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Hamas Political Leader Ismail Haniyeh Assassinated in Tehran; Israel: Beirut Strike Killed Senior Hezbollah Commander. Aired 4-4:30a ET

Aired July 31, 2024 - 04:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[04:00:00]

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN Breaking News.

MAX FOSTER, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, welcome to our viewers joining us in the U.S. and around the world. I'm Max Foster.

BECKY ANDERSON, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Becky Anderson. It is Wednesday, July the 31st, 9 a.m. here in London and we are following breaking news and reaction across the Middle East and beyond to the apparent assassination of the political leader of Hamas, Ismail Haniyeh. The group says he was killed in Tehran on Tuesday after meeting with Iran's newly elected president, you see that here, and attending his inauguration.

Iran's state media says an airborne guided projectile was used to strike where Haniyeh was staying, in the Iranian capital.

FOSTER: Hamas was quick to blame Israel, calling it a, quote, Zionist strike. There's been no official confirmation from Israel, only saying it doesn't respond to reports from foreign media.

Haniyeh was a long-time member of Hamas, joining in the late 1980s and rising through the ranks over the years before becoming the group's political chief in 2017.

ANDERSON: Well, in his statement, a Hamas spokesperson says, and I quote here: This assassination will not achieve the goals of the occupation and will not push Hamas to surrender.

The Palestinian Authority President Mahmoud Abbas calls Haniyeh's killing a dangerous development. Indeed, a number of political leaders across the Middle East have quickly condemned the assassination, warning it could push the region even closer to a potential all-out war.

FOSTER: These reports come after Israel claimed just hours earlier that it killed Hezbollah's most senior commander in a drone strike in Beirut. Israel says it was retaliation for Saturday's deadly rocket attack in the occupied Golan Heights.

ANDERSON: Well, the IDF blamed Fuad Shukr for that attack, which killed 12 children and injured more than 40 people. Hezbollah denies it was responsible and has yet to confirm the commander's death in Beirut. But the militant group does now acknowledge Shukr was present at the time of the Beirut strike.

FOSTER: The Lebanese health ministry says a woman and two children were killed in the Beirut strike with 74 others injured. Lebanon's caretaker prime minister has condemned the attack, calling it a clear violation of international law. The IDF insists it's not looking for an all-out war.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REAR ADMIRAL DANIEL HAGARI, ISRAEL DEFENSE FORCES SPOKESPERSON: Hezbollah's ongoing aggression and brutal attacks are dragging the people of Lebanon and the entire Middle East into a wider escalation. While we prefer to resolve hostilities without a wider war, the IDF is fully prepared for any scenario.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANDERSON: Well, U.S. Defense Secretary Lloyd Austin says Washington is pushing for a diplomatic solution, reiterating America's support for Israel.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

LLOYD AUSTIN, U.S. DEFENSE SECRETARY: I don't think war is inevitable. I maintain that. I think there's always room and opportunities for diplomacy, and I'd like to see parties pursue those opportunities.

If Israel is attacked, we certainly will help defend Israel.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANDERSON: Lloyd Austin speaking. Well, joining us now here in London is Chief International Security Correspondent Nick Paton Walsh. Right.

Two in the morning, Tehran time, a strike on the residence where Hamas's political leader Ismail Haniyeh was staying. He is killed. How? What do we know?

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: We know very little at this point, and it seems in the coming minutes we may hear more from the IRGC, the Iranian Revolutionary Guard Corps, about precisely what happened here. And it's those details that will dictate the next 48 hours, most likely, the kind of response Iran feels it has mandated or forced to prosecute.

Now, we just actually heard from the supreme leader, Ali Khamenei of Iran, essentially their leading voice, that this was a terrorized terror and criminal Zionist regime act and that it's paved the way for hard punishment.

It's a rough translation there, but essentially the highest voice in Iran pointing the finger directly at Israel and saying that there must be some sort of clear response to avenge this death. Now, rewinding back to your original question, Becky, we know at 2

a.m. an explosion. We don't know the extent of the damage. We don't know how precise or controlled that particular blast was. It appears to be that Ismail Haniyeh was staying in some sort of veteran's guesthouse, unclear under whose protection necessarily.

Kind of a side issue, frankly, whose responsibility it was keeping him safe because he was in Tehran. He was in Iran's securest bubble, frankly, and should have felt, as he most likely was, asleep in his bed safe that particular night.

[04:05:04]

So, a startling breach of their own security. But whether this was a jet firing a missile, or a drone piloted from Israel launching the attack, or, as we've seen before, saboteurs, groups of Israeli agents acting on the ground to, in this case, assassinate a singular individual with, it seems, pretty significant precision and good intelligence here, will force Khamenei, it seems, into specific directions. And that's utterly key here. Because they have few good options at this point.

Iran, it's unlikely, I would think at this point that this is the moment they choose to use their proxy, Hezbollah, in Lebanon to ignite a border conflict there with Israel. But that's one option. But it's one they've been reluctant to do for a number of months.

They tried a drone and missile attack back in April when key IRGC commanders were killed in an airstrike on Damascus, in the Damascus consulate there. And they simply didn't get through. So I think we're going to hear a lot of fiery rhetoric here.

But it's the exact nature of the details of this, the level of the embarrassment, the violation of Iran's sense of sovereignty that will force their hand in particular directions. But make no mistake, we are in a very dangerous window here where literally 12 hours ago it was the southern Beirut strike causing everyone to believe the region could be close to the precipice. Now we have an utterly unprecedented attack on a key figure in negotiations between Hamas and Israel, right in the heart of Israel, sworn enemy, in the middle of their capital there.

FOSTER: Could you just explain a bit more about who he was, for people who might be confused? He was the political leader, but he wasn't the military leader of Hamas.

WALSH: No, certainly. And a separation between Yahya Sinwar inside, it's thought, of Gaza, who was considered the sort of mastermind of the October 7th attacks against Israel, and then Haniyeh, who clearly was seen associating himself with those, almost celebrating those attacks in the aftermath of October 7th, but was a political figure. Seen by some as more comparatively moderate, mostly in Doha in recent months, but involved in negotiations with the United States. So a kind of bifurcation of Hamas leadership to some degree, but one that didn't make a distinction in terms of who Israel said they were necessarily going to hit. ANDERSON: And if you talk to sources around the region, they will tell you that this is a guy, Ismail Haniyeh, the political leader of Hamas, who was actually working through those mediation efforts and talks and pushing for a deal and a compromise. And the interlocutor between, of course, those in those talks and the militant wing on the ground, including Yahya Sinwar.

Nick, you raise a really important point about where we stand with regard to the region at present. You and I spoke earlier, and I think it's worth bringing up again, that Lloyd Austin has said overnight, the U.S. defense minister, that he doesn't see a regional escalation as inevitable at this point. What he hasn't said is it's not going to happen. He's just said it's not inevitable at this point.

WALSH: We've had somebody in this position saying war is inevitable.

ANDERSON: Right.

WALSH: Right. I mean, that's never going to be his job. But ultimately, he's on the same talking points as he was yesterday.

The big question in all of this is, did the U.S. have foreknowledge? Did they end possibly in some way assist? That would seem unlikely. They're certainly making it clear publicly, it seems at this stage, that that's not the case.

And where does this leave U.S. traction in the region, period? They were calling for de-escalation prior to the strike on southern Beirut against the key Hezbollah commander. Now we're seeing an unprecedented attack on a Hamas political figure inside of Tehran itself, really pushing the envelope of quite what Israel has done so far, if indeed it was Israel at this point, but all fingers pointing in that direction.

And so, are the U.S. simply finding their calls not being returned anymore by Benjamin Netanyahu after his recent visit? Is he just pursuing his own direction? Or is there something else at play here which we don't yet fully understand?

But, you know, situations like this, it's very possible to think that the worst is ultimately unavoidable. But we've seen in previous months, people pull back. I think the utter humanitarian catastrophe of a Hezbollah-Israel war would be so devastating for both Israelis and Lebanese, and I think both sides there are exceptionally anxious to avoid it.

No one's going to be a winner from it. It's not going to get the Israelis back into their homes in northern Israel by the beginning of the school year, even if it started now. It's just simply not going to happen.

And so, yes, we're in a place where Iran will clearly feel pressure to respond in some way or other, but exactly how this went down will dictate the nature of that, as will also, too, their capabilities. They're not a 10-foot-tall giant walking around the region. You know, they didn't manage to get through with missiles and drones in April, and that will probably linger in the back of their minds.

ANDERSON: They do, though, have proxies around the region who they can pull into any sort of response at this point. Nick, good to have you.

FOSTER: Let's bring in Ben Wedeman. He's live for us in Beirut.

[04:10:00]

Ben, within 24 hours, we've had someone very senior in both Hezbollah and Hamas taken out. How do you read this?

BEN WEDEMAN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: It certainly represents an escalation of the likes of which we have not seen in a long time. Now, yesterday, just before 8 p.m. local time here in Beirut, Fuad Shukr, the military, senior military commander with Hezbollah, seems to have been assassinated, although Hezbollah hasn't actually confirmed that. And that was already a notching up of tensions, but certainly the assassination in Tehran of Ismail Haniyeh definitely represents just one more step to the edge of the abyss.

And before, you were talking with Nick about the U.S. talking about they don't think there's going to be a regional war. I don't think they would have said that if they had known that Ismail Haniyeh was going to be assassinated in Tehran. This certainly does represent a notching up of tensions that we haven't seen yet.

Now, Hezbollah has commented on the assassination of Ismail Haniyeh, describing him as one of the great resistance leaders of our present era. They go on to say: We in Hezbollah share with our dear brothers in the Hamas movement all the feelings of pain over the loss of this great leader, the feelings of anger at the enemy's crimes.

Now, of course, we shall see what the response will be.

Now, in 2004, the Israelis assassinated Sheikh Ahmed Yassin, who was the founder and the spiritual leader of Hamas. I was in Gaza at the time. Everyone anticipated some sort of massive response by Hamas, but they did relatively little.

But that was 2004. That was 20 years ago. And I think if you look the broad -- take a broad view of the region, you have this horrendous ongoing war in Gaza, which has left more than 40,000 people dead.

You have tensions on the Lebanese-Israeli border higher than they've ever been before. You've had the Houthis, who've successfully interfered with international navigation in the Red Sea. They've been able to fire a deadly drone all the way to Tel Aviv.

You have Iranian-backed militias in Syria and Iraq ready to fire at U.S. forces in that area. And now you have Iran mortally offended that Israel has assassinated the head of the political leader of Hamas in the capital, Tehran. All of this adds up to a scenario where it's hard to imagine a positive outcome.

As we've been reporting now for days, for months, neither side, Israel or Hezbollah, can afford really wants an all-out war. But we are at the point where there is a minefield of miscalculations through which everyone is walking, including the United States, which has been active in fairly passive diplomacy, not using all its leverage, all its power, to bring this conflict somehow to an end 10 months in. And it's just getting worse, and it's getting more dangerous, and it doesn't appear there's going to be a ceasefire in Gaza, which is really key to bringing the tensions to an end.

Hezbollah has made it clear it will stop firing at Israel as soon as there is a ceasefire in Gaza. We saw they made good on that back in November of last year during that brief period during which more than 100 Israeli hostages were released in exchange for the release of Palestinian prisoners and detainees. So the solution is there.

The problem is those who can actually make it happen aren't doing their job -- Max.

ANDERSON: Ben, I see much talk, and I'm hearing this from my own sources, about the security apparatus of Hezbollah being compromised in the attack in Beirut and, indeed, the Revolutionary Guard's security apparatus, if, indeed, the house that Hamas's political leader was in was supposed to be supported by them. Where does this leave Israel and its confidence, do you believe, from your point of view? Where does this leave Israel as far as its strength, perceived strength, around the region is concerned?

[04:15:03]

WEDEMAN: Well, certainly, there seems to be serious lapses in the security of Hezbollah, which is normally pretty good, as well as Iran. So clearly, the Israelis have a level of intelligence and an ability to reach targets. I mean, Beirut's not far from Israel, but Tehran is a long way away, and their ability to make such a pinpoint strike in the capital of Iran and also finding where Fuad Shukr was precisely yesterday, just before 8 p.m. local time, is quite an achievement.

Now, having said that, let's not forget October 7th. It was a massive Israeli intelligence failure where for days they were unable to retake control of the border area around Gaza. So it's a mixed picture.

And in terms of Israel's military abilities, it's one thing to do a pinpoint strike in Tehran, assassinating a Hamas leader, quite an accomplishment. It's another full-scale war, for instance, with Hezbollah. We have seen over the last 10 months that Hezbollah has military capabilities that even the Israelis were surprised at.

They've been able to shoot down top-of-the-line Israeli drones. They've been able to disable much of the surveillance equipment that Israel has along its borders. They've been able to, in some instances, disable the Iron Dome system or Iron Dome batteries and also anti- drone defenses.

And the Israelis themselves acknowledge Hezbollah has more than 150,000 missiles and rockets at their disposal, and they've only used a tiny fraction of them. So their intelligence, the Israelis, chapeau. But Hezbollah has real ability to inflict intense pain on Israel in the event of a full-scale war -- Becky. ANDERSON: Ben Wedeman is in Beirut. Ben, thank you.

FOSTER: We're also joined from Beirut by Maha Yahya, the director of the Carnegie Middle East Center. The Iranian National Guard is apparently going to come out with a statement any time now. That's the big concern, isn't it, whether Iran will directly respond to this attack on their territory? How concerned are you about that?

MAHA YAHYA, DIRECTOR, CARNEGIE MIDDLE EAST CENTER: Good morning, and thank you for having me. I'm very concerned. Khamenei just came out and said that this happened on Iranian soil, and therefore we have a responsibility to respond.

Unlike the assassination of Imad Mughniyeh, this did happen in Tehran. And so I am very concerned that Iran is going to want to respond in a certain way. That sends a message.

However, I think they will think carefully about this, knowing full well that any kind of response is going to pull an American reaction. And it's not just about Israel. It's also about the U.S. And the last thing Iran wants right now is to get into a direct conflict with the United States at this point.

ANDERSON: Maha, let me ask you -- it's Becky Anderson here out of London today.

YAHYA: Hi, Becky.

ANDERSON: Hi, good to have you on.

You're on the ground in Beirut and I've been watching what you've been posting over the last 24 hours in response, of course, to the assassination of the Hezbollah leader there. How would you describe the atmosphere? And what are your sources telling you about what happens next?

YAHYA: What happens next is really an unknown at this point. No one has any idea in terms of how Hezbollah is going to respond. They still haven't even announced that Fuad Shukr is dead.

The statement that they just put out earlier today said that he was in the building, but did not confirm that he was killed. Earlier reports had indicated that he was in the building but had left. So we're not sure where things are on that front.

But the mood is very somber. People are very anxious and very worried about the prospect of an escalation, one that Lebanon cannot afford. Lebanon has been down this road so many times with Israel already, '78, '82, '93, '96, and 2006.

These are all dates of Israeli invasions of Lebanon or war between Lebanon and Israel.

[04:20:00]

So it's not something that the Lebanese want to see yet or live through one more time.

There's also quite a bit of cynicism around, you know, that the fact that Israel is using the horrific attack on Majdal Shams in a way to kind of eliminate more of its adversaries and do away with the prospect of any ceasefire with the Palestinians. They really want to turn this into a conflict between Israel and Iran rather than with the Palestinians. There's a lot of concern around that, which then means that this will not be limited to, you know, this is going to drag in the U.S. and others into the fold, especially if Iran's other partners and proxies in the region also get involved as we're all expecting and as they have already.

FOSTER: You've obviously studied how Hezbollah operates for many years. Why do you think they're not confirming the death? Are they trying to figure out a strategy and a message there?

YAHYA: They're probably trying to figure out what to do next on the one hand, and perhaps, I mean, they may not have located the body, quite honestly. They're still searching under the rubble. The toll has now risen to four dead and 80 injured as a result of this attack.

So I think they're buying some time, probably, to try and coordinate with Iran and see how best to respond to this and in what way. They cannot take it sitting down. At the same time, they understand that any kind of response is going to drag, you know, bring on another reaction from Israel.

And we could just go down a path of a regional conflict that will literally see the end of Lebanon as it is today.

ANDERSON: Yes. I mean, what a statement.

YAHYA: It's horrific. The prospects are just horrific. And it's frightening, the sense of adventurism, I think, and a sense of impunity that this particular Israeli government is showing. I mean, the key to all of this is a ceasefire in Gaza.

Get a ceasefire. I mean, enough, enough bloodshed, enough killing. Get a ceasefire in Gaza and de-escalate in the rest of the region.

ANDERSON: That's certainly what you and I are hearing around the region. And we have been hearing that around the region since, of course, you know, mid-October. Maha, it's good to have you. Thank you very much indeed.

FOSTER: I mean, the prospects of a peace deal are now reduced in the short term, surely.

ANDERSON: So, you know, I've spoken to people this morning about the role of Ismail Haniyeh, the political leader of Hamas, who has been absolutely integrally involved, based in Doha, of course, and integrally involved in what are these indirect talks between Israel and Hamas in trying to get a conclusion to this. And many people will tell you this is the guy who was, you know, they were leaning into to help find some sort of compromise on the deal. Some people might disagree with that positioning, given that he is Hamas's political leader at the end of the day.

But that was certainly the view. And so, you know, one school of thought says basically, you know, the guy was hoping to help solve, you know, seal a deal has gone. The other school of thought says, and so therefore the deal is gone. And this was something that was, you know, some momentum for this in Rome just earlier this week.

Others will say Benjamin Netanyahu has got a win out of this, assassinating, the Israelis aren't admitting to it as of yet, but the alleged assassination of the Hamas leader gives him a win. Does that put him back at the negotiation table? And does that make a ceasefire and hostage deal actually more likely?

And we do not know where this stands at present. We will, but we will, we will see in the next, in the next days and weeks.

FOSTER: Yes, we've got lots of experts coming up to give their view on what is a very sort of, you know, unknown effectively. Hamas saying its political leader has been assassinated in Tehran. We'll be back in a moment.

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(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

ANDERSON: Right, more on our breaking news from Tehran. Hamas officials reacting with condemnation and defiance after the apparent assassination of the group's political leader Ismail Haniyeh. Hamas says he was killed in an Israeli strike in Tehran after attending the inauguration of Iran's new president on Tuesday.

Israel so far not commenting or claiming responsibility.

FOSTER: The 62-year-old Haniyeh was born in a Gaza refugee camp. He joined Hamas in the late 1980s during the First Intifada. Haniyeh rose through the ranks becoming the group's political chief in 2017 and soon after he was named a specially designated global terrorist by the U.S.

CNN's Paul Hancocks joins us now live from Abu Dhabi. Despite all of that he was seen as someone that the international community could work with. So what's been the loss to the, you know, the diplomacy here for Hamas?

PAULA HANCOCKS, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well Max, he was certainly the most visible Hamas leader since the October 7th attacks. We have been seeing him carrying out indirect negotiations with Israel since then when it comes to these hostage ceasefire talks. And he has been very key when it comes to speaking to the two key mediators, Qatar and Egypt.

He was based in Doha, Qatar for some years and really did have, appear to have the freedom to be able to move around the region at will. He has been out of the Gaza Strip for some time. So within the Gaza Strip itself it is known that that Yahya Sinwar is the main leader.

He is the one who Israel believes is currently hiding in the tunnels below.

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