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Fire Rips Through Hong Kong High-Rise; FBI Wants to Interview Lawmakers; Rep. Gregory Meeks (D-NY) is Interviewed about Witkoff Transcripts; Nicole Lapin is Interviewed about a Holiday Budget. Aired 8:30-9a ET

Aired November 26, 2025 - 08:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

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[08:30:56]

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, we do have breaking news out of Hong Kong. Look at that. That is a giant high rise apartment complex on fire from top to bottom. At least 13 people are now confirmed dead. We just learned that seven of the eight buildings are still on fire. They're saying at least 15 people are hurt. One of those killed was a firefighter. There may be many, many people still trapped inside as this is still very much an ongoing fluid situation.

Our Ivan Watson is on the ground there.

Ivan, give us the latest.

IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: All right, John, this deadly fire is the worst that I've seen in Hong Kong in the ten years that I've lived here. As you can see over my shoulder, seven of the eight towers in this public housing development, which is home to more than 4,000 people, are still very much on fire with the flames raging out of control. I can see from this side of the housing estate it looks like two hoses trying to blast the towers at lower floors. But there is no sign of any end in sight to this fire, which has already claimed at least 13 lives. Among those killed is a veteran fireman named Ho Yi Ho (ph), 37 years old, who has been in the fire department for some nine years already.

One of the worrying things here is, as I mentioned, more than 4,000 people live in these towers. And many of them are elderly.

The fire first broke out before 3:00 p.m. local time, that's around seven hours ago. When the fire crews arrived on the scene, they said that it had already spread to the bamboo scaffolding that was sheathing these towers and the construction netting that was also wrapped around them.

And Dan, who's filming right there, might be able to zoom in to show some of that bamboo scaffolding, which is very common practice here in Hong Kong for constructing these towers that are ubiquitous in this densely populated city. I just heard just a boom of some kind just now. And we can see debris

still raining off of this building. I'm not sure whether or not the scaffolding could have contributed or the netting to the spread of this fire, which has engulfed seven of the eight towers here. And in addition to killing at least 13 people, including one fireman, has injured dozens.

One of the real concerns is, could there be more people missing? Is it possible that people could not have evacuated in time, particularly the elderly or children, as this fire rapidly spread out of control?

There are scores and scores of fire trucks on the scene here. There's a community center on the other side of this development which presumably is sheltering some of the residents who made it out. And that's been cordoned off by police. The authorities have expressed their condolences to the firemen who died already.

But this is, again, I'll say as a -- as a decade long resident of the city, the worst and deadliest fire that I have seen in my time here in Hong Kong.

John.

BERMAN: And what's remarkable, when you look at these images, Ivan, and again, seven of the eight buildings in this complex said to be on fire right now, the blaze from top to bottom, they are just completely engulfed in flames. I don't know how you would even go about trying to battle these blazes right now. Is there a sense, can you tell, if it's contained to a certain area, or is there concern that it could still spread?

WATSON: Well, look, I'm across the street from the -- from the fire. Certainly in the towers that are burning right now, there is no sign whatsoever that they're under -- that the flames are under control.

[08:35:05]

I mean -- and sure there's fire hoses blazing -- blasting water. Three of them that I can see from this side. But they're not reaching, I don't think, by my estimates from here, more than ten stories up. And these buildings might be 20, 30 stories tall, which is standard in this city.

So, there is no end to this flame in sight. Perhaps the only saving grace here is we're on the waterfront here. So, the -- it is unlikely that this will extend beyond this public housing development.

But a major emergency and crisis for this city right now.

John.

BERMAN: Ivan, as I said, it just looks like there is very little end in sight for this blaze. It could go all night long. Please keep us posted as to the developments and if they have a sense if there are people trapped inside.

Thank you, Ivan.

Sara.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: It's truly awful seeing those images.

All right, Washington, D.C. Mayor Muriel Bowser announcing she will not run for a fourth term. Bowser has served as mayor of the nation's capital for the past ten years. The Democrat has been walking a fine line in dealing with the Trump administration after the president sought to exert control over D.C.'s Metropolitan Police Department with the federal takeover. She faced heavy criticism from some of her constituents for cooperating with President Trump. Bowser said she decided to step down at the end of her term for her family, and said it was, quote, "time to pass the baton."

All right, the South Carolina Supreme Court has scheduled oral arguments now to hear Alex Murdaugh's appeal of his double murder convictions for killing his wife and his son. That will happen February 11th, nearly three years after the disgraced former attorney was found guilty of murdering his wife Maggie and young son Paul in 2021. He was sentenced to two life sentences. His attorneys argue his conviction should be tossed for several reasons, alleging possible witness tampering and improper allowances from the judge.

Kate.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Breaking news overnight, there's new CNN reporting about Pentagon plans. The secretary of defense now examining ways to punish a sitting U.S. senator, Democratic Senator Mark Kelly, over the video that he appeared in urging U.S. troops to not follow illegal orders. A source now tells CNN that the defense secretary is weighing possibly taking real action against Senator Kelly. It could be anything from reducing his rank and cutting his pension, to even possibly prosecuting him under military law, as he is a retired Navy officer.

This is happening while the FBI is also taking the highly unusual step of seeking to interview the six Democrats in -- that appeared in that video. You see their names right there.

Joining us right now for some perspective on all of this is CNN's senior law enforcement analyst and former deputy director of the FBI, Andrew McCabe.

Andy, thanks for being here.

First and foremost on the FBI interviews, how unusual is this?

ANDREW MCCABE, CNN SENIOR LAW ENFORCEMENT ANALYST: Kate, it's very unusual. And it appears to be directly contradictory to one of the FBI's most basic policies, which is that you didn't -- you never initiate an investigation or any investigative activity based solely on the expression of First Amendment protected speech. And that is clearly what we have here. This is, you know, a group of political people, a senator and five congressmen, talking about politics and encouraging other people to obey the law. You may not agree with their sentiment, you may think they should have minded their own business or what have you, but that is nothing other than First Amendment protected speech.

I should also add that it's likely also covered by Congress' speech and debate clause, which of course protects members of Congress for any sort of repercussions, certainly criminal prosecution or investigation, for things that they say and do in the course of their legislative duties. So, really no business for the FBI to get involved in here whatsoever.

BOLDUAN: With that in mind, I mean, do you think -- do the members of Congress, can or should they fight against this or will they have to submit for interviews?

MCCABE: They absolutely don't have to submit to an interview. They may choose to do so. And, you know, obviously, I would suggest that they talk to their own counsel about that. But this is simply a request to sit down and provide information. And they can -- they are -- they are well within their rights to decline that request. We don't have any indication that there's a subpoena or some sort of legal process that would compel them to sit down and provide testimony. That's a much bigger step forward.

But I would add, though, that in the current climate, what this administration has done in several of these vindictive sort of retribution flavored investigations is go after people for things they said to -- during testimony or interviews.

[08:40:01]

The case against Jim Comey is a perfect example. So, if you're a member of Congress and you're thinking about sitting down with the FBI to explain why they're wrong about looking into this, you have to be really careful. Because if you say something that can then later be characterized as a -- as a misstatement or an intentional misstatement, you could be charged with lying to a federal official. So, it's really very shaky ground here and they should be very careful about going forward.

BOLDUAN: Just give me your gut on this one, because the take from some Republicans, who are defending the president's anger and even how far the president went talking about -- when talking about sedition, and which is punishable by -- punishable by death. He even sent out on social media at one point, that the support from Republicans in defending the president in these actions is well summed up by Congressman Byron Donalds, who told reporters this, that "they created a political stunt," meaning the Democratic members of Congress, and "they created a political stunt to get a response. And they didn't like the response." If that is -- if this is just a political stunt, as Byron Donalds suggests, do you think this really goes anywhere?

MCCABE: No -- it shouldn't. It absolutely should not. This is a political matter, right? These are -- these are Democrats expressing their concern about the administration's policies, likely involving the alleged drug boats and things like that. We're not really sure. They weren't that specific. The proper response here is for Republicans to get out into that

political conversation and release their own video, which I know they did yesterday. That's absolutely -- that's how this thing should resolve. Let people decide which perspective they support.

But for the president to start calling for, you know, and I would add, mistaking one statute for another, saying it's a seditious conspiracy and therefore they should be put to death, that is absolutely not available under the seditious conspiracy statute.

But nevertheless, that is taking things to a new level. And I would add a dangerous level. We know that there are some unbalanced people, you know, not many, but enough who listen very closely to what the president says. People have taken action, violent action, attempted to do so based on his comments before. And you can never rule that out from happening in the future. So, bad idea by the president to weigh in on this thing, I think, at all.

BOLDUAN: Yes. I mean, the political climate and political violence you don't need to look far to see how horrible it has gotten in recent weeks.

MCCABE: That's right.

BOLDUAN: So, Andy, it's good to see you. Thank you so much.

John.

BERMAN: All right, major fallout this morning from this remarkable report in "Bloomberg" on the U.S. special envoy to Ukraine seeming to coach a senior Russian official. A transcript of an October 14th phone call between Steve Witkoff and a top aide to Putin, Yuri Ushakov, shows Witkoff essentially instructing Ushakov on how Vladimir Putin should talk to President Trump.

This is a portion of the transcript. Steve Witkoff said, "just reiterate that you congratulate the president on this achievement" -- he's talking about the Gaza ceasefire deal -- "that you supported it, that you respect that he is a man of peace and you're just, you're really glad to have seen it happen." Ushakov, "I agree with you that he will congratulate. He will say that Mr. Trump is a real peace man and so and so."

With us now is Democratic Congressman Gregory Meeks of New York. He's the ranking member on the House Foreign Affairs Committee.

By now, Congressman, I'm sure you've seen this transcript. What questions do you have about it?

REP. GREGORY MEEKS (D-NY): Well, look, this seems to be more of the usual. Number one, it seems Witkoff, and as well as the president, are in bed with the Russians. Everything that you see. You know, it is not your -- you know, believe your eyes, here and what you read as far as this transcript is concerned, that there is nothing that they are doing to stop Russia and its incursion into Ukraine. And now they're trying, though this 28-point plan. Clearly it's a plan that Russia gave to Witkoff or someone of that nature who then tried to impose that on the Ukrainian people.

There is -- you know, we got a same president. Remember the first time that he was president. You know, he took Russian intelligence over the United States intelligence. And now there are -- actually, when you think about this whole negotiation, where are the diplomats? Theres no one, no diplomats that are negotiating anything. Why? Because they basically shut down the State Department, got rid of all the experts that know how to deal with negotiations, that also know how to hold Russia accountable, because there's no accountability right now that is going toward Russia. And still, just last night, Russia is bombing Ukraine, not stopping at all, even while these talks are going on.

[08:45:04]

And then we threaten Ukraine about not sharing intelligence with them. The whole thing rings like something terrible is going on. And then finally, you know, when you think about what the Trump administration is doing, he's trying to make the United States Congress to be like the dumas, a do nothing legislative body. That's not who we are.

And then he goes after, as the other story talked about, members of Congress for saying that you should abide by the Constitution. There are warning lights signing right now against what is taking place with Mr. Witkoff and just about everybody else that is doing these negotiations.

BERMAN: I want to back up just a little bit. You were talking about no diplomats. Secretary of State Marco Rubio was just in Geneva speaking with Ukrainian officials there, and then negotiations have moved on to Abu Dhabi and whatnot.

But on Witkoff specifically, President Trump says he's headed to Russia to speak directly now with Vladimir Putin. How much faith do you have given the nature of this conversation, the transcript that we've now seen? How much faith do you have in Steve Witkoff --

MEEKS: Let me just --

BERMAN: To negotiate for U.S. interests?

MEEKS: How do I have any faith? You know, I know Marco Rubio has several jobs, but I'm talking about there's deputy secretaries, et cetera, generally the way diplomacy works. So, I'm talking about diplomacy in action. But how can you have any faith? Because we've heard this before time and time again. Secretary Rubio just said a few days ago that when you heard the 28-point plan that this was the great accomplishments, that we were moving closer.

And now when the rubber hits the road, when you start talking about whether or not we're talking about land and protection for Ukraine, those are the difficult subject matters that are not being talked about. And I would hope that, you know, the conversations continue between the Trump administration and Ukrainians because there should be no agreement without our European allies and Ukraine. And so, Witkoff, what you've just seen, but I think that if you could get transcripts of others talking to Russians, talking to the Putin administration, you'll see that there have been some similar conversations, as well as -- I mean it's common knowledge that if you butter up Trump, generally you get what you want.

BERMAN: I will say --

MEEKS: I mean everybody -- you hear him, Ukraine, he said Ukraine don't thank him enough.

BERMAN: So, Steve Witkoff and Jared Kushner were largely, you know, led the team that was able to hammer out an agreement between Hamas and Israel, ultimately, over Gaza. Why don't you think they could do a similar -- have similar success when it comes to Ukraine?

MEEKS: Well, what was the key in Gaza was the Saudi Arabians and some of the Gulf countries that were also a part of it. And in that regard, you know, the Trump family did get richer also. But I think that, in this situation, all you got to do is look at what has taken place with Russia from the very beginning of the Trump presidency. Tell me when Russia has ever been held accountable for any of its actions. There has been no accountability at all. Just coming to the United States, Russia gets a red carpet, Zelenskyy gets treated very badly in the White House.

So, I'm only going by, you know, and you're hearing frustration from me right now because I'm looking at death continuing of the Ukrainian people. Every day you're reporting another bomb, another -- other deaths of Ukrainians living -- trying to live their lives and what's taking place here. So, it's just frustrating over the entire period of time.

BERMAN: A new attack -- a new attack on Zaporizhzhia overnight.

Congressman Gregory Meeks, ranking member of the House Foreign Affairs Committee, thanks for being with us.

Sara.

SIDNER: All right, a terrifying sight after record rainfall. A massive snake seen slithering around in flood waters. More on this video ahead.

And 30 going on 17. Why researchers say your brain may be younger than your actual age.

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[08:53:43]

BOLDUAN: All right, it is officially holiday shopping season. Yes, black Friday is, well, Friday. But this year millions of shoppers are dealing with a lot going on. Higher prices from tariffs and inflation and just a -- they don't feel good about the economy as they need -- now need to check off a lot of gifts on their lists.

Let's bring in Harry Enten. He's running the numbers on us -- on us and on this. HARRY ENTEN, Yes, two.

BOLDUAN: Two people. Harry, you're so smart.

ENTEN: Awe.

BOLDUAN: How many people are -- what are the numbers on how many people are expected to really get their holiday shopping started?

ENTEN: Record, record numbers, Kate Bolduan. I mean I -- personally, I think this is all insane. Record shoppers this weekend. We're talking 187 million of you crazy, crazy people going out there either shopping in person or shopping online between Black Friday and Cyber Monday. That is one, two, three. See, Kate, I can count, million more than in 2024. She is absolutely cracking up on the side of the screen there.

BOLDUAN: Oh, you almost -- you almost wasted some coffee. I mean that would have been a problem.

ENTEN: I -- you know what, there's a Starbucks down the street.

BOLDUAN: Oh, really?

ENTEN: Yes.

BOLDUAN: We'll go back (INAUDIBLE).

ENTEN: We're in New York.

BOLDUAN: Are you done? Can I ask you the next question?

ENTEN: Please.

BOLDUAN: Great. Is there any sign of, like, of that -- what we're hearing -- what you see in polling and just the economic divide that is apparent is changing holiday spending versus last year?

ENTEN: Yes, OK.

[08:55:00]

So, you see this 187 million. That's a record number of shoppers. But there's clearly some signs of what is called this, you know, k sort of economy.

BOLDUAN: Yes.

ENTEN: This k-shaped economy. And you can see here, expected holiday shopping versus 2024 by household income. You look at those making at least $100,000.

BOLDUAN: (INAUDIBLE) that.

ENTEN: The amount of money being spent, up five percent. Then you go down the next bracket, $50,000 to $100,000, it's down six percent. And then look at that, under $50,000, way down there, down at 16 percent. So that down 16 percent, the amount of money being spent of household incomes, $50,000 -- less than $50,000, compared to up five percent among those making at least $100,000, I think that is the perfect sort of illustration of this k-shaped economy, whereby folks who are doing pretty gosh darn good are putting out their money, but those who aren't are really going to hold back this year versus last year.

BOLDUAN: And people feel it all the time. It's not just during the holiday season.

ENTEN: Yes.

BOLDUAN: But this is when it like -- it gets particularly painful when you have to also say that you can't do what you want to do, which is bring love and joy and bring -- and give people holiday gifts.

ENTEN: Exactly right.

BOLDUAN: That is a lot of pain. That really is. What -- and -- which also raises concerns about people going into debt to try to continue doing this. What are you seeing on that?

ENTEN: Yes. OK. So, you know, we talk about credit card balances that, you know, 90 plus days late. I mean, look at this, it's the highest since the Great Recession. We're talking about balances.

BOLDUAN: Oh, wow.

ENTEN: And 12.4 percent of balances are at least 90 percent -- 90 days late, excuse me. That is way up from where we were three years ago at this point when it was 7.6 percent of balances that were 90 plus days late. So, clearly, people are taking on more debt and the debts are climbing higher on their credit cards.

My piece of advice is, you know, look, Christmas time, very, very important, but that doesn't mean you should necessarily go further into debt at this point.

BOLDUAN: But it also is a reminder, going into Thanksgiving, there's a lot of things to be thankful for, but there is a lot of stress that people are facing right now.

ENTEN: There is a lot of economic stress. Again, that k-shaped economy, those who are doing well, you know, spending a lot, but those who aren't really, you know, having problems.

BOLDUAN: Feeling it for sure.

Thanks, Harry.

ENTEN: Thanks.

BOLDUAN: Sara.

SIDNER: All right, we've got some more advice for you. How you can save -- how you can save money while you are going out there trying to buy those holiday gifts. Joining me now is Nicole Lapin, financial journalist and author of

"The Money School: Twelve Simple Lessons to Master Financial Markets and Investing."

All right, what is a great rule of thumb for setting a realistic holiday budget? Because we all get into this spirit and you go, oh, no problem, I'll just do this, OK I'll get this little extra thing, and then your budget is blown.

NICOLE LAPIN, FINANCIAL JOURNALIST: Well, Sara, I would use the one percent rule. So, take one percent of your annual income and make that the ceiling, so the upper bound for the entire season. If you make $70,000, that's $700 for everything. So, for gifts, travel, food, hosting. If you make $50,000, that's $500. It gives you one clear boundary so that you're choosing intentionally instead of trying to react to every single invite or every single sale out there.

And honestly, just having a plan or having an idea of a boundary is one of the simplest antidotes to all of the stress and all of the overwhelm that we all feel this time of year.

SIDNER: I hadn't heard that before. So, 1 percent of your budget, that's sort of what you should aim for.

Now, once you've set that boundary, do you have some tips on like how to spend that money, how to divvy it out?

LAPIN: Yes, for sure. I think sometimes people flip the equation. I would start with the total and then make the list to fit into that and not the other way around. So, create a short most list for a few people or moments that truly, truly matter and then everything else can become optional.

I would also think about adding a transaction limit, not just a dollar figure. So, for example, give yourself eight purchases total. So, capping the number of swipes or purchases is one of the easiest ways to avoid that quiet build up of all the micro spending and micro swipes that really blow up even the best laid plans.

SIDNER: Yes, it's a -- it's really good. I like you got the micro swipes. You're like, these are the small things. It's not a big deal. And then it really balloons.

LAPIN: Right.

SIDNER: What are some ways that, you know, because it is an emotional time and a lot of emotional spending happens as well. How do you keep yourself from going off the rails?

LAPIN: A few things. First, I would leave items in your cart for 24 hours and then walk away. Have a little cooling off period. So, either you get a discount, like an abandoned cart discount, and a lot of brands are doubling down on those this holiday season, or you just lose the urge and you forget about it, in which case you didn't probably need it anyway. The second thing I would do is set up a separate email just for

holiday shopping. So, like, Sara's coupons or Sara's shopping at gmail.com. It keeps all of the promo codes organized and separate, but you get them when you need them so they're not bombarding you in your regular email inbox.

And last I would pair price tracking tools with credit card price protection. Extensions in your web browser, like Honey flag price drops for you, and a lot of credit cards will offer you a refund for the difference if the price does go down. It's one of the easiest ways to save without waiting or chasing deals.

[09:00:02]

SIDNER: Nicole Lapin, thank you so much for those great deals and those great ideas to keep us from losing it. Appreciate it.