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Romney in Florida; Wisconsin Local News Anchor Responds to Viewer Mail; Appearance and Celebrity; Families of Imprisoned People

Aired October 06, 2012 - 22:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

DON LEMON, CNN HOST: Hello, I'm Don Lemon. The stories you're talking about in just a moment. But first, we want to get you up to speed on the day's headlines.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MITT ROMNEY (R), PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: This is not just a race between two individuals or even two parties. It's a race to define what America is going to be over the coming decades. The president has his vision, the place he would take it. I have a different vision.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Mitt Romney, the Republican White House hopeful, firing up a friendly crowd in swing state Florida this evening. Team Romney's enjoying something of a post-debate bounce. His campaign announced today that contributions jumped more than $12 million since Wednesday's Obama/Romney debate in Denver.

President Obama was off to campaign trail today celebrating his 20th anniversary tonight with the first lady at the D.C. restaurant. He will campaign in California on Sunday.

We have new developments on that deadly meningitis outbreak to tell you about. The CDC says the death toll has risen to seven people, 64 people in nine states have contracted meningitis linked to steroid injections into their spines. The plant where the contaminated steroid has made has been voluntarily shut down.

There is no let up in Syria where the opposition says at least 105 people died in fighting today. This is Homs where activists say rebels battled government forces. Meantime, Turkey's military fired artillery into Syria today, retaliating for strikes from Syria.

Defense secretary Leon Panetta warns that civil war in Syria could become something much worse.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LEON PANETTA, DEFENSE SECRETARY: The fact that there are now exchanges of fire between these two countries raises additional concerns that this conflict could broaden.

(END VIDEO CLIP) LEMON: Gas prices in California jumped again overnight, drivers now paying an average of $4.61 a gallon with some parts of the state seeing closer to six bucks. Experts are blaming it to a series of problems in California with refineries coupled with and already low supply.

Here's what's we're working on tonight.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: TV anchor fights back.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: I am much more than a number on a scale.

LEMON: Going off on a viewer who called her fat and a bad example to young girls. Is he right?

Celebrities, local and beyond, even politicians. Are they obligated to be attractive and healthy role models? Plus-size model Emme has a lot to say about that, live.

Fat America. Our addiction to food rivals drugs. More than one-third of all adults are obese. An addiction doctor says it's high time for tough love.

BARACK OBAMA, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: The unemployment rate has fallen to its lowest level since I took office.

LEMON: That's the good news. Here's the bad. The president's debate performance numbers lower than the unemployment rate. Can he recover?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What's going on in here?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What do you think is going on in here?

LEMON: Get rid of prisons. That's what one filmmaker wants to do. Will her new movie make her case? She'll tell you.

Plus, a daredevil's latest shocking stunt. A dream fulfilled. An idol/diva showdown.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: All right, personae, perception, and the public eye. From actress politicians to news anchors and reporters, we are all accountable to you, the people we serve. And boy, do you let us know it.

Many of your comments via e-mail, twitter, phone calls, however you can sent them to us, they have constructive. Others are downright nasty. You criticize our clothes, our hair, what we say, how we say it.

But, in Jennifer Livingston's case, it was her weight. On viewer, his name Kenneth Krause, he e-mailed this. A Wisconsin news anchor telling her in part, surely you don't consider yourself a suitable example for this community's you people, girls in particular. Obesity is one of the worst choices a person can make and one of the most dangerous habits to maintain.

I leave you this note hoping you'll reconsider your responsibility as a local public personality and promote a healthy lifestyle. Well, just an example of the unsolicited jabs that we get, people in the public eye. Livingston delivered a searing four-minute on-air response to that e-mail, take a look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JENNIFER LIVINGSTON, NEWS TV ANCHOR: The truth is, I am overweight. You could call me fat. And yes, even obese on a doctor's chart. But to the person who wrote me that letter, do you think I don't know that? That your cruel words are pointing out something that I don't see?

You don't know me. You are not a friend of mine. You are not a part of my family and you have admitted that you don't watch this show. So you know nothing about me but what you see on the outside. And I am much more than a number on a scale.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: OK. Was she bullied? Or was she the bully? We'll get to that in a moment.

But first, let's tackle a couple of other issues. Joining me now to do that is psychologist Dr. Wendy Walsh and full-figure supermodel Emme. I said I'm surrounded by beautiful blonds, I feel like Charlie of "Charlie's angels."

(LAUGHTER)

LEMON: It is good to see you, ladies. Thank you both, for being here. So I want to throw this out there.

Wendy, I want to start with you. If you're a public figure and if you're in the public spotlight, do you have a responsibility when it comes to your appearance? Just the appearance.

DOCTOR WENDY WALSH, HUMAN BEHAVIOR SPECIALIST: No. I think you have a responsibility to be moral, to be ethical, and to be honest. I think as far as your appearance is concerned, I take exception with the viewer who called this a choice for obesity. No one chooses to be overweight.

EMME, SUPERMODEL: I agree.

WALSH: No one chooses to be obese. This is a very complicated cocktail of biology, environment, and psychology. And it's not simply a behavioral choice.

LEMON: OK. Let me play devil's advocate. And said, no one chooses to be overweight?

EMME: Absolutely not, or anorexic.

LEMON: Yes, OK. Buy, many people will say, well yes, you do, it is a choice. It's a lifestyle choices that you make and it's a food choices that you make.

Emme, you're very much in the public spotlight, what are your thoughts on this?

EMME: I definitely think that -- absolutely I agree with you, doctor, you cannot choose to be obese, you don't choose to be anorexic, it just seems to be that yes, people think you probably sit at home and you eat tons of food, you sit at home or don't eat anything at all, that's a choice.

It's beyond that. It's way beyond that. There's so many factors involved. I think that the issue here is that it was the straw that broke the camel's back with Jennifer. And I do believe that she has used this opportunity during the month of anti-bullying to step up. And her news director OK'd it and the station supported her to stand up and not name the individual that wrote the -- I guess it's a blog or letter to her. She actually directed the comments that she had to the person who wrote this. But it really was an extended, back off the fat girl, I am a great reporter, you don't see me being a fitness expert here, I'm not portraying myself as someone who does push-ups and sit-ups. I think there's a double standard also, that you don't see gentlemen who are in the news media get this kind of --

LEMON: We're going to talk about that, when it comes to age and everything. And since you bring that up, not just in the news media. Let's take New Jersey governor Chris Christie as an example of a figure who has been very publicly criticized about his figure, about his weight. The governor, he is very overweight, he knows it, he admits it, he's addressed this issue time and again, even discussing it with CNN's Piers Morgan, look.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

CHRIS CHRISTIE (R), GOVERNOR, NEW JERSEY: The thing I feel most guilty about, my weight.

PIERS MORGAN, CNN TV HOST, PIERS MORGAN TONIGHT SHOW: Really?

CHRISTIE: Yes. Because I'm really struggling. Been struggling for a long time with it. And I know that it would be better for my kids. If I got it more under control. And so, I do feel a sense of guilt at times about that.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: OK.

EMME: Wow. I've never heard him say that before, Don, ever.

LEMON: Listen. Can we take that down? Can we take that full-screen down, and I'll get to it in a second. But isn't he saying the same thing as this guy is saying? That she's not a role model for young girl.

WALSH: Different.

LEMON: He's saying, I'm not a role model for my kids.

WALSH: It's not about role model, it's about getting to be a parent and stay around for a long time, it's about health. But you know, something I want to say, Don, is that I don't think there's a population that's more discriminated against than people who are overweight. And kudos to this anchor's news director and general manager for keeping her on the air. Because you know they could have come up with "another reason" to let her go.

EMME: And they do. And do.

WALSH: Plenty of people -- they do. There are plenty of people who have the same psychological issues who may homed on, and you don't see them, addicted to internet porn, shooting heroin, addicted to gambling, doing all kinds of things to assuage their anxiety or depression but they don't have to walk it every day on television or the workplace. So, kudos to her.

LEMON: I'm going to let you get in, Emme. But I want to say, if someone is on television or a politician, was an alcoholic or had an addiction issue, alcohol or drugs --

EMME: There are a lot of the them.

LEMON: And they were on television or showed it in the public, wouldn't that person, shouldn't that person, be criticized? Wouldn't we get help? Say, this person needs to stop that addiction now and get help? What's wrong with saying, this person needs to stop an addiction to food or bad lifestyle choices and get help?

EMME: I got to tell you --

LEMON: Go ahead, Emme.

EMME: I'm going to jump in really quickly here. Because this is such a big box of nuts. Because it's so much more than just one individual, obviously.

LEMON: Right.

EMME: There is -- you go down this road with Jennifer being the one that has to get off-air because she's obese. That is the wrong angle here. There's three body types. We as a nation need to understand what is out there. There is -- there are people that are larger than others. We have to look at her as a very good reporter. She's won Emme awards, and she's done very well in the community. She's an upstanding citizen. She loves her family. She needs to take the personal step back and think, you know, what am I doing for myself? Will I be around, as the doctor has said, for my children? I just don't -- I just don't think that it's the way to take -- if someone's going to be drunk on-air, yes, absolutely.

WALSH: Right.

EMME: There's totally two different things --

LEMON: Hold on, Wendy. I want to read this and then you can respond. I want to red you the op-ed from "the Washington Post" in this 2011 talking about Chris Christie, problems with weight. This is a quote. "Cease being a private matter when he stepped into the public arena and it's not something you can fail to notice." And then it goes on to say, "furthermore, the op-ed, it was in the "Washington Post," a paper seen internationally, even at one point the author said he wanted to offer advice to governor Christie, eat a salad and take a walk."

OK. So governor Christie --

EMME: That's glib. That's so glib, Don.

LEMON: He uses his platform --

WALSH: If only it were that simple.

LEMON: He didn't accuse anyone of bullying him.

WALSH: I know but --

LEMON: He's the governor, health care and obesity are important issues, overweight people tax the system much like smokers, is that irresponsibility, Wendy?

WALSH: The fact that he came out and became vulnerable is really what it's about and would have earned him those votes. Look at Obama telling America, I'm going to quit smoking for you, I'm going to work for it. And Michelle saying, watch him, let me know how he's doing, right?

So I think the point is, we all have foibles. But when you talk about, you asked earlier about a politician potentially using drugs and alcohol. Those kinds of chemicals affect their judgment and their decision-making ability when they have to make public policy, Don.

EMME: Good point.

WALSH: That's a little different than someone reading the news and being judged for what she looks like, instead of how she thinks and what she does.

LEMON: Go ahead, Emme.

EMME: Absolutely, I agree with you, doctor. I think we have to take a look at this. The people who are larger in this country, it is the last laugh. It is the joke that's acceptable. It is truly -- there are children that are committing suicide, that are being home- schooled, because of their obesity.

It is the last frontier of absolute worst judgment of parties saying, you know what, that kid's fat. They speak out loud in public places. I've been to restaurants already I've seen parents move their family from places where they're eating because the family was larger. It almost was like there was a cootie effect that might rub off on them. So, this is really a much bigger, bigger issue.

WALSH: Emme, how can we blame the individual when we're talking about a culture full of processed food where some people live in food deserts and they can't I'm get vegetables?

LEMON: OK. That is another issue and we are going to tackle that issue a little bit later on in the show when we talk about America. And quite frankly, we call it fat America because one-third of adults in the U.S. are considered to be obese.

EMME: We need to get better food.

LEMON: So ladies, let me ask you this question. Was this anchor bullied? Or was she the bully? I want to hear your answers. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: All right. So, we have been talking about the incident involving Wisconsin news anchor Jennifer Livingston. She received a critique about her weight from a viewer. His name is Kenneth Krause. Krause said, she had a responsibility as a local public personality to promote a healthy lifestyle. Livingston gave a scathing four minute on-air response.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LIVINGSTON: To the person who wrote me that letter, do you think I don't know that? That your cruel words are pointing out something that I don't see? You don't know me. You are not a friend of mine. You are not a part of my family and you have admitted that you don't watch this show. So you know nothing about me but what you see on the outside. And I am much more than a number on a scale.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: OK, a lot of you are weighing in on this. I'm checking my twitter. A lot of you have comments for me. And Emme and Doctor Wendy, a lot of people don't know that I have to play devil easily advocate and ask the questions --

WALSH: I know, you love all people, Don.

EMME: Get us going, Don.

LEMON: Don't you know being overweight isn't about sitting around and waiting? I know that, but I have to ask the question. So, I'm going to ask this question tonight. Who's the real bully here? Krause for writing the e-mail, or Livingston for her four-minute on-air response, or neither of them?

WALSH: Neither of them.

LEMON: Emme, I will start with you.

EMME: I really don't think, neither. I think one end, Mr. Krause is voicing his opinion. He might have too much time on his hands, and he might have issues of his own with what is acceptable or what is out there, taking the potshot at her personally about her own kids and children and being a role model.

I don't think that Jennifer was being a bully in any way. And in fact, I didn't think that her rhetoric was scathing. I think her rhetoric was passionate. I think it was absolutely on-mark. And I do believe she was speaking not only for just herself, but I think that she had a collective spirit of what was happening in the country.

LEMON: OK, listen. I've heard people talking about this story, and they say, you know what? What he said wasn't that bad, it wasn't like he called her some nasty name. They didn't think it warranted a four- minute response on television.

And Wendy, I know -- listen, she has the bully pulpit, she's the one on television, she really has the power. You don't think that this interaction --

WALSH: Perfect timing.

LEMON: -- should be called bullying? In fact, you said calling it bullying is insane. Why Wendy?

WALSH: Well, I think calling it bullying is a little bit insane because we loosely use this term now because it's hip in our pop psych culture. The truth is these were two human beings communicating with each other and they each had a different method of communication.

He had e-mail. He could blog and put it on the internet so the world could see it. She had her television microphone and camera. These were two adults communicating opinions.

Hey, Don. Remember what we talked about last week? Sometimes when you feel something negative about somebody else, it's something you feel about yourself. So I'm wondering what this guy doesn't like about himself, as far as a role model is concerned. But this isn't bullying, this is communication, and it's bringing an issue up.

LEMON: So, Krause has now apologized, as he did on "Good Morning America." Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE REPORTER: Wish you would have handled things differently?

KENNETH KRAUSE, WROTE EMAIL TO NEWS ANCHOR: No, like I say, it's possible that I could have revised a few things. And like I said, I never meant to hurt Jennifer in any way. If she is truly hurt, I do apologize for that.

(END VIDEO CLIP) LEMON: Here's what he also told ABC news as my former co-working Alex (INAUDIBLE). He said, "calling me a bad role model for our community that I've worked at for 15 years and especially for young girls, when I have three girls, was a low blow and I thought it was uncalled for and I wanted to call him out." That's what she said.

OK, so listen. Emme, just because she wanted to call him out on it, does it mean that she should have used the air, on-air, to do so for four minutes? Maybe she could have said something, to the guy you wrote me, you're a jerk, and moved on. Do you think she should have used the air, Emme?

EMME: There is -- I think that there was a line as a reporter that was crossed. However, it was perfect timing with the culture of being as hot and as really urgent for body culture, the obesity situation, how stereotypes really hurt, words hurt. And I think it was the last straw. I think it was this particular letter motivated her. Because I know, we all get a lot of mail about hair, about makeup, about what we said, about anything. I mean, it's really insane.

WALSH: Everything.

EMME: And hit delete, hit delete, you don't listen. End of the day you're like, oh my God. But I do think -- I do think that it was perfect timing for a conversation like this to come out.

LEMON: OK, Emme, you have lots more time because you're going to stick around and talk about what we've called here fat America, right? About obesity in America. You're going to talk more about that.

Wendy, this is it for you. Until we see you next time. But you know what, Wendy? We can go through --

WALSH: Pleasure.

LEMON: I can go through my twitter feed, e-mail, and just get nasty comments.

WALSH: Oh, yes. Every time I leave your show, Don, I get -- the good news is that we also get a lot of love e-mail and a lot of love tweets and those are fabulous to get.

EMME: Absolutely.

WALSH: We did get awful negative ones too.

LEMON: And here's the best news. We can block them. And they don't even know it. Sometimes they don't even get through, they go in my spam thing, wow, glad I never saw that. Thank you.

WALSH: Thank you, take care.

LEMON: And next --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

OBAMA: The unemployment rate has fallen to its lowest level since I took office.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: That's the good news. Here's the bad. The president's debate performance numbers, lower than the unemployment rate. Can he recover?

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: OK, an upbeat jobs report may shake up the presidential race. The unemployment rate fell below eight percent for the first time since January 2009. And that's when President Obama took office.

Some say it is a huge boost for the president's campaign. On the flip side, Republicans are downplaying the report's significance saying it doesn't reflect the big picture or unemployed people who got discouraged and stopped looking for work. Some of them are staying, it's smoke and mirrors with the number. The Obama campaign is manipulating the numbers. On and on.

I want to bring in Rachel Smolkin, the White House editor for "Politico."

OK. You've seen all of this. I saw people on, when those numbers came out, on television the other morning, Friday morning, there's no way this is right, what's going on, oh my God, the world is going to end!

So Rachel, how do we measure the political impact of the jobs reports on the presidential race? Is this the October surprise that we had been waiting for or not a big deal?

RACHEL SMOLKIN, WHITE HOUSE EDITOR, POLITICO: Somewhere in between the two. I would not go so far as to call it the October surprise. These numbers are notoriously volatile. One good month can be followed by a bad month and the next month is four days before the presidential election.

But this was a very good end to a bad week for the president. Really the best possible end that President Obama could have hoped for. Mitt Romney came out so strong in that debate, President Obama lackluster. He got called rusty. Detached. Not the words he was looking for.

LEMON: Hold that thought, we're going to talk about that. I want to go back to something, four days before the presidential election is when the next jobs report is going to come out. If they go down even further? What does that mean if.

SMOLKIN: It could go down. It could also go back up.

LEMON: Right.

SMOLKIN: This has been an economic recovery that's been a difficult one. The administration says that as well. This was a great jobs report for the president. It broke down past that eight percent mark that Mitt Romney's been hitting so hard in this campaign.

LEMON: You can imagine --

SMOLKIN: So, this is a great day for the president.

LEMON: You can imagine the White House and probably the campaign in Chicago, they were doing somersaults. But, this is make people now say, what debate? Because you said, you know, by most people's accounts, the president was awful, horrible. That's what everyone says, even ardent Obama supporters. Does this cancel out his performance at all, what debate, the jobs are getting better?

SMOLKIN: Americans have very short memories. I don't think their memories are quite that short. This debate was only a few days ago. We have two more presidential debates to come and a VP debate next week. No, I do not think it erases the debate. But it helps counter that narrative. The emerging narrative after the debate was one of Mitt Romney picking up momentum, a race that the president seemed to be somewhat pulling ahead, maybe even pulling away in a couple of key swing states, now seems very much up in the air. So these numbers help that narrative at least a little, maybe put it on pause a bit, and put the pressure on Joe Biden coming out next week to turn things around for the president.

LEMON: You just answered my next question. So, the other question after that, is this psychological? This -- you know, the unemployment rate going down? Or is it, I don't know, does it really make that much of a difference? Psychological or more of considered just a milestone? What is it?

SMOLKIN: It's definitely psychological. It's also a good job report. It's a good sign that the country is beginning to heal. As I said, these numbers can go up and down. So one month does not make --

LEMON: And they could revise it?

SMOLKIN: The administration said -- the administration was very clear in saying this was a good report but they were being cautious, they want to continue the progress. So they weren't pulling out the confetti on Friday.

LEMON: Yes, as you know, the two previous jobs reports were revised. That's what helped this job report. So it could be revised for the next jobs report. So who knows. All right, thank you, Rachel. Great conversation.

SMOLKIN: Thank you.

LEMON: Up next --

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Fat America. Our addiction to food rivals drugs. More than one-third of all adults are obese. An addiction doctor says it's high time for tough love.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: Tonight, we are talking about Jennifer Livingston. He is the Wisconsin local news anchor who took to the air to call out a viewer who criticize her weight. She called him a bully and she disputed his opinion that obesity was in his words one of the worst choices a person could make.

Our conversation ignite about public image, self-perception and that hinges on our size and our shape. The way we look. And the perfect guy to talk about this, Dr. Marc Kern. He is a clinical psychologist and addiction specialist. He is in Los Angeles tonight.

Doctor, thank you for joining us. You treat people who are addicted to alcohol, hard drugs, tobacco, gambling, pornography. Does overeating belong on the list of things people are really addicted to?

DOCTOR MARC KERN, CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST, ADDICTION SPECIALIST: Absolutely. More than ever. In fact, new research seems to suggest we can soon have a new diagnosis of food addiction and it will go right along with the same properties, principles, that you see with alcohol, drugs, cocaine, and very much so. Many of the causes of overweight, obesity, are very, very similar with legal, illegal, and now food.

LEMON: Yes. So here's the thing, then. This anchor said, you know, she has said once it was a medical problem, I think she said it was a thyroid problem. And so, you know, that's an issue on its own. But there are very few people who actually have thyroid problems. Most times in the medical community believe there is an excuse.

So, but she says, it's part of the problem and that is a legitimate issue. But there are people who are addicted to food and there are people who are addicted to bad lifestyle choices and we don't -- why do we treat them differently than someone who's addicted to alcohol, someone who's addicted to drug, people who are addicted to pornography? Isn't an addiction, an addiction, an addiction? Is this a wakeup call for us?

KERN: Well, I think it could be. I don't think it's exactly the same. I mean, the reality is food is a natural part of our daily life and our society. But, you know, the number of people with obesity problems has increased every single decade.

But, you know, that's not all our fault. I mean, the fast food industry and portion sizes have changed. There's often a lot more shame about food and appearance. And I'm not here to really talk about appearance or even self-esteem. I'm talking about the phenomenon of choosing the wrong thing for you, eating too much, eating too often, gaining euphoria, seeking euphoria relief from food.

LEMON: And Emme, I want to bring Emme back in. Emme is -- what do you like to be called? Somebody say, plus size model. Is it full- figured model, right, that you like to be called?

EMME: Curvy model, woman, you know.

LEMON: Has anyone ever tried to cure you or intervene on your life with the goal of changing your appearance?

EMME: No. Because I was an athlete and I just am a curvy girl that loves to do triathlons. And I've always kept myself in shape but I would never get rid of my wiggle. If I start to jiggle, that's when I start training a little bit more. But that's just because I know what I like. I was asked to lose weight at the very beginning. You know.

LEMON: And you embraced it. I remember your story very clearly. You embraced it, you were one of the first full-figured models, curvy model. But, do you think, you have heard what the doctor said. I'm sure you've seen some of the research, you're no stranger to this. Food is an addiction for a lot of people and that causes them to be obese.

EMME: Absolutely. It is an addiction. And it's a very, very big problem. When I work with the national eating disorders association, NEDA, you know, it's a big -- it's a hard place to try and blame one group, whether it's your parents, whether it's your society, whether it's your media, because it's a conglomerate, right, doctor, of everything.

KERN: Absolutely, absolutely.

EMME: It really comes down to whether the coping mechanisms for an individual are intact, or they really have the tools -- the emotional toolbox to be able to verbal it's what's going on in their life, to absolutely try and assimilate the stresses in life.

And sometimes we go out for a run. Sometimes we sit and meditate. Sometimes we eat. And then we don't know how to stop. Or sometimes we do other things that are really not healthy for us. But it's really about how we accept ourselves. And a lot of the people are walking around with horrible, horrible self-esteem. And it could be an obesity set, a very normal, regular body shape, or someone who's extremely thin.

LEMON: It's how someone --

EMME: Across the board.

LEMON: If they have underlying issues it's all how it comes out. It can come out through food, drug, second, a number of issues. I wish we had more time.

Emme, you were great. Doctor, you were fantastic. I want to bring you back, Doctor, to talk about your work with food addiction, you said it's a growing problem, as we said in the beginning of the show, a third of all adult Americans are considered obese. That is alarming.

Thank you. Thanks to both of you.

EMME: Thank you.

KERN: Thank you.

LEMON: All right.

Now this.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: What's going on in here.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What do you think Is going on in here?

LEMON: Get rid of prisons. That's what one filmmaker wants to do. Will her new movie make her case? He will tell you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: OK. It as conversation that can't be talked about enough. The staggering prison population here in the United States. But, it is a conversation that too often only focus on the person who is locked up and not those who are left behind.

And Rarely does it focus on the children. 2.7 million of them who have parents behind bars. The film "middle of nowhere" tackles the issue head-on, receiving much acclaim at the Sundance film festival.

The film easily award-winning director Ava Duvernay joins me now. Serious topic but I love saying your last name, Duvernay. You know, the film concentrates on men in prison and the women who wait for them. Why do you decide to focus on women instead of the alarming number of men in prison?

AVA DUVERNAY, WRITER, DIRECTOR: Well, I'm really focusing on the families of the incarcerated. The people who love folks that are behind bars. I mean, when you think about the 2.2 million people who are locked up in this country, then you mutt fly that by the mothers and sisters and wives and daughters and children, you know, you're talking about multiples of millions.

And so, this is a secret society that's not really talked about. We're not looking at sort of the predatory practices that are happening around this community of people who wait for their loved ones. And so, it's time to talk about it.

LEMON: You're using the film to raise awareness for the excessive cost of making a phone call from prison and how private phone companies prey on the families. Sometimes to the tune of $280 a month for calls. Why should people who don't have relatives in prison care about this?

DUVERNAY: Well, you may not have a relative in prison now. But you never know how things are going to go. And it's wrong. It's wrong to prey on people who are economically disadvantages to begin with, it's wrong to prey on folks who did nothing wrong. It's not right that to accept a phone call from your loved one that you're being charged over $2 a minute. It's cheaper to call from North Carolina to Singapore for 15 minutes than it is to call from a prison in north Carolina to a residence in north Carolina. And so, that's just seems to be unjust. And so, we ask people to - who care about what's right to look into this.

LEMON: And listen. There was a typo in the prompter, sorry to call you Anna, it's Ava.

DUVERNAY: Yes.

LEMON: But this, this is what I thought was really important that this -- you reached this epiphany doing work on prisons. You said if you had the power to do so, you'd abolish prisons, you would get rid of them. Why? And how would you punish criminals? What would you do with murders, and child molesters, on and on and on?

DUVERNAY: Well, you know, it really came from doing research on this film "middle of nowhere." You know, we took it to Sundance. We have had a beautiful festival one. It opens on Friday. And I interviewed over 100 women, 100 women who are in this situation. And I started to research this whole prison industrial complex.

It's really a business. As opposed to curbing crime. Again and again we've seen statistics come out year after year that shows factually, from the government, from the center of media justice is, that prisons and incarceration does not curb crime rates.

And so I really think that we need to look more towards rehabilitation. We need to look more toward programs that help people to curb their behavior, corrective measures along those lines, as opposed to creating huge spaces where we house men, warehouse men, and make a lot of money off of it.

LEMON: Yes. I find this particular subject fascinating. And as I told you during the break, I'm reading Michelle Alexander's book, and it is taking me forever to get through it because I want to read every single word on the page. And I go back and re-read pages. It's about the prison industrial complex. And she makes many of the same points that you make. Your film is called "middle of nowhere." It opens on Friday. My thanks to you, Ava Duvernay. I really appreciate it.

DUVERNAY: Thank you so much, Don.

LEMON: Thank you.

A magician gets electric over New York. What's this all about? That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: I told you "American idol" people this. This past week damage control after two "American idol" judges begin feuding before the show even goes on the air.

Dean Obeidallah is here to talk entertainment. He is a comedian.

Dean, people were laughing at me when I said Mariah Carey is like three people in one, meaning you never know what's going to come out. And Nicki Minaj, who knows what personality is going to come out for Nicki Minaj. Mariah Carey apparently told Barbara Walters that she was worried that Nicki Minaj might even pull a gun on her.

Most people say, is this show falling apart before it starts? No, I'm sure the "American idol" people love this publicity.

DEAN OBEIDALLAH, POLITICAL COMEDIAN: Absolutely. Ratings were down 25 percent last year. They fired judges. This is what they want. In fact, Steven Tyler, the judge -- one of them who got let go, today came out called this all bull and said this is like professional wrestling.

And let's be honest in a way, as Americans, the idea of someone just singing, seen it, done that, bored with it. We like this fighting. You're bringing "the real housewives" to "American idol." they're going to fight. That's what it's about. I think it's to get press, and get people to watch the show again, watch the ratings jump.

LEMON: I can't do the talent shows. You know how much I love Howard Stern. Keep it. But, I just, I can't even watch that other show.

OBEIDALLAH: "America's Got Talent."

LEMON: I can't. It's boring. But this is definitely interesting.

OBEIDALLAH: That's what this is about.

LEMON: Yes. Let's move on. Out of New York city, illusionist David Blaine puts on a mesh suit with a million volts of electricity coursing all around him for three days, no sleep, no food. I mean, so you amazed by this stunt? Dean, remember --

OBEIDALLAH: Amazed?

LEMON: Under the pavement, the cement, remember that with the glass wall?

OBEIDALLAH: No. I'm not amazed by this at all. Staying awake three days? I have friends who stay awake five days at a time.

LEMON: Starbucks.

OBEIDALLAH: People who don't eat or drink, stuck outside, they should get the money. If David Blaine wants to impress me, every hour get a fork and jam it into an electrical socket. Let's see what happens then. I would watch that. There's no illusion involved. He is just staying outside for three days. I wish there were some lightning. That would make him more fun. I would like to see that happen.

LEMON: I saw David. I used to see David Blaine at my old gym, and I just I thought maybe he would like take the weights and do it with, you know, no hands or something.

OBEIDALLAH: Magic.

LEMON: That never happened. All right, Dean, listen. I want you to stay with us. Because you and I were talking during the last break, and you said some things that I want to talk about more. You heard our conversation about obesity in America. And we are going to talk about it. OK?

OBEIDALLAH: OK, sure.

LEMON: And I want to tell viewers, guess what? You can take CNN with you. You can even watch it while you are at work. Go to CNN.com/TV and watch CNN live on your computer or on you Smartphone.

Don't go anywhere. Stay right there.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: OK, so tonight, two political powerhouses clash in one epic debate. Two men who are either the brightest minds in the nation or a couple of television loudmouths or both. They're called both a lot. Jon Stewart, bill O'Reilly.

Post-presidential election fever, these two guys faced off this evening to represent their well-known political positions at George Washington University. It was memorable. Here's a little chunk of it.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JON STEWART, HOST, THE DAILY SHOW: Because we as a country are only as strong as the weakest amongst us. As the new testament tells us, the poor will always be with us --

BILL O'REILLY, HOST, THE O'REILLY FACTOR: Wait a minute, wait a minute. You're telling me --

STEWART: Whether or not to take care of them but how best to efficiently bring the poor and those in need back into more productive society --

(APPLAUSE)

O'REILLY: This is total irony. This man, this man, this man over here, that is offended every single American. Are you going to stand there, are you sitting or standing?

STEWART: I read the bible. You know what?

O'REILLY: We are only --

STEWART: I am short, but when you tell me I'm short I don't blame the liberal weights and measures bureau. I don't suggest that my numbers are skewed and I'm really 6'1", if only the mainstream media would tell people. I trust that I'm 5'7".

O'REILLY: That's right. and you don't know this but the feds pay for that lift, right?

(LAUGHTER) (END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: That was great. I really wish the regular debates were like that. Are you watching, presidential debate commission? The other night?

The big event was live streamed on the internet and was so well- attempted it crashed the Web site for a little while. They called this epic meeting, the rumble in the air conditioned auditorium. Not sure if they solved anything but those two love did argue. And you know what? Who won? Of course they'll both say they did and it was really good television and they talked about really important issues.

Dean, in a way that was not deadly dull.

OBEIDALLAH: Yes. That's great. I mean, that brings people in. Let's be honest. You might call it deficit and health care law but you get it when it's a joke and something's funny. And in that joke, a little seed of truth, a little information, you'll remember that more than --.

LEMON: Yes. Truth, humor, realness. The way people actually talk to each other instead of talking points. OK.

So Dean, we're talking about our conversation at the top of the show, the Wisconsin news anchor and the guy who wrote in, and they were talking about weight. And there are people who are saying listen, I disagree with your guest, overeating is an addiction, and that's why most people in this country are overweight. And we're only coddling people by telling them that it's a thyroid problem, it's this or that. You have to eat properly, it's about making healthy choices.

OBEIDALLAH: I think it's certainly about making healthy choices. I mean, I have an addiction to food, I have eat every day. It's a question of how much I eat, frankly.

You know, my mom had great issues with weight. I went to weight watchers and many organizes growing up. So, I was firsthand seeing the struggle. And it impacted me. I was a chubby kid and she forced me to get thinner, frankly. But, it wasn't until my father passed away from complications of diabetes and weight issues, that she lost the weight and for two reasons.

One, for health and second, I'm going to be brutally honest, because she was going back into the dating world and wanted to look good. And that's the truth. And some people may not like to hear that, but that's exactly what motivated her. One of the biggest motivations was that.

So, it took us a life-changing event of losing my father for her to finally say, I'm not going to binge, I'm not going to overeat. And it wasn't all the meetings she went to. It was internal. But, I can't say that's for everyone to be honest with you. It took that in my family for her to wake up. And you know, it's had impact. We all have body image issues, no way to get around that. LEMON: I've never been grossly obese. I've been 20 pounds heavier than this. I have been 20 pounds lighter than this and I too struggle. I have to have nutritionists and I have to have a trainer. And it's tough. But, if I don't do what they say immediately, I can see the weight going up. You just have to be disciplined about it. It's not that way for everyone. But I think for many people in America, it is. And we just need some tough love to tell us, sadly.

OBEIDALLAH: Some people, you're right, I know what you're saying. Others, I this it's beyond their control, frankly. You know.

LEMON: Thank you, Dean. Appreciate it.

OBEIDALLAH: Thanks, Don.

LEMON: Next. Moment of the week, basketball -- baseball player, excuse me, who hit a home run with the fans without ever touching the ball.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

LEMON: I want you to imagine this, going from the highest point of your life to the lowest point in a fraction of a second. Now think about if you're given a second chance to prove yourself.

With the crowd behind him, as Aerosmith's "dream on" blared from the mighty Marlin steady, stadium speaker's Adam Greenberg stepped up to the plate for the first time since 2005. You may be thinking, the guy just struck out. But you must remember what he did to get to this point.

Seven years ago, Greenberg made his major league baseball debut. He was beamed in the head on the first pitch, in his first time at-bat, ending his major league baseball career on the spot. Then a movement and passion was born.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

ADAM GREENBERG, INJURED BATTER GOT A SECOND SHOT: This is the start. This is realizing day one of that dream that I had seven years ago and had as a child. But I never went at this as a publicity stunt, I didn't start this campaign, I didn't ask for it. Matt Listen called me out of the blue, told me he had this great idea to create an army of fans to get me back to the big leagues.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

LEMON: Well, because he went for his one in a million shot, Adam Greenberg is our "moment of the week." Congratulations.

What a great show this was. Thank you so much for watching. I'm glad you did. See you back here tomorrow.

Good night.