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Zelenskyy Praises U.S.-Ukraine Diplomatic Discussions; White House: DOJ Will Appeal Very Soon After Judge Dismisses Cases Against James Comey and Letitia James; White House Postpones Unveiling of Trump's Health Care Plan; This Will Be the Busiest Thanksgiving Travel Period in 15 Years. Aired 3:30-4p ET

Aired November 24, 2025 - 15:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:30:00]

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy is now four days from a deadline from President Trump to accept a peace plan to end Russia's war in Ukraine, a plan that critics say favors the Kremlin. Weekend diplomatic talks seem to reveal some signs of progress, though. Ukraine's president saying that he believes that Trump is hearing Kyiv's concerns, calling the Sunday talks substantive.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): Diplomacy has been activated, which is good, very good. We expect that the result will be the right steps. The first priority is reliable peace, guaranteed security, respect for our people, respect for everyone who gave their lives defending Ukraine from Russian aggression.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Let's discuss with geopolitics expert Ian Bremmer. He's a president and founder of Eurasia Group and GZERO Media. Ian, thank you so much for being with us.

So now that we've learned that this 28-point peace plan is a working document, do you have confidence that it is going to lead to a lasting peace in Eastern Europe?

IAN BREMMER, PRESIDENT AND FOUNDER, EURASIA GROUP: No, of course not, because it's very far from anything that the Ukrainians and Russians could together accept. There were non-starters for the Ukrainians and Europeans in the initial plan that was largely drafted by the Kremlin. And once you get the Ukrainians and the Europeans to say what would be minimally acceptable, Putin feels no reason to go there, and certainly not when he's being given some ground cover by President Trump.

So, unfortunately, the big takeaway here is you're going to continue to see a lot of fighting on the ground. And unfortunately, it looks like the Russians are going to continue to press military advantages that they have right now on the front lines. SANCHEZ: To that point, do you, by the tacit admission or at least point that supporters of this plan are trying to make, that Ukraine is at such a disadvantage right now on the battlefield that this is their best option?

BREMMER: I don't know, honestly. The fact is that Europe today is providing all the financial support. The United States is not. The taxpayers are not.

[15:35:00]

In fact, Trump will say and has said to supporters that the U.S. is making money on this war because of all of the American weapons that are being purchased by the Europeans for Ukraine. So, I mean, as long as the Americans aren't playing a role in the war, are the Ukrainians going to be able to continue to defend their front lines or are they going to lose a lot more territory? What does that look like? And what about the Russian economy?

There is more pressure on the Russian economy today, but you saw that Trump just gave the Hungarians another year before they have to stop buying oil. There has been some talk of more significant sanctions that will be implemented against the Indians and the Chinese. We'll see where that goes.

So, I guess I would say that right now, time does not appear to be on Ukraine's side, but you wouldn't say it to the degree that the Ukrainians would need to take a deal that, frankly, would delegitimize the Ukrainian leadership in the eyes of his own people. Today, Boris, a strong majority of Ukrainians want a ceasefire, but they would reject the ceasefire on the terms that had been brought to them by the United States and Russia over the last several days.

SANCHEZ: On the question of security guarantees, as it sits right now, the initial plan had some form of Ukraine relinquishing NATO membership forever, but having some form of backstop with the United States, would it be a significant move if the United States were to say that they would give Ukraine Article 5-like guarantees, but not actual NATO membership? Would that be progress for Ukraine?

BREMMER: NATO membership hasn't been in reality on the table at any point through this war. There's been a lot of commitment in principle, but you need unanimity, and there are certainly NATO members that are refusing to give it, and the United States, I think, would be one of those refusals. Now, any Article 5-type guarantee from the United States needs to be reliable, it needs to be credible over time, and I don't think that anyone in Ukraine or anyone in NATO would accept that unless it went through Congress.

So it would have to be ratified, and the devil's in the details there.

SANCHEZ: As always, Ian Bremmer, thanks so much for the expertise.

BREMMER: Sure, Boris.

SANCHEZ: Still ahead, the White House says the DOJ will be appealing a judge's decision to throw out the indictments against James Comey and Letitia James. We'll discuss in just moments.

[15:40:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

SANCHEZ: We're continuing to follow breaking news this afternoon. Just moments ago, the White House directly responded to the press secretary after a federal judge dismissed the criminal cases against former FBI Director James Comey and New York Attorney General Letitia James.

JESSICA DEAN, CNN HOST: The judge concluded that interim U.S. Attorney Lindsey Halligan, who single-handedly brought the charges against Comey and James, was unlawfully appointed without Senate confirmation. Here's White House Press Secretary Karoline Leavitt just moments ago.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAROLINE LEAVITT, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: I know there was a judge who is clearly trying to shield Letitia James and James Comey from receiving accountability. And that's why they took this unprecedented action to throw away the indictments against these two individuals. But the Department of Justice will be appealing very soon.

And it is our position that Lindsey Halligan is extremely qualified for this position, but more importantly, was legally appointed to it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN: And joining us now to discuss, Jackie Kucinich, Washington bureau chief for the Boston Globe, and Andrew Egger, White House correspondent for The Bulwark. Great to have both of you here with us. Jackie, let's start first with you, just in terms of the politics of all of this.

JACKIE KUCINICH, WASHINGTON BUREAU CHIEF, BOSTON GLOBE: Right.

What does this mean for the president? Obviously, Karoline Leavitt saying that they're going to appeal. But what does this mean politically?

KUCINICH: And blaming the judge, which is something that we've heard before from the administration. But listen, this is something the president wants. And this White House is going to exhaust every avenue in order to do this.

And he made this very clear. We saw it in that text or the DM that was public. Whether or not this helps him politically, I don't think that matters.

This is personal.

SANCHEZ: Andrew, what do you think you just heard? It's likely going to be an appeal. At some point, they may have to replace Lindsey Halligan.

They're not really sure how that's going to go.

ANDREW EGGER, WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT, THE BULWARK: Yes, well, the press secretary mentioned that it's an unprecedented moment from the judge. And that is true. I mean, we're in unprecedented waters with a lot of how they've tried to handle these U.S. attorney appointments. You know, they have 120 days to get an interim in there. At that point, the judge ruled today it's supposed to -- the decision making process moves to a lower court. The White House has tried to push past that not only here, but in a lot of different jurisdictions.

Now they're running into legal trouble there. It's interesting also that it has nothing to do with anything that Lindsey Halligan has done during the trial. You know, it's from the very moment she was appointed, the judge is saying it was it was tainted because they didn't have the authority to do this.

DEAN: They haven't even gotten into the rest of it. Andrew, I also want to ask you about other news we're following today out of the White House, which is that they postponed this expected announcement on a potential new health care policy.

[15:45:00]

What are you -- what are you hearing and seeing about why?

EGGER: Well, from everything that we can tell, this is essentially a result of the White House moving in very late in this process. I mean, you remember these health care subsidies, these Obamacare subsidies, were the primary sticking point for the entire shutdown that we just went through. There were not really any negotiations happening about them. There were little green shoots here and there.

But what the White House is doing now is kind of parachuting in with a plan that is it's not really designed to please anybody. And because it's so late in the game, the reaction they've gotten from the Hill, you know, even congressional Republicans on the Hill, a lot of the conservatives don't want to see those subsidies extended at all, are kind of mistrustful of anything that they perceive to be propping up Obamacare. Meanwhile, Democrats have, you know, their own problems with what's being proposed.

So even though it's kind of in the middle, in that way, in theory, maybe there were some good things about what they were proposing. It's just so late in the process for them to be able to kind of get a hearing. And I mean, we're already in the open enrollment period, right?

SANCHEZ: To that point, Jackie, it's been about a decade of President Trump promising that there will be a repeal and replacement of Obamacare. Concepts of a plan now coming together for this announcement that is now postponed.

KUCINICH: Welcome to Infrastructure Week.

SANCHEZ: To Andrew's point, in 30 days, the subsidies expire and the White House isn't really showing up with cards to deal on a policy that the president doesn't like.

KUCINICH: In the best case scenario, and let's not forget how short the amount of time that Congress has to figure this out and hammer this out. And if it goes past that deadline, it gets even less likely that this has come out. And for Democrats, they're thinking midterms because the Republicans have been in the one standing in the way of these subsidies and just extending them just full out.

And you're hearing that from blue state Republicans, from blue districts. They're very worried about their futures. But listen, the reason the president is even doing this is because he knows that this could be a political problem for Republicans going into the midterms.

However, it doesn't sound like the House in particular is willing to budge on what they -- what was floated out there as to what he was going to present.

DEAN: Yes. And Andrew, when it comes to kind of Trump's thinking on the midterms and what Republicans on the Hill are thinking in terms of, you know, all the House members and the senators that are going to have to run for re-election, what's going on? What is the back and forth there?

Because obviously, as we saw with Marjorie Taylor Greene, you step out against him and you're kind of pushed to the side. But they may need to do that in some of these districts. How are they thinking about all of this?

EGGER: And a big part of this is that Trump just doesn't share a lot of the kind of like ideological presuppositions that a lot of these other, you know, Republicans are bringing to the table where they might think, you know, like it doesn't matter if it's like a super winning or a super losing issue. We have these particular beliefs on health care. Trump kind of thinks he's saving them from themselves in certain ways by trying to get some sort of deal done to stop these costs from spiking.

But the other thing that we're hearing, we've seen a lot of reporting just in the last couple of days, is of a lot of just real dissatisfaction from House Republicans about the amount of communication they are getting from the White House on this and on everything. I mean, like they just increasingly feel like they are being asked to just sort of march along with whatever they hear the president is going to do on a very short timetable in public on a given day. And I think one thing that you're seeing from folks like Marjorie Taylor Greene is that there is a limited and shrinking appetite for that.

KUCINICH: But at the same time, the White House has been conditioned to believe that they can do that.

EGGER: Yes, that's true.

KUCINICH: They can just say to House Republicans, vote for this, and they get an OK on the other side.

DEAN: It's been this situation for a long, long time now.

KUCINICH: Yes, exactly.

SANCHEZ: Lastly, your reaction to the resignation of Marjorie Taylor Greene coming up in January.

KUCINICH: I mean, I think everyone was very surprised by it. And but to say the least. But it is she's not the only one who's been pushing back against this president.

And I think you are seeing maybe she's not the -- she's the most vocal, but you are seeing these cracks because they many Republicans know, particularly those in the House, that the president's not in the ballot in 20 -- in 2026. And his political juice only goes so far, particularly because his term is over after this one.

DEAN: All right, it will be interesting to see what comes next. Jackie and Andrew, our thanks to both of you. Great to have you here.

Let's take a look at some headlines that we're watching this hour. A controversial aid organization in Gaza is closing its operations in the enclave. The U.S. and Israeli backed Gaza Humanitarian Foundation began operating several aid sites in southern Gaza back in May. But the distribution effort quickly turned chaotic as desperate Palestinians rushed those enclosures in an attempt to access the limited food stored there. According to the U.N., more than 2,000 Palestinians were killed while they were seeking aid.

SANCHEZ: The woman institutionalized for stabbing her friend 19 times in the name of a fictional boogeyman called "Slender Man" is now awaiting extradition. Morgan Geyser escaped a group home in Madison, Wisconsin, Saturday night after cutting off her bracelet monitor.

[15:50:00]

Police say they found her last night sleeping at a truck stop some 150 miles away in Illinois. Police say that she and a male acquaintance traveled there by bus. Officers say that Geyser initially refused to give her name and told them it was because she had done something really bad, allegedly telling folks to Google her to find out her past.

Also, an update in the case of an 18 year old cheerleader found dead on a carnival cruise ship. Anna Kepner's grandparents tell ABC News that Kepner may have died from asphyxiation and say the FBI has been questioning her younger stepbrother. They say the teen had been sharing a stateroom on the ship with her brother and stepbrother and was found underneath a bed inside the trio's room.

Officials have not released an official cause of death in the case, though CNN has reached out to try to find out. There's also no indication that Kepner's stepbrother has been arrested or at this point charged with a crime.

So millions of Americans are headed to airports this Thanksgiving week, and many are worried about the just ended government shutdown, how it might lead to lingering headaches and flight delays.

We'll tell you what the FAA just said about that in just moments.

[15:55:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

DEAN: CNN is learning more than 90 percent of the TSA workforce has received back pay from the government shutdown. That's according to an agency spokesperson. The 43 day shutdown, the longest in our history, left federal workers without paychecks for weeks.

The remaining Transportation and Security Administration employees are expected to receive their back pay by the end of today.

The Thanksgiving holiday week travel rush is underway across the U.S., and a record number of people are expected to hit the roads and the airports. Airlines bracing for their busiest Thanksgiving travel period in 15 years.

SANCHEZ: Just moments ago, the nation's top transportation and aviation officials held a press conference assuring travelers the airports and towers have recovered from the government shutdown and will be staffed and ready for the holiday surge.

We're joined now by CNN aviation correspondent Pete Muntean. Pete, are we packing our pieces?

PETE MUNTEAN, CNN AVIATION CORRESPONDENT: I am, because this is probably my last live shot in the building until I go to D.C.A. all day tomorrow and all day on Wednesday.

SANCHEZ: And you've got a sleeping bag ready?

MUNTEAN: You know, it's going to be huge, but it's not been without snags already. And earlier today, the Federal Aviation Administration imposed a ground stop for all flights at both main airports in Dallas, DFW and Dallas Love, and that was due to air traffic control radio frequency outages.

Those issues are over now. Good thing it is not tomorrow, because Tuesday is expected to be the busiest in the skies in terms of the number of flights in the air, 52,000 flights expected to be handled by air traffic controllers in the U.S. The head of the Federal Aviation Administration just said this is the Super Bowl for air travel on the heels of a government shutdown that caused some pretty big issues. Air traffic controllers are now getting paid again, and the staffing shortages have gone down.

But Transportation Secretary Sean Duffy just said it is now on passengers to hold up their end of the deal. He's been pushing what the Trump administration calls a new golden age of air travel, and a big part of that is what Duffy calls a civility campaign. Duffy says it's important to say please and thank you to flight attendants.

That's pretty good advice. And dress well like people did boarding flights back in the 1950s. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN DUFFY, TRANSPORTATION SECRETARY: I call this just maybe dressing with some respect. You know whether it's a pair of jeans and a decent shirt, I would encourage people to maybe dress a little better, which encourages us to maybe behave a little better. Let's try not to wear slippers and pajamas as we come to the airport.

I think that's positive.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MUNTEAN: If you've been on a flight in 2025, you know that comfort is key. So I'm not going to drag anybody who dresses for max comfort. It also begs mentioning the number of unruly passengers has gone way down since their high of 2021 when fights and ugliness.

DEAN: It was a rough year.

MUNTEAN: Yes, it was a really rough year of flights and ugliness. Man, I was doing that story like every week. It felt like really one up.

It was like with regularity, doing part that mask mandates. This year, though, has not really been without issues. You see the spike there. Fifty nine hundred back in 2021.

We're now about four times lower than what we were four years ago. So things are on a positive trend. These do pop up still occasionally.

Not sure if dressing better is going to change things, but we'll see.

SANCHEZ: I mean, I wish the flights would go back to the 1950s where everybody was basically in first class because the seats were huge. Now they have people standing you're uncomfortable. Why not wear a sweatpants?

MUNTEAN: Well, you know, the whole thing

SANCHEZ: Cutoff jean shorts.

MUNTEAN: And the other thing about the 1950s is flying was so expensive and it wasn't really democratized like it is now. You know, there was no Southwest Airlines. There were no low cost carriers back then.

It was very, very expensive. And so it was kind of a upper crust kind of experience. And that's a little different.

I'm not a Crocs wearer, you may be, Boris. And that's fine.

SANCHEZ: Tank tops, cut off jeans.

DEAN: What you wear is really telling.

SANCHEZ: Every time, every time. MUNTEAN: I have the little like button on the Crocs. Like the little

door. I don't know --

SANCHEZ: Yes, I got a hot dog.

MUNTEAN: You've got your patience. A nice little CNN logo. You're going to get my folding chair out there today.

SANCHEZ: A Pete Muntean like floating man.

MUNTEAN: Silhouette. Yes, like this, yes, anytime.

SANCHEZ: Any tips for folks traveling this week?

MUNTEAN: I think the big thing is get there early. And, you know, I'm guilty of this too. And I'm the type, my fiance would get mad at me.

She loves to be there way, way early. I like to push it to the last minute. I don't really want to wait around at the airport.

I don't really need to get coffee. I'm ready to send it. So I think the big thing is to get there early.

[16:00:00]

No, the lines are going to be long, no things are going to take a while. And also it leaves you the max amount of wiggle room if there's traffic into the airport. And that's going to be a big thing too, is the traffic to the airport.

SANCHEZ: Packing patients and a sleeping bag as he heads to DCA.

MUNTEAN: That's right

DEAN: Godspeed.

MUNTEAN: My tent. Yes.

SANCHEZ: Pete Muntean thanks so much for being with us. Thank you so much for joining us. Jessica, I appreciate you.

DEAN: Thanks for having me.

SANCHEZ: "THE ARENA" with Kasie Hunt starts right now.

END