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James Marsh is Interviewed about the Epstein Files; Rep. Eugene Vindman (D-VA) is Interviewed about a Saudi Call; Iran Open to U.S. Talks; Maggie Astor is Interviewed about A.I. for Health; Chris Swonger is Interviewed about Tariffs. Aired 8:30-9a ET

Aired November 19, 2025 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[08:30:40]

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: The bill to force the Justice Department to release all its files in the Jeffrey Epstein investigation is expected to land on President Trump's desk this morning. He said he will sign it. He hasn't said exactly when.

What we do know is that this is a stunning reversal for the party and the president, who had tried to block the release for months. For survivors of Epstein's abuse, who have fought for years for justice, this is an enormous victory. Still, there is skepticism about what happens after the president puts pen to paper to make the files public.

With me now is attorney James Marsh. He is representing victims of Jeffrey Epstein.

You represented -- you represent many clients, including Maria Farmer, who was the very first person to -- known to have reported to the FBI that she suffered abuse by Epstein and Ghislaine Maxwell in -- back in 1996. I'm just curious how she is responding seeing what is happening with Congress and the promise by the president to sign this.

JAMES R. MARSH, ATTORNEY REPRESENTING VICTIMS OF JEFFREY EPSTEIN: Yes, thank you for that question. It's really sort of miraculous what's happened to her in the last few days. She's had a great deal of health problems. She's been suffering physically from this for a long time. And she got a report just a few days ago that many of her test results are positive. For the first time in many, many years. So, this is a real manifestation, not only of the toll that it takes on victims and survivors, but how, you know, the move towards justice and accountability can really make, in this case, a physical difference on her health. So, she's -- she's very, very happy for what happened yesterday with the realization that this is really only the beginning. We've only, you said, all the files. Well, that's a big definition, all the files.

SIDNER: Yes. I do want to talk about what she told our Erin Burnett. She spoke to her for the very first time publicly. And she talked about this encounter that she had after being called to Epstein's offices in New York when Donald Trump, she says, showed up.

Here's what she said.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARIA FARMER, JEFFREY EPSTEIN ACCUSER: Trump's standing here. I'm here. And he walks out of his office and he goes, oh, no, no, no. He was laughing at me. And he goes, she's not here for you. Follow me, right? And he escorts him in to this other room. But he made a joke to Epstein, oh, I thought she was 16.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: Now, the White House is denying all of this, saying Trump was never in Epstein's offices. He's calling the Epstein files a Democratic hoax. And he's now pushing the DOJ to investigate Democrats only and their involvement with Epstein.

When you put all that together, including their denial, are your clients and you confident that you're going to see all the files, that the DOJ is not going to cherry pick any of this and release them all?

MARSH: No, we're not confident. I mean that's the easy answer. Our clients are not stupid. The American people are not naive. They know that it's taken decades, in many cases, to get to this point.

And the curious aside about the president. He was a Democrat at the time, if you recall, before he became a Republican. So, whether or not this is a Democratic hoax, a Republican hoax, you can change your party, you can change your -- you can change your tune, but you can't really change what's in the files. And our clients know that. And we feel that we're -- we've jumped the first hurdle and we're at the -- sort of the end of the beginning. This is no way over by any -- by any measure.

SIDNER: You have filed suit against the United States government, particularly in Maria's case. What is it that you are suing for against the government? And what ultimately does justice look like for your clients?

MARSH: There's been a lot of budding accountability on the part of the banks. We've seen those lawsuits. We've seen the emails come out from the estate. There have been other lawsuits against private individuals.

What we do not know is what is in the federal government files. It's very important to remember that the files that were released were from the estate. All those emails, all those revelations that took the world by storm, I don't know, three days ago, here we are, we don't know what's in the files. So, we really feel that that is the missing piece of accountability.

In 1996, when Maria Farmer made her report, Jeffrey Epstein was already under investigation as part of the tower financial scandal. He was also under investigation and was sued by the State Department that leased him the former Iranian consulate in New York City. [08:35:04]

These are facts that people have long forgotten.

But we want to go back to the beginning, find out that -- what law enforcement knew. I'm very happy that they listened and the U.S. attorney in the Southern District of New York also has to release their litigation files. There's a huge record in the government files on Jeffrey Epstein. And we want to know who facilitated and who contributed to his rise to power. We think that will be found in the government files, and we hope for some government accountability and the creation of a fund or some kind of means to compensate these victims for the government's failure.

SIDNER: Yes. I mean, there is so much there. And we heard from the victims with just stunningly emotional comments about how they have tried to survive all of this, and they're finally getting a little bit of relief.

MARSH: It's been decades for many of them.

SIDNER: At least some acknowledgment here.

MARSH: Yes.

SIDNER: James Marsh, thank you so much. I'm sure we'll be talking to you throughout.

MARSH: Thank you for your coverage. And keep on this story. I don't think we're near the end, anywhere near the end.

SIDNER: Thank you. We do appreciate it. We will.

MARSH: Thank you.

SIDNER: Kate.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: New this morning, on the heels of President Trump rolling out the red carpet for the Saudi crown prince at the White House, a Democratic lawmaker took to the House floor to raise alarm about it and new questions over it. President Trump, yesterday, hosted the crown prince, Mohammed -- crown prince, MBS, at the White House and defended him over the murder of journalist and Saudi dissident Jamal Khashoggi, among other things. And because of that, hearing that, Congressman Eugene Vindman is now demanding that President Trump release the transcript of a call with the crown prince that took place back in 2019 with MBS, when the congressman was actually not a congressman, was actually serving on President Trump's National Security Council.

Listen to this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. EUGENE VINDMAN (D-VA): During my tenure on Trump's White House National Security Council staff, I reviewed many of Trump's calls with foreign leaders. Of all the calls I reviewed, two stood out as the most problematic. The first we all know, it was between President Trump and President Zelenskyy, which resulted in President Trump's first impeachment. The second was between President Trump and Mohammed bin Salman. After the murder of journalist Jamal Khashoggi, I reviewed a call between the president and the Saudi crown prince. The American people and the Khashoggi family deserve to know what was said on that call. If history is any guide, the receipts will be shocking. I call on the president to release that transcript.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: (AUDIO GAP) Democratic Congressman Eugene Vindman of Virginia.

Congressman, thank you for being here.

I don't know how much you can discuss, but what are you suggesting happened on that call?

REP. EUGENE VINDMAN (D-VA): Well, look, as I mentioned last night on the floor of the House of Representatives, that there were two calls among many with foreign leaders that particularly disturbed me. And one we know was with President Zelenskyy of Ukraine, the extortion call. And that resulted in the president's first impeachment.

This is the second one that really bothered me. Because this was about the murder of an American resident, a Virginia resident, and a "Washington Post" reporter, and the president -- the conversation he had, obviously I can't get into the details, but it was counterfactual to what the president was claiming last night, what U.S. security and intelligence services have known and stated publicly was the involvement of MBS, and it's time that the president come clean. And, frankly, in light of the enrichment that the Trump family has received in the ensuing years, I think it's even more deeply disturbing and, frankly, shocking.

BOLDUAN: I mean, the contents of the Zelenskyy call, as you mentioned, resulted in Trump's first impeachment. I mean what are you suggesting about the call that MBS -- with MBS contained, impeachable offenses, or just it's different from what he said publicly yesterday?

VINDMAN: Well, look, there was actually a book written by Mr. Woodward where the president said that he saved MBS' ass. I'm just going to quote that. And I think that the actions and the special treatment that the Saudi crown prince has received, and the ensuing self- enrichment by the Trump family from Saudi Arabia, Saudi Arabian officials, is certainly a conflict of interest. It was -- the call itself, I think, would be shocking. Again, I can't get into any details.

But the president actually released the transcript of the Ukraine call. And I think the president should also release the transcript of the call with MBS that occurred after the journalist that was brutally butchered by Saudi agents in the Turkish embassy in Istanbul.

[08:40:07] BOLDUAN: You -- as you mentioned, the Khashoggi family. I want to play how angrily and forcefully President Trump defended being asked about that Saudi dissident's murder.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: You're mentioning somebody that was extremely controversial. A lot of people didn't like that gentleman that you're talking about. Whether you like him or didn't like him, things happened. But he knew nothing about it. And we can leave it at that. You don't have to embarrass our guests by asking a question like that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: Congressman, you hear that and you think what?

VINDMAN: I think it's a ridiculous statement. Look, we have to deal with potentially unsavory or adversarial folks from around the world. And whether it's Kim Jong-un, king or, you know, the president of North Korea, or the leader of North Korea, or Vladimir Putin,, or President Xi of China, we have to deal with them. But that doesn't mean we have to cozy up to him. That doesn't mean we have to whitewash history and eliminate what we know are facts or claims certainly made by the intelligence services of the United States that the prince was involved in the murder, the brutal murder of Khashoggi. We can deal with him and at the same time acknowledge that those things happened. And the president actually seems to be whitewashing it, which the American people deserve to know the truth. The Khashoggi family deserves to know the truth. And, you know, it should come as no surprise that this -- that the Ukraine phone call was not the only phone call that was problematic that the president had with other foreign leaders.

BOLDUAN: Congressman Eugene Vindman, thank you so much for coming in.

VINDMAN: Thank you.

BOLDUAN: John.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, Americans turning to A.I. for medical advice. So, what happens if it has one of those so-called hallucinations?

And then it has to be one of the most shocking mystery boxes of all time. A man buys a storage unit only to find two million fentanyl pills inside.

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[08:45:23]

BERMAN: All right, new this morning, a CNN exclusive. CNN has learned that Iran is signaling it is open to resuming nuclear talks with the United States. That is according to a senior Iranian official. But officials there insist they will not shift their conditions and are demanding, quote, "mutual respect."

Let's go to Tehran. CNN's Fred Pleitgen is live there with this brand- new reporting.

Fred, what have you learned?

FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi there, John. It's quite a big step, actually, for the Iranians. Of course, they say that they felt quite betrayed by the United States after that 12 day war that happened here in June where they got attacked by the Israelis. And, of course, then, at the end of the day, the Trump administration bombed several sites of Iran's nuclear program.

The Iranians are now signaling that, yes, they are willing to enter into talks again, but they also say that they're only willing to do that on their own terms, especially as far as their nuclear program and nuclear enrichment are concerned.

Here's what that senior official had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PLEITGEN: Who do you think needs to make the first move if you want to start talking again? Do you think they need to come to you, or would you be willing to contact them also?

KAMAL KHARRAZI, SENIOR POLICY ADVISER TO THE SUPREME LEADER OF IRAN: Yes, to make the first move we should (INAUDIBLE) that they are ready to engage with us on the conditions that we put.

PLEITGEN: What does that mean as far as Iran's nuclear program is concerned?

KHARRAZI: The nuclear program of Iran is indigenous and cannot be removed simply by force.

PLEITGEN: What are your red lines as far as the enrichment of uranium is concerned?

KHARRAZI: We have to continue our enrichment because we need to produce fuel for power plants, as well for our medical activities. Therefore, we cannot just stop enriching uranium. The degree of enrichment is the question of negotiations.

PLEITGEN: And do you think that there could be a common understanding there?

KHARRAZI: I think so. If there would be a genuine negotiations between Iran and the United States, there are ways and means of how to ensure that Iran can continue its enrichment. But, I mean, the same times assure the others that it's not going to look for nuclear weapons.

PLEITGEN: One of the things that Iran prides itself on, and one of the things that's very important to this country's defense, is your ballistic missile program. How are you looking to enhance that program? KHARRAZI: Certainly we have to defend ourselves. Whatever we can do in

producing our missiles, certainly we do not neglect. And that's the -- I mean the weapons that we can defend ourselves and safeguard our national security.

PLEITGEN: So Iran is going to continue to expand its ballistic missile program, because I know that some of the ballistic missiles are very sophisticated.

KHARRAZI: No question -- not question about that. And it is only nuclear issue that we are ready to engage with the United States and others. We are not going to speak to others or negotiate with others on the other issues, including missile activities.

PLEITGEN: What -- as we sit here, what is your message right now to U.S. President Donald Trump?

KHARRAZI: Start with a positive approach with Iran. If it would be positive, certainly it would be reciprocated. But for that, they have to refrain from any force against Iran.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

PLEITGEN: So, some very clear words there from Kamal Kharrazi, the senior foreign policy adviser directly for the supreme leader of Iran, Ayatollah Ali Khamenei, clearly speaking about the ballistic missile program and the nuclear program, John.

There was one other question that I posed to him as well, because there is still a lot of tension, obviously, here in the region, is whether or not he feared that there could be renewed military conflict between the U.S. and Iran, between Israel and Iran. He said he thinks anything is possible. But he also says that Iran is prepared for it.

John.

BERMAN: Got to say, that felt like a fascinating conversation that could have been something of a trial balloon there.

Frederik Pleitgen, live in Tehran for us this morning. So terrific to have you there. Thanks so much, Fred.

Sara.

SIDNER: All right, thank you, John.

For decades people have been googling their health symptoms. Now, more and more, Americans are turning to A.I. bots for medical advice. A survey by the Kaiser Family Foundation found that in 2024 about one in six adults use chat bots to find health information at least once a month. The study also found about a quarter of adults under the age of 30 sought medical advice from A.I. monthly.

[08:50:04]

Joining me now is Maggie Astor, a reporter for "The New York Times." You wrote this great piece on this. And one of the things that really

came out of this after you interviewed dozens of people, is what is driving so many people to ask these chat bots for medical help in the first place. What did you learn?

MAGGIE ASTOR, REPORTER, "THE NEW YORK TIMES": Well, there's a range of factors happening here. Some people are turning to the chat bots because of the cost of medical care. Some of them are turning to them because of the accessibility of medical care, whether it's that they live in a rural area without a lot of options or their doctor isn't available for an urgent problem for a couple of weeks. There are also people who do see their doctor, but they find that the doctor talks to them in a sort of jargony, inaccessible way and they don't really understand what they're hearing. So, they sort of ask A.I. to translate.

And there are people who feel that they're being dismissed by their doctors. That their doctors aren't taking their symptoms seriously, or perhaps that their doctors simply aren't able to figure out what's causing their symptoms and so they feel that they need to turn somewhere else.

SIDNER: You, as you reported through this, and having talked to so many people, what did you find were sort of the major risks that you discovered when patients did use A.I. chatbots and did do what those chatbots told them to do to try to remedy things?

ASTOR: So, there have been both good and bad experiences. There are certainly people who have found that the chatbots have given them good advice that ultimately aligned with what their doctor said. They perhaps later went to their doctors and heard similar things.

But there are also risks, as you alluded to, yes. The chatbots can provide medically dangerous advice. There was a case study published recently of a patient who wanted to reduce salt in their diet. And so A.I. advised them to replace salt with sodium bromide, which is a very toxic substance in high quantities. And they ended up having hallucinations, paranoia. They were in a psychiatric ward.

We also, my colleague and I, talked to a bioethicist who had a case where the relative of a patient wanted to follow a treatment plan that the doctors actually believed could kill her because that treatment plan was recommended by ChatGPT. And the patient's family actually checked her out of the hospital against medical advice because they wanted to pursue a treatment course that was more aligned with what the A.I. had said.

There's also the issue of sycophancy, which is the A.I. essentially affirming what people already believe. It will pick up on perhaps a diagnosis that you already think you have, and then reaffirm that to the exclusion of other possibilities.

SIDNER: Yes, there's a lot to unpack here, but it does tell you something about how people feel about the health care system overall.

Maggie Astor, thank you so much for the piece and for coming on this morning. Do appreciate you.

John.

BERMAN: All right, this morning, one shocking storage unit. DEA agents say a person who bought a storage unit legally at auction opened it to find $1.7 million -- I'm sorry, 1.7 counterfeit fentanyl pills inside. They also found 12 kilograms of fentanyl powder and two and a half pounds of meth. This person called authorities right away. The agency says this is officially the largest fentanyl seizure in Colorado history.

So, a win with a major asterisk by artificial intelligence. This happened at an F1 showcase in Abu Dhabi. It pitted a former Formula One champion against a car driven by A.I. in a ten-lap human versus A.I. challenge. The automated car came out on top, but it was given a head start. So, I'm not even sure why we're talking about this. With the head start it just edged out the living driver by a fraction of seconds. This whole event ended with a six-car race, all driven by A.I.

Britain's Royal Mint is celebrating legendary musician Feddie Mercury with a brand-new coin. The design marks 40 years since the iconic performance at Live Aid. The Royal Mint says it will donate a special gold edition of the coin to the Mercury Phoenix Trust. That's the charity started in the singer's memory that donates funds to people living with HIV and AIDS.

Kate.

BOLDUAN: So, right now, the president's trade pivot is rolling out. The major development being that the president has announced he's pulling back on certain tariffs in an effort to try and help bring down prices, exempting more than 200 food products, including bananas, beef, coffee from the so-called reciprocal tariffs that he imposed on U.S. trading partners. This shift, celebrated for sure by many of those industries, but industries left out sounding the alarm, including the distilled spirits industry, like scotch, cognac, Irish whiskey.

[08:55:08]

The head of the leading trade group for that industry saying this after the president made this announcement. "Not including E.U. and U.K. spirits on the list of tariff modifications is yet another blow to the U.S. hospitality industry, just as the critical holiday season kicks in to high gear."

The United States is currently imposing a 15 percent tariff on imports from the E.U., a 10 percent tariff on imports from the U.K. And according to data from the Distilled Spirits Council, the tariff on spirits from the E.U. alone could lead to a $1 billion loss in U.S. sales.

Joining me right now is the president and CEO of the Distilled Spirits Council, Chris Swonger.

It's good to have you back. Thank you for being here.

The point of the rollback, according to the Treasury secretary, was to ease price pressure on products not made in the United States. Why weren't distilled spirits included?

CHRIS SWONGER, PRESIDENT AND CEO, DISTILLED SPIRITS COUNCIL OF THE U.S.: Well, we are certainly hopeful this is a building block. Kudos for the administration to recognize the tariffs on bananas and coffee beans are having an impact on the American economy. So, we're in the middle of the hot holiday selling season for the distilled spirits industry, as you said, and it will inject economic vitality in the American hospitality industry, Twenty-one percent of the sales at restaurants come from beverage, alcohol and spirits. And Americans love their cognac and scotch and Irish whiskey and so forth. So, we hope it's a building block. Ambassador Greer is going to be going to the U.K., I think, within the next week or so. And we think there's an opportunity to eliminate that 10 percent tariff that's applied on U.K. spirits.

BOLDUAN: How hard has the industry been hit since tariffs set in?

SWONGER: We've had a massive impact. Unfortunately, we reported a 9 percent decline, a sharp decline in American distilled spirits exports to our major trading markets. Canada has been a significant hit. Many of the provinces still aren't taking American spirits and wine products. It's had a massive impact. Spirits has had an 85 percent reduction in our sales. And the same is applied.

So, we're navigating a very unpredictable marketplace. And the tariffs, the 15 percent tariff on all E.U. spirits is having an impact. And a 10 percent tariff on all U.K. spirits is having an impact. Our industry is distinct because we have distinctive products. You can't make Irish whiskey in the United States, or cognac in the United States, or scotch whiskey. So, we're hopeful. And we think this should be a great building block for the administration to consider.

BOLDUAN: Chris, did I hear you right? You said an 85 reduction in sales of what? That's insane.

SWONGER: Massive. Massive impact. And, you know, we are hopeful that many of the provinces, Ottawa in Canada, they've taken a position not to take American distilled spirits products, wine products as well, American beer products, and it's having an impact. It's having a direct impact on craft distilleries all around the country that look to Canada. Canadians love American whiskey, obviously, as Americans appreciate and love Canadian whiskey as well.

So, we are hopeful the administration and the president can help with this because it's going to have a -- it's having a direct impact on the American economy and American hospitality.

BOLDUAN: Because I was going to ask you, I mean, you told me last time you were on, 20 years ago there were 60 distilleries in the United States. Today, there's over 3,000 distilleries around the country.

SWONGER: That's right. Yes. BOLDUAN: The point of the trade war, according to the White House, was to boost American manufacturing. What you're saying is that that is not happening for American distilleries?

SWONGER: We're seeing the data that it's having an impact. The unpredictable marketplace that we're navigating is having an impact on that great American success story, the growth of American distilleries.

BOLDUAN: You're saying a negative impact?

SWONGER: A negative impact. No doubt about it. And that's why we saw, you know, a sharp decline in American distilled spirits exports around the world with our key trading markets.

And we recognize the president is trying to inject a strong, vivacious American economy. And the best way to do that for our industry is for zero for zero tariffs, because we're so intertwined. And American consumers appreciate and love imported distilled spirits, just like we want our key trading partners and consumers around the world to appreciate American distilled spirits products.

BOLDUAN: Let us see what happens here.

Chris Swonger, thanks for coming back on.

A new hour of CNN NEWS CENTRAL starts right now.

[09:00:03]

SIDNER: Today could be the day the president signs the bill forcing the release of the Epstein files.