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FBI Searches Home And Office Of Trump Adviser John Bolton; Texas Republicans Approve New Congressional Maps; U.N. Backed Group Declares "Man-Made" Famine In Parts Of Gaza; Powerful Rally After Fed Chief Fuels Hopes For A Rate Cut; OpenAI CEO Signals A.I. May Be In A Bubble; Tour Championship This Weekend, Winner Gets $10 Million. Aired 4-5p ET

Aired August 23, 2025 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[16:00:39]

JESSICA DEAN, CNN HOST: You're in the CNN NEWSROOM. Hi, everyone. I'm Jessica Dean in Los Angeles.

Vice President JD Vance saying the FBI search of John Bolton's home was, quote, "not at all driven by Trump seeking revenge for Bolton's frequent criticisms." Bolton served as National Security adviser for 17 months during Trump's first term in office. He has since become an outspoken critic and has appeared on this program many times.

A group of FBI agents were seen going in and out of Bolton's Maryland home and his Washington, D.C., office yesterday. Sources say the searches were tied to Bolton's handling of classified documents.

Let's bring in Julia Benbrook, who's at the White House this afternoon.

And Julia, on the campaign trail, Trump promised retribution for any perceived enemies. What is the president saying about this?

JULIA BENBROOK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, we know that yesterday the FBI carried out a search of former National Security adviser John Bolton's Bethesda home, as well as his D.C. office. And at the center of this is a question about whether Bolton shared what Trump administration officials believe was classified information with people who were not authorized to see it.

This is related to his 2020 book, and there was a criminal investigation back in 2020. It was later dropped when President Joe Biden was in office. But some of the questions there were whether he shared portions of that book with people who were not cleared or had clearance to see that before it was given final approval from the government. So lots of questions surrounding this.

We do know that Bolton has been a staunch critic of the president in recent years. We know the Trump fired him in 2019, and that he even threatened to jail Bolton during his first term when in that book, "The Room Where It Happened," Bolton claimed that Trump was woefully under-informed on issues related to foreign policy and that he was obsessed with shaping his media legacy. Now, Vice President JD Vance, while speaking with NBC yesterday, said

that classified documents, the concerns there and the probe are a part of this. But he also said this. He said, "I think there's a broad concern about Ambassador Bolton."

Yesterday in the Oval Office, CNN's Alayna Treene was able to press Trump on that, what those concerns are. He said that ultimately he doesn't really want to be involved here, but he also used the opportunity to criticize Bolton more. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: I haven't spoken to Pam and the group yet, but I will be. I saw that just like everybody else. I try and stay out of that stuff. I'm allowed to be and I'm chief law enforcement officer, believe it or not. You know, I don't like to go around saying that, but I am. That's the position. But I purposely don't want to really get involved in it.

I'm not a fan of John Bolton. I thought he was a sleazebag actually. And he's a -- suffers major Trump derangement syndrome.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BENBROOK: Now, the public nature of this FBI search, with even some administration officials drawing attention to it on social media, has led some to speculate if this could be a form of political retribution. In fact, around the time that the search was taking place, we saw FBI director Kash Patel post this. He said, "No one is above the law. FBI agents on a mission." That was then reposted by several prominent members of the administration.

As news of the search broke, CNN did reach out to Bolton, who was unaware of it at the time, and said he was looking for more information -- Jessica.

DEAN: All right. Julia Benbrook, with the latest reporting from the White House this afternoon. Thank you so much.

And joining us now to talk more about this is former Manhattan assistant district attorney, Jeremy Saland.

Jeremy, thanks so much for being here with us. I first just want to get your reaction to these searches of John Bolton's home and office and the state of play right now.

JEREMY SALAND, FORMER MANHATTAN ASSISTANT DISTRICT ATTORNEY: As a preliminary matter, you have a judge who's signing off on this, someone, meaning law enforcement, can't just go into your home. So that legal hurdle and that legal requirement has been met. That being said, that doesn't mean that it's precluded from or isn't anything involving retribution. I think it's fair to say that Bolton has certainly criticized the president right or wrong. He's criticized other presidents right or wrong.

But you cannot weaponize or lawfare, you know, the federal government and the FBI and the U.S. attorney's office, and it should everybody concerned and pause.

[16:05:08]

And I would say you have to be a little bit cowardly not to be able to identify and show your concern that there's someone being targeted because it is quite rich that the president, as we all recall, was allegedly possessing classified documents himself with the Espionage Act indictments with Jack Smith. And now we're hearing cries from the administration how wrong this is. Well, they need to look in the mirror because he was on the cusp, meaning the former president, and being in a far worse shape than Mr. Bolton.

DEAN: I want to go back to one of the first things you said about just the legal hurdle here. What would the Trump administration have had to prove to reopen this investigation to get these warrants?

SALAND: So when you go before a judge, you have to show that judge that there's a likelihood or probable cause or reasonable cause that what you're looking for is in a specified place at that person's home or wherever that is, that business. It can even be more specific than that. When the allegations involve some sort of computer data or computer information that generally gives a broader scope because that can be hidden arguably anywhere, as opposed to something physical like a gun that would be in a cabinet or under a mattress.

So that has to be presented and signed off for before a judge. And a judge has to say you have sufficient evidence, but, you know, that doesn't change how we got here and the basis of it. And I would just add that the president's comments about how despicable he finds Mr. Bolton does nothing but potentially prejudice a jury if it ever gets to that point and damages that jury and gives Mr. Bolton an avenue to appeal if he's ever ultimately charged and prosecuted.

The president should be standing out of this completely and let the Department of Justice do their job, again, right or wrong.

DEAN: And walk me through the effect something like this could have, the chilling effect that something like this might have on others who may be perceived, who might be afraid to now speak out.

SALAND: Yes. I don't think you need to say might have. I would say in fact does have. It's incredibly scary. I think about you or me and I'm a nobody here. And I always have in the back of my mind if I say something wrong just here on CNN or wherever I may be, is the IRS going to audit me? Now, what if I was someone who was in a position of power, in a position of authority, who had access to information, and now I'm talking about Trump, and Trump gets out there and says these things, forget the legal avenue, to galvanize people to be angry at that person and target that person?

But he can weaponize a government. And just as he said, when one of his -- one of the things he recently just said was, I am the chief law enforcement officer, whether I like to say it or not, meaning he is involved firsthand, and that's a frightening thing and something that could be weaponized terribly to stop dissent, to stop challenges, and to stop confronting him, as we all should whether in the press or in the halls of Congress.

DEAN: And so how do you see this playing out next? And I know you don't think the timing of all of this is coincidental. Tell us about that.

SALAND: Yes. Absolutely not. You know, this could just be an effort to scare and traumatize both Bolton and the public and anyone who wants to speak out against him, because keep in mind, even if there's never a grand jury convened, even if there's never an indictment and a charge, now, I mean, Bolton, do I have to hire counsel? Of course I do. What's coming next? When's the next shoe going to drop? Is it going to drop?

You know, who do I speak to? Who can I trust? Are they watching me? Are they on my phones? There's so many things that I now have to be concerned about. So, you know, that's where we are and we find ourselves. And it's just another distraction, in my opinion, in part when we have, you know, his personal attorney going to speak with Maxwell.

There's so many different things that this administration is doing and flooding the airwaves of, you know, these investigations and challenging the law has never done before to distract. And you just can't juggle it all to fairly assess everything that's coming at you.

DEAN: I do. Before I let you go, you mentioned the Ghislaine Maxwell interview. The DOJ Friday releasing those transcripts of that weeks- old interview with Ghislaine Maxwell. She didn't implicate anyone or admit to any wrongdoing herself. She has obviously been found guilty, is serving a prison sentence. Can she be trusted?

SALAND: No. Period. She fawned over Trump in the transcript. She says how impressed she was by Trump, about what he did to become president, how much she likes Trump. I mean, this is just a farce. You're taking your personal attorney. If nothing else it has the appearance of impropriety. Granted he's now in the Department of Justice to speak with this woman one-on-one.

Yes, there was an FBI agent there as well to gather information from her and sharing a transcript, which is incredibly atypical, and talking about going to a grand jury, pardon me, the judge to release grand jury minutes.

Just go back to the file, Mr. Trump, if you want to be honest and transparent, release it.

[16:10:02]

This all tells me that he does not want to be. Certainly I'm not in that room, but it's telling.

DEAN: All right, Jeremy Saland, thank you so much. Always good to see you. We appreciate it.

SALAND: My pleasure. DEAN: It happened overnight in the wee hours of this morning. Texas

Senate Republicans approving the controversial redistricting legislation designed to create five additional Republican leaning congressional districts in that state. The bill will now head to Republican Governor Greg Abbott for his signature.

CNN correspondent Arlette Saenz is outside the state capitol in Austin -- Arlette.

ARLETTE SAENZ, CNN CORRESPONDENT: The Texas Senate gave its final stamp of approval on a redistricting bill that could reshape the landscape for the 2026 midterm elections. The bill passed the state's Senate in the early morning hours of Saturday, and now will head to Texas Governor Greg Abbott for his signature. He's expected to sign it early next week.

But really, this represents a major victory for President Trump and the Republican Party as they are trying to pick up an additional five U.S. House seats here in Texas. And Republicans have been very blunt about why they are pushing these redistricting plans.

Take a listen to State Senator Phil King, a Republican, on the Senate floor.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

PHIL KING (R), TEXAS STATE SENATE: I'm convinced that if Texas does not take this action, that there is an extreme risk that that Republican majority will be lost. And if it does, the next two years after the midterms, they will be nothing but inquisitions and impeachments and humiliation for our country.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

SAENZ: Texas Democrats, who had fled the state to try to block this bill for two weeks, had no other legislative options left to prevent this from being passed. Now, Democrats are turning their attention to the courts, hoping that the court system will step in to block these maps from going into effect. But already this map, even before it was passed and signed into law, it's already impacting the 2026 midterms here in Texas.

There's Congressman Lloyd Doggett, who represents a district right here in Austin. He announced that he would not seek reelection if the courts do not block these maps. That -- part of that is because a congressman from a district just south of here, Greg Casar, said that he would now run in Doggett's district after his own district is essentially eliminated to become a more GOP-leaning district.

So there's a lot of big questions going forward for Democrats about how they are going to handle this, whether they will continue to seek reelection in their districts or perhaps decide to retire. But at this moment, this really represents a major victory for President Donald Trump, who has also vowed to push other states to consider their own redistricting options as well.

Arlette Saenz, CNN, Austin, Texas.

DEAN: All right, Arlette, thank you so much.

Still ahead here, President Trump says the same show of force we've seen in Washington, D.C., is headed to Chicago next. The political ramifications of sending the National Guard to more cities.

And after hypnotizing Wall Street and Silicon Valley, some fear artificial intelligence could be headed toward a market bust. Why some investors are bracing for a nosedive.

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[16:17:55]

DEAN: Israeli strikes and shelling continue tonight on Gaza City as attacks escalate ahead of a planned operation to take over the city. Smoke could be seen rising over Gaza City earlier today. Palestinian state media reporting three children killed in the strikes. Medical officials and international aid organizations were told this week to prepare for mass evacuation.

Now, this is the largest city in northern Gaza packed with locals and also with refugees. And for Palestinians living there in Gaza, the situation is becoming increasingly desperate, with limited aid, access to fresh drinking water and medical supplies. A U.N. backed group has now confirmed famine in some parts, including Gaza City, and CNN's Nada Bashir has more now.

NADA BASHIR, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, following months of warnings from the U.N. and other humanitarian organizations, the hunger crisis gripping Gaza has deepened to a distressing new low. A U.N. backed initiative confirming that parts of Gaza are now officially experiencing famine, with the rest of the enclave facing emergency levels of hunger and famine expected to spread further across the strip over the coming months.

Now, the U.N. backed report has warned that malnutrition is projected to threaten the lives of more than 130,000 children under the age of five through June of next year, doubling their estimate from this past May. In a statement, the U.N. secretary general, Antonio Guterres, described the famine in in Gaza following Israel's near total blockade on the enclave as a, quote, "man-made disaster, moral indictment and a failure of humanity itself," adding that Israel, as the occupying power, has unequivocal obligations under international law to ensure access to food and medical supplies for the population of Gaza.

The U.N.'s Humanitarian Affairs chief, Tom Fletcher, meanwhile, had this to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

TOM FLETCHER, U.N. UNDER-SECRETARY GENERAL FOR HUMANITARIAN AFFAIRS: Please read the IPC report cover to cover. Read it in sorrow and in anger. Not as words and numbers, but as names and lives.

[16:20:04]

Be in no doubt that this is irrefutable testimony. It is a famine.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BASHIR: Now, Israeli authorities have rejected the U.N. backed report as one sided, claiming the report relies on data provided by Hamas, adding that the initiative failed to take into consideration recent upticks in the amount of food, water and medical supplies that have been allowed into Gaza during the reporting period.

The U.S. ambassador to Israel, Mike Huckabee, meanwhile, said Saturday that the United Nations should declare itself, quote, "corrupt and incompetent." However, over the course of nearly two years of war, Israel has restricted and at times even blocked humanitarian supplies and food aid from entering the strip. Humanitarian organizations on the ground have repeatedly sounded the alarm over the desperate shortage of food available in Gaza, and rising cases of acute malnutrition.

And many will have, of course, seen the harrowing images of emaciated civilians, including children, as well as the desperate scenes of families scrambling to receive what little food is available at aid distribution sites, with some even being killed in the process.

Nada Bashir, CNN, in London.

DEAN: Nada, thank you.

And we are joined now by former State Department Middle East negotiator Aaron David Miller.

Aaron, good to see you on this Saturday. Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu saying this week he's ordering negotiations to start immediately on bringing the hostages home, ending the war on conditions he said are, quote, "acceptable to Israel." We don't know exactly what those terms are. We probably have a good idea based on all the negotiations that have gone on in the past. Earlier this week, Hamas accepted a proposal put forth by Qatar and Egypt.

I feel like, again, we're a broken record here, but do you see any opening for progress to be made here?

AARON DAVID MILLER, FORMER STATE DEPARTMENT MIDDLE EAST NEGOTIATOR: Not on the negotiation front, Jessica, and thanks for having me. I think the situation, the headlines situations get worse before it gets worse. The prime minister wants now a comprehensive end to the war. And those terms are reasonable. Hamas should give up the hostages and end the war, and that would end the suffering.

The reality is they won't do that. And as a consequence, the prime minister has another option. And that is the threat and perhaps the reality of a major ground ops into Gaza City. It's already begun in terms of operating in some of the outer suburbs of Zaytoun and trying to get 800,000 Palestinians, voluntarily or not, to move further south so that the IDF, the Israeli Defense Forces, can operate more effectively.

I think that option is not only going to lead to more civilian deaths, worsen the humanitarian issue. Whether you call it food insecurity, starvation, malnutrition or famine, there is not enough food and medical care getting into Gaza. No access to potable water, sanitation particularly for children. They constitute almost half of the population. So he has two options. And it seems to me right now it looks to me like the military pressure is going to ramp up.

DEAN: And so knowing all of that, what does the military pressure do to any potential deal that could happen? Obviously the hope is, from the Israeli side, that if they do this, that they can push Hamas to some sort of deal. Is that -- is that probable? Is it possible?

MILLER: I mean, is it possible that Hamas will give up the remaining hostages, 20, who are still alive, and 30 plus, who are no longer alive? My analysis says no. It's their only card. They're interested in survival, political survival. They know they can no longer govern Gaza administratively. And the Israelis have hollowed them out as a military organization.

The only way to effectively counter Hamas is to create an alternative. And that requires cooperation with the Egyptians and the Qataris. It requires leadership from Washington and requires an Israeli government frankly that is interested in ending the war on terms that I think would benefit not only Israel, but certainly the hostages and their families and long suffering Palestinian civilians in Gaza. But that's not what's coming. And I don't foresee that happening any time soon.

DEAN: Yes. And so what does this mean? So we just heard Nada's reporting on how serious and dire the humanitarian issue is there in Gaza. You mentioned especially for children that make up a huge population there. And then you have the hostages who you also just noted, who are still there, who are still in captivity.

[16:25:00]

Not that long ago we had that video of one of the hostages said to be digging his own grave, looking absolutely emaciated. What happens to these hostages and to their families?

MILLER: I mean, that question is tragic. But that question is immediate. The reality is the destruction of Hamas, the end of its political influence in Gaza, the Israelis want to continue to do that as they probably will, fine. But the reality is, for 20 lives, for their families, for some measure, I hate to use the word closure for the families who will end up with bodies not live loved ones, this is an immediate problem and just strikes me, as it struck me since October 7th, that the priority for this Israeli government, for this prime minister, is avenging the dead, not redeeming the living.

And again, I mentioned that the situation will get worse before it gets worse. And it is possible for the situation to deteriorate even further. What is missing, Jessica, and what is required is leadership, primarily by the government of Israel to pursue a sane, rational policy and also by the Trump administration. And this particular president is busy with other matters. Ukraine, Russia, a much bigger play for him right now.

And he's all but acquiesced, it seems to me. I've worked and voted for Democrats and Republicans. He's acquiesced, frankly, in Netanyahu's strategy, which I think is flawed and ultimately tragic.

DEAN: All right, Aaron David Miller, good to see you. Thanks so much for that. We appreciate it.

MILLER: Thank you, Jessica.

DEAN: Still to come, the U.S. stock market rallied to record highs after the Fed chief hinted at the possibility of rate cuts. That would mark a win for President Trump, who has been pressuring Jerome Powell since he got into office.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:31:28]

DEAN: The Dow pulled off its first record-high close this year after Fed Chief Jerome Powell signaled the possibility of interest rate cuts. Powell's remarks the Federal Reserve annual meeting in Jackson Hole, Wyoming, coming after relentless pressure from President Trump on Powell and the Fed to cut rates. Here to break this down is staff writer at The Atlantic Toluse Olorunnipa, and Axios Political Reporter Brittany Gibson. Great to have both of you here on a Saturday afternoon.

Toluse, let's stay on this topic. President Trump has long been pressuring the Fed, turning up the pressure and attacks on Jerome Powell, now threatening to fire Fed Governor Lisa Cook. What is -- you know, is the end result he just wants the rate cuts or -- what is his thinking behind all of this?

TOLUSE OLORUNNIPA, STAFF WRITER, THE ATLANTIC: well, the president is someone who watches the stock market very closely. He had to be pleased that the stock market hit another record-high on Friday. He has been putting pressure on Fed Chairman Jerome Powell to cut rates for a long time, saying that Powell is "too late and is waiting too long to cut rates."

But it's important to mark -- to remark that the reason that chair -- Fed Chair Powell decided to hint that he may be cutting rates in the month ahead is because of the weakness in the job market. We saw that job report at the beginning of August, in which we had a revision downward. We saw the jobs coming in at such a low number that it really embarrassed President Trump.

And he had to fire the person who was doing the number crunching and putting out the statistics that the Bureau of Labor Statistics. And so, that's the reason why the Fed has considered cutting rates and not holding steady, because there is a fear that weakness in the job market is more of a significant threat than the inflation that could be caused by Trump's tariffs. And so, while Trump is happy with the stock market, he can't be happy with the underlying state of the economy that is causing Fed Chair Powell to consider cutting rates in the future.

DEAN: And, Brittany, as Trump continues to try and exude control over the Central Bank, there's obviously this question around the impact on the Fed's credibility as an independent institution, what that means, not just for the domestic economy, but the global economy as well. What have you found in your reporting about how the Trump administration is thinking about this? Obviously, Scott Bessent has tried to keep the president, you know, kind of on the straight and narrow here as it were. What are you learning about all of those relationships and the dynamics?

BRITTANY GIBSON, POLITICS REPORTER, AXIOS: I think you're right to single out Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent as more of a moderate or traditionalist when it comes to the finance sphere and the Central Bank in particular. But you don't have to dig very deep to see almost every day, every press availability we've had recently with the White House, with President Trump, that he is a bit indifferent to, I think, the norms of -- and respect of leaving alone the Central Bank, having that independence.

He cares very deeply about the stats of the economy. The stats of how he likes to measure U.S. progress and success of his presidency is tied very closely to that. So, he doesn't see a line there. He takes it very personally and sees this as part of his legacy and also part of a measure of the work that he's doing.

DEAN: I also want to ask you both about another story line we've, of course, been following quite closely, which are these federal troops now in the streets of Washington, D.C. Toluse, I want to listen to a clip of what the president said yesterday.

[16:35:04]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

DONALD TRUMP, PRESIDENT OF THE UNITED STATES: After we do this, we'll go to another location, and we'll make it safe also. We're going to make our country very safe. We're going to make our cities very, very safe.

Chicago is a mess. You have an incompetent Mayor. Grossly incompetent. So, I think Chicago will be our next. And then we'll help with New York.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

DEAN: So, Toluse, President Trump has argued this is all about safety. But there's also the geography at play here. These are all blue cities run by Democratic leaders. Is that what this is really about?

OLORUNNIPA: That is really what this is about. President Trump has had a long history of attacking the big cities of this country, a lot of times led by Democratic mayors and often led by black mayors. He has really called those cities out and criticized them and often use dehumanizing language to talk about life in those cities. (AUDIO GAP) Specific case, because it does have the home charter rule that allows the federal government to take over the local police department.

No other city has that same statistic and that same breakdown. And so, if President Trump wanted to take over or send Federal troops into big cities, he'd have to use the National Guard, federalize the National Guard over the objection of state governors who are not happy with that. And also have to focus on the fact that a lot of the people within those cities do not want federal troops roaming their streets.

And so, he's talking about this. We'll have to wait and see whether he makes good on this threat. But it's very different from Washington, D.C., where other local cities have their own police departments. They're not under threat of being taken over by the -- by Washington or by the White House. And sending federal troops into those places could lead to a much more hostile reception than Washington, D.C., where the local mayor had no choice but to allow President Trump to take over her police department.

DEAN: Yes. And I think that's such an important point and a piece of context to remember to this -- that Washington, D.C., exists as one scenario. Brittany, if he were to do this into Chicago, that is -- that is -- that is different than what we're seeing in Washington for all the reasons Toluse just laid out. What does this all mean for him politically?

GIBSON: Yes, absolutely. And I would just add to that too, though, that while D.C. is a unique situation, this is not the first time that President Trump in this administration has targeted blue cities or targeted cities that he views as working against his agenda. He ordered the Department of Homeland Security and Department of Justice to create a list of sanctuary cities that were being, in his view, non-cooperative with his immigration agenda, where he uses very similar language of, you know, cleaning up the cities, fighting crimes, targeting criminal, illegal people, and going after them in that way. And it was more of a priority at the start of this administration to target those sanctuary cities one by one.

I think L.A. is probably the last, you know, more narrow target we've seen from immigration officials, which are, of course, federal law enforcement as well. And so, this, to me, feels like a similar version of that. You know, while he might not be able to send the National Guard into Chicago the same way he can in D.C., he can send, you know, I.C.E. agents and, you know, CBP, and those federal immigration enforcement officers, the way he has earlier in this administration.

DEAN: Yes. And, Toluse, lastly, I do want to get your thoughts on this investigation into Trump's former National Security Advisor John Bolton. Since firing Bolton in 2019, they have been at odds. Now, we see federal agents going to his home, his offices. In your reporting, what have you learned about how this all came to be?

OLORUNNIPA: Well, it is important to note that John Bolton, whom I remember covering him. And President Trump, they were hip to hip and side by side back in the first Trump Administration. In recent weeks and days, he has been one of the top critics of President Trump and his foreign policy, talking about what's happened in the Ukraine- Russia situation with a lot of criticism for how Trump has handled that.

And so, it is very curious that this raid is happening on his home and business at a time when he's speaking out. And it happens against the backdrop of a lot of retribution against President Trump's other perceived enemies. People being fired from the defense intelligence agency, people being taken out of the office of the Director of National Intelligence. And then being -- that being downsized with a lot of people being taken out who are seen as not loyal to Trump.

And this broader backdrop of retribution is very hard to ignore when you have federal agents going and raiding the home of someone who worked for multiple presidents and who, for lack of any other evidence that we've seen publicly, is just speaking and using his First Amendment right to criticize the president. And so, until we see more, it definitely looks like it's part of this broader sense of retribution and attacks on Trump's perceived enemies. That has continued over the course of the last seven months. And Trump has shown no desire to halt that or to slow down on going after people who have criticized him in public.

[16:40:14]

DEAN: All right. Toluse and Brittany, our thanks to both of you on a summer Saturday. Thanks for being here.

OLORUNNIPA: Thank you.

DEAN: And still to come. After years of boom, the atmosphere around A.I. is it starting to shift a little? The recent stumbles that may have investors and companies rethinking their plans.

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[16:45:10]

DEAN: For years, businesses have been racing to invest in and use artificial intelligence, but now some of the top human minds involved in A.I. are debating whether there's a bubble underway. And that includes Sam Altman, the head of OpenAI. His company owns ChatGPT. He's often seen as the face of the A.I. industry. The Verge reports Altman said, "Are we in a phase where investors as a whole are overexcited about A.I.? My opinion is yes."

Let's bring in CNN Senior Business Writer Allison Morrow. Allison, good to see you. What are the signs that we could be in for, let's call it a vibe shift on A.I.?

ALLISON MORROW, CNN BUSINESS SENIOR WRITER: Yes. Look, the reason I call it a vibe shift is not because we're seeing all of it change at once. It's been a kind of series of disappointments. And when you're typically in a bubble, the bubble tends to burst, right?

But we're not seeing that happen quite the same way with A.I. There's still a ton of interest and a ton of money in this. But the mood around the narrative that Silicon Valley has been feeding us for the last three years about this supposedly revolutionary technology is just starting to feel a bit stale. And we've seen in the last couple of weeks several events that kind of make that very clear.

So, you had Meta is reportedly after spending hundreds of billions of dollars on its A.I. division, freezing hiring. It's potentially going to downsize its A.I. division. And just a few months ago, it was offering huge, huge signing bonuses for A.I. engineers.

As you mentioned, Sam Altman even used the word bubble in a media interview. And the thing that really alarmed Wall Street last week was an M.I.T. report that showed corporations that had adopted A.I. pilot programs in a way to try to goose their revenue and streamline their operations. 95 percent of them found the A.I. made absolutely no difference.

So, a lot of the warnings we've been getting about how this is a job killer and how it's going to completely remake the economy just haven't come to fruition. And so, we're in a moment right now where people are asking, like, where's the money going? And when is this revolution going to happen?

DEAN: Yes. That is fascinating. In terms of the limitations of this technology -- and it was interesting to hear you talking about that M.I.T. report. But what are the limitations of this technology, and how is that running up against this moment?

MORROW: Sure. I mean, so I'm not a technologist, but what I understand about generative A.I. is that these are large language models that are essentially like autocomplete. They anticipate the words -- and the numbers sometimes that are going to come next in a sequence. And so, when you prompt ChatGPT for something, it's going to give you an answer based on a bunch of data that's been trained on.

And that's a very useful technology. Don't get me wrong. Like, I think the revolution has been overhyped, but it's obvious that a lot of people find some value and it's a slightly better search engine. Sometimes you don't get the same, like sponsored ads that people are frustrated with on Google search. It's also been shown to be very helpful for young coders, like working through their code and trying to debug computer code. So, there are -- there is value there, but there are limits. And I think we've been sold a little bit more of a revolution than we've been getting.

DEAN: A very interesting perspective on all of this. Allison Morrow, great reporting. Thanks so much. We really appreciate it.

And if you want to read CNN Business's evening newsletter nightcap, go to cnn.com/nightcap. You can sign up. We'll be right back.

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[16:53:22]

DEAN: This is one of the biggest weekends in golf, at least when it comes to money. The PGA Tour, playing its tour championship final in Atlanta. It is the best of the best from the entire season, whittled down to the top 30 players. And the winner gets a $10 million top prize. CNN's Sports Don Riddell is joining us now from East Lake Golf Club, where the third round is now underway despite some wet weather. Don, there was a tie for the lead at the start of the day. $10 million on the line. What's happening now?

DON RIDDELL, CNN WORLD SPORT CORRESPONDENT: Hi, there, Jessica. Well, England's Tommy Fleetwood is starting to sort of pull away from the field here. He is nicknamed "Fairway Jesus" for his very impressive head of hair. And it kind of feels like he's walking on water at the moment. We've had so much rain here at East Lake. But he is playing absolutely superbly.

Within the last hour or so, he has made four consecutive birdies for a three-shot lead. And what's particularly noteworthy about Fleetwood is that he has never, ever won on the PGA Tour. And so, what are the chances that his first win could be of all tournaments this one? I asked him about that after his second round.

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TOMMY FLEETWOOD, PLAYED IN 163 PGA TOUR EVENTS, ZERO WINS: Well, it would be cool. Yes. No, I probably never, never thought about it. The change in format means yes, I could end up winning the FedEx Cup.

But no. You know, I -- every tournament we play, I would picture myself winning it. So, I would say this is just another one of those. Obviously, it's a very coveted one and a very big one. But, yes, I always sort of feel like I imagine winning every tournament. And this is -- this is just another one of those.

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RIDDELL: There's a lot of golf still to play, though, Jessica, and it is very, very competitive. And nobody should rule out the World Number One Scottie Scheffler. He's also having a very impressive day.

He began with back-to-back bogeys. But he has since made five birdies in quick succession. He's only four strokes back. So, don't rule out Scottie Scheffler.

[16:55:18]

DEAN: All right. Don Riddell with the very latest. Thank you so much for that.

And still ahead on the CNN NEWSROOM. With a late-night gavel, Texas lawmakers putting their redistricting plan on the governor's desk. The move, though, sparking a national fight with governors from both parties now promising to redraw their own maps. The latest on this when we come back.

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