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U.S. And Chinese Officials Reach "Framework Of A Trade Deal; Hurricane Melissa Intensifies To Major Category 4 Storm; Flight Delays Grow As Shutdown Enters Fifth Week; Deadly Russian Strikes Tears Into Kyiv Residential High Rises; Two Suspects Arrested In Louvre Museum Heist. Aired 4-5p ET

Aired October 26, 2025 - 16:00   ET

THIS IS A RUSH TRANSCRIPT. THIS COPY MAY NOT BE IN ITS FINAL FORM AND MAY BE UPDATED.

[16:00:00]

FREDRICKA WHITFIELD, CNN HOST: OK. So it's one thing to, you know, be in that state and playing the scales, it's another to watch the video of the procedure. I mean, how does it match up? I mean, what is it like to be watching yourself in surgery and being able to play the scales and comprehend and do the exercises of your hands there, you know, with your doctors and your team working on you?

BACON: Yes. So I thankfully didn't know everything that they were doing. I knew they were putting in electrodes, and I certainly could hear the drill going through my skull. But apart from that, I was -- I was aware that I was playing the clarinet and that it got better when they sort of put more stimulation on one side, it got better. You see that very clearly on the video.

WHITFIELD: Wonderful. Well, I mean, this is so extraordinary, so enlightening to hear the points of view of both of you and of course to put it all together and see the video, too. You're taking us into the operating room and recovery as well, all at once.

All right, Dr. Kim Mars Ashkan and Denise Bacon, thanks to both of you. All the best. And congratulations again.

All right. Hello, again, everyone. Thank you so much for joining me. I'm Fredricka Whitfield.

And we're following major developments on a possible breakthrough in U.S. trade relations with China. Today Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent said the U.S. has reached a substantial framework of a trade deal with China, which would avoid an additional 100 percent U.S. tariff on Chinese imports.

The development comes as President Trump is in the midst of a five-day high-stakes diplomatic trip to Asia aimed at easing trade tensions with Beijing. Bessent says the framework agreement sets the stage for Trump's key meeting with Chinese leader Xi Jinping on Thursday.

We've got team coverage of this. CNN's Ivan Watson is in Malaysia, where President Trump is today. But let's begin with Julia Benbrook in the nation's capital.

Julia, bring us up to speed on today's developments.

JULIA BENBROOK, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Well, President Donald Trump, as you mentioned, he's in Malaysia right now. He'll be making stops in Japan. And then also in South Korea. And that is where we expect a highly anticipated sit-down with Chinese President Xi Jinping to take place. And in preparation for that meeting, United States officials and Chinese officials have been meeting throughout the weekend to talk trade and set the stage for that.

Following two days of negotiations, Treasury Secretary Scott Bessent said that it was a good meeting and that the two teams had come up with a substantial framework. He added that he didn't want to get too ahead of those two leaders and that sit-down, but that he does believe the threat of the new additional 100 percent tariff has gone away. Take a listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SCOTT BESSENT, TREASURY SECRETARY: I think we've reached a substantial framework for the two leaders who will meet in Korea next Thursday. So, you know, on the -- on the table, the president had given me maximum leverage when he threatened 100 percent tariffs if the Chinese imposed their rare earth global export controls. So I think we have averted that. So the tariffs will be averted.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

BENBROOK: And there has been a lot of back and forth, of course, in recent weeks when Beijing signaled that it would ramp up export restrictions on critical rare earth minerals. Trump threatened that he would put sky-high tariffs into place up to 157 percent. China said that they could then enact countermeasures if he doesn't back away from that.

In recent days, though, Trump has been optimistic about this meeting, saying he believes it will be a good one, maybe even a great one. He has said that China will need to make some concessions, but has suggested he is open to doing that as well.

WHITFIELD: All right, Julia Benbrook, thanks so much.

Let's go now to Ivan Watson in Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia.

So, Ivan, you know, set the stage for this Thursday big meeting between President Trump and Xi Jinping, and how much of it will be about tariffs.

IVAN WATSON, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, look, you've got the leaders of the two -- world's two largest economies that have effectively been in a trade war. And so that's why Bessent's announcement that he thinks the 100 percent tariff being off the table is such a big deal because, you know, that would throw a major wrench into the works of bilateral trade.

Also that suggestion that China and its rare earth virtual monopoly, he's suggesting that's probably off the table, is going to be something welcomed, I think, by industrialists, by investors all around the world right now. But the proof is in the pudding. What's going to happen when these two leaders actually sit down and meet? Will they in fact?

[16:05:01]

Because we haven't had confirmation from the Chinese side that the Chinese leader Xi Jinping is actually going to be meeting with Trump yet, though we have heard that Xi will be traveling to Korea to the APEC summit. That is going to be held there. So this is something to watch closely how this could unfold.

And just because the two days of trade talks here in Kuala Lumpur, you've got U.S. negotiators like Scott Bessent walking out sounding very optimistic, that's not a guarantee that this deal will ultimately be agreed upon, some kind of truce in the escalating trade war when President Trump and President Xi actually sit down together, if they sit down together in Korea on Thursday.

I should say that President Trump did arrive here in Kuala Lumpur seeming very, almost giddy and very happy, clearly in a mood to make deals. He signed deals with -- trade deals with Malaysia, with Cambodia. He's helped broker what he described as a peace deal, a continuance of a ceasefire between Thailand and Cambodia that were fighting a war back in July against each other.

And actually even sat down with the Brazilian president and said there's the possibility of a deal in the future. And that's a leader that President Trump has been very critical about in just recent months, instead softening his tone very much on the Brazilian president.

WHITFIELD: All right. Ivan Watson in Kuala Lumpur, thanks so much.

All right. Let's talk further about all of this. Joining me right now is Jamie Metzl. He is a senior fellow at the Atlantic Council and a former executive vice president of the Asia Society. He's also the author of this book, "Super Convergence: How the Genetics, Biotech, and A.I. Revolutions Will Transform Our Lives, Work, and World."

Great to see you. So Bessent sounds like he's very optimistic about this framework of a deal, but then just listening to Ivan's reporting there that the Chinese are not confirming that Xi Jinping and President Trump are meeting in Korea, what does that say to you?

JAMIE METZL, SENIOR FELLOW, ATLANTIC COUNCIL: Well, certainly the deal is not confirmed yet. And President Trump is very untraditional as a U.S. negotiator. And really, nobody knows what he's going to do. I'm optimistic there's going to be some kind of meeting and probably there's going to be some kind of deal.

But that shouldn't lead people to believe that relations between the United States and China are going to improve anytime soon because the centerpiece of U.S. strategy is to decrease our reliance on China because the perception of American political leaders on both -- in both political parties is that China has weaponized the international trade system for its benefit and against us.

And that's what they're purportedly -- our side is purportedly trying to do. So this is just one step, but we have a lot of tough waters ahead.

WHITFIELD: OK. And aside from tariffs, and you know, what would be some sort of framework of a deal, again, we don't know the details of it, Trump and you know, and Xi will need to work out, you know, the details to also crack down on fentanyl. Apparently there are a lot of things on the table. China making substantial purchases of, you know, U.S. soybeans, China delaying export curbs on rare earth materials, and then some sort of TikTok deal.

METZL: Right.

WHITFIELD: How are these things being prioritized?

METZL: Right. Well, we'll see. Certainly on the U.S. side, it would be a very big deal for us to be completely cut off from the rare earth metals, rare earth minerals that are so important to our high tech. And China knows that. And China basically has dismantled the rare earth industry in the United States and shipped it over to -- over to China. And the same time, the American farmers, many of whom have supported President Trump, are feeling the pinch of China not buying U.S. soybeans.

So because of these strong dependencies, interdependencies between the United States and China, each side has the ability to actually harm the other significantly. But because we're so connected, it's difficult to push back against the other without harming ourselves. And so one of two things is ultimately going to happen.

Either we're going to have to find a way to build a better world together, which is not what's happening now, or we're going to see an increasing decoupling between the United States and China, and there'll be moments of greater truce, which this seems to be, and moments of greater conflict of which -- many of which are coming. And it's going to be a painful process because we've been spending so many decades bringing our two economies and societies together.

WHITFIELD: A lot at stake. All right. Jamie Metzl, thanks so much. Great to see you.

[16:10:00]

All right. We're also following breaking developments as Hurricane Melissa charges its way toward Jamaica. Melissa is a powerful category four storm that is set to strengthen into a rare category five, potentially as early as tonight. The National Hurricane Center warns that catastrophic flooding up to 40 inches of rain could isolate Jamaican communities for days. The slow moving system could also pummel the island with ferocious winds and up to 13 feet of storm surge. Local officials say now is the time to finish preparations.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP) DESMOND MCKENZIE, MINISTER OF LOCAL GOVERNMENT AND COMMUNITY DEVELOPMENT: It is a collective response of all of us as Jamaicans that will take us through. This is just the beginning.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: At least four storm-related deaths have already been reported in Haiti and the Dominican Republic. Meteorologist Derek van Dam is live for us in Kingston.

Intense and dire conditions are imminent. Is Jamaica ready for this?

DEREK VAN DAM, AMS METEOROLOGIST: Oh, that's -- this is going to be a huge test on their infrastructure going forward. Undoubtedly, we're facing what could potentially be the strongest hurricane strike in this island nation in modern record keeping. And it's the slow nature of the storm that is going to bring the catastrophe that will unfold here in the next several days. Notice I didn't say day. Days. This is a long duration event.

I want to show you the satellite and why this is so important. This is a very well-defined concentric eye. That shows to me as a meteorologist that it's starting to reach this maximum potential. It's still a category four as we speak, but that is just the textbook look to a powerful major, major hurricane.

So look at the duration here. And you can see on the top right hand corner of this graphic, the time frame. We're not expecting this storm to really exit Jamaica until Tuesday afternoon. Conditions will deteriorate overnight, but it's Tuesday afternoon. So we're talking a good two to three days of tropical storm force winds, potentially a day of hurricane force winds. And what's the big concern for this mountainous island nation is the heavy rainfall potential.

We're not going to measure this in inches, Fredricka. This will be in feet. It's like taking a wet sponge and pushing it up against an immovable object which are those mountains you see over my right hand shoulder and squeezing out all the available moisture. And that's going to produce this catastrophic rain. It will pick up debris from the mountains and bring it into the valleys below.

By the way, Kingston, where I'm at, is kind of situated in a bowl. So think about the mountains surrounding this area. The water funnels directly into this location, and it's the storm surge that's going to counteract the inland flooding that's coming from those mountains because the storm surge being pushed up by the winds of the hurricane will actually meet the flooding rains from the mountains, and that water has nowhere to go but up.

And you can see here on this map that this is the area that we are so concerned about. Those areas in red that will be inundated by 10 feet of water or more. The Norman Manley International Airport, directly over my left hand shoulder, I can see the aviation tower there, that has one access road that is highly, highly susceptible to this storm surge threat as well. Long duration event, I talked to the National Hurricane Center deputy

director just moments ago about what Jamaica is facing, and he had some very strong words to say to the people here. Listen.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

JAMIE RHOME, DEPUTY DIRECTOR, NATIONAL HURRICANE CENTER: Make sure you've got what you need. Supplies, medicine, your food, whatever it is you need to be in your home for multiple days. You will not be able to venture out of your home for multiple days, and things will start to go downhill rather abruptly starting this evening and especially overnight. So it's imperative that people have this done before sunset today.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

VAN DAM: So, Fredricka, with this slow motion disaster that will unfold in the coming days here in Jamaica, it doesn't give people the opportunity to recover amongst the height of the storm. So you need to rush preparations to secure your property and your life if you're watching perhaps from Jamaica or know anyone here -- Fredricka.

WHITFIELD: Of course. Can't do it soon enough. All right. Thank you so much, Derek Van Dam, in Jamaica. Stay safe you and the crew and everyone there.

Still to come, the U.S. government shutdown is slowing down travelers across the country. We'll have a live report on the delays fliers are facing already and if it could get even worse in the coming weeks. And later, get a behind the scares look at how those top tier haunted houses pack in the frights.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:19:34]

WHITFIELD: All right. As the U.S. government shutdown winds down its 26th day now, air travelers are feeling the pain in the form of delayed or canceled flights. According to the FAA, this has been the worst weekend for staffing of air traffic controllers since the government shutdown began. And as the impacts of the shutdown grow, there's still no bipartisan deal in sight.

Here's what House Minority Leader Hakeem Jeffries told me a short time ago.

[16:20:04]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES (D-NY): A starting point would be Speaker Johnson actually bringing House Republicans back to Congress so we can actually function as a body and work toward enacting a bipartisan resolution and a spending bill that meets the needs of the American people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: All right. Let's bring in CNN's Rafael Romo who is there at Atlanta's Hartsfield Jackson International Airport.

A lot of people behind you. Are they frustrated? Are they getting through TSA no problem? What's up?

RAFAEL ROMO, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Yes, Fred, in a way, this kind of feels like travel -- the kind of travel that you see around Thanksgiving just to give you an idea about how busy it's been. And Transportation Secretary Sean Duffy said earlier in an interview that more air traffic controllers are calling in sick, and listen to this. He also expressed concern that some may need to resort to food banks after missing paychecks.

Friday, by the way, marked the first full paycheck missed by some federal workers since the government shutdown began. Delays during Sunday's early hours here in Atlanta and other airports across the nation seem normal, although it's become busier in the last few hours as you can see here behind me, in the main checkpoint area. We also have to consider that bad weather is affecting parts of the south so that may also explain some of the delays we may see today and tomorrow.

But Secretary Duffy acknowledged that there's a very real problem when it comes to air traffic controllers not showing up for work.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SEAN DUFFY, TRANSPORTATION SECRETARY: We have more people calling in sick, more people not showing up for work. And again, by the way, Maria, my message has been to the controllers, show up. That's your job. Eventually you're going to be paid, but there's real-life situations that they're dealing with their families.

DYLAN COUSINS, AIR TRAVELER: I think they probably just need to come to an agreement and reopen the government. And there's a lot of things that need to get done, and they need to figure out how to make that happen.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

ROMO: And, Fred, also, Transportation Secretary Duffy said earlier today that on Saturday there were 22 notices of understaffing for air traffic controllers around the country, adding that, quote, "That's a sign that the controllers are wearing thin."

Fred, back to you.

WHITFIELD: All right. Rafael Romo, thanks so much.

All right, still to come, it was the heist seen around the world. Snatched jewels, priceless jewels snatched in broad daylight from the Louvre Museum. And now two of the suspects are in police custody. What led to their arrests? That's next.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:27:00]

WHITFIELD: All right. New today, deadly Russian strikes tear into residential high rise buildings in Kyiv, killing at least three people. It's the second attack on the Ukrainian capital in 24 hours. And it comes just hours after President Volodymyr Zelenskyy renewed calls for more Patriot missile defense systems.

President Donald Trump has been pushing for a peace deal between Ukraine and Russia, but those attempts have made little to no progress.

CNN's Paula Hancocks has the latest.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

PAULA HANCOCKS, CNN INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: It's been a deadly weekend across Ukraine, in particular in the capital Kyiv. Residents woken once again on Sunday morning to further drone attacks. More than 100 drones being fired from Russia.

We know over the past couple of days there has been loss of life. There has also been a number of people injured, including children among the injured. The youngest we know of is just 4 years old now.

Now we have heard from President Volodymyr Zelenskyy saying they've been striking residential buildings, our people, our children. He also had quite a sobering number, saying that just over the past week, Russia has fired some 1200 drones and more than 1300 guided aerial bombs.

Now he did renew his call once again for more Patriot missile guided systems, saying that the air defenses need to be bolstered in Ukraine. We do know from the air force there that there have been the majority of these missiles and drones being shot down, but those that are getting through are deadly, and we really are seeing that the recent Russian launches are showing the shortfalls in the Ukrainian air defense systems.

Now, we have been speaking to some of those impacted in the latest strikes. Let's listen to what they said.

NATALIA ZURA, KYIV RESIDENT (through translator): We had a terrible night. We had to climb down the fire escape from the third floor. Thank you to our rescuers, our guardian angels. We are very grateful because almost suffocated, we almost burned to death.

MARIA ZURA, KYIV RESIDENT (through translator): When I was climbing down, I stopped being nervous because I realized that if I was nervous, I'd get in the way of the person who was rescuing me.

OLHA MOTIANINA, KYIV RESIDENT (through translator): Look, it's a very sad picture. People have died, and I don't know how to describe it. It's very sad and affects my mental state. HANCOCKS: Now, at the same time as Russia is launching these attacks,

it is also testing new weapons. According to the head of the armed services, saying that they have successfully tested a nuclear powered Burevestnik cruise missile.

Now, he was showing the president, Vladimir Putin, claiming that it remained airborne for some 15 hours, that it managed to travel some 14,000 kilometers. That's about 8500 miles. These claims coming from the Russian military side, not any independent source. But we did hear President Putin saying that he wanted to see these weapons deployed as soon as possible.

[16:30:06]

Now, of course, diplomacy is very much on hold when it comes to this situation. Just last week, the U.S. President Donald Trump cancelled his plans to meet with President Putin. It was going to be in Budapest. And then we heard just on Saturday again him saying that it simply wasn't the time to be meeting with Putin, saying, quote, "It didn't feel like we were going to get to the place we have to get to."

Paula Hancocks CNN Abu Dhabi.

(END VIDEOTAPE)

WHITFIELD: And new today, two arrests in connection with the Louvre jewelry heist. Police telling us that they nabbed one of the suspects at the Charles de Gaulle airport outside Paris last night as he was trying to flee to Algeria. At the heart of this case, the brazen theft last week of more than $100 million worth of historic jewels from the iconic Louvre Museum.

CNN's Melissa Bell is joining us now from Paris. Melissa, I mean, this news broke this morning. What can you tell us about the manhunt, the arrests and the jewels?

MELISSA BELL, CNN SENIOR INTERNATIONAL CORRESPONDENT: Well, this has been going on for a week, of course, with 100 investigators trying to figure out how this seven-minute heist could have happened, who was involved, and perhaps most importantly, where the jewels are, Fredricka.

We understand that they've been working with 150 different pieces of traces of DNA that were left at the scene of the crime. And of course, all the pieces of evidence that we've been speaking about over the course of the last week, the tools that the robbers used to get in the truck, that angle grinder, but of course, stuff they left behind, one of their gloves, a motorcycle helmet, one of the scooters that was involved in their escape that Sunday morning.

Now, a breakthrough, two people arrested, one of them, as you say, at Charles de Gaulle. What we understand from French media reports is that the two men are in their 30s and were known to the police before this. So, that also will have helped in terms of matching DNA with people they had on their databases. But an important break. We don't know much more yet, because the prosecutor here in Paris, beyond confirming those arrests on Saturday night, has remained pretty tight-lipped around the rest of the investigation. We understand also, Fredricka, from the interior minister, that as it continues, they will continue to keep their cards close to their chest. But still, an important breakthrough. It had been a week.

And of course, the pressure on French authorities to come up with something was pretty tremendous. This is really a robbery that has captured the attention of so many around the world, given how brazen it was, given that it happened in daylight hours, and given that a week later, we really hadn't known until this morning what progress they were making.

They kept saying that they had this body of evidence, they were making certain progress. But still, the fact that there have been those two arrests are pretty important piece of progress in this investigation as we await to find more about how this heist could have been organized, who was involved.

What we do understand, Fredricka, is that for the time being, whilst they have two people in custody that they can keep until Wednesday as they try and look at evidence that ties them to this crime. Is that for now there is no word on where the jewels might be. We understand that they simply haven't managed to get their hands on them just yet.

WHITFIELD: Wow. I mean, so many surprises in this heist and in the ongoing investigation. Melissa Bell, thanks so much.

All right. Straight ahead, a gambling scandal shocks the sports world. We'll get the inside information on how the FBI digs into the underworld of sports betting.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

[16:35:00]

WHITFIELD: All right. At the heart of the ongoing U.S. government shutdown, the fight to extend Obamacare subsidies. Those tax credits that help people afford health insurance are set to expire at the end of this month, leaving Congress just less than a week to figure out a fix before millions of Americans will be notified of much higher premiums when open enrollment begins.

Earlier, I spoke with the top Democrat in the House about the impact of all of this. Here's what Congressman Hakeem Jeffries had to say.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

REP. HAKEEM JEFFRIES (D-NY), MINORITY LEADER: Well, this should never be the case in the United States of America, the wealthiest country in the history of the world. And as Democrats, we've made the case that we are not going to support a partisan Republican spending bill that continues to gut the health care of the American people in an environment where the cost of living in this country is already too high. Donald Trump promised to lower costs on day one. Costs haven't gone down. They're going up. Electricity bills are through the roof. Housing costs are up. Inflation is up. Grocery costs are up. And now, tens of millions of people in Georgia and in beyond are facing the very real possibility that they will be unable to afford a doctor when they need one.

We're talking about a situation where many people will confront increased health care costs of $1,000 to $2,000 per month. That's $12,000 to $24,000 in additional costs per year, when more than 90 percent of the people who receive Affordable Care Act tax credits make around $62,000 a year. It's unaffordable. It's unsustainable. And it's unconscionable. That's why we are demanding that our Republican colleagues sit back down at the table so we can get this resolved for the American people.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: U.S. senators are expected back on the Hill tomorrow. All right. tonight, discover the breads that bond Sao Paulo on a new episode of the CNN original series "Tony Shalhoub Breaking Bread." Here's a preview.

[16:40:00]

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Little bit salt. Cut.

TONY SHALHOUB, HOST, "TONY SHALHOUB BREAKING BREAD": Why do you want to cut away the crust?

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Because the Japanese style. And look. It's raw inside.

SHALHOUB: Oh, look at how beautiful the presentation is.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Let's try.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: It's crazy, huh.

SHALHOUB: There is so much going on in there. Crunchy and soft.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: And spicy.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: Yes. And spicy.

SHALHOUB: Spicy and sweet. And I don't know whether to laugh or cry. Honestly, this is amazing.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: He is crying.

SHALHOUB: I cry at everything. All right. Thank you.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

[16:45:00]

WHITFIELD: Oh, that's sweet. He's doing both, he's laughing and crying. New episode of "Tony Shalhoub Breaking Bread" premiers tomorrow at 9:00 p.m. Easter and Pacific only on CNN.

(COMMERCIAL BREAK)

WHITFIELD: All right. An explosive gambling investigation shocked the sports world this week in netting an NBA coach, player and 32 others in two alleged illicit schemes. Prosecutors say the operations included x-ray poker tables, rigged card shufflers and insider information to steal tens of millions of dollars from victims. One of the alleged schemes even involved the mafia. Take a look at how these specialized glasses work at the poker table.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

SAL PIACENTE, PRESIDENT, UNIVERSAL GAME PROTECTION DEVELOPMENT INC.: If you actually sell what is that top card? Honestly, I can't tell you. But if I put my contact lenses on or if you're wearing these poker glasses, you'll be able to look right through that filter and see exactly what that card is.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: Oh, wow. All right. Joining me right now for more insight is retired FBI agent Seamus McElearney. Seamus, great to see you. And you're also the author of "Flipping Capo: How the FBI Dismantled the Real Sopranos."

All right. So, Seamus, I mean, what was your initial reaction to the FBI's announcement about who was involved, the kinds of tools allegedly used as well?

SEAMUS MCELEARNEY, RETIRED FBI AGENT AND AUTHOR, "FLIPPING CAPO: HOW THE FBI DISMANTLED THE REAL SOPRANOS": Well, for the last set -- like I would say the last few -- like few days, all that I've heard is the mob is back. Well, the mob has never left. The mob has been around for 125 years. They are not going away. They just adapt.

And when I saw the techniques that they used, I was very impressed because they use some serious types of techniques. When you use x-ray tables, you use glasses, you use card trays. Very impressive stuff.

WHITFIELD: Yes, impressive. I mean, this is a stuff like out of Get Smart, for those who remember Get Smart TV or even like "Mission Impossible" kind of movies. But this is the real deal that were allegedly used in these enterprises. So, I mean, is this very unique or does this kind of unveiling of this mean that it's very pervasive?

MCELEARNEY: Well, sports betting has been a staple of the mob for years, so that's not new to them at all. But the techniques that they've used is impressive. And I think that's kind of new for them now. But as I said, a mob just constantly adapts. There's more people that work for the mob, so they're just constantly going to adapt. WHITFIELD: OK. Adapt. And so, well, you know, widespread -- there's this widespread legalization of sports betting. But what would be the draw now for these, you know, crime families as it's being alleged that they were involved in? You know, I guess why make it bigger and broader?

MCELEARNEY: Because unfortunately, when people gamble, they tend to lose money, right? So, when you gamble, when you lose money, then you're going to try to cover those debts. So, then you're going to go to the mob to try to cover those debts. It happens all the time.

WHITFIELD: And so, what do you see as the next step in, I guess, this investigation? I mean, there were some big names, you know, that were now alleged to be involved here. And perhaps that's a little distracting from the web, I guess, that the FBI or investigators are saying has been, you know, carefully weaved.

MCELEARNEY: Well, now the process has just started, right? So, you'll probably see more indictments coming. You'll probably see more people try to plead guilty and try to get out of the case as quick as they possibly can. You had 34 people arrested. So, there's a good chance people are going to flip. They're going to try to cooperate with the government.

So, I expect people to flip. And once people flip, you never know what they're going to say. So, I expect more people to flip and then more charges to come from that.

WHITFIELD: OK. And that there are -- oh, go ahead.

MCELEARNEY: And there's a vicious cycle. What happens is gambling, as I said, has been a staple of the mob for years. Gambling leads to loan sharking. When people lose money, then they have to cover their debts. So, they go to the mob to get loans to pay for their debts. Loan sharking is a profitable tool for the mob to make money. When you can't pay back those debts, that leads to extortion.

[16:50:00]

Now, I don't know the ins and outs of this particular case, but what could have happened is extortion in this particular role could have been using the players to provide information. That could be one tool of extortion. A second tool of extortion could have been using some of the stars that are in this case to lure high-ranking people that play poker to these games. So, that's another form of extortion.

WHITFIELD: Wow.

MCELEARNEY: The mob has gotten very smart, though, where they are no longer using violence, because they know violence tends to attract law enforcement. So, in the last couple of years, they've come to minimize the violence.

WHITFIELD: And so, there were four, you know, crime families that were named in these allegations. Does this undermine, threaten their existence, or maybe even heighten their profile? MCELEARNEY: No. I think -- I know they said four families were involved. I think there was three of the major families were involved. The Gambino family, the Genovese family, and the Bonanno family. I think there was just one Lucchese associate that was involved in this. But the maiden members were for the first three families that I had talked about there.

It's not going to deter them. They're going to learn from this. They're going to see where they made the mistakes and who they let into their circle to actually expose this. So, as I said, the mob has been around forever. They're not going to be deterred by this. They're going to learn from their mistakes, adapt, and see how they can actually make money in other ways as well.

WHITFIELD: Wow. Fascinating. All right. Seamus McElearney, great talking to you. Thank you.

MCELEARNEY: It was great to meet you. Thank you.

WHITFIELD: All right. Still to come, we take you behind the scenes of this spooky season.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

BEN ARMSTRONG, CO-OWNER, NETHERWORLD HAUNTED HOUSE: We can actually come up to a person.

ISABEL ROSALES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: Oh, it really moves. Oh, my goodness.

ARMSTRONG: We can bite them and we can pull them back into the darkness.

(END VIDEO CLIP)

WHITFIELD: Our own Isabel Rosales takes a look at the science of the scares at the haunted houses. I was at one of those haunted houses last night. Now, I get it. She has her own monster makeover too that's --

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[16:55:00]

WHITFIELD: All right. It's scary times. That means haunted houses are everywhere. And just like many of you, I actually braved one haunted house here in Atlanta. I went there last night with my kiddos. And it turns out it's the same one where CNN's Isabel Rosales stepped into recently. And she actually transformed herself into a monster to scare unsuspecting guests.

(BEGIN VIDEOTAPE)

ISABEL ROSALES, CNN CORRESPONDENT: This haunted house rests on 10 sprawling acres. And every single day, they can expect over a thousand patrons to come through these doors. They also boast over 450 animatronics and special effects. Let's go inside to see just what makes it so scary.

BEN ARMSTRONG, CO-OWNER, NETHERWORLD HAUNTED HOUSE: The secret is pleasing the group.

ROSALES: How do you make sure that it's really scary?

ARMSTRONG: In the brain, there's a thing called the amygdala. It protects you by suddenly taking over the conscious mind. Everything is safe here. But if the amygdala senses potential danger, bam, it kicks in. And that's when your body starts to react. Your skin gets paler. All the blood flows to your muscles. And you get into that fight or flight response. It's crazy how people react.

ROSALES: It sounds like once you step into a haunted house, you're really -- you're being attacked from all angles.

ARMSTRONG: Absolutely.

UNIDENTIFIED FEMALE: Oh, my god. Oh, my god.

ARMSTRONG: What we want to do is keep you off balance. It's not so much a horror movie as an action movie. It's constantly things are jumping out. There's animatronics everywhere. There's sound. There's lighting. There's huge monsters. All this is setting you up for the actors. It's distraction. It's just over the top action. And also, the suspense of not knowing what's going to happen.

When people are going to come here, they start getting nervous. It's like the click, click, click, click, click of a roller coaster.

This is our wolf gorge area. We have an actor on a wire that flies over your head. And they walk right around this corner. And hidden in this hole is another werewolf actor. He reaches out and hits a button with a sound scare and a light. This is the mega mouth.

This is a puppet. This thing has a bite that is massive in scale. And we can actually come up to a person.

ROSALES: Oh, it really moves. Oh, my goodness.

ARMSTRONG: We can bite them. And then we can pull them back into the darkness. And this plays into that fear.

This is a gory room. This creature is going to sew people together with different creatures. It's gross.

ROSALES: But to really understand fear, I got to join the monsters.

UNIDENTIFIED MALE: What you'll do is you'll take your hand and lunge out.

ROSALES: I feel like there's a talent deep inside. The problem is I can't stop laughing after I scare people.

(END VIDEOTAPE) WHITFIELD: Yes. You know, that was -- well, I must say I laughed a lot too. It was fun. It all worked. It is scary. But sometimes it wasn't just the big stuff, it was the little things and it was the lighting.