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Department Of Homeland Security Official Claims Congressmembers Assaulted ICE Agents In New Jersey While They Were Arresting Newark, New Jersey Mayor Ras Baraka; Rep. Bonnie Watson Coleman (D-NJ) Denies During Interview Department Of Homeland Security's Characterization Of Incident Between New Jersey Congressmembers And ICE Agents; European Leaders Meet With Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy In Kyiv And Call On Russia To Agree To 30-Day Ceasefire; CEO Of American Toymaker Calls For Reversal Of Trump Administration Policy On Tariffs On Chinese Imports; India And Pakistan Agree To Ceasefire After Escalation Of Conflict In Kashmir; New Pope Leo XIV To Give First Sunday Mass; Eva Longoria Discusses Her Experiences Of The Food And People Of Madrid, Spain. Aired 2-3p ET.
Aired May 10, 2025 - 14:00 ET
THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.
[14:00:00]
FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN ANCHOR: Minutes later he was arrested.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
TRICIA MCLAUGHLIN, ASSISTANT SECRETARY FOR PUBLIC AFFAIRS, DEPARTMENT OF HOMELAND SECURITY: These members of Congress, including the mayor as well, in a mob of protesters as there was a bus full of detainees going through the gate. They stormed the gate and actually entered the first security checkpoint. This put law enforcement at risk, and this actually put the detainees as well at risk.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: The mayor strongly denies those claims in an interview minutes later.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
MAYOR RAS BARAKA, (D) NEWARK, NEW JERSEY: There was no bus of detainees there at all. Nobody stormed the place.
The congresspeople were invited there. They invited me there for a press conference. There was no storming. There was -- none of the stuff she's talking about has ever, ever happened.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: The mayor says he is facing trespassing charges, which he will fight in court. But the spokeswoman for the Department of Homeland Security made another serious claim during her CNN interview.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) MCLAUGHLIN: There will likely be more arrests coming. We actually have body camera footage of some of these members of Congress assaulting our ICE enforcement officers, including body slamming a female ICE officer. So we will be showing that to viewers very shortly.
VICTOR BLACKWELL, CNN ANCHOR: You say a video of members of Congress body slamming ICE --
MCLAUGHLIN: That correct.
BLACKWELL: -- officials?
MCLAUGHLIN: That's correct sir. It's disgusting.
BLACKWELL: OK. And so if you have that video, are you suggesting that members of Congress will be arrested who were there yesterday?
MCLAUGHLIN: This is an ongoing investigation, and that is definitely on the table.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: And this is what Mayor Ras Baraka said in response to those allegations that were on the air.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
BARAKA: That's ridiculous. I'm waiting for them to show a video. I mean, you had two older women, congressman, Congresswoman Bonnie Watson Coleman, who probably couldn't lift any of them.
BLACKWELL: She's 80 years old.
BARACKA: Right. Congresswoman McIver and Congressman Menendez, none of those people body slammed any officer.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: The Trump administration released some of the body camera videos after these interviews aired. They blurred the faces before releasing it. Here's part of the confrontation involving one of the Congresswomen, LaMonica McIver.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
(YELLING)
UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Don't touch us! Don't touch us!
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: This yelling and pushing continues for about another 30 seconds.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
UNIDENTIFIED MALE: You cannot push me! You cannot push me! You cannot push me! You cannot push me!
(YELLING)
(END VIDEO CLIP)
WHITFIELD: So CNN has reached out to a Representative McIver for comment on social media. She said, quote, "Members of Congress are permitted by law to go into ICE facilities and make sure they're up to par. We came to see if the rights of the 100 plus detainees were being upheld. What happened today, from the mishandling of me and my colleagues to the arrest of the mayor, should never have occurred," end quote.
I want to bring in now one of the other congresswomen who was at that protest, Congresswoman Bonnie Watson Coleman. Congresswoman, so good to see you. So I mean, describe, if you could, what happened.
REP. BONNIE WATSON COLEMAN, (D-NJ): So we were there for a tour. ICE was giving us the runaround. We finally got into a facility. We heard some noise. We came out, we found that the mayor was there, and ICE was having conversations with him. They asked him to leave the facility. He left the facility, went behind the gates out there with the protesters.
The ICE members were talking on the phone. We hear them say, all right, we're going to go to arrest him. We asked, why are you arresting him? He's not on the property. He's not on your property. They ignored us. They opened the gate. They pushed through people. There were several armed guards, and they went to get the mayor, get to the mayor. And LaMonica and Rob and I tried to shield the mayor.
I don't know anything about anybody hitting back at any of those large and weaponized officers. This whole issue of arresting the mayor on what was public property was wrong. There's no reason to arrest him. ICE caused this chaos, and it was just an illustration of their responding to someone at a very high level in the organization.
[14:05:03]
Because we had all of the New Jersey ICE officers and supervisors there on the ground with us to conduct the tour. So our question was, why are you arresting the mayor who is not on your property? Why are you causing this chaos? And why are you treating people with such disrespect, and humiliating the mayor of the largest city of the state of New Jersey? And why are you pushing on us? You know who we are. We've been here for two hours trying to conduct a tour that were legally able to do.
WHITFIELD: So your interpretation and your use of words is very different from the spokesperson for DHS who was on CNN. She used the words "body slamming," saying that the mayor and other members of Congress were body slamming and were being rough with the ICE officials. You're disputing that?
COLEMAN: Yes. So how ridiculous does that sound? They're 200 pounds. They've got about 35 pounds worth of stuff around them, including a gun on their arms.
I can tell you what I think about what they're saying. The president of the United States opens his mouth every day and lies. He can't breathe without lying. He's given permission to his cabinet and those who work for him to lie. And she's lying too. And so I was there. I saw it. I was a part of it. I was in the middle of it. We did not in any way, shape, or form disrespect the physicality of any of those ICE agents. And to say so is just to perpetuate the kind of lying that we are experiencing in this country at the highest levels. And it's disgusting.
WHITFIELD: And in some of the video that we're seeing here, just prior to the arrest, I don't know if you're able to see on your monitor at the same time. We do see --
COLEMAN: I'm not.
WHITFIELD: OK, well, I'll try to describe as best I can. We see the mayor who is inside the fence with a number of people who have gathered. And then he, it looks like he's exiting. He's exiting the fence area. And you're saying, if I'm understanding you right, that is the portion that is now public property. And that is when he is approached by ICE officials and then arrested?
COLEMAN: Yes.
WHITFIELD: Do you remember where you were in proximity to that? Were you on the inside of the fence or the outside?
COLEMAN: I was on the outside of the fence holding on to the mayor, because we were determined to shield the mayor from any kind of danger or abuse of power on the part of ICE agents. They came outside of the property onto where the protesters were, which was not any part of the detention facility, and they arrested the mayor there.
When they asked the mayor to leave when he was inside, after they had invited him inside, then they asked him to leave. He turned around and left. He did exactly as they asked. And so for them to react in the way that they did was so abusive, unnecessary, and disrespectful. And if they can do that to us, they can do that to the mayor of the largest city in the state of New Jersey, they can do that to treat three members of Congress, and they knew who we were because we had been there trying to do the tour for over two hours. Then we're very concerned what they're doing on the streets to people who are simply living their lives, going to work, dropping their kids off from school, going to the grocery store. ICE is out of control, and it's been given permission to be out of control.
WHITFIELD: And as we continue to replay, I see now you on one side of the fence as the mayor was leaving in proximity. You're talking to him. And then at some point, he is turned around and he is arrested. The DHS spokesperson I mentioned, who was on the air earlier, is saying that the videotape, the bodycam video that would be released later would show the violent nature of the mayor and others body slamming. We don't see that on this videotape, but we do see some movement of bodies and the tussling of the moving of the bodycam vantage point. But it doesn't appear to show the mayor being violent or members of Congress being violent with anyone. Did you see anything that would match that description?
COLEMAN: No. And as you can see, I was literally, literally in the middle of it. No. If there's any such body, of any kind of footage, it is footage that is manufactured for this purpose, because I said it before, and I'll say it again, they are lying.
[14:10:09]
There was no reason to arrest Mayor Baraka. There was no reason to create that chaos. There was no reason to cause any kind of confrontation. He did exactly as they asked. They went outside of the property following the orders of someone on the phone, and they arrested the mayor of the city of Newark.
WHITFIELD: That spokesperson, who was on the air with CNN earlier today, said there will be other arrests involving and including members of Congress. Are you concerned that you will be arrested, or that you are being -- will be targeted in this investigation?
COLEMAN: So let's just say I have not done anything wrong. Neither have my other colleagues. That doesn't mean that we can't stop them from harassing us, targeting us, or even trying to arrest us. But we will be sure that we will have our due process, something that they're casting aside in this country right now. I need folks to know, Americans across this country to know, that were we are living in a dictatorship right now, and we've got to take back our democracy. And the way to do that is to stand up and be counted.
WHITFIELD: Congresswoman Bonnie Watson Coleman, thank you so much for being with us, your point of view. And of course, this really just seems to be the very beginning. Appreciate it.
COLEMAN: Thank you so much for having me.
WHITFIELD: Absolutely. Thank you.
All right, other breaking news we are following right now out of Ukraine. A remarkable and highly symbolic meeting in the capital of Kyiv. That's where leaders of Ukraine's top European allies gathered together in person -- Germany, France, the U.K., Poland, all part of the so-called coalition of the willing. They there was representation there demanding a 30-day cease fire from Russia and warning of possible severe sanctions on the Kremlin if it does not comply.
CNN chief international security correspondent Nick Paton Walsh, joining us now from Kyiv. Tell us more about this meeting and what might be next.
NICK PATON WALSH, CNN INTERNATIONAL SECURITY EDITOR: Yes, I mean, make no mistake here, Fredricka, this is an extraordinary moment in a war that's now brutally gone on since Russia invaded over three years ago. As of midnight between Sunday to Monday, four of the largest European powers, two nuclear powers, the four largest armies and Ukraine are demanding an unconditional 30-day ceasefire that Ukraine, they say, will respect. And they have yet to hear the answer from Moscow as to whether they will go along with it as well.
They say they have the support of U.S. President Donald Trump. And indeed, there were images posted by the French President Emmanuel Macron, who came here with the U.K. prime minister, the German chancellor, the Polish prime minister, all of them huddled around a telephone speaking to U.S. President Donald Trump, who they say supported not only this proposal, it is originally something the U.S. and Ukraine put forward nearly two months ago now, but saying he supported what macron called the massive sanctions, and Zelenskyy suggested that would hit the banking and energy sectors that would come against Russia if they violated this particular ceasefire.
We don't know Moscow's response at this point. Our Fred Pleitgen has spoken to the Kremlin spokesperson, who said that they are thinking about this, but again addressed the fact they want certain nuances, essentially conditions to be addressed before they might agree to it. That's not a final answer, but here is exactly what the Ukrainian president said earlier on today.
And so key to this is the monitoring which the French President Emmanuel Macron said indeed would be done by the United States.
Now, the tone I think of these European leaders, despite the historic moment of unity here, remember, there were 20 countries in total, some joining online from New Zealand to Canada. We were indeed told that they are essentially, now with American backing, showing significant skepticism as to whether they believe Russia will indeed sign on to this and keep the truce that they're asking for.
I should point out, we are now coming to the end of a truce that was unilaterally declared by Russia. Many cynics of this idea suggesting it was essentially to make sure that their parade in Red Square went more calmly on Friday. But Ukraine has said there's been at last count well over 700 violations of that unilaterally declared ceasefire, which Ukraine didn't sign up to, saying they didn't trust Russia to hold it themselves.
So the idea of truce here already on very shaky ground, but it is a massive ask, frankly, for Ukraine to find a way to explain to its frontline forces what to do, indeed, if they are attacked.
[14:15:00]
Do they act in self-defense? Do they have to ease off on those actions to try and give the ceasefire a chance? The issue of monitoring an enormous task for the Americans, potentially, given the hundreds of kilometers of very violent front line that they'd have to be monitoring simultaneously.
A lot that needs to be done. But ultimately, this is a test. I think the Europeans are putting forward to the Russian administration here to see if they are indeed serious about peace. And the answer they get, I think they believe, they hope will indeed inform President Trump who they, I think, are trying to drag more into their orbit. Those phone calls today during their meeting so key in securing that White House support, and I think key to the outcome we'll see from the next 30 hours. A vital moment in this war, Fredricka.
WHITFIELD: All right, Nick Paton Walsh in Kyiv, thank you so much.
All right, Russia is now responding to CNN about those calls from top European leaders demanding a 30-day ceasefire in Ukraine. CNN's Fred Pleitgen is at the Kremlin, where just a short time ago Moscow reacted to this meeting in Kyiv.
FREDERIK PLEITGEN, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Hi there, Fredricka. Yes, I'm actually inside the Grand Kremlin Palace right now. And what's been going on over the past two days, really, is that Vladimir Putin has been involved in a flurry of bilateral meetings with leaders from around the world. And that's important because the Kremlin is saying they believe that those European leaders that we saw earlier today in Kyiv are nervous because all of that, because the Russians here, of course, are portraying that Vladimir Putin by no means is isolated and that there are many leaders who are willing to come here to Moscow and meet with him and also improve relations with Russia.
Of course, it comes only a day after that massive May 9th parade, Victory Day parade, which happened on Red Square here in Moscow with Xi Jinping, the Chinese leader, as the guest of honor.
But I did indeed ask the Kremlin spokesman, Dmitry Peskov, about that meeting that the Europeans had with the Volodymyr Zelenskyy about that demand for a 30-day ceasefire, and here's what he had to say.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
PLEITGEN: Sir, the Europeans are currently meeting with Zelenskyy in Kyiv, and they said that they are demanding a ceasefire from Monday for 30 days. They're threatening massive sanctions against Russia and saying that U.S. President Trump is on board. Do you feel Russia is being pushed into a corner?
DMITRY PESKOV, KREMLIN SPOKESMAN: No, I don't think so. Well. Actually, a couple of days ago, Putin announced a ceasefire for three days. Have you heard any reaction from Kyiv? No. We haven't heard it either. Have you heard any criticism of Kyiv for not being able to respond, or not willing to respond? No. So if Kyiv is willing to have a ceasefire, why not have a ceasefire for at least three days? So this is --
PLEITGEN: They want the three-day ceasefire to essentially go on for 30 days.
PESKOV: We have to think about that. We have to think about that. These are -- these are new developments. So we have our own position. Yes, definitely, we see that Europe is confronting us. Europe is actually confronting us very openly. We feel it, we know it, and we are quite accustomed to that.
PLEITGEN: Do you think that Russia can be pressured in this case?
PESKOV: Well, if you look during the history, during the old history, during the modern history, you'll see that Russia is quite resistant to any kinds of pressure. We are open for dialog. We are open for attempts to have a settlement in Ukraine. We do appreciate efforts of mediation. We do appreciate, and we are very grateful.
PLEITGEN: From the Trump administration?
PESKOV: Of course, of course. But at the same time, it's quite useless to try to press upon us.
(END VIDEO CLIP)
PLEITGEN: So you have the Kremlin spokesman speaking to me earlier today, Dmitry Peskov, saying that Russia will not bow down to pressure. And one of the things that we have, of course, heard from the Russians is that they are willing to enter into direct negotiations with Ukraine. But at the same time, they say that they are not going to back down from what they call their core national security interests, Fredricka.
WHITFIELD: All right, Fred Pleitgen, thank you so much.
All right, still to come, after weeks of intense fighting between India and Pakistan, they now say they have reached a ceasefire agreement. We're live from both countries.
And how the U.S. and China are trying to work out a new trade deal. Up next, we'll hear how the tariffs have taken a toll on toymakers.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[14:24:03]
WHITFIELD: All right, the first day of high-level talks between the U.S. and China in Switzerland aimed at easing the escalating trade war, well, it's just wrapped up. Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent met behind closed doors in Geneva today with Chinas top economic representative. This marks the most significant trade discussions between the two nations since President Trump announced the 145 percent tariffs on China.
Joining me right now is Jay Foreman. He is the CEO of Basic Fun, a toymaker based in Florida, and his company sources the majority of its products from China. So we're talking about everything from Tonka to Care Bears to Lite-Brite. Jay, great to see you.
JAY FOREMAN, CEO, BASIC FUN: Good to be here with you.
WHITFIELD: All right, so how is all this potentially going to impact you? What are you bracing for?
[14:24:56]
FOREMAN: Well, were bracing for some good news this weekend. If Mr. Bassett is as good of a salesman as we hope he is, and he can sell and work a deal with the Chinese, we're hoping that tariffs will come down, maybe to the universal 10 percent, at least for non-strategic products like toys and baby goods and Halloween costumes and back to school. That's what we're hoping for.
WHITFIELD: So you estimate that about 80 percent of toys sold in the U.S. are made in China. So that means this is going to potentially have a pretty significant impact on you and your business.
FOREMAN: Oh, it certainly will. I mean, were we in our industry and most industries that are exporting from China are at a standstill and have been for about five weeks now. So if you can imagine if you didn't get a paycheck for five weeks, what that would be doing to your savings and your household income. Same thing for companies. Nobody is bringing in goods. Nobody is selling goods. And that's really crippling a lot of businesses right now, starting with the small ones, and will start to hit the medium size and the larger ones later.
WHITFIELD: So when the president says there will be some discomfort for a little bit, and he also said, you know, for young girls out there, maybe they'll only get two or three dolls instead of 30, how does all that land with you? Are you able to kind of think optimistically that around this discomfort, things will get better for you and your business?
FOREMAN: Well, we just hope cooler heads will prevail. I mean, the fact is, the economy is heading into an iceberg right now. And if there's not a bit of a course correction, it's going to hit. You think about two dolls or 20. How about an iPhone store only selling two iPhones this week instead of 30 iPhones? Or a stroller store only selling two strollers instead of 30? It's not just what people get, it's what people sell. And what people sell is what drives our economy.
And if we don't have trade driving our economy, then there's going to be big problems with GDP, unemployment, and business failures. And that's what the administration has to understand. And of course, it's not too late. We're just at the beginning of the shipping season, but you'll see back to school start to get hit right away, then Halloween, then toys, then Christmas decorations and Christmas lights. It's like dominoes falling with empty shelves and really a lot less business activity. And that's the real problem. Not whether a kid gets two dolls or 30, but whether businesses can stay alive through this period.
WHITFIELD: Ahead of these trade talks with China, the president has suggested that he might be open to lowering the tariffs. Take a listen to this from the White House spokesperson just yesterday.
(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)
KAROLINE LEAVITT, WHITE HOUSE PRESS SECRETARY: He is not going to unilaterally bring down tariffs on China. We need to see concessions from them as well. And again, that's part of the reason that Secretary Bessent is going to talk to his Chinese counterparts this weekend to start those discussions in person. As for the 80 percent number, that was a number the president threw out there. And we'll see what happens this weekend.
(END VIDEO CLIP) WHITFIELD: All right. So you say shipping is down 60 percent this week on arrivals into the west coast from China, going down 80 percent and then zero. Almost no one can handle 145 percent, even 80 percent. This is pretty unworkable for most. So while it's hard to plan when you don't know what the cost will be, how do you plan for trying to stay afloat?
FOREMAN: Well, you just, really, I mean, it's very difficult to plan when you can't ship merchandise when the tariff rate is so high. So really, you're not planning. You're praying.
You have to think about it. The president -- when the president says every box that doesn't ship from China is a good thing, I'd suggest he's not getting the right advice. If you think about every box that ships from China with a $10 bill taped to it, and when it hits the port in China, they take the $10 bill off. But when it gets to the United States, you open the box, there's $30 in the box, and that $30 gets spread around all over America. The trucking company, the warehouse company, the store clerk, the retailer, the licensor. Our company, goes to payrolls, goes to pay taxes. If you don't ship that box and then you're losing all that money on the residual and there's nothing to replace it, and that's the key.
So like I said, it's not too late. If the president went down to say 10 percent, put China and the non-essential goods, non-strategic goods on a 10 percent, on the 10 percent universal tariffs, that would save the shipping season for the year. And that would -- and he would still be demonstrating what he wants to on tariffs. He's got everybody's attention now. Now it's time to make sure that this doesn't go too far.
WHITFIELD: All right, Jay Foreman, thank you so much. And all the best on your business in the road ahead.
FOREMAN: Thanks, Fredricka.
WHITFIELD: All right, next, this breaking news after weeks of intense fighting between India and Pakistan, they now say they have reached a ceasefire agreement.
[14:30:01]
We're live from both countries.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[14:00:00]
WHITFIELD: All right, this breaking news for you. India and Pakistan say they have reached a ceasefire agreement after weeks of dramatically escalating fighting between the two nuclear rivals. President Trump said the U.S. mediated intense talks between the two sides and added "Congratulations to both countries on using common sense and great intelligence."
Just hours ago, the conflict had escalated further when Pakistan launched a new military operation, saying it was in retaliation for India's attacks on military bases. But this was the scene a short time ago in Pakistan, celebrated news of the ceasefire.
[14:35:05]
We've got full coverage of these developments. CNN's Nic Robertson is in Islamabad, Pakistan. Matthew Chance is in New Delhi, India. Matthew, to you first. India's foreign secretary is accusing Pakistan of now breaking the ceasefire?
MATTHEW CHANCE, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Yes, I mean, there's lots of reports, Fredricka, circulating about how in the hours after the ceasefire declaration was made and agreed to, after it was brokered by the U.S., that there have been violations, there's been cross-border attacks, there have been reports of explosions in Indian administered Kashmir and indeed in the on the Pakistani side, in Pakistan administered Kashmir as well, that disputed state in in northern India that is the center of this most recent conflict between India and Pakistan.
It may just be teething problems. And I think the hope is in, in India at least, that the situation will settle over the coming hours and the ceasefire will start to hold.
But look, it was a surprise announcement, and it came, as you mentioned, after a really dangerous escalation in the fighting between India and Pakistan. India conducted very deep raids inside Pakistan, air raids. It struck military targets, one military base very close to the capital, Islamabad, other military targets as well.
Pakistan then responded furiously, launching its own strikes inside India, hitting dozens of locations inside this country as well.
And I think it was probably the upsurge in in that fighting and these strikes deep inside each other's territory that finally focused attention in Washington. There's been reporting that we have from Washington that there was some sort of alarming intelligence that they call it that led them to sort of pick up the phone and get the sides talking.
But in any event, that's what happened. And within a couple of hours of intensive negotiations, it seems, in which U.S. political figures like J.D. Vance, the vice president, and U.S. Secretary of State Marco Rubio spoke to political and military figures on both sides, there was a deal that was done.
Now, the big problem with it, of course, is that the deal is unlikely to address the underlying problems in the state of Kashmir. And so it may be something that that sort of comes back with a vengeance in the future.
WHITFIELD: All right, Matthew, thanks so much. Nic Robertson, to you. Both sides equally willing to kind of cool things off. But then there's this, you know, wrinkle already.
NIC ROBERTSON, CNN INTERNATIONAL DIPLOMATIC EDITOR: Yes, the forum, the information minister was asked this question just Within the past hour about violations across the line of control in the disputed Kashmir region. He said there wasn't any going on. That was the Pakistan minister of information.
What we're getting from our sources on the ground is that it is still continuing, what has been happening at the border there. There's been intense artillery fire, tank fire, gunfire between both sides. Pakistan has -- the military have released and put on, released video of Indian military posts on the border being hit.
Is it still happening at the intensity that it was last night? It doesn't seem to be so. Is it going to get into a deeper lull? Possibly. But it does underscore those tensions.
One of the things that India has resisted, and this conflict, this line of control, has been going on since 1947 when the British pulled out of India, turned it into two countries, Pakistan and India, fought a war, then fought in 1971, fought again in 1998. Three wars, many skirmishes. And the border has been this border line, the line of control has been the contentious issue all along.
But trying to -- the thing that India has always resisted doing is internationalizing it, is bringing in international players to mediate. And when it decided to, and Matthew alluded to this, India recently, since the terrorist attack inside of India, killing those 26 civilians a couple of weeks ago, since then India said it was going to cut off the waterflows to Pakistan. That's existential to Pakistan. That hasn't been addressed in the ceasefire agreement. And a source I talked to when I asked that question said, look, this is just a ceasefire. We are going to have to get to that bigger issue.
But the question that sort of stands in my mind, while the United States has come in and helped bring a ceasefire, is India, as Pakistan wants and has asked for on multiple occasions and very recently as well, to internationalize it and bring in a number of countries to oversee the dispute there about the water, about the about the killing of the 26 civilians, about multiple issues, countries that would be favorable to both India and Pakistan.
[14:40:23]
India doesn't go for it. Pakistan really wants it. And this resistance of India to internationalize the problem, if you will, is what is going to dog mediators, international mediators, if there are some, as the U.S. has played a role today to help move it forward.
WHITFIELD: All right, Nic Robertson and Matthew Chance, thanks to both of you, appreciate it.
All right, coming up, a closer look at Pope Leo XIV, on the eve of his first Sunday mass.
(COMMERCIAL BREAK)
[14:45:30] WHITFIELD: All right, welcome back. We're getting new video as Pope Leo XIV makes his way back to the Vatican today. After visiting an Augustinian shrine, he stopped to pray before the final resting place of the late Pope Francis. You see it right there. Earlier today, Leo told cardinals that his papacy would follow Francis's precious legacy of church reform and social justice.
Here with me now is Susan Reynolds, assistant professor of Catholic Studies at Emory University here in Atlanta. Great to see you. I would love to get your point of view, your reaction to seeing him really paying homage to his predecessor. And they had a closeness, right, from the very beginning. But what is that like to see him in so many different venues and moments now? And it's only been a couple of days.
SUSAN REYNOLDS, ASSISTANT PROFESSOR OF CATHOLIC STUDIES, EMORY UNIVERSITY PHD: It's very powerful. I think that he's somebody who, from the jump, from the get-go, was seen as somebody who will continue Francis's legacy, Francis's project of reform, but also the sort of spirit of warmth and closeness to the people that Francis really exuded. So it's very touching to see him praying before that simple tomb, that simple shrine of Francis's body. The only thing you see there is that cross, that pectoral cross that Francis wore.
And it's just a beautiful reminder, I think, of his first days as Pope, that iconic moment on the loggia, the balcony, when he greeted everyone with this simple, "Buona sera." That was so endearing. And I think that you see a similar kind of humility of spirit about Pope Leo as well.
WHITFIELD: And while he's already committing publicly to carry on the legacy, it will be his duty, right, to make it his own. Based on what you know about him or have come to know about him, is that going to be a giant challenge of, how do you continue someone's legacy but at the same time create some extensions where you're maybe there's risk taking or maybe you're going to, you know, take it to another level in a different way?
REYNOLDS: I think he's already sort of set a trajectory for himself in the name that he chose. The name Leo is incredibly significant. And earlier today, he actually explained to his fellow cardinals, formerly fellow cardinals, why he chose that name. The last Pope Leo, Leo the XIII, was Pope for 25 years at the end of the 1800s, during this period, in the wake of this period of massive industrialization. Think of the rise of the factory, the creation of this urban, kind of a misery stricken working class. Think of, you know, "Les Mis" or Charles Dickens's London.
And into this situation of really searing human rights abuses and a completely different kind of economic stratification, Pope Leo the XIII, the last Pope Leo, wrote this incredibly important document on the rights of the worker. And our Leo, Leo the XIV, this morning told his fellow cardinals, you know, I took this name because I see that we are in the midst of a similar revolution. The rise of A.I., for example, with similar questions about what it means to be human in the face of new technology. How do we think about fundamental human dignity, fundamental human worth, in a way that's not just created -- connected to economic productivity, right? What is it, what is how do we preserve the value of what is human? So I think even there you see that he kind of has an agenda. And I think that you'll get a mix of that, that deeply pastoral, Francis-like spirit, but also this kind of this new way of looking at reality that sees these urgent needs.
WHITFIELD: So we've heard a little bit about his commitment then going forward through that. Now, what about for his first Sunday mass tomorrow? I mean, how does he broaden it, or -- and is it about broadening the catholic church when he does this, or is it about kind of staking a claim of this is what you're going -- this is a little bit of what you're going to get from me, you know, for a very long time?
REYNOLDS: I think more than anything, we'll actually get a sense of his preaching style, his communication style. The beauty of the Catholic liturgy is that it's the same whether you are in mass in Chicago or Peru or Rome. You're hearing the same readings. You're going through the same motions, you're consecrating the same bread and wine.
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Really, the only space for individualizing it is the homily, the sermon. And it will be interesting to see how he reflects on the readings for the day. We'll get a sense of how he speaks, what sort of mannerisms he is using, but also who he's trying to connect with, who he sort of seems to understand his audience as I'm really interested.
WHITFIELD: The improv of Leo XIV. All right, Associate Professor Susan Reynolds, great to see you. Thank you so much for coming in. Appreciate it.
All right, and we'll be right back.
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WHITFIELD: All right, this week on "Searching for Spain," Eva Longoria takes a culinary and cultural journey throughout Spain's capital city of Madrid. Eva recently swapped travel stories with CNN anchor John Berman.
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EVA LONGORIA, ACTRESS: This is a tortilla de patatas, tortilla de patatas. It's like an omelet. Mexicans call tortillas something else. In Spain, this is a tortilla, which is egg with potato inside.
JOHN BERMAN, CNN ANCHOR: My story with tortillas is I was in Madrid after college, and I was broke. And my friends all wanted to spend any money we had at the clubs at night. So during the day, the only thing I could afford was tortilla. So for like two weeks I ate nothing. But this.
LONGORIA: Tortilla de patatas. Yes, it's everywhere, in bars. It's a very common tapas that you get along with the croqueta.
BERMAN: Cheers.
LONGORIA: Cheers.
We did a Madrid episode.
BERMAN: How did you like Madrid?
LONGORIA: I love Madrid, and I love Madrilenos, the people of Madrid. They have a saying in in Madrid, it's Madrid al Cielo, which means after you experience Madrid, the last thing to experience in life is heaven because that's how high they think of Madrid. It's a beautiful city, obviously very cosmopolitan. Even though it's landlocked it has the best cuisine of the country.
BERMAN: I felt, and this was years ago right after college, it was electric. It was just pulsing electric. So vibrant.
LONGORIA: Yes. The streets are alive in Madrid. I mean, it could be 11:00 at night and people are still outside drinking in the pubs and bars, eating. Spain does clean eating, very clean eating, very minimal ingredients in in the way they cook and how they present things. And you don't really have to go to a farmers' market because everywhere is a farmers' market. Their produce, they don't have to transport things very far. You just have the freshest tomatoes, the freshest potatoes, the freshest meats.
Also in the Madrid episode, it's really a city welcoming of immigrants. It really has so many different neighborhoods, so many different kinds of foods, so many fusions. They are very welcoming of any walk of life, any type of person, no matter where you're from.
(END VIDEO TAPE)
BERMAN: Yum, looks so good. A new episode of "Eva Longoria, Searching for Spain" airs Sunday, 9:00 p.m. eastern and pacific only on CNN.
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