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Don Lemon Pleads Not Guilty In Church Protest Case; Search For Savannah Guthrie's Missing Mom Nears 2 Weeks; A.I.-Industry CEO "Spooked" By Some A.I. Models; A.I. Insider: A.I. Will Do Most White- Collar Tasks Within 18 Months; DHS On Brink Of Shutdown As Lawmakers Leave D.C. Without A Deal. Aired 3-3:30p ET

Aired February 13, 2026 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

BORIS SANCHEZ, CNN HOST: That arrangement contradicts what astronomers typically see across the galaxy.

And we're learning that five more minutes of exercise a week can actually help you live longer. The study, published recently in the Lancet Journal, reinforces the benefits of small increases in exercise on overall health, especially for folks who are more sedentary.

A new hour of CNN NEWS CENTRAL starts right now.

Fighting back, Don Lemon pleading not guilty to federal charges over that church protest. We're going to look at the road ahead for this case.

And the FBI releasing more details about the suspect in Nancy Guthrie's disappearance. We're live on the ground in Tucson with more on where this search stands.

And on the brink of a shutdown, lawmakers on both sides have just nine hours to come to an agreement on DHS funding or face a partial government closure. But many lawmakers are already out of town.

We're following these major developing stories and many more, all coming in right here to CNN NEWS CENTRAL.

Happening right now, independent journalist Don Lemon is inside a federal courtroom in Minnesota where he just pleaded not guilty to two federal crimes. The charges stem from an anti-ICE protest at a church in Saint Paul last month. Lemon has repeatedly said that he was there as a journalist, not participating as a protester. We have reporters in the room who will give us updates as soon as this wraps up.

We're joined now by former federal prosecutor Brendan Ballou -- Brian -- Brendan, rather, thank you so much for being with us. He's being charged in part with the FACE Act charge. I -- I wonder how you see his participation in that event. He's saying that he's documenting it, that he's not impeding these folks from participating, from celebrating their faith. That's not how the government sees it.

BRENDAN BALLOU, FORMER FEDERAL PROSECUTOR: Certainly not how the government sees it. But I think the government's going to have a real tough time making this case right now. So, let's just start with the text of the statute, which requires proving that Lemon intentionally interfered with a religious proceeding with force or the threat of the use of force.

It's not at all clear that Don Lemon used force or the threat of the use of force. It's not even really clear that he interfered with a religious proceeding, as opposed to the activists that he says that he was covering. It's certainly not clear that he was doing so intentionally. That's just the statute. If you add on top of that, there are a number of constitutional problems with this act as it's being applied.

So, among other things, this law actually has never been applied to a religious proceeding before, and it's not really clear that Congress had the constitutional authority to pass that law in that context. Additionally, yod know, this is looking like a case where nominally it's about protecting religious freedom, but really it's about persecuting political speech. And so, you may actually even have a First Amendment issue here.

Now, just lastly ...

SANCHEZ: Yes.

BALLOU: ... add on top of all that, you've got a vindictive persecution claim. The idea that Don Lemon is getting prosecuted not because he committed a crime, but because he's an enemy of the President.

SANCHEZ: Well, the President has made remarks about Lemon and -- and other journalists in the past. Is that an argument that you're anticipating that the defense is going to go with as a motion to dismiss this case?

BALLOU: Absolutely, and they may not even need to go there given the other problems that you have in the case, but certainly every time that this administration brings another case against a political opponent, you know, James Comey, Tish James, John Bolton, now Don Lemon, the argument for selective or vindictive prosecution becomes more plausible, and it's more likely that a judge is going to take it seriously.

SANCHEZ: I also wonder what you think prosecutors need to demonstrate in order to prove their case. Part -- part of what they're arguing is that Lemon, who -- who we should note is a former CNN anchor, had an awareness that these activists were going to do this and he was outside of the church with them before they went in. I mean, would they need some kind of evidence that he was conspiring with them, that he gave them some kind of advice or something?

BALLOU: Yes. You know, they're probably not going to have some sort of smoking gun email where he says, I am joining you with the intention of also disrupting ...

SANCHEZ: Sure.

BALLOU: ... this religious proceeding. You know, what they're going to need to show through video evidence, through, you know, witnesses on the scene suggesting that Lemon was more than just a documentarian, but he was an active participant trying to interfere here, and again, it goes down to intent. What was he actually trying to do when he was in that church?

SANCHEZ: Notably, a lot of that video evidence actually comes from Don Lemon, who is documenting what was happening. I did want to get your thoughts on Lemon's decision to hire Joseph Thompson. He is the former federal prosecutor who resigned from the Minnesota U.S. Attorney's Office over what was described as a pressure to prosecute a case against Renee Good, or -- or at least to move that case in a direction that cast her in a negative light.

BALLOU: Yes. I mean, I find it pretty extraordinary that Thompson not only resigned from DOJ, but then immediately went to representing Lemon. I think it speaks both to the quality of Lemon's case and the weakness of the Department of Justice's.

[15:05:05]

I will say, in a world where DOJ is going to really struggle potentially here prosecuting this, they may be more inclined to just try to gum up the works. So, if, for instance, Lemon brings a selective prosecution claim, the government might try to bring a claim saying that, in fact, Thompson's a material fact witness to that, and try to get him disqualified from the case.

SANCHEZ: Overall, would you say that this creates a chilling effect for journalists in -- in the sense that they may not have grounds for a conviction, but it's not pleasant to be brought into court on stuff like this, and it's expensive?

BALLOU: Absolutely, it's very expensive. Lemon's in a position where he can pay for this. Independent journalists -- journalists at small outlets, might not be in a position to do so. So, I think there's absolutely a chilling effect, even if the case isn't strong.

SANCHEZ: Brendan Ballou, thank you so much for the analysis, appreciate it.

Now, to the desperate search for "Today" show host Savannah Guthrie's 84-year-old mother, Nancy. The FBI says they're looking for this man, a male suspect, they say is somewhere around the height of 5'9" to 5'10", with an average build. Neighbors within a two-mile radius of Guthrie's home are being asked to check their cameras for anything suspicious, dating back to January 1st, an entire month before officials say that Guthrie was taken. Let's go live on the scene in Tucson with CNN's Nick Watt, who has the latest.

Nick, what more are you learning?

NICK WATT, CNN NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, we hear from the sheriff that they have, quote, good leads. We don't know what those leads are. And listen, it is important to note that in a case like this, we in the media and the public are not privy to everything that is going on behind the scenes. Authorities, investigators release what is useful to them in furthering the -- the investigation.

Now, my colleague, Eddie Lavandera, is going to be interviewing the sheriff in about an hour from now. So, maybe we will get some more information from him.

Now, what they have put out, Boris, as you mentioned, that description, 5'9", 5'10", the FBI also putting out pictures of that backpack, that backpack bought in Walmart. They will, of course, be scouring Wal-Marts to see if one of those was sold any time recently around here.

Also, that appeal for video is really interesting, that month. So, they obviously feel that this person, that wasn't the first time he'd been in this area when he was caught on that camera outside Nancy Guthrie's house. They obviously believe he was in and around this area previously. They'd given us a couple of dates as well that they were specifically honing in on January 11th and January 31st earlier in the day, just before Nancy Guthrie was taken.

So, with all this information put out there, they -- they've been getting thousands of tips. Now, with all this information, hopefully that sort of hones it down. Maybe they'll get fewer tips, but those tips will be of better quality and perhaps lead them to this perpetrator. Listen, Boris, it is now day 13 of this search for Nancy Guthrie. And as far as we in the public and the media know, there has been no sign of life, Boris.

SANCHEZ: Yes. And Nick, we -- we have seen flowers, yellow ribbons, signs of support going up in the Tucson area and near Guthrie's home and community. What are you hearing from those neighbors?

WATT: Absolutely. Listen, Nancy Guthrie appears to have been a well- loved and longtime member of this community. Also, earlier this morning, there was a guy came up here -- a guy of about my age, who said, I watch the "Today" show every day. Savannah Guthrie, to me, feels like family. So, this really feels close.

Now, the yellow you mentioned -- the yellow ribbons, of course -- remember, we saw them first, I believe it was, you know, during the hostage crisis, the Iranian revolution in '79. The yellow is a symbol of hope. A lot of yellow ribbons, a lot of yellow flowers, hope. But, you know, as that Today Show fan told me, 13 days, it's been too long, Boris.

SANCHEZ: Nick Watt with the latest from Tucson. Thank you so much.

Listen, anyone who may know anything about Nancy Guthrie's disappearance is asked to call the Pima County Sheriff or this number at the bottom of your screen, 1-800-CALL-FBI.

Still to come, a bitterly divided Washington headed for its third government funding lapse in the past few months. Where things stand ahead of tonight's shutdown deadline for DHS. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:13:42]

SANCHEZ: Alarm over artificial intelligence is growing ever more urgent. The latest warning has a doomsday deadline that is freakishly close. The A.I. chief at Microsoft told the Financial Times, quote, "White-collar work -- most of the tasks will be fully automated by an A.I. within the next 12 to 18 months." That matches what another A.I. insider is saying.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MATT SHUMER, CEO, HYPERWRITE: Very, very recently, a new string of A.I. models came out. One in particular that I was a little, say, spooked or amazed by. That frankly can do pretty much everything I can do when it comes to engineering. And in a lot of ways, it's quite a bit better and more thoughtful than I am. And the idea is that if that's the case, and that's where we are today when it comes to engineering, it's very likely that those capabilities are going to be available for almost every other role that could be done on a computer in, say, a year or two years.

SANCHEZ: This month, a wave of outgoing A.I. researchers and executives sent serious distress signals as they exited. A former executive at Anthropic warned the world is in peril. An ex-researcher at OpenAI wrote that A.I. has, quote, "a potential for manipulating users in ways we don't have the tools to understand, let alone prevent."

With us now, tech journalist Jacob Ward, host of "The Rip Current" podcast, also author of "The Loop: How A.I. is Creating a World Without Choices and How to Fight Back."

[15:15:06]

Jacob, thanks for being with us. Do you agree with this 18-month timeline?

JACOB WARD, TECHNOLOGY JOURNALIST & HOSTS "THE RIP CURRENT" PODCAST: Well, Boris, what I think we've seen over the course of the last few years is that whether or not we can agree philosophically that A.I. is poised to replace our ability to, you know, write our wedding vows or teach our kids, companies are willing to let it do that, right?

We've seen in the most recent jobs report a weird set of numbers, and that was accompanied by all kinds of research that shows things like the Harvard Business Review suggesting that 60% of companies right now are looking to lay people off in anticipation of what A.I. is about to be able to do. They're not even firing people, Boris, because the A.I. can do it yet. They just are excited at the prospect of doing so. So, we know that the stuff is absolutely convincing the C-suite of companies that they're not going to need humans in these roles anymore. And as a result, I think this is why you're seeing everybody from the people that you've quoted there to the heads of these companies saying, you know what, I think there's going to be enormous job disruption and enormous social upheaval, which is going to be accompanied by that disruption, Boris. SANCHEZ: You believe, quote, "we are psychologically and socially

unprepared for what A.I. is about to do to us." You sort of alluded to social disruption, but I -- I wonder what you mean by psychological disruption.

WARD: Well, my book, "The Loop," I wrote about a year before ChatGPT came out. I thought I was like five years early. It turns out I was like three financial quarters early. And what, you know, I was worried about in that book and -- and I'm, if anything, more worried about is that human beings are built psychologically to outsource our thinking wherever we can. We just don't like to think it through if we don't have to. It's how we are built. It's not because we're lazy or at least not because we choose to be lazy. We're just wired this way from an evolutionary perspective. And so, the book is all about how we're not ready for something that comes along pretending to be an omnipotent system that will do all of our thinking and our writing and our math for us, because we're just too happy to let it do it, even if it doesn't do a good job at it.

If it does just enough of a simulation of our work, then the people certainly who employ us in our jobs are willing to replace us with that technology. And we, in the meantime, are going to be giving over our agency to it in the same way that we've given our sense of direction to Google Maps. That's the worry that I have. And I think we are way unprepared for what's coming here, Boris.

SANCHEZ: So, what does this mean for future generations? It seems like -- and -- and obviously I'm just going off of sort of what you're describing. It seems like those -- those -- that C-suite level, the level that owns the software, that owns what these models are employed to do, are just going to get more powerful and the rest of us are just going to have a boot on our face, as George Orwell once said.

WARD: I mean, this is the thing, right? We're hearing from people like Elon Musk that he specifically believes that everyone's going to not have to work, which is another way of saying that nobody gets to work and that a certain number of technocrats simply get to run the show. You know, Sam Altman, the -- the founder of OpenAI, a co-founder, famously said in a podcast interview that he and his friends have a bet going as to when we're going to see the first billion-dollar one person company. That is not a future that economists would say is going to distribute wealth very well. And so, for future generations, I think we're really in trouble.

I think in the short term, we're going to see things like, you know, non-college educated women are absolutely the first going to be affected here because the great jobs available to them were things like admin, bookkeeping, clerical. These are the things that this system is poised to replace. So, I think it's going to fall very heavily on a certain category of human beings. But I think eventually it could really sweep all of us up into it and that's why we're going to need to start seeing some political will and some new, I think, much subtler conversations about what this technology holds for us, Boris.

SANCHEZ: Wow, this is a fascinating conversation. I -- I wish we could continue it. Jacob Ward, I look forward to having you on again. Thanks so much.

WARD: Appreciate it, Boris. Thanks.

SANCHEZ: Of course. Let's actually go to Don Lemon speaking just moments ago. The former CNN anchor arraigned in Saint Paul. He spoke to cameras shortly after he left the courtroom. Let's listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DON LEMON, INDEPENDENT JOURNALIST: Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. I wanted to say this isn't just about me. This is about all journalists, especially in the United States. First off, I'd like to thank everyone again for their support to my colleagues, countless journalists around the world, the Lemon nation, my family and my friends. You all have showed up for me in a real way. And I am extremely grateful for that. I feel it. I feel it. I feel it.

For more than 30 years, I've been a journalist. And the power and protection of the First Amendment has been the underpinning of my work, where the First Amendment, the freedom of the press, the bedrock of our democracy.

[15:20:00]

The events before my arrest (INAUDIBLE) so that people are finally realizing what this administration is all about. The process is the punishment with them. And like all of you here in Minnesota, the great people of Minnesota, I will not be intimidated. I will not back down. I will fight these baseless charges and I will not be silenced. Thank you very much.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: That was Don Lemon, former CNN anchor outside the courtroom in Saint Paul, Minnesota, where he was just arraigned on two federal charges stemming from an incident in which he was covering a protest, a group of protesters that entered a church during Sunday service.

Lemon there saying that he will not be silenced and touting the strength of the First Amendment. He entered a plea of not guilty on both charges. Stay with CNN. We're going to take a quick break. We'll be right back.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:25:30]

SANCHEZ: The U.S. is heading toward another government shutdown, at least a partial one involving the Department of Homeland Security. Democratic lawmakers are holding up a funding bill until changes to immigration enforcement policies are implemented. The demands include targeted ICE enforcement and use of signed judicial warrants, no masks and an end to racial profiling, and better ID for ICE agents, as well as the use of body cams.

Republicans say some demands go too far and ignore concerns over officer safety. Today, President Trump appeared noncommittal on a deal with Democrats to avoid what would be the third shutdown of his second term.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: So, I -- I am here to protect law enforcement and law -- our -- our great police, and ICE, and Border Patrol and everybody. I'm here to protect them because they're protecting us. And the job they've done is incredible.

Look, I know what they want. I know what they can live with. The Democrats have gone crazy. They're radical left lunatics. That's why their cities are so unsafe.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SANCHEZ: Let's get more on the stalemate with CNN Congressional Correspondent Lauren Fox. Lauren, what's going to happen with the shutdown?

LAUREN FOX, CNN CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I mean, this could go on for a really long time because, as you know, Boris, when you enter into a shutdown like this and there's no clear sense that a deal is imminent, what it means is the off-ramp is really hard to find. And lawmakers have been negotiating with the White House. Democratic leadership has been negotiating with the White House, trying to find some kind of middle ground. But the pace at which this negotiation unfolded over the course of the last two weeks, it was just too slow. No one seemed to have the kind of inertia that you needed in order to get to a deal by today.

Obviously, lawmakers aren't in Washington. They are back home or on CODELs. They're going to have a week-long recess. Leadership on the Republican side has made clear to their members that if they get a deal or one is imminent, they'll call them back to Washington. But right now, there's no sign that that is about to take place, in part because this issue of immigration is just really hard to untangle for both sides of the aisle. They've been working on this for decades. They've never found a consensus. It felt like a window opened up after the death of Alex Pretti, but it has quickly shrunk once again.

SANCHEZ: Well, which side would you say at this point has the upper hand? It seems like both feel that they do.

FOX: Yes, I think Democrats feel very emboldened that this is a moment that they want to stick out and argue that Trump's immigration enforcement policies have just gone too far. They feel emboldened by their members. They feel emboldened by the base. They feel like Americans at large are with them on that issue.

Meanwhile, the actual reality of a shutdown is where Republicans think that they have the upper hand. Because Trump's Big Beautiful Bill infused 10s of billions of dollars into CBP and ICE and immigration enforcement around the country. The reality is that a shutdown of the Department of Homeland Security does not stop the Trump administration's practices. They have plenty of funding. They probably have funding for the next several years.

And so therefore, the impact of the shutdown is going to be felt more on FEMA, on TSA, on the Coast Guard. And that's where Republicans are arguing if Democrats want to be held responsible for that, that's on them.

SANCHEZ: What does a compromise ultimately look like? Republicans have been asking for voter ID laws and -- and to push the SAVE Act forward, is that that something Democrats are open to?

FOX: Democrats have been opposed to that bill over and over again. I don't think that that is something that they're going to be willing to accept even now, especially as I said, they feel like they have the upper hand. But ultimately, there's just no sign that a deal is imminent right now, Boris. And I think that this shutdown could go on for quite a while.

SANCHEZ: Lauren Fox, thank you so much for the update on Capitol Hill.

We're following breaking news to CNN right now, two ICE officers are on leave as federal authorities investigate whether they lied about a shooting in Minneapolis, a separate shooting, aside from that of Renee Good and Alex Pretti. We have a new report after this.

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