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Rick Perry Drops Out of Presidential Race, Endorses Gingrich; Gingrich Addresses Supporters; Official Iowa Results: Santorum Wins; Cruise Ship Captain Says He Tripped Off Ship
Aired January 19, 2012 - 11:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN ANCHOR: Live from Studio 7, I'm Suzanne Malveaux. Want to get you up to speed for this Thursday, January 19th.
We begin with two major breaking news stories right now in the Republican race for president: one candidate ending his campaign; another just got a big boost from the Iowa caucuses. Certified results were just released a couple of hours ago.
Want to start with the big story CNN broke this morning, Rick Perry dropping out of the race. Perry's expected to speak any minute now, and we're going to bring that to you live. His decision comes just two days before the South Carolina primary. This follows his poor showings in Iowa and New Hampshire.
Other big story: a reversal in the Iowa caucuses. Rick Santorum actually finished 34 votes ahead of Mitt Romney. We're going to have more on that.
But first, want to start with Rick Perry's decision to pull the plug on his campaign, what it means for the race moving forward.
Want to bring in our political team, the heavy hitters: John King, Gloria Borger, Candy Crowley; and John, let's start with you. You're moderating tonight's debate on CNN. They've got one less player. There are now four. How does this impact the debate with Perry out?
JOHN KING, CNN HOST, "JOHN KING, USA": It's a fascinating question, Suzanne. It's going to be a little bit lonely up there. We're down to four candidates. This race not that long ago had eight.
How does it impact the race? You know, governor Perry was in single digits here in South Carolina. He told me just the other day, it would take some supernatural force to get him to quit South Carolina before the primary. Obviously, though, reality settled in. He's looked at all the polls that have come out in recent days. He was getting a very small, maybe 6 percent, maybe 7 percent of the vote, in some polls even less than that. So, he made this decision.
You asked the key question, how does it impact? You know, go back to 2008. John McCain came out of New Hampshire with the win, came into South Carolina. What were the others saying? He's not conservative enough for the Republican Party. And what happened? Mike Huckabee and Fred Thompson split the very conservative vote here. Huckabee got most of it but Thompson got enough and McCain eked out a victory and went on to be the Republican nominee.
Now you have Newt Gingrich and Rick Santorum. Are they the Huckabee and Thompson of this campaign? Can Romney win with some conservative support and then the more moderate base of the Republican Party here?
That's the big challenge tonight. It will certainly make the debate more interesting.
Governor Perry stumbled in some of the debates, but recently, he seems to be going dead at Romney on the issue of taxes, on the issue of Bain Capital. So, it takes out of the debate a candidate who in the past 72 hours or so has been dead on hitting the front-runner -- Suzanne.
MALVEAUX: And John, are you rejiggering any of your questions now when you move forward and you look at what you've got tonight?
KING: Those Perry questions are going into the shredder, Suzanne. That's just, you know -- we're going to have to -- look, we want this to be about the issues. This is the candidates' debate, it's not my debate or CNN's debate.
But sure, you sort of plan your questions and your issues and follow the debate on the campaign trail and say, how do we get an interesting conversation going? And now you have to go back and look and say, there will be four gentlemen up there tonight, not five, and so you make some adjustments.
MALVEAUX: And our own Dana Bash is reporting that his supporters going to go to Newt Gingrich, and they're going to help out in Texas with the Texas delegates.
Gloria, how helpful is that to him?
GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: Well, I think it's very helpful to Newt Gingrich. It will be interesting to watch the language that Rick Perry uses this morning.
I was talking to a source in the Perry campaign who said to me that on a staff call this morning, it still was a jump ball about how exactly Perry would behave towards Gingrich. Would he give him a full- throated endorsement, as Dana Bash reports?
That's probably not going to be the case. But if you even nod in his direction, it's going to be taken by Newt Gingrich as a huge endorsement.
This source also said to me that Perry is what he called a very relational person and he has a relationship with Newt Gingrich, who wrote the introduction to his book, that he likes Newt Gingrich. So, it seems to me that everything would be headed in that direction.
Whether he actually comes out and says the words "I endorse Newt Gingrich," or whether it's a wink, I think the Gingrich campaign will interpret it as an endorsement because they'd like Rick Perry's supporters.
MALVEAUX: I want to bring in Candy Crowley out of Washington.
And Candy, you've been watching this all unfold here. How do we suppose this is going to impact Mitt Romney, who so far has been ahead of everybody?
CANDY CROWLEY, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: Listen, I think that over the course of this week, and especially today, Mitt Romney has taken a number of hits. The first was his last debate, where he did not seem as sure of foot as he has in other debates. He didn't get that great of grades from the pundits following the last debate, and Newt got boffo grades. So, then what do we see sort of after that?
We begin to see the polls closing. Perhaps they would have closed anyway, as pollsters want to do. But nonetheless, we see the gap between Gingrich and Romney narrowing.
Now comes the doubleheader today. It turns out Mitt Romney did not win the Iowa caucuses. And look, does it make a substantive difference as to what would happen in New Hampshire? No, it doesn't.
Mitt Romney would likely still have won New Hampshire, regardless of those Iowa consequences. Let's remember that Romney wasn't even playing in Iowa until the very end, or at least overtly playing.
So, you know, would it have made a difference? No, but it's a headline that takes away a little bit of that inevitability.
Gee, he's on a roll, he's won two. Well, no, not so much. He didn't win that first one. Then comes this Perry thing.
Whether he winks at Newt or says his name favorably or full-throatedly endorses him, it hardly matters, because what it does is it says to everybody, Newt's my guy, and it consolidates whatever few votes Rick Perry may have had. They could add to that gap that Gingrich is trying to close.
So, I think it really puts the pressure on Romney tonight. I don't think he can have an off debate going into South Carolina. They are going to be watching this debate very closely there. He just can't be off.
He has to be Mitt Romney at his best, sort of, you know, cool, calm, assured, however people saw him in previous debates. He needs to be back to that guy and needs to push back on some of the stuff, particularly Bain Capital and, by the way, his tax rate.
MALVEAUX: Sure. Candy, why do you think it was Rick Perry, once considered the darling of the party, begging him to get involved? He skipped debates, then New Hampshire and polls showed him at seven percent or so in South Carolina. He really was supposed to gain traction and momentum, putting all of his resources in South Carolina.
What did he do wrong? Where did it go wrong? CROWLEY: I can do that in a single word, debates. Even Rick Perry would tell you that.
Remember, he did so poorly in the first couple, he came out and said, I don't know, there's too many debates. I don't think I'll do debates anymore, which he really couldn't get away with, so of course, he did every debate after that.
But where they were so fundamental in shaping Rick Perry is not ready for prime time. And when you saw the Evangelicals meeting in Texas, the home state, although not all of them are from there, but the home state of Rick Perry, a lot of those Evangelicals are totally with Rick Perry, born-again Christian.
And what did they say when they came out? Rick Perry is with us on all the issues, but we just don't think he can win. That was essentially the message out of there. And I think that all goes back to those bad debates he had.
MALVEAUX: I want to bring a new picture in here and bring back our John King as well, because they are now removing the fifth podium that was there for Rick Perry in the debate tonight.
John, you're watching. We see that they're even -- oh, you've now got four, four of these candidates who will be taking on each other.
I want to talk a little bit about, John, if you're with us, what happened in Iowa, the Iowa caucuses and this stunning reversal that took place here with Rick Santorum now declared the winner, as opposed to Mitt Romney.
Do we think that that really gives him more momentum tonight going into this debate?
KING: Well, it certainly doesn't hurt. Candy makes the fundamentally most critical point, which is would it have impacted the New Hampshire results any, if on Iowa night we were saying Mitt Romney came in second by, you know, 10, 15 are 20 votes, as opposed to what we were saying at 3:00 in the morning, took the loaded call, remember, that he won by eight votes? I don't think.
Santorum might have had a little more momentum. New Hampshire is not his state. Does it help him tonight come into this state? Does it help with the Evangelical voters that perhaps were supporting Rick Perry, who are undecided? Sure, it helps a little bit.
Winning helps in politics. The interesting question is, it might matter more on Sunday morning, depending on what happens here, more than it matters today, in the sense that if somebody other than Mitt Romney wins South Carolina, if it's Rick Santorum, then he has two victories.
If it's Newt Gingrich, we wake up Sunday morning and we have Santorum in Iowa, Romney in New Hampshire, Gingrich, or let's say Ron Paul in South Carolina. Then it's to Florida with a giant question mark, a giant question mark and a wide-open race. If Romney wins two in a row, New Hampshire, South Carolina, after coming in, essentially a tie, but now second place in New Hampshire, then we're still back to the idea he has the money, he has the organization, how can you stop him?
But, Suzanne, you now have Rick Santorum, who can use that Iowa victory as some leverage, some leverage. We'll se how much leverage, in the fundamental question in this race.
Gingrich and Santorum are making the case, each saying I am the better conservative alternative to Mitt Romney. The question in this race is, will Republican voters pick one? Will they decide we need to pick one guy to challenge Mitt Romney, or will we get a mixed message out of South Carolina, like we did in 2008, that allows Romney to rack up another victory? And if he does, you can't say it's his, but he's on a pretty good path -- Suzanne.
MALVEAUX: Gloria, I want to bring you in as well. Talk a little bit about Mitt Romney and what he needs to do now that we realize that the Iowa caucuses really wasn't a win for him.
BORGER: Well, I think what Mitt Romney has going for him is this question of electability. If you look at all of our CNN polls and the polls of other news organizations, Mitt Romney beats the other candidates on the question of who is best able to beat Barack Obama. And in talking to voters in this state and in other early states, it's very clear that what goes on before you cast your vote in a primary is that sort of gut check moment.
Does it matter to me so much that this candidate agrees with me on everything or shares my values? Or does matter to me more that this is a candidate who can beat Barack Obama? That's why the debates have been important to Mitt Romney, because people have seen him as presidential, if you will, somebody who could go toe to toe, also for Newt Gingrich, because Newt Gingrich has performed very well in these debates.
I would argue they're the single thing that has catapulted his candidacy up to the top tier. And that's what destroyed Rick Perry.
So, these debates have, in effect, become the first primary. And I talked to somebody in the Perry campaign who said to me today, the very moment that Rick Perry said "Oops" in that debate, his campaign was over. So, this evening, I think you're going to see a competition between Newt Gingrich and Mitt Romney about who can cross the presidential threshold.
MALVEAUX: Candy, I want to bring you back in, talk a little bit about Mitt Romney here. There's been a lot of criticism lately, the 15 percent tax rate. You had, of course, the super PACs going after him, Bain Capital.
Is any of this really sticking? Has he become the Teflon candidate here? Has he been damaged in any way going into this debate?
CROWLEY: Any time you're talking about a candidate in a negative way when the race is this close and this undecided, as it now appears, it hurts, of course. I think the question tonight is, does he have like a full-on answer for that? Can he explain?
Look, 15 percent, you know, I paid taxes on a lot of this once. This is how, you know -- this is the capital gains tax. This is how we get people to invest. And by the way, the average tax that a middle class person pays is not, you know, whatever, 20-something percent. It really comes down to 10 percent.
Whatever his rationale is, he needs to have it ready for tonight, because that's not going to go away, because what has always been kind of the chink in this armor, it's been, you know what? Mitt Romney doesn't understand real voters. He doesn't understand real people.
He lives in la-la land. He thinks $300,000 in speeches isn't that much money that he earned. You know, that kind of thing is what hurts him.
So, yes, I think that insofar as it is fed into that he's kind of up here but he doesn't know how it is to live as a real voter, I think that always hurts him. And that's the kind of thing where, if he has a response, and he does, you know, that he needs to kind of make it succinctly and put it out there in a strong way. Otherwise, it chips away at him.
MALVEAUX: John, describe the mood for us, if you will. I know you're preparing for this big debate right before the South Carolina primary. I remember moderating the one on the Democratic side and that epic battle between Hillary Clinton, Barack Obama and John Edwards.
Is there a tension? Is there excitement? What's going on?
KING: Well, I think among the candidates, there's a great deal of tension and they understand the decisive moment. If you're Newt Gingrich, Rick Santorum or Ron Paul, you understand if Romney, has a strong debate and can turn that into a victory in South Carolina, he becomes very, very, very hard to stop, and they all know that.
They all understand the history of this state. They all understand the depth of the Romney organization, whether it's people on the ground or whether it's fund-raising. So, they understand the stakes tonight.
This is a state -- we always talk about the pride, the people of Iowa, new Hampshire. We should include South Carolina, taking their early role in the process. South Carolina likes to say Iowa and New Hampshire, whittled the field.
Here's Governor Perry, I think, stepping up.
(BEGIN LIVE SPEECH)
GOV. RICK PERRY (R-TX), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Thank you all for coming out, and particularly to my incredible staff that's here.
I just want to say thanks to each of you for the work that you've done, and Mario (ph) and Rick and Victoria (ph), you all are awesome.
Nelson, thank you.
And it's just been a real privilege to be able to learn and to grow under your work.
And as I've stated numerous times during the campaign, this campaign's never been about the candidates. You know, I ran for president because I love America. I love our people. I love our freedom. And as a matter of fact, this mission is greater than any one man.
As I have traveled across this great country, starting here in Charleston, going to New Hampshire and to Iowa, California, down into Florida, numerous states in between, obviously, and I discovered this tremendous purpose and resiliency of our people.
They never lost hope, despite the circumstances that we find ourselves in. They hadn't stopped believing in the promise of America. They haven't stopped believing in the American dream.
Americans are down, but we can never be counted out. We're too great a people for that.
What's broken in America is not our people, it's our politics. And what we need in Washington is a place that is humbler, with a federal government that is smaller, so that our people can live freer.
I entered this campaign offering a unique perspective, a governor who had led a large state, leading the nation in job creation; an executive leader who had implemented conservative principles, a son of tenant farmers who was born with little more than a good name, but who has experienced the great opportunity and freedom of this country.
But I've never believed that the cause of conservatism is embodied by one individual. Our party and the conservative philosophy transcends any one individual. It's a movement full of ideas that are greater than any one of us and will live long past any of us in our lives.
As a former Air Force pilot, I don't get confused. I know we can't lose track of the ultimate objective in carrying out our mission. And that objective is not only to defeat President Obama, but to replace him with a conservative leader who will bring about real change.
And our country's hurting. Make no mistake about that. Thirteen million people out of work; 50 million of our citizens on food stamps; $15 trillion national debt and growing. We need bold, conservative leadership that will take on the entrenched interests and give the American people their country back.
I've always believed the mission is greater than the man. As I have contemplated the future of this campaign, I have come to the conclusion that there is no viable path forward for me in this 2012 campaign.
Therefore, today I am suspending my campaign and endorsing Newt Gingrich for president of the United States. I believe Newt is a conservative visionary who can transform our country. We've had our differences, which campaigns will inevitably have, and Newt is not perfect, but who among us is? The fact is, there is forgiveness for those who seek God, and I believe in the power of redemption, for it is a central tenet of my Christian faith.
I have no question that Newt Gingrich has the heart of a conservative reformer, the ability to rally and captivate the conservative movement, the courage to tell those Washington interests to take a hike, if that's what's in the best interest of our country.
As a Texan, I've never shied away from a fight, particularly when I considered the cause to be righteous. But as someone who's always admired a great, if not the greatest, Texas governor, Sam Houston, I know when it's time to make a strategic retreat.
So, I will leave the trail, return home to Texas, wind down my 2012 campaign, and I will do so with pride, knowing I gave fully of myself, of a cause worthy of this country. As I head home, I do so with the love of my life by my side, a woman who makes every day good when she is there by me, and that's my wife, Anita.
I love you. Honey, thank you for all you've done.
She has been an incredible patriot during this process.
I also want to thank my son, Griffin, and his beautiful wife, Meredith; Sydney, who is not with us here today. But the fact is, with a good wife, with three loving children, and a loving God who is in my life, things are going to be good no matter what I do.
I'm proud of the policies we put forward to the American people, and I believe that we provided the right path forward for our party and our nation: overhaul Washington, providing, I think, the roadmap for that; proclaiming the 10th Amendment and all the goodness of allowing the states to be more competitive and the local governments; creating energy and energy security, energy jobs and energy security; cutting and spending, eliminating these unnecessary federal agencies; cutting taxes to that flat and simple 20 percent.
And I'll continue to fight for these conservative reforms because the future of our country is at stake, and the road we're traveling today, President Obama's road, is a very dangerous one.
I want to thank some wonderful individuals who I've come to know and admire and who have stood by my side in this state.
Katon Dawson, thank you, brother, for all the work that you've done and just being the loyal supporter that you've been.
A strong and a good man in the United States Congress, Mick Mulvaney. Ambassador Wilkins.
I talked to all of them this morning, and I just want to thank my supporters, the men and women who have come across the country to be here in South Carolina, that were in New Hampshire and Iowa. God bless you for loving your country. You know, for volunteering and being here and making a difference.
In particular, I want to say thanks to Governor Bobby Jindal, who has just been a fabulous spokesperson; Steve Forbes, who I -- as I know him more, I admire him greatly. What a fabulous, patriotic American.
And Governor Sam Brownback, Senator Jim Inhofe, Congresswoman Candace Miller, Congressman Sam Graves, all just great Americans who we have come to have such great respect for and reflect their love of country.
And I want to say a really special thanks to three distinguished veterans who have joined me on the trail -- Medal of Honor recipient Mike Thornton (ph). Mike spent the last two days with us as we traveled across South Carolina. Navy Cross recipient Marcus Latrell (ph).
Thank you, brother. I appreciate you and Mel (ph) coming and being with us today.
And my Christian brother who is up in Greenville and has traveled so many miles with me, young Marine Captain Dan Moran (ph).
They truly represent what is best about America, who give so much of themselves. And they have been uplifting for me as a citizen, as the commander-in-chief of our Texas forces. And again, they are truly my heroes.
You know, I began this race with a sense of calling. I felt led into the arena to fight for the future of this country. And I feel no different today than I did then, knowing a calling never guarantees a particular outcome, but the journey that tests one's faith and one's character.
So, now the journey leads me back to Texas, neither discouraged nor disenchanted, but instead, rewarded highly by the experience and resolute to remain in the arena and in the service of my country.
Our country needs bold leadership and real transformation. Our country deserves that.
We must rise to the occasion and elect a conservative champion to put our nation back on the right track. And this I know -- I'm not done fighting for the cause of conservatism. As a matter of fact, I have just begun to fight.
God bless you. God bless this great country of America.
Thank you for coming out and being with us today.
(APPLAUSE)
MALVEAUX: Rick Perry dropping out of the race, saying the problem is not the people, but politics. With his family by his side, making that announcement. Also making that critical endorsement of Newt Gingrich.
Want to bring our Dana Bash with us. She's on her way to Mt. Pleasant, South Carolina.
You were covering the Rick Santorum event, but Dana, you brought some very important, breaking news earlier today about that endorsement, how important that endorsement was.
How did he come about making that decision? Give us a little of the backstory.
DANA BASH, CNN SR. CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, my understanding's from one source that spoke to actually both of these candidates, said that it was, as you can imagine, the process of some pretty intense negotiation and back-and-forth. A lot of our colleagues were reporting earlier that, as you can imagine, Rick Santorum was calling pretty quickly after he heard that Rick Perry was going to drop out to try to get the endorsement, but obviously that didn't happen.
Now, what kind of an impact will this be, Suzanne? Look, the bottom line is Rick Perry was dropping out for a reason.
He is in single digits here in South Carolina. So, it's unclear how much he's going to actually mean to Newt Gingrich when it comes to actual votes, but he's definitely going to give Newt Gingrich something that he desperately needed (INAUDIBLE), and that's something he's already had --
MALVEAUX: All right, Dana. We're going to get back to you. Your connection's a little bad.
I want to go to Soledad O'Brien, who's on the ground at the event with Rick Perry.
Soledad, if you can hear us, give us a sense of what is the atmosphere, what is the mood? Set the scene for us, if you will.
SOLEDAD O'BRIEN, CNN SPECIAL CORRESPONDENT: You bet.
We're in a small sort of conference room at the Hyatt hotel, and they brought the media in very slowly. And he was about five or 10 minutes late, but then came out and made his statement, and right after the statement didn't take any questions and departed.
He had with him some family members and his wife by his side as well. And one of the things I thought was most interesting -- and you were just talking sort of about the impact, because, you know, Rick Perry has been polling in South Carolina with low, single-digit numbers, and similar performance, I think it's fair to say, in Iowa polls and in New Hampshire polls. So, what is the implications of handing off his endorsement to Newt Gingrich?
What he said was Newt is not perfect, but who among us is? There is forgiveness for those who seek God. And to me, that seemed to be an indication of where Rick Perry might be able to be helpful to Newt Gingrich as everyone is expecting some information from Newt Gingrich's ex-wife to be coming out later this evening. So he may be that person who's able to sort of voice -- in addition to giving an endorsement, sort of voice the forgiveness angle as well.
It was interesting to see Mrs. Perry by his side, especially when Rick Perry mentioned his wife, the love of his life, and how much he valued her by his side. She was tearing up a little bit. Clearly, it was a little bit of a tough announcement for her.
And then he took a moment to thank some veterans who had been on the trail with him as well, and some other folks who have supported him along the way. But the announcement was relatively quick.
He said that he did not leave discouraged, that he did not leave disenchanted, that he was going to leave the trail, return to Texas, wind down the campaign, but do so with pride and continue the fight -- Suzanne.
MALVEAUX: All right. Thank you, Soledad.
I want to bring in Jim Acosta, who is with Mitt Romney in his event as well.
And Jim, a couple questions for you. Obviously, breaking news on two fronts.
Mitt Romney did not get the endorsement of Rick Perry. How disappointing is that? Is there any reaction from the campaign?
I'm not hearing Jim Acosta. I don't believe we have Jim Acosta with us.
All right. I'm going to go back -- let's go back to John King on this.
Got a question for you. It was something that was interesting that Rick Perry brought up.
He talked about the fact that 15 million Americans are on food stamps, very much singing from the same song sheet of Newt Gingrich, who has called our president the food stamp president here.
What is this obsession? What is this emphasis on food stamps about when it comes to winning over Republican voters?
KING: Well, it is one of the ways these candidates try to make the case that maybe you see the unemployment rate going down, but there is still this deep economic ditch in the country, there are still millions of Americans who are unemployed or underemployed and there are millions of Americans, a record number of Americans, they say, who need government assistance like food stamps. Some voters find that off-putting. Some voters find when speaker Gingrich said, they find some have complained, does it have a tinge of racial politics in there?
I've known Speaker Gingrich for some time and he has a provocative idea of dealing with poverty. He gets himself in trouble sometimes with the forcefulness of his language. Some people find it off- putting. Governor Perry there essentially saying, this was more to the question, governor Perry in raising those points was more to the question of who do you want to go to Washington and deal with all these programs, deal with these issues? Do you want Mitt Romney, who Governor Perry views as sort of a pragmatic, strategic -- I mean, tactical conservative -- let's move this program here, let's do a little tinkering here, but somebody who would tinker around the edges -- or do you want a more strategic conservative like Newt Gingrich? That's what he was trying to get out.
Gloria and Candy knows this, if you go back to the 2008 race and talk to Huckabee, Thompson, Giuliani, the other candidates in the race, John McCain -- they won't like me saying this publicly, but if you talk to them privately back in those days and talk to these candidates now, they all say the same thing -- they don't like Mitt Romney, for some reason. So, Governor Perry does not have a good personal relationship with Romney. He has a very good personal relationship with Newt Gingrich.
Remember, Suzanne, when the Gingrich staff imploded back in June and most of his staff quit, where did they go? They went to the Perry campaign. So, there are bonds and ties between the two that are quite natural.
So, some of this is not surprising. But there's also a little bit of a personal. If you talk quietly to the candidates in there now, Mitt Romney does not yuck it up. He's not a locker room guy with these guys backstage, and that sometimes matters in politics.
MALVEAUX: I want to bring in Gloria here, because there was something that struck me as well, Rick Perry saying that Newt Gingrich was the true conservative here and that he believed in redemption, that Newt Gingrich was not perfect but, that he was a man of faith and that he was a true conservative.
How important is that moving forward here? We know that there's been a huge split among Republicans about what is most important.
BORGER: Yes, there is. Look, I think Rick Perry was specific on purpose about this. He knows that Newt Gingrich's values and his previous marriages have been dogging him in this campaign, and that Gingrich has explained it, and that it has been a question mark among Evangelical voters in particular.
And I think what you heard Rick Perry say today was, very specifically, I believe in redemption. Newt Gingrich is not perfect. There is forgiveness for those who seek God, as Soledad pointed out earlier. And I think he did that to send a signal to those voters that it's OK to vote for Newt Gingrich.
Now, let me just say this. In our CNN poll we released yesterday, Rick Perry, as you know, has been in the single digits, hasn't gotten a tremendous amount of support. But he had 9 percent from born-again voters. And I think that that could really help Newt Gingrich if they get that signal. 6 percent from conservatives and 5 percent from Tea Party voters. But his largest support was from those evangelicals. And I think that's important to Newt Gingrich because that is where he could use some help.
MALVEAUX: And, Candy, I want to bring a quick question to you here, just to kind of put a button on this, to wrap this up a little bit. Tonight's debate -- this is, what, I'm losing count here. Could be debate number 17. What are voters going to be listening for? What are they going to be looking out for tonight?
CROWLEY: Well, if you're talking about South Carolina voters, we are still talking about a largely conservative, particularly when it comes to the social issues, group. So, they are going to be looking for how they stand on those sorts of things.
But more importantly, every time we poll, no matter what state, what comes up is the economy. So, there's a practicality here that's at play. There is not just who, you know, do I think could best steer the economy? It's also who do I think has the best chance of winning over President Obama. So, I think that still hangs heavy over these voters, regardless of their -- you know, I've talked to some evangelicals along the way who say, listen, we want someone who can beat Barack Obama. So, I think that's still foremost on their minds. So, they're looking for that flair in the candidate, to say I think this guy can.
MALVEAUX: All right. Candy, thank you.
Candy, thanks. John, Gloria, Soledad, everybody.
(LAUGHTER)
We'll get back to you after the break.
(LAUGHTER)
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MALVEAUX: Want to go straight to an event. Newt Gingrich. This is in South Carolina at a town hall. Let's listen in.
(BEGIN LIVE SPEECH)
(JOINED IN PROGRESS)
NEWT GINGRICH, (R), FORMER HOUSE SPEAKER & PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: He understands exactly the mission of defending and expanding freedom, and he understands that every citizen has different ways to participate. And I am confident that he will continue to participate.
He and I talked this morning. I have asked him to head up a Tenth Amendment Enforcement Project, reaching out to every governor in the country in both parties, reaching out to mayors and county commissions, reaching out to state legislators, and then working with conservative legislators in Washington so that we can have a very strong platform plank in Tampa in August with the Tenth Amendment, and we can have a very strong bill that we can put in the 21st-century contract to the Americans in September. And we can then pass that legislation no later than the end of the first quarter of 2013 to return power to the citizens, the communities and the states, and get it out of Washington, D.C.
(APPLAUSE)
GINGRICH: And Governor Perry agreed that he would tackle that huge project, which is something he and I have talked about for several years. And so, I'm just delighted.
But I'm also burdened. And I want to share with you for a minute, before we talk about national security, because I don't come here to ask you to be for me. Because if you're for me, you're going to vote, go home and say, I sure hope Newt fixes it.
We come here to ask you to be with us for the next eight years because we need you by our side every single day, reminding the Congress, the governor, the state legislature, the city council, the county commission, the school board.
We are all going to move America back on to the right track, and we have to do it at every level of government simultaneously, and that requires citizen engagement.
I also want you to be with me, because the scale of change that we're talking about is so large that we're inevitably going to make mistakes.
And we have to have an open flow of communication, whether it's Facebook or Twitter or YouTube or e-mail. We somehow have to learn from people when things aren't working. We have to learn when there are new and better ideas. We have to learn when reality is changing.
537 elected officials cannot fix this country. They're not that smart. And their staffs aren't that smart. But millions of citizens working together can, in fact, create an enormous difference.
Finally, if we return power back home and Governor Perry succeeds in this project that he and I have agreed on, and if we succeed on getting the Congress to truly transfer power back home, as we shrink Washington, we have to build citizenship. So I'm asking you to be with me as a citizen taking on new and important responsibility.
And in that tradition, I want to compliment Captain Howard, who is here today, who is a ranger, a man who went through a great deal of pain for his country, a man who is committed to leading a full life and someone who has developed the Independence Wellness Center.
And he has a particular project I hope all of you will pay attention to. They have a program that Gary Sinise helps them with, called the Lieutenant Dan Weekend. It's in September. It's a great project.
I know Gary, and we know that he is deeply, passionately committed to helping our wounded warriors, helping our men and women in uniform, to helping those who are wounded in America. So I hope you will reach to Captain Howard. And that that is part of your mission as a citizen is to actively work to help create a true Independence Wellness Center that give veterans all across the country a wonderful place to come to to enjoy the coast here in South Carolina. And I thank Captain Howard.
(APPLAUSE)
GINGRICH: Captain Howard is an example of the kind of citizen who just keeps leading in whatever role he happens to find himself in, and I'm very proud of him.
Now, Colonel Seal (ph) talked about the challenges we face and how to be commander in chief and what we actually -
(END LIVE SPEECH_
MALVEAUX: Newt Gingrich out of what I've been told is Beaufort, South Carolina. That's the way they say it in South Carolina, there -- at a town hall. He got the endorsement of Rick Perry, who just dropped out.
One of our correspondents, Joe Johns, sending this e-mail about Gingrich's reaction to that endorsement. According to Joe Johns, who says the staff, Gingrich's staff said that he watched the Perry announcement on the bus, said he was very honored and humbled to have Perry speak so well about endorsing him. He has been a great patriot. And he also has asked him to head a Tenth Amendment Enforcement Project. Governor Perry agreed he would tackle the project and they have talked about that for several years. So, those comments from Newt Gingrich about the endorsement of Rick Perry.
We'll have a lot more on this developing news story, lots of politics in the next couple of hours.
We're going to take a quick break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MALVEAUX: Big political day here. Lots of news. First of all, we had just watched Rick Perry, Texas Governor Rick Perry, dropping out of the race, making this dramatic announcement before tonight's debate, as well as before South Carolina's primary, just two days away. Also very important, who he endorsed. He said it was Newt Gingrich.
Let's take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
RICK PERRY, (R), GOVERNOR OF TEXAS & PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: As I have contemplated the future of this campaign, I have come to the conclusion that there is no viable path forward for me in this 2012 campaign. Therefore, today, I am suspending my campaign and endorsing Newt Gingrich for president of the United States.
(END VIDEO CLIP) MALVEAUX: So, Rick Perry putting his weight and his support -- not a lot of numbers, not a lot of supporters out of South Carolina. If you believe those polls, single digits. But perhaps a very critical group, evangelical Christians. Perhaps, he can persuade them to go to Newt Gingrich.
Another big political story today that we are following, and that was the reversal of the results out of the Iowa caucuses. It was Mitt Romney who was believed to have won the Iowa caucuses. Well, now, today, Iowa officials saying it was actually Rick Santorum. We'll see if that means he has more momentum leading into tonight's debate as well as the South Carolina primary. That in two days, but the debate and CNN tonight. So, all things politics.
We are also following another big story, and that, of course, that ship that went down, the Italian ship. We are hearing that the crew's ship captain, explaining his actions now in a transcript obtained by an Italian newspaper. The captain claims he tripped and fell into a lifeboat. He also told a judge he was navigating by sight, saying, quote, "I was navigating by sight because I knew the depths well and I had done this maneuver three or four times. But this time, I ordered the turn too late and I ended up in water that was too shallow."
Joining us, Atlanta residents, Justin Evans, a trapeze artist, and Keiko Guest, a retired dancer and photographer.
You both do extraordinary work here in Atlanta. First of all, I have to say I'm so happy that both of you are OK. You were vacationing. You were celebrating your birthdays. You were aboard this cruise. Talk about the moment when you realize something was terribly wrong.
JUSTIN EVANS, CRUISE SHIP SURVIVOR: Well, it was about 30 minutes into the crash when we actually realized something was wrong. We were told to calm down and we were told that it was a generator, twice. So, we tried to stay as calm as possible as this was going on. It was until they said that we needed to head to the muster station that we realized there was something seriously going wrong.
MALVEAUX: How did you escape? I know that you're a gymnast, a dancer. How did you do this?
KEIKO GUEST, CRUISE SHIP SURVIVOR: Well, we found ourselves in a state of calm that was unbelievable. It felt like we were in this divine bubble or something and we found passages through all these people. It seems to open up for us, and we managed to get to a lifeboat that was not being overrun. And the crew tried to keep us back, but we felt all this pressure coming from behind.
MALVEAUX: People pushing, you mean?
GUEST: Yes.
MALVEAUX: Stampeding.
GUEST: Yes, stampeding, trying desperately to save their lives.
EVANS: Babies crying.
GUEST: The siren was unbelievable. It was so piercing that the children and babies were screaming at the top of their lungs while everybody else was screaming to try to be heard. It was so chaotic. It was like the disaster movies.
MALVEAUX: And how did you manage to get into the lifeboat and to safety, to land?
EVANS: Well, we kind of pushed our way to the front. We thought -- of course, we didn't do the mustard station drill, so when we first attempted to go to the mustard station, we went to the wrong side and realized that we needed to immediately go to the other side because the boat was way too high for them to even release the lifeboats. So, we rushed over to the other side. We kind of saw that one side was crowded with people, so we went to the other side that didn't have the most people, pushed our way to the front, helped a couple of kids, helped a couple of old people on, and we kind of got on the ship. But the ship was overloaded with people.
MALVEAUX: That lifeboat that you're on.
EVANS: The lifeboat, yes.
MALVEAUX: Well, how do you react to the reports now and the audio tapes of this captain, who seemingly, it appears as if he abandoned you and the other passengers?
GUEST: We were already off, I believe. But to hear about this man who left people stranded on ladders and having to get into this cold water, it was unbelievable. Unbelievable. He just -- we didn't know all this until we heard it on the news. But since then, it appears to us that things were a whole lot worse and a lot of people faired far worse. We had no idea people were trapped, waiting to die. It was quite an experience.
EVANS: I mean it was a horrible experience. And also knowing that the staff -- I mean, they seemed younger than me. They did not know what to do. They got on the lifeboats and they could not even drive the lifeboat. It was someone that jumped into the water, climbed on to the lifeboat and began to maneuver it to drive off that saved us. He was a hero. Because we thought we were going to die.
MALVEAUX: Do you plan on doing anything in terms of holding Carnival Cruises responsible or suing anybody at this point, or have you heard anything from the carnival cruise line?
GUEST: We heard from the American embassy, and they have us on a list of the Americans who did survive. And I've asked for us to be included in any notification or correspondences that may pertain to us. So, at this point, we have no idea about anything. We have tremendous losses of property, but that's nothing compared to what other people lost.
MALVEAUX: Like their lives.
GUEST: Their lives.
MALVEAUX: Do you know anybody who lost their life?
GUEST: No, no one.
EVANS: No.
GUEST: We hardly -- we had met two Americans, and that was it.
EVANS: Yes, we were on the ship three hours before it sank.
MALVEAUX: All right.
EVANS: And --
(CROSSTALK)
MALVEAUX: Go ahead.
All right, well, I'm just so happy that you're both safe and that you're back here in Atlanta. We really appreciate your time.
EVANS: Thank you, Suzanne.
GUEST: Thank you so much, Suzanne.
MALVEAUX: Thank you.
There's a new winner in the Iowa caucuses. That's the other story we're following, even though that final vote, the totals may never be known. We're going to talk to a reporter from the "Des Moines Register" about all of the confusion.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MALVEAUX: Mitt Romney has one less rival in the Republican presidential race but he also learned today that he did not win the Iowa caucuses after all.
Jim Acosta is at a campaign stop in Charleston, South Carolina.
Lots to go over here, Jim. There's breaking news regarding Mitt Romney.
JIM ACOSTA, CNN POLITICAL CORRESPONDENT: That's right.
MALVEAUX: Let's talk about the Iowa caucuses first, this reversal here. What do they make of what happened there? What did he say?
ACOSTA: I wish I could tell you that, Suzanne. We -- the press, who are following Mitt Romney from stop to stop, tried repeatedly to get Mitt Romney to make a comment on what happened in Iowa. The campaign put out a statement earlier this morning calling what happened in Iowa a virtual tie. Obviously, that is not what the Santorum campaign is saying. They put out a release saying Santorum wins Iowa.
I tried repeatedly, other reporters tried repeatedly to get Romney to talk about the results out of the Iowa caucuses. He simply refused to do so. He held an event here with three of his top surrogates. It was quite striking to see this, Suzanne, I have to tell you. Rob Portman, the Senator from Ohio, who endorsed Mitt Romney, was here. Nikki Haley, the governor of South Carolina was here. Tim Pawlenty, the former governor of Minnesota, was also here. It was a very small crowd. Considering the fire power that they had out here, it was a very small crowd.
During his comments, he did not mention the blockbusting news that Rick Perry is dropping out and endorsing Newt Gingrich for president. As he was trying to give us the slip -- he went out of the back door of the campaign headquarters. The traveling press caught up with Mitt Romney just as he was about to get into his SUV and head out of here, where he gave just a few comments about Rick Perry dropping out of the race. Here's what he had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MITT ROMNEY, (R), FORMER MASSACHUSETTS GOVERNOR & PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Governor Perry is a terrific guy, terrific conservative. He's been a great governor, great in the race. We're going to miss him on the stage tonight. Good guy.
ACOSTA: How about the results out of Iowa, is it fair to call it a tie when Santorum came out on top?
Governor, it's been a big news day. Can you just give us a couple of comments, here?
ROMNEY: I've got to get through.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
ACOSTA: So there you go. You can tell from that little clip there, Suzanne, that this was all about message control for the Romney campaign. They did not want any slip ups. you heard what happened the other days when he gave that media avail in Florence, South Carolina, and just sort of dropped it out there that he's paying a 15 percent effective tax rate ever since then. Couple that with the debate performance he had on Monday night, things have been going in Newt Gingrich's direction.
And there's this new poll out from ARG that shows Newt Gingrich in the lead with a statistically small but interesting one-point margin over Mitt Romney. "Politico" also shows Romney with a seven- point lead in South Carolina.
But make no mistake, the Romney campaign is clamping down on the message. They've hurried off their candidate off to the debate prep. That's where he's going to be there until the end of the day -- Suzanne? MALVEAUX: Jim, it was pretty clear he did not want to talk to reporters there.
ACOSTA: No.
MALVEAUX: What is he going to focus on tonight at the debate? Because message and staying on message is so important for him, and this week has not been a good one for him.
ACOSTA: No. And I spoke to Stu Stevens (ph), the chief strategist for the Romney campaign. And I asked him about the last 24 hours and how they are feeling today, and he just said, crazy day. So that's summing it up for the Romney campaign.
But in terms of preparing for tonight's debate, Mitt Romney, make no mistake, has to be on his A-game. What happened the other night, when he was hemming and hawing, giving two different answers on whether he would release his tax returns, that was not a good moment for the Romney campaign.
He was asked by a protester/heckler here a few moments ago, hey, when are we going to see these tax returns. He said wait until April. We'll get them out in April. He's sticking to this claim that he made, this statement that he's made that he's going to release the tax returns in April.
So I would have to say, you know, this is a very important debate for Mitt Romney. If he lets South Carolina slip through his fingerprints and Newt Gingrich somehow wins this state, obviously, this goes on into Florida. The polls we're seeing in Florida are meaningless because Gingrich will get such a boost out of South Carolina. It's basically game on, perhaps all the way to Super Tuesday.
MALVEAUX: Jim, we're going to all be watching. That debate will be critical for Mitt Romney this evening, the CNN debate.
There's also a shakeup in the first political contest between the Republicans. Mitt Romney was originally named the winner of the Iowa caucuses by just eight votes. But this morning, the official certified results showed Rick Santorum on top by 34 votes. So what is behind all of this mess? It is a hot mess.
Jennifer Jacobs, chief political reporter with the "Des Moines Register," joining us by phone.
Jennifer, when you think about these kinds of problems, the debacle between George Bush and Al Gore, that recount, the chads, the hanging chads, the pregnant chads with the ballots there, how does this stack up to the Republican race? I mean, this reversal seems like it's a big mistake.
JENNIFER JACOBS, CHIEF POLITICAL REPORTER, DES MOINES REGISTER (via telephone): Yes. Big difference than on caucus night. We had results from every single precinct and, in this particular case, we're just missing results from eight precincts. So that's the big difference.
I mean, I can verify that GOP officials were out there trying to track down every last number that they could, and we've never, in the history of the caucuses, have gotten to certify all but eight precincts before. So this is unprecedented. So it's ironic to some people that there's been criticism about what a mess this is when actually probably GOP officials have done a better job this cycle than they've ever done before.
MALVEAUX: Jennifer, why was it such a mess, though? Why did they just get this wrong?
JACOBS: Here's the deal. We don't have any sort of a recount. The GOP caucuses don't have a recount procedure. So those ballots are gone. All that the Republican Party can do is certify the votes, which means that those volunteers in charge of these little neighborhood meetings across Iowa are supposed to sign an official form that night and then they have two weeks to turn them into Republican Party headquarters. Most of them turned it in, too.
We're trying to track down what happened to the last eight. They did their best. It's a volunteer run system. It's just very loose, a neighborhood organization. And I think people really tried to do their best.
MALVEAUX: Jennifer, we know that someone by the name of Edward True reported the day after the Iowa caucus he actually knew his precinct made a mistake. Instead of counting two votes for Romney, they marked down 22, and he tried to ring the alarms and he was largely dismissed. Why didn't they take him seriously?
JACOBS: He was pretty close on discovering that error. And GOP officials, you know, they released those exact results from that county and it shows Rick Santorum had the advantage the night of the caucuses and he still won that county. So GOP officials at the time that that gentleman came forward said, yes, there is a typo but it's not going to change the outcome of this particular county, and that ended up being the case.
But, granted, there were 131 incidents where there were typos or a little change that needed to be made in the certified results. That's a lot of human errors there. But the party has caught them all and they have made all of those numbers public now.
MALVEAUX: Glad this is all being sorted out.
Jennifer Jacobs, thank you so much for keeping track of all of that.
I want to let you know, Edward True, the guy who was trying to ring all those alarms the day after the Iowa caucuses about his own precinct, saying, look, you got this wrong, we're going to be talking to him right after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
