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Paul Whelan and Evan Gershkovich Released in Prisoner Swap. Aired 11-11:30a ET

Aired August 01, 2024 - 11:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[11:01:01]

ANNOUNCER: This is CNN breaking news.

ERIN BURNETT, CNN HOST: And good morning. I'm Erin Burnett in New York.

And we do have breaking news today, significant news and incredible news for some American families. Let's just show you live images of an airport in Ankara, Turkey, where the story centers this morning, afternoon there. The president's office in Turkey confirms that they are mediating a massive prisoner exchange, an historic day involving 26 people from seven countries, the U.S. and Russia obviously chief among them.

We are told that two of those prisoners are children. This would be the largest prisoner swap between the United States and Russia since the end of the Cold War, a day in history.

And we have just moments ago also learned from Turkey that two of the best-known Americans held in Russia have been exchanged already as part of this ongoing, fraught moment that we are all witnessing, "The Wall Street Journal" reporter Evan Gershkovich, who was detained more than 15 months ago and just last month in Russia sentenced to 16 years in a penal colony.

Also freed today, Marine veteran Paul Whelan. He has been held the longest, we believe, of the prisoners involved today, more than five- and-a-half years in a penal colony eight hours outside of Moscow. The U.S, of course, has denounced the convictions of both Whelan and Gershkovich. Far from espionage, they are political prisoners.

CNN crews are in place across the world, working their sources, bringing you the latest details as this is happening as we are speaking.

I want to go straight to Alex Marquardt.

And, Alex, you have been breaking so many of the details today, and I know you have some new information at this moment about the CIA's involvement. What are you learning?

ALEX MARQUARDT, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Erin, this was obviously a multipronged effort by the Biden administration to get these Americans home, but leading the charge, I'm told, at least in a very big way, was the CIA and the CIA director, Bill Burns.

Years ago they established what they're calling an intelligence channel between U.S. intelligence and Russian intelligence, and this is the channel through which these negotiations happened. This is according to a U.S. official.

Now, sometimes that could take place physically in person, meetings between U.S. and Russian intelligence officers. That could also take place on the phone. I'm told that for what we're seeing unfold today that, in late June, there was a meeting in a third country that this U.S. official declined to tell me, and that meeting was between Russian and U.S. intelligence officials, at which point the U.S. put forward this latest proposal.

It was accepted a few days later in early July. That was on a phone call between Russian intelligence and the CIA director, Bill Burns. It was accepted in principle, I should say, and then it was formally accepted in mid-July through that same channel.

Now, we don't exactly know who's on the other side of those meetings on the Russian side, but you can certainly assume that it would be a counterpart or several counterparts of Bill Burns and his top deputies from the Russian security services.

So, the CIA playing a pivotal role in all of this. One of your previous guests also mentioned Roger Carstens. He is the top State Department official in charge of hostage negotiations. So when the U.S. declares that Americans around the world have been wrongfully detained, he and his team leap into action and jump-start the negotiations.

But because so much of the U.S. and Russian relationship is based in the security world, U.S. intelligence did take a leading role when it came to the negotiations about these prisoners and the release today, Erin.

BURNETT: All right, Alex, thank you very much.

And, of course, changes recently at the head of the FSB's Fifth Service, which had been so crucially involved on the Russian side, a change in leadership there. It is these individuals and whether that played a role in why now and not earlier that I know so much of the reporting here will uncover.

Jim Sciutto, we understand just moments ago confirming that Evan Gershkovich and Paul Whelan have been exchanged. We're using the past tense on that, so in terms of the reporting right now.

[11:05:10]

I know you have been speaking to the families.

JIM SCIUTTO, CNN CHIEF NATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Yes.

BURNETT: So what does such a moment mean for them? Obviously, this doesn't happen where they're on a tarmac, right? SCIUTTO: Right.

BURNETT: This exchange happens. The families are waiting. They get word. What are you learning?

SCIUTTO: So the families gathered at a hotel here in Washington, D.C., as news of this deal coming together was relayed to them, awaiting a visit with the president.

They're going to be meeting with the president today as well as this deal is finalized.

I will say, an enormous amount of relief, I'm told by someone who's with the families, right now, an enormous amount of joy, annihilation, anticipation, but also nervousness right up to the final moment, because these are families who have been victim to really the unjust detention of their loved ones for months, in some cases years, but also repeated disappointments, right, when they thought that there might be a deal that was closed, and then they were disappointed.

Or, in the case of some families, Paul Whelan, for instance, they thought they would be part of a previous exchange and were not part of that exchange when you go back to, for instance, the Brittney Griner exchange. So, elation, but also nervousness mixed in with that, as they await to see the pictures of their loved ones and speak to their loved ones on the phone and then get the moment to sit down with the president as well.

BURNETT: Yes. And that moment, we anticipate, will happen as those families, we understand, will have time with the president of the United States today, and he may address all of this.

Matthew Chance is in London. Matthew, when you think about how all this happened -- and I referenced some changes at the FSB's Fifth Service.

You also have as so central to this, we know Vladimir Putin wanted the return of an assassin who was serving a life sentence in Germany, the name Krasikov, and that there were some in the German government who did not want to do this. And all these pieces and players had to come into place at the right time with the right conversations for this to happen.

But yet, ultimately, Matthew, Vladimir Putin had to say yes. And why do you think he said yes now?

MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN CHIEF GLOBAL AFFAIRS CORRESPONDENT: I think this is a great deal for Vladimir Putin.

He has managed to basically get back a Kremlin assassin, a colonel in the FSB who killed in broad daylight a Chechen dissident in the center of the German capital, in exchange -- as well as a lot of other people as well who Russia is interested in and may have information that Russia wants to keep to itself and not be disclosed to its rivals, in exchange for a group of individuals who, for all intents and purposes, did nothing wrong. People like Evan Gershkovich, who was doing his job as a journalist. He was accused and convicted of espionage of spying for the CIA, but he categorically denied it, as did the U.S. government. Paul Whelan as well, this former Marine who's been in a Russian jail for the best part of the past six years, he was in Moscow attending a wedding, and he was accused and convicted and sentenced to 16 years of spying as well.

So, yes, this is a big tactical victory on the part of the United States. They're bringing these people home, but, strategically, this is a vindication, I think, for Vladimir Putin of his strategy of taking bargaining chips and using them to extract as big a concession as possible from the United States and from the West at large.

And so this is an important day, it's an emotional day, but it's also a day that has involved a substantial amount of moral compromise on the part of the West to get these people back.

BURNETT: Yes, and I think it's important and we will go through as we learn more and can confirm names, the individuals, the criminals that the United States, at the least, is returning to Russia in exchange for this, and very, very serious criminals convicted of incredibly serious crimes.

Let's go to senior White House correspondent Kayla Tausche, because, Kayla, Jim mentioned Jim Sciutto, that some of these families are with President Biden and maybe having a meeting that we may be able to have an opportunity as this unfolds to hear from him.

We understand, obviously, we're in these final fraught moments. Exchanges could still be occurring. What are your sources telling you?

KAYLA TAUSCHE, CNN SENIOR WHITE HOUSE CORRESPONDENT: Well, Erin, the president has remained out of the public eye up until this point. And when asked why that was, the White House has only said, tune in.

I can tell you that, within the last 45 minutes, President Biden has made his way from the White House residence to the West Wing, the Marine guard standing outside the West Wing portico signaling that the president is inside the West Wing. He took his post just about 45 minutes ago.

[11:10:00]

Of course, President Biden has been working through painstaking negotiations and updates with his top diplomats for, in the case of Paul Whelan, multiple years and, in the case of Evan Gershkovich, many, many months, urging them to find a deal that is agreeable by all sides and meeting with these families on multiple occasions over the course of the last several years, urging them, in a vintage Biden phrase, to keep the faith and telling them that his administration is doing everything that it can.

Of course, for President Biden, who has now made the decision to be a one-term president, this is a legacy issue for him as well. In a speech from the Oval Office just last week, he said that one of the top priorities for him in his remaining time in office is bringing not just these Americans, but all Americans who are being wrongfully held overseas back home, where they belong.

Biden has addressed this issue in public at the White House Correspondents Dinner and in multiple addresses to the nation over the years. So, certainly, this will be seen as a major victory by the White House, but also a victory on a human level, Erin.

And, to that end, on the discussion of the potential debate around the moral equivalency of exchanging people who are criminals for people who are practicing journalism or who were activists, I spoke with a source with knowledge of the deal and this person told me this, that it's the unfortunate realpolitik of negotiating with Vladimir Putin, saying, in Putin's world, everyone is seen as useful no matter who they are or what they do, that it's the unfortunate reality of this situation.

But it should also, Erin, not be seen as a change in posture between the administration and Russia, with this source saying these hostage negotiations take place in very specific channels and they don't really spill over to other issues.

BURNETT: All right, Kayla, thank you very much.

And we are still awaiting, understanding, more names that may have been involved, including Vladimir Kara-Murza. We do not yet know if that exchange has happened, if he is formally on this list.

So, as we are awaiting this to try to understand these names and what is happening in the moment, we are getting new reporting on the assassination of the Hamas leader, and we are going to go live, give you the latest on that we are just breaking right after this.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:16:50]

BURNETT: More breaking news right now, and this coming from the Middle East, tensions skyrocketing there after assassinations this week.

And we are getting right now some brand-new details about exactly how the assassination of the Hamas political leader, Ismail Haniyeh, went down. And this -- these are incredible details that Jeremy Diamond is breaking. He's in Haifa, Israel, in Northern Israel, right now.

And, Jeremy, these details are pretty stunning.

JEREMY DIAMOND, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, no doubt about it, Erin. I mean, this was a quite sophisticated operation.

I'm told by a source familiar with the matter that Ismail Haniyeh was assassinated in Tehran early yesterday morning using a bomb that was covertly hidden in the guest house where he was staying. But this bomb, I'm told, was actually covertly planted inside that guest house about two months ago, and it was only remotely detonated once it was clear that Ismail Haniyeh, Hamas' political leader, was actually inside his room inside of that guest house.

When that bomb was detonated, he was killed, alongside his bodyguard, who was also there. Now, we should note that Israel has still neither confirmed nor denied its involvement in this. Iranian officials and Hamas have said that Israel was behind this attack.

I'm also told that Israel -- Israeli officials actually briefed U.S. officials on this operation, but only after it took place, only after we learned that Ismail Haniyeh had been killed in this.

What's also interesting here is that this guest house was actually under the control of Iran's Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps. And so this represents a stunning breach of security for them, a very big embarrassment for the IRGC.

And we have reached out to Iranian officials for comments on this, but we know, of course, that we heard yesterday from Iran's supreme leader, vowing revenge, saying that Israel has -- quote -- "paved the way for your harsh punishment."

This assassination has put this region a knife's edge, in addition, of course, to the Israeli strike in Beirut, just hours before this that took out a senior Hezbollah commander. There are now threats of retaliation, not only from Iran, but also from Hezbollah and Hamas, putting this region and this area where I am right now in Northern Israel very much on edge as the possibility of retaliation now looms -- Erin.

BURNETT: Thank you very much, Jeremy Diamond.

Cedric Leighton joins me now, Colonel Cedric Leighton.

Colonel, Jeremy's reporting is really stunning. And he mentioned this, but let's just emphasize this again. He is reporting that, ostensibly, some Israeli operative, although they have not confirmed their involvement, planted an IED in Tehran in a guest house controlled by the Islamic Revolutionary Guard Corps, the elite IRGC, two months ago, and then remotely detonated it when they knew that the guy they wanted to get was actually staying in that house.

Holy cow.

COL. CEDRIC LEIGHTON (RET.), CNN MILITARY ANALYST: Yes, holy cow is right, Erin.

This is a classic operation, kind of in line with the tradition of Israeli intelligence going back almost to the founding of Israel. And what the Israelis, if they did this, what they were able to do, as Jeremy pointed out, was breach security in a really remarkable way.

[11:20:11]

The IRGC, the Iranian Revolutionary Guard Corps, is very much in control of a lot of different aspects of Iranian life, but they weren't in direct control of this guest house, which was ostensibly their own guest house. And whoever breached this -- and the supposition is that it was

Israel, but whoever did this did a remarkable job. And the fact also has to be noted that this was not detected for probably over two months, if Jeremy's reporting is -- and his sources are accurate.

So, that really indicates that people were, quite frankly, overcome by their own sloppiness in this particular case. And this very fact on the Iranian sideshows that Israel has been able to penetrate their security apparatus quite a bit.

And that, of course, signals some major weaknesses in the Iranian structure.

BURNETT: I mean, Jeremy, just to emphasize this -- and I know -- obviously, I don't know if your reporting is -- is how detailed it is on the form of an IED, but you have an improvised explosive device inside a guest house, which would presumably mean no one was sweeping it or checking it before this Hamas leader came in, or in fact any time in the past two months, which would seem to be just a really basic, basic point of protocol.

DIAMOND: Yes, look, we don't know exactly what kind of explosive device this was.

We don't know exactly where it was hidden, whether this was something that could have evaded the typical checks that the IRGC would conduct on this. But I think one clear failure of security here is the fact that this guest house, the reason why this bomb was planted there is because it was a guest house where Ismail Haniyeh was known to have stayed.

And so this indicates that Haniyeh was a repeat guest in this same location, which is obviously a security -- a major security vulnerability that the Israelis appear to have exploited here. And so we don't know exactly how this happened, but there's no question that there will be major questions asked within the IRGC, within Iran's top political and military echelons about how this could have possibly happened.

And I also think it's notable that, yesterday, Iranian state media was reporting that this was a rocket that was fired from outside into this guest house that actually killed Haniyeh. But the fact that it was actually something that was planted in the guest house suggests even additional layers of failure.

BURNETT: Yes.

DIAMOND: It also makes clear that this was not fired by a drone or by a fighter jet that would have violated Iranian airspace. So that also may factor into how Iran chooses to retaliate for this assassination.

BURNETT: And that's a significant point as well, Colonel.

It also, though, what Jeremy's saying, does just make one thing sort of unbelievably clear. So let's just say it in black and white. That means a human being is involved who's in Tehran who actually gets access to this guest house and plants something.

At some point, there is a human being infiltration, which is different than what Jeremy's saying they had originally been put out there about a rocket or a drone, right, which could be completely done remotely. That shows actual physical human involvement, Colonel.

LEIGHTON: It does, absolutely. And it's really a classic case of, in essence, a clandestine operation.

These are the kinds of operations you would have seen the British conduct in World War II with a special operations executive in Europe. You would have seen the OSS, the forerunner of the CIA, doing stuff like this also in that conflict.

And the Mossad has a history of doing things of this type in various countries around the world. And, of course, Iran is a prime target. We know a lot about the -- many of the nuclear scientists who have been killed in Iran ostensibly by the Israelis.

That kind of operation and the fact that these things are continuing and that there's such a significant penetration of IRGC security at a guest house that is frequented by people like Haniyeh, that really shows that, as Jeremy said, there's a significant weakness in their security apparatus, and they really didn't take care of things.

BURNETT: All right, thank you very much, Colonel and Jeremy, for that incredible and significant reporting on that assassination.

And as we take a brief break here on this incredible day of breaking news, the joy for Evan Gershkovich's family. Look at the front of "The Wall Street Journal" right now. Honestly, kind of choked up saying it: "Wall Street Reporter Evan Gershkovich Is Free."

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[11:29:31]

BURNETT: All right, we are back with our breaking news, this now the home page of "The Wall Street Journal: "Wall Street Journal Reporter Evan Gershkovich is free."

Jill Dougherty, former Moscow bureau chief for us, of course, Russia expert extraordinaire, is with me now.

Jill, a moment that I don't think anyone can see and read that and not feel emotion. And that is so much of what today really is about. With all the diplomacy and all the discussion that will happen, very fairly, about who was exchanged for what and what the moral compromises were, this moment is an incredible moment of joy.