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Texas Death Row Inmate Tries to Stop His Execution; Fighting Misinformation and Threats; Fact-Check: Trump and Harris Tax Plans; Two Giant Pandas Arrive in Washington. Aired 10:30-11a ET

Aired October 15, 2024 - 10:30   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[10:30:00]

LACEY HULL (R), TEXAS STATE HOUSE: Thank you for having me. Yes, this was a pretty clear case where Robert Robertson did not have due process, a fundamental right that we all should have. And he did not have that here. And so, we are asking for a new trial, and that has been so clear all throughout the process. He didn't -- he never had a proper defense and that is what he truly needs here.

JIM ACOSTA, CNN ANCHOR: And you said that if there's a chance that Robert is innocent, he should not be executed, that your words, we want our system of justice to work. Did the system not work here?

HULL: It did not. No. Texans deserve to know that our justice system is fair and just. And we cannot say that right now.

ACOSTA: And I guess, what do you make of the fact that he was sentenced to death in this case? I mean, shaken baby syndrome is obviously -- I mean, that is a horrific thing. But it is that unusual for that kind of sentence to be handed down in this type of case?

HULL: We see this not only in Texas, but across the country too. Now, other people and other states have been exonerated for this same thing. We have one of the best junk science statutes in the nation here in Texas. And unfortunately, it doesn't seem like that was used here. And that is one thing that we are asking for is under the junk science statute, Robert Robertson deserves a new trial.

ACOSTA: And what's your sense of it? I mean, what are his chances at this point?

HULL: We still have hope. You know, I met with Robert. I went to death row and visited him with a bipartisan group of other lawmakers, and that man has so much hope. And so, it is -- you can't help but be filled with hope. And so, we still have a few options. The courts can still intervene. And we are waiting for the Board of Pardons and Paroles to make their recommendations. Our governor cannot act until the board makes their recommendations. And so, there's a few different options here and we're just in a waiting period.

ACOSTA: And, Representative, you may already know this, but our Ed Lavandera spoke with Robert. Let's listen to what he had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) ED LAVANDERA, CNN SENIOR NATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Why should people believe that you didn't kill your daughter?

ROBERT ROBERTSON, CONVICTED IN DEATH OF DAUGHTER: Because I didn't, you know. We can't make a person believers, you know, and stuff, you know. But I carried her to the hospital and stuff, you know. I didn't have nothing to hide.

LAVANDERA: Why do you think you were convicted?

ROBERTSON: Just because I couldn't explain what happened to her. They said, you're guilty, and that way I was acting funny. Because of my autism. I didn't even know I had autism until I was here.

LAVANDERA: Did you love your daughter?

ROBERTSON: Yes, sir. I loved her. And I -- right now, you said, was I prepared? I might not have been prepared like I should have been, you know.

LAVANDERA: Right.

ROBERTSON: But yes, I did love her.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: Absolutely tragic case. Representative, is part of this about the death penalty, in your state? Texas leads all U.S. states in executions since the death penalty was reinstated in 1976. What do you think?

HULL: I only get involved in the cases where I truly believe that someone is innocent, and that's what I believe here with Robert. And either way, he deserves a new trial. When you look at all of the history of the trials, the appeals, he never had a proper defense. All of the scientific evidence was never properly heard in court. And that's what we are asking for here.

Unfortunately, in Texas and across the country, we have innocent parents wrongfully convicted of child abuse and medical child abuse. It's just less rare or it's not as common that you see them on death row. And so, this paints a much bigger picture and shines a light on a much greater problem that we have not only in Texas but nationwide.

ACOSTA: All right. Texas State Lawmaker Representative Lacey Hull, thank you very much for your time. Please keep us posted on Robert's case.

HULL: Thank you for having me.

ACOSTA: Thanks so much. All right. Coming up, fighting misinformation and now threats of violence. How FEMA is working to get aid to people who need it the most in North Carolina. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:35:00]

ACOSTA: FEMA is resuming door-to-door recovery assistance in Western North Carolina after reported threats against the agency led to one arrest.

Governor Roy Cooper now directing the state's public safety department to help protect FEMA workers as they continue trying to help people affected by Hurricane Helene, and CNN's Gabe Cohen joins us now. Gabe, what do we know about this person who was arrested? And I guess, I mean, this is sort of a warning sign as to what misinformation, disinformation can lead to in these areas that have been hit by disasters.

GABE COHEN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Jim, it's really indicative of this boiling point that we have hit. both in North Carolina and really across the country with these hurricanes. So, we know that the Rutherford County Sheriff's Office in Western North Carolina, one of the hardest hit areas, they arrested 44-year-old William Parsons over the weekend.

And they explained to me that on Saturday they received a phone call warning them that Parsons was armed and he was making comments about potentially harming FEMA workers. And when they located him a little while after that, he was in a vehicle right by a relief site where people had been getting donations, food, water, clothing, things like that. And he was armed with a rifle and a couple handguns. He was arrested. And at this point, is facing a charge for a misdemeanor, essentially terrorizing the public.

And what we don't know at this point was what exactly was his motive? What were his plans in that parking lot? But as you mentioned, FEMA sounding alarm bells in recent days about the harassment, the threats that they're getting and all of the rumors and the misinformation. A lot of it spread by Former President Donald Trump.

[10:40:00]

There are all kinds of claims that we're talking about here that federal officials, FEMA is going to confiscate people's land if they were hit by the storm, that they've spent all the relief money on undocumented immigrants, that they are refusing to help Republicans, even as local Republican officials in these areas are saying, that's not true. Do not believe it.

And some of the claims, they sound ridiculous. But realize that FEMA is not only now worried for their security, ramping up police presence as they're going out there in North Carolina, but they're also worried about one people who are going to face delays getting assistance because they've had to roll back some of their work. But also, what about the vulnerable people who are buying into these rumors who might not seek assistance, even though they could get thousands or tens of thousands of dollars that might help them get back on their feet after losing everything?

ACOSTA: Yes. And it's incredible because it is coming out of Trump's mouth and some of his allies, and then ricocheting on social media. So, people pick up on it on their Facebook feeds and so on. And we've been telling people FEMA is trying to combat this by putting out their own website.

COHEN: Yes, they have a rumor web page to address and dispel each of these individual rumors. And we're hearing from officials who are out front every day saying this is really what we're doing. And look, they're relying on some of those local officials or leaders in this nation to get out there and dispel the rumors themselves. But the reality is there is only so much they can do.

When you go on X, you go on social media and you see the posts that are getting millions and millions of views, making these vile claims about FEMA and the good people who are working with them who are out there trying to help these communities get peace back together.

ACOSTA: And the good people who need that help. All right. Gabe Cohen, a very important update. Thank you very much.

And if you need help after Harleen and/or Milton, two storms, obviously that some folks are dealing with at the same time, you can apply for federal disaster assistance a few different ways. You can go online to disasterassistance.gov. You can also call this number, 1- 800-621-3362, or by downloading the FEMA app.

All right. Coming up, we're digging deeper into the tax plans for each candidate and what they may mean for you and your family. That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:45:00]

AMANPOUR: All right. We've got an important fact-check for you now. The presidential candidates have been attacking one another over their plans for the economy, especially over what Americans will be paying in taxes. Have a look at this ad from Vice President Kamala Harris.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

KAMALA HARRIS, U.S. VICE PRESIDENT AND U.S. PRESIDENTIAL DEMOCRATIC CANDIDATE: The American people face a choice between two different paths for our economy. Donald Trump intends to take America backward while raising taxes on the middle class by almost $4,000 a year.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: All right. What do these tax plans really mean for you? CNN's Matt Egan and Daniel Dale are here to sift through all of this. Matt, let me start with you. What are economists saying about these tax plans?

MATT EGAN, CNN REPORTER: Well, Jim, both of these candidates have laid out a laundry list of promises, right? Everything from bringing jobs that were shipped overseas home to tackling the affordability crisis. But these proposals, they carry hefty price tags and neither candidate has clearly laid out plans to fully pay for them. So, that's why experts say that the national debt is likely to go sharply higher, no matter who wins in November.

Now, under the Harris economic plan, the national debt would go up by $3.5 trillion over a decade. That's according to an analysis from the Committee for a Responsible Federal Budget. Remember, Harris has called for extending some of the 2017 tax cuts. She's also called for expanding the child tax credit, the earned income tax credit.

But look at that. Under the Trump agenda, the Trump proposals, the national debt would spike far more, by 7.5 trillion under his plans. The big cost, of course, is fully extending the Trump tax cuts. But Trump has also laid out other plans. He wants to impose no tax on overtime, no tax on Social Security, no tax on tips, and a 15 percent tax on U.S. manufacturers. Trump has promised so many giveaways that both the Wall Street Journal and The New York Times have said that his economic policies look like they were crafted by Oprah, except instead of free cars, of course, he's offering tax breaks. Jim.

ACOSTA: And Daniel we also have a Trump ad on taxes. Let's watch that.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Kamala Harris is going to significantly raise taxes.

HARRIS: Taxes are going to have to go up. Kamala's plan will raise families' taxes by nearly $2,600 a year. Under Kamala, prices have already soared. Now, she'd make it worse, with even higher taxes.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ACOSTA: All right. Daniel, what are the facts here?

DANIEL DALE, CNN SENIOR REPORTER: Jim, this might be the single most deceptive campaign ad I've seen all cycle. In that short clip, we had two just horrifically edited quotes, plus a made-up statistic. So, the first quote, they said The New York Times, and they say, Harris is seeking to significantly raise taxes. OK. Let's go to The New York Times and see what that article actually says.

What that article actually says is Harris is seeking to significantly raise taxes on the wealthiest Americans and large corporations. So, those very important words edited out. Now, similarly, that clip features Harris herself, saying taxes are going to have to go up. So, OK, let's go to that 2019 event where she said something like this. Listen to what the actual quote was.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

HARRIS: And also looking at estate taxes are going to have to go up for the richest Americans.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DALE: So, estate taxes are going to have to go up for the richest Americans, not taxes, a little different. ACOSTA: Some editing there, yes.

[10:50:00]

DALE: A little bit of editing. And then, the third thing. So, they cite the Tax Foundation, which is a right leaning but credible think tank saying that Harris her plan will raise taxes $2,600 for American families. I reached out to the Tax Foundation, Senior Economist and Research Director Erica York. She said, quote, "I don't know where that number comes from." She added, that is not our estimate for Harris' tax proposals.

So, what it actually is, is an estimate of what would happen if all of the Trump tax cuts were allowed to expire. But first of all, that's not Harris' plan. We don't know exactly how she plans to handle those expirations or non-expirations. And second of all, as Matt laid out, she's laid out a whole bunch of other proposals. So, again, this number is not a number that applies to Harris' plan in particular.

ACOSTA: Yes, fascinating. And, Matt, Trump's big pitch is that he will impose new tariffs, massive new tariffs, especially on China that will stimulate American manufacturing, pay for his tax cuts, he says. Can you walk us through how this is all going to work, how these tariffs are going to work, and whether the claims from Trump really hold water?

EGAN: Well, Jim, this is really important because tariffs might be Trump's favorite tool, right? I mean, he's called them the greatest thing ever invented. He's called himself the tariff man. And yet, he repeatedly falsely describes how tariffs actually work, because he claims that China would pay the price of these tariffs and that billions of dollars would come pouring in, but that's just not how it works.

Let me give you an example. Let's say there's a Chinese company that makes sneakers and they're going to make those sneakers overseas. And then, when those goods are shipped to the United States, they're going to face that 60 percent tariff that Trump has proposed. So, instead of costing $100, this is going to cost $160. And so, now the U.S. company, the U.S. sneaker company, importing those goods has to decide, are they going to eat the cost of those tariffs? That might mean paying workers less, maybe it means they're going to hire fewer workers, or are they're going to pass along some or all of the costs to consumers in the form of higher prices? And study after study finds that Americans bore almost the entire cost of the Trump tariffs on China.

ACOSTA: Yes.

EGAN: And so, that's why there's all these studies out there that find that the typical family is going to pay more under the Trump tariff plan. There's estimates out there between $1,350 and $3,900 a year in costs for the average middle class family.

And remember, Trump has promised to make prices plunge. But again, economists, they don't agree with that. The Wall Street Journal, just this week, came out with a survey of economists and it found that more than two-thirds, 68 percent of the economists who were surveyed, they say that prices would rise faster under Trump than under Harris. Just 12 percent said that it would be under Harris.

And one other point here is the whole point of the tariffs is to try to bring back jobs from overseas. But again, the survey from the Wall Street Journal, the economists say that they think that manufacturing employment in the U.S. would actually be lower under Trump's plans than without.

ACOSTA: Yes. Yes, we just don't know what the impact of these tariffs are going to be long-term from a macroeconomic standpoint either. I mean, for the industry, that's important. And, Daniel, Trump has made a lot of claims about tariffs and how they're going to impact Americans, but give us the facts here.

DALE: Yes. So, two big lies Trump tells over and over. First of all, he says they won't even affect Americans. China pays this. China paid us hundreds of billions of dollars, as Matt laid out, Americans pay these tariffs. The second thing he says is that no one before I was president had ever generated even 10 cents from tariffs on China. Aside from the fact that Americans pay the tariffs, the U.S. has had tariffs on China since the 1700s and had averaged about $12 billion a year in those tariff revenues under Barack Obama.

ACOSTA: He missed the part going back to the 1700s.

DALE: He did. He did.

ACOSTA: All right. All right. Matt Egan, Daniel Dale, very important fact-check, very important information for Americans who are worried about prices at the grocery store, prices at the car dealership and so on. Really important stuff. Thanks guys so much. Really appreciate.

Coming up. Bizarre conspiracy theories creating headaches for people already dealing with so much in the wake of Hurricane Helene. The mayor of Chimney Rock, North Carolina joins us next in the next hour to set the record straight. Stay with us for that.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[10:55:00]

ACOSTA: Thank you very much for joining me this morning. I want to bring in my good friend and colleague Pamela Brown. Pam, I don't know if you saw this, that the pandas have arrived back in Washington. We're getting those pandas back. Not the same pandas, but different pandas.

PAMELA BROWN, CNN ANCHOR: We are. Not the same pandas, different pandas. I can't wait to go to the zoo and visit them. You know, pandas just -- there's something about them that just brings people joy and comfort and especially this time of year where there's a lot of nerves, Jim, about the election and anxiety. We have a segment coming up about election anxiety. Pandas are what we all need right now. Would you agree with that? ACOSTA: I would agree with that. We'll call this our timeline cleanser moment of the day, seeing these pandas come out. I do feel a little bad for these guys being in those steel boxes. I assume they're fine. They're doing OK.

But, you know, Pamela, I grew up in this area as a kid going to the National Zoo, and my favorite thing to see was the pandas. Like that was my favorite animal growing up because the pandas were here in Washington.

BROWN: Oh, yes.

ACOSTA: So, it was so sad when they left and it's great that they're back.

BROWN: It is. Panda diplomacy at its finest right here. They're in that box, folks. Like you said, I'm sure they have nice accommodations in there, one would hope.

ACOSTA: Yes.

BROWN: But yes. I mean, it's, you know, pandemonium --

ACOSTA: There you go.

BROWN: -- in D.C., whenever you get the pandas. And the --

[11:00:00]