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Maduro Arrives at Courthouse; Trump Implies Other Countries Could be Next; Walz Ends Re-election Bid; Sen. Jeff Merkley (D-OR) is Interviewed about Venezuela. Aired 9-9:30a ET

Aired January 05, 2026 - 09:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[09:00:00]

SHIMON PROKUPECZ, CNN SENIOR CRIME AND JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Who survived, Arnulfo Reyes, he is here. Amy Marin, who was the school employee, a teacher as well, who was accused of leaving the door open, she is here as well. They are all ready and prepared to testify. Many of them feeling like they finally have a moment here to explain to someone about what happened here and perhaps get some accountability. So, it's going to definitely be a very emotional few weeks here.

KATE BOLDUAN, CNN ANCHOR: Absolutely, Shimon. And you see that line of people going into the courthouse just behind you as it's all going to start to get underway.

Thank you so much, Shimon, for being there.

A new hour of CNN NEWS CENTRAL starts right now.

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

SARA SIDNER, CNN ANCHOR: We begin the hour with breaking news. Just a short time ago, the former leader of Venezuela seen arriving at the federal courthouse in New York, where he is set to make his first court appearance on U.S. soil today, Nicolas Maduro was transferred by helicopter from Brooklyn, where he's been held in a detention facility there. Maduro facing drug, weapons and narco conspiracy charges. Both he and his wife were captured in a dramatic U.S. military operation in Venezuela early Saturday morning. But more than two days later, there are a lot of unanswered questions. Why did this happen now? Was it legal? And who exactly is now running Venezuela?

The president had an answer for the last one.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We're dealing with the people. We're dealing with the people that just got sworn in. And don't ask me who's in charge, because I'll give you an answer and it will be very controversial.

REPORTER: What does that mean?

TRUMP: It means we're in charge. We're going to run everything. We're going to run it, fix it. We'll

have elections at the right time. But the main thing you have to fix, it's a broken country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: The U.S. president said the U.S. is going to run everything in Venezuela for now.

But on the ground in Venezuela, Delcy Rodriguez, Maduro's vice president, is acting as president, though President Trump is threatening her with a fate that's, quote, probably worse than Maduro's if she doesn't cooperate with the U.S.

Joining me now from outside the courthouse, our CNN chief legal analyst, Laura Coates and Evan Perez.

Laura, what can we expect from this initial appearance by Maduro and his wife this morning.

LAURA COATES, CNN ANCHOR AND CHIEF LEGAL ANALYST: As you've laid out, this is extremely significant for the course of events that have unfolded since January 3rd. But the actual process of an arraignment quite -- not extraordinary. It will be a routine in terms of the allegations and the charges that he's been indicted being read to both defendants, the wife and, of course, Maduro as well. They will enter a plea. We expect it to be a not guilty plea.

But what will happen today is two things. We will know, number one, who might be defending this person. Who might defend them as defense counsel. Who will speak on their behalf? Will it be a temporary appointment by the court in some way or is their private counsel already going to be named? And what will the defense things they will say? They actually have a court appointed attorney we're hearing as well at the moment right now, which means that it's not a matter of him not being able to financially provide for one, perhaps, but the idea of the pacing of all of this.

And Evan's with me right now knowing full well, this has been years in the making. DOJ has wanted this indictment for quite some time. They got this indictment years ago. All that was left was actually having them here and in the country to have them be presented for the actual charges. We have no idea what the defense they might raise will be, or whether they'll try to get bail. It'll likely be denied. But talk to me about this process. Years in the making of getting Maduro indicted.

EVAN PEREZ, CNN SENIOR JUSTICE CORRESPONDENT: Yes. Yes, this is a case that's for more than a decade. The DEA, the Drug Enforcement Administration, the agents there have been pursuing Maduro and a number of other high-level officials in Venezuela. Just last year the former intelligence chief in Venezuela pleaded guilty to narco- terrorism charges, sort of laying the groundwork for what we are seeing in the charges today. Maduro and his -- and his wife, Cilia Flores, are both charged with narco-terrorism. They're charged -- they're charged with -- they're charged with cocaine importation conspiracy. They're all -- COATES: Conspiracy-related charges, yes.

PEREZ: They're all -- they're all part of the -- this is all part of the charges that they are facing.

And, you know, for the -- for the agents who've been doing this, you know, they believe that they have a solid case. They believe that they have evidence that shows Maduro was involved in not only aiding and abetting the narco-traffickers, but also that he was -- that he was getting money for it. He was getting paid for it. He was putting money away for himself, enriching himself.

COATES: A good point, because in the indictment, Evan, they're asking for there to be a forfeiture of assets.

[09:05:04]

PEREZ: Correct.

COATES: Which is a huge moment because that would mean anything that's a result of the crime or sort of a fruit of that would be able to be seized. We're talking about an extraordinary amount of wealth.

PEREZ: Right. A lot of money. Millions of dollars according to the U.S. government.

Now, the question is, how does this affect Maduro's ability to defend himself? He has a right to make a defense. He has a right to have the funds to make -- to make that defense. The government is not allowed to just make a -- to seize all the money and make it impossible for Maduro and his wife to defend themselves. And so, that's going to be one of the first legal fights that we're going to see inside this courtroom today.

COATES: Yes.

PEREZ: Now, one of the things --

COATES: And I can bet, by the way, this judge is going to look at the past cases. Like Noriega, for example, and suggest whether there's going to be any movement for immunity, or head of state. They don't recognize him in the United States as the true leader of Venezuela. So, the judge is likely going to defer to the executive branch, who's going to say he's not a rightful president of Venezuela. But that might factor into consideration today whether he gets to be either, a, released or have contact with his attorney.

PEREZ: Right. Exactly. And so, this is going to be something that -- we don't anticipate that this is a trial that's going to go before this -- this court -- is going to get started for at least a year. I mean this is something that is going to take a long time to work out.

COATES: Really important. Thank you so much.

Sara, a lot to unfold in the hours to come.

SIDNER: There are so many questions, but we're going to get at least a couple of shots of answers as we see this first court appearance here.

Thank you to both of you.

Watching these, again, pictures of Maduro being taken to the helicopter as he made his way there with his wife to that very courtroom.

I know you will be inside watching all of this unfold. Thank you to the both of you out there outside federal court.

Kate.

BOLDUAN: And while there will be some answers there coming from federal courthouse, President Trump has yet to clarify how he will be running and for how long he will be running Venezuela. Yet he is already leveling new threats at even more countries, namely Colombia, Greenland, Mexico.

CNN's Alayna Treene is at the White House with more on this.

The president is saying quite a lot already since the Venezuelan operation about wanting to oust other leaders or take over other countries. How serious is this?

ALAYNA TREENE, CNN WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Yes. And I think, Kate, to your point, you know, we've had a lot of reaction, of course, from leaders around the world to this U.S. capture of Maduro, as well as the strikes in Caracas Saturday morning. And it's been met with some, you know, condemnation, but also support. And I think for many of the leaders who argued and also had the U.S. view that Maduro was an illegitimate leader of Venezuela, there are some concerns that are cropping up about what kind of precedent this sets.

And some of the president's comments, as it relates to other countries like Greenland, which I should note is a Danish territory, this idea of wanting to take that over. He's also leveled threats at Columbia, saying that its president, Petro, could be next to face, you know, some retaliation from the United States for what the president has argued as, you know, trafficking cocaine into the U.S. And he's also talked about Mexico as well and wanting to crack down even harsher on the drugs being kind of stemming into the U.S. from the southern border. All of this, I think, leaving a lot of world leaders uneasy about what this could mean. And again, whether or not this sets a precedent.

But I do want to get back to a little bit, Kate, about what we're -- the clearer picture we're actually getting from the president about next steps for Venezuela and really the U.S. role in it. It's been clear that the White House really led by people like the secretary of state, Marco Rubio, Stephen Miller, one of the president's deputy chiefs, the defense secretary, Pete Hegseth, all of them are working to really establish a pliant government within Venezuela.

And right now that means trying to coerce, that's the word that Rubio used, the current, you know, interim president, Delcy Rodrguez, to kind of bow to U.S. pressure on how to move forward here. And they're kind of putting that, this administrative stability, this idea of wanting to remake the country's oil infrastructure above an immediate democratic process.

Now, the president has said he is looking at having elections in Venezuela in the coming weeks and months. But the question now is really, how are they going to run, in the president's words, Venezuela moving forward. All of this starting to get a clearer picture today as we learn more.

Kate.

BOLDUAN: Absolutely. Alayna Treene at the White House, thank you so much for that.

John.

JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: All right, with us now, CNN chief law enforcement and intelligence analyst John Miller.

And, John, we got a bit of news here from Kaitlan Collins who reports that Maduro's court appointed attorney for today's initial appearance will be David Wikstrom. That's according to someone familiar with the case. That tells us that he doesn't -- he didn't get his own guys first. He is having a court-appointed attorney today.

JOHN MILLER, CNN CHIEF LAW ENFORCEMENT AND INTELLIGENCE ANALYST: That's right. And David Wikstrom is not one of the famous, you know, New York criminal defense lawyers, but he has been in the business over 40 years.

[09:10:04]

He's very well known around the courthouse. Very well known as a -- as a -- as a guy who is a good hand at criminal defense. So, it's likely that the court chose him so that the defendant, President Maduro, would have somebody representing him through the weekend. Calls were going out, back and forth from people in Venezuela to some of the big New York lawyers about the case. As Elie Honig reported on our own air, a lot of the top lawyers are very interested in the case. So, it's not clear whether Wikstrom will stay with this client as they develop a relationship through this morning or whether they're still looking for someone else.

BERMAN: Yes. I mean, how is that even going to work? You know, how will these people -- will they get paid? Will they be paid by the government of Venezuela? I can't imagine.

MILLER: So, that's a really tough question because, according to the indictment, the defendant here, Maduro, has access to millions and millions of dollars, allegedly of ill-gotten gains through, you know, his association, allegedly, with these narcotics cartels and so on through shipping thousands of tons of cocaine to America and Europe. Now, the government typically tries to freeze all of that as, you know, fruits of the forbidden tree for forfeiture.

Then there's, will the government of Venezuela pay for his lawyer? And if so, how do they arrange to do that? And then does that lawyer become, you know, have to become a registered foreign agent? I mean there's layers and layers of complicated questions here.

But somebody referred a few minutes ago on our broadcast to the Noriega case. You know, Noriega hired the famous defense lawyer, Barry Slotnick. He represented him in Miami. Bills got paid. Defense got done. He got convicted. So, it's not -- it's rarely trodden path, but not untrodden.

BERMAN: What are you watching for today, John? And what happens over the next few days?

MILLER: So, what I'm watching for is, if Judge Hellerstein sits on this case, and not one of the magistrate who usually does the initial appearances, it will be a full-on arraignment. They're going to deal with the question of bail. I think that's a nonstarter. You've got a defendant who's got an interest in fleeing. They're going to deal with the issues that Evan was talking about. Does he have diplomatic immunity? How many times had he come in and out of the United States for the General Assembly at the U.N. or other times when he was under these charges where he was not arrested and so on? Was he illegally arrested, kidnaped out of his home? Was there the proper legal process?

At this stage, the judge is going to say, put that all into motions. I'll read those when you -- when you send them. Today he's going to have a chance to hear those charges. They'll waive the reading of the indictment, it's 25 pages, and send him back to the Metropolitan Detention Center with his wife. But the wheels are now turning.

BERMAN: Well, it looks like they'll be living in Brooklyn for some time.

John Miller, thank you so much for this. We'll keep in touch over the hours and days, I think.

MILLER: Yes.

BERMAN: Kate.

BOLDUAN: We have some breaking news coming in. We have just learned Minnesota Governor Tim Walz is not running for re-election. What we are hearing now. What he is saying about it. We're going to bring that to you after the break.

Also, we're following a developing story out of northern California. Just cannot catch a break. Another day of dangerous flood threats is facing portions of that -- of that state after a weekend of record- breaking weather.

And a daring police rescue after a boy falls into an icy lake.

We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[09:17:53]

BERMAN: Big, breaking political news out of Minnesota. Governor Tim Walz, who, of course, was the Democratic nominee for vice president in 2024, has ended his re-election bid for governor. He is not going to run for re-election. This comes as pressure has been growing around this widening welfare fraud scandal.

Now, Walz has not been accused of any wrongdoing, but it has been a growing political headache.

Let's get right to CNN chief national affairs correspondent Jeff Zeleny.

This is a wow this morning, or at least would have been if you had said it was going to happen, what, two or three months ago.

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: That's right, John. Good morning.

Even perhaps two or three weeks ago the reality is Minnesota Governor Tim Walz had been insistent on running for a third term, which would have been unprecedented in and of itself. Minnesota has not elected a governor for three consecutive terms. But it is that deepening federal probe as well as this widening scandal.

As you said, he is not implicated in this at all. This is actually somewhat old news in Minnesota. This has been going on for years and years. The prosecution started back during the Biden administration. But, over the holidays, it certainly did widen. There was a right wing influencer who posted a viral video on social media that quite literally went viral when the vice president of the United States and the FBI director leaned in on this. And it shined a brighter spotlight on really what had been some deep concerns among Minnesota Democrats, even about the wisdom of Governor Walz seeking a third term. They believe that this would hang over the entire re-election effort and perhaps even damage the Democratic Party, even though there is no suggestion that there was wrongdoing.

However, this widening scandal happened on his watch. But we are getting his reasoning in a new statement this morning that's ahead of a news conference he's scheduled to hold in just a few hours. And let's take a look at one small portion of this, if we can, John. The governor writes this. He said, "as I reflected on this moment with my family and my team over the holidays, I came to the conclusion that I can't give a political campaign my all.

[09:20:03]

Every minute I spent defending my own political interests would be a minute. I can't spend defending the people of Minnesota against the criminals who prey on our generosity and the cynics who prey on our differences."

And the governor goes on in quite a lengthy statement, which we expect him to read at that news conference, which is going to be happening at 11:00 a.m. in Saint Paul, Minnesota. He goes on to take direct aim at President Donald Trump and allies of the president and Republican allies who have sought to make political hay out of this, if you will. Of course, they have, on a lot of this, fraud is coming from some leaders of the Somali population in Minneapolis in Minnesota. Long standing members of the community.

And the fraud goes back to the Covid time of federal money that was sent to the state of Minnesota. It was simply misused to the tune of the billions. So, dozens have already been convicted. But again, the governor is taking direct aim at President Trump over this for politicizing this entire matter.

John.

BERMAN: As I said, this is a big decision. One he did not seem to want to make, at least not a few weeks ago. We will see the impact it has. And, of course, we'll be watching very closely for his public statements at 11:00 today.

Jeff Zeleny, thank you so much for delivering this news.

Sara.

SIDNER: All right, this morning, Nicolas Maduro is in a Manhattan courthouse after being captured and charged by the United States alongside his wife. Maduro's vice president, Delcy Rodriguez, has stepped into the fray as the country's acting president, but President Trump is making clear who he says is running things.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: We're dealing with the people. We're dealing with the people that just got sworn in. And -- don't ask me who's in charge because I'll give you an answer and it will be very controversial.

REPORTER: What does that mean?

TRUMP: That means, we're in charge.

We're going to run everything. We're going to run it, fix it. We'll have elections at the right time. But the main thing you have to fix, it's a broken country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: Joining us now is Democratic Senator Jeff Merkley of Oregon.

I'll ask you about Walz ending his bid in a bit. But first I want to talk to you about this.

Trump says, as you heard there, that the U.S. is going to run Venezuela. Has the president simply rendered Congress moot at this point? I mean what role should you all play in this?

SEN. JEFF MERKLEY (D-OR): Well, let's just recognize, Sara, that this is the worst form of gunboat diplomacy that proceeds to create a lot of problems for the United States in the world. There's no great prize in controlling the oil assets of Venezuela. It's heavy crude. It's very hard to refine. But what it has done is triggered an age-old feeling in South America that the United States is all about taking advantage of other countries resources, which is deeply regretted. And it proceeds to say, if that's our sphere of influence, what does that mean for China in its sphere of influence?

All these are issues that Congress should be actively involved in. And under Republican leadership, Congress has been failing its role under our Constitution. We haven't defended the power of the purse. We haven't held oversight hearings. There hasn't been a single hearing in the House and Senate over these last four months, over the diplomacy, or, I guess, you put it differently, the gunboat diplomacy but the taking out the ships in the Caribbean and the east Pacific. And now we haven't had any action by Congress to defend its constitutional role over the power of declaring war. So, all of this needs to be addressed by Congress.

SIDNER: Trump says opposition leader Maria Corina Machado, quote, "does not have the support or respect within the country." But even the U.S. determined she, as part of the Edmundo Gonzalez Urrutia administration, are the rightful winners of the last election. So, how is this about upholding democracy in Venezuela, you think?

MERKLEY: Well, it's certainly not about democracy at all. It's more about the old phrase, hey, it's a bad dictator, but it's our dictator. In other words, a dictatorship is being left in place. But what our secretary of state and the president want is a dictator who bends to our will, puts the U.S. oil companies in charge of Venezuela's oil assets. And there was really no mention by the -- by the president of any interest in democracy.

Think about the fact, a year and a half ago there was an election in Venezuela. And overwhelmingly, by some counts almost a two-thirds majority, said we want the opposition to be in power. And that sense of desire to go back to a democracy is something that Venezuela understands, because it had three decades of a robust democracy. And so, here's the opportunity for the United States to say, we're going to stand with the will of the Venezuelan people. And instead, the president is saying, we're going to stand with oil companies to seize your oil assets. A very different message. Not one that's well received anywhere around the world, and not in our interest.

SIDNER: I want to ask you something about -- that seems surprising that the president said during his press conference on the raid to extricate Nicolas Maduro.

[09:25:07]

Here's what he said about how the U.S. was able to do it so swiftly.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It was dark. The lights of Caracas were largely turned off due to a certain expertise that we have. It was dark. And it was deadly. (END VIDEO CLIP)

SIDNER: Did we just learn a state secret, that the U.S. has the capability of shutting down the entire electric grid of a country?

MERKLEY: Well, there are certainly a lot of capabilities to do that type of thing, whether it's the entire grid or a portion of the grid. It was a well-executed military campaign, no question about that.

And -- but the philosophy behind it is really the question we're dealing with. And whether it serves the interests of the United States and the people of Venezuela, or fails to serve them, and I would argue it serves neither us nor them.

SIDNER: I do want to lastly ask you about the breaking news that just came in to us about the governor of Minnesota, Tim Walz, who also ran as vice president to Kamala Harris. He says he's dropping out. This is happening after all the headlines and the issues with fraud in his state. Does this help or hurt Democrats as you all try to claw back power to govern your way nationally?

MERKLEY: Well, it certainly was old news in Minnesota that there had been such a scandal over these federal programs and that it happened under the governor's watch. And certainly that's a challenge governors have as they -- when something like this occurs and they bring law enforcement to bear to rectify it, it still leaves a lingering sense of, couldn't you have done more? And the governor has done, in many ways, an outstanding job in Minnesota, but he is under that pressure stemming from the -- as more and more news comes out about the details of that scandal.

I think that essentially we are in a moment where the president is really distracting from the fundamental concerns of Americans. He said he'd lower prices. And, in fact, prices are going up everywhere. People feel pressed to the wall. They're suffering higher utility rates, higher grocery prices, higher almost everything because of tariffs. And the president's engaged in a long term strategy of distracting by engaging in foreign affairs with this effort to conduct this regime change in Venezuela.

So, the American people are going to step back and go, well, wait a minute, what about the things you're going to do to make life better here in America. Why is it worse? Why have you spent a year making us sicker and poor rather than healthier and wealthier? That's a question that will be poised time and time again in this campaign. I think the American people are fed up with Trump and we're going to see that reflected this coming November.

SIDNER: We will certainly be watching Congress to see what they do with the American health care situation that folks find themselves in, with spiking premiums as well.

MERKLEY: Yes.

SIDNER: Senator Jeff Merkley, thank you so much.

MERKLEY: Absolutely. Thank you.

SIDNER: John.

BERMAN: All right, just minutes away from the opening bell on Wall Street. Now, the Dow, Nasdaq and S&P all up a little bit this morning. The U.S. action in Venezuela pushing gold prices higher. Oil prices this morning are slightly -- now oil prices are slightly up. Shares in the oil sector led by Chevron and ConocoPhillips. Some good news here. Regardless of the uncertainty in Venezuela, forecasters say in 2026 gas prices will be cheaper. Some of the cheapest they have seen since the pandemic.

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