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Manhunt for Brown University Shooter; Police Release Person Detained in Shooting; Rep. Seth Magaziner (D-RI) is Interviewed about the Brown University Shooting; Rob Reiner and Wife Dead in Apparent Homicide; Fifteen Killed in Australia Attack. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired December 15, 2025 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:00]

MATT EGAN, CNN SENIOR REPORTER: A lot of these bets, they didn't really make sense in the first place, at least when you looked at fundamentals. Market veteran Art Hogan, he summed it up best. He told me, "sometimes irrational exuberance meets the brick wall of logic."

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: That's one way to put it. Art always has a good -- does a good job of a turn of phrase.

EGAN: Yes.

BOLDUAN: It's good to see you, Matt. Thank you very much.

EGAN: Thank you, Kate.

BOLDUAN: Very interesting look at this now about a year in.

EGAN: Yes.

BOLDUAN: All right, a new hour of CNN NEWS CENTRAL starts now.

Breaking news out of Rhode Island. The entire community around Brown University waking up to learn the manhunt is back on. Police released the person of interest they had in custody late last night. So, is the investigation back to square one?

Also overnight, Hollywood legend Rob Reiner and his wife, Michele, found dead in their Los Angeles home. Why LAPD says they are investigating this as a homicide, but say they are not looking for a suspect at this time.

And the death toll is rising in that horrifying mass shooting at a Hanukkah celebration in Australia. Officials now say the gunman, they were a father and son.

I'm Kate Bolduan. John Berman is on the ground in Providence, Rhode Island, for us this morning. Sara is out today. This is CNN NEWS CENTRAL

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: A dizzying amount of breaking news this morning from all around the world.

Here from the campus of Brown University in Providence, Rhode Island, a renewed manhunt for the shooter who killed two students and injured nine others right behind me at the engineering building, behind that police tape there. Overnight, police announced they have to continue their search because they released a man they initially believed to be a person of interest, a person they had taken into custody early yesterday morning. They said the evidence now guiding them in a different direction.

The mayor of Providence says, at this point there's no way of knowing if the attacker is still here in Providence or has left the state. One key piece of evidence, really the only key piece of evidence that we know about, is this surveillance footage, which has been out for a day and a half now. A brief ten-second clip of the person they believe to be connected to the shooting, walking down the street, where I am right now. Authorities are also asking the public to submit any video they may have, or photos, to help with their investigation.

Want to bring in CNN chief law enforcement and intelligence analyst John Miller, who's been working his sources and this story from the beginning.

John, let's start with right now. What's happening?

JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: Well, as you framed it, Ben Erickson has been released. He was held for about 19 hours. The attorney general of Rhode Island described it this way. "Collectively, we were investigating leads. One of those leads led to a person of interest. Over 24 hours, the evidence points in a different direction." OK, how and how did they come to that determination? According to the attorney general and the chief of the Providence Police, "forensic tests were conducted. Evidence was tested. They were not matches." That suggests that when they interviewed this person of interest and he said, I haven't been there. I've been in the hotel the whole time. That that may actually be the case. They tested items found at the scene. Evidence found at the scene against evidence they collected in the search of his hotel room. Things they took pursuant to that search warrant.

Now, we don't know, John, whether that included DNA or whether that just was the ballistics from the guns, or tests on the clothing. But it drove them to the conclusion that they did not have enough to charge this individual. And probably closer to the conclusion that they had the wrong person.

BERMAN: What do they have now? Do you have any sense of where the investigation stands?

MILLER: Well, it's -- it's in the condition of a reset. You know, things slow down when you have a key person of interest because a lot of focus, a lot of investigative resources go into trying to make those connections to prove, or as we saw in this case, to disprove that person's involvement.

In this case, they're at a real deficit because, despite the number of cameras on that campus, to despite whatever number of cameras are around that building, they're missing two important things. They don't have a clear image of the person that they believe to be the gunman coming into the building. They don't have a good image of that person operating during the shooting inside the building.

[09:05:02]

And so far, the only image they have of that person leaving after the shooting they believe is that piece of video of that person clad in black, walking briskly around a corner, one hand dangling at his left side, the other hand appearing to be shoved into a pocket where he may still have a gun from that shooting as he makes his distance from the scene.

That means they're really going to have to expand this video canvas. That means they're going to have to follow the route forward and follow the route backward and see, is there a building, an ATM, a traffic camera, a Ring doorbell camera, a security camera, a bank camera that may have captured an image that is the person they're looking for that they can put out and say, this is a face, an image, a better image than we've seen.

BERMAN: They have the shell casings still --

MILLER: And in the meantime, as Andy McCabe, who was on earlier, he said, you know, there are other things they can do. They're going to be running tips from the public. They're going to be looking at who had an issue with the school. They're going to look at who might have been fired, expelled, suspended. They're going to be looking for people with motive and then examining those people against what occurred. But they're also going to be using more technology to see if they can come up with a better, different, newer, viable suspect.

BERMAN: Yes, both old school and new school methods.

John, before I let you go, how much frustration is there right now in the law enforcement community, both local and federal, behind what's happened?

MILLER: Well, there's some frustration, obviously, because it looked like they had a break in the case to them. That has changed. But there's also some friction between the federal authorities, the FBI, the Providence police and some of their partners about who's actually running this thing, who's calling the shots. They tried to keep a unified and a good face on that last night at the press conference. But you will note that the FBI that was front and center on the first night of this, present at the press conference and speaking as participants, wasn't there last night.

So, I think the attorney general's comments yesterday about who is the actual lead, it's the Providence Police, who will be calling the shot, it's going to be me, the attorney general, was a little bit of a reset, getting local control back over this case.

BERMAN: Well, obviously, everyone needs to be here on the same page. John Miller, thank you for helping us understand how we got to this

point and where we are now. Clearly, so much work still needs to be done. We'll let you get back to working your sources.

In the meantime, I'm joined by CNN's senior national security analyst, former assistant secretary at the Department of Homeland Security, Juliette Kayyem.

We just listened to John tell us where we are in this investigation.

JULIETTE KAYYEM, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: Yes.

BERMAN: What's your first reaction?

KAYYEM: It's -- I think it's kind to call it a manhunt right now in the sense that manhunt generally means you know who you're looking for. If, at least from what we know publicly, they really only have the back shot that we don't even know the identity, race or visuals of the face of the person they're looking for.

So, as John was saying, you sort of have to do a regroup. That regroup is happening in two ways. One is, take a step back and figure out whether where they're looking is the right place to look. He had to have slept somewhere. He had to get gas if he went on I-95.

The second is the regroup of what we call the sort of incident command. And you saw that last night. I had never seen a local jurisdiction essentially throw the FBI under the bus, not just saying we're in charge, but saying, look, that lead that led us to the person of interest who ended up not being the person of interest, essentially was run by the FBI. They said so explicitly.

BERMAN: Yes, I mean, at this point, it's more important to look forward and figure out how they get it right.

KAYYEM: Exactly. And -- right.

BERMAN: But you don't like to hear that in the middle of an investigation.

KAYYEM: Yes.

BERMAN: So, Juliette, we're standing on the corner.

KAYYEM: Yes.

BERMAN: Like right next to the building, which is the crime scene. Some police presence coming back and forth, but not nearly as much as we saw yesterday.

KAYYEM: Right. Yes.

BERMAN: Already speaking to students who tell me they don't feel safe. I mean, how safe should you feel in this community?

KAYYEM: Right. I mean, this is the challenge is -- and, unfortunately, the challenge of having so many mass shootings is, you can't close down a community indefinitely until you say, well, we found the guy.

BERMAN: Right.

KAYYEM: And I actually believe the mayor made the right call. You have to sort of get people starting to think about maybe, you know, living -- it's not normal, certainly yet --

BERMAN: Right.

KAYYEM: But sort of getting back to openness. The lockdown in those immediate hours was totally appropriate. But, you know, we experienced this in Boston during the marathon.

BERMAN: Yes.

KAYYEM: European cities have experienced this after terrorism. If you say everyone lock down until we find him, that's just not the right standard.

[09:10:02]

But -- and so, I know people are saying, well, if they don't have him, why are we out and about? It's just -- it's just, unfortunately, the nature of living with a certain amount of violence and risk in this country at all times.

BERMAN: All right, Juliette Kayyem glad you're here. Hopefully we'll hear more from authorities soon to figure out where exactly things stand, and then you'll help us understand the process.

KAYYEM: Thank you.

BERMAN: Appreciate it.

All right, with us now is Congressman Seth Magaziner, a Democrat from here in Rhode Island.

Congressman, first of all, good to see you. Thank you for being with us. You're smart to be inside. It's about 17 degrees out here right now.

Just give us your reaction to this latest news. Obviously, I think people had let themselves believe that there was someone in custody, that maybe the investigation was coming to an end. Obviously that's changed. What is your reaction this morning?

REP. SETH MAGAZINER (D-RI): Well, of course it's a shocking development and one that we're all still processing here in Rhode Island. You know, at the same time, the identities of the two students who unfortunately lost their lives have also been released. And we are thinking now about the families of Ella Cook and Mukhammad Umurzokov and all of the students who've been impacted by this.

I would say here in Rhode Island, you know, we're grateful for local law enforcement. The mayor, both in Providence and in surrounding communities, are maintaining a stronger than usual police presence to ensure that everyone is as safe as possible.

And while I'm not directly involved in the investigation, what I can say with confidence is that law enforcement in Rhode Island take this one personally. This is -- this is not the kind of thing that happens often here. It's never really happened here. And prior to this terrible event at Brown University, there had only been two homicides in Providence all year. And so, law enforcement in Rhode Island take their job seriously. They bring pride to their work. They know that the eyes of the world are on Rhode Island right now. And I have absolute confidence that they are going to work tirelessly until this murderer is brought to justice.

BERMAN: I don't know if you heard John Miller's reporting. We just had Juliette Kayyem also. A sense that there might be some friction or frustration between federal authorities and local law enforcement. What are your thoughts about that?

MAGAZINER: Well, the most important thing is for all law enforcement agencies, federal, state and local to continue to work together and to keep their eyes on the goal here. This is not a time for second guessing or finger pointing. This is a time for people to work together, do their jobs, and find this guy.

There will -- you know, when this is all over, there'll be plenty of time to reassess what could have been done, what could have been done better. But I will say is that I give a lot of credit to our Rhode Island elected officials in not jumping the gun. They were careful to always call this person a person of interest, not a -- not a suspect. They, you know, have been careful, I think, about the language they've used. Mayor Smiley, the governor, the attorney general. And that does stand in contrast to the president and the FBI director, who, similar to -- in the hours that followed the Charlie Kirk assassination, seemed to be very eager to break news before they're confident whether it's true or not. And so, you know, I hope that the president, the director and others will take a lesson from this and will not jump the gun in terms of public announcements before we know the facts.

That being said, I think at the rank-and-file level, the collaboration between the agencies needs to continue to be strong and people need to continue to focus on doing their job so that no one else can be hurt by this shooter.

BERMAN: Yes, the important thing is the work that they're doing, hopefully together, to find this person and bring him to justice.

You know, what's your message to the people here in Providence and at Brown, albeit the students are leaving the campus as quickly as they can now, about the safety, the current safety of the community?

MAGAZINER: Yes, I would just say to everyone that, you know, the city is doing the right thing. There's a heightened police presence. But, you know, at this point, there are no new threats that we're aware of. I just say, look out for each other. Check in on your neighbors. Take care of each other. It's the holiday season. You know, we're a small, tight-knit state, and people should just continue to look out for one another. BERMAN: No, look, it's very true. I mean every -- you can reach

everyone in Rhode Island within 25, 30 minutes. Everyone does know somebody. I'm sure you've got connections to people here on campus who have been impacted by this.

Congressman Seth Magaziner, from Rhode Island, we do appreciate your time. All the best, sir.

And, Kate, these are, you know, the latest developments here. Obviously, we're waiting to hear again from authorities, hopefully soon.

[09:15:00]

The congressman did bring up a good point. Authorities here, they've been criticized to a certain extent for not releasing more information publicly. From the very beginning here, they were being careful. One can understand perhaps now why they were being so careful based on the information that they had, and where it ultimately did not lead.

Kate.

BOLDUAN: And, John, also what he told you, that just how much this has rocked that community, there have been only two homicides in Providence all year and then this. Just remarkable.

We'll get right back to J.B. Thanks, John, for being out there in what really is a freezing cold day.

Breaking overnight, a Hollywood legend is killed. Rob Reiner and his wife found dead inside their home. Why there are so many more questions than answered -- than answers this morning here.

Plus, new details about the man who took down one of the Bondi Beach attackers. His heroic actions caught on camera. We're learning more about him. Just look at that. That's ahead.

Plus, a seriously close call midair between an American passenger jet and a U.S. military aircraft. Why it has a lot to do with Venezuela. And wait until you hear who the JetBlue pilot is blaming.

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[09:20:17]

BOLDUAN: We are following major breaking news out of Hollywood this morning. Actor, director and activist Rob Reiner and his wife, Michele, have been found dead inside their Los Angeles home.

Right now details are scarce surrounding this tragedy. Here is what we do know.

The LAPD is calling their deaths an apparent homicide. A suspect has not been named in their killing. Police said last night they also weren't looking for a suspect at that time and were seeking to get a search warrant in order to carry out a full crime scene investigation. That's basically it.

This morning, tributes are pouring in from all corners of Hollywood and beyond.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BRENT LANG, EXECUTIVE EDITOR, "VARIETY": It's a seismic shock because Rob Reiner is such an outsized presence in the entertainment community. I mean, he's almost the mayor of Hollywood he's such an affable, genial person. And you would be hard pressed to find people, maybe they didn't always agree with him politically, but who disliked him on a personal level. He was that warm and outgoing and beloved, frankly.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BOLDUAN: Jamie Lee Curtis and her husband Christopher Guest, who co- wrote "This is Spinal Tap" with Reiner, they released a statement saying this. "Christopher and I are numb and sad and shocked about the violent, tragic deaths of our dear friends Rob and Michele Singer Reiner and our only focus and care right now is for their children and the immediate families, and we will offer all support possible to help them."

CNN's Stephanie Elam is live in Los Angeles for us this morning.

They're still waking up. What are you learning?

STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, and a lot of people are still waking up in disbelief that this is the reality that we find ourselves in, Kate, the fact that Michele and Rob Reiner are gone.

Just in the last couple of minutes, the police have come and taken off the cordon -- the tape that had cordoned off the street. They've moved out. They were here in the street. So, that may lead us to believe that perhaps they have finished their search warrant.

We know that this attack, that they learned about it, of the Reiners, happened late afternoon yesterday. So, as you can see, there's lights down there now in front of their house as this investigation, the information from the investigation hopefully will start making its way toward us.

But when you talk about someone who was a leader in this industry and, you know, I said a titan of the industry, it really does apply to Rob Reiner. This is a man who came to fame because of his role in "All In the Family" in the '70s, and then went on to direct some of the most quotable movies that we still may recite to this day, like "Princess Bride," "A Few Good Men," "When Harry Met Sally." All of those movies having those one liners that people still quote.

And the love for Rob Reiner and Michele Singer Reiner in this community is massive. And it's not just Los Angeles. It's the greater Hollywood community. So, this loss is seismic. And for it to be happening in this dramatically tragic way is also just making people feel very lost right now with this news, as we're still waiting to hear answers. Answers that will tell us maybe who did it and what the motive was. But nothing to explain how they could be gone way too soon.

Kate.

BOLDUAN: Absolutely. Stephanie, thank you so much. Much more to come on that story, for sure.

We're also following the tragic breaking news out of Sydney, Australia, now the site of a deadly anti-Semitic attack, the worst terror attack in Australia's history. Fifteen people are now killed and dozens more are still in the hospital with injuries. Authorities say two gunmen carried this out, a father and son, and that they targeted the Jewish community specifically during a Hanukkah celebration on the famed Bondi Beach.

Australia's prime minister called the attack "an act of pure evil."

CNN's Will Ripley is in Sydney for us this morning.

Will, there's also new detail coming out about the victims themselves and a bystander being called a true hero.

WILL RIPLEY, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, we know the victims range in age from ten years old, the young daughter of Russian immigrants who came here for a safer, better life, and two rabbis, including one who was running towards the gunman who was firing from right over there, trying to help others get to safety when he was hit. We learned about a 27-year-old soccer player from France who was hit in the head. His roommate, who was here with him, had stepped away just for a moment to go to the store and came back and found his roommate dead. Now he's in an empty apartment tonight. These are just some of the horrible stories that are -- that are coming out, as we've also learned about an incredibly heroic act. The Muslim bystander, Ahmed al-Ahmed, who was unarmed and ran towards the gunman, the father, the older of the gunman, it was a father and son, and he actually wrestled away the rifle from the father, pointed it at him, didn't shoot, but got the father to step back before he set the gun down on a tree and threw rocks at the father, who went back and joined his son, and then he was shot and killed by police.

[09:25:15]

The son was also shot, but he is right now at Saint Francis Hospital here, being guarded by police. He's in critical condition, but is expected to recover, is expected to face charges. Police raided two houses connected to the father and son during the daylight hours today. We were actually at both of them. At one house they took out three people, two women and one man, believed to be family members. At another it was actually a rental property, an Airbnb, where everybody else -- there were multiple rooms in this house. Everybody was basically told to evacuate overnight by police, tactical police, who had everybody come out with their hands up. They were taking evidence from that house as well. They've seized those guns. They say the father was a licensed gun owner, and they're continuing their investigation. There are also a lot of stories out here of a -- of a sharp rise in

anti-Semitism here in Australia ever since the October 7th attacks of 2023. And in fact, one of the friends of the victims was actually showing me, Kate, his Instagram page where he was posting about his friend who died in this horrific attack being memorialized by these flowers behind me. He said, all of his DMs, and he showed them to me, were full of messages of hate, including one saying to "burn in hell." That's what some of the Jewish citizens are facing here as they grieve. And yet there are also members of the Muslim community who have been joining them in candlelight vigils to show their love and support.

So, despite the hate, there's also stories of love and compassion out here.

BOLDUAN: Oh, that is so horrible what that man showed you just insult on tragic injury. I mean that's just absolutely horrible and unacceptable. And also showing that Australia, as they've noted, they have a problem and they need to deal with it.

Will, thank you so much. I really appreciate it.

This morning, there is no suspect in custody after a deadly shooting at Brown University. Why police there released the one person they called a person of interest last night.

And new data this morning about how Americans are really feeling about the U.S. economy.

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