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U.S. Lifts Long-Range Weapons Ban on Ukraine; World Leaders Gather in Rio for G20 Summit. Aired 4-4:30a ET

Aired November 18, 2024 - 04:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[04:00:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

NICK PATON WALSH, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: This gets the United States deeper involved in Ukraine's war at an utterly key time. Ultimately, we are seeing here the Biden administration in its closing months taking this significant step.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: I think he's not only unqualified, he is really disqualified. Are we really going to have an attorney general who there's credible allegations he was involved in child sex trafficking, potential illicit drug use.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: The G20 can have a very busy agenda on paper, but it's what happens on the sidelines, the private conversations that also could generate news.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ANNOUNCER: Live from London, this is CNN NEWSROOM with Max Foster and Christina Macfarlane.

MAX FOSTER, CNN ANCHOR: Hello, a warm welcome to our viewers joining us from the U.S. and around the world. I'm Max Foster.

CHRISTINA MACFARLANE, CNN ANCHOR: And I'm Christina Macfarlane. It's Monday, November 18th, 9 a.m. here in London, 4 a.m. in Washington, where there's been a significant shift in U.S. policy when it comes to the war in Ukraine.

FOSTER: President Joe Biden is now allowing Kyiv to use powerful long range U.S. weapons to strike deeper inside Russia. The decision had been under consideration for months as Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy pressed Washington for the green light, but U.S. officials have been divided and concerned it could escalate the conflict.

MACFARLANE: The weapons which are said to have a range of about 190 miles are expected to be used primarily in Russia's Kursk region for now. That's where Russian forces are looking to take back territory alongside North Korean troops who've joined the Russian offensive. President Zelenskyy had this message after the news of the U.S. decision.

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VOLODYMYR ZELENSKYY, UKRAINIAN PRESIDENT (through translator): Today, there's a lot of talk in the media about us receiving permission for respective actions. But strikes are not carried out with words. Such things are not announced. Missiles will speak for themselves. They certainly will.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

FOSTER: Donald Trump's team has declined to comment with his communications director telling CNN that the incoming president is quote, the only person who can bring both sides together in order to negotiate peace and work towards ending the war and stopping the killing.

Now this decision by President Biden comes with just two months left in office and a lot of uncertainty about the future U.S. support for Ukraine when Donald Trump returns to the White House.

MACFARLANE: More now from CNN's Nick Paton Walsh.

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NICK PATON WALSH, CNN CHIEF INTERNATIONAL SECURITY CORRESPONDENT: Ultimately, it's not clear what impact this decision is going to have on the battlefield. There simply aren't enough of these attack of longer range U.S. precision missiles to make a huge impact on Russia overnight. And that I think was one of the elements of the U.S. decision making process.

They weren't really going to be able to give enough to Ukraine to hugely change the battlefield. What is hugely important though, is the amount of time in which President Joe Biden has said he simply didn't want to make this decision because of how escalatory the introduction of these weapons would be. Well, here, he's made a complete vault fast and said, OK, I'm going to introduce this technology and allow Ukraine to hit deeper inside of Russia.

Now I should point out that Ukraine in the gap while waiting for the White House to make its mind up has been developing longer range drones and they've been quite successful at hitting airports, parts of Russian energy infrastructure, wreaking havoc, frankly, at a pretty low cost. And indeed, it's a program that the U.S. decided to try and assist and fund according to some reports because it was doing quite so well.

But the symbolic nature of this is what is so entirely key. They won't necessarily have enough missiles to make a big difference. But this gets the United States deeper involved in Ukraine's war at an utterly key time. The White House is saying this is a response to Russia's escalation of introducing North Korean troops into the fight, most likely to retake the Kursk region that Ukraine invaded back in August.

But ultimately, we are seeing here the Biden administration in its closing months, taking this significant step. Now, it will likely complicate the life of Donald Trump. Potentially, he can reverse this decision when he becomes president on January the 20th in a matter of hours.

But it certainly puts the U.S. deeper inside this war and potentially will make the Kremlin maybe angrier and demand more at the negotiating table. This also follows a very familiar pattern for the Biden administration when it turns of their aid they've been giving to Ukraine. We've seen with the HIMARS precision missile, the Abrams tank, with the F-16 jet, all things Ukraine has asked for, for months, and then been told by the White House they can't have them.

[04:05:00]

Allies have stepped forward and publicly and privately briefed how much they want this technology to be given to Ukraine. And then ultimately, almost when perhaps Ukraine has given up asking, that technology is furnished to Kyiv. It's exactly the same story with these ATACMS.

Now, we are in an utterly key moment here. These new missiles may not change the battlefield. In fact, there have been some suggestions by U.S. officials that key attack aircraft, these missiles may have been aimed at have moved out of their range deeper inside of Russia, although some analysts have presented a long list of targets they could still potentially hit.

In the next two to three months, we're going to see Ukraine and Russia throw everything they can to put themselves potentially in the best position on the battlefield ahead of the Trump administration.

We don't know Trump's plan. We do know he thinks he can end the conflict in 24 hours. We do know that many of his top national security picks are not fan of the endless assistance that NATO currently thinks it wants to provide Ukraine.

So change is most likely coming and much of the week talking to officials in European capitals about what that may indeed mean for the Western alliance behind Ukraine going forwards. But we're going to see now these ATACMS and longer range missiles part of the bid to give Ukraine a better hand ahead of any talks that may indeed come next year. But the battlefield changing so fast at this point in Russia's favor. We are looking for some very stark months ahead.

Nick Paton Walsh, CNN, London.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

MACFARLANE: Ukraine is reporting widespread damage after Russia's largest aerial attack in months targeted the country's energy infrastructure.

FOSTER: The strikes across Ukraine also killed at least five people and triggered blackouts. The spokesperson for the U.N. Secretary- General says he strongly condemns these strikes, which will only increase the stopping of Ukrainians heading into the winter months.

MACFARLANE: And more Russian missile attacks were reported Sunday night, including a strike in the northeastern Ukrainian city of Sumy that killed 11 people, including two children.

FOSTER: Officials say 68 others were injured in an explosion after the missile hit a residential area. Six apartment buildings were damaged. A separate strike hit the city's energy infrastructure and cut off power supplies.

Nada joins us now. We'll talk in a moment about this permission the Ukrainians have got. But it does come off the back of a particularly intense period of attacks from Russia.

NADA BASHIR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Absolutely. We've seen Russia unleashing one of the most intense attacks on Ukrainian territory that we've really seen in months, as you mentioned, just overnight, seeing those attacks on Sumy killing at least 11 people, 68 others injured. But we've also seen Russia now targeting Ukraine's energy infrastructure once again across multiple cities from Odesa to Dnipro and, of course, energy infrastructure in Sumy as well.

We've seen blackouts now taking place as a result, and this has really ramped up the rhetoric from Ukrainian officials, including the President Volodymyr Zelenskyy, calling for further support, particularly on the military front from the United States when it comes to trying to prevent these attacks from Russia, particularly when it's targeting energy infrastructure over the winter months. And we are still seeing civilians being killed as a result.

MACFARLANE: With regard to these long weapons that were agreed to overnight, we've yet to hear from Moscow, from Putin, any sort of response yet. But we know that just a couple of weeks ago, Putin had said that if these long-range weapons were used to hit Russia, that would amount to a serious escalation from NATO allies. And that's really kept President Biden from crossing that red line previously. Do we expect any escalation to come from this? What is the state of play now?

BASHIR: Well, that is certainly a concern for many U.S. officials. And that's why this has been such a point of debate within the Biden administration, fears that this could lead to an escalation, and also questions around the stockpile supply as well, the effect that this can really have in terms of actually having enough supply for Ukraine to make a tangible and significant change on the battlefield.

Now, we know that President Zelenskyy met with the U.S. President Joe Biden at the White House in September. Sources say, and officials familiar with the talk say that they discussed the potential targets that the Ukrainian armed forces could potentially hit with these missiles and why this would be such a game changer for the Ukrainian armed forces in terms of gaining momentum in the war.

But at that time, we had also heard warnings from, as you mentioned, President Putin, directly towards NATO. I'll just read you a bit of what he had to say in September, that this will mean that NATO countries, the U.S. and European countries are at war with Russia. And if this is the case, then bearing in mind the change in the essence of this conflict, we will make appropriate decisions in response to the threats that will be posed to us. And he has warned that if indeed there is support in supplying these

weapons from a nuclear power, such as the United States, then that would be essentially an opening for Russia to take further action, potentially nuclear action. So a point of concern that we haven't yet heard from the Kremlin, we are expecting a press briefing today from the Kremlin, certainly perhaps this will be a key focus for the members of the press joining that call.

[04:10:03]

But again, this could be an escalation, but this is something that President Zelenskyy has been pushing for months now. Clearly the Biden administration assessing this is now the right time in the war to do so.

MACFARLANE: All right, Nada Bashir, thank you.

Now exiled Russian opposition leaders, including Yulia Navalnaya, the widow of Russian opposition leader Alexei Navalny, rallied in Berlin on Sunday. They're calling for an end to the war in Ukraine.

FOSTER: Thousands took part in the march to show that there are many Russians who disagree with the war but can't voice their opinions because of repression in their native land.

MACFARLANE: Well the protest ended at the Russian embassy with protesters holding up signs reading Putin is a killer and no peace under Russian occupation.

FOSTER: Tomorrow marks 1,000 days since Russia launched its full-scale invasion of Ukraine.

MACFARLANE: Ukrainians are honoring those who've been lost and contemplating an uncertain future as the war quickly approaches the three-year mark.

With more, we're joined now by Ukrainian parliament member Oleksiy Goncharenko, live from Odesa, Ukraine. Thank you so much for joining us.

Let's talk first about these long-range missiles, something Ukraine has been requesting and waiting for, for a very long time. In your view, is this going to be a game-changer for Ukraine? What impact do you expect these missiles to have on the battlefield?

OLEKSIY GONCHARENKO, UKRAINE PARLIAMENT MEMBER: Yes, definitely we welcome this decision. It's a big pity that it took 1,000 days, almost 1,000 days, to make this decision. But better late than never.

But in order not to be too late and too little, too late probably, yes, but too little, it also should include a number of these missiles. Because if it will be 10, 20, 100 missiles, that will unfortunately not change a lot. If we want to have a game-changer to make a real difference, it should be hundreds of these missiles delivered. And I hope that Biden's administration will do this now, not waiting for January. And I ask them to do this now, together with this permission. That can be really important.

Also, we hear that maybe this permission will be only for Kursk region, where North Korean troops are now. I think it's not right, because it's again Ukraine inside some very strict red lines. Because we need a wider permission. Because if Russia will know that only in one region they are threatened, that will not be a big problem for them.

FOSTER: Will President Zelenskyy stick to those red lines? In the past, he has been aware of them, and he's crossed them, and he's got away with it. Could he use these long-range missiles to fire outside that region you just specified?

GONCHARENKO: Never, ever Ukraine crossed the restrictions which were given by our allies.

FOSTER: Well, I'm talking about Kursk, for example. They said they wouldn't be going into Russian territory, which is something that allies have said they did.

GONCHARENKO: We never said that we will not go inside Russian territory. It's our right, according to international law, to attack or aggressor.

FOSTER: I understand that, but OK, red lines set by America. That was a red line that was set by America. I'm just giving examples.

GONCHARENKO: No, that was a red line not to use American missiles and weaponry there. But Ukraine attacked this territory with what we have. So it's not a red line.

Again, we always follow what we promised to our allies, and that will be the same here.

MACFARLANE: But on the subject of Kursk, we know that there are some 50,000 North Korean and Russian soldiers gathered in that region right now. Do you expect, with the supply of these long-range missiles, that you will be able to force those troops back and to retain hold of that Kursk region with this added weaponry now?

GONCHARENKO: It can be. I hope it will help us. It's definitely -- a lot of speaking about some escalations and red lines.

Look, all these axis of chaos, Iran, North Korea, China standing behind them. They don't have any red lines. North Koreans already are attacking Europeans in Europe.

It's a huge escalation. This is the Third World War. Watch the map. Where is North Korea? Where is the Ukrainian-Russian border? And they are there.

And I think this is a big story. But if it will be only a possibility to attack them in the Kursk region, Putin will move them to the Belgrade region, to other neighbor regions. So it will be just a cat- mouse game. It's not how it should be.

[04:15:00]

And the second thing, when Russian allies are sending to Russia not only our weaponry now, but also troops, it's the time to raise the issue when our allies will send troops to Ukraine. Maybe not to a front line to fight, but to help us, for example, to protect Ukrainian-Belarusian border, to help us train Ukrainian soldiers inside Ukraine to make it quicker. I think the time came.

FOSTER: You mentioned World War III. I think the wider view is that it only becomes World War III if NATO troops get directly involved in the conflict. That isn't happening just yet.

But, you know, obviously social media is blowing up with World War III as a hashtag. There is a huge amount of concern that American weapons being fired into Russia will trigger a World War III. What would you say to reassure people?

GONCHARENKO: One question. North Koreans attacking Ukraine. Isn't it World War III? Iranian drones killing Ukrainian people. Isn't it a World War III? So what is a World War III? Well, we should give a definition. It's definitely the war in which more than two nations are involved already. And we are using Western weaponry for almost three years already.

So all these red lines are absolutely artificial. World War III is happening. The only one question is, will it be a full-scale World War like it was World War II?

Or we can stop it in the beginning by stopping Russia in Ukraine. Because if Russia will be in any way successful in Ukraine, not just Russia, we should say no, Russia, Iran, North Korea at least, maybe China also, they will move forward. They will move to Taiwan, to Georgia, Kazakhstan, Baltic states and so on.

That's the only question that we have.

MACFARLANE: It is the case, or it's likely to be the case, that when the new United States administration, Donald Trump moves into office in two months time, there will be a reversal of supply, for instance, for these long-range missiles and perhaps other weaponry as well. Your president has said that the war will end sooner with Donald Trump in office. What is your expectation for the peace proposal that may come your way? And what is Ukraine willing to accept?

GONCHARENKO: First of all, I would like to say one minute about what should be done before the inauguration of Donald Trump. What President Biden can do now. Not just about weapons, it's about sanctions.

Because a lot of sanctions were not full. And now it's time to put financial restrictions on Russia on oil and gas payments before Biden administration was concerned about price on oil. Now it's time to impose these sanctions against Russia.

Now also it's time for President Biden to put all the decisions on sanctions on the basis of another legislation in the United States, which will need the permission of Congress to backpedal it, if Donald Trump will decide this. But at least it will be also needed permission of Congress. And President Biden still has two months to do such steps. And I hope they will do this and many others.

Speaking about Donald Trump and his coming and what is his plan. We don't know. We are ready to listen. We are eager to listen. No one in the world wants this war to end more than Ukrainians. Because every day we are dying. Every day we are suffering. So we want this war to end.

And if Donald Trump will help us to do this in a fair way, we would be the happiest people in the world. And there will be monuments to Donald Trump in our country. But we don't know what exactly Donald Trump wants to do.

So we are looking forward. We are waiting for. We have a lot of hopes, but also we have a lot of concerns.

FOSTER: Oleksiy Goncharenko in Odesa, Ukraine. Thank you so much for sparing your time with us today.

GONCHARENKO: Thank you.

FOSTER: World leaders in Rio de Janeiro for a meeting of the G20 group of nations with uncertainty looming in the face of a new U.S. administration.

MACFARLANE: Plus, sharing a mile-high meal that begs the question of whether Robert F. Kennedy Jr. is serious about making America healthy again. We've got the Candid Shots.

FOSTER: And Beyonce is working on a hometown holiday treat for her fans. How members of The Beehive can spend part of their Christmas with the superstar ahead on CNN.

[04:20:00]

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

MACFARLANE: Welcome back. U.S. President Joe Biden is looking to make the fight against climate change a key part of his legacy. During a historic first presidential visit to the Amazon, Mr. Biden urged the incoming administration to continue to embrace the economic progress offered by a clean energy revolution.

FOSTER: He didn't directly name President-elect Donald Trump, who has questioned whether climate change exists and vowed to reverse Mr. Biden's policies on gas and oil exploration. But Biden delivered a clear message after an aerial tour of the Amazon rainforest.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JOE BIDEN, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: It's no secret that I'm leaving office in January. I will have my -- I will leave my successor and my country in a strong foundation to build on if they choose to do so. It's true, some may seek to deny or delay the clean energy revolution that's underway in America.

But nobody, nobody can reverse it. Nobody. Not when so many people, regardless of party or politics, are enjoying its benefits.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

MACFARLANE: Now world leaders are in Rio de Janeiro for the G20 summit.

FOSTER: That's a state plan to address issues from poverty and hunger to reforming global institutions, as well as climate change.

MACFARLANE: This is U.S. President Joe Biden's final appearance at the meeting and there's speculation about how the Trump administration will handle international issues.

For more we go live now to Marc Stewart joining us in Beijing. And Marc, obviously looking at China, no doubt they're viewing this as a bit of an opportunity with any sort of looming volatility around the Trump administration to make inroads elsewhere. I mean, what are they looking to get out of this summit, do you think?

[04:25:04]

MARC STEWART, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Indeed, Max and Christina. Look, this is a prime opportunity for China to really tell the rest of the world that despite all of the political uncertainty in the United States and how this new administration will emerge, China is going to be a go-to source for stability.

The G20 obviously has a very full agenda, but it's going to be these sideline meetings, these one-on-one meetings between Chinese diplomats and their counterparts from around the world to really spread this messaging and to draw on this other thing that we've talked about a lot, to really draw this wedge between the United States and its allies.

We heard from one analyst from a think tank who suggested this is a time for China to really show its commitment to peace and development. And we've already seen it. It was just last week that a massive port, a mega port, was unveiled in Peru. $1.3 billion of that was funded because of the Chinese government.

Obviously, it's the world's second largest economy, and it wants to show its reach both politically and economically. So Max and Christina, as we look ahead to Rio, expect very strong messaging from China that it is going to be the source of stability in a very uncertain world.

FOSTER: The big sort of headline moment was actually on the sidelines, wasn't it? Biden and Chinese counterpart Xi meeting at the previous meeting. What are you expecting here?

STEWART: Well, this is going to be a chance for Xi Jinping not only to continue his discussions with President Biden to say that China is very much focused on stability and communication, perhaps to send a message to the incoming Trump White House. That's what it wants to focus on. But he'll also have a chance to meet with other world leaders, such as the British prime minister, such as his counterparts from India, Australia, as well as Japan.

It will be a who's who of world leadership. So I'm going to look not only to see if there's any further interaction between he and Joe Biden, but also those world leaders who are also expected to attend.

FOSTER: Marc in Beijing, thank you so much for that.

MACFARLANE: Now in Australia, former longtime radio host Alan Jones reportedly is being charged with assault. TV footage on Monday shows Jones arriving at a police station in custody. Reuters reports the 83- year-old is facing 24 assault and sexual touching offenses following accusations he assaulted young men.

Police allege the offenses took place between 2001 and 2019 against eight victims, the youngest being 17. He denies the assault. Allegations made against him when they were reported last year in Australia.

FOSTER: Still to come, Donald Trump's picks to fill cabinet positions coming under fire, more fire in Washington. And what lawmakers have to say about their chances of being confirmed by the Senate.

MACFARLANE: And Israel launches two deadly attacks on Lebanon's capital in one day, killing another key Hezbollah figure.