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Trump Health Care Proposal; Trump Hints at Ukraine Peace Progress; Kira Rudik is Interviewed about Peace Talks; Billups Arraignment in Rigged Poker Game Case; Justin Wolfers is Interviewed about the Economy. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired November 24, 2025 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:00]

COY WIRE, CNN SPORTS ANCHOR: The Lions kept fighting then. In overtime, their star running back, Jahmyr Gibbs, makes a house call. These teams combined with more than 1,000 yards of total offense. Gibbs had 264 of them and three touchdowns. Giants gave it their all, but they cannot match in O.T. So, the Lions win 34-27.

Another overtime thriller, Colts and Chiefs. Patrick Mahomes looking to avoid the first three game losing streak of his career, but started with an interception on his very first drive. That led to a Colts touchdown. But with the Chiefs behind 11 points to start the fourth, they tie it up, send it to overtime, and there goes Mahomes, finding Xavier Worthy for a huge gain. Then he would hit Rashee Rice, who had 141 yards receiving. That gets them well within field goal range and bring out Harrison Butker. Yes, that's going to be good. Chiefs win 23-20. First time this season they finally come out on top and get a win in a one-score game. They keep their playoff hopes alive.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PATRICK MAHOMES, KC CHIEFS QUARTERBACK: We've been in these games, you know? All five of our losses I feel like felt like these games where there was plays here and there that we didn't make. And we could have won all of them and we didn't. And until you prove it, you can talk about it all day. But until you prove it, it's not going to happen. And so we -- we were able to prove that we can win a game like this, you know, where it's not always going great, where multiple guys got to step up and then you can make the big plays and the big moments. And I thought our guys did that. So, hopefully we can build off that as we go through the reset of this season.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WIRE: John, Pat said that's exactly the type of win they needed as they make their final push to the season. Next up, they have a dinner date, a Thanksgiving feast, shall we say, with the Cowboys on Thursday.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: Yes, two teams that came out on top this week. That will be fun. Best part of the day.

Coy Wire, great to see you. Thanks so much.

A new hour of CNN NEWS CENTRAL starts now.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: A new health care proposal coming from President Trump. CNN has learned he could unveil it as soon as today. With millions of Americans now facing staggering spikes in their premiums, is his plan going to help?

And happening in the next hour, NBA Hall of Famer, current head coach in the NBA, is about to face a judge. Chauncey Billups stands accused of taking part in a rigged poker scheme with mafia ties.

Plus, new details about the health scare that forced Donald Glover, aka Childish Gambino, to cancel his tour, and how he's doing now.

I'm Kate Bolduan, with John Berman and Sara Sidner. This is CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: Breaking overnight, with millions of Americans bracing for skyrocketing health care premiums because Congress has not voted to fund subsidies for Obamacare, we're learning President Trump is planning on finally unveiling a new health care proposal. That could happen as early as today. The president's proposal is expected to include several major changes, including income limits and getting rid of plans with zero-dollar monthly premiums. Both will impact middle class Americans who become eligible for health care assistance through the subsidies for the first time back in 2021.

CNN's Alayna Treene is at the White House for us.

What do you know about this proposal so far and when we might see it?

ALAYNA TREENE, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Well, we're being told by White House officials, Sara, that we could see it as early as today. And look, this is a long-awaited plan. We knew that the Trump administration had been working on something to try and solve this issue, because, remember, this was the fight that was at the center of the government shutdown. Democrats saying they wanted to negotiate some sort of health care plan to prevent these subsidies from expiring at the end of the year. Republicans saying they wanted to just have a clean extension of the government, deal with the health care later.

Well, now the problem is, the timeline is coming up very quickly for when they need to act on these subsidies or you're going to see millions of Americans who rely on the Affordable Care Act, their premiums could double, or even more so, starting next year. And so, the Trump administration recognizes that this is a problem, both practically, of course, for millions of Americans, but also politically, because if -- we do see premiums skyrocket, which would happen if they allow these to expire, these subsidies. This is going to be a major issue in the midterms next year. It's also something a lot of Democrats were kind of banking on as something to message on as we look ahead to 2026 elections.

Now, I want to get into some of the proposals in this framework from the Trump administration, what we could see in this. One would be a temporary extension of subsidies. Unclear how long. We've heard a lot of Republicans kind of spar over how long that could be. I know in some conversations people at the White House has talked about a two year extension. We'll have to see what that actually looks like when this is unveiled.

The next is that it would restore the income cap. This is, of course, changing some of the requirements needed for some of these subsidies.

[09:05:03]

Another would be monthly premiums are required for all of these policies. That's different than what the current guidelines are right now. And then also they would allow for a health saving --health savings account for some of the lower tier plans.

Now, to be clear, this could change. The Trump administration has been very clear that this is not file -- final. It's a framework. But this is really their attempt to try and stave off some of the issues that they know they're staring down when it comes to the health care fight.

SIDNER: And a lot of people will be waiting to see what happens because they're terrified about their premiums and how high they're going to go.

Alayna Treene, thank you so much. Do appreciate your reporting there.

Kate.

BOLDUAN: And this morning there's big progress, maybe. President Trump is weighing in on the negotiations to end Russia's war on Ukraine, after both U.S. and Ukrainian officials said that they were making significant headway this weekend. The president then posted this today, "don't believe it until you see it, but something good just may be happening."

And just moments ago, Ukrainian President Zelenskyy said his country's delegation is now returning home from those talks in Geneva, adding that he's expecting a full report on the progress toward peace.

Secretary of State Marco Rubio, one of the key figures in the talks over the weekend, says that the president -- the Trump administration's 28-point plan is evolving. Critics said the initial language was so favorable to Russia that it was, or could, have been written in the Kremlin itself. Some U.S. senators have even said that Rubio told them it was a Russia wish list. The State Department denies that.

Now, President Trump did set a Thanksgiving deadline for Ukraine to accept the plan. But Marco Rubio suggests that firm deadline may not be so firm right now.

And while they are talking, the war is raging on. Overnight, Ukrainian officials say Russia launched another deadly drone attack in the country's second largest city.

CNN's Matthew Chance is live in Geneva for us today.

Where do things stand right now, Matthew?

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN CHIEF GLOBAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Well, I mean, there's been some significant developments from what we've been told by U.S. Secretary of State Marco Rubio. He was here last night at the U.S. mission in Geneva, talking to the media about how much progress had been made, how constructive the talks have been with the Ukrainian delegation that was sitting across the table from him throughout the course of much of the day. And he also said that he'd briefed President Trump, who just hours before had, you know, kind of criticized, castigated the Ukrainian government for, you know, not being grateful enough essentially. Something he's done in the past.

But Rubio told me that President Trump was now pleased with the progress that he was able to report back to the president about the outcome of the talks. What he was not been -- be able to do, what he wasn't able to do, though, was to give us any details about what exactly had been agreed, what had been put into the proposals, what had been taken out to make it more palatable, potentially for the -- for the Ukrainians, indeed for the Europeans as well, who are very concerned about not being closer involved, more involved in the -- in the negotiations with Ukraine to try to bring an end to the war.

But, you know, there are big issues that still remain. Marco Rubio, the secretary of state, saying he doesn't believe those issues are insurmountable. But, you know, they are still huge. Things like territorial concessions from Ukraine. Things like the limitations being put on its armed forces. Like the general kind of state of the country post war, what that Ukrainian state is going to look like. These are issues that are extremely contentious. And if a new peace proposal, which is currently being negotiated we're told, addresses those Ukrainian concerns, it might create another problem as well. Will the Kremlin, which has been utterly, you know, refusing to make any compromises on its demands so far, will they accept that? And so, yes, as President Trump said, don't believe it until you see it. I think that's very good advice.

BOLDUAN: Probably so. Definitely so when it comes to this.

Matthew, it's great to see you. Thank you so much.

John.

BERMAN: All right, with us now is Kira Rudik, a member of Ukraine's parliament.

Thank you so much for being with us this morning.

You've, I think, probably had a chance to read the presidents words. He says, "is it really possible that big progress is being made in peace talks between Russia and Ukraine? Don't believe it until you see it, but something good may just be happening.

So, when you read that, and we can put that up on the screen so you can see it. When you read that, how hopeful are you? KIRA RUDIK, MEMBER OF UKRAINIAN PARLIAMENT: Hi, John. Thank you so

much for having me.

Well, there are not negotiations between Ukraine and Russia right now. There are negotiations between Ukraine and the United States. And we are hopeful because for the first time in all this whole process, we have seen the point about the security guarantees from the United States.

[09:10:05]

So, if there is a breakthrough, this is a breakthrough. However, we need to learn more about what do these security guarantees mean, and are they actually executable, and is this something that Ukrainian people will trust that will allow us to go ahead in peaceful negotiations?

However, what I am very worried of is that since the beginning of this peace approach, President Trump was not able to get anything from Russia. He was not even able to get them to come to a ceasefire. Something that Ukraine agreed a while ago. And so, while these negotiations happen, Russia continues attacking us, killing people. And so, we don't know, even if we commit to everything that the United States will accept, what will happen next. Why this time President Trump be able -- thinks that he will be able to pressure Putin into agreeing to that. And how much time would it take?

BERMAN: Presumably, if there is some kind of agreement, or when there is ultimately, as a member of Ukraine's parliament, you could get a vote to ratify it, some of the things that have been discussed, you know, ceding territory in Donbas, including territory that Russia hasn't even conquered, to Russia, limiting, putting a cap on the military. Could you ever vote to ratify an agreement where that was included?

RUDIK: That will be incredibly hard because some of the points that you mentioned go against Ukraine's constitution. So, to make those changes, it's not just a vote in Ukraine's parliament. There need to be a referendum. So, these changes will not be something that just the parliament agreed on, but that Ukrainian people agreed on. And for that we would need a ceasefire, the end of the martial law, and then ability to conduct this referendum.

So, nobody's talking about it right now because it seems like a technicality. But for us to have like a real just peace when everything will be done properly, we need to look at how to do it.

But, of course, we are -- this is a red line for us to give up any Ukrainian land, to give up any Ukraine's sovereignty. Let me ask you this. If Russia doesn't plan to attack us in the near future, why would they demand that we are limiting our army? I think this is the question that everybody needs to ask themselves. And then think, is it wise to pressure Ukraine into having this limitation on ourselves? How would we defend Europe and everybody else if this limitation is imposed? BERMAN: One of the other posts that President Trump made over the weekend, he said, "Ukraine's leadership has expressed zero gratitude for our efforts."

How does it make you feel when the president of the United States basically calls Ukrainians ungrateful?

RUDIK: I think this is like a pressure point that President Trump is trying to put onto President Zelenskyy. And I think here we are already sort of used to this roller coaster of having two leaders have good relations and then having not so good relations. My biggest fear here is that it's really demotivating to the people at the front line, because they are showing their gratitude to the whole free world by fighting and sacrificing their lives every single day.

So, it is very hard for me, as a member of parliament, as peoples representative, to explain every time what is going on, that this is rather political than really how people feel. Because what we know for sure and what I'm expressing is that American people are in their hearts standing with Ukrainian people because we are fighting for the same values of freedom and independence that all people in the democratic world can understand and rely. And this is something that I'm explaining over and over again.

BERMAN: Kira Rudik, a member of Ukraine's parliament, thank you, as always, for being with us.

Sara.

SIDNER: All right, ahead this morning, a former all-star turned NBA head coach now accused in a mafia-linked gambling scheme, is scheduled to go before a judge. His attorney denying charges, saying, he has no reason to damage his incredible legacy for a card game. What we expect in court today.

Plus, a terminal cancer diagnosis for the granddaughter of President John F. Kennedy. What we know about the rare form of blood cancer she's been battling after she gave birth.

And the Thanksgiving holiday rush is on. But is it already time to start thinking about your December travel plans? How to score the best deals. We'll talk about it, ahead.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:18:57]

BOLDUAN: So, Chauncey Billups, the NBA Hall of Famer, current coach of the Portland Trail Blazers, is due in court in about an hour. He was indicted last month for allegedly taking part in really a wild and elaborate rigged poker scheme, one of two gambling schemes actually that the federal government is now going after.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOSEPH NOCELLA JR., U.S. ATTORNEY FOR THE EASTERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK: These defendants, which include former professional athletes, used high tech cheating technology to steal millions of dollars from victims in underground poker games that were secretly fixed. The games in the New York area were backed by the Bonanno, Gambino and Genovese crime families of La Cosa Nostra.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: That technology that he's talking about, you can also see it here, it included x-ray card tables and rigged card shuffling machines. Billups is accused of being what they call a face card, a celebrity player, a lure to get people into the -- into the -- what is -- they don't know is a totally fixed poker game. He's expected to plead not guilty.

[09:20:00]

CNN's legal -- CNN's senior legal analyst Elie Honig has much more on this.

I mean there's like questions abound around this one. But based on what you've seen in this indictment, we're talking about just kind of this narrow one, and the court case -- and court filings, how strong is the evidence that prosecution have -- the prosecutors have so far?

ELIE HONIG, CNN SENIOR LEGAL ANALYST: Well, Kate, I think the evidence is solid, but it's not quite overwhelming in my view. Now, there are two types of charges in this case. First, there's the illegal gambling enterprise cases. All prosecutors have to show there is that each of the 31 defendants was present at, participated in, knew about those underground poker games. That's fairly easy to do. But the thing is, the penalty for that is very low under federal law. Could even be non- prison as the ultimate sentence.

The bigger stakes are with the fraud part of this case, right? You just showed the technology that was used to steal from unwitting card players. That's harder to prove. I don't see smoking guns on that, including with respect to Chauncey Billups. Doesn't mean prosecutors have no case at all, but I don't see texts or emails involving Chauncey Billups that shows that, sure, he knew he was at a poker game, but that he knew about the games being rigged. So, he's got what we would call a triable case on that. He's got the ability to go to trial and put up a reasonable defense on those fraud charges.

BOLDUAN: Prosecutors also have talked to the court that they have had productive talks with several defendants about potential guilty pleas. Is that surprising at what feels like this really early point in the case?

HONIG: Not surprising at all. So, the statistics show that over 95 percent of all federal cases end up pleading out, end up with guilty pleas. Here you have 31 defendants. Wouldn't surprise me if high 20s or something close to that end up pleading out.

Also, smart defense lawyers know that generally you're going to get the plea offer earlier on in the case. In a mass defendant case like this, sometimes there's a race in the door. And if you want to cooperate and try to get the best possible deal, then it's absolutely in your interest to work out a deal as quickly as possible.

BOLDUAN: And this is something -- I mean, this is -- you spent much of your career as a federal prosecutor working mafia cases. Talk to me about just what we see here, which is members of organized crime involved with pulling something off with outsiders, like including the famous athletes, famous people.

HONIG: Yes. So, gangsters will generally do business with anyone who they can make money off of. Anyone who can help them make money.

Now, look, these underground poker games are very common. They would often be sort of the last charge in the bigger cases we would bring because, as I said before, it's not a major charge. But the fraud part of this is something new. I mean using that sophisticated technology, the fixed shuffling decks, the infrared vision. I mean, I'll hand it to the mob, I guess they've evolved technologically since I was involved in prosecuting them.

BOLDUAN: It's good to see you, Elie. Thank you so much.

Sara.

HONIG: Thanks, Kate.

SIDNER: You'll never hear that again, Elie Honig handed something to the mob. Never hear it again.

BOLDUAN: Right before he puts cuffs on them.

SIDNER: Correct.

All right, ahead, the administration is fine-tuning its economic message, saying there won't be a recession in 2026. But how are Americans feeling about the economy? We'll have an expert weighing in on what's ahead and the impact on your money.

And we are, of course, just minutes away from the opening bell on Wall Street. We're checking the futures. And take a look. Everything's looking up this morning after a shaky week full of concerns over the possibility of an A.I. bubble that did not surface this time around. Investors are entering a shortened Thanksgiving week with their eyes turned towards December's likely rate cut from the Federal Reserve. The market closed on Thursday, as you might imagine, for the Thanksgiving holiday, and will also close early on Friday.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:28:16]

BERMAN: We are moments away from the opening bell on Wall Street. You can see U.S. futures are up a little bit, perhaps on what they see as rising chances of an interest rate cut.

The Treasury secretary, Scott Bessent, has been talking about the state of the economy.

Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SCOTT BESSENT, TREASURY SECRETARY: I am very confident about 2026 because what we are going to see is the -- the president has done peace deals, tax deals and trade deals. The one big, beautiful bill.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BERMAN: Of course, the president's approval rating on the economy has been going down and down and down. And the Treasury secretary's comments come after the long awaited jobs report offered a mixed picture on the labor market. At least last September, the economy added 119,000 jobs. But revisions showed job losses in June and August, and the unemployment rate, went up in September.

With us now is Justin Wolfers, professor of economics and public policy at the University of Michigan.

And, Professor, you have been, over the last couple days, what I call aggregated. Some comments that you've made on the state of the economy, making the rounds all over the internet. You say early stages of a worrying trend, right? And that has to do with what we saw in September. The unemployment rate actually ticking up and inflation continues to be persistent. And when you get a rising unemployment rate and persistent or rising inflation, what does that equal?

JUSTIN WOLFERS, PROFESSOR OF ECONOMICS AND PUBLIC POLICY, UNIVERSITY OF MICHIGAN: You're looking for a word. It's going to be on my -- my next Macro 101 exam, stagflation. So, "stag" is stagnation. That's when the economy slows. Sometimes when it goes backward. I was just looking at the markets. They're suggesting there's roughly a one in three chance of a recession over the next year. So, that's the "stag." The "flation" is inflation.

[09:30:01]

When inflation currently has remained stubbornly high, it's stuck at about 3 percent. The president continues to deny that prices are rising at all.