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CNN International: Fmr. House Speaker Pelosi Endorses Harris For President; Trump: "We Have To Start All Over Again."; U.S. Secret Service Director Testifies On Trump Shooting. 2-3p ET

Aired July 22, 2024 - 14:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[14:00:00]

JIM SCIUTTO, CO-HOST, CNN NEWSROOM: A very warm welcome to the show, I'm Jim Sciutto in Washington D.C.

JULIA CHATTERLEY, CNNI HOST: And I'm Julia Chatterley in New York.

SCIUTTO: Good to be with Julia. We do begin with breaking news this hour. It is a brand new chapter and the topsy-turvy U.S. presidential race that is now once again been turned upside down. Just in the last hour, the former House Speaker, Nancy Pelosi, of course, a big power in the Democratic Party announced she is endorsing Vice President Kamala Harris after speaking with her today -- on Sunday rather.

Sources tell CNN, Senate Majority leader Chuck Schumer and House Minority leader Hakeem Jeffries also plan to back Harris. We're learning just moments from now, we do expect to hear from Hakeem Jeffries, we will bring you those comments live, possibly with news in his comments.

Those top Democratic lawmakers, including President Joe Biden himself are lining up behind Harris in the 24 hours since the President ended his re-election campaign, it's been very quick. Clearly, many Democrats are energized by the idea of a Harris candidacy, with their campaign raising almost $50 million, and to be clear, in grassroots donations in a matter of just a few hours on Sunday.

Less than a month ago, President Biden was locked in a race that appeared to be a toss-up, but after a disastrous CNN debate that cratered his campaign, he stepped aside, Harris has now stepped into the spotlight. In her first public appearance since Biden stepped aside, the Vice President paid tribute to Mr. Biden.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAMALA HARRIS, VICE PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES (D) AND U.S. PRESIDENTIAL CANDIDATE: Joe Biden's legacy of accomplishment over the past three years is unmatched in modern history. His honesty, his integrity, his commitment to his faith and his family, his big heart and his love, deep love of our country.

And I am firsthand witness that every day, our President Joe Biden fights for the American people and we are deeply grateful for his service to our nation.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SCIUTTO: Let's get more now from CNN chief national affairs correspondent Jeff Zeleny. And you know, Jeff, just in -- just in the time since we last spoke a couple of hours ago on this broadcast, you have more names coming out. Nancy Pelosi, key, but as we wait for these comments from Hakeem Jeffries, perhaps we're going to see all of the Democratic leadership now lining up behind Harris.

JEFF ZELENY, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: Jim, it's really extraordinary, we're really just 24 hours since this bombshell upended this presidential race, and virtually all Democratic wagons have been circled around Vice President Kamala Harris. It's not a matter of if she is going to have a pathway to the nomination, it's exactly when?

I mean, there has been no one to step up to run against her. Some people have looked at it and they have retreated, because they see where this is going. And I'm told talking to a variety of people, it's fueled by this, not necessarily because everyone is confident or sure of the idea that she's the strongest candidate, but it's the anxiety over the Trump campaign has a head-start.

He's in command of this race, and the exhaustion over what President Biden was doing for the last several weeks that really has hastened all of this. I mean, they want to get Democrats -- sort of from donors to officials want to get on with it, and they want this campaign to be about the contrast between their ticket and Donald Trump's ticket. So, that certainly has added some jet fuel to all this, Jim.

SCIUTTO: And you're seeing the figures, the money come in as well, not just those grassroots donations, but this big Super PAC hall in the last 24 hours, $150 million. Jeff, a fairly basic question. Who is leading this? You know, I think often times, folks at home, elsewhere will say, well, the Democrats, you know, they have to do X or Y.

So seldom I find, is that actually true that you have that kind of coordination at a party-wide level? But is there a -- is there someone driving this? Is it the Vice President? Is it the President? Is it some combination?

ZELENY: I probably say Donald Trump is driving it. It is the anxiety and the fear of Democrats really, you know, behind in this race. The fact of the matter is that Democrats have a harder road to winning in November right now than they did a month ago.

[14:05:00]

And that is what is driving all of this. As for the exact Democratic movements, no, you're right, Jim, there is not one, a person who is pulling all of the strings, but they have had more than three weeks to sort of have these contingency plans in place. And Kamala Harris, just the Vice President of the United States, she can command attention and interests, and she has a big of a rolodex as anyone here. So, it's a combination of factors here, but the most difficult work was a President Biden coming around to the decision that he couldn't win in November, he was not certain of that. We're told in the final day or so, he became more convinced of that, that he would be sort of a drag on the Democratic ticket, if you will.

So, after that, there were plans that were -- set in emotions sort of as this was going on. It was sort of happening on dual tracks if you will. But Donald Trump is going to be the unifier here of the Democratic Party.

SCIUTTO: We are perhaps even less than a minute away from Hakeem Jeffries walking to the podium --

ZELENY: Sure --

SCIUTTO: And we will bring you those comments live. And there may very well be news in those comments. Jeff and I on this broadcast and others, we have -- we have shared the national polling, what national polling there is on Trump versus Harris, and CNN's poll of polls shows it basically tied, perhaps a 1 percent difference with Trump in the lead. Should we assume that Democrats, the party itself has more detailed polling on this matchup?

ZELENY: Not really, because --

SCIUTTO: Oh, standby Jeff, standby Jeff, here is Hakeem Jeffries, let's listen in.

REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES (D-NY): Who will go down in American history as one of the greatest public servants of all time. When President Biden and Vice President Harris first took office on January 20 of 2021, the Biden-Harris team assumed a public health crisis and economic crisis, and a democracy crisis in the immediate aftermath of January 6th at the same time.

And thanks to the leadership of President Joe Biden and his partnership with Vice President Kamala Harris, they were able to rescue the country from a once-in-a-century pandemic, and turned the situation around so we could return to normalcy.

Thanks to the leadership of President Biden and his partnership with Vice President Harris, they were able to save the economy from a once- in-a-decade or so recession-like situation, and set us on a positive path, so that everyday Americans could thrive in every single zip code across America.

Thanks to the leadership of President Biden and his partnership with Vice President Harris, dignity and decency and a democratic way of life was restored to the Oval Office in 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue. We owe a debt of gratitude to President Biden for his tremendous leadership, and I'm also thankful for the incredible partnership that he has had for the last three-and-a-half years with Vice President Kamala Harris.

(CROSSTALK) JEFFRIES: Allie(ph) --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Leader Jeffries --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Leader Jeffries, first, will you endorse Kamala Harris? And then I have one other question for you.

JEFFRIES: Well, leader Schumer and I are scheduled to meet with Vice President Harris shortly, the House came back into session today, the Senate does not come back into session tomorrow. I'm excited for that meeting, and let me say this that Vice President Kamala Harris has excited the community, she's excited the House Democratic Caucus, and she's exciting the country.

And so, I'm looking forward to sitting down with her in person in short order with leader Schumer, and we'll have more to say about the path forward as soon as that meeting concludes --

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Quick question. What does President Biden need to do these final few months to ease the path to help -- you know, while he's in office, to ease the path to make it easier for Democrats to put the House and to keep the White House?

JEFFRIES: Well, President Biden is going to continue to do his job, and he's put the country first, he's put the American people first, he's put hardworking American taxpayers first, which is what President Biden has always done.

And as a result of his leadership, we've seen transformational change, fixing our crumbling bridges, roads, tunnels, airports, our sewer and water systems, rescuing the economy from the once-in-a-century pandemic, gun safety legislation for the first time in 30 years.

[14:10:00]

Standing up for our veterans, bringing domestic manufacturing jobs back home to the country and passing the Inflation Reduction Act, which is the largest investment in combating the climate crisis in the history of the world. We still have more work to do, we still have to lower costs, we still have to end price gouging.

We have to continue to grow the middle-class, defend democracy and fight for reproductive freedom. President Biden will continue to do that job along with Vice President Harris and Democrats in the House and the Senate.

(CROSSTALK)

JEFFRIES: Hunter(ph).

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What's -- you know, this has been in a few weeks a very intense discussions about Biden being at the top of the ticket. What light can you shed to the American public about the concerns that you conveyed to the President about staying on the top of the ticket? JEFFRIES: Was a private conversation with President Joe Biden that

will remain private.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Mr. Leader, I mean, there has been a lot of reporting about what was said and wasn't. So, just for the record, can you just be clear? Did you ever tell the President that he could hurt Democrats chances of taking back the majority if he stayed in the race?

And secondly, what do you say to those, whether it's Ron Klain or congressional Republicans who claim that Democratic Party leaders are elected officials to push the President out?

JEFFRIES: President Joe Biden is a heroic, patriotic and transformational figure. And he will go down in history as one of the greatest public servants of all time. That much is clear. I had a private conversation with President Biden to express the perspectives that were wide ranging of the House Democratic Caucus.

That conversation will remain private. In terms of my Republican colleagues, former President Donald Trump and extreme MAGA Republicans are having a meltdown right now. A complete and total meltdown. Why? Because their presidential nominee isn't popular, the extreme MAGA Republican policies are unpopular, including trying to impose a nationwide abortion ban on the American people and their Project 2025 is unpopular.

They're having a meltdown right now. All we want to do as Democrats is have a debate about moving the country forward, and continuing to put people over politics.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Speak for just a moment. To what the concerns you were hearing from members you know, in swing districts who were concerned about the President possibly dragging down ballot and how this potentially changes that equation by changing the top of the ticket --

JEFFRIES: Here's what we're looking forward to. We are going to do everything we need to do as House Democrats to win back control of the House of Representatives and vacate the extreme MAGA Republican majority on November 5th.

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: When is that -- when is that meeting today, tomorrow?

JEFFRIES: We're waiting on leader Schumer to get back into town as well as to get exact confirmation from Vice President Harris. Thanks.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) the House Democratic Caucus. Can you speak to what particularly frights the caucus about her versus the President?

JEFFRIES: Well, we're looking at a frame of change versus the status quo, moving the country forward versus Donald Trump and extreme MAGA Republicans who want to turn back the clock defending freedom like a woman's freedom to make her own reproductive healthcare decisions versus the nationwide abortion ban that Donald Trump and extreme MAGA Republicans want to jam-down the throats of the American people.

We're looking at building an economy from the middle out and the bottom-up that works for everyday Americans versus the extreme MAGA Republican plans, and Donald Trump's plans to drive a big tax-cut down the throats of the American people that benefit the wealthy, the well- off and the well-connected.

(CROSSTALK)

JEFFRIES: Last question, last question, last question. Last question.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: (INAUDIBLE) primary?

JEFFRIES: I'm looking forward and excited for the meeting that we will have in short order with Vice President Kamala Harris. Thank you everyone, thank you everyone --

(CROSSTALK)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Prior to the design, can you respond to that?

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Speaker Jeffries, is that personal level?

SCIUTTO: We've been listening there to the House Democratic leader Hakeem Jeffries. First of all, saying he has a debt of gratitude to President Biden as he steps down, and that the country does. The news there is that he says that he and the Senate Majority leader Chuck Schumer will be meeting with Vice President Harris shortly.

He didn't say exactly when, but notably, senators are back in session tomorrow here in Washington D.C., so, he did not endorse yet -- one might take from his comments there that he is waiting for that meeting with the Senate leader, House leader with Harris, and then perhaps there might be some joint statement.

I want to bring back Jeff Zeleny. Jeff Zeleny, is that your read of him saying they're basically waiting for the meeting with Schumer and Jeffries and Harris can get together, and then there might be some joint endorsement?

[14:15:00]

ZELENY: Sure, waiting for the meeting and also waiting for other state delegations, Democratic delegation who actually are the delegates. New York, at least, the last time I checked, and this is moving very quickly, has not voted to formally endorse Harris.

Of course, he's part of the New York delegation, but I think Jim, this is just a matter of bookkeeping, really in a matter of time, there's no, you know, sort of mood or mystery hanging around the fact if he's going to be supportive of Kamala Harris. What he didn't answer there was perhaps one thing that history will one day inform us.

It's the question our Manu Raju asked, what was that conversation like with Hakeem Jeffries and President Biden? We know it was at the White House, just the two of them, the night of that NATO press conference. So, a little bit more than a week ago, week-and-a-half ago, and Hakeem Jeffries was one of the many people who -- many of the leaders who went to President Biden and told him that Democrats are worried about losing their races.

They do not believe they can win control of the House of Representatives and he's a drag on the ticket. Let's say complicated conversation to have with --

SCIUTTO: Sure --

ZELENY: The President. So that was perhaps a question he didn't answer. But look, the leaders are coming around here, and the entire party is circling Vice President Harris.

SCIUTTO: No question, you have to be a fly on the wall in that room, but clearly, there was behind the scenes, a push, right? A number of senior Democratic leaders going to the President and expressing their fears of what the result might be in November with him at the top. Jeff Zeleny, thanks as always.

I do want to go now to senior DNC adviser, Brad Woodhouse. Brad, good to have you on. You heard Jeffrey speaking there. Is it your expectation that he, Schumer-Harris meet, and then there's some joint announcement from them announcing their support?

BRAD WOODHOUSE, SENIOR ADVISER, DNC: Well, I have no way of knowing, Jim, but I -- but I think if you were reading between the lines, it sounds like that is -- that is distinct possibility, but with respect to the rest of what leader Jeffries had to say, I think he really is reflecting the sentiment broadly across the Democratic Party, which is that President Biden has made a selfless act, that he is heroic.

He's showing patriotism. You know, he did two things in the last five years. At one moment, he sacrificed his retirement, he sacrificed his livelihood outside of government to come back and save America for -- American democracy from Donald Trump. And now he's sacrificing his political ambition to do it -- to do it again.

I just can't speak more highly of President Biden. And I cannot tell you how proud I am to be a Democrat. We have had in the last three weeks adult conversations about the future of our party, about the future of this election that you would never, ever see occurring on the other side, which is basically cult worship of Donald Trump.

SCIUTTO: Shermichael(ph) say he didn't on CNN last night, who of course is a CNN Republican commentator, he made a point that Democrats can expect to gain some votes with Harris at the top of the ticket, particularly among women, perhaps African-Americans as well, but might lose some votes too. Some of the Biden voters who helped turn the 2020 election campaign.

Listen, I know a lot of this is unknowable, but I am certain the Democratic Party is polling and polling pretty hard for a number of days on that very question. What is your read as unbiased as possible if I could ask you about how Harris stacks up against Trump on the numbers in November?

WOODHOUSE: Well, look, I think -- I think she stacks up quite well. I mean, let's be clear, even in the -- a lot of the polling relative to how Joe Biden was running against Donald Trump, it was not -- it was not a wipe out. I mean, we were within 4 or 5 points nationally, 4 or 5 points or even less in a bunch of the -- in a bunch of the battleground states.

And that was with all of this turmoil, all of this internal dissent, all of this adult discussion that was taking place in public. So, this is a winnable race. There are a whole lot of -- there are a whole lot of paths. I think the -- I think you cannot underestimate the power of black women in this party who were a big part of the coalition that delivered the presidency for Joe Biden in 2020, delivered the vice presidency for Kamala Harris in 2020.

And so, I think that -- I think you can't underestimate how powerful that's going to be across all these battleground states. That being a woman, younger generation, I think it's going to be quite powerful.

SCIUTTO: All right, because the news moves really quickly, as you know, a President stepped down yesterday, he endorsed Harris, of course, Harris making her pitch today in numbers coming out of new doors, already the conversation has gone on to her vice presidential choice.

[14:20:00]

Can you give us a sense of who you think the frontrunners are for that job?

WOODHOUSE: Well, I am not going to -- Jim, I'm not going to touch that with a -- with a 10-foot pole, but I think what you see --

SCIUTTO: Everybody is ducking that question --

WOODHOUSE: And you've seen -- you've seen -- but look, what you've seen is when you ought to put this on the screen, you've seen how deep our bench is? I mean, you know, on the other side, the best they could -- the best they could come up with was J.D. Vance who wants a national abortion ban, and wants to ban no-fault divorce.

And on our side, we have governors, we have senators, we have House members, I mean, we have a true -- and it's diverse and it's wide, it's a wide and deep -- and deep bench. So, look, I think she's got tremendous choices to make, and I think any one of the ones that have been discussed or showed and there may be some surprises, I think will help her win this election in November.

SCIUTTO: Well, good to have you on, thanks so much. I'm sure we'll have you back as we digest the news that's sure to come in the coming days.

WOODHOUSE: Right --

SCIUTTO: Thanks for taking time this afternoon. Still to come --

WOODHOUSE: Thank you, Jim --

SCIUTTO: Still to come tonight, Joe Biden's exit from the presidential race may not be good enough for some Republicans on Capitol Hill. Details ahead on who is calling now for the U.S. President to resign from the office.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

CHATTERLEY: Welcome back. The U.S. Secret Service director is testifying before a congressional oversight panel about the assassination attempt against former President Donald Trump, during a testy back and forth with House Republicans and Democrats. Kimberly Cheatle walked a tightrope, sometimes dodging questions.

Cheatle has pledge to move, quote, "heaven and earth' to ensure this never happens again, and accepted responsibility for what did happen on July 13th. This by far, she said no one has been held accountable.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: So, no employee has been disciplined and no employee has been placed in any position that would place their job in jeopardy nor their standing in the agency?

KIMBERLY CHEATLE, DIRECTOR, SECRET SERVICE, UNITED STATES: We are still in the process of --

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: That's not what I asked. You're the person that runs the place. You're the person that knows right from wrong, good from bad.

[14:25:00]

You've had a number of days, and now you come before this committee knowing you're going to be before us, and you've got to slough it off to someone else.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Has the Secret Service provided this committee a complete list of all law enforcement personnel that were there that day. Have you done that? Have you provided a list to the Oversight Committee? Yes or no?

CHEATLE: I will have to get back to you on that.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That is a no. Have you provided all audio and video recordings in your possession to this committee as we asked on July 15th? Yes or no?

CHEATLE: I would have to get back to you on that --

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: That is a no. You're full of -- today. You're just being completely dishonest.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

CHATTERLEY: And joining us now from Washington is Zachary Cohen; CNN's national security reporter. Zach, you've been watching the hearing, and I think what's clear to our viewers there is the deep frustration I think being expressed by both sides of the aisle, of her inability to answer what are legitimate and pertinent questions over just what happened?

ZACHARY COHEN, CNN NATIONAL SECURITY REPORTER: Yes, Julia, a rare moment of bipartisanship in the House and on the Oversight Committee, specifically Democrats and Republicans joining together to call into question Director Cheatle's leadership despite the fact that she admitted that the security failures were colossal on July 13th at Donald Trump's rally that allowed the shooter to take aim at the former president and get multiple shots off and killing one of the rally-goers.

Look, Democrats and Republicans both extremely frustrated during this hearing today with Cheatle's lack of detail and her inability to really answer some basic questions with any sort of meaningful response, including questions like, how did this happen? And how was the shooter allowed to get onto the roof and with a clear line of sight at the former President, despite being observed by rally-goers and pointed out before the former President took the stage.

Why was the former President allowed to take the stage if there had been multiple reports of a suspicious person before he did. So, these were all the things that lawmakers really pressed the director for answers for, but did not receive any. Really prompting Democrats and Republicans to call on her to resign.

Now, she insists that she still believes that she's the best person for this job at this time, but look, we're hours into this hearing and the bipartisan outrage and frustration has been palpable and does call into question whether or not she will remain director for much longer.

CHATTERLEY: Until where there was less or clearly, we can say no bipartisan agreement, I think and the Democrats that were asking her questions chose to pivot this to a discussion about gun control and the fact that this was a 20-year-old using an AR-15 style weapons, something that they've tried to restrict, certainly restrict to the under 21.

Just talk us through the message that the Democrats were sending here about, again, the risks of the weapons that were used and the desire to restrict them.

COHEN: Yes, that's right. Democrats did use this hearing as an opportunity to pivot to the issue of gun control, and why was a 20- year-old allowed to, you know, have an AR-15 and allowed to take a weapon of this caliber into -- or around a Trump rally. And look, this has been -- and I was told that this would be probably where you would see the split between lawmakers prior to the hearing. And indeed, it was. No Republicans really jumping on board with the Democrats and sort of pushing this gun-control messenger in the hearing. But that doesn't eliminate the fact that both parties were adamant that Director Cheatle is responsible for the security failures on July 13th, and members of both parties say that she needs to step down and step down immediately.

CHATTERLEY: Zach, good to have you, thank you so much for that. We'll continue to watch that for now. OK, still to come tonight, Kamala Harris getting support from top Democrats. But what do her voters think of her? We'll break down the data. Stay with us.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[14:32:11]

SCIUTTO: We continue to follow the extraordinary developments from the U.S. presidential race. A growing list of Democrats is now lining up to publicly back Vice President Kamala Harris after President Biden released a statement Sunday afternoon saying he was ending his reelection campaign.

Not long ago, former House Speaker Nancy Pelosi gave Harris her endorsement, joining President Biden himself, former President Bill Clinton, former Secretary of State and presidential candidate Hillary Clinton. Sources say Senate Majority Leader Chuck Schumer and House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries will soon join them. We heard Jeffries a short time ago saying that he's going to be meeting along with Schumer with Vice President Harris shortly.

I want to take you to Middletown, Ohio, where on the other side of the ticket, the Republican vice presidential nominee, J.D. Vance, is speaking. Let's listen in for a moment.

SEN. J.D. VANCE (R-OH), VICE PRESIDENTIAL NOMINEE: That's what this whole thing's all about. Now, look, I'm going to go really off script here. And, you know, all my communication staffers back there are going to get a little nervous.

You know, I was hanging out with my kids yesterday. We're actually swimming at the swimming pool. And somebody brought over their phone and showed me the news that Joe Biden had announced he was dropping out of this race.

And look, I don't like Joe Biden and I don't like his policies. And I'm not a Democrat primary voter. I never have been and I never will be unless something goes really wrong, ladies and gentlemen.

But look, what is going on in this country is absolutely disgraceful. Let me get a little philosophical here. I imagine most of you did not vote for Joe Biden. And if you did, welcome aboard. We're glad to have you.

But if you want to run for president, you've got to make your case to voters. You make your case to voters. That's what President Trump did, even though he would have already been the president. And even though he was by far the most popular person in the Republican Party, he ran for the Republican presidential nomination.

He faced some good competition and he made his case to voters. The idea of selecting the Democrat Party's nominee because George Soros and Barack Obama and a couple of elite Democrats got in a smoke-filled room and decided to throw Joe Biden overboard, that is not how it works.

That is a threat to democracy, not the Republican Party, which is fighting for democracy every single day. This is not OK, ladies and gentlemen. You cannot, for three and a half years, take a guy who clearly didn't have the mental capacity to do the job.

Kamala Harris lied about it. My Senate Democratic colleagues lied about it. The media lied about it. Every single person who saw Joe Biden knew that he wasn't capable of doing the job.

[14:35:05]

And for three years, they said nothing until he became political deadweight. That is not a way to run a country. That is not a way to run a political party. And so -- and I really believe, even though I think the leadership of that party is corrupt, I really believe that most Americans are fundamentally good, whether they're Democrat, Republican or independent. My life has taught me to put my faith in people because they put their faith in me and gave me a lot of opportunities.

So my message to Democrats who are disgusted by this process, disgusted by how anti-democratic it is, you are welcome in the Republican Party where we think we should persuade voters and not lie to voters. Come on in. The water's warm.

SCIUTTO: We've been listening to vice presidential candidate for the Republican Party, J.D. Vance there, saying -- well, offering something of an olive branch to Democratic voters, saying that he does not view Democrats or Republicans as fundamentally one good or one bad. He says they're all Americans and he says that they deserve not to be lied to. Notable words given the man at the top of the Republican ticket.

Donald Trump is often dismissed. Democratic voters attack them as well as lawmakers. Kristen Holmes, she's tracking the Republican reaction to the announcement by President Biden that he's stepping aside, that Vice President Harris, while many Democrats now backing her, she joins us now from our Washington bureau.

Kris, I want to ask you a question, because the reason you and I talked about this a number of times prior to yesterday was that the Trump campaign, they wanted to run against Joe Biden. They thought they had the advantage. They no longer are running against Joe Biden. Are they internally somewhat worried about the prospect of a Harris ticket?

KRISTEN HOLMES, CNN U.S. NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: It's not just a Harris ticket. It's any change at the top of the ticket. But yes, a Harris ticket in particular, because it looks like she's going to be the nominee.

Just remember, it's not just that they wanted to run against Joe Biden. It's that they spent the last two years preparing to run against Joe Biden. Donald Trump announced he was going to run for office in November of 2022.

And since then, they have built out an entire campaign apparatus aimed at running against President Joe Biden. That included millions of dollars that they spent in data modeling and data collection. That was all to, again, beat President Joe Biden.

And then you started seeing during this process them kind of really learning or realizing that Joe Biden could potentially not be at the top of the ticket. And the reason this causes so many issues is, one, talk about an enthusiasm gap. It was very clear to Democrats and Republicans that there was a clear enthusiasm gap when it came to President Joe Biden.

There is going to likely be a shift, no matter who is at the top of the Democratic ticket, in enthusiasm. Enthusiasm generally leads to voter turnout, something that Donald Trump's team was expecting to be very low when it came to Democrats. The other part of this is, what exactly do they do to create a model, a structure, to run against Kamala Harris?

Now, one reason that they are looking forward, or at least more glad that it's Kamala Harris or going to be Kamala Harris or hope that it is Kamala Harris than some of these other people, is that they can tie her to Biden and his administration, particularly the issues that Donald Trump pulls well on, talking about immigration, crime, inflation.

Those are all things that they believe they can link Kamala Harris to President Joe Biden on. But as we both know, Jim, a lot of a presidential campaign is based on personality, is based on people showing up to vote because they like the person and their policies. That's not necessarily just going to be Donald Trump's only ability to beat a potential Kamala Harris, is just arguing about that.

So you're also going to -- arguing about those policies, you're also going to start seeing personal attacks on Kamala Harris. We had seen a little bit of that in a rollout from Donald Trump's campaign. Now we expect that to be escalated tenfold, particularly as, again, it seems as though she is inching towards that nomination.

The super PAC that is aligned with Donald Trump, MAGA Inc., is already spending millions on ads, including an ad about Kamala Harris that's going to air in battleground states like Pennsylvania, Arizona, Nevada and Georgia. That in itself is interesting, given the fact that they felt very confident in those states, so confident that they were going to continue pouring money into them to kind of try to make the gap even bigger so they could focus on some of the tighter states.

That's all going to change now as well because they don't know what the polling is going to suggest.

[14:40:03]

Or what this is actually going to look like once that ticket is set.

SCIUTTO: No question. We'll stand by for some of that messaging because sometimes those attacks have been quite pointed, attacks like that. Kristen Holmes, thanks so much.

All right. So, most important of all, how are voters reacting to Harris's bid for the White House? Here's what we heard in the swing state, the key swing state of Pennsylvania.

(BEGIN VIDEO)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Harris pulls well against Trump, so I think she has a real shot at winning. And I think he's doing the right thing right now despite some people being so nervous and saying it's disastrous, but I think it actually may end up being an asset to the Democratic Party.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I don't think anything should be given to Vice President Harris. I mean, I think the DNC needs to look hard at all possible options.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: If they had made her the nominee in the first place, she could have been a very good candidate. I think that everything that's happened with the attempted assassination on Donald Trump and the way that the, you know, what's going on in Palestine currently, we really are broken up in -- as Democrats at the moment.

(END VIDEO)

SCIUTTO: All right. So, what do the numbers show? Let's bring in a guy who knows the numbers a bit. We'll grant him that. CNN Senior Data Reporter Harry Enten joining us live from New York.

OK. So, let's go big picture and then to the party. Big picture, what is the best data show us so far on how Trump and Harris match up in the general voting population?

HARRY ENTEN, CNN SENIOR DATA REPORTER: Yeah. All right. So, let's take a look nationally because that's where we have the most recent data. And it's not a horse race number, but it gives you an understanding of why Democrats wanted to make the change from Biden to Harris. So, this is post-Republican National Convention. This is the net favorability rating.

So, that's the favorable minus unfavorable rating. And what we see there is, look at this, the vice president has a minus 11 point net favorability rating. Now, that's not particularly good, right? Because that means that more voters have an unfavorable than favorable view of her.

But that is actually tied with Donald Trump at minus 11 points. Look at where Joe Biden is there, minus 23 points. So, all of a sudden, just by making this switch, you end up with a candidate who is actually tied with Donald Trump in terms of their popularity. Again, not beloved, but Donald Trump isn't beloved either. So, you

make a big jump there. Of course, my dear friend, Mr. Sciutto, what matters ultimately are the battleground states, right? We don't have national elections in this country.

So, let's take a look at some battleground states. Now, this is before the Republican National Convention. But again, it gets to the point of why Democrats wanted to make the change.

We'll look at Pennsylvania and Virginia. What we see in both of those states is that Harris runs somewhat better against Donald Trump than Joe Biden did. For example, in Pennsylvania, Joe Biden trailed Donald Trump by three points.

Kamala Harris, though, trails by just one point. How about in Virginia? Joe Biden was up by three. Harris was up by five. Now, you may say to yourself, Mr. Sciutto, these aren't big differences between Joe Biden running against Donald Trump and Kamala Harris running against Donald Trump.

But you know more than anybody else that in this country, elections are decided by the smallest of margins. So, if you're able to pick up two points, especially in a state, the Commonwealth of Pennsylvania, and that all of a sudden moves that race from one in which Trump has a small advantage to one in which is honestly too close to call, you can definitely understand why Democrats want to make the change.

Now, all that being said, Harris is not a shoo-in, but the fact is Joe Biden basically had no real shot and Harris has some shot. So, at the end of the day, I think it was a good switch, at least in terms of the general voter population.

SCIUTTO: I mean, it's amazing. It just shows you how tiny the movable voting population is in the current environment that a two-point move is a notable move in a race. But as you and I know, those moves, or even smaller ones, can decide a race.

OK, so how about Democratic voters themselves? We got a little taste of that, right, given how much money they were writing checks for just in the few hours after President Biden's announcement yesterday, but money is not votes. So, what does the polling tell us about how Democratic voters feel about her?

ENTEN: Yes, you know, I think obviously J.D. Vance, if we were listening earlier on, was this whole idea of a coordination and the voters didn't necessarily get their say. Well, voters did get their say. I can bet, take it to the bank, that they would like Kamala Harris.

And the way we know that is some polling that was taken before the switcheroo or the potential switcheroo took place. But this is a national poll from ABC News, Washington Post, Ipsos. And among Democrats who listed a specific candidate, if it wasn't going to be Joe Biden, look at this. Look how far ahead of the pack Kamala Harris is, 59 percent.

[14:45:00]

ENTEN: Gavin Newsom, who's in second, comes in at just 14 percent of the vote. So she's got, we can do the math quickly here. What is that? That's a 45 point advantage. She -- in Democrats' mind, if it wasn't going to be Joe Biden, it should have been Kamala Harris.

The vast majority of Democrats are satisfied with her being the nominee if it's not Joe Biden. I looked at some state polling as well. It looks very similar to this. Look, at the end of the day, Democratic voters might not have "gotten their say," but if they would have in fact gotten their say, they would have overwhelmingly chosen Kamala Harris, at least according to the most recent polling data.

SCIUTTO: They did elect her as the vice president of the ticket in 2020.

ENTEN: That is true.

SCIUTTO: So there is that. And by the way, you know, it's interesting when you look at those numbers, they look a lot like the Republican primaries with Trump.

ENTEN: They did.

SCIUTTO: Those were the kind of margins he had in those. Harry Enten, thanks so much.

ENTEN: My pleasure, my friend.

SCIUTTO: Still to come, the director of the Secret Service is facing hard questions today in Washington. We're going to tell you what she's saying about the assassination attempt on Donald Trump and what questions she isn't answering.

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CHATTERLEY: OK, let's return now to the U.S. Secret Service director's appearance before the House Oversight Committee. Kimberly Cheatle is being questioned about the failure of her agency to prevent the assassination attempt on former President Donald Trump. Director Kimberly Cheatle admitted she has not been to the Pennsylvania rally site crime scene.

In addition to Donald Trump being hit in the ear, one man was killed and two others seriously wounded. Cheatle did vow to fix the agency's lapses.

(BEGIN VIDEO)

KIMBERLY CHEATLE, DIRECTOR, U.S. SECRET SERVICE: On July 13th, we failed. As a director of the United States Secret Service, I take full responsibility for any security lapse of our agency. We must learn what happened, and I will move heaven and earth to ensure that an incident like July 13th does not happen again.

(END VIDEO) CHATTERLEY: Joining us now is CNN law enforcement contributor Steve Moore. He's also a retired FBI supervisory special agent. Great to have you with us.

There was clear frustration not just with the performance of the Secret Service and what took place that day, but also her inability to answer questions. What did we glean that's new and pertinent today in your mind?

STEVE MOORE, CNN LAW ENFORCEMENT CONTRIBUTOR: I'm not sure we gleaned anything really that's brand new. I think the only information that to me was significant that I've seen is that for about five minutes prior to the shooting, the shooter was designated as a suspicious person.

[14:50:03]

And seconds before the shots rang out, he was designated a threat. Those were the important things.

Otherwise, though, it's as if the director came to school without her homework. I think there was a surprising lack of specificity in her answers and in her preparation. I don't think a lot of it was reluctance to provide information.

It just seemed like she had not gathered it, and they have had time in a week to come up with all those answers.

CHATTERLEY: I picked out two of the things that you mentioned there. She said that the Secret Service was told between two and five times that there was a suspicious person in the area.

She also said the FBI investigation found that the local SWAT team had spotted him 18 minutes before Trump took to the stage. She was asked by one of the representatives on whether there was ever a moment where they considered pausing the rally. I mean, in an 18-minute time period with two to five, lack of specificity there, notifications, would somebody not -- or shouldn't somebody not have been able to say, look, let's just work out what's happening here and make him a little bit late going to the stage?

MOORE: OK. That seems very logical. What I would put as a foil, and I'm not trying to defend the director at all, but just to put reality into this, there are very few events that the Secret Service works where there aren't suspicious persons seen. I mean, that's what they're looking for, people who don't fit the category of the regular attendee. So, it is not unusual at all for them to be working a suspicious person during an event.

I think we're going to need to get more clarity on how they define suspicious versus a threat. I'm not sure that that's an adequate breakdown of the information. There has to be some kind of gradation of suspicion.

I mean, if you just have somebody who's wearing a Biden hat in the crowd, somebody might say that's suspicious. But if you see somebody carrying things that could potentially be weapons, you can't just treat it as a run-of-the-mill threat. You have to treat it as an enhanced threat.

And my suspicion here, and again, I don't know because we haven't been able to get valid information that I think we've had time to obtain, is what made him look suspicious to them. I know that people in the audience saw him as a threat and were reporting him as a threat, but law enforcement takes that as a grain -- with a grain of salt.

CHATTERLEY: I mean, we had representatives on both sides of the aisle saying that there were dramatic failures here and calling for a resignation, but there were a number of Democrats that chose the opportunity as well to talk about the type of weapon that was used, the age of the shooter being 20, and their efforts already to restrict guns in this country.

House Democrat Jared Moskowitz was one that stood out to me. Just listen to this interaction.

(BEGIN VIDEO)

REP. JARED MOSKOWITZ (D-FL): This is not about the Second Amendment. If there are over 400 million guns on the streets, if all of those guns were machine guns, would that make your job harder to protect people?

CHEATLE: Again, I think weapons that are out there --

MOSKOWITZ: If all of those guns were rocket-propelled grenades, would that make your job harder?

CHEATLE: Yes, sir.

MOSKOWITZ: Yes. Okay, thank you.

(END VIDEO)

CHATTERLEY: Yes, that felt like a struggle. Representative Tlaib of Michigan also said, unlike other victims in this country of gun violence, actually, when we see one against a about-to-be presidential nominee or a former president, actually, there is a hearing, and that's important. Previous examples of presidential assassinations, or at least attempted assassinations, whether it was in that year, 1968 or beyond, led to some form of restrictions on guns.

Do you see the events surrounding this in some way convincing the Republican side of the aisle that perhaps something more does need to be done, or is there going to be stony silence once again?

MOORE: Well, I -- no, I don't think there's going to be a change in this at all. First of all, the fact that he used an AR-15, that's a less accurate rifle than a sniper rifle, which is not an assault rifle, which wouldn't be covered under these types of things. The sniper rifle I used with the FBI when I was a sniper was a bolt- action. It was not semi-automatic, but it was incredibly accurate.

So this is an apples and oranges thing. Yes, we can take those -- we can try to take those weapons out of circulation, and certainly we have to have that discussion.

[14:55:00]

But the fact that this was an assault rifle made him less likely to hit the president, as opposed to more likely to hit the president had he used a bolt-action sniper rifle.

CHATTERLEY: I mean, I do think we're splitting hairs in this instance. Very quickly, can I ask your opinion of whether you think she can stay in the job, or whether ultimately a resignation will be required?

MOORE: I think it would be hard for her to continue with the level of distrust on both sides of the aisle. Regardless of any other circumstance, as she said, the buck stops with her. Well, this was a colossal failure. And what do you do when there's a colossal failure? You need to change things.

CHATTERLEY: Yes, a colossal failure by her own admission. Great to chat to you, sir. Thank you so much for your insights.

And thank you for watching tonight. Stay with CNN. "NEWSROOM" with Jim Sciutto is up next.

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