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CNN International: Trump Announces 90-Day Pause on Reciprocal Tariffs; China Tariffs Increased to 125 Percent; China Raises Retaliatory Tariffs to 84 Percent; U.S. Bond Market Sell-Off. U.S. Markets Soar As Trump Hits 90-Pause On Most New Tariffs; Trump Claims "China Wants To Make A Deal"; More Than 120 Killed After Roof Of Nightclub Collapses. Aired 6-7p ET
Aired April 09, 2025 - 18:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[18:00:00]
JIM SCIUTTO, CNN ANCHOR: Hello and welcome to our viewers joining us from all over the world. Another busy news day. I'm Jim Sciutto in Washington.
Just ahead this hour, stock markets soar as President Trump announces a 70 -- a 90-day pause on reciprocal tariffs he imposed on most countries around the world. However, it still singles out China hitting it with a rate of at least 125 percent.
Did President Trump yield? He says he admits he was watching the bond markets. Was it that volatility that convinced him he had to pause now? We're going to have all the analysis next.
We begin with today's just dizzying turn of events. In the markets in President Trump's still ongoing global trade war, Trump backing down significantly, but far from, entirely from his trade fight, pausing all tariffs on U.S. trading partners that kicked in Wednesday for 90 days. One major exception though that is China, where he is raising tariffs significantly now to 125 percent, that more than doubles the cost of its imports into the U.S.
Trump's partial about-face triggered a strong relief rally on Wall Street with all the major indices rebounding from what were multi-year lows, it was, at least for a day, the best day for stocks in 16 years. President Trump says he agreed to pause because the majority of America's trading partners he believes are willing to renegotiate their trade relationship with the U.S.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, U.S. PRESIDENT: They're all calling, how do we do this? They all want to make a deal. Somebody had to do what we did. And I did a 90-day pause for the people that didn't retaliate because I told them, if you retaliate, we're going to double it. And that's what I did with China because they did retaliate. So, we'll see how it all works out. I think it's going to work out amazing.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Even Trump admitted though he is watching the bond markets, which he described as getting yippy. Despite today's temporary retrieve, many other tariffs do remain in effect, including those 10 percent across the board, tariffs against trading partners that Trump put into place last week, plus 25 percent global tariffs specifically on steel, cars, and aluminum.
Today's U-turn also does not solve the massive uncertainties that businesses face as they try to navigate the daily twists and turns and changes and questions of this ongoing trade mess. Delta Airlines and Walmart on Wednesday said they cannot provide near-term guidance because of that tariff confusing confusion.
Neil Irwin joins me now. He is the chief economic correspondent for Axios. Neil, good to have you on.
NEIL IRWIN, CHIEF ECONOMIC CORRESPONDENT, AXIOS: Thanks for having me.
SCIUTTO: Investors certainly saw danger in the bond markets overnight, specifically a spike in yields when they would normally be expected to fall during a stock market crash. Now, Trump himself noted that the bond markets, as I said a moment ago, got yippy. Is that what actually forced his hand here?
IRWIN: It certainly seems to have gotten everyone's attention in the White House in the administration. You know, last week when these were first announced last Wednesday, everything moved the direction you would expect, stocks fell but so did bond yields, bonds rallied. That was the expectation that the Fed would cut interest rates, offset some of the economic damage from tariffs.
What's happened this week is a much more volatile and worrying kind of scenario, as you say, yield rising, bond prices falling. And that has suggested there's some worldwide worry that the U.S. economy is not where you want to park your money, that the U.S. government is not a reliable borrower, and that's the kind of thing no president wants to see. And that seems to at least been a contributing factor in the action the president took today.
SCIUTTO: Now, as you know, Trump always repackages even failure as a win. But given this back down, which it is, because remember, in recent days, his advisers, Trump himself had said they would not back down. Do you see a president that is at least less committed to tariffs as a weapon of a global trade war, this kind of across-the- board tariffs? Is even he wavering on that position going forward?
IRWIN: Look, I think on principle, he loves tariffs. He thinks tariffs are good for the U.S. and is willing to do them. And he has implemented them, right? We have 125 percent on China, and on Canada and Mexico, those are still in place. 10 percent around the world is not a small number. I mean, that's four times what tariffs were this time, three months ago.
[18:05:00] So, look, these are still very aggressive tariffs. They just aren't the extremes that were announced a week ago. But to your point, look, he's -- he is backing up, there's no question, you know. The idea that they spent all weeks saying, these are not up for negotiation. This is a new normal. They backed away from that. There's just no two ways about it.
SCIUTTO: Now, Trump said, as we just played a short time ago, that he's gotten dozens of calls from trading partners to negotiate. I haven't seen any details as to what exactly what concessions those trading partners are offering. Has the administration provided any details of what exactly those trading partners are offering in return?
IRWIN: No. I mean, look there's no active negotiations happening. You can't negotiate with 75 different countries in the space of 24 hours. By the way, when all the principal -- leading people were on TV half the time and doing different events, you know, that's not how you negotiate complex trade deals to reset the entire terms of global finance. And really, 90 days isn't enough to do that either.
What will these countries eventually concede? We don't know. We do know, the U.S. doesn't have very clear-cut specific asks. You know, they calculated these tariffs just based on trade deficits and export flows. A very kind of crude measurement. It's not like they had this specific launch list of requests from Japan, from South Korea, from Vietnam, name a country. Instead, they kind of just want the trade deficit to go away.
So, look, as these get to actual negotiations, what is -- what are the contours of them? Who does them? How do they play out? Can they happen in 90 days? I'm skeptical. Those are the open questions right now.
SCIUTTO: Lots of questions. Neil Irwin, thanks so much for joining.
IRWIN: Thank you.
SCIUTTO: Joining me now on the politics of all, this is CNN Senior Political Analyst Ron Brownstein. Ron, good to have you.
RON BROWNSTEIN, CNN SENIOR POLITICAL ANALYST: Hello, Jim.
SCIUTTO: I'll begin with a very basic question, did Trump blink?
BROWNSTEIN: Absolutely. Do you remember James Carville once said, you know, I used to want to come back as the president or the pope, but now I've decided I want to come back as the bond market?
SCIUTTO: Yes.
BROWNSTEIN: Because you can intimidate anybody. And I think that's what we saw. I mean, it was a very revealing moment yesterday when President Trump said, I know what the hell I'm doing. It's sort of like when Nixon said, I'm not a crook. If you have to assert it, you know, in public you've kind of already lost the argument. It's almost like I'm not a kook. And I think that, clearly, I mean, you know, the president had to back down. But as you have pointed out, backing down leaves some very serious tariffs in place that Americans are going to feel, not only on China, but I think the latest reporting is that he is not changing his tariffs on Mexico or Canada. So, all three of America's largest trading partners are facing elevated tariffs, 25 percent in the Mexico, Canada, over 100 percent. As well as what the tariffs on autos.
So, you know, all those voters who have expressed clear concern in polls about what this means for them, and we can talk about that, they're not out of the woods by any means.
SCIUTTO: Yes. I mean, to that point, just China and the U.S. in the worst of this, that's half the global economy, right? And it's a lot of money moving in both directions. All right. So --
BROWNSTEIN: And a lot of low-cost goods, by the way, right?
SCIUTTO: Yes. Yes. OK. Let's go to some of the numbers, because Quinnipiac at University had a new national poll out on a number of things. First of all, Trump's approval, 41 percent, 53 percent disapprove. But it's the opinions on tariffs, I want to note in particular. 72 percent of voters think the tariffs will hurt the U.S. economy. 22 percent think it will help them in the longer-term. 53 percent of the voters agree, 41 percent.
I wonder, this is clearly a different Trump in the second term, because on a whole host of things he just believes he has a mandate and doesn't seem to care as much about polls, et cetera, as he did in the first term. But do numbers like this move this president?
BROWNSTEIN: I don't know if they move him, but they certainly move -- they -- Republicans in Congress certainly can't, you know, ignore what they are seeing. You know, as I wrote last month, you know, in his first term, confidence in his management of the economy was a floor underneath him despite whatever else might be going on, you know, whatever controversy was swirling around him, voters mostly expressed confidence in his management of the economy. It's very different in the second term.
Consistently, he is pulling lower on the economy and on inflation and now trade and tariffs than on other issues, rather than a floor lifting up, it's a kind of, you know, a headwind pushing him down. You know, in that Quinnipiac poll today and in a separate poll today from economists in YouGov, only one-third of independents that they approved of the way he is handling the economy.
After 2017, Jim, in his first term, it ever got below 46 percent among independents in Gallup polling for his entire presidency. So, there are real concerns here. And it's not only that Quinnipiac question about, do you think it will help or hurt the U.S. economy? What do you think it will do to your personal finances?
[18:10:00]
Again, in that economist poll today, Hispanics, three to one, saying it will hurt them personally. Independents, I think, was more than three to one. So, there's a -- you know, voters have kind of rendered an instant judgment on this even before more -- most of them have gone into effect, and they are clearly worried about what it means at a time when inflation in all polls remains their top concerns about the economy.
SCIUTTO: Yes. I mean, we're just minutes past an election that was driven in large part by concerns about inflation. Ron Brownstein, thanks so much.
BROWNSTEIN: Thanks for having me.
SCIUTTO: Well, President Trump, by all indications, seems to be narrowing at least the pointiest parts of his trade war to China, raising the tariff rate on that country to at least 125 percent in total. Beijing is accusing the U.S. of trade bullying.
Marc Stewart joins me now from Beijing. And I wonder, listening to President Trump today, he said, as he is often said, he's a good friend with Xi Jinping. He's got a good relationship with him. He seems to think China will negotiate. Ut based on official comments from China as well as in CCP influenced newspapers there, et cetera, are Chinese leaders in a mood to negotiate? What kind of signals are they sending out?
MARC STEWART, CNN CORRESPONDENT: I think at this point, Jim, I think that China and the leadership is continuing with this broader message of defiance. And it's clear, it's not just in statements from the government, not just from state media, we have been looking at social media over the last 24 hours or so. In fact, in the last few hours there's very much been this theme of fighting back and for China to stand up strong.
You know, the president said that he feels that China wants to make a deal. But, at this point, the statements that we are hearing from the government reflect otherwise. In fact, one official was asked, what would it take for a sit-down meeting? Will there be a sit-down meeting between these two leaders? And the response was that the United States has not expressed any kind of genuine willingness to have such serious talks.
Now, there could be a broader narrative in all of this, that this is the precursor to a much talked about trade deal. We heard President Trump very early on in his presidency, or if not in the moments leading up to taking office, about how we'd like to come visit China. That could be possible, but it's going to have to be to sign some kind of trade agreement, to have some kind of trade deal.
These two men have had this on and off again, relationship. And right now, we're at this very frosty point. If we look back to 2018 when Xi Jinping and President Trump had some good moments and then some bad moments. At one time he was at Mar-a-Lago, they were having chocolate cake together.
The other big message, though, I think that's important to emphasize is that Beijing, at least publicly, is saying that, we're in this fight for the long haul. Beijing has forged these new economic alliances with Africa, with Latin America. We've seen publicity about headlines about conversations with the European Union, and that is messaging that we are hearing loud and strong here in Beijing.
In fact, let me, play for you a remark that we heard just yesterday from a Chinese official.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
LIN JUAN, SPOKESPERSON, CHINESE FOREIGN MINISTRY (through translator): External shocks cannot alter the fundamental strengths of China's economy. Its stability, abundant advantages, resilience, and great potential.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
STEWART: So, what will China do next? Of course, that is the big question. It could certainly levy more tariffs. We could see restrictions on rare earth minerals, which a lot of American companies depend on. We could see some restrictions on pharmaceuticals.
I think, Jim, thing that we're trying to grapple with right now is, you know, what is political negotiation, what is facade, and then what is reality? Hopefully, we'll find out. You know, it's early morning here in Beijing. Hopefully, we'll find out when we get a government briefing later today here in China.
SCIUTTO: Marc Stewart in Beijing, thanks so much. Well, Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent says today's tariff U-turn was President Trump's overarching plan from the beginning. That said, president has seen growing pushback on Capitol Hill even for members of his own party to the tariff policy. Members of Congress on Wednesday said they are relieved by the president's walk back today.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
REP. DUSTY JOHNSON (R-SD): Done a really good job in the last few days of making it clear to America that they're taking negotiations, right? They're having conversations with some of these key trading partners. I'm not the world's biggest fan of tariffs -- high tariffs as a permanent part of the economic landscape. I'm not opposed at all to using tariffs as a negotiating tool. It seems like that's what the White House is doing. I think the president's shown a willingness to change tactics as the situation changes. And so, we're just going to need to see what the next few weeks hold.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
[18:15:00]
SCIUTTO: Well, fact is the past few weeks of tariffs has many on Capitol Hill, both parties, fearing the president hold too much power over U.S. trade policy, and they are looking to claw some of it back as granted by the Constitution.
Republican Congressman Jeff Hurd is one of the sponsors of the bill that would give Congress powers to approve and also potentially remove new tariffs. And he joins me now from Capitol Hill. Thanks so much for taking the time.
REP. JEFF HURD (R-CO): Happy to be with you, Jim.
SCIUTTO: First, I want to begin on tariffs in general, because you're one of the lawmakers on the Hill of both parties who've expressed concerns about the damage of tariffs to consumers, businesses in your district. And I wonder, are tariffs -- is the U.S. tariff policy under Trump any less concerning to you at this hour than it was this morning before this 90-day pause?
HURD: Well, certainly, Jim, we've seen a lot change in the last 12 hours. But what I would say fundamentally is I support President Trump's effort to onshore domestic manufacturing, to grow American jobs, to make sure that we get more American products overseas. But we fundamentally need to make sure that we do it in the right way, in a way that accords with the Constitution, specifically Article 1, Section 8. And make sure that we have Congress having some insight into this and making sure that the tariff policy that we have is something that Congress has a role in as the Constitution contemplates.
SCIUTTO: So, what's your reaction to the house speaker now basically pushing off your ability to even get a vote on that, right? He -- there were some language, as you know, in the new budget bill, pushing that back several months. How do you react to that move?
HURD: Well, I think that's a different issue, Jim. The legislation that we're talking about is something that looks prospectively going forward and says if the president is going to implement tariffs, he has to do two things. He has to notify Congress within 48 hours. And then, Congress has 60 days within which to evaluate whether those tariffs are strategically advancing the national interests of the country, and then decides whether or not they'll remain in place or not. So, two different issues.
The legislation that we're proposing I think makes sense. It's solid and it accords with, like I said, our goal under the Constitution and making sure that the power is in the right place with congress.
SCIUTTO: The trouble is you need more votes, right? You don't just need a handful of Republican votes, you need a number. And if President Trump follows through on his own threat to veto such legislation, even if it gets passed, the Republican controlled House and Senate, it's not clear, but you do have the votes. I mean, do you believe that over time you will get there?
HURD: Well, Jim, one thing I've learned -- I haven't been in Congress very long, but one thing I've learned is the political situation can oftentimes change quickly. Fundamentally though, for me, what it means is I campaigned and told my constituents that I was running to support the Constitution and then to protect the citizens of Colorado's 3rd Congressional District. And I think that this legislation embodies that. And regardless of where it goes, it's something I stand by and I'm proud to be supporting. SCIUTTO: Tell me about tariffs, because you speak to economists who actually do the math on this. And they say that tariffs will raise prices for consumers, including in your district. And by the way, you look at the polling and Americans believe that tariffs will raise prices for them. So, why do you think the president doesn't see that?
HURD: Well, I think tariffs are useful. They're one very useful tool in the toolbox that we can have, and I think strategically, they can be employed in a way that helps our country, helps re-shore our manufacturing industry, particularly when it comes to national defense, which helps protect American industry when we're exporting products across oceans and make sure that we protect American jobs. We just need to make sure that we're doing it strategically and in the right place.
I do have some concerns about some of the broader-based tariffs, but I do think they have an important strategic role. But generally, I tend to be more of a free market individual. But I do see some role in certain strategic instances.
SCIUTTO: Do the current -- do the tariffs as currently implemented -- by the way, a number of them remain, you know, of the ones on China, 125 percent, you know, those affecting steel, aluminum, cars, et cetera, which the car makers themselves say are going to raise the prices of cars for voters in your district. Do the tariffs, as they currently stand, serve the purpose you're talking about, or are they too high?
HURD: Well, I think we'll have to see exactly what happens in the coming weeks. What I would tell you is there are other parts of the Republican agenda, President Trump's agenda, that will decrease costs for everyday Americans. Particularly important for my district is energy, energy dominance.
One of the hidden taxes that every American pays is bad energy policy that comes from bad energy policy, and I think a lot of the things that President Trump and Republicans are doing in Congress is going to lower costs in other areas, particularly when it comes to energy, which, again, operates as a hidden tax on every single American. If we can get those energy costs low I think we'll see positive effects ripple throughout the economy, in the gas station, at the pump, at the grocery store, and in your utility bills and beyond.
[18:20:00]
SCIUTTO: Final question. Hours before President Trump paused the tariffs today, he posted on Truth Social that it was a good time to buy stocks, and there are a number of folks in the market watching positions that were placed on the market just after that and before the pause was eventually publicly announced.
Do you believe Congress should investigate whether anyone connected to the administration traded off that information prior to it becoming public? Is that something that should be investigated?
HURD: Well, hearing that does give me some concern. I will tell you that I'm a member of Congress that does not believe we should be buying or selling individual securities as members of Congress. Me, personally, I just own mutual funds, broad index-based funds. The success of the American economy is my personal success. It is something that causes some concern for me. We may want to look at that. We'll have to see exactly what the details are.
SCIUTTO: OK. Congressman Jeff Hurd from Colorado, we do appreciate you taking the time this afternoon.
HURD: Thanks a lot, Jim. Happy to join you.
SCIUTTO: Coming up, the turmoil in the bond market may have been the real reason for President Trump's tariff pause. He might have even admitted it as much. We'll discuss these historic market moves and exactly why they cause so much concern.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SCIUTTO: One of the most troubling developments in the trade wars this week has been a sharp sell-off in the U.S. bond market, a market that has traditionally been a safe haven in times of economic uncertainty and distress and stock market falls. Bonds rebounded a bit Wednesday on word of Trump's tariff pause and a better-than-expected bond auction.
But coming into today, yields saw their biggest weekly jump since 2001, and even with today's rebound, 10-year yields remain above sensitive 4 percent levels. President Trump admitted Wednesday that he was paying close attention to that historic bond sell-off.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRUMP: I was watching the bond market. The bond market is very tricky. I was watching it, but if you look at it now, it's beautiful. The bond market right now is beautiful. But yes, I saw last night where people were getting a little queasy.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: A little queasy to say the least. Many believe the steep bond market losses were the real reason for Trump's tariff pause. Robert Tipp joins me now. He's the managing director and head of Global Bonds at PGIM Global Asset Manage Management. Robert, thanks so much for taking the time.
ROBERT TIPP, MANAGING DIRECTOR AND CHIEF INVESTMENT OFFICER, PGIM: Thank you.
[18:25:00]
SCIUTTO: So, can you explain exactly what investors and perhaps even the president himself saw in bond markets overnight that worried him so much?
TIPP: Sure. You know, yields have been rising at the long end of the yield curve, and the United States of course rolls a massive amount of ongoing debt that's been issued in the past and issues a trillion plus of treasuries every year, and it's in the market to the tune of tens of billions in many days, hundreds of millions, including T-bills (ph) of issuance.
So, it relies on the market, and those yields have been pushing higher. And not in small moves, but large moves, both in absolute terms. And within the bond market treasuries have been cheapening to other instruments, suggesting that there's a unique problem brewing in the treasury market. So, I think that was definitely cause for alarm for the president and for markets in general.
SCIUTTO: And big picture, was that a sign, that for that moment at least, the global financial markets did not see the U.S. as the safe haven, specifically the bond market, the safe haven that it usually is in times of distress?
TIPP: That's right. And normally in times of distress, the dollar goes up and people flock into treasuries. And even if Central Banks and emerging market countries are selling treasuries in order to raise dollars and protect their currencies -- case this time. This hasn't been the case for several weeks.
And so, I think there's been a sense that if we're raising tariffs and hurting other countries, why all are going down? And so, I think the United States has been, you know, appearing to be in a self-inflicting wound kind of cycle with the tariffs and the high volatility of policy changes.
SCIUTTO: Is it possible and is there a concern in the market that, well, a country such as China, for instance, that owns an enormous amount of U.S. bonds could use that as a way to turn the screws, right, or to retaliate against the U.S. for tariffs by selling those bonds?
TIPP: You know, on the margin these things are not only possible, but Russia, over the last decade plus, has really removed itself from the United States market. That began back in the financial crisis when they thought they were, you know, putting pressure on the United States when it was weak. And they have pretty much removed themselves.
But, you know, the markets are big, and the United States, for all of our foibles, enjoys a tremendous geographic security, defense capability. The biggest, broadest, deepest fixed income markets in the world that trade on a liquid basis in the hundreds of millions and billions from Sunday night to Friday night. There's nothing like it anyplace else in the world.
So, we have seen, you know, investors in some cases leave the treasury market. And you know, the largest holders of treasuries are in the realm of a trillion each. And those sums though have not been rising. So, the U.S. has not been relying on increasing holdings, and in all likelihood, can manage. But the problem is that it's not just a matter of Central Banks selling treasuries, which again is often the case in times of stress because they need the dollars themself for their own domestic situations and meeting their own debts. But it's the notion that the tariffs are really hurting industry. They're going to raise prices on U.S. consumers. They're hurting the economy. And the Fed, another point that looked like it was going to be a problem starting from Friday, that was a point where the chairman could have said, yes, we're going to accommodate as needed, and we see probable cause to do that by cutting interest rates. And he did not say that.
But we had a lot of things pushing down stock price, pushing up yields. And today, we've seen some measures to turn that around.
SCIUTTO: Is it the 90 days pause, the end of that concern or could it rear its ugly head again based on, well, however Trump is feeling on any particular day about tariffs?
TIPP: Right. Well, honestly, I was hoping that, you know, maybe April 2nd could be at least a peak in the tensions for trade, or maybe this month or maybe this quarter. But by definition, if you're putting it off 90 days, you know, there's a good chance that this is just going to get pushed along.
And this is not the only large item that's moving through the system right now. We've had a big change in terms of immigration. Some would say that the massive immigration we've seen in recent years has been a big driver of growth. We're seeing government layoffs and seeing changes in regulation. There should be a positive. but, you know, there are a number of changes going on the budget negotiations. Could have implications for tax policy that could be positive or negative economy.
So, we're definitely going to have a lot to watch and again, by definition, a 90-day delay. I think the biggest signal here is that there is some care for the markets and I think an -- a priority for investors from the election was that Trump would care about the markets. And his seeming lack of regard for the stock market for the bond market was concerned and it suggested that there was a willingness to take tremendous economic pain in all forms. That was a concern.
So seeing that bend in terms of the curve today, in terms of Trump's psyche, I think is the big positive coming out of this 24 hour cycle here.
JIM SCIUTTO, CNN HOST: Robert Tipp, head of Global Bonds at PGIM. Thanks so much for joining.
Coming up, what China thinks about President Trump's tariffs. How businesses might try to adapt.
We're going to have some insights coming up.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
SCIUTTO: Welcome back to "CNN Newsroom." I'm Jim Sciutto. And here are more international headlines we're watching today. At least 124 people have been confirmed dead now after a nightclub's roof collapsed in the Dominican Republic on Tuesday. At least 300 people were inside the club at the time. The cause of that collapse still unknown. President Abinader declared three days of mourning following the tragedy.
Germany's major centrist parties have reached a coalition deal. Chancellor-in-waiting Friedrich Merz of the Christian Democratic Union Party won February's federal election, but the party failed to secure a majority at the time. Pressure was mounting to reach a deal with the center-left Social Democratic Party amid recession fears.
[18:35:18]
The Vatican says that Britain's King Charles and Queen Camilla have held a private visit with the Pope.
The royal couple are currently on a state visit to Italy. The Vatican said during the meeting the Pope expressed good wishes on the occasion of their wedding anniversary.
And recapping our top story, President Trump's decision to put his newest reciprocal tariffs on hold for now.
What we saw today was either the art of the deal, according to Republican Senator John Cornyn and many others around the President, or perhaps a surrender in the shortest global trade war in history. Those the words of the economist Peter Schiff.
Whatever point of view, there is a palpable sigh of relief at least for now after this pause. Except that is if you're China, because Beijing is now facing a tariff of 125 percent, more than doubling the cost of its goods coming into this country.
Take a look at the Dow Jones today. The moment the pause was announced was met by an instantaneous jump as the President hinted hours earlier, a great time to buy.
Respected economist Mohamed El-Erian openly wondered what it would take for the President to change course. He asked would it be Congress, the President's advisors, business leaders, the legal system, markets, or something else? We got the answer today, it was a bond market.
Particularly how close it gets to the line that separates wild price volatility from market malfunctioning.
Richard Quest is with me now.
Listen, folks you talk to close to the market, they don't buy the art of the deal line. They say the President himself got yippy, to use his words, when he looked at the bond market.
RICHARD QUEST, CNN ANCHOR (on-camera): Yes, he got yippy, he got queasy, and he decided that flexibility was the answer. There is no way that he was not going to keep these tariffs if he could have done so. Because all he would have had to do is, you know, he could have done this last week. Announced the tariff levels and then said there's a 90-day negotiating period.
They were really worried that the bond market, which funds the government and which is the backbone of the economy in a sense, was going to turn turtle and become nasty. Because we'd seen bonds fall and we'd seen shares and equities fall. And that tells you something's wrong. It also tells you the financial plumbing is deeply under strain, as margin calls are starting to come in from people having to sell assets, usually dollar-denominated assets, like bonds, to meet their margins.
SCIUTTO: Yes, I mean there are a lot of hedge funds, there was --
QUEST (on-camera): Yes.
SCIUTTO: -- some heavy trades there. Let me ask you about Trump's tweet, hours before the public announcement of the pause, that at that point it was a good time to buy. A lot of folks looking at the bets that were made prior to his public announcement.
QUEST (on-camera): I hope you're wrong. And I hope others are wrong, who are suggesting the way this has been done. And I hope there wasn't a telegraphing to somebody of what was coming. Because if there is, then frankly just turn off the lights and I'll just head out. Because the entire -- yes, all right. I know people say it's rigged against the little guy. I know people say those are on the inside.
But generally speaking, the principles of transparency and honesty and openness and fair dealings in the market. So, it's pretty awful if there is any suggestion that this was a nod-nod-wink-wink, get in the market now, because you never know what I'm going to do.
For instance, I (INAUDIBLE) you Jim, no, you, you, you (INAUDIBLE). I thought about it, I thought is it time to buy something? Is it time to pick up something cheap? And decided it was just too risky. Just too risky.
SCIUTTO: Listen, I mean the difference would be, right, insider trading.
Richard Quest --
QUEST (on-camera): Yes.
SCIUTTO: -- thanks so much.
QUEST (on-camera): Ah, but don't forget, don't forget, don't forget, Supreme Court says what the President does -- what the President does, not against the law, what the President does, as long as it's a part of his official acts. Tariffs is a part -- you go on, you can see where I'm going with that.
SCIUTTO: I do see where you're going. Always good to have you, Richard. Thanks so much.
QUEST (on-camera): Thank you.
SCIUTTO: And we'll be right back.
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[18:42:15]
SCIUTTO: Welcome back. Britain says it will continue to negotiate a trade deal with the U.S. during the 90-day pause announced by President Trump today. A Downing Street spokesperson says quote, we don't want any tariffs at all, so for jobs and livelihoods across the UK we will coolly and calmly continue to negotiate in Britain's interests.
President Trump says eventually Beijing will also want to make a deal with Washington.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF UNITED STATES: Nothing's over yet, but we have a tremendous amount of spirit from other countries including China. China wants to make a deal. They just don't know how quite to go about it. You know, it's one of those things they don't know quite. They're proud people.
And President Xi's a proud man. I know him very well, and they don't know quite how to go about it, but they'll figure it out.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
SCIUTTO: Myron Brilliant is a former executive vice president and head of international affairs at the U.S. Chamber of Congress. He just returned from ships to China and Europe meeting with government officials and business leaders.
Thanks so much for coming.
MYRON BRILLIANT, FMR HEAD OF INTL. AFFAIRS, U.S. CHAMBERS OF COMMERCE: Thank you, Jim.
SCIUTTO: So, President Trump there says China wants a deal, they're just trying to figure out how to do it. Based on your meetings and your experience with China, is that true?
BRILLIANT: Well, first of all, let's give the President some appreciation for the pause today. I don't think it puts the rest of course how to deal with China. China has always been the number one deal that the United States president wants to get done.
But the question is as you ratchet up the pressure you increase tariffs, do you create the right conditions for China to come to the table and deal with obviously the huge systemic challenges we have of unfair trade practices and coercive economic policies coming out of China.
SCIUTTO: Stolen (INAUDIBLE) -- BRILLIANT: Stolen (INAUDIBLE) property. And frankly the President's
right to talk about the curbing fentanyl exports as well. China could clamp down on that tomorrow if it put its mind to it.
So, president's not wrong, the problem is you ratchet up the pressure and she has his own domestic pressure.
SCIUTTO: Right.
BRILLIANT: And what I heard in Beijing is, we just don't know who we're dealing with. What Trump is going to show up? The Trump that wants to do a deal or the Trump that wants to lay on more tariff pressures on us.
SCIUTTO: Well, that's a question I have. Does China believe Trump wants a deal or that Trump wants to fundamentally weak -- weaken the Chinese economy? Because 125 percent tariffs cause enormous cost to Chinese businesses and economic well-being. What do they believe Trump wants?
BRILLIANT: Well first off, you just said something that's very important underscore. Beijing has a lot to lose, China loses more in a trade war with the United States, but we lose as well the American consumers lose, small businesses lose, big businesses have a big stake in the marketplace. They're going to lose as well.
[18:45:01]
So, both sides gave to be clear at the end of the day. We got to stabilize the relationship. We need to be pragmatic. I think China recognizes that this is a fragile time for its domestic economy. It's certainly operating under 5 percent. It's got a huge turn to domestic consumption, but it's not made the turn. She witnessed a weakening economy over the last five years.
So, I hope they want to get a deal, but they also are the second most powerful economy in the world, the second most powerful nation in the world.
SCIUTTO: Yes.
BRILLIANT: And they want to be treated differently than Zelenskyy was treated on his visit to Washington.
SCIUTTO: But the -- the one of the issues is, President Trump has confused us all by changing the more than once, what the ultimate goals of his tariffs are. Is it about leveling the playing field? Is it about completely eliminating any trade deficit which he sees as a, you know, as being in the red in effect, or is it about reshoring manufacturing jobs which would -- which -- which would mean that China doesn't have those jobs anymore? Right?
I mean the --
BRILLIANT: Jim, it's all the above.
SCIUTTO: Right. That matters though.
BRILLIANT: It's all the above.
SCIUTTO: But it matters from China's per, or -- or any other, or Europe -- Europe's perspective too.
BRILLIANT: Right.
SCIUTTO: Because if the gambit is we want everything back that's not in those country's interests.
BRILLIANT: Well, it's not going to happen.
SCIUTTO: Yes.
BRILLIANT: First of all, there's a word called innovation. So, we're not going to get all those jobs back. And bringing some manufacturing back is -- is a good thing.
SCIUTTO: Yes.
BRILLIANT: But it's not going to happen overnight. If you ask the pharmaceutical industry, if you ask other industries, it takes time. We have complex supply chains, which is why it's so important to recognize that in this debate.
So, you know, the reality is China isn't going to be replacing jobs here. It's replacing, you know, it's replacing jobs everywhere. So, we've got to deal with China in a different terms of our today than we did 10, 15 years ago.
I think the President's right, that we have a systemic challenge with China for all the reasons we can talk about the theft of intellectual property. No question, excess capacity in areas like steel and solar. But the reality is also that China and the United States have a tied economy. Right.
SCIUTTO: Yes.
BRILLIANT: So, we can have mutual assured destruction if we go down a path of decoupling on the economic front.
SCIUTTO: Isn't that what --
BRILLIANT: We're heading --
SCIUTTO: -- Trump and China talking about?
BRILLIANT: We're heading there on the tech side.
SCIUTTO: Yes.
BRILLIANT: Right. We certainly moved in the last eight to 10 years towards tech decoupling. We haven't done that on the trade side. We still have an enormous trading relationship. It's not balanced. It's structurally imbalanced. It's something that the President wants to get at, but the signals that the President is making to all the trading partners is very uncertain, right. Even today's news isn't getting us out of the box, right? We're still playing Russian roulette with trade policy and with our economy.
So, I -- I really wonder whether China thinks this is the right time to cut a big deal. And what does it look like? You know, is, is buying more? LNG gas, is it buying more Ag products? What does a deal look like that will satisfy the appetite of President Trump? And I don't think they know.
SCIUTTO: And does he stick with it? I mean this is something, you know, ask our Mexican and -- and Canadian trading partners as well on deals made and then deals broken.
Myron Brilliant, thanks so much for -- for joining. We appreciate it.
BRILLIANT: Thank you.
SCIUTTO: Coming up, the Dominican Republic deadliest tragedy in decades. We're going to have the latest on the recovery efforts at that club ceiling collapse.
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[18:50:48]
SCIUTTO: Now to the Dominican Republic where rescuers are still working after that catastrophic roof collapse at a nightclub. Authorities say that now more than 120 people were killed when the roof collapsed during a concert, a meringue concert, shortly after midnight, on Tuesday. At least 300 people were inside.
Families are gathered at the scene, anxiously waiting to see if any more survivors could be found. Among the dead, a popular singer, two former major league baseball players, as well as a local governor.
Stefano Pozzebon joins me now from Santa Domingo.
And Stefano, any sense of why this happened?
STEFANO POZZEBON, CNN CONTRIBUTOR (on-camera): No, Jim, unfortunately, we don't have a new sense of the investigations that are of course occurring over the causes of these catastrophic tragedy here in the Dominican Republic. Whenever we spoke with Dominican authorities, they told us that they were focusing on trying to save as many people as possible.
And as you can see from the crowd that gather the -- around the what is left of the building of the JetSet nightclub, just behind my back. And you can (INAUDIBLE) to remove as many debris as possible.
But like I said, these crowds, this is the anxious crowds that you make reference to because many people here are still demanding answers. They still want to know whether the loved ones have been located, what happened with them, because there are still many, many people unidentified and still missing.
Over the last couple of days, Jim, we were able to witness a sense of pain, of course, of tragedy, but also the sense of the community coming together in paying the respect and in a shared moment of sufferance, but also of hope.
Take a listen.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Fernandez Reyes Reyes (ph), Joel Manuel Santana (ph) (INAUDIBLE).
POZZEBON (voice-over): The names read out loud by forensic doctors. Each of them alive cut short.
More than a hundred bodies have been recovered, but dozens yet to be identified in the rooftop collapse of a nightclub in Santo Domingo. A growing death toll cutting through the soul of this nation.
The JetSet was an iconic venue. Monday night, many local celebrities had come here to celebrate its 50th anniversary. Several are now been mourned. Including two former Major League baseball players, a Latin music star, and the governor of a local province.
Dominican President Luis Abinader, declared three days of national mourning to commemorate the victims. Outside the venue, relative search for the names of their loved ones in list hanging on a field hospital.
I've lost two brothers. This is a national tragedy. We are just heartbroken, says these men.
The rescue operations continue in the dark. There are still people to be found a race against time, even when hope is fading fast. A small group of faithful singing their pain. And refusing to let go.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
POZZEBON (on-camera): And Jim, as like I said, and as you can see from what's happening around me, well, these search and rescue operations are still very much going on.
One thing that has changed, however, from yesterday, is that we've seen much debris being removed. We've seen several big trucks leaving the premise compared to yesterday and more cranes. When we were here yesterday, they were only the two major cranes. We didn't have the green one just behind my back.
This has suggested, Jim, that the -- the pace of the operation to clear out the area has increased. And this morning we were able to speak with people from the civil protection who told us that yesterday they had to with caution with very big (INAUDIBLE) precaution because we still believed that there were still people alive under the rubble. So, they were combining through all that was left from the rooftop with extreme and extreme caution. [18:55:03]
It seems that in the last few hours that pace of the operation has increased and that's why we have seen more and more larger trucks and more and more heavy machinery being employed here. We've seen bulldozers coming in, entering the premise. We're still seeing several people on the rooftop, and we still believe that these operation Jim, will continue throughout this night as well. It's a -- it's an effort that is going on for at least the 36 hours nonstop. We were here late last night and early today on -- on Wednesday, and we always saw people who end and rescue services coming in and out.
However, it's important to mark that the operation has increased some pace, which may mean that the majority of what's left of those people inside the building have been removed, Jim.
SCIUTTO: Such a sad story. I feel for all those people gathered out there waiting for news.
Stefano Pozzebon in Santa Domingo. Thanks so much.
And thanks so much to all of you for your company today. I'm Jim Sciutto in Washington. Please do stay with CNN.
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