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CNN International: IDF Spokesperson: Those Who Think Israel Can Make Hams Disappear Are Wrong; U.S. Concerned Israel's Iron Dome Could Be Overwhelmed In War With Hezbollah; Ukraine Moved To Top Of List To Receive U.S. Air Defense Aid; One Week Until First Presidential Debate On CNN; Texas Prepares For Tropical Depression Alberto; Messi Kicks Off Tournament For Favorite Argentina Versus Canada. Aired 3-4p ET

Aired June 20, 2024 - 15:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[15:00:40]

ERICA HILL, CNN HOST: It is 8:00 p.m. in London, 10:00 p.m. in Kyiv, noon in Los Angeles and 3:00 p.m. here in New York City.

I'm Erica Hill. Thanks for joining me today on CNN NEWSROOM.

Let's get your right to the news. First off is Israel Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu comes under increasing pressure nine months into the war in Gaza. A rift between his office and the Israel Defense Forces is now spilling into public view.

Since October, Netanyahu has promised absolute victory over Hamas, but on Wednesday, the Israeli military's chief spokesman warned anyone who thinks they can fully eliminate is wrong.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REAR ADMIRAL DANIEL HAGARI, ISRAEL DEFENSE FORCES (through translator): Hamas is an idea. Those who think we can make Hamas disappear are wrong. I'm not talking about the alternatives. This is a decision of the political echelon and the IDF will implement. But the issue of -- the issue of eliminating Hamas is simply to throw dust to the eyes of the public.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

HILL: As you just heard him there, he said Hamas is an idea and went on to say is deeply rooted in people's hearts.

Meantime, there is new video and you satellite images from Gaza reviewed by CNN, which show the passenger terminal of the Rafah crossing severely damaged and burned, as you see here.

Israel has controlled all checkpoints into Gaza for the last six weeks.

CNN's Paula Hancocks joining me now from Jerusalem.

So, Paula, let's first begin with this increasingly public rift between the IDF and the prime minister's office, how is that playing out in Israel?

PAULA HANCOCKS, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, Erica, historically, the military has always been more supported and being more trusted than the political echelon here in -- excuse me, in Israel. Certainly, if you look at the polls, the IDF does have the trust of the public for the most part.

Now, what we have seen in recent weeks is more and more of a dialogue and public statements from IDF officials saying that there needs to be a political decision and the political strategy for the day after the war ends in Gaza. Now, we're seeing this more and more publicly now with the IDF spokesperson as well. But it's certainly been the feeling within the IDF that they can try and degrade the ability of Hamas. But there does have to be something which follows politically otherwise, Hamas can inevitably just fill the vacuum that is left.

Now we have also heard a subtle changing in the determination not to destroy Hamas, which is what we certainly heard for the first several months of this war. But there now is a public talk of trying to destroy the political and the governance and the military capabilities of Hamas. So, it is changing. I think there is this realization that Hamas cannot be destroyed in full. But there is certainly more of a support for the military sided seems in fact right now, there is a protest outside the Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu's house calling for him to resign, as there has been for months, Erica.

HILL: Yeah, certainly.

When we look at the aid situation, Paula, the U.S. pier has been re- anchored to Gaza's coast after some rough seas, pause those operations there for a second time. Is aid getting in? I mean, how effective is this route at actually bringing that aid?

HANCOCKS: Well, at this point, we have heard from U.S. officials -- to U.S. officials, that it has been reattached to the Gaza coastline. We have not heard that it is currently in use. We know that the aid is bought by ship. It is then put onto the pier and then the World Food Program takes it from the Gaza beach itself, as the U.S. said, it will not have boots on the ground.

Now, considering it was finished at mid-May, when I -- late June, it is only been functioning for two weeks within that time. That the Pentagon says within that time they had about 6,000 metric tons of food and aid that was able to get in. But there was an awful lot of time where it hasn't been functioning high seas, bad weather has really hampered this pier so certainly there will be a hope that this time it can be functioning for longer than just a week.

HILL: Yeah, absolutely. Paula Hancocks, appreciate it. Thank you.

[15:05:03]

We have new exclusive CNN reporting now about U.S. concerns for Israel's Iron Dome. U.S. officials actually warning that air defense system could be overwhelmed if Israel ends up in a full-blown war with Hezbollah. Israeli officials have told the U.S. they're planning to shift resources from southern Gaza to northern Israel in preparation for a possible offensive against Hezbollah.

CNN's Natasha Bertrand joining me now from the Pentagon.

So this is your new reporting, Natasha. Walk us through more of these concerns that you've been hearing.

NATASHA BERTRAND, CNN PENTAGON CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, Erica. So, obviously, the tensions between Israel and Hezbollah have been ramping up significantly over the last several weeks, including last week when we saw the highest rate of cross-border fire between Israel and Hezbollah really since the beginning of the war. And so, all of this has raised fears among the U.S., among its allies that the Israelis and Hezbollah are or potentially getting ready to go to war.

And what we're told is that that would be a potentially big problem, particularly for the Israeli air defense systems, that Iron Dome air defense system that has been so instrumental in protecting is Israeli skies from Hamas rockets and from Hezbollah rockets flying over the border. But that in an event of a full scale war in which has below would launch potentially tens of thousands of precision guided missiles at northern Israel, then that Iron Dome system, especially in the north, it could really fracture.

And so this is what the us has been telling the Israelis that before Israel decides to make a move on southern Lebanon, on Hezbollah there, they need to really consider how this could escalate in a dramatic way, how this is not necessarily going to be a swift and quick and easy victory over Hezbollah there. But the Israelis are saying, look, we need to do something because Hezbollah continues to launch rockets and missiles over the border into northern Israel, where of thousands and thousands of Israelis have had to flee their homes since October 7.

And so, they may feel the need to create a buffer zone between the Israeli and Lebanese border to push Hezbollah back, and they're willing to do so forceful -- forcibly if the U.S. is unable to come to some kind of diplomatic deal with Hezbollah here.

So that is what the Americans are working on now, is trying to de- escalate situation, trying to come up with some kind of diplomatic arrangement, but we are told as the ceasefire seems further and further away, in Gaza, it is also increasingly unlikely that there's going to be a deal reach between Israel and Hezbollah for some kind of peace here, Erica.

HILL: Yeah, absolutely. Natasha, really appreciate the reporting. Thank you.

Joining me now to discuss, CNN political and national security analyst and "New York Times" White House and national security correspondent, David Sanger.

David, good to see you.

Let's pick up where Natasha left off there if we could. First of all on this -- this effort by the U.S., and, of course, by the U.S. envoy to try to de-escalate the situation here, try to find some sort of a diplomatic solution, is that realistic at this point that that could and will happen?

DAVID SANGER, CNN POLITICAL & NATIONAL SECURITY ANALYST: You know, we have had lots of efforts in that where we thought diplomacy was going to work at the president just a month-and-a-half ago, Erica, saying that he thought that a hostage deal was going to come together and course, it didn't.

And now, there's, you know, another -- he gave a speech at the end of May with a proposal for Hamas. Hamas has come back accepting some parts, but rejecting most and that has dragged on. I don't think it's going to be any different in the West Bank with Hezbollah. In fact, Hezbollah sees a moment here to act because they know that a good deal of the Israeli attention and until recently, a good number of the forces were down south.

So this has been the fear all along that this would spread and that if its spread to the West Bank and that's why it would spread to Iran.

HILL: Which is really -- puts people on edge for obvious reasons. Natasha's reporting about concerns that Hezbollah could potentially overwhelm the Iron Dome. Do you agree with those concerns?

SANGER: Absolutely. Look, every anti-missile system has got its limits, right? And so, two things that Hezbollah has learned watching this. The first was that when the Iranians shot a good number of missiles at Israel the only reason they got intercepted was that the United States and Jordan and others were in place to put everybody's anti-missile systems at work at one time. But, you know, they understand what the physical limits of Iron Dome is.

And we've also now seen for the first its time drone attacks on some of the Iron Dome facilities. They haven't been that damaging, but clearly, they know that drones can get in and get at the -- at the Iron Dome hardware. So this has been a concern for awhile and I think Natasha laid out very well why this is just one the mysteries that's got people worried.

[15:10:06]

HILL: Well, also interesting to me, too, as Natasha laid out, the fact that Israeli officials, right, have told the U.S. that, you know, shifting resources, right, shifting resources out of Rafah essentially into northern Israel and preparation at one point, there was some talk that could be ready perhaps in early summer, is there an obvious tipping point that you see in this moment?

SANGER: There is a tipping point. We don't know if we're at it. But think about this for a minute, on the one hand, Prime Minister Netanyahu is saying that they have to completely destroy Hamas and the Hamas leadership is in southern Gaza.

On the other hand, they're moving forces understandably up to the north to deal with Hezbollah, and I think that is part of what's going on when you're hearing the Israeli military officials in these remarkable statements, basically saying that the prime minister doesn't understand the situation and that you never completely defeat a terror group.

He's right. We came to that conclusion after 911 as well, right? We degraded al-Qaeda, but al Qaeda still exists. ISIS then came up. So, you know, on the face of it, the Israeli military has got this right. But Netanyahu does not want to hear it at the moment that his war cabinet has basically fractured and he had to dissolve it and he's very worried about whether or not the right-wing groups that have propped up as government are going to stay -- stay supporting, you know, his bare hold on power.

HILL: Does Israel have not only the resources to handle a second war essentially, but also the support?

SANGER: So really great question. You know, you could, ask the same question of us. Remember the days when the U.S. used to have a strategy that said you needed to be able to conduct a land war in Europe and then at the same time to a holding action in the Pacific against North Korea or China. And then some somebody said, yeah, that'll never happen.

Well, we're into it with Ukraine, and North Korea wasn't looking to high yesterday, right? So, so, it's a really interesting question because you've got a pretty stressed force.

And remember, October 7th happened in part because the Israeli military was so focused in the north.

HILL: It's an excellent point. You know, speaking of Ukraine before I let you go, Vladimir Putin was continuing this tour, right, in Vietnam, after that meeting with North Korea.

As you watch, all of this, and then new reporting to that the U.S. now okay with U.S. weapons being used further inside Russia, is this a little bit of public back-and-forth that we're seeing and how effective is it?

SANGER: So the public back-and-forth we're seeing right now from Putin himself is Putin trying to make the case that he's not that isolated. So, you know, North Korea was all about getting arms and in return for it having this vague of alliance of sorts with the North Koreans, which as we were all discussing yesterday, we don't know the extent of it and whether or not he, in the end, will end up helping them with nuclear program that Putin himself used to try to keep the North Koreans from expanding. So there's one drama underway there.

Vietnam is about trying to stay competitive there because the U.S. has a pretty good relationship now with the Vietnamese government, but they still by Russian military goods and so, what -- they're one of the countries in Southeast Asia. But then on only in Southeast Asia that are saying don't make us choose between signing up with the Russians and signing up with the U.S.

HILL: We will be watching it all.

David, always great to have you. Thank you .

SANGER: Great to be with you, Erica.

Let's keep on this. Subject though, of Russia and Ukraine, shall we?

A senior White House official telling CNN the Biden administration has now moved Ukraine to the top of the list to receive some of that desperately needed U.S. air defense aid. In recent months, Russia has been pummeling Ukraine with missiles and drones, prompting Ukraine's president to plead, as you know, for additional air defenses from the U.S.

CNN's Kylie Atwood joining us now from the State Department.

So, Kylie, talk to us more about why now.

KYLIE ATWOOD, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Yeah. So, U.S. officials had been talking to Ukrainians for quite some time for months now, Erica, and one thing that they had been reiterating is that they needed more of this critical air defense capability in order to, you know, continue carrying on and defending themselves as they continue seeing this Russian assault. So what happened was that the Biden administration has started to think about how they could get them, what they needed.

[15:15:03]

Now, national security adviser Jake Sullivan began this conversation among U.S. officials back in April, and the decision was made just in the last few weeks here with President Biden telling President Zelenskyy that what the United States did is they re-jiggered the entire distribution list for these critical air defense capabilities and put Ukraine at the top of that list.

Now, obviously, Ukraine is welcoming this news. The senior White House official I spoke to about this said that this was necessary in order for, quote, Ukraine's survival, essentially that they could not continue fighting this war without these capabilities coming over to Ukraine. They're supposed to start arriving later this summer. This is a policy decision that will remain intact for 16 months.

So, for more than a year, Ukraine will be at the top of the list. Any of these capabilities that come off of production lines are going to be heading straight over to Ukraine. We should note, however, that that does mean that there are other countries who were in that queue expecting to get those capabilities that have been shifted down. The administration says they're actively engaged in conversations with those countries, telling them if they were in the position of Ukraine, they would have done the same thing for them, of course.

So there are some frustrations that are likely to arise from this, and there are congressional aides who are asking what these countries are, the administration not talking about, which countries have been shifted down publicly right now? But well continue to stay on this and see if any of those countries speak out. HILL: Yeah, absolutely. I do want to ask you to about the U.S., which

appears to have expanded its agreement with Ukraine in terms of striking over the border into Russian territory. How broad is that expansion?

ATWOOD: Yeah, this is a major expansion in something that was sort of rolled out quietly. The national security adviser did an interview earlier this week with PBS, where he said that the new Biden administration policy, which was enacted just last month, that allows Ukraine to shoot over the border at Russian military, you know, effective goals.

On the other side of the border in Russia, it does not just allow them to do that in Kharkiv and the northeast of the country, but it's expanding to anywhere along the border where the Ukrainians see that they need to be going after those kinds of targets that are on the other side of the border. That's significant because what it means is that this is not just a policy decision that lives in one part of the border as this war continues to spread. And, of course, expand and at different times in different places, but they're now allowing Ukrainians to do what they need in a greater number of areas along that border.

Of course, this is something that's helpful for the Ukrainian military a they defend themselves.

HILL: Yeah, absolutely. Kylie, appreciate the reporting. Thank you.

Well, we are officially one week out from the first 2024 presidential debate right here on CNN. Of course, the candidates and their teams now moving into full prep mode. We'll take a closer look at how President Biden and former President Trump are gearing up for their one-on-one clash. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:21:26]

HILL: We are now just one week away from the first presidential debate between President Joe Biden and former President Donald Trump right here on CNN.

And today, we have some new details about that big night. President Biden won a coin toss this morning to choose his podium position. He slipped selected the right side of your screen as you see there. The Trump campaign then chose the order of closing statements and opted for the final word.

And we can now officially confirm this debate will just be the two of them. Robert F. Kennedy Jr. failed to meet the delegate threshold or polling standard to participate in the debate.

And when it comes to polling, they'll show a pretty narrow race between Biden and Trump. CNN data expert Harris Enten joining me now with a closer look.

So, let's look nationally, Harry, as we head into this first debate, basically, a dead heat?

HARRY ENTEN, CNN SENIOR DATA REPORTER: Yeah, I think that's right. Although I must admit, you know, as I saw that Biden chose to position that he did on the stage, I don't know I would necessarily have a preference. Left or right, I think you're just give the debate performance, but either way --

HILL: Maybe it's if you have a better side, Harry.

ENTEN: I know.

HILL: But your sides are great so you don't have to worry.

ENTEN: It takes one to know one, Erica Hill. It takes one to know one.

Anyway onto the polling here, what do we see nationally? Well, you know, those -- the Fox News poll that came out over the last 24 hours and what you saw there was Joe Biden ahead by two, but no clear leader, well within the margin of error.

But I want you to note the trend line from February. Donald Trump was ahead by two in February again, no clear leader within the margin of error, but a four point movement towards Joe Biden.

Of course, I was interested in whether or not it was just the Fox News poll that's showing movement towards the current president of the United States, and it turns out it's not. If you look at the aggregate, you do in fact see this small movement towards Biden over the last few months whereby he was down two in an aggregate back in February. And now, the race is tied.

So I think the real takeaway from here, Erica, no clear leader.

HILL: No clear leader.

Okay. So as we look at that, there has been so much talk about this debate and Donald Trump for his part long before we even had a debate has really worked to lower expectations for Joe Biden. There has been some concern among his supporters that perhaps that is not the best strategy.

What are voters expecting at this point?

ENTEN: Yeah, I was a little bit surprised by this finding from Fox News. I would have thought that Donald Trump clear on ahead and away would be the favorite heading in this debate. And while more voters think he'll do better on the debate stage than Joe Biden, it's not a runaway. Indeed, look here, only favored by five points to win the debate, Donald Trump is, over Joe Biden and that's not very different from what we saw four years ago heading in the first debate where Donald Trump was favored by a point maybe slightly more favorable for the former president, but not overly so.

And of course, I'll note, Erica Hill, that the post debate polls last time found that Joe Biden overwhelmingly won that debate. So to be honest with you, I don't know what Donald Trump is doing lowering expectations for Joe Biden. But then again, I oftentimes have no clue what Donald Trump is doing.

HILL: I won't ask you to get inside his head or any other politician, Harry.

ENTEN: Thank.

HILL: There you go. I promise you that.

This race, look, we know how things work in this country. It's going to be about the Electoral College. What do you see here several months out?

ENTEN: Yes, several months out, months and months to go until we reach the climax of this race in November.

You know, we pointed out the national polls have essentially a tide race, right, and the electoral college, it's a little bit more favorable towards the former President Donald Trump. If you look at the polling average right now, he's leading a number of states where he lost last time around. We're talking Nevada, Arizona, and Georgia.

But I want you to take a look at those yellow states on your screen right there, Wisconsin, Michigan, and Pennsylvania, the Great Lake battleground states. That is clearly Joe Biden's best path to winning.

[15:25:01]

And he -- if he wins all three, he gets exactly 270 electoral votes.

So the question is, how do those states look right now? Well, it won't be much of a surprise based upon what we see nationally that those three states are very, very tight looking at the polling aggregate.

Look here, Pennsylvania has the widest lead for either of the two gentlemen, and it's Trump by only two. Michigan is tied. Wisconsin is tied. And a two-point lead is not very large easily, something that even if it were the case on election day, a polling error could easily flip that around.

The fact is, yes, Donald Trump is ahead on the Electoral College but Joe Biden has a path. It may be a narrow path, but a clear and narrow path to win there, even if the election were held today. Of course, it's not being held today. We have this debate to go, then we'll have another debate in September. And then, of course, we'll have that sprint to Election Day. But still a very interesting picture, even this far out.

HILL: Absolutely. Harry, appreciate it, my friend. Thank you.

ENTEN: Thank you.

HILL: Well, President Biden is going to head tonight to Camp David for his debate prep. It'll kick into high gear. Donald Trump, meantime, is leaning on some of his vice presidential contenders as he preps for the big debate night.

Joining me now for a look behind the curtain at how both campaigns are readying for this major moment, senior White House correspondent MJ Lee and political reporter Alayna Treene.

Good to see you both.

So, MJ, I'll start with you. So Camp David, what's going to happen? Are we talking white whiteboards, role-playing? What are we expecting?

MJ LEE, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE REPORTER: Probably all of the above. Yeah, this is where the president is going to be hunker down probably for a series of days with his advisers to enter the most intensive prep stretch before the debate next week. Of course, that process has already gotten started, starting with these binders that have all of the questions and potential topics that could come up. And then, of course, more importantly, the answers president could give on stage. And if 2020 is any indication, aides have told us that he tends to get very detailed and offering feedback on what exactly he wants to say in any -- any given scenario and question.

And then as we get closer to debate night, we do expect that the Biden team is going to be doing these full run through his mock debates and 2020, you remember that it was the presidents lawyer, Bob Bauer, who played the role of Donald Trump. We're still waiting on board on whether he's going to be you repeating that role-play again this time around.

But really, Erica, the broader strategy that the Biden campaign is going for is holding Trump accountable whenever the president can. So, drawing contrast on issues like reproductive rights, painting the former president as being a threat to democracy and the campaign is really hoping that at the end of the night, what the audience will see is former President Trump is being divisive and chaotic and President Biden being sort of the steadier and wiser alternative.

Now, we are going to see the former chief of staff to the president, Ron Klain, sort of leading these debate prep sessions. But of course, members of his top team, everyone from the deputy chief staff, Bruce Reed, Jeff Zients, Anita Dunn, all of the names that you are familiar with. They're going to be joining him at Camp David.

And I think the one thing worth noting that the Biden team is certainly preparing for our personal insults, including insults that are aimed at members of the Biden family. Biden aides basically say this is territory that they expect from the former president and certainly one that they are going to be extra sensitive to.

HILL: Yeah, one would imagine.

So, Alayna, for Trump's part I know that the former president's advisors like to say he doesn't need the kind of debate prep they feel that Biden or maybe traditional candidates may need, but I would imagine they're also looking back to that performance in the first debate of 2020, when he was constantly interrupting Biden, measures that, you know, suggests that hurt him. So is there any sense that the prep is going to be a little bit

different this time that perhaps they've learned from that last debate?

ALAYNA TREENE, CNN POLITICAL REPORTER: I'd say there's two ways to answer this. It's hard because you're right, Erica, they are trying to say that Donald Trump doesn't need the kind of preparation that most candidates do. He's not going to be doing mock debates or engaging in any sort of role-playing like President Biden is like Donald Trump had done in the past when you had Chris Christie and Rudy Giuliani stand in for his opponent. However, he is hosting, I'm told he is actually participated in more than a dozen what they're dubbing policy discussions with vice presidential contenders, senators, policy experts.

And the conversations is really about sharpening his messaging on a series of topics that they think Donald Trump needs help on that includes how to frame his May 30th conviction in his New York hush money trial, talking about his behavior and handling of January 6 and that Capitol attack, things that they anticipate will come up and also that President Biden might be pushing him a little bit more sharply on.

Now, as for your question about his rhetoric, I'm told that's also come up.

[15:30:01]

So it's not just policy that they're discussing behind closed doors. It's also his rhetoric. And you're totally right, Erica, in the past, Donald Trump has come off very aggressive and one of the 2020 debates, he kept speaking over Biden, wouldn't really let him get a word in and we did see his poll numbers fall in the aftermath of that.

And so, that's definitely been part of the discussions as well.

Now, one thing I also just want to point out is some of the expectations-setting that's happening ahead of next week. Now, we know for months now, Donald Trump's team has called for these debates and they have argued and really painted Joe Biden as someone who mentally and physically is not very fit and that he can barely stand for an hour and kind of painting is someone who is going to struggle very much during this debate.

That's really set the bar low and I'm told it is somewhat of a concern, according to my conversations with those close to the former president, of what that does when you walk into that debate stage next week.

And so, you also have heard the former president without evidence, I should say, touting that may be Donald Trump -- or excuse me, touting that maybe Joe Biden is going to be taking performance enhancers and things like that, things that we know have no evidence, but I thank as part of that expectation setting.

MJ Lee, Alayna Treene, great to have you both here this afternoon. There'll be a lot to follow in the week to come. Thank you.

And, of course, with us now, just seven days away from CNN's presidential debate, if you're wondering where, how, when you can watch it, it is right here on Max. You can also watch it on CNN, 9:00 p.m. Eastern Thursday, January 27th.

Let's take a closer look now at the severe weather we've been talking so much about impacting the U.S. Tropical Storm Alberto has now been kept are categorized rather as a tropical depression after making landfall in central Mexico earlier today. Strong winds of up to 45 miles per hour still pushing water from the Gulf of Mexico on to the Texas coast.

Now, efforts part reporting multiple storm surges of up to 3-1/2 feet across the region. The National Hurricane Center announcing that life- threatening flooding and mud slides are likely as Alberto continues to move through Mexico.

CNN's Rosa Flores is tracking this for us. She joins us from Corpus Christi, Texas.

Little bit of water around you there. Rosa, what more have you seen so far today?

ROSA FLORES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Erica, well, I'm standing in the same location where I was standing yesterday when we talked and just look at the difference. The water has been rising. It's at about 11 inches. It was dry yesterday here. That's the difference in the water levels. Just to give you a sense.

And if you look over my shoulder, you'll be able to see how this water is coming from the Corpus Christi Bay. I mean, just look at this building that's on pilings and these buildings are designed like this for a reason so that the water can flow underneath. But you can see that the bay has complete -- completely eaten the street that's beyond this building and is now flowing under the building.

Now, earlier today, we were probably about a mile to my right. There's a neighborhood in this direction section. And we saw as the Texas A&M task force one team rolled into this north beach area of Corpus Christi and they started going door to door, asking people if they wanted to evacuate because the scene that you see here is replicated down the street. There are many streets here in the north beach area that are completed flooded.

We have video of this team going door-to-door, trying to figure out we saw one woman that accepted the assistance, and evacuated. You know, the city is saying that they are counting their blessings because nobody has died they don't have any injuries. But this is quite the nuisance, Erica, just look around me. I mean, this is what we see in this north beach area, just very high water, a very volatile and, you know, if you're wondering why I am in full rain gear, even though its sunny and beautiful, well, Erica, mother nature has been playing tricks on us.

Every now and then, we get a torrential rain and we get zero notice. It almost killed our camera. I'm glad that we have a camera to do this live shot, but it's just been so bizarre, especially because the storm has hundreds of miles away from where we are. And yet were still seeing these effects here.

Erica, back to you.

HILL: So bizarre, which makes me think of sort of where we're at with a weather pattern in general right now on this planet. And what we are all bracing for, of course, for this hurricane season.

Rosa, appreciate it, my friend. Glad you guys are okay. Glad the cameras okay.

FLORES: Thank you.

HILL: Still to come here, never before have so many people been fleeing conflict, violence, and persecution. That's according to the head of the Norwegian Refugee Council on this World Refugee Day. He joins me next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:38:23]

HILL: Welcome back.

Today is World Refugee Day. At this moment, the U.N. estimates over 120 million people are currently displaced. More than half are displaced inside their own countries.

Ukraine actually led the fastest-growing refugee crisis in 2020. Keep in mind, though, the conflict in Sudan has caused the large just internal displacement crisis in the world.

In Gaza, approximately three-quarters of the population there has been displaced, many of them more than once.

Jan Egeland is secretary general of the Norwegian Refugee Council and joins me now.

It's good to have you with us.

So starting off with Gaza, you've actually been into Gaza several times, as I understand it, since the war began in October and noted, it's not like anything you've seen anywhere else. What is it you think that makes this war and this situation different?

JAN EGELAND, SECRETARY GENERAL, NORWEGIAN REFUGEE COUNCIL: Gaza is the most trapped population. It's a -- it's a population that is in a smallest space without any escape, under more heavy bombardment over a longer time, than anywhere else in living memory. We are seeing the same across countries like Sudan. I was now recently in the Sahel and Burkina Faso (INAUDIBLE) neglected emergency. It's still bombardment in eastern Ukraine, southern Ukraine.

We're accumulating new conflicts on top of the old, and international peace diplomacy is failing.

HILL: New conflicts on top of the old, a failure of diplomacy, as you note.

[15:40:02]

But it isn't just conflict and war, right, that is leading to displacement, climate is increasingly playing a massive role here, which is only going to see the need for safe haven grow. How do you deal with all these things at once?

EGELAND: It's very difficult. I mean, the 120 million figure that you quoted, which is the highest number of people who has flipped from their homes and that is all from violence. On top of that comes increasingly hostile climate and we recorded in the Norwegian Refugee Council, we have an internal displacement monitoring center, we monitored nearly 8 million people just last year having to flee their homes because some natural disasters.

In many places like Afghanistan, Somalia, across the Sahara Desert, Yemen, Syria, natural disasters on top of bad governance and horrific war. We call them complex emergencies, we can do work, we are reaching more and more people, but we are, of course, overstretched and underhanded.

HILL: Overstretch, underfunded. You also have sort of other factors, right? I know there's a growing push against welcoming refugees in a number of countries. We solve course that controversial bill in the UK that was passed earlier this year, sending migrants to Rwanda.

What is your biggest concern today? So where do you -- where do you focus, if you can, as you try to conquer multiple concerns at once?

EGELAND: Well, it is the lack of protection of civilians, of people fleeing and the lack of open borders for them. I think they -- Americans like Norwegians, people in the UK across Europe were closing our borders, as if we were the ones overwhelmed by the waves of refugees, people seeking a safe haven. Nine of the 10 people who flee were within their own country, like within Sudan, or they go to the closest safe country, which could be Chad, or it could be Lebanon, or it could be Ethiopia, or it could be Iran that takes millions and millions.

It's not the rich north which is taking the biggest number of refugees. It's a poor country next to a country in war.

HILL: You know, a lot of times, it feels like the not in my backyard, right? That you see a lot of in a number of those countries, it can be really depressing to look at it and incredibly sobering.

I wonder if there are moments though that gives you hope. Is there something that you can look at the gives you some hope?

EGELAND: Yes. On this World Refugee Day, we have to celebrate also the many successes in my organization, Norwegian Refugee Council, we reached 10 million people last year. We will hopefully reach more people this year. I was recently in southern Lebanon. I was in Gaza, I was in the Sahel now, in Burkina Faso, it's a place nobody's heard about, but it has a terrible war.

But in that place, I saw classrooms with children that we have created these schools and they want to be teachers and nurses, and doctors. And they want to be journalists like you and aid worker like me, they have dreams. We can fulfill those dreams.

They don't want to be terrorists or soldiers. They want to build society, but they need help to do so. And we can provide that. That's why this supplemental bill coming out to the U.S. Congress is actually a big thing for us now. The goods -- it gives us some additional resources, and that's a godsend.

HILL: All right, well, that is a good thing and that is, that is a beautiful note to end.

Jan Egeland, really appreciate you joining us today, and all of the work that you do on a daily basis. Thank you.

EGELAND: Thank you.

HILL: Still to come this hour, remembering a Hollywood legend. Award- winning actor Donald Sutherland has died at the age of 88. We'll take a look back at his career.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[15:47:26]

HILL: Donald Sutherland, the veteran actor known for roles in "MASH" and "Hunger Games", has died. He was 88-years-old.

His actor son, actor Kiefer Sutherland, tweeting: With a heavy heart, I tell you that my father, Donald Sutherland, has passed away. I personally think one of the most important actors in the history of film never daunted by a role, good, bad, or ugly. He loved what he did and did what he loved and one can never ask for more than that. A life well lived.

His agent said that Donald Sutherland had died after a long illness.

Here's CNN's Stephanie Elam with more on his life and his work.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

DONALD SUTHERLAND, ACTOR: Now I'm waiting for reports from some of you.

STEPHANIE ELAM, CNN CORRESPONDENT (voice-over): Funny.

SUTHERLAND: Look, I'm not joking. This is my job.

ELAM: Heartbreaking.

SUTHERLAND: I don't know if I love you anymore. ELAM: And casually cruel.

SUTHERLAND: Contain it.

ELAM: With his distinct voice and appearance Donald Sutherland played scene stealing characters throughout a career that spanned more than half a century.

SUTHERLAND: I think of myself as an artist and I take it very seriously.

ELAM: Sutherland's artistic pursuits started while attending college in his native Canada. He moved to London in the 1950s to continue studying drama and began landing small roles in British TV and films.

The success of 1967's "The Dirty Dozen" launched the actor to Hollywood.

More military movies followed, including "Kelly's Heroes".

SUTHERLAND: Well, the tank is broken and I'm trying to fix it.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Then what happen to them?

SUTHERLAND: Oh, man. I only ride them. I don't know what makes them work.

ELAM: And a starring role as Hawkeye in the 1970s film classic "MASH".

Next, Sutherland teamed up with Jane Fonda onscreen in "Klute".

SUTHERLAND: What else do you remember about the (INAUDIBLE)?

JANE FONDA, ACTRESS: Nothing.

I happened to have a dream.

SUTHERLAND: I have a dram.

ELAM: And off-screen to produce a documentary protesting the Vietnam War.

SUTHERLAND: With 20 millimeter cannons, they're called (ph) the rocket pods. They're called (ph) the personnel fragmentation bombs. And I count 12 water buffalo down and kicking.

ELAM: Sutherland, versatile talent kept him busy and roles ranging from a pot smoking professor in "Animal House" --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I won't go schizo, will I?

SUTHERLAND: It's a distinct possibility.

ELAM: -- to a man desperately trying to hold his family together in the Oscar-winning "Ordinary People". SUTHERLAND: I want a really good picture of the two of you, okay.

ELAM: In recent years, Sutherland's audience of fans became multi- generational when he starred as President Snow in "The Hunger Games".

[15:50:09]

SUTHERLAND: Hope, it is the only thing stronger than fear.

ELAM: The actor liked the message of a successful franchise.

SUTHERLAND: It's an opportunity to catalyze revolutionary potential in young people and given the mess in this world (ph), and that's really important.

ELAM: Sutherland passed on his love of creating entertainment to a son, Kiefer, as well as four other children who all work in front or behind the camera.

When he received a star on the Hollywood Walk of Fame in 2011, Sutherland reflected on his extensive career.

SUTHERLAND: What you're doing at my age is you're looking for your marker and why I am so filled with happiness and joy is because you guys have given me my marker.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

HILL: Welcome back.

It is a pretty great time to be a soccer fan or for the rest of the world outside the U.S., a football fan. The Euro is in full swing in Germany. Later today, the Copa America tournament kicks off in Atlanta, Georgia. Atlanta, Georgia, featuring 16 teams from the Americas.

Global soccer superstar, Lionel Messi, and Argentina will take on Canada tonight, but tournament is being played outside South America for just the second time in its 108-year history.

CNN's Don Riddell joining us now from the site of tonight's game where there's a lot of anticipation, of course, because this is Messi's first game.

Argentina won the last World Cup. Is Argentina the favorite here to win the Copa?

DON RIDDELL, CNN WORLD SPORT ANCHOR AND CORRESPONDENT: Yeah, I think they are for sure, they are the favorites. Remember, they won the Copa as well, what, three, four years ago. So they're defending their title.

I think the expectation is so they're going to make it at least to the final there in the easiest half of the draw, and, of course, they have Lionel Messi. Some are speculating that this might be his last major international tournament. A lot of people were hoping that he would stick around for the 2026 World Cup, which will be co-hosted by the U.S., Canada, and Mexico.

He has said in at least one interview that he won't be around that long. He'll be retiring before then. So if he's true to his word, this could be the last dance for Lionel Messi and there was already going to be so much hype and excitement and noise and interest around this team.

[15:55:01]

But the fact that it could be it for Lionel Messi means I think this is just going to be most watched television for every Argentina in this tournament.

HILL: Yeah, absolutely. And what about the buzz around the U.S. squad kicking off against Bolivia, I believe, on Sunday.

RIDDELL: Yeah, that's right. Yeah. The U.S. are going to be playing Bolivia, Panama, and Uruguay. A lot of interest in the team and to be honest, a lot of pressure, too, because they're going to be co-hosting the World Cup in a couple of years.

They've got a really, really exciting young team of which there is a lot of expectation and playing a home tournament in two years time. People are hoping here, these fans here in this country, hoping that they can go all the way.

But they've got a few things to work out. One of them is their coach, their manager, Gregg Berhalter. It didn't end so well for him after the World Cup in Qatar. He's been given a second chance in his job, but I think if they have a poor tournament here, it might be the end of the road for him and there'll be looking for someone else to take coming to the World Cup. We'll see how it goes.

HILL: We will be watching it all. Don, appreciate it. Thank you.

And thanks to all of you for joining me today. I'm Erica Hill.

Stay tuned. "QUEST MEANS BUSINESS" is up next.