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Coaching The Debaters; First Presidential Debate Tonight On CNN; What Happens During Debate Prep; Secret Obama tape Is Anything But; Watching Debate Issues that Could Sway Voters; Presidential Candidate Wives Support Their Husbands; What Makes/Breaks a Debate; How is Economy Doing Now?
Aired October 03, 2012 - 13:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
SUZANNE MALVEAUX, CNN ANCHOR: It happened late Monday night at Federal Polytechnic. This is a university that is in Mumbai, that is not far from the border with Cameroon. Got to warn you, the pictures you are about to see is rather disturbing. At least 25 people were killed, most of them students.
I'm Suzanne Malveaux. This is hour in the CNN NEWSROOM, tonight is the night. The first of three presidential debates just hours away. President Obama and former Massachusetts Governor Mitt Romney taking the stage at the University of Denver. Our coverage begins at 6:00 -- rather, 7:00 p.m. Eastern.
Both men have a lot riding on tonight's first debate. For the most part, the President has maintained a steady lead over Romney since the Democratic convention but the race is now tightening. I want you to take a look at our latest CNN Poll of Polls. This is an average of five national polls. Among likely voters, the President has 49 percent, Mitt Romney at 46 percent. And, of course, after tonight's 90 minute showdown, everybody is going to be focusing on how these candidates performed. The debate -- after the debate, well, that, of course, is going to rage on. But what we don't see is the work that goes behind the scenes the night before.
Our Dana Bash who sat down with one of the men who is prepping Romney for a debate and gives us an inside look.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
WOLF BLITZER, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: If you make a serious accusation against Governor Romney like that --
NEWT GINGRITCH, FORMER REPUBLICAN PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: I simply suggested --
BLITZER: You need to explain that.
GINGRICH: You want to try again? I mean --
MITT ROMNEY, PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Wouldn't it be nice if people didn't make accusations somewhere else that they weren't willing to defend here? GINGRICH: OK.
DANA BASH, CNN SENIOR CONGRESSIONAL CORRESPONDENT: How critical was that moment?
BRAD O'DONNELL, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: It was a huge moment in the debates --
BASH: Why?
O'DONNELL: -- for Governor Romney. Because in that one sentence, he was able to take an issue that others had been dogging him with and put it to rest. He was able to communicate clearly. If you are going to make the charge, make it on the stage. And that really put Gingrich in his place. You know, and that's happened through -- that happened throughout the primary debates. When Pawlenty wouldn't repeat the Obama care charge. You know, if a candidate is not willing to say the same thing on stage face-to-face that they'll say in an interview, we view them as weak. And that moment was a moment of strength for Governor Romney.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MALVEAUX: Dana Bash is joining us live. Dana, that was really fascinating. Interesting that you spoke to the Republican strategist Brad O'Donnell, one of Romney's primary debates here. He spent a lot of time with him during the primaries. How much does the Romney really think that those 20 or so debates in the primaries is going to help him win tonight?
BASH: Well, of course, any debate that any candidate has they think will help, but, you know, this is a very, very different ball game. First of all, Mitt Romney was standing next to about, you know, half a dozen people at any given moment. This is mano-a-mano with the President of the United States. Never mind the 10s of millions more viewers that are going to be watching. So, it is definitely a very different dynamic.
And that's why, interestingly, Suzanne, this is the first time during this debate prep process -- which Mitt Romney started about a month ago during the Democratic convention, the first time he has done these mock debates. Through all of those primaries, he never did a formal mock debate with what he called game day conditions.
MALVEAUX: Wow, that's really interesting. So, we know that the mock debates are going on this go-around. President Obama has been doing them, Romney as well. And they have the stand-ins. I don't know if They don't fn a lot of people realize. Folks actually stand in for them and Senator Rob Portman of Ohio claims is portraying President Obama. I understand that he was really, really tough on Romney. Romney doesn't even like him anymore. You spoke with him, right?
BASH: I did and Rob Portman is really fascinating because he has been playing the Democratic stand-in since 2000. He is the Republican's go-to guy. And by all accounts, he really sort of takes over the character and the policies of the Democrat, in this case President Obama. And when we talked, I asked him -- in an exclusive interview, I asked how he goes about doing that. Listen to what he said.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
SEN. ROB PORTMAN (R), OHIO: And how they're likely to express themselves, you know, and what the body language is going to be like. You know, try to imitate the person, but you try to give a pair presentation, you know, to whoever you're working with as to what they're likely to do.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
BASH: And maybe he was a little bit modest there, because people who I have talked to who have worked with him for years say that he reads up, he -- on the person in terms of their policies, in the case of President Obama, read his autobiography, watched as many clips of him debating as possible. And to answer your first question, yes, he is very, very tough on anybody he is debating and sparring with, including Mitt Romney. And the point is that they want to be prepared for the worst when they get to the real debate, so if they feel defensive, as they're -- some of Romney's aides are a little bit worried that he might get, he can sort of get it out of his system and react in debate prep as opposed to doing it during the real thing.
MALVEAUX: And, Dana, you say he is the go-to guy for the Republicans for many, many candidates. Does he actually take on the persona of the person that they're debating, you know? Does he try to impersonate Obama in any way?
BASH: I tried to -- I tried to get him to role play to see if, you know, there was sort of an SNL future for him.
MALVEAUX: Exactly.
BASH: He wouldn't -- he wouldn't go there with me. I have asked that question, and for Rob Portman, it's -- I'm told that he doesn't, you know, imitate Barack Obama per say, but he definitely really embodies him with regard to the kind of -- the way he talks, the kind of things that he would say, the phrase of a sentence or two, and, of course, how he feels about policies. He said, you know, maybe it's a little bit scary that I have -- that I have -- that I have come to know the other side's policies so well. But he also said it has prepared him and made him a better legislator, because he actually has had to really own the positions and policies of the --
MALVEAUX: Sure.
BASH: -- other side so many times.
MALVEAUX: Sure. Dana, thank you. It's going to be fascinating tonight. Good to talk to you, as always.
BASH: You, too.
MALVEAUX: The debate is going to focus on domestic policy only. Only half the time is going to be dedicated to the economy. There is going to be also a segment on health care as well. Another on the role of government and one on governing leadership and style. So, the first presidential debate is 2012 tonight. Watch it here on CNN starting at 7:00 p.m. Eastern.
Here is what we're working on for this hour.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MICHELLE OBAMA, FIRST LADY: I do tell him to have fun and relax and just be himself.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MALVEAUX (voice-over): The First Lady and Ann Romney tell us how they're going to help their husbands through tonight's debate.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANN ROMNEY: He will find me in the audience to see was that good? Was that OK?
GLORIA BORGER, CNN CHIEF POLITICAL ANALYST: So, what do you do?
A. ROMNEY: Good. Good.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MALVEAUX: And if you are keeping score in the debate, we'll tell you five key things to look for.
Plus, two moments in history when presidential debates made a real difference in who got elected.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MALVEAUX: So, what is the challenge they need to do to try and gain some traction in tonight's first big debate? Well, one area where Mitt Romney is facing a huge hurdle in overcoming the lead that President Obama has is with Latino voters. Take a look at this. CNN ORC poll of Latino voters choice for president, a whopping 70 percent chose President Obama compared to 26 percent for Mitt Romney. So, doing worse than John McCain did in 2008. McCain got 31 percent of the Latino vote. Worse than Bush. Bush got, back in 2004, 44 percent of Latino votes.
So, Barbara Comstock, she's joining us live from Denver, one of Romney's senior advisors and co-chair of his effort in Virginia. Tonight's debate, first of all, it's on domestic policy, but how does Mitt Romney -- how does he appeal more to Latino voters? Because, clearly, even Colorado, he's got to get at least a quarter to a third to make some real inroads there.
BARBARA COMSTOCK, SENIOR ADVISOR, MITT ROMNEY CAMPAIGN: Sure. I think the way he appeals to Latino voters and women voters and all voters is he is going to focus on an optimistic vision of how we can truly be better off over the next four years with an economy that really makes -- in a policy and in a strategy that puts jobs first. We've seen that we aren't better off after four years of the Obama economy. It's not working. The stimulus failed. The health care is -- bill is now increasing our premiums.
You just have a report that I believe you all and others have reported on today that shows that 27 million Americans will still be uninsured even with the trillions and trillions of dollars of costs in Obama care. Plus, more people will be out of work because of the small business tax increases from Obama care. So, what Mitt Romney is going to talk about is appeal to how we can do so much better. We need to invest in small businesses. And Latinos and women and, you know, people who are coming to this country often are starting small businesses, and that's -- we can't be putting new taxes on those small businesses, and we need to have new health care plans --
MALVEAUX: Is he -- is he going to get more --
COMSTOCK: And it will also help --
MALVEAUX: I'm sorry.
COMSTOCK: (INAUDIBLE.)
MALVEAUX: Is he going to be more specific on what type of loopholes he is talking about, exemptions, to get rid of to offset these tax cuts that he is proposed to grow the economy. Is he going to provide more specifics?
COMSTOCK: Sure, I think you will see that tonight but I think you will also see that when president Romney works on the economy and on health care issues, he's going to do it in an open and transparent way. They've already said they want to have Congress and everybody involved. And when Governor Romney was governor in Massachusetts, he worked with an 85 percent legislator -- legislature and was able to cut taxes over a dozen times while he was cutting spending, but he did it collaboratively, openly, and with his administration that was -- half women were in the cabinets. So, I think he is going to have a dynamic and open policy where he is going to work with everybody on getting those specifics that we're all collectively involved in it.
MALVEAUX: I'm sure --
COMSTOCK: You saw the health care bill -- well, the health care bill was done in secret and that's why it's still so unpopular to this day. And you already have people like Senator Bayh who voted for the bill is now saying how terrible the medical devices tax is because it's going to hurt us being able --
MALVEAUX: OK.
COMSTOCK: -- to develop new medical devices to cure -- you know, to cure people.
MALVEAUX: I want to get in here if I can.
COMSTOCK: So, we need to have a plan that works.
MALVEAUX: OK. I'm sure that he is getting a lot of advice from people about how he should perform.
COMSTOCK: Sure.
MALVEAUX: One of the people we talked to was Republican strategist Ana Navarro about what he need to do and what he needs to avoid and here's what she told us just this last hour.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
ANA NAVARRO, REPUBLICAN STRATEGIST: I would say to him, Mitt, don't try to be funny. You're not funny. You're at your best when you are serious. Do not sing. Go out there, be authentic, be genuine. Now, everybody is going to be looking for singers, because somebody in his campaign talked about him prepping singers. So, if you are going to deliver a singer, you better make sure it come out looking genuine, authentic, and spontaneous, and I think he does need to get specific, and he needs to also smile, be likable. He's got a likability gap. You know, he is -- he can be likable. Go and be on, and no "oops" moment.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MALVEAUX: All right. She pretty much covers it all. Barbara, do you agree?
COMSTOCK: Well, listen, I think you're going to see Mitt Romney talk about a very optimistic future in a very, you know, detailed way and in a way that people will understand. This is somebody who has succeeded at everything he's done in his career, and he has a passion for turning around this economy and putting the unemployed 23 million people back to work and making sure we have policies that lift up everybody. We want to raise everybody's income. I mean, that's the American story. I mean, we've --
MALVEAUX: OK.
COMSTOCK: -- the middle class has been buried over the past four years, but we need a vibrant middle class. You know, Joe Biden was right, but we have to have a vibrant middle class, --
MALVEAUX: OK, we're going to have --
COMSTOCK: -- and that's what Mitt Romney has the prescription and knows how to do.
MALVEAUX: All right. We're going to have to leave it there. Barbara Comstock, thank you so much for joining us, we appreciate it.
Remember this moment?
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JENNIFER GRANHOLM, FORMER GOVERNOR, OHIO: In Ohio, 150,000 jobs, and in the great state of Michigan, 211,000 good-paying American jobs.
(END VIDEO CLIP) MALVEAUX: Of course, that's Jennifer Granholm, former Michigan governor rocking the crowd at the Democratic national convention. She is rocking it, again, and is going to talk about how she thinks tonight's debate is going to pan out. We're going to talk to her live this hour.
Also, some Republican sources are dredging up video they say is exclusive of President Obama speaking to ministers five years ago, praising his pastor at the time. Our local political unit found it's neither exclusive nor new. We're going to see what all the fuss is about.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MALVEAUX: Well, just hours to go until the showdown between President Obama and Mitt Romney. We're talking debate prep. And, of course, want to know what the candidates -- what they've been doing to get ready for tonight's face-off. Former Michigan Governor Jennifer Granholm, she's joining us from New York, where she hosts "The Room" on Current TV.
Governor, good to see you. Jennifer -- I guess I don't know exactly what --
JENNIFER GRANHOLM, HOST, "THE ROOM" ON CURRENT TV: Call me Jennifer, Suzanne. For sure, call me Jennifer.
MALVEAUX: All right, I'll call you Jennifer.
You were the stand-in for Sarah Palin when Joe Biden was prepping back in 2008.
GRANHOLM: Yes.
MALVEAUX: Tell us -- because we're all wondering what's going on behind the scenes -- how important is it this prepping for debate now?
GRANHOLM: Oh, it's huge. I mean you can look at books and study policy papers all you want. There is no substitute for standing behind a podium and having everything but the kitchen sink thrown at you and having you formulate phrases and words to make sure that you communicate. There's no substitute. And no one loves to do it. No one wants to do it. Although I must say, Joe Biden was very game in 2008 to do it.
MALVEAUX: Tell us what it looks like. Who's actually in the room? I mean this is a pretty secretive process.
GRANHOLM: Yes. I mean, I don't know what they're doing this year, but I can tell you in 2008 they have the policy people there. You remember that Biden and Obama were just sort of marrying as a team, and so we had some Obama people, some Biden people in the room. There are debate -- you know, the folks who know the issues extremely well. And the room itself is set up -- the stage exactly like the debate will be, so when you do the mock debates, you're really in character. You don't -- you do the timing of the debates, the format exactly the same, so that you're comfortable with that kind of format. So it is really a very serious effort and it can be a lot of fun, though, too, I must say.
MALVEAUX: I read somewhere you wore the red dress and the glasses to kind of impersonate Sarah Palin.
GRANHOLM: I did.
MALVEAUX: John Kerry --
GRANHOLM: I did the whole thing. Yes, for sure.
MALVEAUX: You did?
GRANHOLM: You betcha. I got it.
MALVEAUX: Oh, you -- even (INAUDIBLE). OK, that's a pretty good impersonation.
Senator John Kerry, he's the stand-in for Mitt Romney this go around. What is he doing with the President? I assume that there's a lot of tough policy questions. Are they practicing zingers as well? How are they actually doing that?
GRANHOLM: You know, I'm not sure how it's working out for them, but I can tell you what I would do or what normally is done. But I think that the challenge in a debate is making sure that you're on offense as often as you can. Now, you're going to take incoming scuds and you're going to have to respond to those and pivot. So the challenge in debate practice is, how can you get to talking about what you want to talk about, rather than chasing a rabbit down the hole.
If you can imagine, Suzanne, when you're standing behind a podium and somebody's attacking you, whether it's on your -- about something personal or about a policy or they're lying about you, you want, with every fiber of your being, to attack back or to respond. The question is, you only have so much real estate, and you have to pick your battles because you want to make sure you make your offensive case as well. And then you want to throw your opponent off by attacking him. So it's all three of those that are going on. And that's really what a lot of the practice behind the scenes in a debate is going to be about.
MALVEAUX: Does the practice end up going to the very end, or is there a certain cut-off point where it's no longer really advantageous or beneficial to do this kind of back and forth?
GRANHOLM: You know, you want to get as much of it in as you possibly can. Obviously, there's a sort of psychic space that the candidate needs to be able to get in their game. But, honestly, you want to go as long. I don't know if they would be doing it, you know, up to the very last minute today, because you need to have some downtime, but you want to get as many moments as you possibly can. Especially, like, for the President. He's out doing presidential stuff. So he hasn't had the chance to, you know, get in a room and stand behind a podium and respond in that way. He needs every bit of that. And especially given the format, he wants to be able to practice shortening answers, pivoting, attacking. That -- all that stuff is really important. MALVEAUX: All right, let's talk about your big moment. The national -- Democratic National Convention. I was there. The audience went crazy, bananas, over your speech.
GRANHOLM: They were crazy.
MALVEAUX: Let's play a little bit of that moment.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
GRANHOLM: All across America. Autos are back. Manufacturing is rebounding. Why? You know what I'm saying.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MALVEAUX: All right. So, Jennifer, I was there --
GRANHOLM: It was wild, Suzanne. It was just so wild.
MALVEAUX: I mean, I don't even think the President got that kind of applause. And the Twitter-verse went crazy. I don't know if you even realized what was going on at the time. But while you were speaking, one of the tweets -- and I had to retweet it. It said, "I'll have what she's having." What was that?
GRANHOLM: I would not know. I did not have any Red Bull. I was not -- I didn't have any, you know, medication. I was high on democracy. But I can tell you that the crowd -- it was such a surprise because normally -- you've been to these conventions.
MALVEAUX: Yes.
GRANHOLM: You speak and the crowd's out there milling about and the people in the back tell you, don't worry, they won't pay attention to you, just talk to the people at home. So I sort of expected that that's what would happen. And when they started to have a sort of call and response, it was -- and they tell you, because we were really late, you have to keep going, keep going keep going because you don't want to take any time. So I had to start yelling over the crowd. And at one point, which you just showed, they were so loud, I had to stop. And they started chanting "USA." Anyway, it was a -- it was a hoot, I'll just say that.
MALVEAUX: Yes, it was. It was amazing to actually feel the energy in that room at the time.
I want to bring it home to Michigan if we can to wrap this up. Mitt Romney, of course, born in Michigan, his father was governor of Michigan, and his mother ran for the U.S. Senate. Now this is a state that is very competitive, but he is losing Michigan. The latest polls show that he's actually trailing Obama. Obama's 49, he's 46 percent in that state. But that's still pretty -- that's a very small margin there when you think about the fact that he didn't even support the auto bailout. Why so competitive, your former state of Michigan?
GRANHOLM: Well, I mean, he -- I -- listen, he's going to lose Michigan, and he's going to lose Michigan because he stabbed us in the back when we were on our knees. And he continues to do it. So Michigan, though, is a purplish state. When I was elect as a Democrat, I had a Republican house, Republican senate, Republican supreme court, Republican attorney general. So it's not a -- it's not a Democratic state necessarily. It is, you know, a state that could go either way. But he's going to lose because he really hurt us by taking out that op-ed that said "let Detroit go bankrupt." It's not going to be forgotten.
MALVEAUX: All right. We're going to leave it there. Jennifer Granholm, good to see you, as always.
GRANHOLM: Great to see you too, Suzanne. Thank you.
MALVEAUX: Thank you.
Some conservative media outlets are behind a campaign of what they're calling a message mystery here. They're pointing to a speech made by Senator Barack Obama, at the time, five times a year ago. They say it shows the President's personal opinions about race in the Katrina aftermath. And they say that nobody has even seen it before. But here's the speech they're talking about. Want to take a look at it. It is June of 2007. Then Senator Barack Obama speaking at the University of Virginia. Looks like, of course, it was recorded at the TV station, and that TV station, a CNN affiliate, and CNN covered a lot of the networks covered, as a matter of fact. It was not recently dug up, and it is not new. Joe Johns is watching the story very closely from Washington.
And, Joe, first of all, in covering the candidate, I know it's not new. I mean, we all saw this speech. We covered it. And we covered the whole issue of Reverend Wright very extensively with the President and even with the first lady in putting many questions to them about this. What's the fuss?
JOE JOHNS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, Suzanne, you know and I know this is a political year. Tapes like this seem to come out of the woodwork close to an election. It could be a way to fire up conservatives ahead of an important debate, going into crunch time around the election. It could also be as simple as "The Daily Caller" discovering this tape after all this time, thinking they have an exclusive, running with it as soon as they saw it.
Either way, safe to say, yes, this is old news. The reason it gets attention from conservative is, there's really a school of thought out there that says the President has deeply held views on race and other issues he's never fully shared with the American people, but shape his policies behind the scenes.
For example, that's the premise of Dinesh D'Souza's movie out in theaters, "2016: Obama's America." Sort of a conservative doom's day scenario of a president's second term. It's made something like almost $30 million in theaters across the country. And according to "The Daily Caller," this tape and other things like it just provide more fodder for those ideas, Suzanne. MALVEAUX: I want to show, you know, obviously the event that was covered by our Wolf Blitzer. They -- we also had, as well, Mary Snow, the very same day, talking about it. Just play a quick clip here.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BLITZER (June 2007): Democratic presidential candidate Senator Barack Obama suggesting there's a disconnect and a serious disconnect in the African-American community, and he's invoking the memory of the deadly 1992 Los Angeles riots.
BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: These quiet riots that take place every day are born from the same place as the fires in destruction and the police decked out in riot gear and death. They happen when a sense of disconnect settles in and hope dissipates.
MARY SNOW, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Senator Obama told a conference of black ministers that Hurricane Katrina exposed some of those quiet riots.
OBAMA: This administration was color-blind in its incompetence, but -- but everyone here knows that the disaster and the poverty happened long before the hurricane hit.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MALVEAUX: All right. So, Joe, are they still saying that this wasn't covered by the media? I mean clearly it shows that our outlets, as well as many others, were.
JOHNS: Well, I checked "The Daily Caller" website just a little while ago, and it's still calling it exclusive. "The Caller" says on its website that no complete video of the Hampton speech was widely released, Suzanne. CNN did cover the speech extensively, especially the idea of the "quiet riot" remarks. There are transcripts of his prepared remarks, but CNN did not cover the shout-outs to Reverend Wright and other small nuggets that "The Daily Caller" and others thought were exclusive, Suzanne.
MALVEAUX: All right, Joe Johns. Thank you, Joe.
If you plan to keep score tonight during the debate, there are five things you should look out for. Here's one of them -- who makes the better case for improving the economy? Hear the rest of it up next.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MALVEAUX: Pivotal moment as both candidates will look to create them in Denver. So what are the things that could swing viewer opinion?
I want to bring in CNN contributor, John -- good to see you -- John Avlon.
Viewers, what should they be watching? Paul Steinhauser and Peter Hamby, both telling us their five things we have to look for. The first one, well, will one candidate appear more presidential? What do you think? JOHN AVLON, SENIOR POLITICAL COLUMNIST, THE DAILY BEAST & CNN CONTRIBUTOR: That's right. This is the ultimate test. Whether Mitt Romney is, standing next to President Obama, can convince the American people that they can envision him as president. And this is a delicate balancing act. It really affects how much candidates go on offense versus defense. The key is to be what might be called respectfully aggressive. To walk that line with -- so when you are trying to attack and make a point that you don't overreach. That's the key question of the American people's mind are, can this man, Mitt Romney, be president? How does he stand up next to a president on the stage? Of course, President Obama has a natural advantage in this because he is not running for president. He is president.
MALVEAUX: All right --
(CROSSTALK)
AVLON: But it is the key criteria, and campaigns shouldn't lose sight of that.
MALVEAUX: We know this is a debate that revolves around domestic policy here. The other question is, will Mitt Romney actually try to bring up Libya into the debate because they've been so critical on the President? They think perhaps this is a weakness.
AVLON: It absolutely is. Polls show it. We're almost at the one- month mark since the attack on our Benghazi consulate, and the ambassador's killers haven't been brought to justice. The Romney campaign will be trying to decide how they can bring this very powerful breaking-news issue into a debate that's supposed to be set aside exclusively for domestic affairs. I don't think they'll pass it up and stand on ceremony because there is a growing investigation. Members of Congress are going to be looking into this, in what might be called a Benghazi backlash. The question is how they will try to insert Libya foreign policy into a domestic policy debate.
MALVEAUX: It's supposed to break all kinds of records. Maybe 50 million people will be watching tonight. A lot of those people unemployed, very frustrated with their own lives. The other question, of course, who will make the better case on improving the economy?
AVLON: That's right. Economy is issue number one, as you well know, Suzanne. And President Obama has been able to make up some gains against Mitt Romney on this issue.
Here's the real question. Can they appeal to those middle class voters that both folks are fighting over? Not make the debate about themselves, but about who can best solve their problems. Mitt Romney just needs to make the case that he can do better than the President. The president will be trying to frame that debate as do you want a return to Bush-era policy that is got us into the mess?
Both candidates need to be aware that they're not simply attacking the other guy, but proposing new plans, giving those undecided swing voters at home, particularly members that squeeze middle class, a reason to believe that the future will be better if their plans are implemented over the next few years.
MALVEAUX: And, John, this seems to be a real weakness for Mitt Romney here. And this is obviously the issue of Latinos and women. But is the President going to widen his lead with women and Latinos, and will Mitt Romney make up any difference there?
AVLON: Mitt Romney has got to make inroads here because the gender gap and the Latino gap are huge, and they have been growing, according to CNN polls and many other polls. Mitt Romney has tried to pivot on some issues, such as the Dream Act, in an attempt to appeal to Latinos. A significant policy shift, but the Republican Party can't simply win with white guys. They need to reach out to women and Latinos. That is an obligation, especially in a state like Colorado, which has an increasing Latino population.
MALVEAUX: Then, finally, the zingers. That's it is things that people actually remember, but will it help or could it backfire?
AVLON: Well, it's the art of a sound bite. And, of course, it's one of the things that made Ronald Reagan such an effective debater. Lines like, "There you go again," which really defanged Jimmy Carter in that 1980 race. Mitt Romney's team leaked that they were practicing some zingers, but humor doesn't often work when it's too practiced. So when you set the bar that people are going to be looking for those zingers, which is sort of an awful word, by the way, from Mitt Romney --
(LAUGHTER)
-- people really will be analyzing and focusing maybe disproportionately on that. The president's team, being careful to say that they're not focused on zingers or sound bites, but they want to focus on the substance. People remember the sounds bites, but you can't put style over substance in a presidential debate.
MALVEAUX: Let's see what people recall tomorrow. It's going to be fascinating to watch.
Thanks, John. Good to see you.
AVLON: It is.
MALVEAUX: We'll be watching for those five things.
The wives of the candidates are telling CNN how they plan to support their husbands. Hear the unusual things Ann Romney says her husband does during every debate.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MALVEAUX: All eye on President Obama and Mitt Romney as they go face- to-face for the first time. Perhaps nobody will be watching more closely than their better halves. The candidate's wives, Michelle Obama and Ann Romney, you're going to hear from both of them. Both have been talking to CNN, and want to focus, first of all, on the first lady. Michelle Obama speaking with our own Jessica Yellin.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
M. OBAMA: I get so nervous at these debates. I'm like one of those parents watching their kid on the balance beam. You're just standing there just trying not to, you know, have any expression at all.
JESSICA YELLIN, CNN CHIEF WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: I've read that before a speech you tell him, have fun. But it's a little bit different because it's more of a competition, more like a game of one- on-one. What's your motivational advice to him before THE --
(CROSSTALK)
M. OBAMA: You know, he doesn't need much advice. He has been doing this for quite some time, so he knows -- he knows the job. He has been doing it for quite some time. He is a very good debater. I do tell him to have fun and relax and just be himself because the truth is, if he is the Barack Obama the country has come to know and trust, he is going to do a great job.
YELLIN: Some of his aides have said one of his challenges is to keep the answers short.
(LAUGHTER)
I know that you have said that you critique his speeches afterwards.
M. OBAMA: Oh, no, I don't critique his speeches afterwards, actually. I give him -- you know, I give him my positive reinforcement.
YELLIN: Only positive?
M. OBAMA: Generally, yes, because he is a great speaker, you know? He is good at this, so.
YELLIN: Do you think he has any challenges going in?
M. OBAMA: You know, I haven't really -- you know, I would have to think about that afterwards, but going into it, I think he will do his best.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MALVEAUX: So now to the woman that would like to be first lady. Ann Romney spoke very candidly and emotionally with our Gloria Borger. The couple has been married for 43 years. Let's listen in.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
A. ROMNEY: I feel like that's my role for mitt, especially when he is going through such a difficult time, I'm there for him. We're there for each other emotionally all the time. In the last 20 debates that we did in the primary, I felt that was my most important role.
BORGER: How do you do that?
A. ROMNEY: You know, it's a cute thing that he does. Almost after every answer, he finds me in the audience. As soon as he gets on stage, the first thing he does is he takes off his watch and puts it on the podium.
(LAUGHTER)
But then he writes dad on a piece of paper. And that's amazing because he loves his dad, respects his dad, doesn't want to do anything that would not make his father proud. And just a reminder that, yes, I'm here, but dad, I love and respect who you are, what you have taught me, what kind of a person you are, and I'm going to honor that, and so I love the fact that Mitt does that. He writes that, and then he looks in the audience and finds me. He has to find where I am. He just needs just that connection. And almost after every answer that he gives, he will find me in the audience to see, was that good, was that OK?
BORGER: What do you do?
A. ROMNEY: Good. Good.
BORGER: What if you don't like what he did?
A. ROMNEY: Oh, oh. No, I don't --
(LAUGHTER)
Oh. I don't do any of that.
(LAUGHTER)
BORGER: So even on stage --
(CROSSTALK)
A. ROMNEY: There's an emotional connection that's happening between the two of us during the debate itself.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MALVEAUX: You can watch the entire interviews CNN did with Michelle Obama and Ann Romney during tonight's debate coverage starting at 7:00 eastern.
Debates, they can be the turning point for any candidate. We'll play some moments from past presidential elections that really made the difference.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MALVEAUX: Millions will watch tonight's first presidential debate, but it all comes down to the two men on stage. The public will perceive one as a winner. And as history has show, nuance can make all the difference. For example, take a look at this. 1960, John F. Kennedy and Richard Nixon squared off in the very first televised debate. While Nixon was known for being a fierce debater, on camera, he looked nervous, sweating profusely under the hot camera lights; whereas Kennedy looked calm, cool, collected. For those that watched the debate, Kennedy was the winner. But for those who listened to the debate on radio, they thought Nixon won. In the end, it was Kennedy who won the presidential race.
Well, of course, humor can also have an affect on the debates. 1980 Ronald Reagan repeatedly attacked by President Jimmy Carter for his stance on health care, but Reagan won fans with his response. Check it out.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
JIMMY CARTER, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Governor Reagan, again, typically is against such a proposal.
RONALD REAGAN, FORMER PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: Governor --
(LAUGHTER)
-- there you go again.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
MALVEAUX: All right. Want to bring in presidential historian, Douglas Brinkley.
Doug, good to see you, as always.
Let's just start, by seeing that moment, how significant was that between Carter and Reagan?
DOUGLAS BRINKLEY, PRESIDENTIAL HISTORIAN: Oh, it was big. If you go back to 1980, you have Jimmy Carter, the sitting president, but he had double-digit inflation, long gasoline lines, an Iran hostage crisis against him, but Reagan was seen as perhaps too right-wing, too extreme. Do you really want his finger on the nuclear button? At that debate, you had 10 percent of the public undecided, and it was in a dead heat, Reagan-Carter, while Reagan came out the winner. And it was done -- he won it because he seemed funny, made Carter seem a little bit like a square or something a little odd about him, flakey. So Reagan's personality started surging after the debate, and he went on to win one of the great landslides in U.S. presidential electoral history.
MALVEAUX: How important is personality?
BRINKLEY: I think it's everything. I mean, we take about the economy over and over again. People on CNN come on and say, it's all about the economy. We also have to say, do we want to live with Mitt Romney, for example, for the next four years, every day on the news. Are we comfortable with that person, our representative abroad, representing American values, of going to a crisis, a Katrina-like crisis and representing the American people, and we know what Barack Obama is like in that role. He has been at it now for almost four years. So it's really an audition for Mitt Romney in front of 50 million American people tonight.
MALVEAUX: Doug, you have watched many of these. You have analyzed many of these. You are calling this one historical, a historical event. Why?
BRINKLEY: Because we're -- it's in this weird cycle here where Barack Obama is a president with over 8 percent unemployment. Usually, that means you lose. But Mitt Romney has run a lackluster campaign, particularly in August and September. You are starting to see in the swing states Barack Obama pulling ahead in virtually all of the polls. And if he comes and gets any more momentum -- he has the momentum right now, Obama, and he doesn't get stopped at all, then it could be a break-out for the President.
On the other hand, Mitt Romney tonight is such an underdog. People don't think he isn't that fantastic of debater. They're underestimating him. He is quite good. He comes and seeming to have parody with the President and maybe get that zinger they're rehearsing so hard, get one in that works and hits this YouTube media cycle, playing over and over again, Romney could turn into the swing states and there will be a dead heat again. And we'll be marching into October with it just being a toss-up, nobody really knowing who is ahead.
MALVEAUX: Doug, how important is this? We'll be watching. Some people will be listening to it. You form your own opinion as it's happening here, but then there's all the post-debate spin that goes on afterwards. How influential is that in determining who actually won the debate?
BRINKLEY: I think it is gigantic, and it's not talked about enough. CNN tonight, people will be watching on CNN. Who have you guys chosen to make the first comments out of it, and what do those people say within about a minute or two can start making the viewers say, yes, that's right, he did screw up. What clip gets played the most in the first 20 minutes after the debate? A lot of people aren't junkies for politics and aren't staying up all night watching this. But they will watch the debate and then listen to maybe ten, 15, 20 minutes of banter afterwards. So you are going to have both the Democrats and Republicans just swamping reporters and hitting the Internet trying to get their word out in a nanosecond. In fact, Twitter now will have people, like David Axelrod or Romney's top people, will be Twittering within the middle of the debate, saying can you believe the President just screwed up or can you believe Romney said that?
MALVEAUX: Doug, we have to leave it there. It's going to be a fascinating evening. I'll be checking my Twitter as well and all of the spin that is going to be happening.
(LAUGHTER)
We're going to be fully engaged tonight.
Thanks again, Doug.
We'll have more after the break.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MALVEAUX: The deadline for American Airlines pilots to vote on whether to strike just passed about an hour ago, 1:00 eastern. We may not learn the results anytime soon. Why? CEO of the pilots union says he may keep the result a secret, use it as a bargaining chip in contract talks that are starting up again. American and its pilots have been at odds since a judge last month threw out the union contract. Since then, American says pilots have engaged in now a work slowdown that has forced a thousand flights to be canceled and delayed 12,000 more. The pilots, they deny the claim.
In Arizona, investigators are searching for the killer of a U.S. Border Patrol agent along the Mexican border. A second agent was also shot. He's expected to recover, however, and authorities haven't said whether the agents returned fire during that shootout. They also haven't named any suspects or even said whether any weapons were found at the scene. 30-year-old Nicholas Ivie, he was married with two children. He is the 14th border agent killed in the line of duty since 2008.
Large part of tonight's debate is going to be devoted to the economy, of course. And who is more equipped to turn it around. We'll look at some key stats to show how the economy is actually doing right now.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
MALVEAUX: The economy is one of most important issues for voters this fall. It will be front and center for the entire first half of tonight's presidential debate. How is the economy doing?
We're joined by Alison Kosik, New York Stock Exchange, to talk a little bit about this.
Alison, the candidates will be pressing each other on the whole issue of jobs. What does the picture look like for jobs?
ALISON KOSIK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: You know, with jobs, it is improving slowly, but the reality is it is just not great. We got another little sliver of information today from ADP. It said private-sector employment gained by 162,000 jobs in September. But this is just a clue of what to expect on Friday from the government jobs report. That's really the biggie, the report that counts. Not only does it factor in the private sector jobs, it counts government jobs, which actually have been shrinking. And the expectation is that the economy added 110,000 jobs in September. And, you know, that would be just be OK, because the reality is we have got a long way to go. In early 2009, the economy lost over 800,000 jobs a month. This, by the way, is the year that President Obama took office. So compared to that, 110,000 on Friday would be good. But over the past few years, the job market has been kind of stuck. We have only been adding enough jobs to keep up with population growth -- Suzanne?
MALVEAUX: Talk about housing here. We have seen some recent improvements. Do we think it is in full recovery mode?
KOSIK: Economists think it is. The housing recovery could be taking hold at this point. There was a "CNN Money" survey done that said nine out of 14 economists say that home prices are higher or will turn higher this year. Home prices have been going up over the past three months. We can put up a chart here to show you that the small increase -- if you can see it on the right side of the screen there -- it means prices have found the bottom. That's a good sign for the recovery to take hold in housing. Home sales are also higher. Home construction is rebounding. Mortgage rates are at record lows. All this stuff helps push along the housing recovery -- Suzanne?
MALVEAUX: So you've got improvement of jobs, a recovery in housing here. A lot of people, however, still suffering. How do you square that?
KOSIK: Yes, because, think about it, the economy is not back to normal. Look at growth. GDP growth in the second quarter of this year is at a measly 1.3 percent rate. That's a slowdown from the previous two quarters. It is expected to remain weak because you have the European debt crisis dragging. Europe is a huge trading partner of ours. That impacts our manufacturers.
An even bigger issue weighing on the U.S. is the fiscal cliff. And economists say we can go into a recession if the spending cuts and tax increases kick in all at once in January.
MALVEAUX: All right.
KOSIK: That kind of uncertainty is freezing businesses from doing any hiring -- Suzanne?
MALVEAUX: Alison Kosik, thank you.
CNN NEWSROOM continues now with Brooke Baldwin.
Hi, Brooke.
BROOKE BALDWIN, CNN ANCHOR: Hey, Suzanne. Thank you so much.
Hi, everyone. I'm Brooke Baldwin.
It's so exciting.
