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Egyptians Protest At U.S. Embassy; Obama Comments On Anti-U.S. Violence; Clinton Says Video Is Reprehensible; U.S. Warships Move Toward Libya; New Voter ID Law in Pennsylvania; Producer Duped Cast on Intent of Film; New Details Surface on Filmmaker; New Stimulus from Federal Reserve; U.S. National Debt Hits $16 Trillion

Aired September 13, 2012 - 13:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN ANCHOR: I'm Suzanne Malveaux. This hour in the CNN NEWSROOM, anti-American protesters are scaling U.S. embassy walls, burning cars in several cities. We're going to check out the map. The protests are happening from Cairo to Sana'a, Yemen, to Tel Aviv, to Tehran.

The anti-American violence started in Egypt. It is not letting up. There are angry crowds that are protesting for a third straight day over the film that insults Islam. Demonstrators threw rocks, Molotov cocktails, pushed through barbed wire fencing outside the U.S. embassy in Cairo. Police responded by firing tear gas. Officials say 224 people were injured in today's protests alone.

Egyptian blogger and journalist Mona Eltahawy, she has been witnessing this and joins us by phone from Cairo. Mona, I know that, first of all, you were in Tahrir Square over the last 24 hours. What is the feeling? What is the mood there?

MONA ELTAHAWY, EGYPTIAN BLOGGER AND JOURNALIST (via telephone): I was there in the early hours of today, Suzanne. I was there at about 2:00 a.m. I was not there today, and there was -- yesterday there was a street that was closed to block access to the U.S. embassy, which is why the clashes were taking place, not right at the premise as they were -- as the protests were on Tuesday, but further away.

From what I gather from people on the ground today, as you said, more than 200 people were injured and it's a very different kind of protest today than it was on Tuesday that first day. On Tuesday, those protests were called by right wing members of the Talis (ph) movement in Egypt, and there was very little security and people were very surprised because the U.S. embassy is usually guarded like a fortress. Security has been out yesterday and today. And I want to emphasize that many of the protesters taking part in the clashes today with police are not just upset about the film but upset about police. There's a long-running anger at police brutality in Egypt, and this protest has as much to do -- or today's clashes have as much to do with that as they do with the film. It's a different kind of clash now.

MALVEAUX: What do they want, Mona? What do the protesters want?

ELTAHAWY: That is a great question, Suzanne, because on Tuesday, it wasn't clear what the protesters then wanted either. It wasn't clear if the protest was called to coincide with 911, and it wasn't clear why people were getting upset about the film now despite the fact it's been online for two months. Tomorrow, there's been a large protest called by the Muslim brotherhood movement from which our current president, Mohammed Morsi comes. And interestingly, the Salafis who are further to the right of the Muslim brotherhood, have decided to boycott tomorrow's protest which is actually one way of answering what's going on. I believe, and many people believe, first of all, there's a big concern about the reinstallment of emergency law and we worry these clashes will be used as a pretext to bring back emergency law but there's also a worry about political jockeying for power.

There's a right wing in the U.S. that is behind this film and it's election season in the U.S., elections in November, obviously. Here in Egypt, there's a different kind of political jockeying. Whereas we have a president who wants to place himself in the center, as Hosni Mubarak (INAUDIBLE) did for years, and point to the Salafis to call the initial protest and point to them as the new right wing. So, it's a very different -- it's a very dangerous political jockeying for power. And those of us who care about the revolution are saying we do not want the right wing in the U.S. or in Egypt to derail our revolution and its goals.

MALVEAUX: And, Mona, what do you think of what the U.S. president has said, Barack Obama saying that he doesn't really consider Egypt an ally or an enemy at this point, that it really is time will tell, that this is a work in progress. I mean, that really is kind of a stunning change of position from the White House perspective.

ELTAHAWY: I think that that statement took many people by surprise and shocked them a great deal because part of the anti-U.S. sentiment, and there is an anti-U.S. sentiment in the clashes today and in the protests on Tuesday and in the various countries where the protests are taking place, the U.S. has been a -- Egypt has been a major ally for the U.S. to the extent that five different U.S. administrations supported our dictator, Mubarak. I think the White House realized -- because over the past few minutes I've been reading statements, the White House realized what a shocking statement that was and it looks like they're trying to back pedal from this idea that Egypt has been demoted as an ally.

I think everybody right now feels how sensitive the situation is and understands this political jockeying for power and again to reiterate, it's -- the revolution and its goals, freedom and dignity, but not be derailed. And I think it's imperative for the U.S. administration as well as the Egyptian administration to focus on those goals and not allow the right wing to derail us.

MALVEAUX: So, Mona, give -- what is the reaction of people in Egypt, though, to those statements, to the president's statement there? Do they feel abandoned? I mean, when they hear that the president of the United States is no longer necessarily categorically calling Egypt an ally?

ELTAHAWY: Well, you know, quite honestly, Suzanne, there's been a lot of confusion about what the U.S. role is right now and how the U.S. feels about Egypt, because, as I said, before our revolution began, there was and continued to be a lot of anti-U.S. sentiment because of this support by various U.S. administrations for dictators in this region. But hearing the statement today, I think people are thinking, --

MALVEAUX: All right.

ELTAHAWY: -- well, you know, whose side are you on because we're trying to get this revolution working and it has definitely confused a lot of people.

MALVEAUX: All right, Mona Eltahawy, thank you so much for your time. I want to go directly to Golden, Colorado. This is where the president is speaking about the four who were killed in Libya.

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: -- who serve in difficult and dangerous places all around the world, to advance the interests and the values that we hold dear as Americans. And a lot of times, their work goes unheralded, it doesn't get a lot of attention but it is vitally important. We enjoy our security and our liberty because of the sacrifices that they make. And they do an outstanding job every single day without a lot of fan fare. So, what I want all of you to know is that we are going to bring those who killed our fellow Americans to justice.

I want people around the world to hear me, to all those who would do us harm, no act of terror will go unpunished. It will not dim the light of the values that we proudly present to the rest of the world. No act of violence shakes the resolve of the United States of America, and I have directed my administration to do whatever is necessary to protect all Americans who are serving abroad, that's one of my highest priorities as president. And we're also in contact with other governments to underscore that they've got an obligation to cooperate with us, to protect our citizens. That's part of their job.

Now, I know that it's difficult sometimes seeing these disturbing images on television, because our world is filled with serious challenges. This is a tumultuous time that we're in. But we can and we will meet those challenges if we stay true to who we are. And if we would remind ourselves that we're different from other nations. We are -- we're different not only because of the incredible landscape that God has given us, we're different because we're a nation that's bound together by a creed. We're not made up of a single tribe or single religion or a single race. We're a collection of people from all around the world who came here because of a certain set of principles. The idea that all men and women are created equal. That we are all endowed by our creator with certain unalienable rights. That's what binds us together. That's what our flag means.

But we also believe that these are not just American rights. We believe these are universal aspirations. And they are held by people who live in tiny villages in Libya, prosperous cities in Europe. That's our light to the world. And our task, as the most powerful nation on earth, is to defend and protect and advance our people, but also to defend and protect and advance those values at home and around the world. That's what our troops do. That's what our diplomats do. That's what our intelligence officers do. That's what our citizens do. That's what we believe. Those are the values that we hold to.

And here in America, there is no more fundamental part of our democracy than the fact that all of you get a say in the decisions that are made about our country's future. And that's why we're here today. You know, over the past few weeks, Colorado, you've been offered two very different paths for our future. You've seen their convention, you've seen ours. And now you chase -- now you face one big choice. Ours -- our vision, our fight, is to restore the basic bargain that built the largest middle class and the strongest economy the world has ever known. The promise that says hard work will pay off. If you work hard, you can make it. That responsibility will be rewarded. That in this country of ours, everybody gets a fair shot and everybody does their fair share and everybody plays by the same rules from Wall Street to main street to Washington, D.C.

MALVEAUX: President Obama in Golden, Colorado, before an enthusiastic group of campaigners.

Absolute chaos at the U.S. embassy today in the capital of Yemen. Furious protesters scaled the security fence, smashed car windows nearby. People are angry about a film produced in the United States that is offensive to Muslims. We are seeing similar scenes at U.S. embassies and consulates in Egypt, Libya and Tunisia.

Secretary of state, Hillary Clinton, talked about that film today and spoke directly to the people who are furious at the United States and attacking the embassies and consulates overseas. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HILLARY CLINTON, SECRETARY OF STATE: I also want to take a moment to address the video circulating on the Internet that has led to these protests in a number of countries. Let me state very clearly, and I hope it is obvious, that the United States government had absolutely nothing to do with this video. We absolutely reject its content and message. America's commitment to religious tolerance goes back to the very beginning of our nation. And as you know, we are home to people of all religions, many of whom came to this country speaking the right to exercise their own religion, including, of course, millions of Muslims. And we have the greatest respect for people of faith.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: Secretary Clinton also had words for the protesters who are expressing their anger with violence.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CLINTON: To us, to me personally, this video is disgusting and reprehensible. It appears to have a deeply cynical purpose, to denigrate a great religion and to provoke rage. But as I said yesterday, there is no justification, none at all, for responding to this video with violence. We condemn the violence that has resulted in the strongest terms, and we greatly appreciate that many Muslims in the United States and around the world have spoken out on this issue.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: The hunt for those who killed the Americans in Libya will include warships and surveillance drones. Now, right now, there are two U.S. Navy destroyers, they are equipped with guided cruise missiles. They're on route to the Libyan coast. A contingent of Marines has also already arrived.

I want to bring in Chris Lawrence from the Pentagon to talk about this. We know that there are drones, warships that are moving into position. What is the mission? What is the plan?

CHRIS LAWRENCE, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Well, Suzanne, to put it bluntly, it's to find the insurgent cell responsible for this attack and then to either capture or kill those responsible. The drones, we are told now, have been flying for several months. Pentagon officials confirming that they were flying perhaps even as far back as before the last attack on this American compound which was back in June. But now, the search is going to become much more focused, looking for elements of this insurgent cell that can then be targeted.

Now, when you talk about some of the ships that are coming, two destroyers have been ordered to come to the coast, off the coast of Libya. Both of those are armed with tomahawk cruise missiles, which can be programmed to strike specific targets and are guided by satellite.

MALVEAUX: Give us a sense of what the Marines are going to be doing as well.

LAWRENCE: Yes, a quick response team of 50 Marines landed in Tripoli yesterday. They are there now. Their primary job is to beef up security at the main diplomatic compound there in Tripoli. They're also on hand in case even more Americans need to be evacuated. And we're also told that some U.S. units, some troops around the world, have also been notified that they may be moved to U.S. embassies around the world as well if the U.S. feels that extra security is needed. It goes back to what you heard President Obama just saying, that he had directed his team to make sure that diplomats and Americans that are working abroad for the government are protected.

LAWRENCE: ...well if the U.S. feels that extra security is needed. It goes back to what you heard President Obama just saying, that he had directed his team to make sure that diplomats and Americans that are working abroad for the government are protected. The ships right now are a contingency. There is not a specific mission. But what they do, together with those drones, is give the President options.

MALVEAUX: All right. Chris Lawrence, thank you. Appreciate it, Chris.

Here's what we're working on for this hour. Many experts believe al Qaeda was behind the deadly attack on the U.S. consulate in Libya. We'll talk to an al Qaeda expert about the motive.

We're also learning more about the filmmaker who sparked protests around the world. (COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: Libyan and US authorities are searching for a pro al Qaeda group they say is responsible for the attack that killed the US ambassador and three other Americans. They believe it is the same group that claimed responsibility for this attack on the US consulate in Banghazi in June. We want to bring in our CNN National Security Analyst Peter Bergen who has reported extensively on al Qaeda as well interviewing Osama bin Laden back in '97. I had a chance to talk to Peter earlier today and he explained how the US first learned about this al Qaeda group in Libya.

PETER BERGEN, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: in 2007 the US military uncovered a trove of documents in Iraq basically the sort of Rosetta Stone of al Qaeda in Iraq. And when they looked at these documents and analyzed them they found that 40% of the foreign fighters coming into Iraq were coming from Libya, which was kind of an unexpected thing to find. And so historically, Libya has provided quite a lot of suicide attackers to al Qaeda and the group that is deemed to be behind this attack is probably one of these sort of splinter groups from al Qaeda central.

MALVEAUX: How strong is their presence there in Libya and who leads them, do we know?

BERGEN: You know, I mean there is sort of umbrella group, according to the former Libyan jihadist called Ansar al Sharia, which basically means supporters of Sharia. I think a lot of this is relatively secretive. This is not obviously an organization that operates in a very overt manner. My guess is that we're talking about a few hundred people at most. It doesn't represent the tens of thousands or hundreds of thousands of people who are taking up arms against Gadhafi. They have -- as the reporter in Libya indicated, been able to do some attacks on western targets. My guess is they're going to come under extreme pressure right now.

MALVEAUX: Democrats say that new voter ID laws could cost them votes in November. Civil rights groups, they are outraged. We're going to take a look at what it could mean in this critical swing state of Pennsylvania.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: Pennsylvania's controversial voter ID law goes before the State Supreme Court today. Now, the court has to decide whether a lower court was right to let the law go into effect. Civil rights activists and others are challenging voter ID laws in Pennsylvania and several other states. They say that the laws will mostly affect poor and elderly voters. Here's CNN's Deborah Feyerick.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DEBORAH FEYERICK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: (voice over) For Teresa Lacoco getting anywhere with her elderly parents is challenging enough. But getting them to the DMV for a voter ID card which they have never needed before is absolutely daunting. TERESA LACOCO, LOCAL VOTER: It's just a horrible experience. They're not giving people the right to vote if they make it impossible for them to vote.

FEYERICK: (voice over) The number of Pennsylvania voters who may not have the right ID come November vary widely. State officials say it's 100,000 people. Civil rights activists and community organizers like Lisa Frank say it could be upwards of a million.

LISA FRANK, COMMUNITY ORGANIZER: The huge information chasm that the state has created that folks like me are running around trying to fill. By tabling, by actually knocking doors, by having one-on-one conversations and saying let's look together and make sure you're ready to vote.

FEYERICK: (voice over) Republican lawmakers passed a new voter ID law in March, saying it's designed to protect voter integrity. But a comment in June by a top state Republican which appeared on YouTube has raised serious questions.

UNIDENTIFIED PENNSYLVANIA STATE TOPREPUBLICAN: Voter ID., which is going to allow Governor Romney, to win the state of Pennsylvania. Done.

FEYERICK: (voice over) The state's chief election official says claims that blocks of voters will be disenfranchised are exaggerated.

CAROL AICHELE, PENNSYLVANIA SECRETARY OF STATE: We are reasonably certain, pretty darn certain that we can address the needs of photo ID for every eligible voter in Pennsylvania.

FEYERICK: (voice over) Both sides concede there are no known cases of voter impersonation in the state.

VIC WALCZAK, ACLU ATTORNEY: They are saying you have to prove who you are in order for us to make sure that this non-problem doesn't occur.

FEYERICK: (voice over) ACLU lawyer, Vic Walczak and others are suing to block voter id requirements.

(on camera) Is there a socioeconomic component as to who is having to get these IDs?

WALCZAK: Absolutely. Given that the vast majority of people who are impacted by this law are poor, uneducated, of color, live in cities, i.e. Philadelphia and Pittsburgh and are likely to vote Democratic, this law could have an impact on the presidential election.

FEYERICK: (voice over) The debate is now before the state supreme court. Deborah Feyerick, CNN, Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: New details are coming to light about the man behind the anti-Islam film that sparked all those protests. We're going to talk about the violence with the man who actually was a consultant on that film.

Don't forget, you can watch --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FILM CONSULTANT: If anybody paid attention to it. When we first showed it, nobody paid any attention to it.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: And don't forget, you can watch CNN live on your computer while you're at work. Head to CNN.com/tv.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUXAn online movie, offensive to Muslims, is triggering a third straight day of protests in parts of Africa as well as the Middle East. Now the cast of that movie, they're speaking out, claiming they were shocked by what they called "drastic rewrites of the script."

One of the actresses spoke directly to us and she says she called the producer of the movie. He told her to deliver a message to the world. Let's listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED ACTRESS: Tell the media that I'm tired of the Muslims killing innocent people. And he said -- oh, I don't want to get it wrong -- "That I'm tired of them killing innocent people and that I am from Israel."

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: Brian Todd is joining us now with new information about this guy who made the movie.

What do we know about him?

BRIAN TODD, CNN CORRESPONDENT: He's a fairly murky figure, Suzanne. A member of the production staff who worked on the film has told CNN the producer's name was listed as Abanob Nakoula Bacile or it could be pronounced Bacile. That was on paperwork filed with the Screen Actor's Guild. The Associated Press is reporting his name as Nakoula Bassely Nakoula. In previous meetings, he identified himself as Sam Bacile and said he was an Israeli-American real estate developer from California.

But this production staffer who spoke to CNN producer, Jennifer Wolfe, said he believed this filmmaker, whichever name he goes by, was a Coptic Christian. That is a Christian church based in Egypt with tens of millions of members worldwide. There are reports the filmmaker self-financed this movie and made a trip to Egypt to raise money for the film. I have spoken with an official of the Coptic Church here in the Washington, D.C., area. He told me the church condemns this film very strongly. They have issued a statement saying that the movie is part of what he calls "a malicious campaign aiming to divide people, especially Egyptians." It says Coptic Christian leaders have expressed a deep dissatisfaction with this film, which it calls abusive -- Suzanne?

MALVEAUX: The man who was a consultant on the film as well, who was talking and speaking out, what does he tell us about the producer of this movie?

TODD: We caught up to this gentleman yesterday. His name is Steve Klein, a consultant on that film. He told me the filmmaker is afraid for his own safety and was upset about the killing of the U.S. ambassador.

But when I asked Klein a key question, which I asked him if he still only had the name Bacile for this filmmaker, Klein himself struck a very different tone. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TODD: Do you and Mr. Bacile feel that you have any blood on your hands as a result of the violence?

STEVE KLEIN, FILM CONSULTANT: That's a very good question. Under the rules of engagement in Vietnam, where I killed the North Vietnamese army and the Viet Cong, I go to bed with blood on my hand. It does not bother me a bit. In this case, with the ambassador, I did not kill these people. It is they who pulled the trigger. It is they who murdered the ambassador.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

TODD: Now, regarding that Vietnam reference, Steve Klein told us he himself is a veteran of Vietnam. There is some information we've gathered in addition to what he told us that indicates that he served in combat there and is a former Marine. Klein also told us that his own son had been wounded in Iraq by a suicide bomber there. We can't independently verify that claim at the moment but there you have a little background on Steve Klein -- Suzanne?

MALVEAUX: Do we know if anybody is looking for, searching for, questioning, investigating this movie maker?

TODD: Well, we know that several media entities have been doing that over the past few days, including CNN. We don't know much beyond that. He has apparently, at least for the moment, gone underground. He's a very difficult guy to find at the moment, although, some media entities have been able to catch up to him, at least on the phone. But, no, we don't know if any federal authorities or anybody else are looking for him or are connecting him in any way as part of any kind of an investigation at this point -- Suzanne?

MALVEAUX: And, Brian, do we know if he could possibly be charged with anything? There are a lot of people very upset about what he's done, but could he face any charges, civil or criminal charges?

TODD: That's a little unclear. Some of the initial reporting we're getting is that this man has a criminal background and did serve some time and was on parole for some fraud violations. If somehow this -- the making of this film violated his parole, that could be a possibility. We're still kind of working out some of the information and some of the reporting on that, so that's kind of a speculative thing right now. But there is some information that he does have a criminal background.

MALVEAUX: All right, Brian, if anybody can find him, you can.

Thank you, appreciate it.

(LAUGHTER)

TODD: All right.

MALVEAUX: Sure.

Today, we learned the name of another American killed this week in a rocket attack in Libya, the same attack that killed the U.S. ambassador to the country. The family of former Navy SEAL Glen Doherty spoke to reporters today near Boston.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KATE QUIGLEY, DAUGHTER OF GLEN DOHERTY: Our family would like to thank everyone for their love and support. Glen lived his life to the fullest. He was my brother, but if you ask his friends, he was their brother as well. We ask for privacy during this time as we grieve for our friend, my brother, our brother, our son, and our American hero. Thank you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: Glen Doherty's mother says she received confirmation of her son's death just last night. Doherty, U.S. Ambassador Chris Stevens' foreign service information management officer, Sean Smith, and one other American were killed Tuesday when militants fired rockets into the U.S. consulate in Benghazi, Libya.

Just one hour ago, the Federal Reserve pledged to keep interest rates low until 2015. We have details from the Fed's latest attempt to boost the economy up next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: Just about an hour ago, Wall Street got the news it was looking for. There's going to be a third round of stimulus from the Federal Reserve. The Fed says it will buy $40 million of reserves a month. It will likely keep interest rates low until 2015.

Alison Kosik has been watching all the moves before the New York Stock Exchange.

So what does it mean?

ALISON KOSIK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: What the Fed is eventually doing, Suzanne, is taking risk in the form of mortgage debt off the banks shoulders, so it's going to go ahead and take $40 billion a month off of its own balance sheet, give that cash right to banks, take that mortgage debt off of their shoulders in hopes of pushing interest rates lower and incentivizing the banks to give out loans. In all of this, the consumers out there, the businesses out there, they have got to want to take out loans as well, so it's got to come both ways. Also the Fed promised to keep interest rates lower until 2015 instead of 2014 -- Suzanne?

MALVEAUX: So what's trader reaction to today's news?

KOSIK: The reaction is strong. The Dow right now is up 156 points. You know, we are back -- or at least stocks are back up to levels for the Dow that we haven't seen since December of 2007. That was right before the recession began. So this is what investors have been expecting. They have been expecting it since June. They have been bidding up stocks since then. So this comes as no surprise. Still, you've got investors buying in. We are watching bank shares, anywhere from 2 percent to 4 percent higher right now -- Suzanne?

MALVEAUX: Do we think this is going to actually boost the economy, another round of stimulus?

KOSIK: And that really is the money question, because there are two schools of thought. Critics say, you know what, interest rates are already low and you don't see a lot of loans being handed out. You don't see a lot of consumers out there and businesses taking out loans. Many question how this is going to help. Also there's a confidence issue, as far as businesses go. You know, what is going to make them want to take out a loan when they are feeling like the economy is not on solid ground? Also there's a lot of uncertainty involving the fiscal cliff. What are tax policies going to look like as of January 1? That can't give businesses much incentive either.

What you'll find is, this discussion, even after the Fed made this move, the discussion is still going to turn to Congress and whether or not Congress will act on this fiscal cliff -- Suzanne?

MALVEAUX: Alison, thank you.

President Obama and Mitt Romney say they have plans to shrink the U.S. debt, but there are problems with both the plans. We have details up next.

POPPY HARLOW, CNNMONEY.COM CORRESPONDENT: Hey there, everyone. Today on the "Help Desk" we're talking about the best way to tackle your credit card debt. A lot of people have this issue.

Joining me this hour, Donna Rosato and Ryan Mack.

Donna, this woman told me, when I talked to her, that she has $4,000 in debt. So take a listen to her question.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: If you've got multiple credit cards, you know, what's the best way to work out a plan where you can pay it off? (END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: Yes, I think she's wondering which do I pay off first?

DONNA ROSATO, SENIOR WRITER, MONEY: That's right. Well, there are two schools of thought on this. Generally it's better to focus on the highest rate card and pay that down as quickly as possible because you'll pay less interest over time and, of course, you want to keep paying the minimum payment on your other ones.

HARLOW: Right.

ROSATA: But a lot of people get a psychological boost by paying off the smallest balances first and just getting rid of them. That's very motivating. But the best plan is whatever makes you stick to it. Whichever one helps you, then that's the most important thing, just pay those cards down.

RYAN MACK: You know, this question is important because it amazes me how few people actually write the debts on paper so they can see exactly what the debts are and see exactly what the interest rates are. Before you pay a cent, call each one of those credit card companies and be aggressive. Call them three or four times --

(CROSSTALK)

HARLOW: Try to negotiate.

MACK: Lower those interest rates. See if you can get more money in your pocket.

HARLOW: A lot of people don't want to look at it --

MACK: Right.

HARLOW: But it's not going to go away. It's going to get worse.

MACK: I keep on saying that it works.

HARLOW: Absolutely.

Guys, thank you.

If you've got a question you want our experts to tackle, just upload a 30-second video with your question to ireport.com.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: It's been more than a year since U.S. debt was downgraded by Standard & Poor's. Now another credit agency, Moody's, is threatening now to do the same. They give the same reason. They say partisan politics. They say Washington just can't get it together to make any progress, getting the debt or the deficit under control. So what do the candidates plan to do about the national debt now at $16 trillion, and how did we get there in the first place?

Ali Velshi, he takes a look.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ALI VELSHI, CNN CHIEF BUSINESS CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Just a few steps from the billboards of Times Square is a billboard of a different sort, the National Debt Clock.

New York real estate developer, Seymour Durst, set up the first debt clock in 1989.

DOUGLAS DURST, NEW YORK REAL ESTATE DEVELOPER: When my father designed the clock, the debt was about $2 trillion. He would be shocked that we're at this number today.

VELSHI: Last year, the federal government spent $3.6 trillion. But it only took in $2.3 trillion in revenue. It borrowed the shortfall, $1.3 trillion, and that's the deficit. The accumulated deficits, or shortfalls, plus interest make up the national debt. And it's more than $16 trillion today.

The debt had run up under both Republican and Democratic presidents and Congresses. Both have had opportunities to tackle it, but it is never politically palatable.

President Obama formed the Simpson-Bowles Commission, headed by former Republican Senator, Alan Simpson, and Bill Clinton's chief of staff, Erskine Bowles. They came up with a plan to cut the growing debt by $4 trillion over 10 years.

Vice presidential candidate, Paul Ryan, was a member of that commission but he and enough others voted against it so it never even got to Congress.

Critics say President Obama has all but ignored it.

Commission co-head, Alan Simpson, says the growing debt poses a major threat to the U.S. economy.

ALAN SIMPSON, (R), CO-DIRECTOR, DEBT COMMISSION & FORMER SENATOR: Where is the tipping point? I don't know where it is. But when it comes, it's going to be so swift and so savage.

VELSHI: The president says he still wants to reach an agreement based on Simpson-Bowles. And while he's proposed cuts, they're not enough. Obama's plan proposes $360 billion in cuts to Medicare, Medicaid, and other programs over the next decade, but because costs in those programs are rising fast, the debt would be $6.4 trillion higher in 10 years. The president's budget also proposes cuts to discretionary and mandatory spending that would save $737 billion over a decade. Military spending would be reduced, saving $487 billion. And unlike anything the GOP proposes, there's a $1.5 trillion tax hike with the wealthy taking the biggest hit.

(CHEERING) VELSHI: Mitt Romney doesn't want tax hikes for the rich, so how will he deal with the debt?

MITT ROMNEY, (R), FORMER MASSACHUSETTS GOVERNOR & PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I will cut the deficit and get us on track to a balanced budget.

(APPLAUSE)

VELSHI: Romney's 59-point economic plan calls for reducing the federal workforce by 10 percent. Like Obama, he also proposes entitlement reform and some major spending cuts, but he hasn't detailed them yet. As for taxes, Romney proposes cutting income tax rates by a fifth across the board, presumably balanced by closing loopholes, but again, no specifics.

In short, neither candidate has proposed a plan that puts a serious dent in the U.S. debt.

But Douglas Durst still holds out hope that, one day, he'll be able to retire his dad's debt clock.

DURST: I'm an optimist. We're going to have a very big party.

(LAUGHTER)

VELSHI: Ali Velshi, CNN, New York.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MALVEAUX: It was a memorial at Washington National Cathedral today for the first man on the moon, Neil Armstrong. We're going to take you there.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: Astronaut Neil Armstrong being remembered today in a public memorial at the National Cathedral in Washington.

Jazz singer, Diana Krall, honored Armstrong with her rendition of "Fly Me to the Moon."

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

(SINGING)

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MALVEAUX: Of course, you remember Armstrong was the first man to walk on the moon in 1969. He is being honored today by fellow astronauts and NASA officials.

Our own John Zarrella has been watching the service.

Obviously, an American icon. You had an opportunity, actually, to meet him on several occasions. What was he like? JOHN ZARRELLA, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I did. And, you know, the most recent was backing a couple of years ago at the anniversary of the Apollo 7 moon landings and he went to the anniversaries, the private events, Suzanne. Just the astronauts attended. I happen to be the emcee for that event. You know, even at those events everybody wanted a picture with him, shake his hand, and he was most gracious all the time in doing that. But that was why he shied away from the public limelight. Because everybody always wanted to be there to touch him and say, I shook the hand of the first man to walk on the moon. It was difficult for him.

MALVEAUX: What do you think he took away from that? What do you think that people would remember him for, the kind of person that he was?

ZARRELLA: You know, I think and what the problem was, so many people did not know the real Neil Armstrong. and what we took away even from the ceremony today and from astronauts that I had the opportunity to talk to in the last week, the Apollo astronauts who were so close to him -- you know, Gene Cernan, the last man to fly on the moon, spoke today eloquently and haltingly and with tears in his eyes about the relationship with Neil and the kind of man he was. And everybody that I've talked to, and what Cernan said today, Neil was always about the team. It was never about Neil Armstrong. He always believed that the accomplishment of landing on the moon was about the engineers, the scientists, everybody who was involved, the technicians, and, of course, would not have happened if not for the thousands of people who made it happen. He just happened to be at the tip of the spear. That's how he looked at it.

MALVEAUX: All right. John Zarrella, thank you very much. Appreciate it.

Today, New York City banned large sodas in restaurants. We'll tell you when the law takes effect and where you can still get a big drink.

On the "Next List," one man sets out on a personal quest to teach people how to live off the grid in the jungles of Costa Rica.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

JUAN SOSTHEIM, OWNER & FOUNDER, RANCHO MARGOT: My father thought I was a nut for taking the job but I took a job working at Burger King. I became operations manager and director of Burger King in Europe.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: One, he is coming from a very strong corporate sector and he says he is now paying for his sins.

SOSTHEIM: And now I want to use the knowledge that I gain and give it to others, so I'm creating this living university here so that people can come, enjoy themselves and, by osmosis, if nothing else, take over everything that we know.

Hello, everyone. My name is Juan Sostheim, and I'm the owner and founder of Rancho Margot.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MALVEAUX: Paul Ryan takes a break from the campaign trail to return to Capitol Hill. The Republican vice presidential nominee is back for a vote on the so-called continuing resolution. That's a bill to keep the government up and running through March. Ryan is chairman of the House Budget Committee, and this is his first time back in Congress since Mitt Romney picked him as a running mate.

And the super-sized sodas days, over for New Yorkers. The city's Board of Health of the city voted today to ban the sale of sodas and other sugar drinks of more than 16 ounces at restaurants, street carts and movie theaters. It goes in effect next march along with a $200 fine for violations. If you just have to have that Big Gulp, places like 7-Eleven and convenience stores are exempt from the law.

The CNN NEWSROOM continues right now with Don Lemon.

Hi, Don.

DON LEMON, CNN ANCHOR: Hey, Suzanne. Thank you very much.

I'm Don Lemon.