see in black and white that Jeffrey Epstein was concerned about Trump's knowledge of his activities. We don't know exactly what, but it is right there in black and white and it is such a stunning term, the dog that hasn't barked.

That is not some casual reference. And Virginia's name, as we know, is in the e-mail released by Congress as well. So it's a really important development for those of us that have covered this for a very long time. We have expected these documents to come out at some point, and I think it really remains to be seen kind of what steps happen from now on. To me, as someone who covers this investigation for years, we have always been asking if Trump had knowledge, was in proximity, was there, as I reported for the first time in 2019, as others have reported, why hasn't he been interviewed by the FBI, by the Department of Justice? If he was a witness to potential criminal conduct, why has that not happened?

We've heard from both sides of the aisle that they wanted these investigations to be thorough. And yet we're seeing that not every rock has been turned over and not every witness has been, including the president.

KEILAR: I'm so happy to have you here because we can't ask questions of Virginia Giuffre. She's gone. And you spent a lot of time talking to her and her family.

She never -- she actually writes in her book, "Nobody's Girl," sort of positively about Trump.

[15:35:00]

And here you have Epstein saying that Trump spent hours with her. Square that for us, because if you're to think of credibility, I mean, Virginia Giuffre has more than Jeffrey Epstein. So what do you think reading that?

FITZPATRICK: There's a couple kind of factors to put into play here. I knew Virginia very well. We have had hundreds of hours of conversation right up until before she died.

Her credibility is excellent. However, she has always been very clear and very transparent of the fact that she was given drugs. She was on a lot of drugs at this time period, provided by Epstein's associates, provided by others.

And she's always been very clear and transparent about that. So there are aspects of her memory that she has not -- that are unclear, that are missing. There are things that she's very been clear about, and then she's always been clear about things that she's not.

So I think that's an important context. And for many of the victims, they were prescribed, they were given substances, they were taken to doctors. And that's an element of this story, the kind of professional and illegal substances that were in this mix that I think is an area of reporting and something that I'm working on in a book that I'm working on right now.

But separately, I also think it's important, Virginia has said that she did not witness anything, but others have noticed Trump at the house at various events. So I think there's also an important thing. The trafficking, like the true -- there were levels of criminality in the Epstein scheme.

They go from absolute, you know, violent rapes and horrific trafficking to kind of a variety of behavior. And in some parts, there are people who were cultivated by Ghislaine, by Epstein, to be in the vicinity that may have not taken part in the criminal activity. They may have just been there to have an affair.

They may have just been there to take part in some kind of other untoward activity. And there were kind of layers of who knew what and how that was presented by design, because it prevented anyone from looking closely.

SANCHEZ: Well, aside from the White House saying that this is an effort by Democrats to distract from the government reopening and this is a selective leak, it does bring up additional questions about Trump's relationship with Epstein. I wonder how you think that'll be received.

WILL SOMMER, SENIOR REPORTER, THE BULWARK: This is a really challenging issue for the White House. I mean, for months, for years, people like J.D. Vance, Kash Patel said the Epstein case mattered a lot, that these files, this Imagine client list, this was all really important. And now you have these e-mails where Epstein's saying, you know, Trump knew about the girls. He's saying he spent time with one of Epstein's victims. So I mean, basically, we're seeing conservative media outlets, some are going with the idea that this is a distraction.

Others are saying, you know, maybe on the fringe, maybe this means Trump was an informant or something crazy like that. But really, I think it's just a very challenging issue right now for the MAGA movement.

KEILAR: It's interesting, too, when you look at the poll that this issue has for people in the MAGA orbit, Lauren Boebert is, according to sources, not being swayed from being on that discharge petition, even as she's getting what appears to be some pressure from the White House.

SOMMER: Yes, I mean, people like Lauren Boebert, Marjorie Taylor Greene, who was a big QAnon believer. I mean, these people are pushing the discharge petition, because I think they see it as a really big issue. And I think both a lot of people in the MAGA base and then in sort of the more right-leaning independent world, they care a lot about this issue.

SANCHEZ: To me, one of the e-mails that raises a lot of questions is this exchange between Michael Wolff, the author, and Jeffrey Epstein. This is back in December of 2015, when Trump was still a candidate and CNN was hosting a Republican presidential debate -- a primary debate, I should say. Wolff intimates to Epstein that he got some tip that there was going to be a question asked about Trump's relationship with a convicted sex offender.

That never came up, to be clear. CNN never asked a question about that. But Epstein, according to the e-mail, responds to Wolff, quote, "... if we were able to craft an answer for him, what do you think it should be?" Wolff responds, "...you should let him hang himself. If he says he hasn't been on the plane or the house, that gives you a valuable PR and political currency. You can hang him in a way that potentially generates a positive benefit for you. Or if it really looks like he could win, you could save him generating a debt."

I mean, they're clearly thinking about the political prism of this relationship. What do you make of that exchange?

SOMMER: I mean, this e-mail suggests that Epstein at least believed he had some kind of damaging information on Trump that he could hold over him. And I think now it's very relevant as we see this strange deal Ghislaine Maxwell appears to have struck with the administration. She's now in a minimum security prison, being treated very well, reportedly preparing to ask for a commutation. I mean, so it's a very strange situation.

It makes you wonder, what did people in Epstein's orbit know about Trump, or at least thought they knew?

KEILAR: It's really, really interesting.

SANCHEZ: Your response? What do you think of that exchange?

[15:40:00]

FITZPATRICK: I think it's very telling. I also think that Epstein and Ghislaine also went through a lot of effort to try and cultivate people that would be in their debt. That was a very active part of this trafficking operation. But I also think it shows that, you know, there was a knowledge that this could be politically problematic by both parties years in advance of right now.

So the idea that this is something that is a hoax or something that is unknown to the White House that they couldn't prepare for, that's totally belied by this new information.

KEILAR: So when she says, I was thinking of that, you just read that as them kind of scheming together?

FITZPATRICK: Yes, absolutely. Absolutely.

SANCHEZ: Sarah Fox -- Fitzpatrick, I should say -- Will Sommer, thank you both for being with us. Appreciate it.

Still plenty more news to come.

More than a dozen babies have gotten so sick, they've had to be rushed to the hospital after drinking formula suspected to be infected with botulism. The latest on the concerning outbreak, right after this.

[15:45:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: There's an important recall that parents need to know about. The entire line of ByHeart infant formula has been pulled from shelves because of serious health concerns. KEILAR: The company says several cases of infant botulism were reported in babies who had used ByHeart formula. CNN health reporter Jacqueline Howard has more.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JACQUELINE HOWARD, CNN HEALTH REPORTER: This recall is happening as there are now 15 cases of infant botulism that have been identified in 12 different states. These babies range in age from just 16 days old to 157 days old. They were all hospitalized.

They have been treated. Thankfully, no deaths have been reported. And the company ByHeart says it is working closely with the FDA in this investigation.

But at this moment, the company says all ByHeart infant formula products must be discarded. If you have been using this formula for your own baby, take the steps now to switch them to a different formula because infant botulism -- it's a serious illness. It occurs when a baby swallows the spores of the bacterium that causes botulism.

That bacterium is called Clostridium botulinum. When this happens, those spores can grow in the gut and produce a neurotoxin which causes serious illness. Signs and symptoms can include difficulty swallowing, loss of head control, even decreased facial expression.

Your baby may develop a weak or altered cry. And this can progress to even difficulty breathing or respiratory arrest. That's why, again, it's important to switch formulas if you have been using this product.

And both the FDA and CDC say that their investigations are ongoing.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

SANCHEZ: Really important for parents to be on the lookout. Jacqueline Howard, thank you so much.

Now to some of the other headlines we're watching this hour.

The mother of a missing 9-year-old, Melodee Buzzard, was in court today, but on charges unrelated to her daughter's disappearance. Ashlee Buzzard pleaded not guilty to a false imprisonment charge and was released from custody. Today's hearing was held about a month after Buzzard's daughter vanished during a multi-state road trip.

Melodee was last seen on surveillance video near the Colorado-Utah state line on October 9th, one day before her mother returned to California without her. The search for the girl continues.

And more than 30 people are dead, another dozen injured after a bus plunged into a deep ravine in Peru. According to local reports, the bus collided with a pickup truck early Wednesday morning while traveling down the Panamericana-Sur highway. The coastal road makes up the southern portion of the Panamerican highway, which is technically the longest in the world. KEILAR: Plus, passengers got a real scare on a commuter train in San Francisco. Video showing the train operator appearing to doze off at the controls. You can see the operator swaying with the train as it travels 50 miles per hour.

Going through a curve, some passengers were tossed around the car.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: It was fast. (INAUDIBLE) just hope my (INAUDIBLE) is gone.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I'm sorry relax, relax, relax.

(INAUDIBLE)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

KEILAR: Transit officials say the incident was a result of operator fatigue. The employee has since been placed on non-driving status.

And are you feeling lucky? Because the Mega Millions jackpot is approaching a billion dollars. The estimated prize for Friday's drawing is $965 million.

It's the eighth largest since the game started in 2002. That means that the cash payout, oh, it's just a paltry $445 million. The good news, the chance of winning any prize is actually about one in 23.

But don't go quitting your day job just yet, Boris.

SANCHEZ: I'm not going to quit.

KEILAR: Good. OK, good.

SANCHEZ: You will notice certain changes though.

KEILAR: Wait, hold on, prompter, go back. Go back, prompter. I missed the end of the story.

[15:50:00]

OK, because the chance of winning the whole jackpot is about one in 290.5 million. OK, that's not great.

SANCHEZ: We didn't really have to go back to read that part.

KEILAR: It's a lot, people. It's a lot.

SANCHEZ: Yes, the disenchanting part of it. There's still a chance.

KEILAR: Yes, from one billion to one cent. The U.S. government won't make pennies anymore. The very last one cent coin was minted just a bit ago.

So what it means for your change next? Maybe less of it. That's not a bad thing, right?

And this Sunday, take an intimate look into the extraordinary political career and life of New Zealand's former Prime Minister, Jacinda Ardern, in the new CNN film, "PRIME MINISTER."

[15:55:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: Today, the U.S. officially got penny-wise. A short time ago, the U.S. minted its final penny. After decades of losing money from producing the single-cent coin, the U.S. has been making pennies for more than 230 years.

KEILAR: And while no new ones will be made, the Treasury estimates there are more than 114 billion pennies still in circulation.

CNN's Danny Freeman was there to say farewell. Was it tearful, Danny? Were you so sad you're outside the U.S. mint in Philadelphia? Did you cry? You did, you cried, huh?

DANNY FREEMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Oh, shed many, many a tears. Listen, penny-pinching really has a whole new meaning today because, of course, after more than 230 years, the penny has finally been retired. There were five final coins minted and struck today here at the U.S. mint here in Philadelphia. Really, really the end of an era.

Now, the reason for this, as you noted, Boris, is because the Trump administration says that the American people have really been short- changed because the cost to produce the penny has tripled in the past 10 years and the demand to use the penny has absolutely plummeted. And the administration says that, basically, the intention is to, by stopping this, save more than $50 million a year for taxpayers.

But make no mistake, this has not been without some challenges, especially for retailers, because a lot of folks who still operate in that exact change world, they're going to have to start deciding if they want to round up to a nickel or round down to a nickel. So there are still some challenges to be worked out. But essentially, the administration, as you noted, said, don't throw out your pennies.

They are still legal, tender. They're about 300 billion out there in circulation. You can still roll them up, cash them in. So don't just toss them away.

One other thing I'll note is the Treasury Secretary, he was supposed to make an appearance today. He had to cancel at the last minute.

So the U.S. Treasurer was the one who ultimately struck that final penny. And where those five pennies are going, they're going to be auctioned off, ultimately.

Last thing I'll say, Boris, Brianna, pennies are really going to be lost when it comes to our phrases.

Penny for your thoughts, nickel for your thoughts. Penny wise, pound foolish, nickel wise, pound foolish. Listen, I don't know, this is my lucky penny.

And just being there for that historic moment, worth every penny.

KEILAR: Certainly was a penny for your thoughts, and we appreciate it, Danny Freeman, joining us on this emotional day. Thank you, sir.

Much of America will get another chance tonight to see something that we rarely get to see.

SANCHEZ: The aurora borealis, or the northern lights, which are usually seen in Arctic areas, they did reach the deep south last night.

Meteorologist Allison Chinchar joins us now. Allison, what are the northern lights exactly, and where are we going to see them tonight?

ALLISON CHINCHAR, CNN METEOROLOGIST: Yes, I mean, if you take a look at some of these images that came in last night, I would love to see this all over again. This is absolutely stunning. This is from Conway, Arkansas.

Again, not usually a state that you would normally see the northern lights. We think of folks in places like Minnesota, Maine, Alaska, not necessarily Iowa, but that's where this one is located here. Now, one thing to note is green is the most common color for the northern lights, but folks last night were able to see the reds, the pinks, even some purples.

Those colors are a bit more rare. So here's a look. There's that first wave that came in last night.

And again, see those dark colors there? That just goes to show you how dense that plasma was when it finally reached Earth. Now, the second wave, this is the one that's expected to come in today.

Notice, not quite as colorful, meaning it's not going to reach quite as far south because it's just not expected to be as strong of an event as the one we had last night. So if you're wondering, OK, well, who is going to see it? Will it be me?

This white circle here, this white line, this is essentially going to be the cutoff point. So if you live south of that line, it's not looking so good. The best chance is actually going to be in this green area here, which is usually the places that we end up seeing it, Canada, Alaska, and then those extreme northern states like Minnesota, Montana, and North Dakota.

Now, that doesn't necessarily mean you will guarantee seeing them because we are also expecting some cloud cover in a lot of these spots too. So you need both the clear skies, but you're also going to need to be a little bit far north to be able to see spectacular things like this. Again, take a look at this video.

This is from Crested Butte, Colorado. All of those bright red and pink colors. Hopefully, we will get a chance to see something very similar in some places yet again tonight. KEILAR: Can you go back to that map? So we're not going to get it here. We have no chance in Washington, D.C., Allison.

SANCHEZ: It looks like we're just barely in there.

KEILAR: We're like, no? Is that a no? Just --

[16:00:00]

CHINCHAR: Also, maybe the light pollution's probably not going to be your favorite either.

SANCHEZ: That's what I was going to say. That's probably the thing.

KEILAR: Come on, Allison, breaking our hearts. Breaking our hearts. All right.

SANCHEZ: There's a chance. There's always a chance.

SANCHEZ: All right. There's a chance.

KEILAR: There's always a chance. "THE ARENA" with Kasie Hunt starts right now.

END